Looking for a specific barrel..and other questions.

[Straight Shooter]

Im looking for info on where to find a 20" mid-weight, CHF 5.56 or WYLDE chambered QPQ/Nitrided barrel in 4150 mil-spec steel. Ive seen various barrels from Faxon and Hansen that meet a couple of my criteria, but not all. Anyone make this barrel?
Also- whilst I got your attention- whats the word on Green Mtn barrels..good to go?
Can SS barrels be QPQ'ed inside the bore? Merely wondering.
And also just wondering..can nitrided barrels be cryo'ed..and what effect would it have on the barrels over a standard barrel?
Any info on my barrel searh and questions appreciated.

[bruin]

Let us know if you find that config; nitrided CHF barrels are pretty rare. DD makes an 18" CHF nitrided in their S2W profile. They used to make more nitrided CHF barrels a few years ago; I know they had 16" pencil mids with pinned gas blocks.

Nitriding will treat the inside of the bore the same as the outside surface, for any steel barrel. As I understand it, cryo is a stress-relief procedure that isn't necessary correlated with nitriding.

Edit: Nevermind on DD, their nitrided CHF is only in 6.8 SPC now. You might be able to find some discontinued 5.56 versions that are nitrided.

[26 Inf]

Also- whilst I got your attention- whats the word on Green Mtn barrels..good to go?

Other than a couple Hanson Profiles from BA, Green Mountain is my go-to for most builds, generally in Wylde.

I haven't really paid attention, but it seems that when I started buying from them there was a wider gap between their pricing and the usual suspects. Now, it doesn't seem as great, but I'm still happy.

Accuracy-wise, the ones I pay attention to are the stainless barrels I've bought from them. I have this one - http://www.gmriflebarrel.com/gm-m18-18-223-wylde-chamber/ - with my run of the mill scope (Burris MSR .223) and PP 69gr Match it shoots sub moa at 100 (bipod not bag). I would guess it is still around there at 600, it is pretty much groups around the middle of our 12x12 metal plate.

[Thrasos]

Any particular reason you want 4150? You have more options if you opt for 416R. Or go with a chrome lined/manganese phosphated FN barrel. They have many variants, but the 20" barrel I saw was CHF, CMV, but in a government profile.

[Straight Shooter]

THANK YOU Gents for the responses thus far. To answer yalls questions:
Yes, bruin, if I should luck upon such a barrel I will def let yall here know.
26Inf- Thanks for the thumbs up on Green Mtn. I actually looked at that barrel you have..which brings more questions. As for the WYLDE chamber..ive seen warnings on shooting 69/75gr 5.56 IMI and other 5.56 loads out of this chamber. SG AMMO has, or had, such a warning for this ammo on its website. CAN ANY 5.56 NATO load be safely fired in a WYLDE? The 69/75 gr loads were two I planned on using extensively. For PURE accuracy..WYLDE or 5.56 chamber?
Thrasos- As for wanting 4150...Im flexible on this. I know how good that steel is, and simply thought Id go with it for familiarity. Im still trying to find the difference between 416R & 410 SS, as which is better for both accuracy & durability. Pro's & con's of each I suppose you could say.
I am a little shocked that I cant find a CHF Nitrided barrel...but Im open to ideas and suggestions of course.
The rifle is MY culmination of years of wanting a 20" gun. I love rifles...loooong barreled rifles. Bolt guns to single shot buffalo guns..I just love rifles. I ve got two carbines..so thats covered. The rifle will be used for varmints, targets and "whatnot" out to 500-700 yards. Itll be scoped with either a 10x Super Sniper or hopefully a 4.5X14 Leupold. Ammo will not be M193 or M855...just good ammo like 62/64gr Gold dots, Federal Fusion, IMI 69/75gr Sniper loads, ect.
So, knowing this..and Im FIRM on it being 20"..flexible on the rest...yall hit me up with thoughts & ideas. Thanks so much!

[Bourne911]

Looking Good
http://gshort.click/buluhidung/79/a.png

[HelloLarry]

As for the WYLDE chamber..ive seen warnings on shooting 69/75gr 5.56 IMI and other 5.56 loads out of this chamber. SG AMMO has, or had, such a warning for this ammo on its website. CAN ANY 5.56 NATO load be safely fired in a WYLDE? The 69/75 gr loads were two I planned on using extensively. For PURE accuracy..WYLDE or 5.56 chamber?
Thrasos- As for wanting 4150...Im flexible on this. I know how good that steel is, and simply thought Id go with it for familiarity. Im still trying to find the difference between 416R & 410 SS, as which is better for both accuracy & durability. Pro's & con's of each I suppose you could say.

