View Full Version : 14.5" "Medium" Profile Midlength Barrels
Hi all,
I'm currently building a rifle based around Hodge Defense parts on a Capitol Armory/Mega Arms lower and I'm having some trouble picking out a barrel. I'm using the Hodge Defense Wedge Lock rail system and the Hodge/SLR gas block to fit under it, and I'm now trying to decide on a barrel. I want to get a 14.5" midlength barrel and pin/weld a Surefire Warcomp on the end, but due to the pin/weld I'm hesitant to buy some of the less expensive barrels despite the good reputations of some of them. If I could find one, I'd consider just using one of Hodge's purpose-built barrels, but they're basically unicorns. The Hodge/SLR gas block is .750, so there's some options for a frankenbuild.
The goal here is really little more than a quality 14.5 general purpose "mini-Recce" made in the mold of Hodge's AU-MOD 2 uppers. This was a for-fun build that slowly spiraled out of control, hilariously enough, but now that I'm in this deep I figure I may as well give it a good barrel too. Barrel budget is about $250-$270. Durability with respectable accuracy is the name of the game since a pin/weld would make replacement a bit more time consuming. Weight is concern, but everything with a .750 gas block journal seems to sit around 23-26 ounces anyway, so I'm not super concerned about that so much as I am with weight distribution. Jim Hodge specifies his barrel as a "taper" profile on the AU-MOD 2s, so that or something similar is what I'm hoping to find.
I know the Hodge barrels are made by FN, but I can't seem to find a 14.5" middy from FN in my usual spots. My original plan was to go with the Ballistic Advantage Hanson to help control gassiness and trim down the weight some. Spike's Optimum profile seemed to fit the bill almost perfectly, but they're no longer FN marked so I'm assuming they're no longer using them as an OEM, which in turn has me hesitating there as well.
My current shortlist looks something like this:
-BA Hanson .750 - 26 oz, QPQ
-BCM Standard Enhanced Medium Weight - 26 oz, chrome-lined
-DD Lightweight - 22 oz, hammer forged, chrome-lined
-Spike's Optimum - 24 oz, hammer forged, chrome-lined
Any reasons I should pick one over the others? The BA is obviously the cheapest, but the DD is lighter, and the BCM looks like it'd have the best weight distribution overall. I'm not sure what the gas port sizing on any of these are either, which is a minor point of concern in case I decide to suppress the rifle later. I asked about these things on TOS, but didn't get much more than some anecdotal recommendations for Green Mountain and Faxon, which isn't really satisfactory for me since I'm spending significantly more time and money ensuring I get quality parts and trying to do deep dives on the technical aspects of the parts going into this rifle.
I have a BA hanson profile with .750 gas block and a DD 14.5 that also has a .750 gas block. Both have midlength gas systems. The more I shoot the BA barrel the more i like it. Out of the two the BA is also more accurate. Weight is not enough to notice. I'm about to do a pistol build with a BA barrel. It was between them and bcm, but since BA is giving away upper receivers with 175$ purchase I'm chosing them. I have the DD as a heavy use high round count upper and the BA as a bench type with a bipod and big scope.
jason el cuerdo
11-16-17, 10:27
hah, I've had almost the same project percolating for a while now. Recently discovered the spike's 14.5 you referred to; looks to me the closest to be the closest to the Hodge as is available but with the brand gives me a blah taste in mah mouth. I wasn't aware of any new omission of a FN mark but to my (relatively limited) knowledge FN is the only shop to make barrels with that steel & double thick chrome line process?
My backup choice is a BCM but the ELW BFH because am quite happy with the one I have and might as well stick with a known quantity
RobertTheTexan
11-16-17, 11:14
I own a couple of BA Hanson 14.5’s. The BCM mid-length I had was 16”. It was a good barrel. I also own a DD 11.5 and a LW 16” both of which are also good barrels. But of those barrels the BA Hanson is the only one I have two of. It’s on probably the best shooting AR that I’ve not only built but shot. It’s accurate, sub MOA accurate at least to the 250 yd mark. I’ve got that second 14.5 in a work in progress build, but the plan is to build a more compact precision gun. Docsherm called that purpose an “Urban Precision Rifle” and that has stuck with me. So much so that I’m building one and plan to run a 1-8 on it with a Centurion Arms hand-guard. I’d definitely recommend the BA Hanson. All my BA barrels are just outstanding barrels.
