View Full Version : You are moving to CA what guns do you go with
Don't answer my question, with I would never move to a place as messed up as CA.
For what ever reason your moving to CA, what would you do about having guns there? What guns would you buy to feel comfortable with living in CA?
Digital_Damage
04-02-17, 09:14
Sell everything and buy one at a store in CA to be safe.
You are going to be limited to 10 rounds, period.
Bullet button AR's are retarded and pointless. I would start going the M1a route if forced.
Honestly, If I am at that point....It means guns no longer matter that much to me.
Therefore:
1911
P225
Benelli M2 w/ slugs
Remington 700 in .300 Win Mag
Model 686 4"
That really would be all I'd need. Nothing I couldn't handle. I'd miss ARs but if this is purely "just for defense"; I can't think of much I couldnt handle with the aforementioned.
Bullet button AR's are retarded and pointless. I would start going the M1a route if forced.
This is a moronic statement and if you just think it through for a minute, you'll see why. Look up Raddlock bullet button. My ARs are four turns of a screw different than yours.
Understand, I'm not attacking you, I'm disputing your statement. I like you and enjoy reading your posts, but I can't let that statement stand.
I put bullet buttons on some, bought some 10 rounders, and witches one gun over to "featureless" but I didn't sell anything or get rid of anything. In fact, every time I leave the state for military training or to visit people I come back with more regular mags. I am seriously considering not complying with the newest round of laws, in which case I might just remove all my bullet buttons, keeping my HD gun featureless though.
Yoni, you will need to call the local LE in the area you are moving to. You'll get wildly varying answers on this question. LAPD will have someone behind a desk telling you one thing, and the local sheriff in a rural red county will tell you the opposite.
I think you can bring all your handguns, but they will all have to be registered in CA to be legal. You can't buy certain ones here that are not on "the list", but my understanding is that people can bring those guns that they already own with them. We had a loophole that closed on Jan 1st of this year that allowed a parent to ship to an FFL of an adult child, or adult child to ship to the FFL of a parent in CA guns that weren't on "the list" and legally transfer them to a CA resident. I mention this because it is not illegal to have off-list handguns here, as long as they entered the state legally through an FFL. You just can't buy them over the counter here.
Prior to Jan 1st of this year, we could still possess standard cap and high cap mags if they were pre-ban, or refurbished pre-ban mags, but I think this ended. Not sure if that took effect in Jan 2017, or if it takes effect Jan of 2018. None of us care, and everyone I know is ignoring this. Its in dispute, and no one knows what the law is or what to do about it. If anyone is worried about it, stick to 10 rounders in public and no one will bother you.
All normal shotguns and bolt guns are fine as long as they meet federal standards of 18"+ barrels.
ARs, AKs, etc. are in a bit of limbo right now. Bullet buttons were the work-around for a few years, but the libs apparently caught on and have attempted to end that loophole. CA DOJ is supposed to come out with some compliance guidelines, but its also tied up in the courts right now too. This won't take effect until Jan 2018, and frankly we don't know what we're going to do about it. Most people I know are taking their bullet buttons off and ignoring all of this liberal non-sense, but they made "assault weapon" possession a felony with this new batch of laws, so ignoring it is not without risk. You can also register them as assault weapons, and keep them, but no one wants to do that for obvious reasons. There is supposedly a new device that you can install and be able to legally keep your guns without any sort of registration, but we are all in a wait-and-see pattern at the moment. I have LEO friends telling me to ignore it all and that none of them intend to enforce any of this, but… well… its a dilemma.
I put bullet buttons on some, bought some 10 rounders, and witches one gun over to "featureless" but I didn't sell anything or get rid of anything. In fact, every time I leave the state for military training or to visit people I come back with more regular mags. I am seriously considering not complying with the newest round of laws, in which case I might just remove all my bullet buttons, keeping my HD gun featureless though.
This is pretty much the same story I hear from everyone here.
In regards to your statement about bringing back mags, I think what you meant to say is that you brought home magazine parts in order to repair and refurbish your pre-ban existing standard and high cap magazines that you already had in your possession before the ban went into effect, right? Say "yes". Please.
Sell everything and buy one at a store in CA to be safe.
You are going to be limited to 10 rounds, period.
Bullet button AR's are retarded and pointless. I would start going the M1a route if forced.
This is what I would do. Instead of idiotic with an AR, I would become a master of guns not targeted by the ban. Still lots of good choices.
Digital_Damage
04-02-17, 12:45
This is a moronic statement and if you just think it through for a minute, you'll see why. Look up Raddlock bullet button. My ARs are four turns of a screw different than yours.
Understand, I'm not attacking you, I'm disputing your statement. I like you and enjoy reading your posts, but I can't let that statement stand.
Not moronic in the slightest. They remove one of the driving requirements for the original concept of the AR, they are retarded. There are FAR better options for long guns in HD situations than the AR if you can't have a removable magazine or other intended features.
And lets be honest, which is more probable. You have to use your weapon in a home defense situation or you have to remove your BB to fight off hoarding zombies during the apocalypse...
My advice to the OP is get a system that is fully featured for its platform and become as efficient with it as possible and be confident in your skills with it.
Don't answer my question, with I would never move to a place as messed up as CA.
For what ever reason your moving to CA, what would you do about having guns there? What guns would you buy to feel comfortable with living in CA?
Your best resources are Calguns.net and the California Dept. Of Justice: Bureau of Firearms.
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=741530
See "Moving to California" thread.
https://oag.ca.gov/firearms
Note: If you are LE or active Military there are some exemptions.
RetroRevolver77
04-02-17, 13:05
Sell everything and buy one at a store in CA to be safe.
You are going to be limited to 10 rounds, period.
Bullet button AR's are retarded and pointless. I would start going the M1a route if forced.
I would definitely go the M1A and 1911 route if I lived out there. Then maybe some pump shotguns, wheelguns and .22's for plinking.
I believe the M1A's with compensators instead of flashiders are legal like this one:
http://www.springfield-armory.com/products/m1a-scout-squad/#AA9120
This is pretty much the same story I hear from everyone here.
In regards to your statement about bringing back mags, I think what you meant to say is that you brought home magazine parts in order to repair and refurbish your pre-ban existing standard and high cap magazines that you already had in your possession before the ban went into effect, right? Say "yes". Please.
Nope, doesn't matter as rebuild kits are illegal as well, have been for the last two years so I simply no longer care.
If memory serves me correctly, the complete mag ban goes into effect July 1st.
Digital_Damage
04-02-17, 13:58
I would definitely go the M1A and 1911 route if I lived out there. Then maybe some pump shotguns, wheelguns and .22's for plinking.
I believe the M1A's with compensators instead of flashiders are legal like this one:
http://www.springfield-armory.com/products/m1a-scout-squad/#AA9120
I believe they are as well, I would pick up a SOCOM 16 instead of the scout tho.
MountainRaven
04-02-17, 14:30
Late-war/Korean War-era M1 Carbine with Ultimak, SF Scout, and AP Micro OR a "Tanker" Garand in 308 OR a Winchester 73 or 92 Trapper in 357 Mag.
Wilson Combat 1911 in 9mm.
I'd rather have a bare muzzle than a brake on a defensive gun.
RetroRevolver77
04-02-17, 14:45
I believe they are as well, I would pick up a SOCOM 16 instead of the scout tho.
I'd probably have a couple of each, the Scout Squad and the SOCOM. Or maybe some LRB M25's with the railed receivers and tanker barrel set ups w/ comps. Then a couple of outfitted 1911's with eight round mags for carry or ten round magazines for the house. I wouldn't feel undergunned at all honestly. I wouldn't bother with a bullet button anything.
I couldn't bring most of my guns into the state. Probably go 1911, Rem 870 and something like a Steyr scout.
sevenhelmet
04-02-17, 15:02
Honestly, If I am at that point....It means guns no longer matter that much to me.
Therefore:
1911
870 w/ slugs
Remington 700
Model 686
Pretty much this. TBH, if I were moving into CA now, I would probably leave most of my firearms with trusted family in TX, and just bring the 1911s, revolvers, and Marlin lever out here. Firearms and accessories that were completely legal when I first moved to CA in 2012 are now illegal. Starting in 2019 (IIRC), you won't even be able to buy ammo online or in a store any more without a special license from the state. There is zero doubt in my mind they will continue making gun laws worse for honest folks, until firearms can't be legally owned or enjoyed anymore. Meanwhile ganstas still gonna gansta, and still gonna get off on plea deals. What I find particularly saddening is that even the police out here realize how bad the laws have become. I've met some great folks who carry firearms for a living here, and they all understand how screwed-up this state is politically. They support people like us, who enjoy firearms, understand the value of hard work, and take personal defense seriously. Yet things don't seem to get better out here. Up there in Sacramento, they just keep doubling down on stupid, forgiving criminals and punishing honest people. It's too bad, because this state really truly does have a lot of nice places and people in it. They're just outnumbered and/or politically outgunned by the real nut-cases.
Guns matter to me a lot, as do personal responsibility and the right to self defense. None of this is in line with CA's political agenda. I've come up with a solution I can live with in the long-term, but I promise you I won't be in CA one day longer than the military says I have to be.
So a SOCOM is legal?
No need for a bullet button?
If this is true then it would be a SOCOM and a 9mm 1911.
sevenhelmet
04-02-17, 15:10
So a SOCOM is legal?
No need for a bullet button?
If this is true then it would be a SOCOM and a 9mm 1911.
Only if you're willing to register your SOCOM, or permanently modify it as a breech-loading, fixed magazine SOCOM. Bullet buttons are no longer approved by the state, so don't waste your money on them.
The other thing a lot of people overlook is that, per the law, every firearm that is brought into the state has to be registered with the state, for a nominal fee of $19.00 per firearm. Because, you know, they're dangerous and all...
Only if you're willing to register your SOCOM, or permanently modify it as a breech-loading, fixed magazine SOCOM. Bullet buttons are no longer approved by the state, so don't waste your money on them.
The other thing a lot of people overlook is that, per the law, every firearm that is brought into the state has to be registered with the state, for a nominal fee of $19.00 per firearm. Because, you know, they're dangerous and all...
Only pistols brought into the state have to be registered, don't have to register anything else. As far as obeying the new round of laws, making the magazine fixed, or registering it as an AW when they get around to letting people register, that's up to each person as to what they decide what to do. Me personally, I'm not registering anything and am still undecided if I'm going to make my guns featureless or swap out the bullet button for the new ones, or just say F it and just ignore the law. You have until Jan 1, 2018 to make the decision.
