View Full Version : Thoughts on being "low key"?
Been pondering this since last night and thought I'd ask people what they personally do in order to get some better insight. I apologize for the wall of text.
Stopped at the local gas station last night and while at the counter some guy in a sports jersey with mirror shades swaggers in. You know the walk, similar to the strut guys at the gym use after doing reps with the really heavy weights (yet they complain if you ask them to help move a couch because its "too heavy"). After a quick once-over I just walked past as usual and exited.
His shiny, jacked up Jeep was parked in the handicap spot directly in front of the doors. Pristine winch and line, smoked covers on the lights, off road tires that only make sense if you are...well, actually off road somewhere like Arizona. Lots of auxiliary lights (covered). Not a bad looking Jeep if it was in a parts catalog or King of Hammers video. Well, not bad for being a newer one with plastic fenders (I'm a purist, REAL Jeeps don't have plastic fenders).
As I get into my Jeep I notice by the driver side door the other guy has a decal of three .308 rounds next to two "bullet hole" decals split by a slash mark. Haven't seen a 3%-er decal like that before, it was admittedly "cool" looking. Backing out of my parking spot I spy various "Kill or be Killed", a smiley face with a bullet hole in the forehead, a "this is my safety" (just the words, nothing else), and something about houses & Glocks.
Personally, I've always preferred LOOKING non-threatening. I like being under estimated (the looks on people's faces when they realize they just F'd up is amusing). I have often wondered are people like that guy just "posers" or can they back up their advertising? My default is to go with they can back up their claims as I'd rather over estimate than under. Given the slightly arrogant look of dismissal the guy gave me I don't think he realized I have a CCW permit or understand practicality of Jeep mods vs actual use.
The whole thing makes me wonder, how much do you advertise your views/beliefs/support of the 2A/draw attention to yourself or vehicle?
Coal Dragger
03-31-18, 10:31
Sounds like a typical bro-douche.
I don’t advertise at all. No gun company apparel or stickers. No 2nd Amendment apparel or stickers. No USMC apparel or stickers. Etc. No tattoos either.
I don't put anything firearm related, political, or otherwise on my vehicle. But I'm not one to really draw attention to myself anyway.
SeriousStudent
03-31-18, 10:37
I strive to attract zero attention.
If I wished to be a douche canoe, I'd park my shiny Jeep in a handicap spot so some elderly person or war veteran missing a leg would have to walk. But I'm not, and I actually enjoy the exercise of walking in parking lots.
Dude was probably a cook or postal clerk.
With the exception of my "US Air Force Retired " license plate frame, there is nothing. I wear nothing that would advertise or stand out. All my goodie stickers are saved for display on the cabinet doors on my reloading bench. I completely agree with SS above.
Same here- nothing on my car at all other than my Big Red front license plate, which most people don’t know what that is anyway. I don’t wear any logo shirts or caps, either. I am just an older, balding married guy. With hidden fangs.
Averageman
03-31-18, 11:25
I actually have considered getting two of those "U.S. Army RETIRED" stickers and cutting them up.
I just don't know how some folks would feel about "U.S. ARMY RETARDED" on the back window of my Truck.
Most of those type of guys will grow out of it and see the value in being the grey man. I'm not sure I've ever seen a rig like that owned by anyone over the age of 45.
We have the same issue with young guns in backcountry snowmobiling. They get their first high paying job and borrow the money for a jacked up diesel truck, a brand new $15,000 snowmobiles and $5000 of accessories to go with it. They run loud exhausts that draw negative attention to our sport and usually don't make it 5 miles from the parking lot. All of the sudden they turn 40 and all that shit is gone. They either drop out of the sport or become one of the old dudes like me; riding deep into the back country, stealthily with stock exhaust (so nobody poaches your secret riding area), saving all our "bro" money for more gas, and becoming ambassadors for our sport.
Some reach the crotchety old dude level sooner than others. Some never have the gene to be a show off. Me, I don't care anymore.
SeriousStudent
03-31-18, 11:35
I actually have considered getting two of those "U.S. Army RETIRED" stickers and cutting them up.
I just don't know how some folks would feel about "U.S. ARMY RETARDED" on the back window of my Truck.
My brother is a retired Master Sergeant, and just has a very small sticker where he cut off the "Re". It just says "U.S. Army tired".
My wife's truck has a couple stickers about dogs. my daughter's car has a couple paw print stickers and my Jeep has nothing covering the dirt on it. I'm not advertising for someone unless they pay me, and nobody's paying me...
My brother is a retired Master Sergeant, and just has a very small sticker where he cut off the "Re". It just says "U.S. Army tired".
That made me laugh hard
BrigandTwoFour
03-31-18, 14:15
I do not advertise whatsoever. No stickers on my car, no obviously tacti-cool clothing (5.11 pants, multicam combat shirts, etc.), nor do I go out of my way to walk/talk a certain way. I dress nicely, but not flashy.
At 6'2", 220 lbs, relatively fit, and a shaved head, I automatically stand out as somewhat intimidating. I keep my head on a swivel and maintain awareness of my surroundings. In short, I know I'm not going to blend in as a "grey man," so I maintain the look of someone who probably knows how to handle themselves without being showy.
Seems to have worked fine.
Most of those type of guys will grow out of it and see the value in being the grey man. I'm not sure I've ever seen a rig like that owned by anyone over the age of 45.
We have the same issue with young guns in backcountry snowmobiling. They get their first high paying job and borrow the money for a jacked up diesel truck, a brand new $15,000 snowmobiles and $5000 of accessories to go with it. They run loud exhausts that draw negative attention to our sport and usually don't make it 5 miles from the parking lot. All of the sudden they turn 40 and all that shit is gone. They either drop out of the sport or become one of the old dudes like me; riding deep into the back country, stealthily with stock exhaust (so nobody poaches your secret riding area), saving all our "bro" money for more gas, and becoming ambassadors for our sport.