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I too am despairing of ever seeing Hodge Mod 2 uppers hitting the market again, and am tempted to just build my own. The barrel I would use is the FN CHF 14.5.
Our BRT OPTIMUM Light barrel (http://www.blackrivertactical.com/concrete5/store/#!/BRT-16-OPTIMUM-Light-Barrel/p/61518552/category=1852006) may fit your needs nicely.
It is 16" but is comparable to the 14.5" in handiness due to the continuous taper profile and .625 gas block.
The EXT gas length and port sizing allow it to work well with a wide range of ammo and it takes a suppressor well.
For techies, the gas system parameters are similar to a 14.5" mid length.
https://dqzrr9k4bjpzk.cloudfront.net/images/812059/465401099.jpg
Take a look at the Faxon 14.5" middy. Get it with the matched bolt
http://faxonfirearms.com/14-5-gunner-5-56-nato-mid-length-4150-qpq/
hah, I've had almost the same project percolating for a while now. Recently discovered the spike's 14.5 you referred to; looks to me the closest to be the closest to the Hodge as is available but with the brand gives me a blah taste in mah mouth. I wasn't aware of any new omission of a FN mark but to my (relatively limited) knowledge FN is the only shop to make barrels with that steel & double thick chrome line process?
My backup choice is a BCM but the ELW BFH because am quite happy with the one I have and might as well stick with a known quantity
I bought a Spike's rifle when I was in college and it's currently my only complete AR. The barrel I have on that gun pre-dated their involvement with FN by a few months, so I looked to them early on while planning this project. However, I noticed that the pictures of the Optimum profile barrels from their introductory period are marked "Spikes FN", and that newer photos of the barrels simply read "Spikes" followed by the technical data. I'm not sure why they'd axe the FN stamp after making such a big deal about sourcing their barrels from them, but it's enough to give me pause, especially since PSA's FN-made barrels apparently still wear it.
As for the other recommendations made so far, I looked around at the other options and the current parts I have/need for this build pre-empt using them. Faxon in particular was axed from my list early on; their Gunner profiles are .650 at the gas block and their only other options for a 14.5" are Government profile. The Hodge Wedge Lock is supposed to be paired with their SLR gas block that is .750 only, and I've already bought both - only missing a barrel and Warcomp for this build now. My Spike's rifle is a Government profile; not a huge fan of the profile's weight distribution. I also looked at FN early on as a direct OEM option, but noticed they do not sell any 14.5" midlength barrels directly, and the 14.5"s they do sell lack the midweight/taper profile I was looking for.
I've considered going to 16" previously as well, but the use of a Warcomp would make the gun fairly long as-is. My existing rifle is a 16" with a BE Meyers 556 ASR on the end and I was hoping to get it at least somewhat shorter than that, so 14.5" seems to be the sweet spot that I'd really prefer to stick with.
I'm glad to hear the BA Hansons are capable of trading blows with the much more expensive, chrome-lined hammer-forged barrels, though. Obviously I want this to be as high a round count a barrel as I can make it, and the low cost of the BA barrels these days has been making me second-guess myself. Any idea how the more conservative gas porting on those plays with H buffers? I've got Geissele Super 42 setups in both my existing gun and the complete lower I've already got for this one, so I want to make sure it'll cycle it properly.
Walker_Texasranger
11-16-17, 12:39
Noveske? I believe they do a tapered barrel similar to Spikes’ Optimum.
Mine runs fine with a standard carbine spring and an h buffer. I don't shoot any wolf or tula though. Im going to try a sprinco blue spring and an h2 just for fun to see how it works. But i have other uppers i want to use on the lower so I'm trying to find the best setup for all of them.
noonesshowmonkey
11-16-17, 13:44
Colt SOCOM 14.5" barrels are forged with faerie dust.
Do a little looking for the Molon accuracy test with them. For a 4150CMV chrome lined barrel, they are pretty unreal.
