View Full Version : Watching Thin Red Line for the 50th Time...
...while giving attention to my M1 Garand.
How do you all like Saving Private Ryan more? Sure, it is gory and has this Zone Troopers appeal but it is over-hyped and kinda lame. Everything is all dramatic.
Thin Red Line has this depth. This swallowed whole feeling. Like Platoon but in WWII. Themes of morality and youth. But not in the concept of age. Youth in the sense of the smallness of us as people.
There are no comic book villains. No final boss. No real goal.
A jungle and brutality.
Like you have these guinea men. Ignorant to the world about them in like a paradise. Then they discover the "evolved" man and embrace him and then reject him and the evil he has brought.
No super snipers, no commandos, no last stands.
Like since the 90s people have accused me of being on acid or being in a K Hole for liking this movie so much. There's always something new. It's holding a mirror up to society, man.
Even though it is depressing, it has an optimism. Maybe not like "Everything is super. You will go home a hero and and marry the town tease and fly back to Normandy as an old man with grandkids and ponder if you lived a good life"
But optimistic in that, time goes forward and somewhere there are people who dont have your first world problems and never will.
It's a world and we're all just living in it. No real point. Right now some dude is thinking about driving his car off a bridge because of the rat race and simultaneously there is a man naked, yet contented who has spent all day fishing and will dance under firelight to a tribal song, bed one of his wives, and let only the sun be his alarm clock.
MountainRaven
02-07-18, 21:14
First off, welcome to the Right Honorable Order of the Poor Brother Knights of the Rifle of St. John the Baptist Cantius Garand. We have cookies and coffee.
Second off, I've watched The Thin Red Line twice.
Both times, I was bored to death by it and only made it through because I forced myself to. My parents and brother tried watching it once and made it about half an hour before they found something better to do - like watch paint dry.
Saving Private Ryan seems pretty cheesy after Band of Brothers and The Pacific, but at least it's entertaining.
RetroRevolver77
02-07-18, 21:20
I thought it was slow, I don't even remember how it ends.
Thanks. Not just a Garand, but a Winchester.
The Pacific I didnt like at first but after some years went by I discovered it again and liked it.
TRL seems boring I guess to some but it has this distant quality of a Time I'll never live in nor a place I'll never be able to go. I could go to Guadalcanal today and it would be not the same.
Or maybe I'm just weird
Parts I liked, parts I didn’t. But after Woody blew his ass off with a grenade, and I laughed, I was done.
I thought it was slow, I don't even remember how it ends.
Witt's friends go home on the LCT after he draws Japanese infantry away
band of brothers is my go to
I had an uncle Art. He island hopped with the 1st Marine Div. He had a hatred of Japanese I never really understood until the day he died. He hung onto a 25 year old Zenith because he couldn’t get a made in USA tv.
Anyway, we’d watch John Wayne in Iwo Jima or the like and he’d flash back and berated the movie up and down. Glad I never had to witness what he did.
I had an uncle Art. He island hopped with the 1st Marine Div. He had a hatred of Japanese I never really understood until the day he died. He hung onto a 25 year old Zenith because he couldn’t get a made in USA tv.
Anyway, we’d watch John Wayne in Iwo Jima or the like and he’d flash back and berated the movie up and down. Glad I never had to witness what he did.
That reminds me of a dude I went to college with. He was really old and went for free and he was my buddy. Lost track of him 17 years ago but he is surely passed. There were days when we would all, no joke, pull our chairs together and the prof would give him the floor and he would go on about WWII Pacific and what seemed like another day to him in those days had us on the edge of our seats.
He never got pissed. He'd say "That was bad or sad at the time, but here I am now. I have no complaints." He confided later in a few of us he hung around at the little cafeteria that his son died in Vietnam. He got a bit weepy but he always said "Well he's just been waiting in Heaven for me all these years. I reckon I'll see him before too long".
THAT is a guy who never had neurotic crises of self worth.
Best class ever. Always pick the brains of older folks. They've lived longer, lost way more friends than you have, and most don't worry about anything because they BTDT and got the T shirt.
Boba Fett v2
02-07-18, 21:54
...while giving attention to my M1 Garand.
How do you all like Saving Private Ryan more? Sure, it is gory and has this Zone Troopers appeal but it is over-hyped and kinda lame. Everything is all dramatic.
Thin Red Line has this depth. This swallowed whole feeling. Like Platoon but in WWII. Themes of morality and youth. But not in the concept of age. Youth in the sense of the smallness of us as people.
There are no comic book villains. No final boss. No real goal.
A jungle and brutality.
Like you have these guinea men. Ignorant to the world about them in like a paradise. Then they discover the "evolved" man and embrace him and then reject him and the evil he has brought.
No super snipers, no commandos, no last stands.
Like since the 90s people have accused me of being on acid or being in a K Hole for liking this movie so much. There's always something new. It's holding a mirror up to society, man.
Even though it is depressing, it has an optimism. Maybe not like "Everything is super. You will go home a hero and and marry the town tease and fly back to Normandy as an old man with grandkids and ponder if you lived a good life"
But optimistic in that, time goes forward and somewhere there are people who dont have your first world problems and never will.
It's a world and we're all just living in it. No real point. Right now some dude is thinking about driving his car off a bridge because of the rat race and simultaneously there is a man naked, yet contented who has spent all day fishing and will dance under firelight to a tribal song, bed one of his wives, and let only the sun be his alarm clock.
Ew.
I saw this movie once when it first came out with a bunch of guys from my platoon in Germany. We all hated it. Best modern war flicks about the campaign in the Pacific in my opinion were Hacksaw Ridge, Flags of Our Fathers and Letters from Iwo Jima. But TRL and Windtalkers falls into the category of "I'd rather watch paint dry" for me.
See now I liked Windtalkers too.
It had Injuns and Christian Slater.
Nobody understands me, man.
This is Book Club all over again....