So I can take a regular SOCOM and register it and I am good to go.
Or I can convert a SOCOM into a fixed magazine, what ever and not register it and be good to go.
Digital_Damage
04-02-17, 15:48
Only if you're willing to register your SOCOM, or permanently modify it as a breech-loading, fixed magazine SOCOM. Bullet buttons are no longer approved by the state, so don't waste your money on them.
The other thing a lot of people overlook is that, per the law, every firearm that is brought into the state has to be registered with the state, for a nominal fee of $19.00 per firearm. Because, you know, they're dangerous and all...
To clarify his post. If you register it (is done when purchasing it in a CA store) no bullet button needed.
So big deal.
Register it and get a 9mm 1911, and that is it.
CA is a state, I will be there I think at most a year. At the end of the time me and my guns leave the state and join the rest of my guns in freedom. But I will have put a lot of bucks in my pocket.
Does that make me a whore?
Does that make me a whore?
If you genuinely enjoy what you are doing, no.
If you have to turn your head, close your eyes, and weep silently into your pillow at night, yes.
Source: I watched Pretty Woman numerous times over the years.
Digital_Damage
04-02-17, 16:28
So big deal.
Register it and get a 9mm 1911, and that is it.
CA is a state, I will be there I think at most a year. At the end of the time me and my guns leave the state and join the rest of my guns in freedom. But I will have put a lot of bucks in my pocket.
Does that make me a whore?
Yes, yes it does but we are all whores.
If you genuinely enjoy what you are doing, no.
If you have to turn your head, close your eyes, and weep silently into your pillow at night, yes.
Source: I watched Pretty Woman numerous times over the years.
Making money I enjoy. Not for the money sake but for the challenge of it, money is just the score you rack up.
Like the 25 years I was a sniper CK's was the score, that was important between me and my friends.
I like my guns and they are a sign of being a free man. But if I can have a SOCOM that functions normally and when I leave CA I buy a bunch of 20 round mags for it.
Big Deal.
9mm 1911 also not the end of the world.
I think being in the Dominican Republic really changed my mind on what I need to protect me. If I could run ambushes against thieves on my farm with a 12 ga pump and a 10.5" Bowie and get the job done . A SOCOM and 1911 are miles ahead of it.
Yes, yes it does but we are all whores.
I'm not! I mighta been born poor white trash but Fancy is my name!
Digital_Damage
04-02-17, 17:04
Making money I enjoy. Not for the money sake but for the challenge of it, money is just the score you rack up.
Like the 25 years I was a sniper CK's was the score, that was important between me and my friends.
I like my guns and they are a sign of being a free man. But if I can have a SOCOM that functions normally and when I leave CA I buy a bunch of 20 round mags for it.
Big Deal.
9mm 1911 also not the end of the world.
I think being in the Dominican Republic really changed my mind on what I need to protect me. If I could run ambushes against thieves on my farm with a 12 ga pump and a 10.5" Bowie and get the job done . A SOCOM and 1911 are miles ahead of it.
nevermind
MountainRaven
04-02-17, 17:07
I would get a Scout Squad: SOCOMs have dwell time issues.
titsonritz
04-02-17, 17:13
I would definitely go the M1A and 1911 route if I lived out there. Then maybe some pump shotguns, wheelguns and .22's for plinking.
I believe the M1A's with compensators instead of flashiders are legal like this one:
http://www.springfield-armory.com/products/m1a-scout-squad/#AA9120
I couldn't bring most of my guns into the state. Probably go 1911, Rem 870 and something like a Steyr scout.
These are the weapons I had when I was there, plus older S&W wheel guns and Marlin & Winchester lever actions.
So big deal.
Register it and get a 9mm 1911, and that is it.
CA is a state, I will be there I think at most a year. At the end of the time me and my guns leave the state and join the rest of my guns in freedom. But I will have put a lot of bucks in my pocket.
Does that make me a whore?
I think there are better choices than a 9mm 1911 for cost and size and reliably. I really like my 9mm S&W Shield. It has a great balance of size, concealability and mag capacity. Would a G26 be CA legal? Or a G19 with 10 round magazines? The 12GA is an awesome weapon too. I'm a sucker for old cowboy movies. A lever gun in .357 and a new S&W 8 shot .357 would be a fun pair. An M1 carbide is another great little rifle. It was the first patrol rifle I carried as a cop here in VT in the 1992.
Kinda OT, but usmcvet....an M1 carbine as a Patrol Rifle is pretty gangster.
I thought my longpike DRMO M14 was far out but that's full on Screaming Eagle Bush Pointman mess right there.
Bonus points if it was a Korean era with the 25 rounder
What are your needs? 5.56, 9, and 308? Been there done that for a year in Palo Alto. I opted to bring an AR with noveske n4 middy upper, bullet button, and 10-round mags. Same with my 762 obr. I blocked a few pmags to 10 rounds and picked up 10 round mags for my g17. I also brought my benelli m1s90. My MGs, suppressors, SBRs , and standard semiautos were left in a free state locked inside a safe that was stored inside a friend's walk in vault.
If I had it to do over again I would choose:
Ares SCR lower and the upper of your choosing.
Whatever pistol you like with 10-round mags.
A light 16" bolt action rifle with detachable mag, likely a Steyr.
I think bullet buttons suck. I had one that was supposedly "convertible" and found it to not really live up to the task. They are very cumbersome. I would greatly prefer the SCR lower as a featureless build. At least you keep a detachable mag.
Depending on where you are moving you may or may not be able to get a CCW permit. In Palo Alto it was a no-go. I didn't even attempt it as I knew I was there for only a year.
Kinda OT, but usmcvet....an M1 carbine as a Patrol Rifle is pretty gangster.
I thought my longpike DRMO M14 was far out but that's full on Screaming Eagle Bush Pointman mess right there.
Bonus points if it was a Korean era with the 25 rounder
I am ashamed I don't remember the make of the M1. We had two patrol cars. Each had a 12GA and one held an M1 Carbine with 30 round mag and two 15's on the stock. The other car had an UZI with a 32 round magazine. I shot my first deer with the UZI after it had been hit by a car. The Chief and Sgt. and the other full time cop all carried 1911's. It was hillarious when people would walk up to them and say excuse me officer. Your pistol is cocked. I was teased because I carried a .40 S&W Glock 23.
The department provided ammo for .38, .357, 9mm & .45. I had to buy my own ammo. That's why I shot the deer with the UZI! =). That was a strange weapon. It had the cool factor but it was way too heavy for a semi. I liked the M1 Carbine. It would be even better today with the ammo we have available.
Personally, I refuse to follow unconstitutional laws- so I'd say fvck it and bring whatever.
You wanna follow illegitimate laws- 870 or 590 and a 10 round .45, doesn't really matter what. Lever action .357 mag, M1A, whatever makes more sense.
My advice to everyone is don't follow unconstitutional laws- they'd go away overnight if everyone wasn't such a fvcming cuck
But what do I know- I'm just a dumb ass sumabitch who believes in right and wrong and doesn't give a fvck about bullshit unconstitutional "laws".
When you're there, please tell all the Californians you see that Colorado sucks and they should avoid it at all cost.
I would get a Scout Squad: SOCOMs have dwell time issues.
I have also heard of more problems with the SOCOM than the 18".
For a year? Whatever pistol you train with now and 10 round mags. A shotgun if you are confident running it, if not then an M1 carbine. Maybe a PC9/40 if you can find one or a Mini14 if you can stomach paying 8 or 900 for it...
See you can say all that, and I can agree with you, but unfortunately Modern Policework is a racket.
Jerome Harris gets caught with a hogleg sawed way off at both ends and ATF yawns at me, the DA tosses the state charge and just goes with felon in possession plus time served and all sorts of Monty Hall BS.
If YOUR narrow, tax paying, job having ass is one micro-meter off compliance they will shove the full weight of the US Govt up your ass like a jackhammer.
Why? You have seizable assets, property, etc. etc.
Jerome doesn't have shit and aint ever gonna have shit. All he does is eat sleep and shit. Plus he has HIV, Hep, Herp, Hypertension, Diabetic Foot pain, and actually costs more to jail whereas you will have some sobbing wife/sister/mother ponying up bail, court costs, etc, etc. and thereby they turn a profit.
So there it is. You obey the Law because the Law applies to you. You enjoy your 2nd Amendment privileges if you follow the rules
If you elect to freelance, then you better be accustomed to living in a shithole and not having anything. Most people in honest, tax paying society cannot make that adjustment.
I have an active, running theory that if DeMarco Daniels ever got caught with a full on M240 and a yard long belt that the charge would be just the same as if he had a Cobray Derringer.
Simply because he dont have shit. Thats why he is slinging and stealing.
Can't rob a poor person. Waste of time, effort, and ammo.
I have also heard of more problems with the SOCOM than the 18".
For a year? Whatever pistol you train with now and 10 round mags. A shotgun if you are confident running it, if not then an M1 carbine. Maybe a PC9/40 if you can find one or a Mini14 if you can stomach paying 8 or 900 for it...
Just like the 5" .45 ACP 1911 is typically the model reliable model of the type of pistol.
The original M1A 22" barreled model is the most reliable and trouble free M14 copy.
I've shot all of the Springfield M1As except for the high-end target models. The 16" SOCOM with a brake makes my 14.5 AR sound like a pellet gun. Between the short barrel and the brake it's way too loud.
The 18" Scout model was easier on the ears and shot pretty good (50 and 100 yards) with iron sights.
It was pretty surprising to me that the rifle I ended up liking the most was the standard 22" M1A loaded model with the walnut stock. It was more accurate with iron sights than the two shorter models, cycled smoother, and was more quiet even with a brake.
It might be worth shooting the different models before purchasing one.
Personally, I refuse to follow unconstitutional laws- so I'd say fvck it and bring whatever.
You wanna follow illegitimate laws- 870 or 590 and a 10 round .45, doesn't really matter what. Lever action .357 mag, M1A, whatever makes more sense.
My advice to everyone is don't follow unconstitutional laws- they'd go away overnight if everyone wasn't such a fvcming cuck
But what do I know- I'm just a dumb ass sumabitch who believes in right and wrong and doesn't give a fvck about bullshit unconstitutional "laws".
When you're there, please tell all the Californians you see that Colorado sucks and they should avoid it at all cost.