I asked about these things on TOS, but didn't get much more than some anecdotal recommendations for Green Mountain and Faxon, which isn't really satisfactory for me since I'm spending significantly more time and money ensuring I get quality parts and trying to do deep dives on the technical aspects of the parts going into this rifle.
Take a look at the Faxon 14.5" middy. Get it with the matched bolt
http://faxonfirearms.com/14-5-gunner-5-56-nato-mid-length-4150-qpq/
:lol:
OP, out of the barrels you listed, given the rest of your build kit & goal, the BCM barrel gets my vote 10 out of 10 times.
Accuracy is gonna be with a wash across all of these if you factor in match ammo.
Out of the barrels OP listed only Ballistic Advantage provides 1 MOA guarantee as far as I know. If you're looking for more of a long term durability rather than accuracy I'd suggest to look at Cold Hammer Forged barrel. From what I've seen and heard regardless of a manufacturer all current CHF barrels on the market are typically good.
I had a 14.5" BCM EMW and would recommend it over the others. I have 3 BA barrels (13.7, 14.0, and 18), but the BCM still gets my vote. It comes dimpled for a low pro gas block, has a better profile (my opinion),and is chrome-lined.
I had been searching for the exact barrel you are describing for years, and had originally settled on a Centurion Arms 14.5" midlength or carbine, but they no longer sell them. I bought a BCM ELW instead, and I have been very happy with it. If BCM made a mid weight barrel, I would get one of those as well for a suppressor host.
I had been searching for the exact barrel you are describing for years, and had originally settled on a Centurion Arms 14.5" midlength or carbine, but they no longer sell them. I bought a BCM ELW instead, and I have been very happy with it. If BCM made a mid weight barrel, I would get one of those as well for a suppressor host.
Like this?
https://www.bravocompanyusa.com/BCM-14-5-Mid-Barrel-ENHANCED-MID-WEIGHT-FLUTED-p/bcm-brl-mid-14-emwf-std.htm
RobertTheTexan
11-16-17, 20:07
I had a 14.5" BCM EMW and would recommend it over the others. I have 3 BA barrels (13.7, 14.0, and 18), but the BCM still gets my vote. It comes dimpled for a low pro gas block, has a better profile (my opinion),and is chrome-lined.
My BA barrels come pinned with a low pro gas block. I believe e that’s standard on their Hanson barrels. What BA barrel profile did you get?
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My BA barrels come pinned with a low pro gas block. I believe e that’s standard on their Hanson barrels.
As far as I can tell, it is; I haven't seen anyone selling them without them. However, since I'm adding the SLR gas block, which will need to be pinned I assume, would there be any benefits to getting a barrel that hasn't ever had a gas block pinned on before? I don't have enough experience with gas systems to know for certain, but I would assume that having a dimple for a normal sized gas block pin instead of drilling out the old pin and needing to use a new, oversized pin would be preferable.
RobertTheTexan
11-16-17, 21:52
You don’t have to drill out the existing pin, you just knock it out. However since you are using an SLR GB, I’m guessing their Sentry 7, pinning is moot since their GB’s use set screws from the bottom or clamped is screws on the side. IMO if longevity is key, you really can’t beat a pinned gas block. The pin that is used is normally hardened steel and can take punching out and punching in more than a few times. I have a test barrel that has a chopped FSP and I’ve hammered those pins out and in so many times I can’t remember but they are still tight , really tight. So are you going clamped or with the set screws? I bought a jig from SLR and I tap my own dimples for when I want to run an adjustable gas block.
However I’m considering a change of SOP in using adjustable gas blocks, but that’s not your topic. But they do present an additional failure point that doesn’t exist with mil spec GB’s. Anyway...
So even though I have to dimple my BA barrels for the GB, I still prefer those over the other barrels I’ve used including BCM, and DD, because in my builds, they have had an edge in accuracy. I think it’s been noted that they are the only one of the group (at least my group) who offer a sub MOA guarantee. That said I’ve done builds where longevity/endurance were a higher criteria than sub MOA accuracy and I went with a DD because I like their CHF barrels. They’ve been making those for a good while and they’ve been proven in combat theaters.
