View Full Version : DON'T FALL FOR THE "It's over" hype--get out and vote.
The Dumb Gun Collector
10-18-08, 23:52
This is a VERY close election by historical standards. McCain is within 4-5 points in most polls (excluding the 2 point polls and the 7-9 point polls). That is TIGHT. The media is flat selling us a bill of goods trying to suppress turnout.
All we need is a small break and we can win this thing. Don't quit!!!:D
randyman_ar
10-19-08, 00:07
This is a VERY close election by historical standards. McCain is within 4-5 points in most polls (excluding the 2 point polls and the 7-9 point polls). That is TIGHT. The media is flat selling us a bill of goods trying to suppress turnout.
All we need is a small break and we can win this thing. Don't quit!!!:D
Nunt uh!!!! The media is fair and unbiased!! Only reporting the truth!!! If you don't believe me just ask Katie C.:rolleyes:
AZ Old Guy
10-19-08, 01:25
I'm hoping for a landslide voter turnout of people like us to turn those frikkin polls on their ear. And I'm so afraid for my grandchildrens' future, I'd be happy if the "Bradley Effect" was real and shows up in this election. I'm not a racist, but I'm definitely an ideologue who hates Socialists and Communists. I wouldn't care if Obama were purple, his Socialist politics are just wrong.
From Wikepedia: The Bradley effect, less commonly called the Wilder effect, is a proposed explanation for an alleged discrepancy between voter opinion polls and election outcomes in American political campaigns when a white candidate and a non-white candidate run against each other. Named for Tom Bradley, an African-American who lost the 1982 California governor's race despite being ahead in some voter polls, the Bradley effect refers to an alleged tendency on the part of some voters to tell pollsters that they are undecided or likely to vote for a black candidate, and yet, on election day, vote for his/her white opponent.
All you guys are right, the polls showed john kerry winning in 04 by nearly a double digit margin and he lost by 3. Those polls are all fixed and designed to give the impression its already over. Don't fall for it, get out and vote. Vote freedom first!
All you guys are right, the polls showed john kerry winning in 04 by nearly a double digit margin and he lost by 3. Those polls are all fixed and designed to give the impression its already over. Don't fall for it, get out and vote. Vote freedom first!
Exactly!
McCain will win.
Go Vote.
I think we will lose, mainly due to the economy. I will get out and vote anyway, more than once If I can.
The Dumb Gun Collector
10-19-08, 07:59
I see todays Reuters has Obama down to 3 points. Several other polls show 2. If these translate into the battleground states we will win. Obama consistently over-polls. In damn near ever race so far he has gotten fewer votes at the ballot box than he did in the phone polls. I have also noticed our polls go up every weekend, only to drop on tues-thurs. I think working folks simply don't get polled as much during the week.
Nra-Life-Member
10-19-08, 12:00
When President Obama takes office - was it because you didn't vote?
Get out and Vote !
+1 for McCain, even though I would like to throw my vote to Baldwin but I'm not wastin a vote with this much at stake this year, maybe 2012 for Baldwin:confused:
I keep trying to talk myself into voting- but I hate Mccain. I don't believe he's gun friendly. I don't believe he's any more conservative than Osama. If he wins, the Dems will have even more ammo to elect an even more radical, socialist, gun-hating, terrorist-loving candidate next election.
On the flip side, if Osama wins, he'll be a huge dissapointment, and we can elect a good strong conservative in 4.
The country's problems aren't going away in the next 4 years. Our economy is going to fail, the war is going to get out of hand, we might even see conscription again. Neither of these candidates are bold enough to fix anything, even if a president could fix anything. They'll be failures and we'll rebel against their party, whichever it be, in 4 years. I'd rather we rebel against the Dems.
So I think I'll just stay home and put together another AR on election day.
I keep trying to talk myself into voting- but I hate Mccain. I don't believe he's gun friendly. I don't believe he's any more conservative than Osama. If he wins, the Dems will have even more ammo to elect an even more radical, socialist, gun-hating, terrorist-loving candidate next election.
