View Full Version : 55gr Remington UMC
lanceriley
10-18-08, 19:05
Anybody ever use this ammo? Im going to use it on a 1/7 twist 14.5 barrel. any good? price?
I've shot several hundred rounds of it through both my 1x9 16" Middy and 1x7 10.5" SBR and never had a problem with it in any way. Good for range ammo. I had a gift card to Dick's and it was the only .223 55gr they had.
-RD62
I use to buy it for plinking when it was cheap at walmart but now its not so cheap and there are better options for the same money.
lanceriley
10-18-08, 22:31
would you like to share what other ammos are good for plinking and should have a decent accuracy up to 100 yards scoped?
Anybody ever use this ammo? Im going to use it on a 1/7 twist 14.5 barrel. any good? price?
Economy, marginal load. Availability tends to be better than most, so it's seen a lot. There's both much worse and much better.
Mild loaded ammo. (which I prefer for practice ammo)
The brass is awesome for reloading... no crimp, doesn't need trimming on the first loading, etc.
I agree that it's far from the best value in ammo. It's overpriced right now in the retail realm.
They shoot OK but like most have said, they are overpriced right now.
My only problem is from the 1K I ordered few months ago, I already had 5 or 6 setback with this ammo. Still have more than 500 rounds to go.... :rolleyes:
They shoot OK but like most have said, they are overpriced right now.
My only problem is from the 1K I ordered few months ago, I already had 5 or 6 setback with this ammo. Still have more than 500 rounds to go.... :rolleyes:
Yeah. I've read more than one report of the current UMC not having a crimp. I picked up a box for the hell of it not too long ago. I ran all of it through my factory crimp die before I fired any of it.
It's price prohibitive generally for what you get. I work part time at DSG and if you hit the ammo sales just right, (we just had a buy 1 get one 50% off), you can get it for a "decent" price, (whatever that means). The "Value Packs" are no value, ($105.00 for 200 rounds), but if you buy the boxes of 20, a case price for the same 200 rounds will be $89.98....I found UMC to be barely adequate, smelly and extremely mild and dirty ammunition....It went bang - that's about it....
I just used up the last of my supply. It actually shoots quite accurately in my guns, my gripe was that I had a dud round. In probably close to 10000 rds total of centerfire, I believe it was my first dud. Pissed me off cause it ruined my score. Generally speaking, give it a try, it may shoot well. It's no self defense round, but it's also easier on the weapon than say XM193.
chillindrdude
10-22-08, 21:00
i've been using it for my LMT since i can get it for $75/200rds. i haven't had a malfunction (knock on wood). doesn't seem any dirtier than the UMC or Blazer that i use for my 9mm.
just for clarification, my brass casings are alittle discolored at the "neck"/bullet end. appears to be heat annealing type discoloration. is that the same for you guys?
my brass casings are alittle discolored at the "neck"/bullet end. appears to be heat annealing type discoloration. is that the same for you guys?
On some of the UMC I find this. This is something I want to see on my brass. The newer boxes of UMC are shiney like Federal AE. I don't know if this is because they polish off the annealing or if they're skipping the annealing?
lanceriley
10-22-08, 21:42
setback on a rifle round? wow that's scary
setback on a rifle round? wow that's scary
Man yea...
Fortunately, it jam on it's way up to the chamber (partly still in the mag) each time.
I am still afraid to use it....wondering why!
lanceriley
10-23-08, 11:36
I would suggest you dispose of that specific ammo. if it sets back again... it will be very disastrous. I know ammo is expensive but so is good guns.... and let's not forget your safety
I would suggest you dispose of that specific ammo. if it sets back again... it will be very disastrous. I know ammo is expensive but so is good guns.... and let's not forget your safety
Just run it through a crimp die. Or bargain it to a reloader who can... or wants it for components.
They shoot OK but like most have said, they are overpriced right now.
My only problem is from the 1K I ordered few months ago, I already had 5 or 6 setback with this ammo. Still have more than 500 rounds to go.... :rolleyes:
setback from what? repeatedly chambering same round? how did you measure and how much setback are we talking?
lanceriley
10-23-08, 12:02
I would agree selling it for components but to have it recrimp. I would still have my doubts.
setback from what? repeatedly chambering same round? how did you measure and how much setback are we talking?
He's getting the bullet set WAY back from just normal cycling.
He's getting the bullet set WAY back from just normal cycling.
And again, HOW is he getting setback?
The act of chambering a round should not produce setback, that's usually associated with recoil bouncing the bullets inside the mag, Think Kinetic Bullet puller in reverse.
It could be a QC issue with the Ammo itself, or it could be something totally different.
As for knowing he had setback, how did he know? If it's jamming before chambering, it's the bullets being bounced around in the mag from recoil, and I'd bet dollars to dimes that the problem only associates itself to that mag. If they chamber and fire, there is no way to know if you had setback, other than MAYBE an increased recoil/report, unless you can recover the brass to look at pressure signs...And I'm not talking looking at the primer. If they are NOT chambering, and instead jamming on feedramps, I'd place the blame again with the mag not orienting the round properly for the bolt to strip it off.