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The gas block used with the Hodge Wedge Lock is the SLR GB-7. It actually has one set screw and is dimpled for a pin as well. I was planning to have the gas block pinned in place during the pin and weld of the Warcomp.
RobertTheTexan
11-16-17, 22:56
I just saw that when I looked up the GB7. So I’m not sure the hole or dimpled barrel would be an advantage to you, if it doesn’t align with the set screw and the pinning hole on the gas block. If I recall BA’s GB, their pin goes between the two set screws. I’d like to know how they align if at all.
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jason el cuerdo
11-17-17, 02:19
The barrel I have on that gun pre-dated their involvement with FN by a few months, so I looked to them early on while planning this project. However, I noticed that the pictures of the Optimum profile barrels from their introductory period are marked "Spikes FN", and that newer photos of the barrels simply read "Spikes" followed by the technical data. I'm not sure why they'd axe the FN stamp after making such a big deal about sourcing their barrels from them, but it's enough to give me pause, especially since PSA's FN-made barrels apparently still wear it.
.
Some thoughts I had (not as an argument because I'm really thinking about myself and my back burner poor man's Hodge clone project haha): how many places can hammer forge a barrel? Are any of them low quality? How many places does FN make hammer forged barrels as an OEM for? (me no expert and memory fails but I believe at least Hodge, BCM and Noveske with respect to forged/ double chromed).
Marking them FN earlier and not now could easily be a case of "Hey look at us, we're increasing our quality by going with well established OEM" to now "We are the manufacturer of high quality parts pay no attention to that hammer forge behind the curtain" (seems like just about everyone has something made for them by someone else anyhow).
Just thinkin'...
You don’t have to drill out the existing pin, you just knock it out. However since you are using an SLR GB, I’m guessing their Sentry 7, pinning is moot since their GB’s use set screws from the bottom or clamped is screws on the side. IMO if longevity is key, you really can’t beat a pinned gas block. The pin that is used is normally hardened steel and can take punching out and punching in more than a few times. I have a test barrel that has a chopped FSP and I’ve hammered those pins out and in so many times I can’t remember but they are still tight , really tight. So are you going clamped or with the set screws? I bought a jig from SLR and I tap my own dimples for when I want to run an adjustable gas block.
However I’m considering a change of SOP in using adjustable gas blocks, but that’s not your topic. But they do present an additional failure point that doesn’t exist with mil spec GB’s. Anyway...
So even though I have to dimple my BA barrels for the GB, I still prefer those over the other barrels I’ve used including BCM, and DD, because in my builds, they have had an edge in accuracy. I think it’s been noted that they are the only one of the group (at least my group) who offer a sub MOA guarantee. That said I’ve done builds where longevity/endurance were a higher criteria than sub MOA accuracy and I went with a DD because I like their CHF barrels. They’ve been making those for a good while and they’ve been proven in combat theaters.
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Yea RTT I was just about to say, the SLR Sentry's come with a shelf to have the gb drilled and pinned. I am going to be picking up a Sentry 6 to go on my 11.5" Big Gunner barrel and I am trying to decide if I should send it off to be pinned. I think I likely will.
My BA barrels come pinned with a low pro gas block. I believe e that’s standard on their Hanson barrels. What BA barrel profile did you get?
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Correct, my two BA hansen profiles did come with pinned gas block. I also bought an 18" without a gas block with no dimple. I agree though, the pinned low pro from them is a great option.
Some thoughts I had (not as an argument because I'm really thinking about myself and my back burner poor man's Hodge clone project haha): how many places can hammer forge a barrel? Are any of them low quality? How many places does FN make hammer forged barrels as an OEM for? (me no expert and memory fails but I believe at least Hodge, BCM and Noveske with respect to forged/ double chromed).
Marking them FN earlier and not now could easily be a case of "Hey look at us, we're increasing our quality by going with well established OEM" to now "We are the manufacturer of high quality parts pay no attention to that hammer forge behind the curtain" (seems like just about everyone has something made for them by someone else anyhow).
Just thinkin'...