On the flip side, if Osama wins, he'll be a huge dissapointment, and we can elect a good strong conservative in 4.
The country's problems aren't going away in the next 4 years. Our economy is going to fail, the war is going to get out of hand, we might even see conscription again. Neither of these candidates are bold enough to fix anything, even if a president could fix anything. They'll be failures and we'll rebel against their party, whichever it be, in 4 years. I'd rather we rebel against the Dems.
So I think I'll just stay home and put together another AR on election day.
That exact thought did run through my mind:o, especially with this Congress.
McCain is not my favorite, either. But a vote FOR him is a vote AGAINST the Commie Obama Bin Biden. McCain is a lot more gun friendly than Obama - and the only choices we have this election is to vut our losses and live to fight another day.
It's your vote - but please don't waste it. There are thousands of homeless people, chipmunks, cartoon mice, and dead people turing out to vote for Obama Bin Biden.
Vote against Obammunism. I want to see the look on their faces when we win by a landslide.
variablebinary
10-19-08, 20:01
It's a changin...
By Andrew Quinn
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Democrat Barack Obama's lead over Republican John McCain in the presidential race has dropped to 3 points, according to a Reuters/C-SPAN/Zogby poll released on Sunday.
Obama leads McCain by 48 to 45 percent among likely U.S. voters, down 1 percentage point from Saturday. The four-day tracking poll, which has a margin of error of 2.9 points.
Pollster John Zogby said the numbers were good news for McCain, and probably reflected a bump following his appearance in the third and final presidential debate on Wednesday.
"For the first time in the polling McCain is up above 45 percent. There is no question something has happened," Zogby said.
He said the Arizona senator appeared to have solidified his support with the Republican base -- where 9 out of 10 voters now back him -- and was also gaining ground among the independents who may play a decisive role in the November 4 election.
Obama's lead among independent voters dropped to 8 points on Sunday from 16 points a day earlier.
'RED FLAGS'
"If that trend continues, it is something that has got to raise red flags for Obama," Zogby said. "It suggests to me that his outward look of confidence may be as much strategy as it is real."
Other national polls have given Obama a double-digit overall lead, fueled by perceptions he would do a better job managing the faltering economy and unhappiness with McCain's attacks on him over the past week.
But he has cautioned his supporters against overconfidence and most polls now put his lead in single digits.
Obama, 47, who would be the first black president, enjoys strong support among black, Hispanic, Catholic and Jewish voters while the 72-year-old McCain holds a narrower lead among male and white voters.
Women, who are expected to be an important factor in the election, still favor Obama by a 6-point margin, although this has been declining in recent days.
Independent Ralph Nader drew 2 percent support in the poll, conducted Saturday through Tuesday, while Libertarian Bob Barr registered 1 percent, both little changed.
The rolling tracking poll surveyed 1,210 likely voters in the presidential election. In a tracking poll, the most recent day's results are added while the oldest day's results are dropped in an effort to track changing momentum.
The U.S. president is determined not by the most votes nationally but by a majority of the Electoral College, which has 538 members allotted to all 50 states and the District of Columbia in proportion to their representation in Congress.
(Reporting by Andrew Quinn, Editing by Sandra Maler)
Be ready for the rioting though, if you live in an urban area. It'll be just like what happened after the Rodney King incident, only all across the nation wherever liberals are found. Be very weary of people who vote for Obama and say that they are "peace loving".
It's getting tight here in PA also. Vote McCain!
Be ready for the rioting though, if you live in an urban area. It'll be just like what happened after the Rodney King incident, only all across the nation wherever liberals are found. Be very weary of people who vote for Obama and say that they are "peace loving".
that would be BAD-ASS. Instigate! Instigate!
No shit. Give me just one reason.
I always vote on the first day of early voting, and am there a few minutes before opening. Almost missed this on time voting this time around but found out that early voting started Saturday at of all places, my local gun store!
Showed up at 0845 (polls opened at 0900). They opened :10 early. Was out of there by 0857.
