BCM Intermediate Buffer System with BCM 14.5 Mid?

[NOTANASSHOLE]

My other thread got completely side tracked so I figured I'd ask a more specific question.

Anyone running a BCM Intermediate Buffer System with a BCM 14.5 midlength upper? I want the benefits of the Vltor a5, will the BCM get it done or do I need to wait until I can find the Vltor system in stock?

I've read every thread I could find on the Vltor a5 system as well as the BCM Intermediate Buffer System as well as started my own threads but nobody seems to have a conclusive answer. I just want to order something and have it work, and not have to spend more money buying different buffers later. That's wasted ammo money.

I'm laid up waiting on back and shoulder surgeries so I figured I'd try my first AR build. What a pain in the butt. So many variables. I've always just bought BCM guns and the snot out of them. I never put any thought into what parts were inside. Buy gun, slap optic and sling on, shoot. This building thing requires some thought. So far this build is: BCM EMWF 14.5 upper, SOLGW BCG, SOLGW LPK, Geiselle s3g trigger, Trijicon Accupower 1-4x with Aero mount, BCM stock, Aero lower, BCM trigger guard. All I have left to pick up is a pistol grip, a charging handle, a sling, a weapon light, and all the buffer system parts.

[ssc]

I have run my BCM 14.5 ML upper with a BCM intermediate buffer system. Yes the BCM gets it done. BCM, in response to my email recommends the H0 buffer. I have also run many of my guns with both the H0 and H2 A5 Buffer and have not had any issues. Further, unless I am mistaken, the Vltor and BCM A5 systems are identical, except for the buffer. To offer, my personal opinion, I do not see any benefit in running the A5 vs the standard RE in my situation, though I am aware of the alleged benefits.

Cheers, Steve

[NOTANASSHOLE]

I have run my BCM 14.5 ML upper with a BCM intermediate buffer system. Yes the BCM gets it done. BCM, in response to my email recommends the H0 buffer. I have also run many of my guns with both the H0 and H2 A5 Buffer and have not had any issues. Further, unless I am mistaken, the Vltor and BCM A5 systems are identical, except for the buffer. To offer, my personal opinion, I do not see any benefit in running the A5 vs the standard RE in my situation, though I am aware of the alleged benefits.

Cheers, Steve

Cool thanks for the info.

I keep reading about this a5 system improving reliability while at the same time not reliably running steel cased or lower pressure ammo. I run my guns hard in classes and sometimes run crap PMC or Wolf simply because it's cheap. I'm also not famous for cleaning my guns. I lube often, but I certainly don't clean often. I'm starting to question the claims of improves reliability over a simple carbine h buffer setup... Wondering if the a5 type setup is even worth the extra $20 for me.

[Wake27]

Cool thanks for the info.

I keep reading about this a5 system improving reliability while at the same time not reliably running steel cased or lower pressure ammo. I run my guns hard in classes and sometimes run crap PMC or Wolf simply because it's cheap. I'm also not famous for cleaning my guns. I lube often, but I certainly don't clean often. I'm starting to question the claims of improves reliability over a simple carbine h buffer setup... Wondering if the a5 type setup is even worth the extra $20 for me.

I don’t shoot steel but I’d be pretty surprised if an A5H2 can’t cycle it, definitely an A5H1 or A5H0. PMC and UMC both cycle fine on my BCM ELW upper and A5H2.


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[Gatorgrizz27]

I have run my BCM 14.5 ML upper with a BCM intermediate buffer system. Yes the BCM gets it done. BCM, in response to my email recommends the H0 buffer. I have also run many of my guns with both the H0 and H2 A5 Buffer and have not had any issues. Further, unless I am mistaken, the Vltor and BCM A5 systems are identical, except for the buffer. To offer, my personal opinion, I do not see any benefit in running the A5 vs the standard RE in my situation, though I am aware of the alleged benefits.

Cheers, Steve

I’m curious about your comment of not seeing any benefit. I understand the A5 can improve reliability but a properly setup carbine system can also be 100% reliable. However, I’ve heard the A5 system offers a much smoother recoil impulse. Do you not find this to be the case or is it just a matter of personal preference?

[Wake27]

I’m curious about your comment of not seeing any benefit. I understand the A5 can improve reliability but a properly setup carbine system can also be 100% reliable. However, I’ve heard the A5 system offers a much smoother recoil impulse. Do you not find this to be the case or is it just a matter of personal preference?

I wouldn’t say it’s a much smoother impulse. Better, but not significant.


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[Todd.K]

It's the same thing. Vltor A5 buffer and a standard rifle spring, the receiver extension can be Vltor, BCM, Armalite, LMT... It just needs to be AR-10/A5 length.

Just ask BCM what A5 buffer weight they recommend.

[NOTANASSHOLE]

It's the same thing. Vltor A5 buffer and a standard rifle spring, the receiver extension can be Vltor, BCM, Armalite, LMT... It just needs to be AR-10/A5 length.

Just ask BCM what A5 buffer weight they recommend.

Lol I litteraly just hit send on an email to BCM.

[Wake27]

I don’t shoot steel but I’d be pretty surprised if an A5H2 can’t cycle it, definitely an A5H1 or A5H0. PMC and UMC both cycle fine on my BCM ELW upper and A5H2.


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So I was wrong, my BCM middy is using an A5-3 and cycles PMC and UMC without issue. I think those two may be the weakest brass .223 there is and I don't clean it a lot.

[thehammer69]

I just want to order something and have it work, and not have to spend more money buying different buffers later. That's wasted ammo money.

