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Averageman
04-17-18, 14:02
https://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/local/Airplane-Makes-Emergency-Landing-at-Philadelphia-International-Airport-480008613.html

A Southwest Airlines flight landed safely in Philadelphia Tuesday after the jet violently depressurized when a piece of an engine flew into and broke a window, according to passenger accounts and the pilot's conversations with air traffic control.
One passenger's father-in-law, relaying information from his daughter, said the impact was so severe that a female passenger was partially sucked out of the plane when the window imploded.
Todd Baur told NBC10 the woman was partially "drawn out" of the plane before being "pulled back in by other passengers."
The jet's left engine blew shortly after takeoff, passengers said. Pieces of shrapnel flew into the plane's fuselage and at least one window, the passengers and the FAA said.
"There is a hole in the side of the aircraft, also," an aircraft controller relayed to firefighters at the airport.

Like something out of a disaster movie, but real...WTF?

FromMyColdDeadHand
04-17-18, 14:11
Seatbelts.....

I saw a report that there was blood everywhere- hope the lady is OK. That must have been the wildest ride since that Hawaii plane lost it's roof.

This is why I always try to sit in front of the engines- though she was a fair ways back from the engine

223to45
04-17-18, 14:30
They are reporting one person dead, now.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

FromMyColdDeadHand
04-17-18, 15:51
That's horrible. Still the safest way to travel, but the absolute lack of control makes it more frightening.

My dad worked with a guy who was on two commercial flights that crashed with fatalities- and walked away from both. Crazy.

26 Inf
04-17-18, 16:16
My dad worked with a guy who was on two commercial flights that crashed with fatalities- and walked away from both. Crazy.

I hope ol' Typhoid Marvin quite flying after the sending one for the sake of the other passengers.

WillBrink
04-17-18, 17:44
Seatbelts.....

I saw a report that there was blood everywhere- hope the lady is OK. That must have been the wildest ride since that Hawaii plane lost it's roof.

This is why I always try to sit in front of the engines- though she was a fair ways back from the engine

I always wear mine, car or plane. Hell, we hit a big air pocket on my way back from Panama last time and one chick went flying up and out of her seat landing half into the walkway of the plane. No one was seriously hurt, but she was all freaked out as you'd expect.

FromMyColdDeadHand
04-17-18, 17:54
I have dreams of catching a hot stewardess and saving her, and she is very greatful.

Hmac
04-17-18, 17:55
I heard on Fox that this turbine blade failure/exploding engine business has happened before to Southwest, a few years ago. Holes in the plane, but no depressurization and no injuries.

Ryno12
04-17-18, 17:55
This was the second major engine failure that Southwest had in less than two years.

SeriousStudent
04-17-18, 19:26
I am really sorry to hear about this, and my thoughts are with the family that lost a loved one.

I have a lot of friends that work at Southwest. This is the first time they have ever had a fatality. Believe me, they are definitely taking this very seriously.

gunrunner505
04-17-18, 19:57
One photo I saw shows about half the fan section and it looks intact but the entire inlet cowl is missing. I haven't seen any pictures of the rest of the engine or damage further back like a turbine section taking the day off. That had to be a very scary few minutes.

flenna
04-17-18, 19:57
Geeezzzz.... This is like something out of a horror movie. I couldn't imagine what that was like for those people.

Pappabear
04-17-18, 20:33
I am really sorry to hear about this, and my thoughts are with the family that lost a loved one.

I have a lot of friends that work at Southwest. This is the first time they have ever had a fatality. Believe me, they are definitely taking this very seriously.

I do as well, my next door neihbor is a SW mechanic, and he is pretty buttoned up. I hope this is the last of such shit storms.

PB

elephant
04-17-18, 21:52
from the photos I have seen, it doesn't look like the fan or the gearbox malfunctioned because it looked to be intact.

It appears the fan shroud blew apart. The shroud does a few things:(1) The duct is convergent hence the velocity of air also increases producing larger thrust.(2) The bypass airflow cools the main engine unlike a propeller aeroplane. (3) The air flow is also directed and merged with the flow through the main engine hence reducing the EGT/TGT considerably. (4) The shroud also reduces the chopping sound of the propeller and makes the engine quieter. (5) The lining of the shroud is perforated and takes exhaust heat to de-ice, or to prevent ice build up on the front housing.

