Which anti-seize compound for barrel nut?

[zippygaloo]

I've been trying to find Loctite C5-A because I was told it would work well for my barrel nut. Only problem is nobody carries it locally. The only thing I can find locally (in auto parts stores) is "permatex" anti-seize, and I know nothing about it. Which anti-sieze compound should I use and which should I stay away from.


Loctite C5-A Anti-Seize Lubricant: Copper based, anti-seize lubricant provides a shield against high temperature seizing, keeping metal parts protected during extended firing sessions. Used by top gun manufacturers to keep parts moving smoothly without galling. Easy to use: simply apply a thin coating and wipe off the excess. Protects metals to 1800°F (980°C).
http://www.brownells.com/Images/Products/532000012.jpg

Permatex Anti-Seize Lubricant: A highly refined blend of aluminum, copper and graphite lubricants. Use during assembly to prevent galling, corrosion and seizing and to assure easier disassembly. Temperature range: -60°F to 1600°F (-51°Cto 871°C). Salt, corrosion and moisture resistant – ideal for marine use. Non-aerosol version meets Mil Spec #907E. Aerosol - Level 3*
http://shopping.rexmar.com/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/167196.jpg

[Iraqgunz]

I can't guarantee that it will work. But, I don't see why it wouldn't. I am surprised that no one has the Loc-Tite C5-A anti-seize.

[rob_s]

Use the right stuff.
http://m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=9032&highlight=moly

Bushmaster part # MS-100 $8.50 for a lifetime supply.

[Robb Jensen]

I use this from Brownells 'Action Lube Plus':

http://www.brownells.com/Images/Products/083050002.jpg

http://www.brownells.com/aspx/ns/store/ProductDetail.aspx?p=1147&title=ACTION%20LUBE%20PLUS~#specs

[Legion6]

I just use regular moly grease from any auto store. I personally haven't had any trouble with it myself. YMMV

[hags]

I use this from Brownells 'Action Lube Plus':

http://www.brownells.com/Images/Products/083050002.jpg

http://www.brownells.com/aspx/ns/store/ProductDetail.aspx?p=1147&title=ACTION%20LUBE%20PLUS~#specs

That's the stuff! Good quality moly lube and anti-seize.

[Azrael2004]

The Neko Moly-Slide is what I use as well. The link to Bushmaster in the post rob referred to is no longer valid.
You can find it here http://www.bushmaster.com/products.asp?cat=16 about 3/4 of the way down the page.
Unless your a manufacturer this would likely last you a lifetime of AR building.

[C4IGrant]

We are now using the C5-A. It is really good stuff (maybe too good).

Brownells sells it.


C4

[zippygaloo]

I can only find the "Quick Stik" Loctite C5-A Anti-Seize Compound locally. Will this "Quick Stick" work the same way as the tubed Loctite C5-A? Anybody ever use the Quick Stick?

[Bat Guano]

Doubt it makes any difference as long as it's a reputable brand. I first got sold on it for exhaust studs and nuts on engines. Anytime you can remove said nut easily a few years later it's got to be good stuff.

I've rebarrelled two Garands with Permatex anti-seize, and I put more foot pounds of torque on those than you ever will on an AR.

I also use it on gas cylinder lock screws, and anything I don't want trouble with down the line. Great stuff.

[Rmplstlskn]

Permatex Anti-Seize Lubricant: A highly refined blend of aluminum, copper and graphite lubricants. Use during assembly to prevent galling, corrosion and seizing and to assure easier disassembly. Temperature range: -60°F to 1600°F (-51°Cto 871°C). Salt, corrosion and moisture resistant – ideal for marine use. Non-aerosol version meets Mil Spec #907E. Aerosol - Level 3*
http://shopping.rexmar.com/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/167196.jpg

Be careful with the above product as it is silver in color and if too much is put on it will follow the nut onto the receiver and is VERY HARD to get off the black anodized finish of your BLACK rifle... :eek:

But it is awesome stuff and I have used it for all kinds of anti-seize tasks for DECADES... mainly automotive and industrial applications though.

I personally do not like MOLY products as a anti-seize compound... YMMV

Rmpl

[molsen]

Be careful with the above product as it is silver in color and if too much is put on it will follow the nut onto the receiver and is VERY HARD to get off the black anodized finish of your BLACK rifle... :eek:

But it is awesome stuff and I have used it for all kinds of anti-seize tasks for DECADES... mainly automotive and industrial applications though.