A bit of Irish Democracy?
What are your needs? 5.56, 9, and 308? Been there done that for a year in Palo Alto. I opted to bring an AR with noveske n4 middy upper, bullet button, and 10-round mags. Same with my 762 obr. I blocked a few pmags to 10 rounds and picked up 10 round mags for my g17. I also brought my benelli m1s90. My MGs, suppressors, SBRs , and standard semiautos were left in a free state locked inside a safe that was stored inside a friend's walk in vault.
If I had it to do over again I would choose:
Ares SCR lower and the upper of your choosing.
Whatever pistol you like with 10-round mags.
A light 16" bolt action rifle with detachable mag, likely a Steyr.
I think bullet buttons suck. I had one that was supposedly "convertible" and found it to not really live up to the task. They are very cumbersome. I would greatly prefer the SCR lower as a featureless build. At least you keep a detachable mag.
Depending on where you are moving you may or may not be able to get a CCW permit. In Palo Alto it was a no-go. I didn't even attempt it as I knew I was there for only a year.
Ares renamed to FightLite last year, but yeah, the Ares/FightLite SCR is pretty neat. I kind of want one and I don't have an AWB in my state.
I would probably not use an AR15 for HD if I lived in CA. I would go with an SKS or Mossberg500 shotgun, then a 1911 in 45acp. I would use a neutered AR or AK for recreational shooting only.
California is a nice state that is ruined by its politics and stupid laws...
I am looking at several different options.
But a M1 carbine is not a bad little gun with the right ammo.
Then a 9mm pistol that can take an RMR.
Bolt rifle for fun.
But I am as said looking at other ways to solve the problem.
Digital_Damage
04-03-17, 08:27
Personally, I refuse to follow unconstitutional laws- so I'd say fvck it and bring whatever.
You wanna follow illegitimate laws- 870 or 590 and a 10 round .45, doesn't really matter what. Lever action .357 mag, M1A, whatever makes more sense.
My advice to everyone is don't follow unconstitutional laws- they'd go away overnight if everyone wasn't such a fvcming cuck
But what do I know- I'm just a dumb ass sumabitch who believes in right and wrong and doesn't give a fvck about bullshit unconstitutional "laws".
When you're there, please tell all the Californians you see that Colorado sucks and they should avoid it at all cost.
ummm ya... don't listen to this shit.
It's all fun and games until you meet Raoul in the clink.
All seriousness, I'd bring my Ruger Scout (if legal?), 1873/94/95 lever guns, and revolvers. I'd hate to have to modify anything I already own or buy something stupid just to comply with their nonsense on a temporary basis.
I don't know why everyone is recommending 1911s. You can buy Glocks, S&Ws, and most others in any gun store here. And there are a lot of gun stores...
Not moronic in the slightest. They remove one of the driving requirements for the original concept of the AR, they are retarded. There are FAR better options for long guns in HD situations than the AR if you can't have a removable magazine or other intended features.
And lets be honest, which is more probable. You have to use your weapon in a home defense situation or you have to remove your BB to fight off hoarding zombies during the apocalypse...
My advice to the OP is get a system that is fully featured for its platform and become as efficient with it as possible and be confident in your skills with it.
You didn't look up Raddlock did you? I don't have to remove anything.
My "Go To California" rifle would be the Fightlite SCR. No bullet button needed. I don't know why this rifle isn't a run away success in the Occupied Zone. I would include a dedicated 22 upper.
For a handgun, I'd probably buy a Glock 19 before moving. I wouldn't bother with a shotgun unless I planned to go bird hunting. I might consider a bolt action 22-250 for blowing up jackrabbits out in the Mojave desert
Ares renamed to FightLite last year, but yeah, the Ares/FightLite SCR is pretty neat. I kind of want one and I don't have an AWB in my state.
I feel the same.
MountainRaven
04-03-17, 13:32
I think there are better choices than a 9mm 1911 for cost and size and reliably. I really like my 9mm S&W Shield. It has a great balance of size, concealability and mag capacity. Would a G26 be CA legal? Or a G19 with 10 round magazines? The 12GA is an awesome weapon too. I'm a sucker for old cowboy movies. A lever gun in .357 and a new S&W 8 shot .357 would be a fun pair. An M1 carbide is another great little rifle. It was the first patrol rifle I carried as a cop here in VT in the 1992.
I don't believe there is.
I don't know why everyone is recommending 1911s. You can buy Glocks, S&Ws, and most others in any gun store here. And there are a lot of gun stores...
Because there is no sense in selecting a handgun designed around a capacity greater than ten rounds and whose reliability is compromised by the modifications necessary to reduce its capacity.
My requirements are a fighting-sized handgun I can conceal as well as a Glock 19. The 1911 is the only pistol I am aware of that meets that criteria and was designed to hold ten rounds of ammunition or fewer. 9mm still wins out over 45 for me, but I don't see a problem necessarily with choosing 45 over 9mm.
Sure, there are smaller guns that hold ten rounds or less of 9mm. But they are guns to carry when one is not carrying a handgun, not a handgun one chooses because one expects to actually fight with it.
Digital_Damage
04-03-17, 14:22
You didn't look up Raddlock did you? I don't have to remove anything.
Did... it is equally limited as other offerings. As evident in the long list of replies in this thread, from a functionality point of view there is no reason to own an AR in CA.
Digital_Damage
04-03-17, 14:24
I don't know why everyone is recommending 1911s. You can buy Glocks, S&Ws, and most others in any gun store here. And there are a lot of gun stores...
Because once again you are trying to stick a square peg in a round hole.
the 1911 is purpose built to hold under 10 rounds, it is not a comprise. Glocks and S&w were not made to hold fewer than 10 rounds, the design and ergonomics were designed for double stack in mind.
under the strict law in California, I would have a nice 1911 like an Infinity Arms single stack in 45 ACP or 38 Super.
I'd probably prefer a 1911 in 45. But live in a free state and want one in 9mm anyway.
I clarified that for a 9mm that I'd get a 225 or maybe a 239.
I oh so fondly remember the ban and have some ban era 10 rounders and a double stack size 10 round gun is kinda lame. I liked my Glock though (still do) but a 225 old and new is pretty concealable and has a legit single stack grip. I have big hands but if I am using a single stack capacity, then I'd want a single stack grip as it is most comfortable.
I wouldn't recommend it for modern era but I love my Walther P5. That pistol is sort of a safe queen now but is what a single stack 9 should be.
I'm just saying what I would do if I decided to move to Cali. I would have to lose a lot of interest in guns, but if I did; then I would be all on that single stack life.
M1 Carbines are nice, but if I felt I needed a .223 and only got 10 rounds then I'd get a Mini-14. Not ideal, not my first choice but nobody questions a wood stock Mini 14. Within 100 yards it only has to be minute of man. Newer ones have better mounts and I'd pop on an aimpoint.
It'd be great if California had full 2nd Amendment freedom but for whatever reason the state of Reagan has opted to vote their freedoms away.
under the strict law in California, I would have a nice 1911 like an Infinity Arms single stack in 45 ACP or 38 Super.
however, I would not live in a state where the law enforcement has full auto MP5's and M16's and I am regulated to just 10 rounds in a single fire weapon. The Infinity Arms single stack I mentioned above would be the only gun California knew about.
Maybe if you have always wanted one, it could be a good excuse. There is no practical reason I can think of to not just use the pistol you train with and 10 round mags.
It'd be great if California had full 2nd Amendment freedom but for whatever reason the state of Reagan has opted to vote their freedoms away.
Not much voting on it. State legislature kind of does what it wants.
Right now, everyone is waiting for the new rules on the new "assault rifle" definitions and registration requirements to be posted. A full four months into the law, and we still don't know how to comply (no unconstitutional laws rhetoric, please).
Others have opined about the M-1 carbine. I saw a 9mm version at my LGS, but haven't heard of any experiences with it. Looks like a good solve.
As for the Fightlite, $1100 is a lot of scratch for that gun. I always wonders why Remington made a 7615 pump, but never a 7415 semi. Or why at this point Ruger doesn't make a Mini-15 (not a typo) that takes STANAG magazines.
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$1100 isn't that bad for a featureless rifle that takes AR uppers and mags without looking like it was designed by Picasso. I'd rather put the money into the SCR than a Mini and the SCR is handier than any M14 variant. I cannot think of any self loading rifle that's a better fit for the mission in question.
The Glock 19 works for me because I left a variety of pre ban mags in the Occupied Zone with friends
crusader377
04-03-17, 16:59
I honesty would be extremely cautious with firearms in CA due to the insane gun laws and the tendency of politicians and district attorneys in the state to make stuff up as they go along. Given that information, I would run something that their is no debating its legality for pistols that would be either a quality M1911 or perhaps a good revolver like a S&W 686 plus. For a rifle, I would run with either a good Winchester or Marlin lever action or a bolt action like a Ruger Gunsite. I personally wouldn't run any high capacity pistols using a reduce capacity magazine due to possible reliability issues and if you ever had to use your weapon defensively, you risk have some over zealous DA or politician try to screw you by claiming you had a high capacity weapon even though you were using reduced capacity magazines.
Sorry to hear that you have been sentenced to Commiefornia, I hate it here. I'll just leave you suggestions and some facts here, because some of the questions are complicated and you should double check on anything anyone says. I closely follow the changes in the laws, but there are nuances:
1. As others have suggested, get an account on CalGuns.net. Ask your question there too.
2. Every long gun coming into CA (except rimfire) will have to be registered (check on this). They care most about semi-auto rifles and shotguns. But I think they all have to be registered.
3. Possession of magazines over ten rounds will be illegal by the end of the year. Use is already illegal, possession will be.
4. You may bring "assault weapons" into CA if they are first converted to something called "featureless". You'll have to look this up.
5. You may bring unregistered parts (like an upper) into CA. You may bring stripped registered pieces (such as a stripped AR lower) into CA as long as you don't make them into an illegal configuration once here. It must become "featureless". And FLASH HIDERS are not legal. Check to see if the stripped serialized parts need to be registered when coming into CA, I believe you do.
6. SBRs and other NFA items are generally illegal in CA. Rifle OAL must be 30" or more (unlike 26" in many free states). As of this moment the over all lengths (OAL) do not need to be strictly permanent. A stock may not fold or collapse on a "featureless" rifle. And barrels must be 16" permanent as in most states.
