View Full Version : Police Shootings: Harvard study
Harvard study, black professor, etc. Will this make the news? Of course not, as it does not fit the narrative:
Roland G. Fryer Jr. is an economics professor at Harvard. Distressed by what he was seeing in the treatment of black men like Michael Brown and Freddie Gray, Fryer commissioned a study on how the role race play in the use of lethal force by police.
The study examined more than 1,000 police shootings from 10 large police departments in California, Florida and Texas.
The results? Not what Black Lives Matter would have you believe. The study found no indication of racial bias associated with incidents in which cops fired their guns.
The study concluded that police officers who had not been attacked were more likely to shoot white suspects. This goes completly against the mythology.
Cont:
http://tribunist.com/news/harvard-study-on-police-shootings-and-race-offers-shocking-conclusion/
Dist. Expert 26
09-30-17, 09:42
Go figure, the media promotes an agenda based on deception and lies.
Say it isn't so? The Liberal left race mongers and BLM are not right? This is my surprised look...... :blink:
So they are full of SH#$.......
Here's the actual paper:
https://scholar.harvard.edu/files/fryer/files/appendix-july_2016.pdf
BoringGuy45
09-30-17, 10:23
Doesn't matter. The media, BLM, and the left in general employ the Texas sharpshooter fallacy to prove all their points: Shoot a hundred holes into the side of a barn, draw a line around the tightest group, take a picture, use picture as proof that they're marksmen.
I had a debate once with a guy who insisted that there was an "epidemic" of cops killing unarmed black people, and of course, he used all the high profile examples in the media. I responded by asking him, if 10 people came down with the flu in New York City, and nobody else in the city got sick, would you say there was major outbreak of the flu? Of course you wouldn't. But over the period of a week, the media includes the story of a new case of flu every day, so it doesn't matter if only 10 out of 8 million people got sick. By reporting the same story every day for a week, the media has created the illusion that it's an out of control problem. And that's what's happening with these shootings.
Of course, the argument that's used against this is that sure, maybe only 10 cases of bad shootings were reported. But we can safely assume this is just a sampling; there are probably hundreds more that didn't make the news. And of course, there's the ever popular conspiracy claims: Most of the "justified" shootings were unjustified, but when racist cops are investigated by other racist cops, of COURSE they are going to be found "justified" in executing an innocent black man. And once again, it becomes "don't distract me from my feelings with your stupid facts!"
Go figure, the media promotes an agenda based on deception and lies.
Manufactured outrage.
Dist. Expert 26
09-30-17, 10:46
Manufactured outrage.
If you're into metal, check out "Engage the Fear Machine" by Lamb of God.
If you're into metal, check out "Engage the Fear Machine" by Lamb of God.
I checked it out on youtube with lyrics. Holy cow! They're on point with what's happening these days.
Dist. Expert 26
09-30-17, 10:58
I checked it out on youtube with lyrics. Holy cow! They're on point with what's happening these days.
Delusion Pandemic also hits the nail on the head.
Averageman
09-30-17, 11:06
This as well as many other examples show the media's collision.
This won't be reported, it won't be a story and it certainly won't be a counter point to Antifa violence.
Louder with Crowder recently gathered evidence under cover on Antifa. The MSM wouldn't touch it.
I don't know what a study of 1000 shootings can ultimately tell you about racist or not racist shootings......did this study get to the reasons why a particular cop shot a person. Seems motive is huge. Did they talk to these cops? Can a statistical analysis look into a person's heart?
Whatever the case, true justice absolutely requires that each and every case must be taken on it's own merits. Each policeman, and also each shot person MUST be treated as an individual lest their humanity be swallowed up in some SJW group think (and it doesn't look like good group think). All cops are racist and all shot black persons are victims. If we go down that road too far many people are going to have their lives ruined.
Averageman
09-30-17, 11:47
I believe taking each incident under analysis is necessary and we owe an unbiased investigation in each case.
That being necassay does not however mean the violence will be stopped.
If you can take the Ferguson Missouri case of Mike Brown as an example, the Media owns the majority of the responsibility for the violence and looting by promoting false stories early on.
No one with an agenda is going to wait for or believe a Harvard University Professor.
I believe taking each incident under analysis is necessary and we owe an unbiased investigation in each case.
That being necassay does not however mean the violence will be stopped.
If you can take the Ferguson Missouri case of Mike Brown as an example, the Media owns the majority of the responsibility for the violence and looting by promoting false stories early on.
No one with an agenda is going to wait for or believe a Harvard University Professor.
