View Full Version : Worth the price to pick up a BCM/ Noveske/ FN barrel over the new value barrels?
matthepanther
10-03-17, 21:36
Hey guys, im having a tough time deciding on whether or not to fork over the extra 150-200$ for a CHF barrel from one of the big name manufacturers (FN/Spikes, BCM, Noveske, etc) over a faxon or BA barrel. I am not building a precision gun but I am building a duty rifle that I would use and abuse. After a few years of these new barrel manufacturers on the market, what is the general consensus today? Have they been proven reliable and gtg?
Simply, yes. If you have the money eye get the really good barrel. It is the base of the entire carbine.
Leonidas24
10-03-17, 23:31
Hey guys, im having a tough time deciding on whether or not to fork over the extra 150-200$ for a CHF barrel from one of the big name manufacturers (FN/Spikes, BCM, Noveske, etc) over a faxon or BA barrel. I am not building a precision gun but I am building a duty rifle that I would use and abuse. After a few years of these new barrel manufacturers on the market, what is the general consensus today? Have they been proven reliable and gtg?
Proven reliable and back again, BCM, Centurion Arms, DD, and Noveske are all of sound design and construction. I assembled an upper for a customer two years ago using a Spike's 11.5" CHF LW barrel and it was ported conservatively and now runs well with a suppressor, but I've never had a chance to inspect other examples of Spikes. I've yet to see any substantial data on FN "branded" barrels, but it's my understanding that FN manufactures a large portion of the market's CHF barrels including BCM, Palmetto State Armory, Centurion Arms, Noveske, Spike's, et al, to each mfr's specs they provide.
Duty gun that is going to take some abuse? Yea step up. Range toy that shoots paper? Up to you.
tmwtrfwler
10-04-17, 06:52
I'm struggling with this same topic. I'm not an operator or a wannabe operator. just a guy that likes to shoot steel and have some fun. I also pride myself on having good stuff in the event it hits the fan and I need reliable stuff. That said, for my daily use i'm between adding another BCM upper or go inexpensive and get a DSG arms upper for $400ish.
DSG good to go? or stick with my gut and stick with BCM.
While I have a couple of FN CHF barrels that are great, I also have a couple of Hanson profile Ballistic Advantage barrels. The BA barrels are ported conservatively, accurate, reliable, plus the profiles make a lot of sense. They are proven at this point, as far as I am concerned.
ExplorinInTheWoods
10-04-17, 07:32
So I have the fn/spikes 14.5 lw and it's neck and neck with my stainless noveske 18. It's crazy accurate for a chrome lined barrel. Faxon does make some good Barrels. I have a 16 noveske chf and it doesn't shoot as good as my spikes but shoots solid enough. I think part of it is my vcog has a thick crosshair for grouping. But if I can I always put more money towards the barrel. Bcm does a solid barrel but I'll take the fn ones all day. The noveske ones use fn barrel blanks
ColtSeavers
10-04-17, 09:54
Hey guys, im having a tough time deciding on whether or not to fork over the extra 150-200$ for a CHF barrel from one of the big name manufacturers (FN/Spikes, BCM, Noveske, etc) over a faxon or BA barrel. I am not building a precision gun but I am building a duty rifle that I would use and abuse. After a few years of these new barrel manufacturers on the market, what is the general consensus today? Have they been proven reliable and gtg?
Barring a bleeding edge precision build, there's absolutely no reason to blow $250+ on a barrel unless there's something unique about it (rollmark, length/gas system length, profile) that you hwve to have.
Green Mountain Barrels - you'd be surlrised how many companies get their barrels from them
Ballistic Advantage
Sionics Weapon Systems
Faxon Firearms
Ar15performance - currently closed becaise he's moving his shop
All ~$200 and every one of them will do about anything you need a barrel to do.
Eurodriver
10-04-17, 10:31
Unbelievable.
ColtSeavers
10-04-17, 10:42
Unbelievable.
Agreed. It's as if people do no research at all.
tmwtrfwler
10-04-17, 10:58
Agreed. It's as if people do no research at all.
Don't be that guy. I've researched topics a ton and after all the research I could stand still wanted to know the opinion from actual users of a product. That's relative to any product. Maybe this guy did just that. He's just looking for the opinion of those he trusts on a great site for information.
ExplorinInTheWoods
10-04-17, 11:40
What are they supplying to faxon? Blanks or are you saying that faxon is taking the complete barrel and putting their logo on?