Some reach the crotchety old dude level sooner than others. Some never have the gene to be a show off. Me, I don't care anymore.
IMHO, among the people I ride with, loud exhaust on a snowmobile is more often an unfortunate side effect of the horsepower gains to be achieved. Often useful, especially at altitude.
People who advertise their guns tend to own them for reasons other than self-defense. I feel the same way about open carry.
I do not advertise whatsoever. No stickers on my car, no obviously tacti-cool clothing (5.11 pants, multicam combat shirts, etc.), nor do I go out of my way to walk/talk a certain way. I dress nicely, but not flashy.
At 6'2", 220 lbs, relatively fit, and a shaved head, I automatically stand out as somewhat intimidating. I keep my head on a swivel and maintain awareness of my surroundings. In short, I know I'm not going to blend in as a "grey man," so I maintain the look of someone who probably knows how to handle themselves without being showy.
Seems to have worked fine.
You're the opposite of me physically. I'm only 5'6" and maybe still 165lbs. soaking wet. Most people I work with/am around daily couldn't tell you what color or how much hair I have, usually wear a plain generic ball cap without markings on it. Went to a funeral for a coworker many moons ago, wore a suit & tie and shaved. While smoking with a buddy one of the gals I was around a lot during most days approached and asked my buddy "who's your friend?" I took it as a compliment. Out in public I tend to wear generic jeans/hoodie/t-shirts depending on time of year. At work its always chilly to me so either a grey fleece pullover or an older hoodie. The "retired" logo on my coffee mug is small enough that I've had people ask me on Veterans' Day if I knew anyone who was in the service.
I advertise nothing. I even strip the dealership name off of all my cars.
Shooting club requires a sticker for parking. I use scotch tape and then take it off when I leave.
Stickers I acquire go on a pistol lock-box I have.
I advertise nothing. I even strip the dealership name off of all my cars.
That's hard core. Yet at the same time one of those "something feels off" details that would grab my attention. Fortunately I'm often told I'm in the minority for noticing really small stuff like that.
I advertise nothing. I even strip the dealership name off of all my cars.
Shooting club requires a sticker for parking. I use scotch tape and then take it off when I leave.
Stickers I acquire go on a pistol lock-box I have.
My gun club doesn't require a sticker, other than that, pretty much the way I roll. I put all of my stickers on the garage door that divides my front garage from my back garage.
I'm retired and generally run around in a no tuck shirt and jeans, or a tee-shirt, ball caps are either college related or, something not overtly gun.
MY truck is pretty plain jane, daughters' swim team stickers only. I don't need a four-wheel drive, so I don't have FWD. Having lived in the mountains and the desert where you actually use fwd, I kind of snicker at folks running around with their jacked 4-wheelers and their shiny, unused hi-lift/handyman jack in it's neat little rack.
only off road rigs got stickers nothing else :)
even back in HS days if I had to have parking stickers I would put them on saran wrap instead of the window and throw them on the dash then back in the glove box
mall cruiser trucks do give me a laugh though :)
we had a guy in our 4x4 club that drove a stock FJC with lockers never put on large tires etc.. guy could drive though and would often go places so many here could never even get when on trails
but was told the IFS wont make that trail or you cant go up there your tires are not big enough etc..
Maui used to be funny for that since limited off road mostly mud roads and a small bit of homelands up Poli Poli way but nothing big
but every single Taco had to run a 6" lift with tires that stuck out :) hahahaaha
Diamondback
03-31-18, 16:38
Maui used to be funny for that since limited off road mostly mud roads and a small bit of homelands up Poli Poli way but nothing big
but every single Taco had to run a 6" lift with tires that stuck out :) hahahaaha
Ouch, dude... you're giving me and my hemorrhoids painful flashbacks from going over there with my mother for her 40th or 50th birthday, when Her Boneheadedness insisted on doing the full-loop Road FROM Hana--in a freaking MINIVAN. My ass hurts just remembering it...
Briefly went through a flashy stage in my 20s and quickly grew out of it. I honestly think having my bike sound metered for dual sport rides and hare scrambles started me down the road to keeping everything more low key. I hadn't had the insight to consider the value of being quiet and flying under the radar. The lecture from the older guys about keeping it cool and respecting the places that we were permitted to ride didn't hurt either.
pointblank4445
03-31-18, 17:11
The whole thing makes me wonder, how much do you advertise your views/beliefs/support of the 2A/draw attention to yourself or vehicle?
Has anyone ever altered their opinion via the stupid **** the jerk in front of you has pasted to his car? Rather, I would say the opposite is more true in that I have condemned more institutions, concepts and ideas based on peoples horrible driving and that snowballs into me hating them and everything they stand for by extension (PS: I may have road rage).
What's more is many people do not realize that their projections often say more than what they wish them to. If you ever have the opportunity to learn about some of the real predator criminals in society or talk to DOC personnel that know what's up, the savvy of truly trained observers and seasoned predators is amazing. The over-compensated projection of strength is often subterfuge for weakness or uncertainty.
We must always ask: To whom are we projecting an image, what image is it, and why?
Averageman
03-31-18, 17:49
Has anyone ever altered their opinion via the stupid **** the jerk in front of you has pasted to his car? Rather, I would say the opposite is more true in that I have condemned more institutions, concepts and ideas based on peoples horrible driving and that snowballs into me hating them and everything they stand for by extension (PS: I may have road rage).
What's more is many people do not realize that their projections often say more than what they wish them to. If you ever have the opportunity to learn about some of the real predator criminals in society or talk to DOC personnel that know what's up, the savvy of truly trained observers and seasoned predators is amazing. The over-compensated projection of strength is often subterfuge for weakness or uncertainty.
We must always ask: To whom are we projecting an image, what image is it, and why?
I heard about the Boston Bombing on the way to one of the Mega Mart hardware stores.
All the twenty minute drive I listen to body count, speculation and the horror.