I personally do not like MOLY products as a anti-seize compound... YMMV

Rmpl

I bought a tube of the Permatex 3 or 4 years ago and there's probably 10-15 years worth still in the tube. It works absolutely perfectly and I got it cheap at the Ace hardwear around the corner from where I live. It can get messy, but Gunscrubber takes it right off without any problems.

USMC03 and I have been using it for years without any problems at all.

[chadbag]

I can only find the "Quick Stik" Loctite C5-A Anti-Seize Compound locally. Will this "Quick Stick" work the same way as the tubed Loctite C5-A? Anybody ever use the Quick Stick?

I've been using the stick version with good results.

I also used the permatex stuff once or twice and it worked fine.

[K9-Bob]

I have been using this for the receiver threads with good results. http://www.brownells.com/aspx/NS/store/ProductDetail.aspx?p=1148&title=ACTION%20LUBE%20PLUS~%20SYRINGE

[Robb Jensen]

I have been using this for the receiver threads with good results. http://www.brownells.com/aspx/NS/store/ProductDetail.aspx?p=1148&title=ACTION%20LUBE%20PLUS~%20SYRINGE

That's the same stuff I used, it's just a different package.

[rob_s]

I read in the Brownells catalog that the Locktite stuff has graphite in it. Is this the same stuff that you guys are using? as I understand it, graphite is to be avoided for this application.

[Lawdog-1]

I used Brain Enos's Slide-Guide) installing Mark LaRue FF rail on my first LMT upper. I allso used it on my Kimber Warrior.

[spamsammich]

I used Brain Enos's Slide-Guide) installing Mark LaRue FF rail on my first LMT upper. I allso used it on my Kimber Warrior.

Slide Glide?

[crazymoose]

I read in the Brownells catalog that the Locktite stuff has graphite in it. Is this the same stuff that you guys are using? as I understand it, graphite is to be avoided for this application.

Correct. As I understand it, graphite can cause galvanic corrosion of aluminum. The anodizing is supposed to prevent this; however, my fear is that the torque of a barrel nut being tightened might rub off the anodized surface, thereby making the edges of the threads susceptable.

[Robb Jensen]

Here's the product description from the Brownells website for Action Lube Plus:


Mfr: BROWNELLS

The Ultimate Synthetic Grease That Slicks Up & Protects A Lot More Than Just Triggers; Smooth, Friction-Free Operation For All Types Of Firearms

If you have a firearm that "works", then you need Action Lube Plus. Not a petroleum-based grease, but a synthetic-based, semi-solid lubricant developed and used by military special forces to protect expensive, hi-tech firearms and equipment in all temperatures and all environments; from the deserts of Kuwait to the Bering Strait. Actually exceeds the mil spec of standard, molybdenum disulfide grease. Action Lube Plus lubricates and inhibits corrosion and galling from salt water, powder residue, sweat and moisture on all types of metal, including stainless steel, titanium and aluminum. Action Lube Plus is very concentrated; only a small amount applied to the face of sears and triggers will dramatically decrease pull weight as well as smooth actual trigger feel. On high friction points like bolt raceways and lever mechanisms, just a dab of Action Lube Plus completely eliminates wear and helps assure reliable functioning. A very light coating on the outside of your guns will keep fingerprints neutralized and protect expensive bluing from rust and moisture damage that can occur during storage.

SPECS: 2 oz. (56g) net wt.

Catalog page 260

Since Brownells mentions Action Lube Plus' use on aluminum parts of guns I'm guessing it's safe to use on the aluminum parts of guns. I've used it on at least 500 receiver threads for barrel installations (maybe even more) and haven't ever had a problem due to the Action Lube Plus and I've never had an upper receiver failure. YMMV.
FWIW I can't find anything in the TM which says to avoid moly grease that contains graphite......

[rob_s]

Whether it's in the manual or not, graphite will react adversely with aluminum at high temperature. How much? I don't know. How high of a temperature? I don't know. Is it a realistic problem? I don't know. Is it less than ideal? I think so.

With products available that do not have the graphite content, there would have to be some compelling reason/advantage (besides "it's easy to get at the auto-parts store") to use a product with graphite in it, IMHO.

[Robb Jensen]

Whether it's in the manual or not, graphite will react adversely with aluminum at high temperature. How much? I don't know. How high of a temperature? I don't know. Is it a realistic problem? I don't know. Is it less than ideal? I think so.

With products available that do not have the graphite content, there would have to be some compelling reason/advantage (besides "it's easy to get at the auto-parts store") to use a product with graphite in it, IMHO.

The compelling reason I use Action Lube Plus is that it's designed for guns and that they specifically mention it's use on aluminum.