Even if he's black I would think. The cause is everything in the end, the individual is swallowed up. He'll probably be totally ignored or label an uncle Tom or traitor or something.
Averageman
09-30-17, 12:07
These numbers from many different studies simply go ignored for the most part.
Even the annual FBI numbers go against the entire narrative, but the narrative doesn't change.
I've been told "Follow the Money" so many times that has become a mantra for my every day life.
People gain money, power and fame promoting racism and hatred. It sells everything from television commercial time to lavish lifestyles for various "Reverends".
It may be fortunate that we seem to be entering a time where these lies are now being rejected in such a public forum as NFL football.
Maybe some of the people who have shut off the TV will read this guys study, but I'm not really hopeful.
It may be fortunate that we seem to be entering a time where these lies are now being rejected in such a public forum as NFL football.
Maybe some of the people who have shut off the TV will read this guys study, but I'm not really hopeful.
I think there is reason for hope. Word is getting out. Look what "they" said about HRC and Trump. Who is sitting in the Oval Office now?
I truly believed the system was rigged and we had no chance. But here we are.
FromMyColdDeadHand
09-30-17, 13:12
I don't know what a study of 1000 shootings can ultimately tell you about racist or not racist shootings......did this study get to the reasons why a particular cop shot a person. Seems motive is huge. Did they talk to these cops? Can a statistical analysis look into a person's heart?
Whatever the case, true justice absolutely requires that each and every case must be taken on it's own merits. Each policeman, and also each shot person MUST be treated as an individual lest their humanity be swallowed up in some SJW group think (and it doesn't look like good group think). All cops are racist and all shot black persons are victims. If we go down that road too far many people are going to have their lives ruined.
The BLMs argument and reason for being is that there is systemic racism and it is leading to an inordinate, epidemic really, of young black men being shot. This paper, and there was another one that showed similar findings, runs against that argument. I don't know of a scholarly argument that actually reinforces the BLM line of thinking- past that rough percentages of police shootings, which doesn't account for general criminal activity or violence. Look at the pictures that are included in The Chicago Tribune has collected systematically about the victims and sustpects in all the murders there. Those definately don't reflect the population of the city.
It would appear that there is no widespread occurrence of cops shooting YBM for no or racist reasons. That is what the BLM is pushing. They are starting a war based on a lie, to co-opt a popular phrase. That a Progressive group would latch onto group rights and wrongs, rather than individual guilt or innocence is not surprising. That they would condemn LEOs for a few bad actors and absolve of all sins, even though far larger percentage are involved in illegal activity, young black men shows their intellecual biases and preconceived notions.
I believe taking each incident under analysis is necessary and we owe an unbiased investigation in each case.
That being necassay does not however mean the violence will be stopped.
If you can take the Ferguson Missouri case of Mike Brown as an example, the Media owns the majority of the responsibility for the violence and looting by promoting false stories early on.
No one with an agenda is going to wait for or believe a Harvard University Professor.
And not doing a damn thing to correct it when all the stories, such the "hands up BS" were shown to be fabrication. To this day, you have idiots marching with their hands up...
Averageman
09-30-17, 13:48
And not doing a damn thing to correct it when all the stories, such the "hands up BS" were shown to be fabrication. To this day, you have idiots marching with their hands up...
Put a dollar value on the false stories, think of the continued advertising dollars, the continued campaign contributions, the consolidation of political power.
The story, the agenda, the entire political movement relies on the media not retracting any of it no matter how disproven it later is. The networks have a sweet deal and they're deeply entrenched in the Socialist Progressive movement.
Put a dollar value on the false stories, think of the continued advertising dollars, the continued campaign contributions, the consolidation of political power.
The story, the agenda, the entire political movement relies on the media not retracting any of it no matter how disproven it later is. The networks have a sweet deal and they're deeply entrenched in the Socialist Progressive movement.
In their world view, the end justifies the means and it's for your own good.
Averageman
09-30-17, 14:15
They aren't in the truth business, they aren't in the news business, they are in the business of shaping the way people think.
How many real stories have you sat down and done twenty minutes of research on and have found the MSM story is patently false?
So who has twenty minutes per story to investigate each day?
How many people take the story they've been given on CNN for the complete truth?
It's a wonder it isn't worse.
They aren't in the truth business, they aren't in the news business, they are in the business of shaping the way people think.
How many real stories have you sat down and done twenty minutes of research on and have found the MSM story is patently false?
So who has twenty minutes per story to investigate each day?
How many people take the story they've been given on CNN for the complete truth?
It's a wonder it isn't worse.
Like they tell us Hillary lost due to misogyny...never mind that the country is more than half women.