Simple. Easy. Effective.
SPARTAN HOPLITE ARMS
10-19-08, 20:54
As my good friend, who is an Airman in the USAF and a politcal fanatic, says we can just accept an Obama victory and a nice hard turn to the far left for the USA. Of course you can skip the vote cause you don't like McCain. Just be ready to accept the consequences of a prez Obamination. It'll be a bit hard to undo anything he and a Dem supermajority in the House and Senate will put into place. We're talking Fed Judges, Supreme court judges, etc. Don't be surprised if the "CHANGE" you can't believe in is the Change you can never reverse...sliding on down towards a Marxist utopia for all the liberals to enjoy. :mad:
As my good friend, who is an Airman in the USAF and a politcal fanatic, says we can just accept an Obama victory and a nice hard turn to the far left for the USA. Of course you can skip the vote cause you don't like McCain. Just be ready to accept the consequences of a prez Obamination. It'll be a bit hard to undo anything he and a Dem supermajority in the House and Senate will put into place. We're talking Fed Judges, Supreme court judges, etc. Don't be surprised if the "CHANGE" you can't believe in is the Change you can never reverse...sliding on down towards a Marxist utopia for all the liberals to enjoy. :mad:
while I do believe that irreversible change can occure, in the form of a change in American social psychology; there isn't anything Obama can do that cant be undone later, legally, technically speaking. Supreme Court rulings CAN be overturned, Federal judges CAN be fired, congressmen and senators CAN be voted out, as well as cold-fish presidents- and I do believe Osama will be cold.
Very cold. he'll whine about how he can't accomplish anything because of the damage done by W and his boys, the vast right wing conspiracy conspirators, and damage done to international relations... and he'll get nothing done, will sink, and be booted out to make way for someone "better" (who will also suck balls).
I have trouble with this idea that we're going to sink in marxism because of one piece of crap president. We've had literally dozens of piece of crap presidents... we're not marxist yet. it's not a president that will bring about a totalitarian government; it's a bad congress and SC justices that'll do us in. The president holds sway with his veto power, but that's about it. He can't, and wouldn't want to, veto congress into some kind of bolshevic revolution- red revolutions occure to OUST the leaders, they aren't initiated BY leaders. No, what these libs want is a EU-style government; democratic-looking enough to keep people quiet, but slowly, ever so slowly, eroding away at civil liberties in the name of INCREASING CIVIL LIBERTIES.... as ironic as that sounds. They want a thought-controlled society that's so dependent upon their government, they cant even conceive of rebelling against it- marxist rebellion included.
bah. the world can just go to hell, for all I care. America was the last-bastion of freedom and Christianity, but now there's no place to go. I'll just sit back and watch it burn from my front porch, with an EBR on my lap. I got a big porch, if anyone wants to join.
One thing about the HYPE.
It works both ways. How many Obama voters will think it is a done deal and stay home?
The Dumb Gun Collector
10-19-08, 22:37
I was very subtle at the range today. A guy I know who is always there and talking about the gold standard (:rolleyes:) was telling me how he wasn't going to vote. He said their was no difference between Obama and McCain. I said, right to his face: "Any man who can't tell the difference between those two is a stone cold idiot."
I don't think he will harass me about the gold standard anymore.:D
Business_Casual
10-19-08, 22:48
The president holds sway with his veto power, but that's about it.
The president appoints all of the executive branch leadership, who in turn make regulation that has the force of law. BATFE, FBI, IRS, FEMA, etc. That is significant power. Not to mention that he can issue executive orders. Obama can do plenty of damage make no mistake.
M_P
The president appoints all of the executive branch leadership, who in turn make regulation that has the force of law. BATFE, FBI, IRS, FEMA, etc. That is significant power. Not to mention that he can issue executive orders. Obama can do plenty of damage make no mistake.