If I see ANY problems with factory ammo, I let the factory that produced it know about it. Usually, they respond by giving me free ammo to replace the problem ones.
Here's a small test to see if case mouth tension is correct. Take a loaded round and measure OAL. Than, push it bullet first into your bench with moderate pressure. Measure again. Sufficient mouth tension will not allow that bullet to move. If it DOES, then the case mouth was expanded too far in the loading process, not allowing the case to properly grip the bullet. I usually see that problem in dies that are not set up correctly, and the expander ball is too far towards the open end of the die.
Any round that does not pass the "Push Test" gets torn apart and recycled. I have only seen a true case of setback in factory ammo exactly 3 times. Every time the ammo company in question confirmed a QC problem with that lot and refunded the ammo. Ammo companies are REALLY shy about liability lawsuits and any sign of defective ammo usually gets attention right away.
The act of chambering a round should not produce setback
Right! That's the problem with the ammo. I think I read a few accounts of guys who could set the bullet back in the case with their fingers.
There's no question that the issue is with the ammo. Too many reports of it have been popping up on the gun boards.
Right! That's the problem with the ammo. I think I read a few accounts of guys who could set the bullet back in the case with their fingers.
Did any of these people contact Remington? Or instead just bitch and badmouth the brand on a forum?
Not a troll, not intended to flame, but the vocal minority rules on the internet.
If you could push the bullet into the case with your fingers then you should be able to remove the bullet just as easy. That's a QC issue and I'll assure you if you contact Remington on the issue they WILL make it right.
Does that mean you shouldn't buy Remington ammo? Not at all. Machines that make ammo are just that. Machines. They sometimes fall out of adjustment.
*I* wouldn;t buy remington UMC ammo for the simple fact that I refuse to pay 9 bucks for 20 rounds.:D
Did any of these people contact Remington? Or instead just bitch and badmouth the brand on a forum?
I really don't know. I don't recall any bitching or badmouthing. It was more of sharing info and getting opinions. I think it's good for people to make others aware of these issues as they arrise.
I really don't know. I don't recall any bitching or badmouthing. It was more of sharing info and getting opinions. I think it's good for people to make others aware of these issues as they arrise.
The whole problem with the internet is that people can post whatever they feel for whatever reasons they feel.
I've never fired any of the UMC ammo, so I cannot offer an opinion on how it performs.
Here is what I mean...
No round have been chamber before, and of course, never been chambered again.
Not a mag issue since it does the problem with different mags and not a rifle issue since it does the same thing with both of my AR and my Type-97.
I guess the crimping in not strong enough to support the feeding of a semi-auto, but even that, I never experience any problem with any match ammo...
http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b394/Eth0/Rem1.jpg
Both of those bullets hit something inside the receiver HARD. Either barrel ext. or a 3-point jam. Flattened points are the first give away.
That's not a QC problem, that's a firearm malfunction.
Yea they stuck on the feeding ramp and the mag while been pushed by the bolt.
I shoot thousands of AE, SP and other like BTHP, Match, etc.. and never experience that problem. No malfunction ever at the exception of these Rem UMC.
Tolerance stacking, worn feed lips, too tight feed lips, tilting follower, weak mag spring all could cause that problem.
Blaming the ammo would be the last thing I would do.
Well I also taught it was mag related problem but it happened in two different rifles (AR and Type-97), so two different feed ramp and with different mags (yea I did check and marked any mag when malfunction happened).
If it was a problem for hitting something to hard, any soft point would have done the same problem prior any FMJ bullet I believe.
Anyway, this is just my opinion...
Did you contact Remington?
Did you contact Remington?
Nhaaa and maybe I should email them with the lot number and see what they will say about it.
The fact is these ammo were imported to Canada for me from a rep here and just wondering what would be the process but hey, why not contact them fist...
lanceriley
10-23-08, 18:42
whoa. that looks scary enough for me. just imagine what would happen if you fired that thing. did it cause a jam?
whoa. that looks scary enough for me. just imagine what would happen if you fired that thing. did it cause a jam?
Absolutely, every time...
Fortunately, it jam while chambering (between the feeding ramp and the mag).
Thing is I am now afraid of any Kaboom...you guys understand me :rolleyes:
At least, they jam prior being in the chamber.
I am sure Remington has been warned and fixed the problem. Meanwhile, I will use some regular AE.
Maybe I can sell it back to any guy that have a bolt action...
Storydude- I've seen multiple examples of soft brass, bullet setback, and related problems from this (Rem UMC) ammunition. It's predictable in a good quantity of ammo, and not confined to a certain lot or production range. It's occurred in known-good guns and magazines, and has been observed by multiple shooters in a class.
Remington is well aware of the issue(s). Their response is underwhelming. Remington is producing what the market is demanding. Most folks don't shoot enough to produce issues. Those that do tend to shoot other stuff.
It's one of the few loads that maintains some good availability. There's a reason for that.