I get my hardware and lumber and while I'm loading the Truck a guy pulls in with a "Coexist" bumper sticker.
I asked him just how well that seemed to be working in F'ing Boston that morning and what kind of a man would put such BS on his car.
Sometimes, being an A'hole just feels good.
militarymoron
03-31-18, 18:25
I have an American flag sticker on our family vehicle.
I have an American flag sticker on our family vehicle.Me too! I think you copied me...
I like guys like in the OP. Nice to have a canary around to attract unwanted attention from random Adam Henrys.
Dennis.
nightchief
03-31-18, 19:35
Like virtually everyone who has already posted, I too have NO "gun or 2A swag" on my car, house, worn as everyday clothing, tattooed to my body, etc. I also don't advertise in my neighborhood and try to be as discreet as possible with most folks I associate with. I always load and unload my vehicle for range trips in the garage with the door closed. I do wear 5.11 pants to the range though, they are WAY more comfortable in the Texas heat than jeans!
I'm not a small person (6'2", 240) and that makes being a "grey man" somewhat difficult. A fiend at work, retired mil, and I were once talking and he said he would consider me a threat if he was assessing a situation. I asked why on earth, as I have no mil or LE experience, just a middle aged guy, slightly over weight? He said "you're a big guy and "look" like you know how to handle yourself." Ha! "You're not much of a threat assessor" I replied. Ever since, I've tried to pay attention to whatever I might telegraph that makes me appear to somehow be a "tough guy". Hell, I drive a 4 door FOP sedan or a 20 year old Cherokee, that has failing paint!
Same guy said one thing he noticed about me though, I never have my cell phone out when I walk into a retail store. I always keep it in my pocket, so I can watch the other people. He told me that stands out in today's society. So to blend in, I suppose you have to have your nose buried in your smart phone, as you walk though the parking lot, to look like you're totally disengaged from reality!
I’ve been driving this every summer since new, but it only says Ford on it.
http://i66.tinypic.com/10mquzr.jpg
I’ve been driving this every summer since new, but it only says Ford on it.
http://i66.tinypic.com/10mquzr.jpg
Can't get any more low key than that...;)
Nothing says early-mid 90's Ford than that...
Sounds like a typical bro-douche.
I don’t advertise at all. No gun company apparel or stickers. No 2nd Amendment apparel or stickers. No USMC apparel or stickers. Etc. No tattoos either.
Same here! Especially no tats!
buckshot1220
03-31-18, 21:33
Very low key for me. No bumper stickers, signs, t-shirts or hats relating to politics or 2A. The only thing on my home is my alarm company name. If I were a sports guy, which I'm not, I probably wouldn't even put my team on anything knowing how crazy some fan rivalries can get.
I broke this rule only once. My salesman and I took a good customer of ours to a recently opened state of the art gun range. While there he wanted some t-shirts with the range name on them. I bought a handful for all of us to split up. I typically would only wear this stuff around the house, but ended up one day running multiple errands while wearing the shirt. Inside of a few hours two complete strangers at retail stores and a neighbor started a conversation with me about firearms. Never again.
I don't put stickers of any kind on my truck. I also removed anything that advertises for the dealership where I got it (factory emblems are still intact).
I do have several gun branded t-shirts but I don't wear them much any more. Until recently I was working part-time at a LGS and that gave me a legit venue for them. My big offender is that I prefer to wear cargo pants of some sort over jeans on a daily basis because I find them so much more useful and comfortable.
I used to have an NRA sticker on my car back when I was younger and didn’t see the value in flying under the radar. Now, I have no stickers on my vehicles.
Im a results-driven person. What will being flashy accomplish? Nothing. What could being un-noticed accomplish? A lot.
I like to get things done. If i am successful, people will know me by my actions, not stickers or whether my collar is popped.
My car is clean. Bumper sickers look trashy anyways, and my current and future occupations have certain standards.
My gun club doesn't require a sticker, other than that, pretty much the way I roll. I put all of my stickers on the garage door that divides my front garage from my back garage.
I'm retired and generally run around in a no tuck shirt and jeans, or a tee-shirt, ball caps are either college related or, something not overtly gun.
MY truck is pretty plain jane, daughters' swim team stickers only. I don't need a four-wheel drive, so I don't have FWD. Having lived in the mountains and the desert where you actually use fwd, I kind of snicker at folks running around with their jacked 4-wheelers and their shiny, unused hi-lift/handyman jack in it's neat little rack.
Yep, I buy purpose built vehicles to use and have fun with, not just look at. [emoji106]
Straight Shooter
03-31-18, 22:58
Sounds like a typical bro-douche.
I don’t advertise at all. No gun company apparel or stickers. No 2nd Amendment apparel or stickers. No USMC apparel or stickers. Etc. No tattoos either.
DITTO. Except for my two tats, high up on both arms. Ive known people for 30 years who dont know Ive got them. My own mother still doesnt.
Can't get any more low key than that...;)
I thought that would spice up the thread a bit.
SilverBullet432
04-01-18, 00:24
I have a few stickers, just a Tx flag and another. Not too conspicuous. Not a big fan of standing out at all. Plenty of guys around here rolling around in their raptors with every sticker under the sun on there. :sarcastic:
MountainRaven
04-01-18, 03:36
I have an American flag sticker on our family vehicle.
Me too! I think you copied me...
I like guys like in the OP. Nice to have a canary around to attract unwanted attention from random Adam Henrys.
Dennis.
I have a Betsy Ross flag decal I've had for years, never put it on a car. Since I just washed my car (snow melting and all that), I figured now would be a good time to put it on... but I don't have a clue where to put it. Looking at the most, "official," ways to apply one makes it seem like I will need a second reversed one and put them on the left and right front quarter panels, left and right front doors, or the left and right rear quarter panels. So I'm curious as to where you guys put yours.
