View Full Version : Active shooter Santa Fe TX HS
I wrote NM, it should be Taxes
SANTA FE, Texas (KTRK) --
Santa Fe High School is on lockdown after a shooting inside the school. Witnesses say the shooting took place in an art class on campus between 7:30 and 7:45 a.m.
Life Flight was also called to the scene. There is no official confirmation of any injuries at this time, but there does appear to be a possible body under a sheet near an exit door
http://abc13.com/live-coverage-active-shooter-situation-at-santa-fe-hs/3490869/
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Killer(s) in custody: http://abc13.com/live-coverage-active-shooter-situation-at-santa-fe-hs/3490869/
First reports were singular but now say there were 2 of them.
This is going to the new norm because spoiled brat kids feel like they need to make a name for themselves by hurting others.
Averageman
05-18-18, 10:00
Vigilante Justice might be an ugly thing, but it might not be as ugly or as harmful as this continuing.
Coming out of any terrorist (and that's what I'm beginning to believe this is turning in to) incident and mugging for the camera and the media would stop if some parents found a handy rope and a street lamp.
8 dead so far, 2 in custody. Crap.
"I was sitting in my classroom and I heard really loud booms, but I really didn't know what they were at first," student Dakota Schrader said. "Then, I realized what they were when I heard screaming."
"I never thought it would happen here," said Tyler Turner.
That, in a nut shell, is one of the major problems. Said it before, say it again: no four words in human history has lead to the deaths of more people than "It can't happen here"
Denial id the mother of all human fu&% ups.
Here we go again.. CNN / Hogg time coming in 3 2 1.
CNN report states shotgun and a second suspect
*Most Likely* Two Columbine wannabe POS. Wish they were PODS at this time.
The reality is, I agree Average. How long until we can get some real justice for these people. The only time their names and faces should be on TV is when they face the firing line filled with any parent of any child who loses their life from ScumBags like this.
Innocent until proven guilty, absolutely. Refutable evidence of killing with cameras in the school? No justification, no plea deals, no life with no parole. Give those parents a chance at some real justice by making sure they can never hurt another person again, for any reason.
CNN report states shotgun and a second suspect
Not trying to make light of this event at all, but at least that prevents it from becoming another AR story so they can avoid/ignore the actual issues.
FromMyColdDeadHand
05-18-18, 11:24
It always changes from the first reporting to the reality, but two people (but they seem to imply one shooter) and a shotgun?
The press really need to keep the kids names out of the news and go generic on descriptions.
They also always say 'Gunman", the really should "Gunkid".
The only time their names and faces should be on TV is when they face the firing line filled with any parent of any child who loses their life from ScumBags like this.
Yep, 100%. The news coverage and 24/7 big media/social media splash of every FB post, every tweet, every Instagram photo by the ****ing killers is what differentiates 2018 from 1960. The guns have always been here.
We have to remove the platform for these assholes to become infamous. The more we can make them go away forgotten, the less we encourage these kinds of events.
Prayers for the victims and their families. Hoping for swift justice to be served to the POS.
Strange how this happened one day after Obama, Clinton, and the FBI came under new scrutiny concerning them spying on the Trump campaign. I’m beginning to believe more and more there is a real deep state and conspiracy theory’s are more then just that.
Apologies if I’m out of turn here. Again prayers for the victims and their families, this s*** is gotta stop. God knows they don’t care about anything but their children right now.
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We should watch our language as we can't control what the media use to describe the one that cause these tragedies. We should not use their word "gunman" and "shooter". Gun man is basically man with gun. Good guys are gun man. People on this forum and million others are "shooters", but we don't kill or murder people. The bad individuals are "killers".
Also, avoid using the term "mass shootings". It's a "massacre" or rampage.
Officials say explosives have been found both on and off campus
Explosive devices were found at Santa Fe High School in Santa Fe, Texas and the surrounding areas near the high school, according to Chief Walter Braun of Santa Fe Independent School District Police.
Braun said community members should be on alert for any suspicious devices, and call 9-1-1 if they find a suspicious device
https://www.cnn.com/us/live-news/santa-fe-texas-shooting
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*Most Likely* Two Columbine wannabe POS. Wish they were PODS at this time.