Since you bring it up have you heard of anyone having a problem with Action Lube Plus on an AR since you say it contains graphite?

I think you might be confusing possibility and probability.

It's completely possible that the next time I pull the trigger on any of my guns it might blow up but it's just not very probable.

[rob_s]

Which is fine. I frankly don't much care what other people use on guns for other people, just putting the information out there for public consumption.

As I said, I don't think it will fail, I just don't see any reason to risk it when there are products available (that are also intended for guns) that do not have graphite in them.

To each their own.

As to the probability thing, it's not very probable that I'm going to get into a car accident, but it's possible and therefore I wear my seatbelt.

Or even more appropriate to this forum, it is statistically almost 100% guaranteed that I will never use a carbine to defend myself (or frankly a firearm at all), but it's still possible so I train for it (and carry a pistol).

[Robb Jensen]

Which is fine. I frankly don't much care what other people use on guns for other people, just putting the information out there for public consumption.

As I said, I don't think it will fail, I just don't see any reason to risk it when there are products available (that are also intended for guns) that do not have graphite in them.



Apparently you do care since you stated that "as I understand it, graphite is to be avoided for this application. " from your post (post #16). But no where have you come up with a who (what manufacturer) or where in the TM does it recommend against molybdenum disulfide greases which contain graphite.

Basically your lane has turned into a dirt road.

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[rob_s]

Basically your lane has turned into a dirt road.

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Really? You're sinking to that just because I disagree with you? Really?

Oh well. Appears to be becoming par for the course 'round these parts.

If you don't understand the difference between not caring what people do, but still wanting to put the information out there so that they can at least make an informed decision, then I don't know what to tell you. I don't care what carbine people buy, but I still take the time to update The Chart.

Do what you like, it's no sweat off my balls either way. People can make up their own minds and do whatever they like as well. I'll continue to use the product with NO downside as opposed to the one with even so much as a theoretical downside. YMMV and all that.

[rob_s]

here (http://www.finishing.com/82/53.shtml) is an interesting discussion on the matter, with points made by both sides of the argument.

One poster there says

Every military spec for solid film lubricants must be certified as graphite free.

I'm going to see if I can find, or get in touch with him and have him provide it, where he got this from.

ETA:
not the military, but NASA (http://corrosion.ksc.nasa.gov/pubs/tm584c.txt).

[Robb Jensen]

here (http://www.finishing.com/82/53.shtml) is an interesting discussion on the matter, with points made by both sides of the argument.

One poster there says


I'm going to see if I can find, or get in touch with him and have him provide it, where he got this from.


So it's something you read on the internet vs. real world experience. That's what I'm getting at. You aren't speaking from experience which is what M4C is all about.

[rob_s]

So it's something you read on the internet vs. real world experience. That's what I'm getting at. You aren't speaking from experience which is what M4C is all about.

What experience would be relevant here?

If, in fact, there is a military requirement for all moly lubes to be graphite-free, then could we not defer to their experience? Or, when I find it are you just going to say "oh, well, that's on the INTERNET"?

So far I posted NASA's requirements above. I'll keep looking for the military one if it exists.

And you're still driving damn hard away from the point, which is that given the option of using a product that is less than ideal vs. one that does not run the same (however theoretical) risks, why wouldn't you choose the one with no risks?

[Robb Jensen]

What experience would be relevant here?

If, in fact, there is a military requirement for all moly lubes to be graphite-free, then could we not defer to their experience? Or, when I find it are you just going to say "oh, well, that's on the INTERNET"?

So far I posted NASA's requirements above. I'll keep looking for the military one if it exists.

And you're still driving damn hard away from the point, which is that given the option of using a product that is less than ideal vs. one that does not run the same (however theoretical) risks, why wouldn't you choose the one with no risks?

At the top of your screen there is an icon titled rules.

Quote from those rules:

Posting Suggestions

In order to maintain a site that is an effective database of good information, it is best to post information that you have first hand knowledge of. If you are repeating information that you have been told or have read from another poster, it is best to disclose that in the opening of the post.

Differences in opinion are quite common amongst the firearms industry, as there are few absolutes in this industry. And as a result, debates over preferences are common. We hope you use this forum to share and exchange ideas and not to win arguments. It is the bigger man that agrees to disagree without being disagreeable.

[rob_s]

I just ordered some of the Brownells material, as well as the Locktite material. I'll do a couple of tests with these and the Bushmaster stuff and see what happens. I'll try some annodized and some bare aluminum.