7. Rifles that are already featureless such as Mini-14s, M1As, etc. will not have to be modified unless they are under 30" OAL and/or have a flash hider. Flash Hiders will have to be swapped out with a thread protector or a compensator with no flash suppression.
8. The bottom line is that you can bring in most rifles and shotguns by doing cheap mods. OR disassembling them.
9. Handguns - You cannot bring in AR, AK, or other assault weapon based (magazine not in grip) semi-auto pistols (check on this, its complicated)
10. For normal handguns (rifled barrels, not shotgun) you can bring in almost anything as of right now. In fact, right now you can buy what you want out of state and bring it with you. We cannot get a lot of pistols that are common else where. (double check, I don't know for sure there hasn't been a change on this.) Don't bother with 1911's you can get those here.
11. Move quickly! We just had a bunch of law changes. The regulations were put out and then pulled back. So we are in limbo, decide what you want to do and then check to see if its OK, then move quickly.
12 Lastly, if you have a lot of ammo bring it with you. There are ammo laws going into affect at the end of this year that will raise the cost of ammo, probably significantly. All ammo purchased after this year will have to be bought through an "approved" store and you will be background checked on EVERY ammo purchase. So, bring your ammo and buy more here before 1/1/2018.
Like I said those are the general guide lines. Get a CalGuns account and run your thoughts through them. Good luck and welcome to Commiefornia.
BTW - All Gen 3 Glocks are available to you here. If you want a Gen 4 buy it before you come. Same with HK VP9, Walther PPQ Gen2, Sig P320, etc. Generally newly designed handguns are unavailable here. There is a handgun ROSTER of the handguns you can buy in CA -->http://certguns.doj.ca.gov
Benelli MR1 with a Monte Carlo type stock is also an interesting, albeit expensive (for what it is) option. I would personally opt for a fight light SCR. A browning BAR (the modern hunting rifle) in 308 may also be a good option.
Benelli MR1 with a Monte Carlo type stock is also an interesting, albeit expensive (for what it is) option. I would personally opt for a fight light SCR. A browning BAR (the modern hunting rifle) in 308 may also be a good option.
You can bring a SCAR 17 or any AR 308 with you as long as it is featureless. Here is a pic of one possible featureless configuration. BTW there are some new featureless grips coming that will be better.
44813
You can bring a SCAR 17 or any AR 308 with you as long as it is featureless. Here is a pic of one possible featureless configuration. BTW there are some new featureless grips coming that will be better.
44813
I would prefer the SCR or a non-AR over any of the CA permissible conventional AR options.
Here is what I am thinking now.
Pistol
High end 1911 in 9mm
Some kind of single stack 9mm sized like CZ P09 or P07 . I wish S&W performance center still had 639 with a great action job
Maybe 2 HK P7
some small single stack pocket pistol
M1 Carbine
Scout Squad
Bolt gun for fun
I dont like the idea of a Glock 19 or 17 with a 10 round mag. I can fit 2 10 round single stacks in the same size as a Glock mag.
I would prefer the SCR or a non-AR over any of the CA permissible conventional AR options.
Well, knock yourself out, but most people that live here feel differently. The only difference is the the grip. Neither can have a flash hider, or an adjustable stock, so the only difference is the grip. The SCR makes some sense but the design is not that well tested and there is no .308 version. And the M1A is just plain unacceptable to me, it is a terrible platform and not a good rifle. Plus you give up modularity, and optics mounts are a pain.
RetroRevolver77
04-03-17, 20:16
Well, knock yourself out, but most people that live here feel differently. The only difference is the the grip. Neither can have a flash hider, or an adjustable stock, so the only difference is the grip. The SCR makes some sense but the design is not that well tested and there is no .308 version. And the M1A is just plain unacceptable to me, it is a terrible platform and not a good rifle. Plus you give up modularity, and optics mounts are a pain.
What?
LOL
Sgt. Hartman would have some words for you.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7LhntG_8PUs
Here is what I am thinking now.
Pistol
High end 1911 in 9mm
Some kind of single stack 9mm sized like CZ P09 or P07 . I wish S&W performance center still had 639 with a great action job
Maybe 2 HK P7
some small single stack pocket pistol
M1 Carbine
Scout Squad
Bolt gun for fun
I dont like the idea of a Glock 19 or 17 with a 10 round mag. I can fit 2 10 round single stacks in the same size as a Glock mag.
Are you thinking of buying these before coming to CA? Because some of this stuff is easy to buy in CA. If you buy a Glock 42 or 43 and bring it to CA you can sell it for twice what you paid for it. Same with many other handguns that are not available in CA.
You can buy an M1, M1A, SCR, Mini-14, or any other semi-auto featureless rifle in CA, you don't need to buy before coming.
What?
LOL
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7LhntG_8PUs
Wow, that is some real knuckle dragger thinking you got going there.
Wow, that is some real knuckle dragger thinking you got going there.
Just say a small mental prayer and walk away whistling. You get to bless a heart and not deal with a farfetched reason.
I was responsible for, and relied on, an M14 for 2 years and knowing what I know now, never again for your reasons outlined. Pretty rifle but....nah.
Per Yoni, where would you get two HK P7s?
Do you hate money or have too much? :p
I don't believe there is.
Because there is no sense in selecting a handgun designed around a capacity greater than ten rounds and whose reliability is compromised by the modifications necessary to reduce its capacity.
My requirements are a fighting-sized handgun I can conceal as well as a Glock 19. The 1911 is the only pistol I am aware of that meets that criteria and was designed to hold ten rounds of ammunition or fewer. 9mm still wins out over 45 for me, but I don't see a problem necessarily with choosing 45 over 9mm.
Sure, there are smaller guns that hold ten rounds or less of 9mm. But they are guns to carry when one is not carrying a handgun, not a handgun one chooses because one expects to actually fight with it.
I hear yah. If it's a house gun it's one thing. I carry a G22 40+ hours a week at work. When I'm not working I don't want a big gun. For years I carried a 5 shot 642. The 9mm Shield is the perfect balance for me. I have a big Hand and I can still shoot it well. I carry it in my front pocket most of the time. I love it.
1911's are awesome. They are bigger and heavier than what I'm willing to carry. Someone mentioned a 38 Super. That would be a very cool option. I'd probably stick with a .45. But get what you want not what we want.
I'm not sure if he can get a LTC in CA. OP can you get a LTC? I forgot about the Sig P220. I had one years ago. It's what I taught my ex wife to shoot with. Awesome gun and the newer ones should have a rail. That's why I suggested a G19. I want a light on my pistol when possible. They're also more affordable.
Because once again you are trying to stick a square peg in a round hole.
the 1911 is purpose built to hold under 10 rounds, it is not a comprise. Glocks and S&w were not made to hold fewer than 10 rounds, the design and ergonomics were designed for double stack in mind.
Depends in the gun. That's why I mentioned the G26 & Shield in 9mm. The P225 is a very cool option too and it's still small enough. Do they still make them? I sold the one I had.
under the strict law in California, I would have a nice 1911 like an Infinity Arms single stack in 45 ACP or 38 Super.
.38 Suoer is a cool round. Are many companies making defensive ammo in that Calibre? I know CorBon used to. I talked a buddy out of a 16Ga recently. Told him 12 or 20 were what I suggested because of availability of ammo.
I found your pistol!
https://shop.bravocompanymfg.com/Bravo-Company-MFG-BCM-1911-9mm-Wilson-Combat-p/wc-bcm-1911-9mm.htm
Or
http://shop.bravocompanymfg.com/Bravo-Company-MFG-BCM-1911-45-ACP-Wilson-Combat-p/wc-bcm-1911b.htm
The P225's I saw on gun broker are $8-900. Too pricey for me.
Well, knock yourself out, but most people that live here feel differently. The only difference is the the grip. Neither can have a flash hider, or an adjustable stock, so the only difference is the grip. The SCR makes some sense but the design is not that well tested and there is no .308 version. And the M1A is just plain unacceptable to me, it is a terrible platform and not a good rifle. Plus you give up modularity, and optics mounts are a pain.
Different strokes for different folks. Not my cup o tea, though I understand your perspective. I would really like to see well designed well executed options for CA gun owners.
Didn't know Cali completely banned use of mags holding more than ten rounds. I forgot about the reliability problems with reduced capacity Glock mags. The suggestion of a 1911 does make more sense.
Before you can purchase firearms in Cali, you need to establish residency. I believe you also have to take a gun safety test our have taken and passed a hunter safely course before buying a handgun.
Have they eased up on issuing CCWs?
Didn't know Cali completely banned use of mags holding more than ten rounds. I forgot about the reliability problems with reduced capacity Glock mags. The suggestion of a 1911 does make more sense.
Before you can purchase firearms in Cali, you need to establish residency. I believe you also have to take a gun safety test our have taken and passed a hunter safely course before buying a handgun.
Have they eased up on issuing CCWs?
Yeah, you have to take a test, but it is pretty easy if you just pick the most PC answers possible.
You can get a CCW in some counties. If you live in the counties with big liberal cities you'll never get a CCW. There are some which are easier, Sacramento County, Fresno County and most of the rural/mountain counties. Forget the Bay Area or LA area, or San Diego area. There is a whole section on this at CalGuns.
Yeah, you have to take a test, but it is pretty easy if you just pick the most PC answers possible.
You can get a CCW in some counties. If you live in the counties with big liberal cities you'll never get a CCW. There are some which are easier, Sacramento County, Fresno County and most of the rural/mountain counties. Forget the Bay Area or LA area, or San Diego area. There is a whole section on this at CalGuns.
Question: Is a Cali CCW good Statewide or just for that County? I heard it is weird how they do it. Like a guy in good with his Sheriff in a deep Red, rural county might have a problem CCWing in the middle of LA or some such despite having a license.
Just asking. My time in Cali was short, sweet, and guns were not a priority in my thoughtpath at that time
Question: Is a Cali CCW good Statewide or just for that County? I heard it is weird how they do it. Like a guy in good with his Sheriff in a deep Red, rural county might have a problem CCWing in the middle of LA or some such despite having a license.
Just asking. My time in Cali was short, sweet, and guns were not a priority in my thoughtpath at that time
If you have a CA CCW it is good in all of CA. Doesn't mean officer Rodriguez of the LAPD knows that though. He didn't want to let me enter LAX with my properly locked and unloaded G26 on my way to a free state where I can legally carry while I'm there for work. His Sarge had to come over and literally MAKE the trembling, sweating young man give me back my gun after an ID check and the serial number came back clean.