It's not my fault those fuddy duddies didn't understand Less Than Zero.
eightmillimeter
02-07-18, 22:14
@firefly do you have the soundtrack? “Journey to the Line” is one of the best tracks ever written for film.
Boba Fett v2
02-07-18, 22:25
See now I liked Windtalkers too.
It had Injuns and Christian Slater.
Nobody understands me, man.
This is Book Club all over again....
It's not my fault those fuddy duddies didn't understand Less Than Zero.
My family doesn't get my love for Flash Gordon (1980), so it's all good.
My family doesn't get my love for Flash Gordon (1980), so it's all good.
Dude, I LOVE that movie.
I have to rewatch TLR. Only saw it once when it was in theaters. But I was 18 at the time and my depth of understanding was pretty much limited to the last boss, the last stand! I found parts of it entertaining but overall boring. But that was back then. I should give it another go
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Boba Fett v2
02-07-18, 22:30
Dude, I LOVE that movie.
What's not to love?
https://youtu.be/MS4_Z84-rRE
@firefly do you have the soundtrack? “Journey to the Line” is one of the best tracks ever written for film.
I never bought the CD, but I listen to it online every so often. I agree.
The Thin Red Line is the ONLY WWII film that always puts me to sleep.
Boring, slow and stupid. The only cool part was the Japanese coming out of the jungle. Didn't care about their characters, their problems or whatever.
See now I liked Windtalkers too.
It had Injuns and Christian Slater.
Nobody understands me, man.
This is Book Club all over again....
It's not my fault those fuddy duddies didn't understand Less Than Zero.
Now LTZ was a great movie despite being incredibly prophetic for Robert Downy Jr.
Boba Fett v2
02-08-18, 00:10
Now LTZ was a great movie despite being incredibly prophetic for Robert Downy Jr.
The only thing I remember about LTZ was the Going Back to Cali single, so the movie must've sucked. It gets a total limp dick rating from me. Not even a quarter boner.
While in college I spent a summer working for a bush pilot who was there and wrote a book about it. He started off as a junior officer in the 164th Americal Regiment and ended the war as a major. He saw action on Guadalcanal, Bougainville and Leyte - fighting in the first American offensive action of 1942 all the way to one of the last in 1945. Went to school with his daughter whom he mentions. He was a good guy but you didn't want to rile him.
https://www.amazon.com/Combat-Officer-Memoir-South-Pacific/dp/0345463854
The only thing I remember about LTZ was the Going Back to Cali single, so the movie must've sucked. It gets a total limp dick rating from me. Not even a quarter boner.
Really?!? It was a movie about a bunch of privileged rich kids who just had to go along with the program and they STILL managed to screw it all up and destroy their lives. Even if you are born with a golden spoon in your mouth you can still end up blowing guys at the no tell motel for Rip.
Girls are young and hot but taking decades off of their lives with coke. Seems only two people in the whole movie manage to escape with their lives intact but it still comes with a cost.
The grass isn't always greener, but I'd be willing to give it it try if it meant I could bang Jamie Gertz against the wall. She was hot.
And the real single from the film was "Hazy Shade of Winter."
...while giving attention to my M1 Garand.
How do you all like Saving Private Ryan more? Sure, it is gory and has this Zone Troopers appeal but it is over-hyped and kinda lame. Everything is all dramatic.
Interesting that you say that. My father, who retired from the Marine Corps, did three tours in Viet Nam and is a harsh war movie critic, liked TRL much better than SPR. He said the TRL was like combat- you only knew what was going on right around you, it wasn't action 24/7, and that hill fight scene was like every hill he fought on.
Man, 3 pages deep and no love in sight for TRL!
Also one of my favorites if not the favorite WWII film and Ive taken an assload of flak over the years because of it. I have good news, I have met at least One other person that liked it. So there may be 10-15 of us world wide.
I was told once the movie was based on a book (which I knew) but the book has some foxhole buggery going on in it which I cant verify or care to. If its true and Hollyweird didnt try to shoe horn it into the movie it couldnt have been all that important to the story.
Unfortunately I cant show love for windtalkers, too big set feeling, with giant fireball explosions and the cheesy infiltration of the Japanese "base" in the end. I wanted it to workout for Kickin Wings war movie, at least Eastwood put him to good use in Flags of our Fathers (or someones fathers apparently they still cant figure this who raised what)
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The Thin Red Line book by James Jones was part of a series of WWII books, he also wrote From Here to Eternity about the pre war period in Hawaii. I also remember a short story he did about a unauthorized 1911, can't remember all the details but it was about a snuffy who was given a pistol for guard duty on Dec. 6th and in the confusion after attack never turned it in. IIRC it was stolen from him on the troop ship on the way to Guadalcanal. Been many years since I read TRL but I don't recall any buggery, but I do recall there were too guys in a pup tent and there was either HJ or BJ involved. Not so much homo as just two scared young men facing death spending their days moving a 37 mm AT gun through the jungle by manpower alone looking for a distraction and some relief from the horrors of war.
Dude, I LOVE that movie.You're going to laugh, but somewhere I have the soundtrack on LP.
People did not understand it was largely an tribute/homage to the grade B (C?) SF serials of the past.
At the late night, double feature, picture show...
Unfortunately I cant show love for windtalkers, too big set feeling, with giant fireball explosions and the cheesy infiltration of the Japanese "base" in the end.
Just happened to have been on the primary site where they filmed it recently, including seeing the model of the valley where the coreographed the explosions.
It's literally 50 yards from the Jurassic Park running dinosaurs, hide behind the log scene. And the Godzilla footprints from GZ2000 are there as well. And most "Lost" exterior shots. Yep, it's a movie set. Just a big, glorious one.
As for TRL, I've tried, more than once. I sort of "get" some of the scenes. Then it drags on. And on. I don't think I've ever finished it. Will try again.
Fully agree it might be more realistic than SPR, though the opening scene of SPR I felt was the best effort so far to capture Normandy on film.