Regardless, the air pressure inside of the shroud housing is usually pretty high, but not high enough to blow the shroud made of composites, aluminum and titanium completely apart. Unless there was water trapped in the housing and somehow the heat turned the water into steam and turned the fan housing into a pressure cooker bomb.

Averageman
04-17-18, 22:00
FOD sucked in during take off?

OH58D
04-17-18, 22:15
The SW pilot is Tammi Jo Shults, one of the first Navy Fighter Pilots. From Heavy.com:

Tammie Jo Shults, Southwest Pilot: 5 Fast Facts You Need to Know

https://heavy.com/news/2018/04/tammie-jo-shults-pilot-southwest-flight-1380-engine-hero/

AKDoug
04-17-18, 22:20
I don't think wearing or not wearing a seatbelt played into this. Your upper torso could easily be sucked out that window even if you are belted in tight.

Averageman
04-18-18, 19:58
You know I've never had a good feeling about the trend where people bring "comfort pets" with them on planes.
I can only imagine how a medium sized dog would react and how people would react to the chaos caused by that combination of events.

Pilot1
04-18-18, 20:46
from the photos I have seen, it doesn't look like the fan or the gearbox malfunctioned because it looked to be intact.

It appears the fan shroud blew apart. The shroud does a few things:(1) The duct is convergent hence the velocity of air also increases producing larger thrust.(2) The bypass airflow cools the main engine unlike a propeller aeroplane. (3) The air flow is also directed and merged with the flow through the main engine hence reducing the EGT/TGT considerably. (4) The shroud also reduces the chopping sound of the propeller and makes the engine quieter. (5) The lining of the shroud is perforated and takes exhaust heat to de-ice, or to prevent ice build up on the front housing.

Regardless, the air pressure inside of the shroud housing is usually pretty high, but not high enough to blow the shroud made of composites, aluminum and titanium completely apart. Unless there was water trapped in the housing and somehow the heat turned the water into steam and turned the fan housing into a pressure cooker bomb.

Fatigue of some of the components of the fan shroud? It failed to contain the parts, and fan blades that seem to have exploded for some reason. Maybe a missing blade, or blades, and out of balance? It could have ingested something. Curious to see the NTSB report.

FromMyColdDeadHand
04-18-18, 20:52
You know I've never had a good feeling about the trend where people bring "comfort pets" with them on planes.
I can only imagine how a medium sized dog would react and how people would react to the chaos caused by that combination of events.

And some idiot stealing your oxygen mask for their cat....

SeriousStudent
04-18-18, 22:31
And some idiot stealing your oxygen mask for their self-propelled cracked-window plugger....

Gosh, I wonder if Fluffy would plug that hole in the window? The sizes almost match.

Honu
04-19-18, 01:20
And some idiot stealing your oxygen mask for their cat....

pretend I am oxygen deprived and start flailing about REALLY HARD :)

Moose-Knuckle
04-19-18, 04:50
Yeah that's a horrible way to die, saw all those movies/TV shows as a kid when bad guy would shoot out a window on a plane, depressurize the cabin, and someone would get sucked out.

That and quicksand, as a child I thought quicksand was going to be much more of problem that it really is.

Thanks Hollywood.

Hmac
04-19-18, 06:20
Made an impression on me when I was 13.


http://youtube.com/watch?v=pHXevnoAciY

Arik
04-19-18, 08:57
Reason 94579372641 why I don't fly

Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk

Moose-Knuckle
04-19-18, 13:22
Made an impression on me when I was 13.


http://youtube.com/watch?v=pHXevnoAciY

Exactly!

If Gert Fröbe's fat butt can be sucked through those tiny windows then I'm toast!

FromMyColdDeadHand
04-19-18, 13:55
Yeah that's a horrible way to die, saw all those movies/TV shows as a kid when bad guy would shoot out a window on a plane, depressurize the cabin, and someone would get sucked out.

That and quicksand, as a child I thought quicksand was going to be much more of problem that it really is.