Storydude- I've seen multiple examples of soft brass, bullet setback, and related problems from this (Rem UMC) ammunition. It's predictable in a good quantity of ammo, and not confined to a certain lot or production range. It's occurred in known-good guns and magazines, and has been observed by multiple shooters in a class.
Remington is well aware of the issue(s). Their response is underwhelming. Remington is producing what the market is demanding. Most folks don't shoot enough to produce issues. Those that do tend to shoot other stuff.
It's one of the few loads that maintains some good availability. There's a reason for that.
I'm amazed at that. Most other ammo companies and component companies I've contacted in regards to dangerous ammo/components have been overwhelming positive.
Last thing a ammo company wants is a Kb caused by the ammo they produced. In this litigious society we live in, in EVERY instance of a defective piece of ammo, the maker sent a UPS call tag, AND not only refunded my money, they replaced the ammo free of charge.
Maybe Remington just needs some poor slob to lose a hand/finger/eye/life before they do something about it, IF it's actually caused by the ammo........to my eyes, those rounds posted above still look like they slammed into something hard with momentum and force.
Don;t believe me? Pull apart a factory round of any make, and try and deform the bullet tip with a hammer. Not as easy as it looks with a FMJ bullet.
lanceriley
10-23-08, 23:46
maybe there's something with your ar feeding. bullet height and all. it probably rammed the feed ramps.
Here's a little thread on it from TOS. Another shooter with 6 or 7 setbacks out of 300 rounds.
http://www.jobrelatedstuff.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=16&t=400855
Here's a little thread on it from TOS. Another shooter with 6 or 7 setbacks out of 300 rounds.
http://www.jobrelatedstuff.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=16&t=400855
Umm, I believe that's the same poster as above.:D;)
I'm amazed at that.
Don't be. Companies have an acceptable rate of defect and product return. Some are higher than others, based in no small part on the target user of the widget.
It's economy ammo. Minimally engineered and manufactured.
Last thing a ammo company wants is a Kb caused by the ammo they produced. In this litigious society we live in, in EVERY instance of a defective piece of ammo, the maker sent a UPS call tag, AND not only refunded my money, they replaced the ammo free of charge.
I know a maker that will pay to have their incredibly rare problems picked up, send it to their pertinents and engineers for detailed diagnosis, and return an impressive quantity of ammo to compensate the customer and restore their confidence.
I know another that genuinely doesn't care. They pay insurance premiums, plan to buy an average quantity of replacements a year, and figure they make more in the end cutting corners than buying the occasional.
There are all kinds, and most are somewhere in the middle.
Don;t believe me? Pull apart a factory round of any make, and try and deform the bullet tip with a hammer. Not as easy as it looks with a FMJ bullet.
The jacket on the UMC is pretty thin.
Speaking of the bullet... The UMC 55gr FMJ was found to have jacket/core separations in a couple of 1/7 guns with reasonable predictability. Observed, and by more than one board member here at M4C.
A couple groups of folks shooting ~25k/ea of the same load, in a short period of time, is pretty informative.
It isn't garbage, and it's better than several others. It is what it is though, and no one should be surprised.
Don't be. Companies have an acceptable rate of defect and product return. Some are higher than others, based in no small part on the target user of the widget.
It's economy ammo. Minimally engineered and manufactured.
I know a maker that will pay to have their incredibly rare problems picked up, send it to their pertinents and engineers for detailed diagnosis, and return an impressive quantity of ammo to compensate the customer and restore their confidence.
I know another that genuinely doesn't care. They pay insurance premiums, plan to buy an average quantity of replacements a year, and figure they make more in the end cutting corners than buying the occasional.
There are all kinds, and most are somewhere in the middle.
The jacket on the UMC is pretty thin.
Speaking of the bullet... The UMC 55gr FMJ was found to have jacket/core separations in a couple of 1/7 guns with reasonable predictability. Observed, and by more than one board member here at M4C.
A couple groups of folks shooting ~25k/ea of the same load, in a short period of time, is pretty informative.
It isn't garbage, and it's better than several others. It is what it is though, and no one should be surprised.
Very well put.
Also, it defines why I roll my own. ;)
Umm, I believe that's the same poster as above.:D;)
Oh! Sorry. I just happened across it while looking at TOS. I just found out my account is unBANNED over there.
Umm, I believe that's the same poster as above.:D;)
Yep, the same :D
Did any of these people contact Remington? Or instead just bitch and badmouth the brand on a forum?
Not a troll, not intended to flame, but the vocal minority rules on the internet.
If you could push the bullet into the case with your fingers then you should be able to remove the bullet just as easy. That's a QC issue and I'll assure you if you contact Remington on the issue they WILL make it right.
Does that mean you shouldn't buy Remington ammo? Not at all. Machines that make ammo are just that. Machines. They sometimes fall out of adjustment.
*I* wouldn;t buy remington UMC ammo for the simple fact that I refuse to pay 9 bucks for 20 rounds.:D
Remington bought back 2k from me 2 years ago.
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