I've been slowly visiting the major battlefields of history, and nearly always have an "a-ha, I get it now" moment when I do so. Happened for sure at Omaha Beach and Ponte du Hoc for me last summer.
Without the capability to really see what the island hoppers faced, we may not understand. And the grimness that TRL captures is not entertaining, and probably should not be.
Whiskey_Bravo
02-08-18, 08:24
As a pretext I am not a huge fan of Saving Private Ryan. The opening scenes were great as well as a few other parts but the story was cheesy. With that said I would watch it again over TRL. I thought TRL was boring and I have attempted it a couple of times. Never able to get into it.
Defaultmp3
02-08-18, 09:07
Another fan of TTRL here. SPR was a great movie, but TTRL is a masterpiece, IMO. I will say that it definitely isn't for everyone; too much introspection for the mainstream, I'd wager.
Second off, I've watched The Thin Red Line twice.
Both times, I was bored to death by it and only made it through because I forced myself to. My parents and brother tried watching it once and made it about half an hour before they found something better to do - like watch paint dry.
Unfortunately, this was my experience as well. Too long and too slow.
I loved Band of Brothers, but never got to The Pacific. One of these days I'll get to it.
I watched the Pacific when it first aired on HBO maybe 7 years ago??? It is on Amazon prime right now. Wife and daughter are both watching with me. I have nothing bad to say about the Pacific as I felt it powerful then and powerful and moving today.
I read TRL and watched the movie. The movie was disappointing as the book so much better. The only movie that I have watched that followed the book was We Were Soldiers by Hal Moore. Granted the movie does not portray the slaughter of US troops marching back to their original outposts by a regrouped NVA.
Moose-Knuckle
02-08-18, 12:07
How do you all like Saving Private Ryan more?
Because SPR rawks and TTRL sucks, like The Big Red One level of sucking.
I tried The Thin red Line, twice. Fell asleep, twice. Can't do it.
Because SPR rawks and TTRL sucks, like The Big Red One level of sucking.
I actually liked The Big Red One.
Another fan of TTRL here. SPR was a great movie, but TTRL is a masterpiece, IMO. I will say that it definitely isn't for everyone; too much introspection for the mainstream, I'd wager.
Yeah no. I can watch hours of PBS and can do foreign films standing on my head. I like a thinking mans movie, The Thin Red Line was just boring.
the upsides to a movie like TRL :)
you can watch it twice and since your brain refuses to remember that first event you kinda have this dejavu and at least that gives you something to think about :)
if you get up go to the head you do not miss anything :)
you can go make a pizza come back and not miss anything :)
heck you can even forget something to drink and go to the store come back and not have missed anything :)
good movie to watch with old friends cause you can talk story and not miss anything :)
doing all of the above even you do not miss anything :)
See now I liked Windtalkers too.
It had Injuns and Christian Slater.
I liked Windtalkers...I grew up in a Navajo reservation border town and Code Talkers were a huge deal.
Much respect to those dudes!
Yup, barely an ounce of respect for TRL. Ya'll are too easily bored
Visually SPR was ground breaking, i got to see it with a bunch of my fellow soldiers when we spent a few weeks at Ft. Knox and several times there after. Still the story is absolutely preposterous.
Band of Brothers was Amazing but the story still got butchered and come to find out Ambrose was a bit of a Tool. Still it hit the highlights well enough and seemed to appealed to a broad audience.
The Pacific was OK but tried to be too many things at once which is where it fell short of BoB, they should have stuck to one story line and developed the characters better. Centering around EB Sledges Book would have easily filled out 10 episodes. A couple of guys from Sledges Platoon wrote books and could have Fleshed out some earlier campaigns before bring in Sledge for Peleliu and onwards. That Okinawa got summed up in a single espisode is almost Insulting.
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My main gripe with SPR is that it aged horribly. When it first came out, it was a thing because it was so gory. But looking back it is a total cartoon of a movie. The hardcore Ranger team is gonna let in a goocher because he speaks passable german to be the butt of FNG jokes? The Carlos Hathcock shot through the scope? Total BS. With a Russian scope...yeah. Totally. But a German Zeiss? Naw, no way in hell.
The lone kraut they let live comes back to kill one of the guy and smugly looks at the FNG who campaigned for his life?
Garbage.
TTRL isn't a war movie in that sense although war is the backdrop. No super heroes, nothing. It could have easily been about Vietnam. Not everyone who fought was hepped up on Mom and Apple Pie and not every Japanese was a fanatic. No more than us.
The theme is present, what if we are just one big person sharing the same soul? Its an inadvertently Buddhist idea amidst a conflict between faith and the loss of faith.
The Greek Captain doesnt give some lame ass "Earn This" spiel. He says "I have commanded these boys for 3 years and you want me to let them die over a rock?" and the gloryhound Lt. Col. tries to get him out of the way despite admitting it is his first war that he is already too old for. The way he words it seems anachronistic talking to his Juniors but shows instability. He doesn't know Korea is 9 years off from the films timeline. Most people were thinking "once this is over we can live a normal life again".
And the young Private doesnt seek to escape out of cowardice, more out of an appreciation for life. When they bring him back, he fights, but sees merit in the ways of the guinea men.
People think it is this long film with no direction. I think it was brilliant.
You go into SPR knowing that God, Mom, Apple Pie, and a few Army Rangers are gonna kick Hitler's ass. You know who is going to die and when, but Private Ryan is gonna make it out because dammit he's a hero.
You can go into TTRL knowing Japan gets A-Bombed but doesnt chamge the feeling of fatigue. No jump cuts, no cool moves, a jungle Army in a jungle war. The closest you get is the trench gun pointman who has embraced the hate and takes teeth as trophies but you discover it is just a coping mechanism. The dude getting the divorce letter, you feel his pain and the woman doesnt care. She is after the Bigger, Better Deal.
And even though Sean Penn sucks as a person, his 1SG character comes out more jaded but also a little more hopeful.