The reality is, I agree Average. How long until we can get some real justice for these people. The only time their names and faces should be on TV is when they face the firing line filled with any parent of any child who loses their life from ScumBags like this.
Innocent until proven guilty, absolutely. Refutable evidence of killing with cameras in the school? No justification, no plea deals, no life with no parole. Give those parents a chance at some real justice by making sure they can never hurt another person again, for any reason.
I agree, no refutable evidence, no name or face publicized, no prison time. Bag over the head, firing squad, film at 11. Harsh yes, but I'm betting it would put a fast stop or reduction on this madness. This country has turned into an open asylum. So sad..
Our daily dose of Evil.
Nothing we can’t shrug off in 2018 A.D.
hotrodder636
05-18-18, 11:59
The large amount of these incidents taking place recently really makes me wonder if there is an agenda in play.
Regardless, prayers for the family. Prayers for us legal/legit firearms owners.
Not trying to make light of this event at all, but at least that prevents it from becoming another AR story so they can avoid/ignore the actual issues.
It’s part of the reason I posted that detail.
And then there is this idiot:
https://www.yahoo.com/news/man-shows-sight-santa-fe-150800287.html
FromMyColdDeadHand
05-18-18, 12:21
We should watch our language as we can't control what the media use to describe the one that cause these tragedies. We should not use their word "gunman" and "shooter". Gun man is basically man with gun. Good guys are gun man. People on this forum and million others are "shooters", but we don't kill or murder people. The bad individuals are "killers".
Also, avoid using the term "mass shootings". It's a "massacre" or rampage.
Well put.
Animals?
Almost all of these school shootings are with in the community. People aren't randomly attacking schools, or even going to a rival school. It is all fratricide; schoolicide; sophicide? I don't think that the internal nature of these shootings is examined fully enough.
The large amount of these incidents taking place recently really makes me wonder if there is an agenda in play.
It is more that they see how much press and attention these shooters get and it builds itself up. Notice too that these guys are more likely lately to survive and/or not kill themselves? That is a deviation from the past.
Funny how we never hear from Cruz, or his lawyers.
RetroRevolver77
05-18-18, 12:23
And then there is this idiot:
https://www.yahoo.com/news/man-shows-sight-santa-fe-150800287.html
He's a CTR shill, trying to connect the shooter to the Trump base after it was discovered that the shooter is a leftist. They have pictures of the murder's jacket that he wore often to school with both Commie and Nazi pins on it. Here is a photo of the jacket the murderer wore often and was pulled directly from his facebook account before they managed to scrub it;
https://i.imgur.com/C1akxLY.jpg
He's a CTR shill, trying to connect the shooter to the Trump base ....
That was the first impression I got when I saw that report.
It always changes from the first reporting to the reality, but two people (but they seem to imply one shooter) and a shotgun?
The press really need to keep the kids names out of the news and go generic on descriptions.
They also always say 'Gunman", the really should "Gunkid".
I prefer "gunbitch".
I really don't understand why shooting up your school has become such an attractive option for troubled kids these days...
Also if the explosive thing is correct... that's kind of a lot of devices... a lot of suspicious stuff with shootings recently...
titsonritz
05-18-18, 13:26
Prayers out to the victims, their families and friends of this horrible crime.
RetroRevolver77
05-18-18, 13:31
Facebook screengrab before they managed to scrub it.
https://archive.fo/rNTp9
Facebook screengrab before they managed to scrub it.
https://archive.fo/rNTp9
Did someone, seriously, respond with: "Didn't even get the high score, LAME?" About the shooting, or am I just missing the context here?
The day shows the 2nd, but the reply shows 2mins ago, I can't tell...
Averageman
05-18-18, 13:38
School RO is wounded along with at least one Teacher and one Student.