You can easily disassemble the buffers and swap a steel weight for a Tungsten weight if you want to go up in weight. They only cost around $7 each

[GH41]

I wouldn’t say it’s a much smoother impulse. Better, but not significant.


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I know what you mean. The kind of mod you forget you made after a couple of magazines. If I built a new lower tomorrow I would use the A5 system but I wouldn't tear apart an existing rifle to add one.

[vicious_cb]

I wouldn’t say it’s a much smoother impulse. Better, but not significant.


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Pretty much, you arent buying the A5 system for its awesome recoil reducing capability. You buy it because you get a wider window of function which includes: ammo, gas systems, temperatures, suppressed/unsuppressed, dwell times ect.

I standardized on the A5 system a few years ago, now all my uppers will work 100% with any of my lowers.

[ssc]

I’m curious about your comment of not seeing any benefit. I understand the A5 can improve reliability but a properly setup carbine system can also be 100% reliable. However, I’ve heard the A5 system offers a much smoother recoil impulse. Do you not find this to be the case or is it just a matter of personal preference?

For me, the recoil impulse difference is so minimal that it is not a factor. Again, this is for my situation. I generally shoot 14.5-16 inch guns (one has the A5) with appropriate gassed barrels. In my humble opinion, where I think I would be more inclined to run the A5 would be if I ran suppressed and with many uppers that had different length barrels from 10-20 inches. From my experience the theoretical advantage of the A5 then begins to shine as providing a wider spectrum of reliability.

Cheers, Steve

Edit: I see that CB and I posted at about the same time. I completely agree with his post and he has expressed it better than I did.

[Gatorgrizz27]

Thanks for the feedback about the recoil. I understand that’s not why the A5 setup was created, but smoothing things out a bit was the primary reason I was considering switching over.

I have a 14.5” midlength with an H2 carbine buffer and Springco blue spring. I don’t shoot steel cased ammo but want to keep the ability to if it’s all that is available. It barely locks the bolt open on an empty mag with it, but does so reliably. With full power 5.56 ammo the recoil is just harsh enough to slow down getting the red dot back on target.

Obviously the solution is to go to a smaller gas port or shoot .223 level ammo.

[NOTANASSHOLE]

Response from BCM:

"Thank you for contacting us. The Intermediate (A5) System has a longer receiver extension than the standard carbine receiver extension so it offers a slightly longer length of pull and we have heard reports from customers stating that it reduces the amount of felt recoil. Customers have also stated that it runs great in our 14.5” and 16” mid-length upper receiver groups with a A5H0 buffer."

[Shooterman017]

Pretty much, you arent buying the A5 system for its awesome recoil reducing capability. You buy it because you get a wider window of function which includes: ammo, gas systems, temperatures, suppressed/unsuppressed, dwell times ect.

I standardized on the A5 system a few years ago, now all my uppers will work 100% with any of my lowers.

This is what I did it for. Everything I have runs an A5, and performs consistently across suppressed and unsuppressed and any ammo I've bothered trying.

Question for you OP, gonna run it suppressed?? For your thread here...got a 16" middy with a not-so-conservative gas port, but is smooth as butter with an A5H0 unsuppressed. Usually running XM193 equivalent.

[NOTANASSHOLE]

Question for you OP, gonna run it suppressed?? For your thread here...got a 16" middy with a not-so-conservative gas port, but is smooth as butter with an A5H0 unsuppressed. Usually running XM193 equivalent.

Nope won't be suppressed.

BCM recommended the Intermediate System with the H0 buffer, which to my knowledge is the same as a H buffer in a carbine RE. So all I'm gaining is a rifle length spring and potentially a slightly different recoil impulse correct?

[MistWolf]

Nope won't be suppressed.
Hah! Famous last words. If you want to keep that promise, do not ever be around anyone when they suppressed. Do not ever shoot a suppressed AR.


BCM recommended the Intermediate System with the H0 buffer, which to my knowledge is the same as a H buffer in a carbine RE.
I find the A5H2 gives flatter recoil.


So all I'm gaining is a rifle length spring and potentially a slightly different recoil impulse correct?
It will be more forgiving.

Just get the A5/intermediate RE and get to shooting.

[Shooterman017]

I find the A5H2 gives flatter recoil.

I have tried an A5H1 on the midlength (versus a 0) and there wasn't quite a tangible difference...anywhere. Felt recoil/impulse was the same. Not even ejection pattern change worth noting. It felt like it could handle an A5H2 with ease.


Pretty sure that was with the can on. But honestly it's gravy with the A5H0, suppressed or not; I prefer that to a standard carbine spring and buffer.

Hoping a buddy grabs a BCM 14.5" mid here soon so we can play around with it too.

[MistWolf]

I have tried an A5H1 on the midlength (versus a 0) and there wasn't quite a tangible difference...anywhere. Felt recoil/impulse was the same. Not even ejection pattern change worth noting. It felt like it could handle an A5H2 with ease.
I've been using the A5 with a suppressed 11.5" upper. I would ignore ejection pattern, for the most part. Too many variables affecting the pattern.



...it's gravy with the A5H0...
That's what counts. Use what works best for you.

[TacticalMark]

With my 14.5” midlength BCM, I’ve been using the A5H2 both suppressed and unsuppressed without any issues. Have run a full range of ammo from PMC bronze to M855. Been using a Sprinco Green spring for about the last 1k. It’s a very forgiving all around great set up.

[NOTANASSHOLE]

Think the H0 would be more forgiving in a dirty gun vs H1 or H2? I dont clean my guns very often. In fact I didn't clean either of my ARs in 2017 over 4600 rounds fired. I just add Lucas EDGO and I go shoot.

[Wake27]

Just get the A5/intermediate RE and get to shooting.

Do this.


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