IMHO, among the people I ride with, loud exhaust on a snowmobile is more often an unfortunate side effect of the horsepower gains to be achieved. Often useful, especially at altitude.
There isn’t a single can out there that can prove any real gains. Gaining HP has became way more difficult the more computerized sleds become.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I thought that would spice up the thread a bit.
It isn't easy to keep a truck, or any vehicle, up as nicely as you seem to have done over the long haul. Nice looking. (thumbs up emoji if I knew how to do one)
Has anyone ever altered their opinion via the stupid **** the jerk in front of you has pasted to his car? Rather, I would say the opposite is more true in that I have condemned more institutions, concepts and ideas based on peoples horrible driving and that snowballs into me hating them and everything they stand for by extension (PS: I may have road rage).
What's more is many people do not realize that their projections often say more than what they wish them to. If you ever have the opportunity to learn about some of the real predator criminals in society or talk to DOC personnel that know what's up, the savvy of truly trained observers and seasoned predators is amazing. The over-compensated projection of strength is often subterfuge for weakness or uncertainty.
We must always ask: To whom are we projecting an image, what image is it, and why?
Very well said.
I have an NRA and We The People sticker.
I would hope that like minded people would see it and know they aren't alone. Anyone else wouldn't notice.
I don't see harm is there.
Personally, I've always preferred LOOKING non-threatening. I like being under estimated (the looks on people's faces when they realize they just F'd up is amusing). I have often wondered are people like that guy just "posers" or can they back up their advertising? My default is to go with they can back up their claims as I'd rather over estimate than under. Given the slightly arrogant look of dismissal the guy gave me I don't think he realized I have a CCW permit or understand practicality of Jeep mods vs actual use.
Sorry, this just reeks of "but I'm the REAL badass here."
Sorry, this just reeks of "but I'm the REAL badass here."
No need to apologize. I could/should have worded that better as admittedly I do occasionally let stuff like that get to me (a sign I have my own self-view issues to continue to work on). Way back when in Basic Training we had a DI who would always tell us "Privates, its OK to be cocky sometimes as long as you can back it up". While I've put a lot of work into being low key/flying under the radar, sometimes it causes being over looked to get the best of me.
I honestly thank you for pointing that out :-)
.
The whole thing makes me wonder, how much do you advertise your views/beliefs/support of the 2A/draw attention to yourself or vehicle?
Zero. No real reason though. I just don't. Never had. I don't own any firearms related swag, I don't put any stickers on my car. My car is a 8 year old silver Toyota Corolla with one hub cap missing. I don't even talk about guns much outside of a few gun forums. I have two friends who are into guns and most of the time I don't even talk to them about guns or show them anything new I've bought. I'm not trying to hide anything it's just the way I've always been
My first car, when I was in highschool, had a MARINES bumper sticker. The one with just the sword. I tried taking it off but it started to pull the paint off as well so I just left it on there.
I never understood the point of spending money to add useless bling to my cars. Rims, spoilers, whatever. If it wasn't necessary I didn't spend money on it. Since I didn't off road or race my cars were always avg. In fact 99% of my cars were avg Japanese sedans. I did own one sports car and one truck. Both lasted about a year.
I guess I've always been boring!
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militarymoron
04-01-18, 12:22
I have a Betsy Ross flag decal I've had for years, never put it on a car. Since I just washed my car (snow melting and all that), I figured now would be a good time to put it on... but I don't have a clue where to put it. Looking at the most, "official," ways to apply one makes it seem like I will need a second reversed one and put them on the left and right front quarter panels, left and right front doors, or the left and right rear quarter panels. So I'm curious as to where you guys put yours.
Being 'low key' is also helped by the fact that we have a non-threatening family vehicle that's favoured by liberals ;)
This is actually a flag magnet; not a sticker.
https://i.imgur.com/DbnVQ68.jpg
I get by with a gun sticker on my jeep because the ZOMBIE stuff drowns it out.
There isn’t a single can out there that can prove any real gains. Gaining HP has became way more difficult the more computerized sleds become.
Completely disagree.
Dist. Expert 26
04-01-18, 14:37
There isn’t a single can out there that can prove any real gains. Gaining HP has became way more difficult the more computerized sleds become.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
If sleds are anything like bikes you're categorically wrong. EFI doesn't fix a choked exhaust.
MountainRaven
04-01-18, 15:38
Being 'low key' is also helped by the fact that we have a non-threatening family vehicle that's favoured by liberals ;)
This is actually a flag magnet; not a sticker.
https://i.imgur.com/DbnVQ68.jpg
Mine is a 12 year old effete mid-sized luxury SUV (on the outside - in the inside, it's a Land Cruiser with some bits from a 4Runner). :)
The only time I wear anything that says anything about me is on my suits I wear my Israeli Border Police sniper pin. If you see me in my suit, then you are a client or potential clients. Which means you know we are a Mossad cyber firm and a firm that offers Tier 1 people from either the USA or Israel.
My car have no stickers on them.
If sleds are anything like bikes you're categorically wrong. EFI doesn't fix a choked exhaust.
Yes. Internal combustion engines are basically air pumps. They have to breathe. EFI will only control the A/F ratios at any given RPM, not total volume of air. EFI makes better (noisier) exhaust systems even more effective. They don't replace them.
hotrodder636
04-01-18, 18:05
I prefer the low-key, greyman style. I don’t like the idea of making myself a target. Much like the OP I prefer to be in the non-threat or underestimated category.
pointblank4445
04-01-18, 19:01
Question:
What does it mean to be in the "underestimated" category?
I see this as appearance of being "soft" or "non-threatening" and hoping to employ unperceived ability if engaged. Am I correct in that assessment? If so, is this for the benefit of not scarring Mr and Mrs Timid Citizen or for the hopes of having a would-be attacker bite off more than they can chew?