Thanks Hollywood.

Apes, earthquakes, nuclear war and aligators still haven't panned out.

Why exactly can we hold our breath for a minute, but we loose consciousness so fast at low pressures? Are you breathing your O2 away and can't not breathe or you'll reverse bends?

Being 'extruded' out a window doesn't have any positive aspects.

flenna
04-19-18, 17:28
Exactly!

If Gert Fröbe's fat butt can be sucked through those tiny windows then I'm toast!

I remember as a kid bs'ing with the other kids that you cannot shoot a gun inside a plane. You know, because the pressure is so great it will suck everyone out through the bullet hole.

Honu
04-19-18, 18:03
Apes, earthquakes, nuclear war and aligators still haven't panned out.

Why exactly can we hold our breath for a minute, but we loose consciousness so fast at low pressures? Are you breathing your O2 away and can't not breathe or you'll reverse bends?

Being 'extruded' out a window doesn't have any positive aspects.

partial pressures is why :) You can hold your breathe if that breathe was at pressure

its the exact same thing that happens with shallow water blackout or cerebral hypoxia all due to partial pressures

rjacobs
04-19-18, 20:44
from the photos I have seen, it doesn't look like the fan or the gearbox malfunctioned because it looked to be intact.

It appears the fan shroud blew apart. The shroud does a few things:(1) The duct is convergent hence the velocity of air also increases producing larger thrust.(2) The bypass airflow cools the main engine unlike a propeller aeroplane. (3) The air flow is also directed and merged with the flow through the main engine hence reducing the EGT/TGT considerably. (4) The shroud also reduces the chopping sound of the propeller and makes the engine quieter. (5) The lining of the shroud is perforated and takes exhaust heat to de-ice, or to prevent ice build up on the front housing.

Regardless, the air pressure inside of the shroud housing is usually pretty high, but not high enough to blow the shroud made of composites, aluminum and titanium completely apart. Unless there was water trapped in the housing and somehow the heat turned the water into steam and turned the fan housing into a pressure cooker bomb.

Let me correct basically all the points you attempted to sound educated on. You must be a CNN commentator aviation expert.

The engine lost a fan blade...

CFM 56 has no gear box.

The duct has no affect on increasing thrust by changing its pressure. It really is not a convergent duct.

You are semi correct on #2, but its a secondary effect. Bypass air is most of the thrust at low altitudes. It also masks the exhaust noise from the turbine section.

#3.... no its not. The air flow from the fan section NEVER enters the core sections except at the very front(inlet guide vanes). Its a 5:1 bypass or there abouts. 5 parts go around, 1 part goes in, but once past the inlet guide vanes the core is sealed.

4... Sort of because the tips are typically super sonic.

5. Not perforated for de-ice. Air is driven through the perforations for noise reduction. The lip is heated via bleed air from the compressor, not exhaust from the turbine.

And the air pressure inside the inlet of the engine is actually low pressure, not high pressure. A turbine engine can produce ice due to temperature drop at the inlet(due to the pressure drop) at up to 10c...

Spiffums
04-19-18, 21:22
I have dreams of catching a hot stewardess and saving her, and she is very greatful.

With my luck it would be some dude who falls on my lap and accuses me of sexual harassment when I dump him out in the floor.

elephant
04-19-18, 23:17
Let me correct basically all the points you attempted to sound educated on. You must be a CNN commentator aviation expert.

The engine lost a fan blade... Didn't know that at the time, NTSB didn't release statement till next day

CFM 56 has no gear box.

The duct has no affect on increasing thrust by changing its pressure. It really is not a convergent duct.

You are semi correct on #2, but its a secondary effect. Bypass air is most of the thrust at low altitudes. It also masks the exhaust noise from the turbine section.

#3.... no its not. The air flow from the fan section NEVER enters the core sections except at the very front(inlet guide vanes). Its a 5:1 bypass or there abouts. 5 parts go around, 1 part goes in, but once past the inlet guide vanes the core is sealed.

4... Sort of because the tips are typically super sonic.

5. Not perforated for de-ice. Air is driven through the perforations for noise reduction. The lip is heated via bleed air from the compressor, not exhaust from the turbine.