Fair point. Rainier also seems to have an in-house "medium government" contour barrel with similar specs to the Spike's Optimal - theirs is likewise marked with their branding but nothing after it suggesting who the OEM is. I'd probably give the Rainier barrel more consideration if it wasn't $300 without an Apex membership.
bobbytucson
11-17-17, 22:20
i just visited spikes facility in apopka, the staff and facility are super friendly and top notch. im pretty sure they also own ballistic advantage, which is also operating out of apopka very close by. that would also explain why spikes doesnt have fn marked barrels anymore? i dont see a top notch quality & technological barrel manufacturer just happened to randomly choose a lil tiny town northwest of orlando for any other reason than spikes being there....kinda put 2 & 2 together or pure coincidence? i love spikes products
RobertTheTexan
11-17-17, 22:30
i just visited spikes facility in apopka, the staff and facility are super friendly and top notch. im pretty sure they also own ballistic advantage, which is also operating out of apopka very close by. that would also explain why spikes doesnt have fn marked barrels anymore? i dont see a top notch quality & technological barrel manufacturer just happened to randomly choose a lil tiny town northwest of orlando for any other reason than spikes being there....kinda put 2 & 2 together or pure coincidence? i love spikes products
In this case your 2+2 = 5 because Aero Precision owns Ballistic Advantage.
I think you don’t see a lot of Spikes products on M4C because I think many folks just don’t get into all the weird lowers. At least that’s what it is for me. Rhinoceros lowers and whatnot are just a no go for me. But to each their own. That’s the beauty of free enterprise. We can spend our money on what we like and not spend it on what we don’t.
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Diamondback
11-17-17, 22:47
edit: beaten to the punch by RTT
In this case your 2+2 = 5 because Aero Precision owns Ballistic Advantage.
I think you don’t see a lot of Spikes products on M4C because I think many folks just don’t get into all the weird lowers. At least that’s what it is for me. Rhinoceros lowers and whatnot are just a no go for me. But to each their own. That’s the beauty of free enterprise. We can spend our money on what we like and not spend it on what we don’t.
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It should also be noted that BA doesn't make any CHF barrels themselves either, so they can't be Spike's OEM.
I haven't had any issues with my Spike's rifle, but I also built it in what may as well have been a completely different era for the AR (2010), long before they started churning out all the edgy lowers that seem aimed at the dudes who tailgate me in lifted Dodge Rams while I'm doing 80 in the fast lane before cutting me off and brake checking me.
The rifle itself, mechanically? It's fine, if a bit gassy. Fit and finish is markedly inferior to the Hodge/Mega stuff I've gotten so far and the BCM stuff I've handled, but it beats most of the stuff on the market today and certainly did 7 years ago when there weren't a lot of AR outfits doing mil-spec parts. About the only complaint I have with the rifle I made from their parts is "government profile sucks," which isn't their fault and was something they corrected with the Optimum profile barrel that sparked this conversational detour.
RobertTheTexan
11-18-17, 02:08
Yea RTT I was just about to say, the SLR Sentry's come with a shelf to have the gb drilled and pinned. I am going to be picking up a Sentry 6 to go on my 11.5" Big Gunner barrel and I am trying to decide if I should send it off to be pinned. I think I likely will.
I would if I were you. I’ve done that twice with BA (using their barrels). When I’ve been up at 0300 buying AR parts instead of sleeping. Once I caught it before they shipped it so Kyle from BA took it out on the production floor, the other time was an “oh snap!!” moment when I opened the box. I wrote a short note on the back of the packing slip and mailed it back to them next day and they squared me away. I’ve also use Rainier Arms for that and and for pinning my muzzle devices. Good clean work to date.
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rocket 442
11-19-17, 06:42
In this case your 2+2 = 5 because Aero Precision owns Ballistic Advantage.
I think you don’t see a lot of Spikes products on M4C because I think many folks just don’t get into all the weird lowers. At least that’s what it is for me. Rhinoceros lowers and whatnot are just a no go for me. But to each their own. That’s the beauty of free enterprise. We can spend our money on what we like and not spend it on what we don’t.
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That & powder filled buffers��*♂️
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