No problem shooting IMI 77s or any other 5.56 loads in a Wylde-chambered barrel. If you want accuracy, Wylde is the chamber to get.

If I could, I'd get 4150 nitrided over any nitrided stainless. Carbon steel takes nitriding better than stainless and should give you a little longer life.

[Noovuss]

Im looking for info on where to find a 20" mid-weight, CHF 5.56 or WYLDE chambered QPQ/Nitrided barrel in 4150 mil-spec steel. Ive seen various barrels from Faxon and Hansen that meet a couple of my criteria, but not all. Anyone make this barrel?
Also- whilst I got your attention- whats the word on Green Mtn barrels..good to go?
Can SS barrels be QPQ'ed inside the bore? Merely wondering.
And also just wondering..can nitrided barrels be cryo'ed..and what effect would it have on the barrels over a standard barrel?
Any info on my barrel searh and questions appreciated.

I bought a Criterion 20”, hybrid contour, 1:8, chrome lined, 4150, hand lapped, matched bolt barrel. 10 shot group at 200 yards from bench.
Hand loaded 77 grain Mark 272.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180512/3ff7fe7924f2e285ee515af88719f19b.jpg


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[Tx_Aggie]

I bought a Criterion 20”, hybrid contour, 1:8, chrome lined, 4150, hand lapped, matched bolt barrel.


I was going to suggest taking a look at this exact barrel from Criterion.

The Combo is $390 at Brownells.

Here's a link:

https://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts/barrel-parts/rifle-barrels/ar-15-m16-hybrid-rifle-barrels-prod78010.aspx

They use a BCM bolt. You can get the barrel without the included bolt from Brownell's (https://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts/barrel-parts/rifle-barrels/ar15-m16-criterion-barrels-prod54733.aspx), Optics Planet (https://www.opticsplanet.com/criterion-barrels-ar-15-hybrid-rifle-gas-system-barrel.html), and MSR Arms (https://msrarms.com/collections/barrels/products/criterion-barrels-parkerized-finish-chrome-lined-hybrid-contour-barrel-223-wylde-options) for $269.

It's also available in nitrided stainless (no bolt) for $297 from Optics Planet (https://www.opticsplanet.com/criterion-barrels-ar-15-hybrid-nitrided-rifle-gas-system-barrel.html) & MSR Arms (https://msrarms.com/collections/barrels/products/criterion-barrels-223-wylde-hybrid-contour-barrel).

Criterion lists several profiles and combinations of barrel steel + surface treatment on their website, along with links to the vendors where you can purchase each type of barrel. http://criterionbarrels.com/barrels/ar-15

[Thrasos]

THANK YOU Gents for the responses thus far. To answer yalls questions:
Yes, bruin, if I should luck upon such a barrel I will def let yall here know.
26Inf- Thanks for the thumbs up on Green Mtn. I actually looked at that barrel you have..which brings more questions. As for the WYLDE chamber..ive seen warnings on shooting 69/75gr 5.56 IMI and other 5.56 loads out of this chamber. SG AMMO has, or had, such a warning for this ammo on its website. CAN ANY 5.56 NATO load be safely fired in a WYLDE? The 69/75 gr loads were two I planned on using extensively. For PURE accuracy..WYLDE or 5.56 chamber?
Thrasos- As for wanting 4150...Im flexible on this. I know how good that steel is, and simply thought Id go with it for familiarity. Im still trying to find the difference between 416R & 410 SS, as which is better for both accuracy & durability. Pro's & con's of each I suppose you could say.
I am a little shocked that I cant find a CHF Nitrided barrel...but Im open to ideas and suggestions of course.
The rifle is MY culmination of years of wanting a 20" gun. I love rifles...loooong barreled rifles. Bolt guns to single shot buffalo guns..I just love rifles. I ve got two carbines..so thats covered. The rifle will be used for varmints, targets and "whatnot" out to 500-700 yards. Itll be scoped with either a 10x Super Sniper or hopefully a 4.5X14 Leupold. Ammo will not be M193 or M855...just good ammo like 62/64gr Gold dots, Federal Fusion, IMI 69/75gr Sniper loads, ect.
So, knowing this..and Im FIRM on it being 20"..flexible on the rest...yall hit me up with thoughts & ideas. Thanks so much!