And the air pressure inside the inlet of the engine is actually low pressure, not high pressure. A turbine engine can produce ice due to temperature drop at the inlet(due to the pressure drop) at up to 10c...

The entire CFM 56 series have a gearbox, its manufactured by Safran Transmission Systems, they also manufacture the titanium fan blades and compressor blades, notice the orange covers in the provided photo- that is the gear box!
51631

I figured if you were wrong on the gearbox, the rest of your list would be wrong as well. But I went ahead and read your remarks on 2 through 5.

#1 I was 100% correct :D

#2 I was "semi correct which means I was 100% correct :D

#3 I was 100% correct but you didn't understand what I was saying even after I mentioned the EGT/TGT levels being reduced. So... in layman's terms: The big fan up front turns and creates a lot of wind, a portion of that wind goes around the engine or, "bypasses" the engine and goes out the back making the engine a lot less noisy. :D

#4 You said "sort of so" and explained why, which basically means I am 100% correct. :D

#5 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ZVaeP1fE6w @1:55. Perforations are to blow hot air to prevent ice formation! I did say "exhaust" when in reality the "hot air" air comes from compressor. So........I guess I am 99% correct. :D

I guess my attempt to sound educated really paid off. Like for real, sometimes I literally have to wear a neck brace just to keep my head up because of how smart I am. You would think for how sensationally gorgeous I am, I'm nothing but eye candy for the ladies... but I offer more than just great looks, I have smartness in me. Do you think CNN is hiring?

eodinert
04-20-18, 04:30
It seems to me that pressure would equalize pretty quickly with a window missing...unless the plane was trying to compensate for the loss of cabin pressure.

I would imagine the woman was stuck in the window because of a mechanical interaction between her and the window frame (round peg, square hole), not pressure differential (unless the pump that pressurizes the cabin can keep up with that amount of loss).

Terrible situation, either way.

pinzgauer
04-20-18, 06:05
It seems to me that pressure would equalize pretty quickly with a window missing...unless the plane was trying to compensate for the loss of cabin pressure.

I would imagine the woman was stuck in the window because of a mechanical interaction between her and the window frame (round peg, square hole), not pressure differential (unless the pump that pressurizes the cabin can keep up with that amount of loss).

Terrible situation, either way.Venturi effect will create lower pressure on the inside

rjacobs
04-20-18, 07:35
The entire CFM 56 series have a gearbox, its manufactured by Safran Transmission Systems, they also manufacture the titanium fan blades and compressor blades, notice the orange covers in the provided photo- that is the gear box!
51631

I figured if you were wrong on the gearbox, the rest of your list would be wrong as well. But I went ahead and read your remarks on 2 through 5.

#1 I was 100% correct :D

#2 I was "semi correct which means I was 100% correct :D

#3 I was 100% correct but you didn't understand what I was saying even after I mentioned the EGT/TGT levels being reduced. So... in layman's terms: The big fan up front turns and creates a lot of wind, a portion of that wind goes around the engine or, "bypasses" the engine and goes out the back making the engine a lot less noisy. :D

#4 You said "sort of so" and explained why, which basically means I am 100% correct. :D

#5 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ZVaeP1fE6w @1:55. Perforations are to blow hot air to prevent ice formation! I did say "exhaust" when in reality the "hot air" air comes from compressor. So........I guess I am 99% correct. :D


I would hardly call the accessory drive a "gear box". I was assuming you were trying to reference something like on the new geared turbofan engines because they have a real gear box(not an accessory drive) in between the fan and the compressor section....

I guess your vast experience of 20 hours of flying before quitting due to your "learning disability" that you admitted last year as well as your google expert status trumps my experience flying the actual aircraft in question here... I will gracefully bow out now and let the real experts and arm chair airline pilots answer the hard questions in this thread...

I knew I shouldnt have ventured into this thread.

FromMyColdDeadHand
04-20-18, 08:22
Venturi effect will create lower pressure on the inside

Venturi sucks.