Did... it is equally limited as other offerings. As evident in the long list of replies in this thread, from a functionality point of view there is no reason to own an AR in CA.
No its not. Not at all. A 30 second demonstration with you standing in front of my gun safe would convince you otherwise.
Frankly, it sucks that two people in the USA even have to have this discussion or disagreement. Its despicable, just like the law-makers who made these stupid laws.
You think what you want. I'll keep on doing what works for me, and everyone else whose seen one demonstrated.
.38 Super is a cool round. Are many companies making defensive ammo in that Calibre? I know CorBon used to. I talked a buddy out of a 16Ga recently. Told him 12 or 20 were what I suggested because of availability of ammo.
I doubt it, its popular mostly in Mexico where .45 ACP is illegal to own. .38 is mostly offered in 1911 pistols and a few revolvers and there are maybe 3 companies that offer a 1911 in .38 super which is Colt 1911, Infinity Arms 1911 ($5800) and STI ($4300) which is a IDPA race gun. None of those you would want to carry in there natural state but subtract the mag well, thumb rest and compensator and you could have a decent carry gun.
Some one on here said and suggested that California is in a state of regulatory process concerning guns, and there is a lot that can be said about that. I honestly thought the first gun laws passed a couple years ago couldn't get worse and yet, they did. It appears that California is passing legislation and laws dealing with firearms on a 6 month basis and all these new laws are regulatory an restrictive. I would guess 2 years down the road, it wont matter if you have a "featureless" rifle or not. I would bet that in as few as 5 years, owning any "military grade weapon" regardless of features will be illegal. Hi cap mags are already illegal to own/possess/sell/transfer and its only a matter of time before assault rifles are completely banned and illegal. I see a few possible scenarios" based on the crazy laws previously passed.
1. all pistols are regulated to single stack magazine that can carry no more than 7+1 with a barrel length of at least 5 inches
2. Hollow points, +p, personal defense ammo will be banned for consumer/civilian use
3. Military style assault rifles regardless of features will be banned from consumer/civilian/recreational use unless you go through a rigorous process- like the UK, and you take ownership but no possession
4. Possibly a California equivalent of the European style magazine release on handguns located on the bottom of the grip and not a lever or button for one handed operation.
5. possibly laser engraved parts like lower/upper/magazine/barrel/frame with the firearm owners information and DL number and possibly a government issued number- they tried putting a QR code on ammo but wasn't feasible
ive heard some rumors and they may not be true but I heard that SIG, FN, S&W and Magpul withheld from submitting bids to the California Dept. of Corrections, California Highway Patrol and a majority of State officials because of the harsh laws. They guy I get a lot of the stuff I put on PIF bought something like 3,800 S&W 5906's from the California Department of Corrections and sold them Glock 17's at a huge discount because Glock would not sell direct to California, he then sold the 5906's for like $350 each, he technically made like $360 on each glock he sold them and he sold them 4200.
Because there is no sense in selecting a handgun designed around a capacity greater than ten rounds and whose reliability is compromised by the modifications necessary to reduce its capacity.
How is the reliability compromised by the mag capacity? That makes no sense. I have used 10 rounders, 15 rounders, 17 rounders, modified 23 rounders and those silly 33 rounders for the G18s. All mags functioned perfectly in all of my G19s.
The 10 round mags are the same size as the 15 round mags. It has no impact on the function of the gun.
Does your G19 stop functioning after you fire 6 rounds out of your standard 15 round mag? Of course not. So why would one not function with a 10 round mag? I just put 200 rounds through one of my 19s on Sat and another 200 on Sunday. No malfunctions with 10 round mags. No malfunctions with any of them ever with the exception of a female shooter limp-wristing the gun.
M1 garand....
I'd be fine with.
1911 and glock.
Ruger 1022.
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Because once again you are trying to stick a square peg in a round hole.
the 1911 is purpose built to hold under 10 rounds, it is not a comprise. Glocks and S&w were not made to hold fewer than 10 rounds, the design and ergonomics were designed for double stack in mind.
The 10 round mags are a double stack and they are the same size as the standard capacity mags. They have no effect on the function or ergonomics of the gun.
My point for Yoni is that if he wants a Glock here, he can have one. No reason he has to carry around a 1911, unless he just prefers one.
Have they eased up on issuing CCWs?
Getting a CCW here has always been as easy as it is anywhere else in the country, as long as you live in a county that gives them out. As mentioned before L.A. county, San Diego, and most of the area up around San Fran will not give their residents one. Most of the other counties will. Go 50 miles North of Los Angeles to Kern County and anyone who meets the usual qualifications can get one with no problem. Usual qualifications = Over 21, not a convicted felon, not adjudicated mentally ill in a court of law, etc…
You can easily get a CCW in almost every county surrounding L.A. County. This detail is maddening to most of the people who want one and live in the wrong county.
Moose-Knuckle
04-04-17, 04:24
I surmise if I lived in CA it would give me an excuse to acquire that Benelli M4 I've always wanted but couldn't justify . . .
About the HK P7's and where would I get them.
Out of my gun safe, I have 2 P7's that I paid $400 for one of them and $450 for the other one. It was only about 5 years ago that I bought them. Looking at the prices on Gunbroker make me wish I had bought a truck load 5 years ago.
I have gone through a very interesting change in my life regarding guns, they used to matter more to me. After living in Israel for so long where guns were restricted, when I got back to the USA I bought a lot of guns.
Then I bought a plantation in the Dominican Republic, which has even worse gun control than CA or Israel. We bought 2 Maverick pump guns at $1500 a piece and was happy to get them. Pistols are hard to find on the used market and a Glock can be over $5000. I live in a very small town when I am there and rarely go to the capitol and then only to the up scale part of town. Which the head of the police told criminals if you go to the nice part of town, we will not arrest you we will kill you.
I don't carry a shotgun when I go to town, only when I go out to the plantation. The rest of the time I carry a sap and a big Bowie and feel very comfortable.
I currently live in VA and have a Tavor by my bed and carry my CZ P09.
But due to expanding market needs for my company and the among other reasons my 2 partners live in LA, it is clear that I will need to return to the west coast.
I have looked at all the input by every one and can live with the stupid laws in CA. I will buy some property in a county in the norther part of CA to take care of getting my CCW.
I carried a Hi Power for years, so a 1911 in 9mm with RMR is fine with me. So I will get 1 or 2 great 1911 from either Wilson or STI. Grab my 2 P7's from the safe. Buy a M1 carbine and load it with good ammo for my home defense gun. ( Israeli civilian police for years carried these and they work good. Jim Cirillo of NYPD fame stated the M1 with soft point was the only weapon they had that was 1 shot stop 100% of the time)
Bring one of my bolt guns for range therapy.
Buy enough Glock 43's to make a profit to pay for the guns I need to buy.
Buy a place in AZ, where I can put my good guns and visit when I need a fix.
Make money in CA.
It's all good.
Adapt and over come was how I lived my life in uniform and is CA perfect when it comes to guns, nope. Do I wish that democratic leaders weren't so power hungry and stupid, yep.
But we have a motto in hostage rescue in Israel. "Perfection is the enemy, of good enough."
So I look at it this way, the money we should make in CA makes my ROI on my time and my sacrifice on the guns issue, worth it.
The gun list above is good enough.
Now if I had to live in CA forever and was head inside the borders of CA for life, then no it would be worth it.
Digital_Damage
04-04-17, 07:15
The 10 round mags are a double stack and they are the same size as the standard capacity mags. They have no effect on the function or ergonomics of the gun.
My point for Yoni is that if he wants a Glock here, he can have one. No reason he has to carry around a 1911, unless he just prefers one.
Double stack polymer magazine are exactly the reason ergonomics are so terrible on the Glock. It is a design consideration, sub par ergonomics or more capacity encased in a thicker polymer magazine.
No one is saying he can't have a Glock, but if he cant have the higher capacity magazine that the glock was designed for he might as well opt for superior ergonomics.
All I'm saying is don't look at what other states allow and compromise the system by limiting its intended use or characteristics. Purpose built options will serve him better.
TriggerFish
04-04-17, 08:29
Great thread yoni, I have always liked the way you think.
If you do buy a place in AZ perhaps we can finally meet up at the SAR Show where you can find some real weapons that are NOT CA friendly. Also you are always welcome to get some trigger time on my Mini SMG… maybe pick one up for your Arizona safe!
“See” you on MERF next Sunday. Z06 Bill
ETA: every time I travel to LA or San Diego to visit longtime friends I have to make sure there is nothing in my vehicle that could get me an extended stay in a state B&B.
diving dave
04-04-17, 09:47
Having worked in law enforcement in CA for 25 yrs this thread verifies one thing: retiring and leaving that shithole state was the best thing I ever did. And a bunch of guys and gals I worked with are leaving the state in droves when they retire. I know more than a few who are still working there who will ignore the new laws.
Getting a CCW here has always been as easy as it is anywhere else in the country, as long as you live in a county that gives them out. As mentioned before L.A. county, San Diego, and most of the area up around San Fran will not give their residents one. Most of the other counties will. Go 50 miles North of Los Angeles to Kern County and anyone who meets the usual qualifications can get one with no problem. Usual qualifications = Over 21, not a convicted felon, not adjudicated mentally ill in a court of law, etc…
You can easily get a CCW in almost every county surrounding L.A. County. This detail is maddening to most of the people who want one and live in the wrong county.
It wasn't easy at all, when I lived there. When my father got his back in the 70s, he had to show a need. In his case, it was because he owned a business and carried large amounts of cash to the bank. If we had lived over the hill in L.A. county instead of Ventura county, he would have been denied. When he sold his business, he no longer had a need and couldn't get it renewed. He also had to have every handgun he was going to carry listed on his permit
After reading this dreary indictment of a once great state, this comes to mind:
“If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen.”
― Samuel Adams
Samuel Adams was correct for his time. When a group of colonialist were forced to revolt against the king, they had to make a choice liberty or wealth.
Today I don't think the situation is the same. In my case opening up a branch of my company in CA, gives us access to a large market and means a lot of income for me and my 2 partners. My partners live in LA, but both have other places in either AZ or WY.
I need to be in CA for a year or so full time, to help get this up and running. Then after that I am gone, only flying in once a month for the local staff to check up on things.
Would I move there if it was a full time move with zero chance to move back to a free state, nope.