I figure if the movie was an hour shorter with an evil, knock eyed, bespectacled Japanese officer with a Katana as the last boss and state of the 1990s art gore shots that people would have eaten it up.
Like I haven't watched SPR in 10 years but sat TTRL last night and have it on disc.
Like I'm not a teenybopper and gore does nothing for me and any surviving WWII people I ever knew all said the krauts were doing their job, some better than others, and once they surrendered, they were done fighting.
The one thing that struck me, and it was a pass off line, was hearing a WWII vet speak once and he said the Germans they captured had no real ill will. They were just groomed to think that going to war was just what Europeans did every few decades. Not many were political and those that were simply thought there would be an armistice eventually.
And he grimly intoned that all were grateful not to be on the Eastern Front. In fact, he said more than a few emigrated to the US due to their treatment and admiration of America. Esp. the ones sent to stateside EPW camps.
That was my big hang up with SPR. Steamboat Willy wouldnt have been allowed to live and if he had; he would have GTFO Dodge, not link up with SS.
But none compare to Kelly's Heroes.
Moose-Knuckle
02-08-18, 17:19
I actually liked The Big Red One.
I had big hopes for it, I mean Luke Skywalker and Lee Marvin had some serious potential but when I saw it (only once) it had the same effect on me as TTRL. I was let down the same way I was when I saw TTRL in the theater.
...while giving attention to my M1 Garand.
How do you all like Saving Private Ryan more? Sure, it is gory and has this Zone Troopers appeal but it is over-hyped and kinda lame. Everything is all dramatic.
Thin Red Line has this depth. This swallowed whole feeling. Like Platoon but in WWII. Themes of morality and youth. But not in the concept of age. Youth in the sense of the smallness of us as people.
There are no comic book villains. No final boss. No real goal.
A jungle and brutality.
Like you have these guinea men. Ignorant to the world about them in like a paradise. Then they discover the "evolved" man and embrace him and then reject him and the evil he has brought.
No super snipers, no commandos, no last stands.
Like since the 90s people have accused me of being on acid or being in a K Hole for liking this movie so much. There's always something new. It's holding a mirror up to society, man.
Even though it is depressing, it has an optimism. Maybe not like "Everything is super. You will go home a hero and and marry the town tease and fly back to Normandy as an old man with grandkids and ponder if you lived a good life"
But optimistic in that, time goes forward and somewhere there are people who dont have your first world problems and never will.
It's a world and we're all just living in it. No real point. Right now some dude is thinking about driving his car off a bridge because of the rat race and simultaneously there is a man naked, yet contented who has spent all day fishing and will dance under firelight to a tribal song, bed one of his wives, and let only the sun be his alarm clock.
This movie was boring.
band of brothers did great character dev etc.. they had a huge hit agree wide base :)
Pacific was OK I felt it was lets take the momentum and make it political as we can without loosing to much of the base
Yup, barely an ounce of respect for TRL. Ya'll are too easily bored
Visually SPR was ground breaking, i got to see it with a bunch of my fellow soldiers when we spent a few weeks at Ft. Knox and several times there after. Still the story is absolutely preposterous.
Band of Brothers was Amazing but the story still got butchered and come to find out Ambrose was a bit of a Tool. Still it hit the highlights well enough and seemed to appealed to a broad audience.
The Pacific was OK but tried to be too many things at once which is where it fell short of BoB, they should have stuck to one story line and developed the characters better. Centering around EB Sledges Book would have easily filled out 10 episodes. A couple of guys from Sledges Platoon wrote books and could have Fleshed out some earlier campaigns before bring in Sledge for Peleliu and onwards. That Okinawa got summed up in a single espisode is almost Insulting.
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I saw the TRL in college with a few friends and we all thought it sucked pond scum. The only movie I’ve ever wanted to go demand my money back on.
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MountainRaven
02-08-18, 18:12
My main gripe with SPR is that it aged horribly. When it first came out, it was a thing because it was so gory. But looking back it is a total cartoon of a movie. The hardcore Ranger team is gonna let in a goocher because he speaks passable german to be the butt of FNG jokes? The Carlos Hathcock shot through the scope? Total BS. With a Russian scope...yeah. Totally. But a German Zeiss? Naw, no way in hell.
The lone kraut they let live comes back to kill one of the guy and smugly looks at the FNG who campaigned for his life?
Garbage.
TTRL isn't a war movie in that sense although war is the backdrop. No super heroes, nothing. It could have easily been about Vietnam. Not everyone who fought was hepped up on Mom and Apple Pie and not every Japanese was a fanatic. No more than us.
The theme is present, what if we are just one big person sharing the same soul? Its an inadvertently Buddhist idea amidst a conflict between faith and the loss of faith.
The Greek Captain doesnt give some lame ass "Earn This" spiel. He says "I have commanded these boys for 3 years and you want me to let them die over a rock?" and the gloryhound Lt. Col. tries to get him out of the way despite admitting it is his first war that he is already too old for. The way he words it seems anachronistic talking to his Juniors but shows instability. He doesn't know Korea is 9 years off from the films timeline. Most people were thinking "once this is over we can live a normal life again".
And the young Private doesnt seek to escape out of cowardice, more out of an appreciation for life. When they bring him back, he fights, but sees merit in the ways of the guinea men.
People think it is this long film with no direction. I think it was brilliant.
You go into SPR knowing that God, Mom, Apple Pie, and a few Army Rangers are gonna kick Hitler's ass. You know who is going to die and when, but Private Ryan is gonna make it out because dammit he's a hero.
You can go into TTRL knowing Japan gets A-Bombed but doesnt chamge the feeling of fatigue. No jump cuts, no cool moves, a jungle Army in a jungle war. The closest you get is the trench gun pointman who has embraced the hate and takes teeth as trophies but you discover it is just a coping mechanism. The dude getting the divorce letter, you feel his pain and the woman doesnt care. She is after the Bigger, Better Deal.