What are they supplying to faxon? Blanks or are you saying that faxon is taking the complete barrel and putting their logo on?
i think hes just listing places to buy a decent barrel for $200. Not that green mtn supplies everyone below
Simply, yes. If you have the money eye get the really good barrel. It is the base of the entire carbine.
Agreed.
The barrel is the heart of the weapon. In general, it makes sense to plan the weapon build around the barrel, based on your intended use. I have heard guys complain they have purchased a barrel that is too long, I've heard complaints about the barrel being too heavy, plenty of complaints about barrels being inaccurate, and even complaints about head space and barrel extensions. I have never heard someone complain they purchased too nice of a barrel.
If you have the money then yes, but what is your intended use? I think most people would be better served spending money on training and ammo, but remember you get what you pay for. I recently swapped out the upper on a S&W gun with a BCM CHF. I did notice a difference in performance and accuracy, especially after sustained round count during the last training class, but that was I think more to due with barrel profile (S&W pencil to BCM ELW). The barrel and BCG are really the heart of the gun, make sure it fits your requirements.
longshot2000
10-04-17, 17:38
I am a bit of a barrel snob. Okay, I said it. I agree with Stick and others. Plan your rig around your barrel, not the other way around. I build sniper rifles, and I build CQB riles, like a Mk18. All for the fun of it. In the area of a duty rifle, or any carbine, the name that keeps coming back to me in barrels is Colt. There are others, for sure, but prices have come down. I have not used BA, but, I have heard generally good comments. CHF, to me, is one of the minimum standards. BCM and DD have good products. I think they are over-priced, but they are good. Start thinking about accurate rifles at 18"+, and SPRs, now we get into a different playing field, and we start the leave the carbine barrel names behind. Move into .308 and 6.5mm and larger rounds, and we start talking about an other set of names and standards.
Go back to what your use is, and how you will use the barrel. I would clearly spend more on the barrel than the handrails, and how much are people spending for Geissele or DD rails ? Figure out your budget and your use, and you can get some solid barrels. Oh, nobody mentioned LaRue, but for house brand barrels, at $225, that is a steal. I would bet LaRue against DD any day.
Hammer_Man
10-04-17, 21:21
There is a lot of good advice already in this thread, so I hope my .02 does not detract from the quality of information already here. You mentioned building a duty rifle, so I assume you're looking to build a pretty standard 16" carbine. In that vein there are a lot of good quality barrels available on the market today. Most CHF barrels on the market are built by FN, and are GTG as far as quality/durability is concerned. CHF barrels marketed by Spike's, Rainier Arms, BCM, Palmetto State (PSA), are all made by FN, and can be had at a reasonable price if you don't mind waiting for a sale to come along. My suggestion to you, would be to sign up for their email notification lists, so you know when the good deals are available. Keep in mind black Friday is just a few short weeks away. Lastly, of the budget barrel makers listed so far, I would recommend Green Mountain. Their barrels are supplied to a lot of OEMs, and are GTG as far as I'm concerned. They may not produce a CHF barrel, but chrome lined button rifled barrels are reliable, and capable of lasting a long time. Some would argue button rifling tends to be more accurate than CHF.
matthepanther
10-04-17, 22:30
Unbelievable.
Agreed. It's as if people do no research at all.
sorry? didn't mean to to ruffle your feathers but I don't have 1000's of hours on hours a week to do tons of research. I was curious what people's direct opinions are at this point in time as opinions change as fast as the seasons and sample sizes grow exponentially over time. I've researched but wanted final peace of mind before I drop 300$
Thanks for all the input everyone, I appreciate it and have found it valuable
Save your money. You're unlikely to see any benefit from a CHF barrel until you get into roundcounts in the 1X,XXX range... unless the other option is a cheapo hobby grade tube.