Took an aviation class and the teacher was a crotchy old guy, pissed he lost out to the Wright brothers or something. He asked how a wing makes lift and a smart kid said the Venturi effect and the shape of the wing creates lift. He said, then how does an airplane fly upside down?

militarymoron
04-20-18, 10:16
He asked how a wing makes lift and a smart kid said the Venturi effect and the shape of the wing creates lift. He said, then how does an airplane fly upside down?

Angle of attack for flying upside down. Also, a wing isn't a Venturi nozzle so 'Venturi effect' isn't correct.

Pilot1
04-20-18, 10:43
Angle of attack for flying upside down. Also, a wing isn't a Venturi nozzle so 'Venturi effect' isn't correct.

The wing is somewhat like half a Venturi nozzle. The other half is the ambient air pressure. Bernoulli's Law explains it.

https://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/files/atoms/files/bernoulli_principle_k-4.pdf

Airflow over their hole in the airplane would cause a low pressure area outside the hole and cabin, forcing airflow out of the hole.

militarymoron
04-20-18, 11:49
The wing is somewhat like half a Venturi nozzle. The other half is the ambient air pressure. Bernoulli's Law explains it.

https://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/files/atoms/files/bernoulli_principle_k-4.pdf

That article covers Bernoulli's principles, but doesn't specifically mention a venturi, which was the example that I was referring to. I found another article concerning the specific use of the term 'venturi' when describing lift, and why it's incorrect: https://www.grc.nasa.gov/www/k-12/airplane/wrong3.html

Here's where the segments on incorrect lift theory start - it's a good, quick read, and kind of eye opening because we're so used to seeing the different theories presented:
https://www.grc.nasa.gov/www/k-12/airplane/wrong1.html

Pilot1
04-20-18, 11:53
That article covers Bernoulli's principles, but doesn't specifically mention a venturi, which was the example that I was referring to. I found another article concerning the specific use of the term 'venturi' when describing lift, and why it's incorrect: https://www.grc.nasa.gov/www/k-12/airplane/wrong3.html

There are different schools of thought for sure. I didn't say it WAS a venture, but acted somewhat like a venture, and it does.

militarymoron
04-20-18, 12:04
There are different schools of thought for sure. I didn't say it WAS a venture, but acted somewhat like a venture, and it does.

Understood/agreed - you did say 'somewhat'. :)

FromMyColdDeadHand
04-20-18, 12:07
Someone here offered to tell me about the new Fly-by-wire tweaks that allow F18s to showboat it now. But I deleted the PM. Aerodynamics and flow are so interesting. From airplanes to sails to suppressors. I'd love to spend a day with a water flow table airfoils to watch fluid dynamics.

Pilot1
04-20-18, 13:13
Understood/agreed - you did say 'somewhat'. :)

Hey, I just fly 'em. I don't know what make 'em work.

;)

militarymoron
04-20-18, 14:18
Hey, I just fly 'em. I don't know what make 'em work.

;)

I gathered that from the name ;)
I was always interested in what made them work. We build 'em, you fly 'em. Works for me.

Adrenaline_6
04-20-18, 14:55
From what I took from aeronautical science is that Bernoullis principle is what creates lift. Right side up or upside down on a wing...the AOA creates the effect. It's what also "sucks" the air in on a turbine engine.

Averageman
04-20-18, 23:28
And on a totally different note;
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-04-20/southwest-airlines-gives-5-000-to-passengers-on-fatal-flight
Southwest Airlines Co. is providing $5,000 checks and $1,000 travel vouchers to passengers who were on a flight this week when an engine broke apart, killing a woman on board.
“We value you as our customer and hope you will allow us another opportunity to restore your confidence in Southwest,” Chief Executive Officer Gary Kelly said in a letter to the customers. “In this spirit, we are sending you a check in the amount of $5,000 to cover any of your immediate financial needs.”
Beyond the check and the voucher, Southwest offered the passengers assistance with other “necessities,” including help being reunited with luggage that was on the flight or other expenses. “Our primary focus and commitment is to assist you in every way possible,” Kelly wrote

elephant
04-21-18, 00:25
Mythbusters did a show once where they took a 727 fuselage, spend the better part of a week making it air tight and pumping in high pressure air from an industrial truck mounted air compressor. They pressurized the cabin to be consistent with a normal plane flying at 32,000 ft. Once the pressure was holding steady for 20 or so minutes, Jamie and Adam fired a square shaped charge in the middle fuselage around a window and nothing happened. The pressure quickly escaped but didn't really cause any more damage nor did it make the initial hole bigger. In fact, none of the dummies that were in the seats were disturbed, even the ones that were not wearing a seat belt.