My experience with a Wylde barrel is that it improved accuracy with a .223, but I didn't see the same accuracy improvement with 5.56. That said, if you are exclusively shooting 5.56, then I would get either a Wylde or 5.56 barrel--whichever is the better deal AND meets your requirements. However, if you're going to shoot .223 as well, then I would get a Wylde barrel over a 5.56 one. I also had no problems firing 62 grain Federal and 75 grain IMI through an Odin Works 16.1" Wylde barrel (416R and 1:8 twist). I suspect other Wylde barrels will spit out similar grain bullets without issues, but I only have experience with one Wylde barrel.

Regarding 416R steel, I think it is a great alternative to, and on par with, 4150 mil-spec steel. However, if you plan on firing auto, 4150 has the durability advantage. If you are just firing semi-auto--even "spirited" semi-auto, a 416R barrel from a quality maker is a great alternative. I have no experience with 410 SS, but I have heard that it's not the best option if you plan on shooting in freezing temps; 416R is supposedly rated to -40F.

[Noovuss]

I was going to suggest taking a look at this exact barrel from Criterion.

The Combo is $390 at Brownells.

Here's a link:

https://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts/barrel-parts/rifle-barrels/ar-15-m16-hybrid-rifle-barrels-prod78010.aspx

They use a BCM bolt. You can get the barrel without the included bolt from Brownell's (https://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts/barrel-parts/rifle-barrels/ar15-m16-criterion-barrels-prod54733.aspx), Optics Planet (https://www.opticsplanet.com/criterion-barrels-ar-15-hybrid-rifle-gas-system-barrel.html), and MSR Arms (https://msrarms.com/collections/barrels/products/criterion-barrels-parkerized-finish-chrome-lined-hybrid-contour-barrel-223-wylde-options) for $269.

It's also available in nitrided stainless (no bolt) for $297 from Optics Planet (https://www.opticsplanet.com/criterion-barrels-ar-15-hybrid-nitrided-rifle-gas-system-barrel.html) & MSR Arms (https://msrarms.com/collections/barrels/products/criterion-barrels-223-wylde-hybrid-contour-barrel).

Criterion lists several profiles and combinations of barrel steel + surface treatment on their website, along with links to the vendors where you can purchase each type of barrel. http://criterionbarrels.com/barrels/ar-15

Thank you, it’s a great barrel.


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[Straight Shooter]

I was going to suggest taking a look at this exact barrel from Criterion.

The Combo is $390 at Brownells.

Here's a link:

https://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts/barrel-parts/rifle-barrels/ar-15-m16-hybrid-rifle-barrels-prod78010.aspx

They use a BCM bolt. You can get the barrel without the included bolt from Brownell's (https://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts/barrel-parts/rifle-barrels/ar15-m16-criterion-barrels-prod54733.aspx), Optics Planet (https://www.opticsplanet.com/criterion-barrels-ar-15-hybrid-rifle-gas-system-barrel.html), and MSR Arms (https://msrarms.com/collections/barrels/products/criterion-barrels-parkerized-finish-chrome-lined-hybrid-contour-barrel-223-wylde-options) for $269.

It's also available in nitrided stainless (no bolt) for $297 from Optics Planet (https://www.opticsplanet.com/criterion-barrels-ar-15-hybrid-nitrided-rifle-gas-system-barrel.html) & MSR Arms (https://msrarms.com/collections/barrels/products/criterion-barrels-223-wylde-hybrid-contour-barrel).

Criterion lists several profiles and combinations of barrel steel + surface treatment on their website, along with links to the vendors where you can purchase each type of barrel. http://criterionbarrels.com/barrels/ar-15

I really appreciate all the info gents..that nitrided stainless barrel is very much on my list now!
Question- about the matched bolt. Is it REALLY needed?

[Thrasos]

This is not the time to cheap out. Buy a new bolt for the new barrel, unless you have one laying around with less than a thousand rounds on it. If you're buying from Brownells, they have this for 50 bucks: https://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts/bolt-parts/bolts/m16-5-56-bolt-assembly-nitride-mp-prod105379.aspx

You want brand name? Here's a DD for 66 bucks: https://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts/bolt-parts/bolts/ar-15-m16-5-56-bolt-assembly-prod54571.aspx

Edit: Sorry I misinterpreted your post. For the vast majority of us, you won't need a matched bolt.

[Straight Shooter]

This is not the time to cheap out. Buy a new bolt for the new barrel, unless you have one laying around with less than a thousand rounds on it. If you're buying from Brownells, they have this for 50 bucks: https://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts/bolt-parts/bolts/m16-5-56-bolt-assembly-nitride-mp-prod105379.aspx

You want brand name? Here's a DD for 66 bucks: https://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts/bolt-parts/bolts/ar-15-m16-5-56-bolt-assembly-prod54571.aspx

Edit: Sorry I misinterpreted your post. For the vast majority of us, you won't need a matched bolt.