FWIW, do we know for sure if the Brownells stuff even has graphite in it? I see that the Locktite stuff does, but it's not mentioned for the Brownells brand. Maybe that's why it's listed as safe for aluminum? Maybe it doesn't have the graphite?

[kNOwMORE]

I've been reading this forum for a long time. Because of my job I don't post but this is over the top.

Rob how about instead of arguing about shit you don't understand and arguing with one of the forum founders who's obviously worked on more guns than you will ever see you instead take your little yellow visor over to your little yellow telephone and MAKE A ****ING PHONE CALL.

I did. I've been using the Brownels action lube on aluminum for longer than your 20 something ass has been able to own a gun. Never had a problem. THAT"S EXPERIENCE. But after reading all your doom and gloom quotes from even more unidentified random internet chest thumpers I CALLED BROWNELLS and spoke the tech Dean and asked them to check the MSDS. Guess what, jackass. No graphite in their action lube!!!!!

Compiling a lot of public information into a chart doesn't make you a subject matter expert. It just makes you an internet celebrity. When you've actually DONE SOMETHING in life let me know. Until then, learn when to shut the **** up and listen when adults are talking. It is easy to get out of your lane when your lane is only as wide as a bike tire.

[rob_s]

I've been reading this forum for a long time. Because of my job I don't post but this is over the top.

Rob how about instead of arguing about shit you don't understand and arguing with one of the forum founders who's obviously worked on more guns than you will ever see you instead take your little yellow visor over to your little yellow telephone and MAKE A ****ING PHONE CALL.

I did. I've been using the Brownels action lube on aluminum for longer than your 20 something ass has been able to own a gun. Never had a problem. THAT"S EXPERIENCE. But after reading all your doom and gloom quotes from even more unidentified random internet chest thumpers I CALLED BROWNELLS and spoke the tech Dean and asked them to check the MSDS. Guess what, jackass. No graphite in their action lube!!!!!

Compiling a lot of public information into a chart doesn't make you a subject matter expert. It just makes you an internet celebrity. When you've actually DONE SOMETHING in life let me know. Until then, learn when to shut the **** up and listen when adults are talking. It is easy to get out of your lane when your lane is only as wide as a bike tire.
Wow. Not even sure where to begin there buddy.

I never made a single comment about the Brownells product. I strongly suggest you work on your reading comprehension before you have a meltdown like that.

If your "expert" had done his own research, none of this would have happened. I took it at face value that he knew the product he was using and that it had graphite in it. Turns out he was wrong.


I read in the Brownells catalog that the Locktite stuff has graphite in it. Is this the same stuff that you guys are using? as I understand it, graphite is to be avoided for this application.



Since you bring it up have you heard of anyone having a problem with Action Lube Plus on an AR since it contains graphite?





FWIW, do we know for sure if the Brownells stuff even has graphite in it? I see that the Locktite stuff does, but it's not mentioned for the Brownells brand. Maybe that's why it's listed as safe for aluminum? Maybe it doesn't have the graphite?

Reading. It's fundamental.

Why don't you change your name to "dontkNOwSHIT"?

[kNOwMORE]

I'm not your buddy and I don't need new reading comprehension skills. You were arguing with gotm4 and didn't know what the **** you were talking about. I read the links. A bunch of guys with no credentials offering opinions and a nasa sheet that didn't explain its reasoning. Now you back off and say your going to test it yourself. What is your background for that what credentials do you have and what will your test method be? What are you trying to prove that the MSDS isn't as smart as you?

[kNOwMORE]

You editted your post after I wrote. Making fun of my handle that makes you pretty cool. I'm sure all the other kids at recess will want to be your friend now.

[rob_s]

I'm not your buddy and I don't need new reading comprehension skills. You were arguing with gotm4 and didn't know what the **** you were talking about. I read the links. A bunch of guys with no credentials offering opinions and a nasa sheet that didn't explain its reasoning. Now you back off and say your going to test it yourself. What is your background for that what credentials do you have and what will your test method be? What are you trying to prove that the MSDS isn't as smart as you?

and yet, you still can't read. Let me break it down for you in little words you might understand.

1) I point out that the LOCKTITE brand has graphite in it, and that graphite should be avoided for use with aluminum.
2) gotM4 says (incorrectly) that the Brownells product has graphite in it, and starts an argument about it.
3) I offer to test the various products on two kinds of aluminum, and ask if we're even sure that the Brownells product has graphite in it.
4) You come unglued and show your ass.

[rob_s]

You editted your post after I wrote. Making fun of my handle that makes you pretty cool. I'm sure all the other kids at recess will want to be your friend now.
Ah, but throwing out names like "jackass" and such, that makes you one of the grownups?