The myth was that a small hole in a fuselage while under pressure would be catastrophic to the airframe and send people out the plane while they were still in there seats. They first tested the idea with a .44 Mag, then a shape charge and finally a small explosion to intensify the pressurized cabin. All 3 myths were examined and it was "Busted".

Honu
04-21-18, 05:31
I taught scuba for about 15 years I was in a compressor room and we have banks of bottles(cascade system) at 4500 or 6000 PSI cant remember now
not sure what cubic foot the bottles were think about 500 and 20 or so of them in a small room with a large compressor and one of the bottles valve burst (safety disc had failed) cant imagine a catastrophic failure of a tank
HOLY COW that hurt from the pressure hit in the room and since the room is made to take the hit vs the whole shop still people thought the building blew up next door etc..
same reason we filled tanks in water if they blow the water takes the hit mostly :)
ears bleeding ringing and almost throwing up vision funny could not stand etc.. and oddly just hurt all over from the rapid change :) not to mention the scare factor of that happening thinking for a flash I was dead the one thing I was lucky was I had the door open when it happened :) so that relieved a lot of the pressure

I did have a first stage blow when teaching a rescue class one time to they thought it was part of the class

Rayrevolver
04-21-18, 10:00
Mythbusters did a show once where they took a 727 fuselage, spend the better part of a week making it air tight and pumping in high pressure air from an industrial truck mounted air compressor. They pressurized the cabin to be consistent with a normal plane flying at 32,000 ft. Once the pressure was holding steady for 20 or so minutes, Jamie and Adam fired a square shaped charge in the middle fuselage around a window and nothing happened. The pressure quickly escaped but didn't really cause any more damage nor did it make the initial hole bigger. In fact, none of the dummies that were in the seats were disturbed, even the ones that were not wearing a seat belt.

The myth was that a small hole in a fuselage while under pressure would be catastrophic to the airframe and send people out the plane while they were still in there seats. They first tested the idea with a .44 Mag, then a shape charge and finally a small explosion to intensify the pressurized cabin. All 3 myths were examined and it was "Busted".

No aircraft is airtight. They all have holes, whether by design or manufacturing defects. Some of these designed "holes" are called Outflow Valves and they help control the cabin pressure. Anyone remember the "Ditch Switch" on the Airbus that closed the outflow valves? A 737 does not have a labeled ditch switch but you can manually open/close these outflow valves to regulate cabin pressure.

Lets say for round numbers, at altitude, the cabin delta pressure was +5 PSI. So the cabin was 5 PSI higher than ambient. That means the .44 hole in the window is pulling a tiny amount of air, even a 1" x 1" hole is pulling a whopping 5 PSI.

Again, for round numbers, the window blows out and is a 12"x 12" window. That is 144 inches square. Multiplied by 5 PSI. The initial force of air getting out would be 720 lbs. Even wearing a 5 point harness, you are going to get a good sucking! Real world, it was probably a small hole that started and then took the interior/exterior windows out.

If the hole is big enough we call this a "Rapid D" and it usually happens with boat load of fog. Even when you are expecting them, its a surprise and gets you out of your seat.

Another anecdote, a Rapid D greatly reduces your time of useful consciousness. If you are in a bizjet really high up, like above FL410, then you have seconds to get that O2 on, or you are toast.

Its the area of the hole that makes a difference multiplied by the delta P. Its also why the design of most commercial aviation doors pull in first, so that if there is any cabin delta p you can't open the door. Let the crazy folks try in-flight.

...if you wander into a C-17 you will notice a pressure gauge above the entry door, when its green you can open and exit. If not, you will probably get tossed out hard and die.

No names, but we killed a mechanic who opened a bizjet door while the cabin was pressurized. Do the math on the size of a door, and the delta pressure, and you can imagine he was forced out by a few thousand pounds of pressure onto the ramp.

pinzgauer
04-21-18, 10:39
Myth busters failed to duplicate as they just duplicated static pressure.