ColtSeavers
10-05-17, 01:13
sorry? didn't mean to to ruffle your feathers but I don't have 1000's of hours on hours a week to do tons of research. I was curious what people's direct opinions are at this point in time as opinions change as fast as the seasons and sample sizes grow exponentially over time. I've researched but wanted final peace of mind before I drop 300$
Thanks for all the input everyone, I appreciate it and have found it valuable
Those posts had nothing to do with you.
matthepanther
10-26-17, 19:12
I just picked up a FN lightweight barrel for 200$, so it ended up being the same price as some of the other brands anyway. I'll probably use a Faxon nitride for an SPR on a later build
friendlyfireisnt
10-26-17, 20:14
The short answer is yes. The Barrel is the heart of the rifle; think of all the different aspects that are controlled by the barrel quality, from proper chambering (how many remember RRA and Bushmasters that had incorrect chambers that would cause function issues?), proper headspace, proper twist rate for the purpose as well as having the right sized gas port. Then add in material, coating/treatment, barrel crown, etc.
A good quality barrel, combined with a good quality BCG, assembled properly will more than likely end up as a quality rifle.
That said, what makes a quality barrel can depend on the person.
I've got an older Daniel Defense LWT CHF barrel that I have done tests with, that shot 3 10-shot groups in a row that average 1.25" at 100 yards. Fantastically accurate, and very reliable. Also a soft shooter. Clearly a quality barrel that was worth the cost.
I've got multiple BCM uppers and barrels that are all reliable and decently accurate. All are worth the cost.
I've got an 18" Larue Stealth that has shot multiple 5-shot groups in the .6xx" range. Also a soft shooter, and has been reliable thus far. Worth the $225 I paid for it.
I've also purchased a discount brand .300blk upper for about $299. Had an unknown barrel (now know it was a KAK) that was horribly over gassed and had constant function issues (rarely got through a mag without failure).
Replaced it with a Ballistic Advantage 10.3" .300blk barrel that is gas properly, has not had a single failure and is a solid 1.5-1.75MOA shooter. To me, that barrel was a quality replacement, and was well worth the money.
I've also got a 12" Larue Stealth, that while accurate, is also extremely over gassed (gas port of .088") and is extremely heavy. Fortunately, I won that barrel, so it's worth it. Would not be worth the cost that they charge, IMO. Tomorrow, it's getting replaced. By a Ballistic Advantage 11.3". Won't know if that one was worth it until I test it out.
But I don't get too wrapped up with Melonite vs Chrome Lining vs Stainless Steel, etc. To me, I'm more concerned with proper chambering, the right gas port, an appropriate twist rate and other manufacturing qualities, like proper feed ramps and the proper procedure for attaching to the barrel extension, etc.
matthepanther
10-26-17, 21:46
That's a great deal on a FN barrel!
thanks, there are several places selling the button and CHF FN barrels for that price.
But I don't get too wrapped up with Melonite vs Chrome Lining vs Stainless Steel, etc. To me, I'm more concerned with proper chambering, the right gas port, an appropriate twist rate and other manufacturing qualities, like proper feed ramps and the proper procedure for attaching to the barrel extension, etc.
This is the correct answer along with the method of attachment of the gas block.
Mrgunsngear
10-29-17, 15:09
FWIW, here's a 16'' LW middy FN CHF barrel for $199 (https://goo.gl/MPPUdm)
Agreed.
The barrel is the heart of the weapon. In general, it makes sense to plan the weapon build around the barrel, based on your intended use. I have heard guys complain they have purchased a barrel that is too long, I've heard complaints about the barrel being too heavy, plenty of complaints about barrels being inaccurate, and even complaints about head space and barrel extensions. I have never heard someone complain they purchased too nice of a barrel.
I got the Spikes / FN CHF LW 11.5 on my pistol build. It's too nice ;)
Glock9mm1990
10-29-17, 20:16
IMHO BCM’s BFH ELW barrels are the best barrels you can buy for a combat grade rifle and far exceeds standard mil-spec. I see no reason to buy anything else especially for the money. But I also just buy my uppers complete from BCM where it is done by professionals.
IMHO uppers aren't hard to assemble
Use good parts and viola sub moa rifle
FWIW, here's a 16'' LW middy FN CHF barrel for $199 (https://goo.gl/MPPUdm)
Looks like a good deal, jeez I need to get a good job after college.
vicious_cb
10-29-17, 21:51
Depends. If the gas port is huge I wouldnt bother with the barrel. Gas port size is literally what dictates how your rifle will function. Overgassed = malfunctions + parts breakages
5.56 Bonded SP
10-29-17, 23:59
Depends. If the gas port is huge I wouldnt bother with the barrel. Gas port size is literally what dictates how your rifle will function. Overgassed = malfunctions + parts breakages
This. I think it's annoying how so many places font publish gp data. I shouldn't have to email customer service and ask every time.