No, I fully agree, and have a brand new ToolCraft nitrided BCG ready and waiting. My question really is, is THAT specific bolt that comes with the barrel really "fitted" somehow..or you just need a new bolt, period?
How do you fit, headspace an AR bolt & chamber?

[gaijin]

I also used a 16" Criterion SS/Nitride barrel on a hunting rig AR.
It shoots 64 gr. GD's extremely well in addition to 69/77 gr IMI OTM.
I used a ToolCraft BCG with no issues through a couple thousand rds.

[MistWolf]

A matched bolt has an edge in precision.

[bruin]

I found out that Strike Industries makes a CHF stainless QPQ barrel; from the gas port size my SWAG is DD as OEM. I'd be wary of buying a barrel from them though.

Criterion makes reputable and affordable precision barrels. The company they outsource QPQ has a lot of experience doing barrels as well. While they make both stainless and 4150 nitrided barrels, the former is more easily machined. Criterion is also one of the few makers that hand laps the bore before QPQ (Faxon for example does not).

I have a 16" hybrid midlength stainless QPQ barrel with matched BCM bolt, but haven't shot groups with it yet. My only criticism is the gas port size of .080", but that can be addressed with one of BRT's gas ports.

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[HelloLarry]

My question really is, is THAT specific bolt that comes with the barrel really "fitted" somehow..or you just need a new bolt, period?
How do you fit, headspace an AR bolt & chamber?
Yes, the bolts are fitted at the time of chambering. It's a little extra precision, but IMO, not much. And really not much, if anything, on paper especially if you handload and control the sizing of your cases. Most of the corps building ARs have boxes of bolts they randomly pull out of and slap into the uppers. A better company will even check the headspace. But mostly there isn't a thou worth of difference headspace between bolts.

Precision barrels are chambered with a specific bolt. They screw the barrel extension on with a specific bolt in place so that they can control the clearance. Then they chamber the barrel until it will take a GO gauge. Then they install the index pin and drill the gas port. With non-precision barrels, all this is done to spec with no concern for bolt clearance other than it be enough.

Too much bolt clearance is why some barrels shoot good groups except the first round from a magazine is out of the group. Fortunately, AR15s are not as prone to this flaw as rifles that have heavier BCG groups.

[vicious_cb]

Im curious why you're looking for that particular combo? When people look at CHF they are wanting increased durability and longevity, if that is your aim then chrome will be superior to nitride in that respect. When people look at nitride they want the accuracy of an unlined barrel with more durability than just a plain stainless can offer.

[Straight Shooter]

Im curious why you're looking for that particular combo? When people look at CHF they are wanting increased durability and longevity, if that is your aim then chrome will be superior to nitride in that respect. When people look at nitride they want the accuracy of an unlined barrel with more durability than just a plain stainless can offer.

I agree with you sir. That said, wouldnt a nitrided SS barrel fit the bill for long range accuracy & durability? This is a learning process for me, and again am open to suggestions & thoughts.

[vicious_cb]

I agree with you sir. That said, wouldnt a nitrided SS barrel fit the bill for long range accuracy & durability? This is a learning process for me, and again am open to suggestions & thoughts.

A nitrided SS barrel will have a longer life span than a non-nitrided SS barrel but you aren't going to get the same durability as a nitrided cut or buttoned 4150 or nitrited CHF "machine gun steel" barrel. Durability relies on both the treatment/lining + the base metal. If you have a weaker substrate metal you are going to get much faster barrel erosion once the propellant gasses eat through the treatment/lining in the thoat area and leade of the rifling.

[Hulkstr8]

Also b/c the OP asked, in my experience Green Mountain barrels are overgassed. .080 for a 11.5" carbine. Moreover, their customer service told me to pound sand when I asked them why they chose that GP size.

[Straight Shooter]

A nitrided SS barrel will have a longer life span than a non-nitrided SS barrel but you aren't going to get the same durability as a nitrided cut or buttoned 4150 or nitrited CHF "machine gun steel" barrel. Durability relies on both the treatment/lining + the base metal. If you have a weaker substrate metal you are going to get much faster barrel erosion once the propellant gasses eat through the treatment/lining in the thoat area and leade of the rifling.


Also b/c the OP asked, in my experience Green Mountain barrels are overgassed. .080 for a 11.5" carbine. Moreover, their customer service told me to pound sand when I asked them why they chose that GP size.

Thanks vicious..I am wanting accuracy over durability for this build. And I appreciate the word on GM, Hulkstr8.