Add the Venturi effect of 300 mph relative air velocity going across the newly created Venturi and you have much higher suction.

And smaller holes (windows) create more than bigger holes (doors or larger).

Probably most have not seen one, but the cheap vacuum pump tool in the past attached to your air compressor line and used a Venturi to pull a vacuum. Airplanes with pressure hull breaches are just a bigger version of that.

In my earlier career I kept subscription to Aviation week, which summarized aviation accidents each month. I was amazed at how many engine explosions and tire blow ups there were, and how they created deaths due to cabin depressurization.

Tire explosions far outnumbered catastrophic engine explosions like we just saw, typically with third world carriers.

FromMyColdDeadHand
04-21-18, 17:34
"Confirm and Cross Check" is what I hear on United before they open doors after landing.

And then the other way....

https://aviation-safety.net/database/record.php?id=19990407-2

That made big news when it happened, but it was hard to find in The Google search.

ETA: Here is a better one.
https://theaviationgeekclub.com/time-kc-135-stratotanker-aircraft-exploded-failed-pressure-test/

Det-Sog
04-21-18, 18:34
Mythbusters video. https://youtu.be/4yG2h1aDB6k

You can see why the person sitting at the window probably did not survive this incident. Now add, did the pieces from the engine that went through the window, hit the passenger also. There are lots of possible contributing factors. If they replicated this with a smaller, lighter test dummy, the upper torso could have made it out the window... I darn sure would not have wanted to be sitting there...

Rayrevolver
04-21-18, 20:20
"Confirm and Cross Check" is what I hear on United before they open doors after landing.

And then the other way....

https://aviation-safety.net/database/record.php?id=19990407-2

That made big news when it happened, but it was hard to find in The Google search.

ETA: Here is a better one.
https://theaviationgeekclub.com/time-kc-135-stratotanker-aircraft-exploded-failed-pressure-test/

The slides are manually attached from the bottom of the door to notches on the aircraft side. The flight attendant needs to attach before you go and remove after you land, or else you pop the slide (not sure how Airbus rolls). The slides on a 737 are fun to go down and you make some heat on your butt. I would be scared trying out the slides on the upper deck of a 747. You need to step off and kinda drop. The people who take a big leap land down the slide and bounce. These are the people who break legs and get hurt.

The delta P must have been massive in OKC. If you do a high blow (a touch less than 9 psi) on deck you are supposed to take cover as a loose rivet could turn into a deadly projectile.


Myth busters failed to duplicate as they just duplicated static pressure.

Add the Venturi effect of 300 mph relative air velocity going across the newly created Venturi and you have much higher suction.

And smaller holes (windows) create more than bigger holes (doors or larger).

Probably most have not seen one, but the cheap vacuum pump tool in the past attached to your air compressor line and used a Venturi to pull a vacuum. Airplanes with pressure hull breaches are just a bigger version of that.

In my earlier career I kept subscription to Aviation week, which summarized aviation accidents each month. I was amazed at how many engine explosions and tire blow ups there were, and how they created deaths due to cabin depressurization.

Tire explosions far outnumbered catastrophic engine explosions like we just saw, typically with third world carriers.

I don't want to argue (too much) but...

In general, consider 8 psi differential as close to max of a 737 at 41,000 ft. So if Myth Busters pumped up that 727 to 14.7psi + 8 psi (so 22.7 psi), that would be reasonable. Where the 600mph comes into play is if you are outside the boundary layer so probably 1' away from the fuselage, you will feel the wrath of total pressure.

With respect to the holes, don't confuse steady state with the initial condition of a pressurized tube. Shake up a beer and put a small pin hole in it. Should be a small stream and a little flow. Now shake it up and pop the tab, should be a blast with lots more volume coming out. That is what happened when a window blows out and you have the entire volume of a 737 making its way out.

CFM56s are great and very reliable. But things happen, people make mistakes, and sometimes you get unlucky. Here is another story of an uncontained failure with a CFM56:
http://aerossurance.com/safety-management/uncontained-cfm56-failure-b737/