Moose-Knuckle
05-18-18, 13:52
He's a CTR shill, trying to connect the shooter to the Trump base after it was discovered that the shooter is a leftist. They have pictures of the murder's jacket that he wore often to school with both Commie and Nazi pins on it. Here is a photo of the jacket the murderer wore often and was pulled directly from his facebook account before they managed to scrub it;
https://i.imgur.com/C1akxLY.jpg
Only German item on the black trench coat I see is a cheap reproduction of an Iron Cross, the Iron Cross pre-dates the Third Reich and Nazism in Germany so not really "Nazi" but I know how it will be spinned.
Commie pin on right lapel, can't make out what flag pin that is on the left lapel, what appears to be a Hydra emblem (Capt. America's arch enemies in Marvel) on flap of right side pocket, and for good measure a Satanic pentagram on the flap of the left pocket.
Facebook screengrab before they managed to scrub it.
https://archive.fo/rNTp9
Place of employment on his FB list's USMC, probably nothing but wonder if he was talking to a recruiter.
RetroRevolver77
05-18-18, 13:53
Did someone, seriously, respond with: "Didn't even get the high score, LAME?" About the shooting, or am I just missing the context here?
The day shows the 2nd, but the reply shows 2mins ago, I can't tell...
It's a SCREEN GRAB, a photo of the Facebook screen before it was taken down. It's not interactive. At the time of the grab whatever was posted by other members was still on there. It shows his jacket with the nazi and commie pins, his born to kill shirt, his satanic garbage background, the kid was messed up.
thepatriot2705
05-18-18, 13:53
Did someone, seriously, respond with: "Didn't even get the high score, LAME?" About the shooting, or am I just missing the context here?
The day shows the 2nd, but the reply shows 2mins ago, I can't tell...
It was probably just a comment on the last post that the animal wrote. The high score comment was more than likely in response to the shooting.
Just shows how ****ed society is.
This ain’t a gun problem. It is societal decay.
It's a SCREEN GRAB, a photo of the Facebook screen before it was taken down. It's not interactive. At the time of the grab whatever was posted by other members was still on there. It shows his jacket with the nazi and commie pins, his born to kill shirt, his satanic garbage background, the kid was messed up.
I know that piece,
I was wondering if the Grab was performed today, after the shooting. Or showing an archive of the history on the 2nd, or, in other words, before the shooting.
I am just wondering if this dude responded to his picture like that, today, after the shooting, hopefully the FBI will be knocking on his door and carting him out as he's just as effed in the head.
But, I could be missing the context as the date of the 2mins post could be before Today.
RetroRevolver77
05-18-18, 14:00
I know that piece,
I was wondering if the Grab was performed today, after the shooting. Or showing an archive of the history on the 2nd, or, in other words, before the shooting.
I am just wondering if this dude responded to his picture like that, today, after the shooting, hopefully the FBI will be knocking on his door and carting him out as he's just as effed in the head.
But, I could be missing the context as the date of the 2mins post could be before Today.
It is in response to the shooting, the grab was done just after the shooting.
From the Governor of TX: Two weapons were used, a shotgun and .38 revolver, both owned by the killer's father.
titsonritz
05-18-18, 14:15
Hopefully, the shotgun is a pump.
Moose-Knuckle
05-18-18, 14:16
From the Governor of TX: Two weapons were used, a shotgun and .38 revolver, both owned by the killer's father.
If only law makers would ban AR-15's.
titsonritz
05-18-18, 14:18
I can hear it now, proof the NRA are the bad guys.
https://heavy.com/news/2018/05/dimitrios-pagourtzis/
Averageman
05-18-18, 14:30
Apparently a lot of coincidences took place that made this less fatal than it could have been.
The Chief of Police was on his way to give the School and Resource Officers and award when this shooting took place. The Chief pulled the wounded RO out of the line of fire and exchanged shots with the shooter. The TDPS Officers arrived quickly and they too engaged the shooter.
So apparently, not only was the School practiced in the drills for a Shooter, they were getting an award for it. When it went down, the response was timely by the mere coincidental proximity of available Officers.
The Governor and Local LEO's are answering questions now.
Apparently a lot of coincidences took place that made this less fatal than it could have been.