The_War_Wagon
04-01-18, 19:49
I am the grey rider... :cool:
Only thing on my offroad toy, is stickers of all the parts company's I had to buy products from, to get a sticker. :jester:
one of my buddies that is retired but still teaches intelligence pretty much wears what he gets discounts it seems on so keen shoes Oakley glasses and forgot the pants and shirts :) so he kinda looks like he is was something except for the Hawaiian shirts :) and guess even those have some kinda meaning ?
I find a shirt I like buy a bunch same with shorts so it looks like I wear the same 3 things for a few years :)
No stickers here either.
Prefer to fly under the radar. Easy at my age.
Tattoos under wraps, guns concealed. Just an average, non threatening old dufus by all appearances.
Never have had any confrontations.
I have a theory that most pack animals, jackals, have a 6th sense that advises who are easy pry and who may be a problem.
pointblank4445
04-01-18, 20:50
I have a theory that most pack animals, jackals, have a 6th sense that advises who are easy pry and who may be a problem.
Nah...some are just observant. Every police cadet has heard the same "polish your shoes, press your uni cause if you look squared away...others will assume you are" speech, but there is some degree of truth. I had a frequent-flyer that looked like he was going to fight or run from me and my overweight Sgt. when I was a rookie. I got to see him again later and ask what the deal was.
He said: "I noticed Sarge's grips."
I asked what about them? He replied "Sarge is a shooter, I know that." Not that it mattered as shooting this dude was not in the cards, but it meant something to him.
This dude saw past the gray hair and extra 85lbs of flab to the worn Talo grips on my Sgt's duty gun. He took the grips to mean he was a gun guy and the wear meant he was practiced. He was not wrong. Despite his weight, bad joints and retired-on-duty mentality his last 5 years, this Sgt is one of the sharpest guys I know and one of the fastest draw-and-fire shots I've ever seen. That always stuck with me and I keep seeing this stuff pop up enough that I believe it to be true.
I'm so grey that I'm not even going to brag about how grey I am, nor about what an incognito badass I am, nor how the jackals instinctively give me a wide birth.
.
MountainRaven
04-01-18, 21:45
Question:
What does it mean to be in the "underestimated" category?
I see this as appearance of being "soft" or "non-threatening" and hoping to employ unperceived ability if engaged. Am I correct in that assessment? If so, is this for the benefit of not scarring Mr and Mrs Timid Citizen or for the hopes of having a would-be attacker bite off more than they can chew?
Varg Freeborn (who grew up surrounded by violent criminals and spent some time in prison on an attempted murder charge) would tell you that trying to look, "hard," or, "threatening," doesn't scare the bad guys away. It gives them a target that they'll know they need to come at hard and fast, that they might come after just because you're the biggest, baddest bastard in the room. That for the, "jackals," (or goblins or thugs or whatever you want to call them) looking tough is little different than carrying openly.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YYc_t24FUcE
So, what? Are you guys saying I should take of my plate carrier when mowing my lawn? Is it still okay to lean a rifle against the tree, though?
5.56 Bonded SP
04-01-18, 22:49
I have a trijicon sticker on my truck, just the small one that comes with a scope. I figure only gun nuts will even know what it is, honestly I doubt 99% of people even notice it.
I don't cover my truck or house with shit like that, because I don't want my stuff getting broken into when I'm gone. I off road my truck(a 2008 Tacoma) a few times a month on some pretty damn gnarly ATV trails for various reasons. I don't have a crazy lift or intense tires, and rarely do I even need to use 4 wheel drive. My truck has lots of scratches, and lookswise it looks somewhere between brand new and junker haha.
I always laugh at huge trucks without a single scratch on them with 2 foot lifts and giant tires that you know never see any actual off road use. I mean hey it's their money to spend how they want, just seems like a waste of money to me. I've only got stuck once, and in that situation neither a lift or giant tires would have helped me. Most of that expensive lift kits, and all that are just status symbols.
The funniest is guys who lift their Ford Raptors, because the stock suspension on those trucks is racing suspension, then all the bros literally downgrade their ridiculously expensive truck by ****ing around with lift kits on them :rolleyes:
Now I have nothing against the guys who actually upgrade their off road vehicles because they are into rock crawling or whatever, those aren't the guys I'm shit talking. But like I said not my money, so I don't care. It's just funny because I could probably take my stock little manual transmission Tacoma on way gnarlier trails than probably 90% of the bro'dosers you see on the street.
Socially I'm very vocally pro gun, but I don't advertise it on my property.
If some guy wants to advertise his gun ownership on his truck it doesn't affect me, so I don't care. I just don't do it because I don't want my truck broken into, and I don't want to go out seeking conflict with some liberal who is road raging.
Everyone that actually knows me knows that I'm pro gun, because I try to make intelligent remarkable about the subject here and there. Most people, even liberals whom are my friends or aqquintences will ask me for advice when buying a firearm, to which I usually try to be helpful and informative.
5.56 Bonded SP
04-01-18, 22:50
So, what? Are you guys saying I should take of my plate carrier when mowing my lawn? Is it still okay to lean a rifle against the tree, though?
This is signature worthy.
Lmfao
SeriousStudent
04-01-18, 23:35
So, what? Are you guys saying I should take of my plate carrier when mowing my lawn? Is it still okay to lean a rifle against the tree, though?
Mother of God, don't you own a sling?? That will get you killed on the streetz!
Or the lawn, or maybe the sidewalk, I dunno....
Using a weed-eater with one hand while maintaining a firing grip on an AR is difficult, but the price of vigilance is high, after all.
Mother of God, don't you own a sling??
I'm saving up for one for my yard AR. I had to buy the garden wagon for the fat 50's that hold my mags. It was taking me an hour to get my ammo in place.
I just have a sticker from my son’s private school on my car. Everyone probably thinks I’m just broke...:(
I have a trijicon sticker on my truck, just the small one that comes with a scope. I figure only gun nuts will even know what it is, honestly I doubt 99% of people even notice it.