And even though Sean Penn sucks as a person, his 1SG character comes out more jaded but also a little more hopeful.
I figure if the movie was an hour shorter with an evil, knock eyed, bespectacled Japanese officer with a Katana as the last boss and state of the 1990s art gore shots that people would have eaten it up.
Like I haven't watched SPR in 10 years but sat TTRL last night and have it on disc.
Like I'm not a teenybopper and gore does nothing for me and any surviving WWII people I ever knew all said the krauts were doing their job, some better than others, and once they surrendered, they were done fighting.
The one thing that struck me, and it was a pass off line, was hearing a WWII vet speak once and he said the Germans they captured had no real ill will. They were just groomed to think that going to war was just what Europeans did every few decades. Not many were political and those that were simply thought there would be an armistice eventually.
And he grimly intoned that all were grateful not to be on the Eastern Front. In fact, he said more than a few emigrated to the US due to their treatment and admiration of America. Esp. the ones sent to stateside EPW camps.
That was my big hang up with SPR. Steamboat Willy wouldnt have been allowed to live and if he had; he would have GTFO Dodge, not link up with SS.
But none compare to Kelly's Heroes.
Not gonna lie, even you talking about this movie is boring: I couldn't make it much past where you stop talking about Saving Private Ryan.
;)
Not gonna lie, even you talking about this movie is boring: I couldn't make it much past where you stop talking about Saving Private Ryan.
;)
Well I know there's at least two other folks in this thread who are on my side....
And while I'm here, I liked Day of the Dead better than Dawn
The lone kraut they let live comes back to kill one of the guy and smugly looks at the FNG who campaigned for his life?
Garbage.
This is either a common misconception or a giant eff up in the continuity department but "steam boat willy" and the guy who killed melish, I believe are two different guys. Dont be fooled by buzz cuts and all the shabby german uniforms looking the similar.
Willy was much Bonier and was always in Wehrmacht uniform, even the camo shelter quarter/poncho. The dude on the stairs was fully kitted out SS. He just smells the weakness and passes by. No recognition, not a raise of the brow or even a second glance, just disgust and disregard. Dont make much sense to me other than to high light Uppoms impotence in that moment, but thats what I see. Latter we see willy again when He draws a bead on and shoots Cpt Miller, he is still in wehrmacht uniform When Uppom kills him. Willy is still a dispicable weasel just not the same dispicable weasel, IMHO.
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Well I know there's at least two other folks in this thread who are on my side....
And while I'm here, I liked Day of the Dead better than Dawn
Youve hits the high points on TRL. Ive long since stopped trying to explain my opinions on this movie. The scenery was awesome lets you know this was really someplace beautiful and interesting before a bunch of foreigners showed up to kill each other then leave. My Favorite part was the brief rifle skirmish in the tall blowing grass. There was something surreal about these guys duking it out in the middle of such beauty.
Fugget... Im watching it tonight
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This is either a common misconception or a giant eff up in the continuity department but "steam boat willy" and the guy who killed melish, I believe are two different guys. Dont be fooled by buzz cuts and all the shabby german uniforms looking the similar.
Willy was much Bonier and was always in Wehrmacht uniform, even the camo shelter quarter/poncho. The dude on the stairs was fully kitted out SS. He just smells the weakness and passes by. No recognition, not a raise of the brow or even a second glance, just disgust and disregard. Dont make much sense to me other than to high light Uppoms impotence in that moment, but thats what I see. Latter we see willy again when He draws a bead on and shoots Cpt Miller, he is still in wehrmacht uniform When Uppom kills him. Willy is still a dispicable weasel just not the same dispicable weasel, IMHO.
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I might try to find the clip but could've sworn it was the same guy.
Instead of pulling a Lone Survivor and putting it to a vote, I just would've murked Willy and eliminated all doubt.
And even then if it was a different German and an SS, it shouldn't have mattered. A dude with a semi auto 30-06 is a dude with a semi auto 30-06. He might grow a pair and shoot me in the back. Especially since I just knifed his battle buddy.
The action wasn't bad just kinda disjointed.
Honestly after the Normandy scene the movie is kinda blah.
The dude reciting the Bible verse while working the 03A3 was neat but again, you aint Carlos Hathcocking through a 6x Zeiss. It just aint happening.
War Era German optics were complicated and not as user friendly, but still were pretty well made esp. the glass. Ol buddy might've gotten a hell of a black eye but that's about it.
Youve hits the high points on TRL. Ive long since stopped trying to explain my opinions on this movie. The scenery was awesome lets you know this was really someplace beautiful and interesting before a bunch of foreigners showed up to kill each other then leave. My Favorite part was the brief rifle skirmish in the tall blowing grass. There was something surreal about these guys duking it out in the middle of such beauty.
Fugget... Im watching it tonight
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See, you get where I'm coming from
Boba Fett v2
02-08-18, 19:02
My main gripe with SPR is that it aged horribly. When it first came out, it was a thing because it was so gory. But looking back it is a total cartoon of a movie. The hardcore Ranger team is gonna let in a goocher because he speaks passable german to be the butt of FNG jokes? The Carlos Hathcock shot through the scope? Total BS. With a Russian scope...yeah. Totally. But a German Zeiss? Naw, no way in hell.
The lone kraut they let live comes back to kill one of the guy and smugly looks at the FNG who campaigned for his life?
Garbage.
TTRL isn't a war movie in that sense although war is the backdrop. No super heroes, nothing. It could have easily been about Vietnam. Not everyone who fought was hepped up on Mom and Apple Pie and not every Japanese was a fanatic. No more than us.
The theme is present, what if we are just one big person sharing the same soul? Its an inadvertently Buddhist idea amidst a conflict between faith and the loss of faith.