The Chief of Police was on his way to give the School and Resource Officers and award when this shooting took place. The Chief pulled the wounded RO out of the line of fire and exchanged shots with the shooter. The TDPS Officers arrived quickly and they too engaged the shooter.
So apparently, not only was the School practiced in the drills for a Shooter, they were getting an award for it. When it went down, the response was timely by the mere coincidental proximity of available Officers.
The Governor and Local LEO's are answering questions now.
Too bad the Chief didn’t put two in the murderer’s head. The news is now flashing the murderer’s face all over the place along with his bio.
skywalkrNCSU
05-18-18, 15:09
From the Governor of TX: Two weapons were used, a shotgun and .38 revolver, both owned by the killer's father.
Of course I read an article earlier that said an “AR-15 type rifle” was used. Media can’t be bothered to check those pesky facts when it is what they want to demonize the most...
Too bad the Chief didn’t put two in the murderer’s head. The news is now flashing the murderer’s face all over the place along with his bio.
Making 100% sure there will be a copycat emboldened and motivated. I always post this on my social media and such in such events:
https://nonotoriety.com/
Of course I read an article earlier that said an “AR-15 type rifle” was used. Media can’t be bothered to check those pesky facts when it is what they want to demonize the most...
Putting on my anti hat, the response will be "but it would have been much worse if they'd used an AR"
That's why there's no winning with them, just moving of goal posts to fit an agenda.
Apparently a lot of coincidences took place that made this less fatal than it could have been.
The Chief of Police was on his way to give the School and Resource Officers and award when this shooting took place. The Chief pulled the wounded RO out of the line of fire and exchanged shots with the shooter. The TDPS Officers arrived quickly and they too engaged the shooter.
So apparently, not only was the School practiced in the drills for a Shooter, they were getting an award for it. When it went down, the response was timely by the mere coincidental proximity of available Officers.
The Governor and Local LEO's are answering questions now.
Talk about contrast with Parkland.
Chief showed courage. Far to many of them are paper pushers anymore. This guy obviously wasn't.
titsonritz
05-18-18, 15:24
Making 100% sure there will be a copycat emboldened and motivated. I always post this on my social media and such in such events:
https://nonotoriety.com/
Putting on my anti hat, the response will be "but it would have been much worse if they'd used an AR"
That's why there's no winning with them, just moving of goal posts to fit an agenda.
And I'd respond with "No it would have been worse if there weren't hero cops on site taking care of business"
titsonritz
05-18-18, 15:27
LT Gov appears to have a clue with hardening of the schools.
And then there is this idiot: https://www.yahoo.com/news/man-shows-sight-santa-fe-150800287.html
Yeah, that is a special kind of stupid.
I agree, no refutable evidence, no name or face publicized, no prison time. Bag over the head, firing squad, film at 11. Harsh yes, but I'm betting it would put a fast stop or reduction on this madness. This country has turned into an open asylum. So sad..
I 100% agree that harsh instant punishment would stop or reduce this kind of behavior. Remember, the Boston Bomber is still sitting in USP Terre Haute right now watching TV with Dylann Roof waiting for his execution date which will be in approximately 8 years. Timothy McVeigh was on death row for 6 years, 1 month and 23 days and cost the US taxpayer almost $4M. Mass shooters should go straight to court and if convicted, walk straigh to the gallows.
BoringGuy45
05-18-18, 15:42
From the Governor of TX: Two weapons were used, a shotgun and .38 revolver, both owned by the killer's father.
Hopefully, the shotgun is a pump.
If only law makers would ban AR-15's.
Probably won't matter. On one hand, there's the off chance that this sparks the idea that one does not need an AR to shoot up a school. On the other hand, it will probably just lead the left to expand the definition of "assault weapon" to include everything except double barrel shotguns and single action revolvers. They want to be like Australia, and, to my knowledge, pump action shotguns were banned after the 96 shooting along with semi-auto weapons.
I 100% agree that harsh instant punishment would stop or reduce this kind of behavior. Remember, the Boston Bomber is still sitting in USP Terre Haute right now watching TV with Dylann Roof waiting for his execution date which will be in approximately 8 years. Timothy McVeigh was on death row for 6 years, 1 month and 23 days and cost the US taxpayer almost $4M. Mass shooters should go straight to court and if convicted, walk straigh to the gallows.