I don't cover my truck or house with shit like that, because I don't want my stuff getting broken into when I'm gone. I off road my truck(a 2008 Tacoma) a few times a month on some pretty damn gnarly ATV trails for various reasons. I don't have a crazy lift or intense tires, and rarely do I even need to use 4 wheel drive. My truck has lots of scratches, and lookswise it looks somewhere between brand new and junker haha.
I always laugh at huge trucks without a single scratch on them with 2 foot lifts and giant tires that you know never see any actual off road use. I mean hey it's their money to spend how they want, just seems like a waste of money to me. I've only got stuck once, and in that situation neither a lift or giant tires would have helped me. Most of that expensive lift kits, and all that are just status symbols.
The funniest is guys who lift their Ford Raptors, because the stock suspension on those trucks is racing suspension, then all the bros literally downgrade their ridiculously expensive truck by ****ing around with lift kits on them :rolleyes:
Now I have nothing against the guys who actually upgrade their off road vehicles because they are into rock crawling or whatever, those aren't the guys I'm shit talking. But like I said not my money, so I don't care. It's just funny because I could probably take my stock little manual transmission Tacoma on way gnarlier trails than probably 90% of the bro'dosers you see on the street.
Socially I'm very vocally pro gun, but I don't advertise it on my property.
If some guy wants to advertise his gun ownership on his truck it doesn't affect me, so I don't care. I just don't do it because I don't want my truck broken into, and I don't want to go out seeking conflict with some liberal who is road raging.
Everyone that actually knows me knows that I'm pro gun, because I try to make intelligent remarkable about the subject here and there. Most people, even liberals whom are my friends or aqquintences will ask me for advice when buying a firearm, to which I usually try to be helpful and informative.Lmao, bro'doser! I'm stealing that!!!!
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In Communist New Jersey an NRA sticker has been ruled probable cause to search a vehicle for firearms. So yeah, no stickers on my car what so ever.
I'm saving up for one for my yard AR. I had to buy the garden wagon for the fat 50's that hold my mags. It was taking me an hour to get my ammo in place.
Have you considered putting the ATV gun racks on your mower handle? Kinda like on a 3 gun cart.
jethroUSMC
04-02-18, 07:41
I find a shirt I like buy a bunch same with shorts so it looks like I wear the same 3 things for a few years :)
HAHA...This is me as well. Same shirts shorts, jeans/workpants and some casual footwear (tennis shoes/sneaker type).
No stickers on my vehicles, same as another poster I remove stealership names immediately, only leave factory badging. No firearms or political anything on my vehicles, only on my reloading bench in the shop/garage. Ball caps are either college, some farm equipment usually nasty dirty from manual labor of some sort, or without logos.
I only wear shooting related anything(ball caps), to a training class or around the house when company isn't coming over and i don't have much of it.
I always carry concealed, although I do appreciate the open carry laws in my state in the rare event of an "oops moment". The only times I open carry are on my land and in the house - again when no guests are visiting.
I only speak with family and a few folks at work about firearms - at work because we train together at least a few times a year and we know we're isolated from others if and when that discussion occurs.
Only tat is hidden from normal sight. My family never saw it until I was about 40 and had it since I was 19 and it's fairly small.
The only thing I've done 2 years ago that has made me stand out is what I like to refer to as my genetics experiment. I let my beard/facial hair grow for a year with only trimming was the upper cheek line, blended sideburn area to match my haircut and keep mustache off my lip so I didn't eat it - it was massive....LOL. Kind of miss it.
William B.
04-02-18, 09:28
Dude was probably a cook or postal clerk.
I'm going to go a step further and say he was probably an "I would've joined, but..." and/or an "I would punch a DI in the face if he..."
vicious_cb
04-02-18, 14:34
Being 'low key' is also helped by the fact that we have a non-threatening family vehicle that's favoured by liberals ;)
This is actually a flag magnet; not a sticker.
https://i.imgur.com/DbnVQ68.jpg
Careful man, apparently being patriotic these days means you are oppressing all the racial minorities out there. I wouldnt even run a flag if I was trying to fly under the radar.
http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-supreme-court-american-flag-20150330-story.html
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/grade-point/wp/2016/11/21/massachusetts-college-stops-flying-american-flag-after-it-becomes-focus-of-dispute-over-trump/?utm_term=.7992011c6163
militarymoron
04-02-18, 14:46
Careful man, apparently being patriotic these days means you are oppressing all the racial minorities out there. I wouldnt even run a flag if I was trying to fly under the radar.
http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-supreme-court-american-flag-20150330-story.html
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/grade-point/wp/2016/11/21/massachusetts-college-stops-flying-american-flag-after-it-becomes-focus-of-dispute-over-trump/?utm_term=.7992011c6163
Well, ya gotta draw the line somewhere. That's very sad, indeed.
Right after 9/11, it was hard to find a car not flying the flag. As the flags wore out, and the years passed, they slowly disappeared. We just continued to fly one.
My far back windows or heavily tinted (came that way). If you look really hard you will see a blacked out American flag sticker.
Hell man, I got a ton of .308's linked up strung up on my front push bar, every gun sticker and decal possible, don't forget Molon Lane, 3%, spartan helmet, go back to California sticker, etc.
Gun rack with an SR25, a mac10 and a 93R in the rear window.
I got me some 9mm cases as the caps for my tire air bib too!
Got an American flag and a confederate flag strung up on each side of the back of my truck too.
When I hop out the v'icle I'm sportin twin desert eagles in underarm side holsters with leather chaps, leather jacket, leather hat, leather boots that are all American flag print and I'm sporting a rockin fu manchu.
'Merica bitches!
Oh that would make a awesome poster :)
Hell man, I got a ton of .308's linked up strung up on my front push bar, every gun sticker and decal possible, don't forget Molon Lane, 3%, spartan helmet, go back to California sticker, etc.
Gun rack with an SR25, a mac10 and a 93R in the rear window.