Are not having the guns of my choice enough of a reason to cut myself off from large amounts of profit. I don't think so.
Take the money and run, investing my profit in other business around the world. Which provides good jobs for people and gives my family geographical diversification as well as diversification into different ventures. So please G-D, we will never get wiped out 100% in a financial down turn.
You can call me all sorts of names if you like. But in the world as uncertain as it is today and as small as it has become. I am more than willing to put up with some stupid laws, for the ROI of my time that I believe CA will give me.
For can anyone here tell me I am not armed and protected if I carry a P7 or a 9mm 1911.
For I am the weapon, that is lethal and that will save my life.
Doc Safari
04-04-17, 13:59
So big deal.
Register it and get a 9mm 1911, and that is it.
CA is a state, I will be there I think at most a year. At the end of the time me and my guns leave the state and join the rest of my guns in freedom. But I will have put a lot of bucks in my pocket.
Does that make me a whore?
Since your stay is only temporary, isn't there some way you could store the California-naughty guns out of state? A year is not a long time. I've gone without shooting for a year when I was out of a job and had no money for ammo.
Take a "compliant" firearm with ypu for home defense and maybe rent one of those environment-controlled storage units just across the state line or something for the others.
Barring that, and now I'm speaking theoretically of course, what would happen to that brave soul who knew he was only living in California temporarily and decided to just bring his guns into the state with his mouth kept shut and his behavior discreetly not revealing what he had done?
I'm not advocating breaking the law, but I'm curious as to what might be the risk of getting caught for that brave soul who might be inclined to just hide them in his residence for a year?
I don't violate tax laws and guns laws, I may look for options to help me with both of these kinds of laws. But my evil guns will never see the inside of CA.
Averageman
04-04-17, 15:10
I think if I were going to do this I would buy an older Marlin Guide Gun and put a nice red dot on it and one of those cuffs for the butt-stock that hold several rounds.
I figure it could not only take the fight out of most anyone, it would likely take the fight out of the Buick they are driving also.
I haven't shopped for a 1911 in decades.
I am looking at 9mm from Wilson and STI.
Anyone got any input on either brand, because if I spend big money the thing better work every time like a Glock or my CZ P09.
Digital_Damage
04-04-17, 19:27
I haven't shopped for a 1911 in decades.
I am looking at 9mm from Wilson and STI.
Anyone got any input on either brand, because if I spend big money the thing better work every time like a Glock or my CZ P09.
1911's are one of those "sky is the limit" sort of thing, what is your price point?
MountainRaven
04-04-17, 19:36
I haven't shopped for a 1911 in decades.
I am looking at 9mm from Wilson and STI.
Anyone got any input on either brand, because if I spend big money the thing better work every time like a Glock or my CZ P09.
I have heard good things about both the Wilson and the STI. I personally have a Wilson (albeit not in 9mm) and feel much more confident that it would be a quality weapon. I have also looked at buying one of the 9mm STIs built for export to Australia and may eventually pick one up.
If you want an RMR on your 9mm 1911, you might look at Nighthawk's Shadow Hawk Government. Steve Fisher-endorsed and RMR-equiped from the factory. Link (http://www.nighthawkcustom.com/pistols/1911s-government/shadow-hawk-government-rmr). Steve Fisher reported this pistol in 9mm to an issue of RECOIL's Concealment magazine as being his EDC at the time.
http://www.nighthawkcustom.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/1800x/9a05e486223f6fa0bb1e064fe361d753/s/h/shadowhawk-rmr-color-001.jpg
1911's are one of those "sky is the limit" sort of thing, what is your price point?
What ever it takes to get a 9mm 1911 with a rail and RMR, that goes bang every single time.
I only buy guns with a good resale value. I had like 5 Noveske's and I think I sold them all for $100-200 less than I paid for them, same goes for Knights Armament, FN SCAR, and a couple others. Pistols are different, Glocks generally retail for around $550 and I see them used all the time for around $480, not a huge difference. HK pistols hold there value considerably, usually within 25% of the suggested retail price. 1911 though I have seen quite a few people take a bath on them. Ed Browns, Nighthawk, STI and a few others are most likely worth the original amount paid for them but not worth half the price if selling used. There is a lightly used Nighthawk at my LGS for $1800, the new price was $4300 and it has been sitting since before Christmas. Colts typically go fast, obviously because of the name and the value price associated with it. The reason I mentioned Infinity Arms is because it takes roughly 2 years to get once they receive your down payment. Your typically going to pay around $4300-5200 for a great 1911 and if you had to sell it, you can expect to get 80-85% of your money back. A while back I was seriously debating buying a Christensen Arms 1911 for $4800 but saw too many used ones for $1700. Everyone makes 1911, from Rock Island, Remington, Springfield, and so on. But if your going to buy one, buy one that is worth having. Seriously I would consider looking into buying a single stack .38 super. Its different, not too common and John Dillinger had one.
It wasn't easy at all, when I lived there. When my father got his back in the 70s, he had to show a need. In his case, it was because he owned a business and carried large amounts of cash to the bank. If we had lived over the hill in L.A. county instead of Ventura county, he would have been denied. When he sold his business, he no longer had a need and couldn't get it renewed. He also had to have every handgun he was going to carry listed on his permit
Few people anywhere in the country were getting them in the 70's. Florida paved the way for the current system of "shall issue" starting in 1986. I remember it like it was yesterday. All the libs were running around screaming, "The sky is falling!!!" "There will be shoot outs over every fender bender!!!" "The streets of FL will run red with the blood of innocents!!!" Instead, the FL violent crime rate dropped significantly while the national average climbed ever higher. Other states, including most, but not all of CA, followed suit in the years that followed, and adopted their own "shall issue" laws and got the same results as FL.
If your father had tried to get one in Ventura in the 90's, he would have found the process much easier.
Here's a stupid question-
Are lever action rifles capped at 10 rds in CA?
I seem to remember a few lever guns I'd seen that held a few more.
Double stack polymer magazine are exactly the reason ergonomics are so terrible on the Glock. It is a design consideration, sub par ergonomics or more capacity encased in a thicker polymer magazine.
No one is saying he can't have a Glock, but if he cant have the higher capacity magazine that the glock was designed for he might as well opt for superior ergonomics.
All I'm saying is don't look at what other states allow and compromise the system by limiting its intended use or characteristics. Purpose built options will serve him better.
Now I understand what you are saying. You don't like the ergos of the Glock. This is where we disagree. I prefer the ergos of the Glock to any other handgun. I don't care for 1911 styles at all. I will take a Glock with any size mag in it over a 1911 with a single stack every time.
I don't find the ergonomics of the Glock sub-par or terrible. I find them superior and great. A G19 fits my hand and "feels" better than any purpose built single stack seven, regardless of what size mag is in the Glock. So I don't see what any of this has to do with mag capacity. My Glocks don't "feel" better when they have a 15 round mag in them, because the ergonomics don't change. Because it is not "purpose built" for a 10 round mag, doesn't make it feel or perform any different, and it serves me perfectly.
Moot point anyhow, as Yoni has professed a preference for the 1911 in 9mm. To each his own...
Aren't Tavors fairly easy to convert?
I wish to recant everything and say I would tote two Glock 21s and the meanest Mauser K98 I could find.
Also if Yoni is planning on doing some hardcore jumpout shit in Oakland or South Central. Kinda disgruntled and restless, have gun will travel, no ghetto too grungy, bilingual (Castillan and Cholo), and don't mind being your cover man while you do the Shabbois thing.
Can provide own maglite.
Just saying.....not soliciting but not turning down either.
I carried a Hi Power for years, so a 1911 in 9mm with RMR is fine with me. So I will get 1 or 2 great 1911 from either Wilson or STI. Grab my 2 P7's from the safe. Buy a M1 carbine and load it with good ammo for my home defense gun. ( Israeli civilian police for years carried these and they work good. Jim Cirillo of NYPD fame stated the M1 with soft point was the only weapon they had that was 1 shot stop 100% of the time)
Speaking from personal experience with several M1 Carbines--they do not run reliably enough with softpoints to stake your life on.
Below is a picture that shows a full metal jacket round first with a round of softpoint that failed to feed in the middle and a round of the softpoint straight from the box. Notice the wedge or gouge in nose of the middle round. This was from when the round caught on the feedramp when it failed to feed. Also notice that the soft lead tip has flattened out somewhat compared to next round over which is a fresh from the box softpoint. I ejected a softpoint round that did feed and noticed similar markings on its tip to those that failed to feed.
44850
If I had to go with a CA legal semiauto rifle I would probably go with the Paratroop Version of the SKS (it is just a name they gave it). It has a 16" barrel as opposed to the 20" barrel for a regular SKS and is short and handy. It has a 10 round fixed magazine that can quickly be reloaded from stripper clips.
About the HK P7's and where would I get them.
Out of my gun safe, I have 2 P7's that I paid $400 for one of them and $450 for the other one. It was only about 5 years ago that I bought them. Looking at the prices on Gunbroker make me wish I had bought a truck load 5 years ago.
You and me both. $400 P7 PSPs were the dream and a short lived one at that. Thankfully I grabbed a few. Had 6 at one point, now I'm down to 4. Two original blue, two that I hard chromed.
http://i.imgur.com/y2VqVaR.jpg
Now I understand what you are saying. You don't like the ergos of the Glock. This is where we disagree. I prefer the ergos of the Glock to any other handgun. I don't care for 1911 styles at all. I will take a Glock with any size mag in it over a 1911 with a single stack every time.
I don't find the ergonomics of the Glock sub-par or terrible. I find them superior and great. A G19 fits my hand and "feels" better than any purpose built single stack seven, regardless of what size mag is in the Glock. So I don't see what any of this has to do with mag capacity. My Glocks don't "feel" better when they have a 15 round mag in them, because the ergonomics don't change. Because it is not "purpose built" for a 10 round mag, doesn't make it feel or perform any different, and it serves me perfectly.
Moot point anyhow, as Yoni has professed a preference for the 1911 in 9mm. To each his own...
That's pretty much where I was going too. With magazine capacity limits I'm switching from 9mm to .45 and I shoot a 1911 so much better than I shoot a Glock it isn't funny. I wouldn't have a problem running a G19 with a 10 round magazine and I shoot it well enough, but I grew up on 1911s not Glocks and that's where I get my best results. P7 would be my low profile carry.