The Greek Captain doesnt give some lame ass "Earn This" spiel. He says "I have commanded these boys for 3 years and you want me to let them die over a rock?" and the gloryhound Lt. Col. tries to get him out of the way despite admitting it is his first war that he is already too old for. The way he words it seems anachronistic talking to his Juniors but shows instability. He doesn't know Korea is 9 years off from the films timeline. Most people were thinking "once this is over we can live a normal life again".
And the young Private doesnt seek to escape out of cowardice, more out of an appreciation for life. When they bring him back, he fights, but sees merit in the ways of the guinea men.
People think it is this long film with no direction. I think it was brilliant.
You go into SPR knowing that God, Mom, Apple Pie, and a few Army Rangers are gonna kick Hitler's ass. You know who is going to die and when, but Private Ryan is gonna make it out because dammit he's a hero.
You can go into TTRL knowing Japan gets A-Bombed but doesnt chamge the feeling of fatigue. No jump cuts, no cool moves, a jungle Army in a jungle war. The closest you get is the trench gun pointman who has embraced the hate and takes teeth as trophies but you discover it is just a coping mechanism. The dude getting the divorce letter, you feel his pain and the woman doesnt care. She is after the Bigger, Better Deal.
And even though Sean Penn sucks as a person, his 1SG character comes out more jaded but also a little more hopeful.
I figure if the movie was an hour shorter with an evil, knock eyed, bespectacled Japanese officer with a Katana as the last boss and state of the 1990s art gore shots that people would have eaten it up.
Like I haven't watched SPR in 10 years but sat TTRL last night and have it on disc.
Like I'm not a teenybopper and gore does nothing for me and any surviving WWII people I ever knew all said the krauts were doing their job, some better than others, and once they surrendered, they were done fighting.
The one thing that struck me, and it was a pass off line, was hearing a WWII vet speak once and he said the Germans they captured had no real ill will. They were just groomed to think that going to war was just what Europeans did every few decades. Not many were political and those that were simply thought there would be an armistice eventually.
And he grimly intoned that all were grateful not to be on the Eastern Front. In fact, he said more than a few emigrated to the US due to their treatment and admiration of America. Esp. the ones sent to stateside EPW camps.
That was my big hang up with SPR. Steamboat Willy wouldnt have been allowed to live and if he had; he would have GTFO Dodge, not link up with SS.
But none compare to Kelly's Heroes.
Because it's been way too many years since I first saw it, and because it's your testimony, I'm willing to give it one more shot. Only for you though. If I fall asleep again I'm placing the blame squarely on your shoulders.
ETA: The Longest Day was probably my all-time favorite WWII flick for a long time. I haven't seen it in ages, so my opinion of it might change. When I was a kid I really enjoyed Force 10 From Navarone, probably because Han Solo was in it, but I really didn't care for The Big Red One other than seeing Luke in a war flick. I really enjoyed Dunkirk and The Great Raid wasn't all that bad when it came out. Just thought I'd throw a few honorable mentions out there.
Well if you are willing to do it for me, I'm flattered.
Per The Great Raid, that was a bitterly overlooked film. I enjoyed it. Another liberation attempt like that wouldn't happen again until Son Tay in Vietnam. I have it somewhere I fished from the bargain bin. I think the film does it fair enough justice. I wish I'd seen it in theatres
I watched it again last night :) only thing I got out of it is wow quite a few faces to recognize :) and the idiot brother from Ray Donovan was in it :)
still think it lacks character dev or any reason ? its fine to watch as entertainment but stand by my you can leave come back and not have lost anything
but often people get something out of movies others do not
Thanks for bringing up The Great Raid, I've haven't seen that one yet. I feared disappointment from previews and waited to see it later.....wich still has yet to come. I completely forgot about it and probably could find it for a fiver or less if Id just bother to look.
Honestly with movies Im not easily bored and can be amused more by interesting backdrops and details than a weak, failing or nonexistant plot line. I can stay with most Foreign weird subtitled movies. Winter War (Talvisota) was an interesting Finnish war movie from the ninties about their war against and invading Soviet Union in 1939. The quality of film seemed comparable to 70s or early 80s US flicks. In Finnish with subtitles, the Finnish weaponry and equipment are pretty accurate and Its almost worth it for the cool guns alone. Mass russian assaults, tanks, maxim MGs, maddening artillery barrages. Its slow in parts and while its been ages since I've watched it, I think its a pretty straight foward plot; Guy goes to war, it sucks, friends die, he comes home, life is now meh. Neat seeing commies getting shot wearing their silly pointed wool hats
I like the original 1929 All Quiet on the Western Front, though the primitive sound effect cant wear on the nerves, but it is in english and an american production so its not terribly far behind Sgt. York. Its About a class of german soldiers fighting and dying in WWI. Nazis HATED this movie and the preceding book, written by a german veteran.
Im patiently waiting to see if there is a longer weirder cut of Apocalypse Now hiding somewhere. Im mean the universe did deliver an even longer version of Das Boot, so who knows?
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I liked The Beast. You were supposed to side with the Hajis but I just wanted to see more people shot with the coaxial.
Plus it had the older brother from Lost Boys.
ETA On yt there is a deleted scene from Platoon where Barnes actually lives. As much as I liked Barnes; He kinda had to die.
I always thought it would be better if he lived but it was actually very unsatisfying.
I might try to find the clip but could've sworn it was the same guy.
It's not. But Steamboat Willie IS the guy who shot Capt. Miller on the bridge. It was a different guy who killed Mellisch, note the collar tabs.
I've tried watching TTRL several times but just can't get past how painfully boring it is.
Want a great war film that is different? Try "Hope and Glory" (1987). Boorman is a effin genius.
I liked The Beast. You were supposed to side with the Hajis but I just wanted to see more people shot with the coaxial.
Plus it had the older brother from Lost Boys.
ETA On yt there is a deleted scene from Platoon where Barnes actually lives. As much as I liked Barnes; He kinda had to die.
I always thought it would be better if he lived but it was actually very unsatisfying.
Yeah, talk about a film I watch differently today.