On topic...
I DO however believe there is criminal justice reform needed. But it needs to start with the folks passing the laws.
That a man could be jammed up, and die in police custody for selling loose cigarettes is baffling to me. It's why I think the elites focus on the police conduct...so people don't begin asking why the hell they were there to begin with.
"I've just got like, this 5.56 okay? And it's 55 grain ball. And everybody I've ever seen shot with it, it dicks them up."
---Clint Smith
Thunder Ranch
Dist. Expert 26
09-30-17, 17:40
Like they tell us Hillary lost due to misogyny...never mind that the country is more than half women.
On topic...
I DO however believe there is criminal justice reform needed. But it needs to start with the folks passing the laws.
That a man could be jammed up, and die in police custody for selling loose cigarettes is baffling to me. It's why I think the elites focus on the police conduct...so people don't begin asking why the hell they were there to begin with.
"I've just got like, this 5.56 okay? And it's 55 grain ball. And everybody I've ever seen shot with it, it dicks them up."
---Clint Smith
Thunder Ranch
How dare you question the nobility of the crown's laws, filthy peasant?! For without such laws, what's to stop vagrants from engaging in capitalism?! It would be madness!!!
Averageman
09-30-17, 18:05
How dare you question the nobility of the crown's laws, filthy peasant?! For without such laws, what's to stop vagrants from engaging in capitalism?! It would be madness!!!
And considering the Mob has been running cigarettes in to New York for decades and no doubt some of that money runs back to keep the gears of the political machine well oiled, well, you may be anti American.
When I worked in the cement construction business in Chicago I went in for my interview and walked in to an episode of the Sopranos. I got my card, got a firm talking to and I met a few gentlemen there. Payday the same guys were selling cartons of smokes and televisions right were we parked for the job.
It was a kind of full service Union.
That a man could be jammed up, and die in police custody for selling loose cigarettes is baffling to me.
To be clear, he didn't die in custody. He died, accidentally, while resisting arrest. Again. For the same offense he'd already been cited for and arrested for multiple times previously. For doing business outside the rules, right outside the establishment of someone who was forced to abide by the rules that he was ignoring.
What is your business? I'm sure there are government fees and taxes and permits and all sorts of other mumbo jumbo associated with your business. Lots of expenses right? Suppose I stood right in front of wherever you get your paying customers and offered to do what you do for half price, while not paying any of those taxes or fees that you have to pay… Get the idea?
Your point that all of these government taxes, fees and licensing should not exist, is right on. I agree 100% that we need to fix this badly broken system, but for the time being, if I gotta pay government extortion money to do business, then dammit, so should my competition. If some A-Hole stands outside my store selling the same stuff I sell for half the money while not paying all the fees that I have to pay, I'm going to call the cops on him too. If he does it again and again, I'll keep calling. If he resists arrest each time, then he is responsible for the consequences of his resisting arrest. Nobody would have jumped him, wrestled him to the ground or arm barred his big fat ass if he'd come along quietly and taken responsibility for his crime. Again.
To be clear, he didn't die in custody. He died, accidentally, while resisting arrest. Again. For the same offense he'd already been cited for and arrested for multiple times previously. For doing business outside the rules, right outside the establishment of someone who was forced to abide by the rules that he was ignoring.
What is your business? I'm sure there are government fees and taxes and permits and all sorts of other mumbo jumbo associated with your business. Lots of expenses right? Suppose I stood right in front of wherever you get your paying customers and offered to do what you do for half price, while not paying any of those taxes or fees that you have to pay… Get the idea?
Your point that all of these government taxes, fees and licensing should not exist, is right on. I agree 100% that we need to fix this badly broken system, but for the time being, if I gotta pay government extortion money to do business, then dammit, so should my competition. If some A-Hole stands outside my store selling the same stuff I sell for half the money while not paying all the fees that I have to pay, I'm going to call the cops on him too. If he does it again and again, I'll keep calling. If he resists arrest each time, then he is responsible for the consequences of his resisting arrest. Nobody would have jumped him, wrestled him to the ground or arm barred his big fat ass if he'd come along quietly and taken responsibility for his crime. Again.
Right, but you’re missing my point. If I have to follow the tax man to sell my cigs, and the other guy doesn’t...that’s the gov’s problem. Around here, we call them “Indian smoke shops”. They’re everywhere and QT is doing just fine.
I’m saying that some of these laws are absurd, and enforcement is blamed on popo.
And he was selling “looseys”, so no, I don’t think he was going to put anyone outta business selling one stick at a time.