M_P
my point is that he can't make laws. but you're right, those are important. the AFT, specifically, as the "rules" and "interpretations" they come up with become law-by-proxy, in the end.
my point is that he can't make laws. but you're right, those are important. the AFT, specifically, as the "rules" and "interpretations" they come up with become law-by-proxy, in the end.
89 Bush Ban
Executive Order
the executive order can be a powerful thing, but it's still not "law making." it's SUPPOSED to be limited to initiating policies within the parameters of legitimate legislature.
the executive order can be a powerful thing, but it's still not "law making." it's SUPPOSED to be limited to initiating policies within the parameters of legitimate legislature.
But in practice...
It may not be "law making" in a legal sense but to the man on the street there is no difference.
89 Bush Ban. Wake up one morning and the law NOW says you cannot import certain guns with desirable features or names. Done by Executive Order.
LegalAlien
10-20-08, 10:15
This is the most refreshing thread I have read since the start of the election campaigns!!!
At least we have a good cross section of voters who think logically and realize that a stay-away or protest vote would strengthen Obama's chances.
Yes, there are many, many Republicans and other Conservatives that do not like McCain, but I can see that personal dislikes are being set aside and logic applied in voting for the greater good.
We cannot afford to have Conservative/Republican votes diluted in this election.
Generally I would say, VOTE for the candidate that best represents your view points, but this time we have to put that aside - UNLESS you are prepared to live under Socialist rule for at least the next 4 years.
bah. the world can just go to hell, for all I care. America was the last-bastion of freedom and Christianity, but now there's no place to go. I'll just sit back and watch it burn from my front porch, with an EBR on my lap. I got a big porch, if anyone wants to join.
I'll bring the beer
x2. A no-vote is a vote for Obama--period. We've gained a lot of pro-gun ground in the past eight years and losing any of it would be a shame. At least with McCain we have a good chance of moving further forward with a pro-gun agenda.
This is the most refreshing thread I have read since the start of the election campaigns!!!
At least we have a good cross section of voters who think logically and realize that a stay-away or protest vote would strengthen Obama's chances.
Yes, there are many, many Republicans and other Conservatives that do not like McCain, but I can see that personal dislikes are being set aside and logic applied in voting for the greater good.
We cannot afford to have Conservative/Republican votes diluted in this election.
Generally I would say, VOTE for the candidate that best represents your view points, but this time we have to put that aside - UNLESS you are prepared to live under Socialist rule for at least the next 4 years.
AZ Old Guy
10-21-08, 00:56
x2. A no-vote is a vote for Obama--period. We've gained a lot of pro-gun ground in the past eight years and losing any of it would be a shame. At least with McCain we have a good chance of moving further forward with a pro-gun agenda.
I agree totally. But wait - there's more! There's a fair chance that the party makeup in congress will become filibuster-proof, meaning the Democrats can pass whatever they like. If the Socialist becomes POTUS, he'll pass all their liberal crap. AND WORST OF ALL, THE PRES WILL GET TO APPOINT SUPREME COURT JUSTICES, PROBABLY TWO IN THE NEXT FOUR YEARS. With our love of legislating from the bench, that would put us and most Americans in a world of hurt, because the checks and balances the founders carefully crafted into the Constitution would all be doo-doo.
It isn't over till it's over, and all I hear from the fat lady are a few croaks.
while I do believe that irreversible change can occur, in the form of a change in American social psychology; there isn't anything Obama can do that cant be undone later, legally, technically speaking. Supreme Court rulings CAN be overturned, Federal judges CAN be fired, congressmen and senators CAN be voted out, as well as cold-fish presidents- and I do believe Osama will be cold.
Please elaborate....How many laws, or for that matter, executive orders in the last 40 years have been changed???
Ok, don't strain your mind.................EXTREMELY FEW IF ANY!!!!!!!!!!!!
The only way to stop stupid laws from being passed in the first place is to put people in government positions that think and vote like you and I!!! Don't be the person who complains afterward about stupid laws (or executive orders) being passed by the same person you voted for!!! If you vote, AND EVERY GUN OWNER SHOULD!!!!!!!!, make sure your vote counts for the things you believe in.