Agreed on Platoon, if Barnes didn't get zipped the whole film would have been pointless. He thought he couldn't die and a FNG proved him wrong. It was an ok film but I still prefer Apocalypse and We Were Soldiers. Hell I prefer Siege of Firebase Gloria.
I think Platoon gave a lot of that generation a black eye. Just because Stone got relegated to a flunkie B squad for losers doesn't mean his experience was indicative of the entire VN experience. Lots of guys went over their and did their job, lots more went above and beyond and didn't spend their off time getting stoned out of their mind or trying to get out of everything.
About the only thing Platoon did was give the "baby killer" hippie crowd who spit on returning vets a sympathetic image they could identify with and allow them to see VN vets in a different light, which of course allowed those dope smoking hippies a chance to forgive themselves for how they treated those vets at the time.
And if you are going to buy into the "make love not war" version of VN, then I'll take "The Boys in Company C" over Platoon any day.
I love Boys in Company C but while the story of Platoon may have been a bit out there, at the time, it had some small details that resonated.
I just liked Barnes. I mean in all fairness the village was VC and nobody asked Elias to play hero. The night time ambush and the green commie tracers, as I was told, wasn't like totally hollywood. And some folks did get high too much and usually ended up dead one way or another.
I, obviously, wasn't there, but heard from too many people who were career guys of the era that there were very much two different armies of the day. The Early 60s Army where it was mostly volunteer and guys thinking this was gonna be like WWII and it was going to go "according to plan" and the Late 60s Army where even Career guys were seeing the whole venture as pointless and it was more "Let's just survive and put in time" and was more why Nixon got elected. To hand off the War to the South and withdraw. Neither "era" was wrong IMO but after a while certain things could be overlooked if you were "home," as in not in the bush. I mean its partially what got the voting age from 21 to 18. You are going to send some kid to some place where he stands a good chance of getting maimed or killed and tell him he cant get high or get laid? And he's likely never left his hometown much less the country and never seen a pair of tits before.
Plus the "babykiller" bit goes both ways. They would pay kids' parents off to let them wire their sons or daughters to blow up guys giving out food or medicine. They would recruit girls to shoot folks. There was a lot of treachery afoot. If some bleeding heart reading the news gets PO'd then that's too bad.
It was a different time and why they did a lot of retooling as a result.
Like I was told that unless you A) Didn't do your job or B) did something really, actually illegal then a lot of stuff flew that would get most people royally boned these days.
But again, getting a little grass and sideways ass is nowhere near as bad as the crap some folks been doing like joining the Taliban after going on vision quests or selling off secrets because they think they are a chick in a males body.
I mean eventually you'll sober up and a little Penicillin will square you away but you can't fix that other stuff.
Interesting that you say that. My father, who retired from the Marine Corps, did three tours in Viet Nam and is a harsh war movie critic, liked TRL much better than SPR. He said the TRL was like combat- you only knew what was going on right around you, it wasn't action 24/7, and that hill fight scene was like every hill he fought on.
I don't like it ... slow, like many have said. That being said, I like it for the 'accuracy' in that nothing happens a lot, people **** up, and you don't always get a warning shot.
The "nothing happening and I'm bored" reminds me a lot of Jarhead.
Per The Great Raid, that was a bitterly overlooked film. I enjoyed it. Another liberation attempt like that wouldn't happen again until Son Tay in Vietnam. I have it somewhere I fished from the bargain bin. I think the film does it fair enough justice. I wish I'd seen it in theatres
The Great Raid was an awesome movie, and reading the books it is based on is on my bucket list.
Moose-Knuckle
02-09-18, 13:54
My Favorite part was the brief rifle skirmish in the tall blowing grass. There was something surreal about these guys duking it out in the middle of such beauty.
That was the part that stood out to me about TTRL, the incoming fire from the concealed Jap positions was surreal. It was the first film to depict gun fire like that IIRC.
Fury is another film that gets that down during the Tiger fight. Prior to that scene when they closed with those Jerry's in the hedgerows that had the GI's pinned down that was a scene for sure.
The Great Raid and Windtalkers are also great films and overlooked IMHO.
Averageman
02-09-18, 14:13
Somebody needs to make a movie about the fighting in the French "hedgerows" after the D-day landings.
That was a hell of a scrap and very pivotal as we were in danger of being pushed back to the beaches.
BoB covered it a bit I think.
That was the part that stood out to me about TTRL, the incoming fire from the concealed Jap positions was surreal. It was the first film to depict gun fire like that IIRC.
Fury is another film that gets that down during the Tiger fight. Prior to that scene when they closed with those Jerry's in the hedgerows that had the GI's pinned down that was a scene for sure.
The Great Raid and Windtalkers are also great films and overlooked IMHO.
I think Windtalkets had potential and I had high hopes, but think it flopped. Cheesy story and dialogue, mediocre effects, not enough use of the Navajo and highlighting them.
Plus I really don't like Nicholas Cage.
Averageman
02-10-18, 21:11
I watched TTRL again. I would consider it an underappreciated piece of work.
I enjoyed it much more this time.
I watched TTRL again. I would consider it an underappreciated piece of work.
I enjoyed it much more this time.
I knew I liked you, man.
I too watched it again on TV.
The jumping narration throws people at first but once you get it, it all makes sense.
Doc Safari
01-28-19, 14:50
I hate to be "that guy" but I thought Thin Red Line was one of the most boring movies I've ever seen--not even as good as Hamburger Hill (a similar movie).
That's three hours I'll never get back.
Okay, throw your tomatoes. I'm ready.
Doc Safari
01-28-19, 14:55
Yeah, talk about a film I watch differently today.
Agreed on Platoon, if Barnes didn't get zipped the whole film would have been pointless. He thought he couldn't die and a FNG proved him wrong. It was an ok film but I still prefer Apocalypse and We Were Soldiers. Hell I prefer Siege of Firebase Gloria.