MountainRaven
04-05-17, 01:27
Speaking from personal experience with several M1 Carbines--they do not run reliably enough with softpoints to stake your life on.
Below is a picture that shows a full metal jacket round first with a round of softpoint that failed to feed in the middle and a round of the softpoint straight from the box. Notice the wedge or gouge in nose of the middle round. This was from when the round caught on the feedramp when it failed to feed. Also notice that the soft lead tip has flattened out somewhat compared to next round over which is a fresh from the box softpoint. I ejected a softpoint round that did feed and noticed similar markings on its tip to those that failed to feed.
44850
If I had to go with a CA legal semiauto rifle I would probably go with the Paratroop Version of the SKS (it is just a name they gave it). It has a 16" barrel as opposed to the 20" barrel for a regular SKS and is short and handy. It has a 10 round fixed magazine that can quickly be reloaded from stripper clips.
I would choose the Barnes bullet for the 30 Carbine, personally. I mean... it is California.
The SKS isn't a bad option, but I'd probably go for one of the NOS Yugoslavian guns. Or maybe pick up one of the rumored VEPR/Molot SKS rifles.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-PbH1ztpkGU
The reason I lean toward 1911 V Glock, is the size of the magazine. In the same pocket space I can carry 1 Glock magazine, 2 1911 mags will fit in the same space.
Every day carry will be P7.
But for synagogue I want a bigger pistol that can be fitted with a RMR.
The reason I lean toward 1911 V Glock, is the size of the magazine. In the same pocket space I can carry 1 Glock magazine, 2 1911 mags will fit in the same space.
Every day carry will be P7.
But for synagogue I want a bigger pistol that can be fitted with a RMR.
Ya know the more I read this thread the more I want to try an RMR. Like the RDS I wasn't interested for years. I am still more or an irons first guy. I don't like the idea of batteries. Do you need suppressor height sights to be able to use the irons if the RMR fails.
Since your stay is only temporary, isn't there some way you could store the California-naughty guns out of state? A year is not a long time. I've gone without shooting for a year when I was out of a job and had no money for ammo.
Take a "compliant" firearm with ypu for home defense and maybe rent one of those environment-controlled storage units just across the state line or something for the others.
Barring that, and now I'm speaking theoretically of course, what would happen to that brave soul who knew he was only living in California temporarily and decided to just bring his guns into the state with his mouth kept shut and his behavior discreetly not revealing what he had done?
I'm not advocating breaking the law, but I'm curious as to what might be the risk of getting caught for that brave soul who might be inclined to just hide them in his residence for a year?
I'm likely off a little, especially with the new laws, I got overwhelmed by them and just said F it, not even going to try and learn them like the old ones. But, I believe the risks are: for high capacity magazines, maybe a misdemeanor, but certainly compounding fines, where a decent collection could cost you tens if not over a hundred thousand. For having unregistered AWs, i.e. failing to spend even more money on your gun to register it or to modify it, felony.
Now with that said, the actual chance of getting popped for any of that? Depends on your lifestyle and other actions, if you're a normal law abiding gray man, very low chance, but if you like to rough up your wife, throw wild parties at all hours of the night and drive around in a car that just begs to get you pulled over, then you have a better chance. I know a number of people here in CA who claim to be in possession of all sorts of illegal (in the eyes of CA and a few Federal) guns and magazines. I also know of an individual who has a NFA item, I don't know how long it's been in his possession though, he knows the laws and simply doesn't care. Chances of him getting popped for it, extremely low but a bit higher than if I had it as his lifestyle is a bit more wild than my own.
I need either RMR type sight or XS Big Dots, cant see regular pistol sights like you need to without wearing reading glasses.
I can hit with regular sights at gun fighting range. But if I am at the range without glasses I tend to try and follow the focus as it comes and goes on the front sight, then I hurry the shot. Resulting in horrible shooting.
With XS big dot I can shoot much better out to 25 meters without wearing glasses than I can regular sights.
With RMR, no Glasses it is like being 25 again.
Averageman
04-05-17, 10:00
Ya know the more I read this thread the more I want to try an RMR. Like the RDS I wasn't interested for years. I am still more or an irons first guy. I don't like the idea of batteries. Do you need suppressor height sights to be able to use the irons if the RMR fails.
You'll need the suppressor height sights. I've used two sets of batteries over four years with my RMR, I wouldn't recommend that, honestly you should change them annually, but I think I will see just how long this second set will actually last.
Be aware switching to an RMR is going to create a learning curve for you. Honestly, its going to take some time to get used to the switch.
Be aware switching to an RMR is going to create a learning curve for you. Honestly, its going to take some time to get used to the switch.
This is very true. I've tried them on friend's pistols and didn't care for them. Found it awkward and it really slowed me down. I'm sure with time and practice anyone could master them, but to me it seems like a solution without a problem.
I do prefer RDS on my rifles though...
I need either RMR type sight or XS Big Dots, cant see regular pistol sights like you need to without wearing reading glasses.
I can hit with regular sights at gun fighting range. But if I am at the range without glasses I tend to try and follow the focus as it comes and goes on the front sight, then I hurry the shot. Resulting in horrible shooting.
With XS big dot I can shoot much better out to 25 meters without wearing glasses than I can regular sights.
With RMR, no Glasses it is like being 25 again.
I noticed about ten years ago an issue with my handgun sights. I had trouble at the range. I could not focus on the front sight. The rear sight was clear and the front sight blurry. Obviously backwards! =)
I tried the XS sights and thought I had the problem figured out. Until it came time to qualify. I qualified fine but we do a stress/fun drill at the end of the day or night on the dueling tree. I could not hit the spinner unless I aimed above or bellow it now I can't remember. I think it was above the plate to hit the plate. I was getting all kinds of crap until I had someone switch guns with me and I used their three dot night sights, boom I was competing well again. I called Ameriglo and spoke to one of their folks and they hooked me up with the Hackthorn sets. The rear is plain and the notch is a little wider. Man what a difference it made for me. I still feel faster with a three dot but my percision is much better with the Hackthorn. SOme of mine have the serations on the rear and some do not. I may have pre "Hackthorn" version.
https://ameriglo.com/collections/glock/products/glock-hackathorn-sets
A thread here talking about options for the 1911
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?147192-Are-there-any-sights-for-the-1911-comparable-to-the-Amerglo-Hackathorns
If the XS is working for you rock on. I could not get it to work. I also tried a gostring rear. That bombed for me too. Ahhh but the peep sight on a rifle of shotgun is still Awesome!
You'll need the suppressor height sights. I've used two sets of batteries over four years with my RMR, I wouldn't recommend that, honestly you should change them annually, but I think I will see just how long this second set will actually last.
Be aware switching to an RMR is going to create a learning curve for you. Honestly, its going to take some time to get used to the switch.
Thank you.
This is very true. I've tried them on friend's pistols and didn't care for them. Found it awkward and it really slowed me down. I'm sure with time and practice anyone could master them, but to me it seems like a solution without a problem.
I do prefer RDS on my rifles though...
The RDS on a rifle is very nice.
Like fancy triggers I am hesitant to try because what I have works fine for me. If I switch one I don't want to look at switching everything.
Averageman
04-05-17, 12:54
Here's a brief run down on what I've learned so far.
You can concentrate too hard trying to find the dot at times. At close range, just use the sight as a "box", put box on target and shoot.
It's going to mess with you a bit at first, trust the dot. You'll move from target to target and wonder what in the world is going on, but really trust the dot.
Once you get the hang of it you'll be happily stretching out your distances and wondering why you didn't do this years ago.
You can concentrate too hard trying to find the dot at times.
That was me. Every time I brought the pistol up on target, I had to search around to find the dot. It was mounted on a Glock too, which I am very comfortable with. After my rifle experience with RDS, I really thought I'd like one on a pistol, but I didn't.
How long did it take for you to "get the hang of it"? I only ran about 6 mags through it, but that was enough. How much of a try, should a person give it?
Averageman
04-05-17, 15:00
That was me. Every time I brought the pistol up on target, I had to search around to find the dot. It was mounted on a Glock too, which I am very comfortable with. After my rifle experience with RDS, I really thought I'd like one on a pistol, but I didn't.
How long did it take for you to "get the hang of it"? I only ran about 6 mags through it, but that was enough. How much of a try, should a person give it?
Maybe 250-400 rounds or so.
It's great if it is the only gun you'll use or if every Glock you own has one I would guess. Switching back and forth is not so easy, but after the initial learning curve a couple of magazines and you are fine again.
I don't care for sig pistols, so they are out, and want to think about something other than 1911.
But I am wondering if anyone makes a Glock 17 sized single stack 9mm pistol, that holds 10 rounds in the mag.
They make 10 round magazines in 458socom. Just saying.
No one makes that single stack g17. I have tried. I am thinkg 45shield for me.
I am looking at several different options.
But a M1 carbine is not a bad little gun with the right ammo.
Then a 9mm pistol that can take an RMR.
Bolt rifle for fun.
But I am as said looking at other ways to solve the problem.
I'm not sure if it was mentioned; I didn't have time to read all 12 pages.
As far as handguns:
-Most Beretta 92 variants including Vertec, G-SD, and G models
-CZ 75's, PCR, P01
-Most Gen 3 Glocks including 26, 17, and 19
-HK USP Fullsize and Compacts in 9 mm, 40, and 45 are also ok. Be careful of variant.
You can look these models up on the CA Roster.
http://certguns.doj.ca.gov
*No threaded barrels, and no magazines over 10 rounds. Possession laws are still murky, most people and I are confused as to when they go into effect. Also note that counties and cities may have their own laws on top of existing CA law. I think it was LA that outlawed magazines over 10 rounds a while ago.
Forget anything NFA, unless you are LEO. Even then, I'm not sure what the exact rules are.
The above list of handguns I gave were just models that you can purchase here from a dealer. You can bring any handgun you want as long as:
-No threaded barrel.
-No magazines over 10 Rd capacity.
-You must register them within a certain time period of arriving here.
*I'm not 100% sure about AK/AR/MP5 style pistols. I believe they need a bullet button, although with bullet button the threaded barrel is ok.
Rifles:
You mentioned a Scout gun, if it's what I think it is (an M1A variant), then you don't need a bullet button. ONLY IF it does not have a pistol grip. In this case it would be featureless so the following rules would apply:
-No flash hider.
-No telescoping stock.
*I'm not sure if bayonet is ok on featureless.