This. I think it's annoying how so many places font publish gp data. I shouldn't have to email customer service and ask every time.
I think a small, but growing, portion of buyers actually think about it.
Manufacturers are also in the unenviable position of having to strike the balance between buyers who will only shoot Tula in the winter complaining about how it short strokes and buyers who want to shoot suppressed 5.56-pressure complaining about how it is over gassed.
On the OP subject- we live in a good time to be building these rifles. A lot of the inexpensive barrels (nitride) will put up with a lot of punishment and many of them (stainless usually) will shoot very well. I think CL and/or CHF is still the first choice for a serious use carbine, but the others will do very well if ported/chambered/assembled properly. Nitride for the price resists corrosion and wear very well.
matthepanther
10-30-17, 18:41
Depends. If the gas port is huge I wouldnt bother with the barrel. Gas port size is literally what dictates how your rifle will function. Overgassed = malfunctions + parts breakages
I was told by customer service that the gas port size on the Fn lightweight barrels is 0.078''
I was told by customer service that the gas port size on the Fn lightweight barrels is 0.078''
For a 16 midlength?
matthepanther
10-30-17, 21:04
For a 16 midlength?
yes 16'' middy
I've had nothing but great performance with BCM's CHF chrome lined barrels. They are more accurate than I am, never wear out (for me so far). I couldn't have asked for anything better from the barrels I got from them. IMO the BCM CHF barrels are as close to a sure thing as there is.
Talking Monkey
11-01-17, 08:01
So is it the consensus that BCM’s CHF barrels are worth the premium over their non-CHF barrels? In terms of objective performance metrics, what exactly would one expect to gain in paying the extra for CHF? Sorry if this has be covered before, but last time I looked into it, it seemed that there wasn’t much difference – sounds like opinions may have changed?
Looks like a good deal. Does anyone know if it is dimpled for a set screw GB? Bonus question: How about gas port size?
FWIW, here's a 16'' LW middy FN CHF barrel for $199 (https://goo.gl/MPPUdm)
That's big.
I was told by customer service that the gas port size on the Fn lightweight barrels is 0.078''
cobravenom39
11-01-17, 13:55
I thought we came to the conclusion that the BCM and Spike's barrels were Cold hammer forged from FN and than they were just drilling ports, profiling and finishing at their respective shops?
That being said, not much difference between then and PSA's Premium and CHF line. I don't think PSA even sells them anymore.
matthepanther
11-01-17, 15:24
Looks like a good deal. Does anyone know if it is dimpled for a set screw GB? Bonus question: How about gas port size? this is the barrel I have. not dimpled
matthepanther
11-01-17, 18:25
That's big.
While I agree it seems big, from my understanding I've always heard that FN's barrels usually are 0.078, and I've seen threads where BCM and DD had ports measured in the 0.073-0.075 range. Do you think this is too large?
vicious_cb
11-01-17, 19:39
While I agree it seems big, from my understanding I've always heard that FN's barrels usually are 0.078, and I've seen threads where BCM and DD had ports measured in the 0.073-0.075 range. Do you think this is too large?
Its not, 0.080" is big. A 0.078" is slightly oversize. 0.075"-0.076" is ideal.
matthepanther
11-01-17, 20:22
Its not, 0.080" is big. A 0.078" is slightly oversize. 0.075"-0.076" is ideal.
thanks. I can never see a clear consensus on this topic. I know that .0.08 is getting too large, but never seen any input on the 0.07-0.08. Apparently colt is in the 0.065 range?
thanks. I can never see a clear consensus on this topic. I know that .0.08 is getting too large, but never seen any input on the 0.07-0.08. Apparently colt is in the 0.065 range?
That's because there isn't a TDP for the midlength so everyone has their own sauce, so to speak. Atleast, this was my understanding from a while back. Haven't been as regular here as I used to so I don't know if things have changed. I had an old DD 14.5mid that was .078 and I believe that was larger than what was on BCM's much-talked-about-soft-shooting 14.5mid. .065" is for the CAR system, isn't it?--Albeit a hair large
.063 for a 14.5 carbine. Colt and other manufacturers use it for 16 as well.
There is so much more technology in a barrel than a metal tube. Buying top tier stuff doesn't mean its going to be perfect, but it means its more than likely going to be perfect for your use. You increase your odds greatly to have a good experience.
PB
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.