I got me some 9mm cases as the caps for my tire air bib too!
Got an American flag and a confederate flag strung up on each side of the back of my truck too.
When I hop out the v'icle I'm sportin twin desert eagles in underarm side holsters with leather chaps, leather jacket, leather hat, leather boots that are all American flag print and I'm sporting a rockin fu manchu.
'Merica bitches!
Doc Safari
04-02-18, 17:42
-No stickers on the vehicle or posters in the house.
-Don't talk about firearms with anyone I haven't known for years and likes them too
-Don't wear tactical caps, gun-related apparel of any kind
-I believe I was once followed most of the way home from a gun show, so I even check to see who's in my rearview if I'm heading straight home from a gun shop or gun show (For the incident I'm referring to, I stopped at the Post Office and the driver went on. I made sure he wasn't around when I continued on my journey).
-I know it sounds paranoid, but with NSA listening in on everything, my girlfriend and I worked out a "code" to discuss firearms over the phone without using those pesky "key words" you hear about (and we are not criminals, just pissed-off freedom-loving citizens).
Navy license plate holder, HK sticker and SIG Academy sticker on the back window of my truck. I usually wear an "HK" hat. I don't occupy handicapped spaces as I prefer to park away from others and enjoy the walk.
I dress normally, but if heading to the range will wear camo of some kind.
I don't worry either way about it....There is an argument to be made that being low profile allows the leftists room to operate. I think the silent majority needs to start not being so silent.
I recently bought a "Waterboarding Instructor" T-Shirt, with a huge Red Cross on the back, just to piss off any leftists I may encounter and could care less what they, or anyone else think.
I personally don't sweat it myself...I have a NRA Life Member decal right above the TX registration sticker on the front windshield of both my Camaro & Company Truck. Other than the NRA badge the Camaro stays clean, but on the truck I have a small decal for the TX Sheriff association, along with a small TCU sticker because my son attends. I'll add the TX State Trooper association decal when / if they send one with the recent renewal.
Now my ice chest is another story...it's plastered with all the various marketing stickers from the common vendors we all deal with. Gotta do something with them. Which brings up a question: If m4carbine has a small decal available, would be glad to make a donation & find a spot for her somewhere.:cool:
Fixed it for you:
HOWDY, I got a ton of .308's linked up strung up on my front push bar, every gun sticker and decal possible, don't forget Molon Lane, 3%, spartan helmet, go back to California sticker, etc.
Gun rack with an SR25, a mac10 and a 93R in the rear window.
I got me some 9mm cases as the caps for my tire air bib too!
Got an American flag and a confederate flag strung up on each side of the back of my truck too.
When I hop out the v'icle I'm sportin twin desert eagles in underarm side holsters with leather chaps, leather jacket, leather hat, leather boots that are all American flag print and I'm sporting a rockin fu manchu.
'Merica bitches!
The whole thing makes me wonder, how much do you advertise your views/beliefs/support of the 2A/draw attention to yourself or vehicle?
Zero, the answer is zero. I have never viewed my vehicle as my personal mobile bill bored for my own beliefs, interests, or political views etc. that I have to share with others stuck behind me. The only thing I do have is a pro greyhound adoption sticker currently and that's cuz GF stuck it on there.
Hell man, I got a ton of .308's linked up strung up on my front push bar, every gun sticker and decal possible, don't forget Molon Lane, 3%, spartan helmet, go back to California sticker, etc.
Gun rack with an SR25, a mac10 and a 93R in the rear window.
I got me some 9mm cases as the caps for my tire air bib too!
Got an American flag and a confederate flag strung up on each side of the back of my truck too.
When I hop out the v'icle I'm sportin twin desert eagles in underarm side holsters with leather chaps, leather jacket, leather hat, leather boots that are all American flag print and I'm sporting a rockin fu manchu.
'Merica bitches!
I'd give $10 to see that!
Nothing crazy. I do have an EGA on my trucks back window. As far as clothing goes, I'm pretty boring. Just a jeans, t shirt, and ball cap kind of guy. I do happen to have a few BCM ball caps that have been sent with rifles, parts, etc... I'll wear them every so often, but my guess is that anyone that's not familiar with firearms isn't going to have any idea what BCM is.
If m4carbine has a small decal available, would be glad to make a donation & find a spot for her somewhere.:cool:
If it was a velcro backed patch I'd but a few in a heartbeat. Stick one on my range bag to help get word out about the site, one on the wall in the shop with similar patches/decals, and one in the drawer as a spare.
Averageman
04-02-18, 21:35
If you want to remain "Low Key" you might want to make it more of a lifestyle than a choice of "sticker or no sticker" on your vehicle.
If you are a sum of your parts and you want to live low key and not draw unwanted attention to yourself, there are a lot of things you might want to look at.
OPSEC is more than a commercial on AFN.
You can live grey and still live a rich and fulfilling life by keeping your personal business your own by not advertising things that might target you for unwanted attention.
Put some thought in to who knows or has access to things that might cause you harm, economic loss or extream embarrassment.
Change those things, eliminate strap hangers and keep you business and the types and quantities of possessions you own to yourself.
We're always on the verge of some calamity or another and have been since the turn of the Century.
Keep your circles small and trustworthy.
Interesting thread. Locally I see a lot of guys with stickers on their trucks with pro 2a connotations. Definitely not my thing. I bought my truck used and it had an NRA sticker and a US flag. I removed the NRA sticker. I don't open carry or advertise my beliefs in any way. No 5.11 wearing, not even to the range. At 6ft, 165 I'm not imposing physically and about the only thing that makes me stick out is my accent. I like to keep it that way.
Being the grey man is a good way to be, I don't put any gun related stickers on my ride and I don't wear much in the way of any gun logos. My black rifle coffee stuff is the most I show. My coolers have some stickers and logos on them but not all are gun related and they are not kept visible while camping, hunting or fishing. Most of my gun logos or other LE stuff is kept away in my work room, other than my beer fridge which is covered with stickers.