When I was a kid, the stores SOLD looseys because sometimes you only have a dime when you’re po.
Just seems ridiculous.
ETA...I’m putting his death on the pols, not the cops. Popo did their job.
"I've just got like, this 5.56 okay? And it's 55 grain ball. And everybody I've ever seen shot with it, it dicks them up."
---Clint Smith
Thunder Ranch
How dare you question the nobility of the crown's laws, filthy peasant?! For without such laws, what's to stop vagrants from engaging in capitalism?! It would be madness!!!
Mmmm....I know...big trub Comin’
Lol
"I've just got like, this 5.56 okay? And it's 55 grain ball. And everybody I've ever seen shot with it, it dicks them up."
---Clint Smith
Thunder Ranch
Right, but you’re missing my point. If I have to follow the tax man to sell my cigs, and the other guy doesn’t...that’s the gov’s problem.
While I do think the government and their ridiculous over reach has created this problem, It is still my problem if the people I'm competing against don't have to pay the same ridiculous fees and taxes that I have to pay. Isn't this the same general concept of people hiring illegal aliens instead of Americans?
BLM funded by Russians and promoted by our press
hahahahhaha cant make this up anymore :)
While I do think the government and their ridiculous over reach has created this problem, It is still my problem if the people I'm competing against don't have to pay the same ridiculous fees and taxes that I have to pay. Isn't this the same general concept of people hiring illegal aliens instead of Americans?
I was under the assumption he was buying a pack at retail, then selling singles to bums.
I’m probably wrong. Anyway, we’re 90% on the same page I think, as far as the real problem.
"I've just got like, this 5.56 okay? And it's 55 grain ball. And everybody I've ever seen shot with it, it dicks them up."
---Clint Smith
Thunder Ranch
Moose-Knuckle
10-01-17, 05:51
Here's the actual paper:
https://scholar.harvard.edu/files/fryer/files/appendix-july_2016.pdf
Now if the good professor would only publish a paper on sexual assaults in this country . . .
Averageman
10-01-17, 07:58
Now if the good professor would only publish a paper on sexual assaults in this country . . .
I'm pretty sure he's on some damned thin ice at work already....
Now if the good professor would only publish a paper on sexual assaults in this country . . .
Ohhhh,maaaan, I know I'm gonna regret asking, but what do you mean by that statement?
Why the hell has this been turned into a debate about selling packs of cigs or loose cigs? I don't care if he was selling fuzzy teddy bears he was actively resisting arrest. Doesn't matter what you do if you're being detained and you resist bad shit can happen. Don't want to end up dead: don't do illegal shit. If you do (or even if you don't) and a uniformed officer of the law is trying to detain you don't run, resist or otherwise act like and asshole and odds are pretty good you'll survive the encounter.
FromMyColdDeadHand
10-01-17, 14:46
Here's the actual paper:
https://scholar.harvard.edu/files/fryer/files/appendix-july_2016.pdf
That is what passes for a paper? A bunch of tables? Where is the discussion?
That looks like it was authored by a Excel Spreadsheet.
Averageman
10-01-17, 14:55
Seeing the he is an Economics Professor I can understand that, his mind works in numbers and in a straight forward manner.
That is what was needed facts and numbers. The worst thing that could have happened was for someone's "feelings" to hold more weight than the facts.
titsonritz
10-01-17, 16:30
Put that in your crack pipes and smoke it.
FromMyColdDeadHand
10-01-17, 18:39
Seeing the he is an Economics Professor I can understand that, his mind works in numbers and in a straight forward manner.
That is what was needed facts and numbers. The worst thing that could have happened was for someone's "feelings" to hold more weight than the facts.
Actually, Will linked to the appendix, the paper with the discussion is here :
https://scholar.harvard.edu/files/fryer/files/main-july_2016.pdf
Moose-Knuckle
10-02-17, 05:09
Ohhhh,maaaan, I know I'm gonna regret asking, but what do you mean by that statement?
Since folks want to take a knee on camera or take to the streets to break things when a criminal is killed fighting with LE why don't we look at the real numbers in all areas or violent crimes in this country not just OISs? If we're going to be protesting and rioting over racial violence in this country then let's look at the facts like in this professor's paper. Which is not the first to reveal these stats.
The_War_Wagon
10-02-17, 08:21
The study concluded that police officers who had not been attacked were more likely to shoot white suspects. This goes completly against the mythology.
Now translate it so a 1st grader can read it, & send it to the NFLPA. Then maybe they'll shut up, stand up, and get back to playing their billion dollar ballgame... before it's gone.
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