C'mon. If you're going to dish it out, learn to take it.

[Robb Jensen]

and yet, you still can't read. Let me break it down for you in little words you might understand.

1) I point out that the LOCKTITE brand has graphite in it, and that graphite should be avoided for use with aluminum.
2) gotM4 says (incorrectly) that the Brownells product has graphite in it, and starts an argument about it.
3) I offer to test the various products on two kinds of aluminum, and ask if we're even sure that the Brownells product has graphite in it.
4) You come unglued and show your ass.


Actually rob you edited your post where you claimed the Action Lube Plus had graphite in it. You had quoted the poster that showed a picture of the Brownells Action Lube Plus in a syringe. I quoted the poster saying it's the same stuff I use but it's just in a syringe.

I posted in response to your claim that it contained graphite. You assumed it did and now switched it to read Loctite stuff....

So what it boils down to is that I've been using Action Lube Plus for years on receiver threads and it will not harm anything. You on the other hand are arguing semantics.....

[rob_s]

Actually rob you edited your post where you claimed the Action Lube Plus had graphite in it. You had quoted the poster that showed a picture of the Brownells Action Lube Plus in a syringe. I quoted the poster saying it's the same stuff I use but it's just in a syringe.

I posted in response to your claim that it contained graphite. You assumed it did and now switched it to read Loctite stuff....

So what it boils down to is that I've been using Action Lube Plus for years on receiver threads and it will not harm anything. You on the other hand are arguing semantics.....


I didn't edit, or quote, anything. Note that my post does not have any "edited by" record on it. My post was, is, and has been

I read in the Brownells catalog that the Locktite stuff has graphite in it. Is this the same stuff that you guys are using? as I understand it, graphite is to be avoided for this application.


The only one that ever said the Action Lube had graphite in it was you.


Since you bring it up have you heard of anyone having a problem with Action Lube Plus on an AR since it contains graphite?



which you did then edit just now


Since you bring it up have you heard of anyone having a problem with Action Lube Plus on an AR since you say it contains graphite?

Last edited by gotm4; Today at 12:23 PM.


I think that all this was was a simple misunderstanding between you and I, and you replying to the wrong person when you meant to reply to someone else. .

[kNOwMORE]

Rob you just can't admit your ever wrong can you. You say you didn't edit any of your posts but I know you editted the one I was typing at because when I hit the submit reply button your post was different. Maybe your little yellow visor is using your computer behind your back or something like that. Your a real big man with your dish it out and take it bullshit. All of that time you spend on the range playing games turned you into a big warrior. You need to find some anti-seize compound for your brain little boy.

I editted my post with this sentence to see if it would say so at the bottom.

[rob_s]

Rob you just can't admit your ever wrong can you. You say you didn't edit any of your posts but I know you editted the one I was typing at because when I hit the submit reply button your post was different. Maybe your little yellow visor is using your computer behind your back or something like that. Your a real big man with your dish it out and take it bullshit. All of that time you spend on the range playing games turned you into a big warrior. You need to find some anti-seize compound for your brain little boy.

I editted my post with this sentence to see if it would say so at the bottom.

Actually, I think that only moderators "edited by" notes show up, but they have the ability to check to see if a poster edited something or not.

Either way, I never said Action Lube had graphite, gotM4 did and later edited his post to make it sound like I said it. what I said was, and is, there for everyone else to see, unedited since I posted it. The Brownells website says that the Loktite brand lube has graphite in it.

You have quite the axe to grind there. Seek help. Really. Other than emotional outbursts, do you have something to contribute here? I am flattered that your bottled up little-man rage drove you to register and post JUST so you could attack me personally and stick your nose in where it doesn't belong. Ironic that you're attacking other people's personalities and character when yours appears so flawed and lacking.

[kNOwMORE]

Who is attacking personalities here. I think you are. You are the one who put "expert" in quotes when refering to gotm4 as is his qualifications are something you have any right to question. You are the one who definitely editted a post and now claims otherwise. You stepped far outside your lane to question your betters because you think having a website makes you a subject matter expert. You just can't say I was wrong and move on. You were more interested in having a safe dickless internet fight with people about something rather than picking up a phone and making a phonecall and getting facts. Now like gotm4 said you just want to fight about semantics and pretend you never said the shit you did because you have nothing in your life to feel tough about except being a tough guy on the internet. And yeah your shit after all these years was finally enough to get me to call you on it. Why don't you stop arguing with me and apologize for your big attitude problem instead.

[Robb Jensen]

This thread is done, nothing good coming of it.