I think Platoon gave a lot of that generation a black eye. Just because Stone got relegated to a flunkie B squad for losers doesn't mean his experience was indicative of the entire VN experience. Lots of guys went over their and did their job, lots more went above and beyond and didn't spend their off time getting stoned out of their mind or trying to get out of everything.
About the only thing Platoon did was give the "baby killer" hippie crowd who spit on returning vets a sympathetic image they could identify with and allow them to see VN vets in a different light, which of course allowed those dope smoking hippies a chance to forgive themselves for how they treated those vets at the time.
And if you are going to buy into the "make love not war" version of VN, then I'll take "The Boys in Company C" over Platoon any day.
Green Berets. Forgot Green Berets. Sure it was the 'Murica Vietnam experience, but it was made at a time when the anti-war people were still a tiny minority.
And Full Metal Jacket. R. Lee Ermey became an icon with that movie. Still miss him. Died the same weekend as Art Bell. No more gunny. Civilization can end now.
sundance435
01-28-19, 15:31
My main gripe with SPR is that it aged horribly. When it first came out, it was a thing because it was so gory. But looking back it is a total cartoon of a movie. The hardcore Ranger team is gonna let in a goocher because he speaks passable german to be the butt of FNG jokes? The Carlos Hathcock shot through the scope? Total BS. With a Russian scope...yeah. Totally. But a German Zeiss? Naw, no way in hell.
The lone kraut they let live comes back to kill one of the guy and smugly looks at the FNG who campaigned for his life?
Garbage.
TTRL isn't a war movie in that sense although war is the backdrop. No super heroes, nothing. It could have easily been about Vietnam. Not everyone who fought was hepped up on Mom and Apple Pie and not every Japanese was a fanatic. No more than us.
The theme is present, what if we are just one big person sharing the same soul? Its an inadvertently Buddhist idea amidst a conflict between faith and the loss of faith.
The Greek Captain doesnt give some lame ass "Earn This" spiel. He says "I have commanded these boys for 3 years and you want me to let them die over a rock?" and the gloryhound Lt. Col. tries to get him out of the way despite admitting it is his first war that he is already too old for. The way he words it seems anachronistic talking to his Juniors but shows instability. He doesn't know Korea is 9 years off from the films timeline. Most people were thinking "once this is over we can live a normal life again".
And the young Private doesnt seek to escape out of cowardice, more out of an appreciation for life. When they bring him back, he fights, but sees merit in the ways of the guinea men.
People think it is this long film with no direction. I think it was brilliant.
You go into SPR knowing that God, Mom, Apple Pie, and a few Army Rangers are gonna kick Hitler's ass. You know who is going to die and when, but Private Ryan is gonna make it out because dammit he's a hero.
You can go into TTRL knowing Japan gets A-Bombed but doesnt chamge the feeling of fatigue. No jump cuts, no cool moves, a jungle Army in a jungle war. The closest you get is the trench gun pointman who has embraced the hate and takes teeth as trophies but you discover it is just a coping mechanism. The dude getting the divorce letter, you feel his pain and the woman doesnt care. She is after the Bigger, Better Deal.
And even though Sean Penn sucks as a person, his 1SG character comes out more jaded but also a little more hopeful.
Hated it as a war movie, but watching again several times over the years, I've begun appreciate it more because it's not a traditional war movie - it fills a void that many war movies simply don't have time to between explosions.
Five_Point_Five_Six
01-28-19, 15:46
It's been years since I watched it and I remember being bored to death and probably not finishing it. It's doubtful that I'd give it another go, I usually won't try to watch something a second time if I didn't care for it the first time.
LowSpeed_HighDrag
01-28-19, 15:50
Thin Red Line, I think, feels like a very real depiction of what it must have been like in Guadalcanal. I do enjoy Saving Private Ryan, but it feels more like watching a Marvel superhero movie. They both are enjoyable war flicks for me. Neither holds a candle to The Pacific or BOB.
ramairthree
01-28-19, 16:40
I would like to see a:
Faithful accurate MAC SOG type VN movie.
Accurate movie of Grenada.
Accurate mode if Just Cause.
Accurate day to day regulat rotation couple of platoons of Rangers/ troop of operators GWOT movie- not some big stellar mission type one.
Doc Safari
01-28-19, 16:43
Accurate day to day regulat rotation couple of platoons of Rangers/ troop of operators GWOT movie- not some big stellar mission type one.
Not that it's a perfect representation of what you're asking, but wasn't Restrepo the definitive GWOT "day-to-day" type movie?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Restrepo_(film)
TTRL is for artsy fartsy film affectionados w/imaginations.
An imagination is a serious detriment for an infantryman, unless your dreaming up a kitchen.
LowSpeed_HighDrag
01-29-19, 13:03
Not that it's a perfect representation of what you're asking, but wasn't Restrepo the definitive GWOT "day-to-day" type movie?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Restrepo_(film)
Restrepo is a documentary...
sundance435
01-30-19, 13:25
I would like to see a:
Faithful accurate MAC SOG type VN movie.
That would be awesome. Whole lotta of CAR-goodness and might actually show some of the Montagnard/tribal contributions. I don't recall a movie that ever really showed that. I'd also like to see a more modern, higher budget take on the final French years in Vietnam.
That would be awesome. Whole lotta of CAR-goodness and might actually show some of the Montagnard/tribal contributions. I don't recall a movie that ever really showed that. I'd also like to see a more modern, higher budget take on the final French years in Vietnam.
84 Charlie MoPic is the film you seek.
84 Charlie MoPic is the film you seek.
An excellent, underrated movie. You can watch the whole thing on YouTube.
Doc Safari
01-30-19, 14:36
An excellent, underrated movie. You can watch the whole thing on YouTube.
I agree it's excellent. Way better than I expected.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=StO4BrFYq98
How can you not see the brilliance?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=StO4BrFYq98
How can you not see the brilliance?
One of the best battle scenes ever in my opinion.
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