My main criteria is 2nd Amendment only!!!!! It might sound shallow or narrow, but I really believe that most every party (except Libertarian) has too many of the same policies and bend too much to media/special interests!!! Both parties are extremely gray and don't have the backbone to stand up and do what is right for the people!!!
This country remains asleep....The only two things that woke up the 'giant' in the last 100 years were the two times that we were attacked. Then after a few years, it went back to sleep!!!! All you have to do is look at the percentage of voter turnout in all the elections. It is well below 50% which means that this country deserves whoever gets elected...
If you don't vote, you shouldn't complain PERIOD!!!!!
Rant off...
I keep trying to talk myself into voting- but I hate Mccain. I don't believe he's gun friendly. I don't believe he's any more conservative than Osama. If he wins, the Dems will have even more ammo to elect an even more radical, socialist, gun-hating, terrorist-loving candidate next election.
There is no one worse than Obama in current American politics, as his record demonstrates.
The "let them get in and trash the place" strategy is kind of like convincing your wife of the need for self-protection by letting her hang out with a convicted sex offender. For the strategy to work, the worse has to happen and you'll be dealing with the consequences rather than seeing the improvements you hope for.
the executive order can be a powerful thing, but it's still not "law making." it's SUPPOSED to be limited to initiating policies within the parameters of legitimate legislature.
Changing the sporting purposes test requirements would completely comply with your interpretation of an EO's purpose, and would also castrate importation of firearms and ammunition.
People who think Obama can't hurt things badly, or the damage can be undone or might even be beneficial in the long run need to understand one simple fact: the US has NOT recovered from the damage done by FDR in the 1930s and 1940s. The abuse of the Commerce Clause, the massive intrusion of the federal gov't into daily life, the roots of the American welfare system and the pyramid scheme called Social Security all derive from that period, and all continue to hamper the US today, not to mention the NFA.
Detective_D
10-21-08, 08:42
I dont know if it is a good thing or not, but all this crap is actually sending me to the polls for the first time.
I have NEVER voted for anything. But I could do that because I just accepted what happened in the end. I know I would not be able to accept Obama as president and finally want my voice to be heard.
Just my .02
~D
CarlosDJackal
10-21-08, 08:52
while I do believe that irreversible change can occure, in the form of a change in American social psychology; there isn't anything Obama can do that cant be undone later, legally, technically speaking...
This is pure and utter bullcrap!! The effects of the AWB have yet to be reversed. In some instances the AWB was never repealed because it was adopted at the state level. And for all intense purposes, these laws are there to stay. In most cases we are paying higher prices than what we should be for just about everything that so-called law touched. The 1986 law against legal transfer of NFA items made after the law was enacted has yet to be reversed. Prices for NFA items are so high, only the rich can afford them.
The effects of the Klintonites on the military is still being felt. As the Recruiting and Retention Officer for an Aviation unit in the Army National Guard; my unit was at 98% strength when it was disbanded in the mid 90s. I lost a lot of very good Soldiers who chose to leave the National Guard rather get re-assigned to another unit. These were Soldiers we could use in the current GWOT.
During the Karter administration the use of Human Intelligence was "outlawed". The result being our Intelligence organizations being blind to what is going on. How else could our enemies get close enough to bomb the USS Cole and the WTC.
Don't fool yourself into thinking that a left-wing anti-American President (and his anti-American wife) cannot and will not do some very long-lasting and maybe permanent damage to this country. :mad:
No shit.
Guys, much of the media is so far in the tank this go-around, that they've pretty much dropped all pretenses.
Remember how Kerry's "lead" evaporated? Hell, how Obama's lead in many states went the same way on primary election days? Many of the polls are fundamentally flawed in the first place, and even if they weren't many media outlets are using them to discourage non-Obama voters.
The Dumb Gun Collector
10-21-08, 22:13
We absolutely have to go all out in VA and Mo. I don't see how McCain can win without them. He needs to close the gap SOON.
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