With the family especially I don't want to draw any extra attention unless its needed, and the boys are learning this as well.
I'm curious, how many take body language into consideration?
Took a short course many, many moons ago and found it quite interesting. Before that I'd never given any thought to how we tend to subconsciously interpret different posture, stances, walks, positioning in rooms when interacting with others, even talking with our hands (for those of us who may tend to do that). Found it to be useful, especially back in the day when having to try to de-escalate situations while waiting on LE to arrive.
Honest question.
Despite the obvious advantages of being the grey man, don't you think there are also disadvantages?
Pro 2A types that are responsible and regular people tend to hide. So all that is seen is the types I detailed in my post earlier in this thread.
An obvious dilemma. Hide so you don't have too much risk, but you're also hiding the true nature of most pro 2A people and helping to perpetuate the false image of gun owners by the general public which in turn fuels the "ban it" crowd.
I truly believe that if we are ever to regain our Rights fully in the 2 A camp, we must come out of hiding and show ourselves. Be vocal and conduct marches of our own.
Otherwise we will continue to fight this battle vicariously through the NRA et al, and be hidden figures who slowly give up our rights piece by piece, bit by bit.
Think about it. Most of you all won't even show you support the NRA with a basic sticker! But our enemies are willing to put it all out there to win. Which side will succeed?
Thoughts?
I'm curious, how many take body language into consideration?
Took a short course many, many moons ago and found it quite interesting. Before that I'd never given any thought to how we tend to subconsciously interpret different posture, stances, walks, positioning in rooms when interacting with others, even talking with our hands (for those of us who may tend to do that). Found it to be useful, especially back in the day when having to try to de-escalate situations while waiting on LE to arrive.
I have a friend I used to work with as a police officer. He made some bad decisions and ended up in federal prison. The first day he was there another inmate, and former cop, took him aside and told him it was in his best interest to stop standing like a cop. He did e realize he was doing it.
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I'm curious, how many take body language into consideration?
Took a short course many, many moons ago and found it quite interesting. Before that I'd never given any thought to how we tend to subconsciously interpret different posture, stances, walks, positioning in rooms when interacting with others, even talking with our hands (for those of us who may tend to do that). Found it to be useful, especially back in the day when having to try to de-escalate situations while waiting on LE to arrive.
to me that is the majority of it some dress to and language if they talk and besides accents what words they use etc.. :)
reckon the car is more in travel mode etc..
clothes is the non verbal walking side but here body language comes in to play when ever I am out of the car
and of course if it comes to talking standing confronting whatever total new set of what I am looking for
not sure if they covered mirroring people in the course but its insane powerful once you learn it ?
Honest question.
Despite the obvious advantages of being the grey man, don't you think there are also disadvantages?
Pro 2A types that are responsible and regular people tend to hide. So all that is seen is the types I detailed in my post earlier in this thread.
An obvious dilemma. Hide so you don't have too much risk, but you're also hiding the true nature of most pro 2A people and helping to perpetuate the false image of gun owners by the general public which in turn fuels the "ban it" crowd.
I truly believe that if we are ever to regain our Rights fully in the 2 A camp, we must come out of hiding and show ourselves. Be vocal and conduct marches of our own.
Otherwise we will continue to fight this battle vicariously through the NRA et al, and be hidden figures who slowly give up our rights piece by piece, bit by bit.
Think about it. Most of you all won't even show you support the NRA with a basic sticker! But our enemies are willing to put it all out there to win. Which side will succeed?
Thoughts?
I think mostly the idea of blending in and not standing out is for personal and family security. Kind of a don't be the first target thing.
That somewhat differs from a group activity such as a rally when you are part of a crowd. Although it is safe to assume that some anti-2A groups may be gathering intelligence on people attending, there is less danger than strolling into a convenience store being robbed wearing obviously gun-related clothing.
I think we need to engage folks after we have some inkling they are receptive to dialog. I had a friend who testified about his faith to just about every person he met. If we were keeping score he probably drove more people away from Christ in this moments, than he drew closer to Christ.
People like Hogg are fallow ground, our efforts may be best spent discerning whether a person is open to conversation and learning before jumping in.
I see that differently than wearing my pro-2A identifiers at a rally. So I'm not arguing that your point - we must come out of hiding and show ourselves. Be vocal and conduct marches of our own - is wrong.
Just saying target the message to the time, place, and audience.
I do not advertise whatsoever. No stickers on my car, no obviously tacti-cool clothing (5.11 pants, multicam combat shirts, etc.), nor do I go out of my way to walk/talk a certain way. I dress nicely, but not flashy.
At 6'2", 220 lbs, relatively fit, and a shaved head, I automatically stand out as somewhat intimidating. I keep my head on a swivel and maintain awareness of my surroundings. In short, I know I'm not going to blend in as a "grey man," so I maintain the look of someone who probably knows how to handle themselves without being showy.
Seems to have worked fine.
This is me to a tee......except for the 220lb part.......maybe 20 yrs ago. :jester: NO advertising whatsoever. I cringe whenever I see a jacked up truck with the AR bolt face sticker or a BCM sticker on the rear window.
I have a 9 line sticker in the back window with the helicopter, and a viking tactics with the American flag at the back of the driver's window. The fact that it's on a white with blue stripe 2017 Shelby GT350 pretty much ensures I'm not going to be under the radar so I'm not too worried about the stickers.
As for clothing, I constantly wear stuff I buy from nine line, a couple different NRA "Stand and Fight" t-shirts and anything else that preaches a conservative message that I find cool. I wear it through the streets of New York, mostly because I really enjoy when somebody sneers or snickers while I'm waiting in a line and will actually engage in conversation. Most in New York can't argue anything past a couple of CNN taglines. I know it's a little twisted but I really enjoy it.
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