**All centerfire rifles must be 30 in OAL when in a fireable configuration. Those Keltecs that fold are ok since you can't shoot them folded.
The whole bullet button/assault weapon thing is a mess right now. I believe you can still own, but must register any rifle configured with a bullet button. You can't buy one from a dealer right now. You can buy a featureless AR today, and although physically you can configure it as an "assault weapon", you are not allowed to.
*I'm not entirely sure if you have to register rifles brought into the state. I do know that now every rifle is registered when purchased from a store, regardless of weather it's features or not.
**Also, as far as registration goes. There is just registration that is required of pistols and rifles, and then there is the AW registration which is another thing. Sorry if that was obvious.
***Please look at the list below the AW flow chart.
http://www.calguns.net/caawid/flowchart.pdf
These rifles can not be brought to CA no matter what.
You can permanently pin a 6 foot long barrel extension, weld a 1-shot magazine, remove the pistol grip, paint the gun in pastel Easter colors, and engrave "I'm with her" on the side. If it's on the list, it can't be made compliant.
MountainRaven
04-07-17, 00:53
http://www.calguns.net/caawid/flowchart.pdf
These rifles can not be brought to CA no matter what.
You can permanently pin a 6 foot long barrel extension, weld a 1-shot magazine, remove the pistol grip, paint the gun in pastel Easter colors, and engrave "I'm with her" on the side. If it's on the list, it can't be made compliant.
I believe AR/AK-type pistols are 100% illegal in CA, no matter what.
The flowchart is funny, because it reminds me that CA banned a handguard as an assault weapon.
I believe AR/AK-type pistols are 100% illegal in CA, no matter what.
The flowchart is funny, because it reminds me that CA banned a handguard as an assault weapon.
Not exactly 100%. I know because I had an Arsenal SAM7K that I sold PPT to an off duty Police Officer. They can still be bought and sold the same way off roster handguns get bought and sold today. They come up pretty often in the calguns market place.
ETA: I'm not sure how the new AWB affects them, but as far as that goes, I don't think DOJ clearly stated what is and what isn't ok yet. I'd assume that any of the pistols would have to be registered as assault weapons, with no possible featureless option for them. I'm that case I can see how even getting them through a PPT would now be impossible. However, like said, anyone that has one and registers it can keep it.
I would choose the Barnes bullet for the 30 Carbine, personally. I mean... it is California.
The M1 Carbines I have did not function reliably with the Barnes hollowpoint or the Speer Gold Dots.
ramairthree
04-07-17, 08:04
Would the rules allow a Beretta 96 and CX4 with ten round mags?
Both are very reliable. You could have both and a ton of mags a good stash of ammo for a thousand bucks.
Throw a decent red dot on the CX4.
180 grains of Federal HST at 1000+ FPS is no joke.
Ideal, perfect, or favorite?
I know 40 is not loved anymore, but used Berettas in 40 are a bargain.
FN A3G
Springfield M1A Socom
Sig 220
Glock 39 for carry
I'd likely get into 1911's as a hobby, I'd still want the sig and glock for reliability.
Would the rules allow a Beretta 96 and CX4 with ten round mags?
Both are very reliable. You could have both and a ton of mags a good stash of ammo for a thousand bucks.
Throw a decent red dot on the CX4.
180 grains of Federal HST at 1000+ FPS is no joke.
Ideal, perfect, or favorite?
I know 40 is not loved anymore, but used Berettas in 40 are a bargain.
Yes. The Beretta 96 would be ok, as would the CX4.
Just nothing over 10 rounds, and the CX4 would have to be made featureless. The CX4 would be able to be configured and registered as an assault weapon, but then you run into the issue of whether or not it was purchased before Jan 1, 2017.
Yes. The Beretta 96 would be ok, as would the CX4.
Just nothing over 10 rounds, and the CX4 would have to be made featureless. The CX4 would be able to be configured and registered as an assault weapon, but then you run into the issue of whether or not it was purchased before Jan 1, 2017.
Isn't the CX4 already featureless?
Isn't the CX4 already featureless?
No, at least not in the eyes of CA.
Thumbhole stocks are considered pistol grips here. So you would need to use one of the kydex fins to plug the hole.
No, at least not in the eyes of CA.
Thumbhole stocks are considered pistol grips here. So you would need to use one of the kydex fins to plug the hole.
And increase the OAL to 30", but that is just a simple matter of adding one of the stock spacers that come with the gun. I had one when I moved here, before I came to CA I added the spacer and because there were no products on the market at the time to fill in the thumb hole, and I had no experience with working with kydex, I filled in the hole with Devcon steel, putting down a couple layers of painter's tape first so that it could be removed with no damage to the rifle. It was a fun little gun, probably would have liked it better in 9mm or 45, but had to sell it shortly after moving out here to pay rent
ramairthree
04-07-17, 16:11
My bad. Like USMCVet mentions,
I thought the thumbhole stock, non folding/collapsing stock, non threaded barrel, etc. made it good to go off the shelf.
Since people are still posting about needing to use "bullet button" style maglocks to make firearms CA legal...
Starting 01-01-2017, "bullet button" style maglocks are no longer legal compliance devices that make a "fixed magazine".
It is no longer legal to import, make, or transfer a semi-auto centerfire rifle or semi-auto pistol with a "bullet button" style maglock.
Possession of a semi-auto centerfire rifle or semi-auto pistol with a "bullet button" style maglock in CA is legal until 01-01-2018.
In order to be considered a "fixed magazine", the magazine needs to be locked so that it can not be removed without disassembling the firearm's action or the magazine needs to be welded/epoxied/riveted into the firearm's magazine well.
Here's a stupid question-
Are lever action rifles capped at 10 rds in CA?
I seem to remember a few lever guns I'd seen that held a few more.
Nope.
Fixed tubular magazines on lever-action firearms are exempt from CA large capacity magazine laws. [PC 16740(c)]
That exemption was created as a reward/payoff for cowboy action shooting groups that switched from opposing the CA large capacity magazine ban to supporting it.
ETA: I'm not sure how the new AWB affects them, but as far as that goes, I don't think DOJ clearly stated what is and what isn't ok yet. I'd assume that any of the pistols would have to be registered as assault weapons, with no possible featureless option for them. I'm that case I can see how even getting them through a PPT would now be impossible. However, like said, anyone that has one and registers it can keep it.
They are CA legal with a fixed 10 round magazine.
They are CA legal with a fixed 10 round magazine.
I'm assuming you mean they're legal with the new definition of fixed magazine right?
"In order to be considered a "fixed magazine", the magazine needs to be locked so that it can not be removed without disassembling the firearm's action or the magazine needs to be welded/epoxied/riveted into the firearm's magazine well."
That could be true; I really don't know. However, would featureless requirements apply?
Or would the "new" definition of fixed magazine basically let you configure the gun like the previous bullet buttoned rifles?
No, at least not in the eyes of CA.
Thumbhole stocks are considered pistol grips here. So you would need to use one of the kydex fins to plug the hole.
My bad. Like USMCVet mentions,
I thought the thumbhole stock, non folding/collapsing stock, non threaded barrel, etc. made it good to go off the shelf.
Dang my GF has one in .40 I've shot it a few times. I don't like it. I can not imagine how to shoot it with the thumb hole filled in! Anyone have a photo?
I saw a link to this in another thread.
http://pacifictoolandgauge.com/remington-700-detachable-mag-bottom-metal-dbm/9404-remington-700-short-short-action-sa-stealth-detach-mag-bottom-metal-for-ar-15-magazines-223-556.html
Would this be a no go in CA or ok with a 5/10 round mag? I see what looks like a bullet button in one of the photos. I think it would be cool to add to a .300 BlackOut in a free state so you could add a suppressor. I'd prob shoot it most often with a 5 round hunting mag. Putting a 20 or 30 in would be fun.
Look up cross armory quick pins and safe mag and see if that works for you
Dang my GF has one in .40 I've shot it a few times. I don't like it. I can not imagine how to shoot it with the thumb hole filled in! Anyone have a photo?
I saw a link to this in another thread.
http://pacifictoolandgauge.com/remington-700-detachable-mag-bottom-metal-dbm/9404-remington-700-short-short-action-sa-stealth-detach-mag-bottom-metal-for-ar-15-magazines-223-556.html
Would this be a no go in CA or ok with a 5/10 round mag? I see what looks like a bullet button in one of the photos. I think it would be cool to add to a .300 BlackOut in a free state so you could add a suppressor. I'd prob shoot it most often with a 5 round hunting mag. Putting a 20 or 30 in would be fun.
No worries, you almost need a law degree to understand CA gun law.
In the link you provided, seeing that it attached to a Rem 700, it should be good to go. As long as the rest of the 700 remains as is; no flash hider, no pistol grip, no adjustable stock, 30 in OAL, &c.
Bolt guns can have all the evil features they want, it's just semi-autos that get neutered. At least for the moment.
I just remembered years ago wanting a Spanish FR8's in .308 with a bayonet of course!
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/f7/b3/34/f7b3345de3946d04e8625568f641f437.jpg
Bolt guns can have all the evil features they want, it's just semi-autos that get neutered. At least for the moment.
Yes this is true. That completely slipped my mind haha.
For what it's worth, shotgun laws are different as well. So a Benelli M4 or similar would be good to go with pistol grip and no mag locks/welds. Although the stock must be fixed.
I'm assuming you mean they're legal with the new definition of fixed magazine right?
"In order to be considered a "fixed magazine", the magazine needs to be locked so that it can not be removed without disassembling the firearm's action or the magazine needs to be welded/epoxied/riveted into the firearm's magazine well."
That could be true; I really don't know. However, would featureless requirements apply?
Or would the "new" definition of fixed magazine basically let you configure the gun like the previous bullet buttoned rifles?
Yes, CA legal as "fixed magazine" using the new CA definition of a "fixed magazine".
Since the magazine is located outside of the pistol's grip, there is no way to make an AR/AK style pistol "featureless".
Which means, in order to be CA legal, all AR/AK style pistols must operate using a new CA definition "fixed magazine".
Dang my GF has one in .40 I've shot it a few times. I don't like it. I can not imagine how to shoot it with the thumb hole filled in! Anyone have a photo?
https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQts_LyvlwISxij_dL76pUEQSi0yUUqV3e_p1FkvXFE4dNbpja-
For me it's simple, glock 26 and 870 marine, a pair in the vehicle and a pair in the home. California compliant and would be useful for most situations.
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