Would save us a metric-shite-ton in Money, Labor, and Services; as well as fees, law suits, but most importantly: A lot of pain and suffering from families who are impacted by people who don't deserve to be taking breaths when the people they did wrong are no longer.
skywalkrNCSU
05-18-18, 16:04
Putting on my anti hat, the response will be "but it would have been much worse if they'd used an AR"
That's why there's no winning with them, just moving of goal posts to fit an agenda.
Yeah in reality it doesn’t matter, no one who is anti gun is going to see a mass shooting not involving an AR and have a change of heart
I prefer "gunbitch".
I really don't understand why shooting up your school has become such an attractive option for troubled kids these days...
Also if the explosive thing is correct... that's kind of a lot of devices... a lot of suspicious stuff with shootings recently...I think "murderer" will suffice.
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titsonritz
05-18-18, 16:48
I am good with "accused murderer" until he is convicted. Hopefully, Texas won't give a 17-year-old a pass on the needle.
Of course I read an article earlier that said an “AR-15 type rifle” was used. Media can’t be bothered to check those pesky facts when it is what they want to demonize the most...It was an AR with revolving mag, shooting 38 shots of special shotgun ammo
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He had pressure cookers and pipe bombs. As in multiple. The pressure cookers were placed around the school area. . How did no one notice that? I own a pressure cooker and it's not small nor easlily concealable. One would take up a school bag. He had more than one.
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I am good with "accused murderer" until he is convicted. Hopefully, Texas won't give a 17-year-old a pass on the needle.
You used to be able to count on TX and VA to rid the planet of these guys. Not so in VA any longer. Beltway sniper got a pass due to age.
It would be nice if a special court could be appointed for mass murderers. Shoot on Friday, trial on Monday, appeal on Thursday, Needle on Saturday.
I just can't understand what is going on in a kids mind that they think shooting up a school is a good idea AND that surrendering makes it an even better plan.
I think it's time to bring the gallows back. This is getting too crazy to deal with by conventional manners.
Moose-Knuckle
05-18-18, 17:17
He had pressure cookers and pipe bombs. As in multiple. The pressure cookers were placed around the school area. . How did no one notice that? I own a pressure cooker and it's not small nor easlily concealable. One would take up a school bag. He had more than one.
Especially post Boston.
Everyone knows what a pressure cooker looks like now.
CleverNickname
05-18-18, 17:23
I am good with "accused murderer" until he is convicted. Hopefully, Texas won't give a 17-year-old a pass on the needle.
Roper v. Simmons (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roper_v._Simmons) says crimes committed by minors aren't eligible for the death penalty.
Moose-Knuckle
05-18-18, 17:29
Roper v. Simmons (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roper_v._Simmons) says crimes committed by minors aren't eligible for the death penalty.
In the state of Texas 17 year olds are considered adults.
I am good with "accused murderer" until he is convicted. Hopefully, Texas won't give a 17-year-old a pass on the needle.
pretty sure they will drive him right on up the road to Huntsville and let nature take its course...
Roper v. Simmons (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roper_v._Simmons) says crimes committed by minors aren't eligible for the death penalty.
Terrorism laws and punishments -should- make those laws moot, but I suppose they won't or don't.
Averageman
05-18-18, 17:51
I 100% agree that harsh instant punishment would stop or reduce this kind of behavior. Remember, the Boston Bomber is still sitting in USP Terre Haute right now watching TV with Dylann Roof waiting for his execution date which will be in approximately 8 years. Timothy McVeigh was on death row for 6 years, 1 month and 23 days and cost the US taxpayer almost $4M. Mass shooters should go straight to court and if convicted, walk straigh to the gallows.
It's hard to be a super villain when your dragged by your hair to a lamp post screaming.
It's even more difficult to be a cool kid example for the next psycho when, as you slowly die because the rope around your neck is choking the life out of you, you're urinating and defecating all over yourself.
Sometimes vigilantes had a real purpose to serve.
11 kids killed each day cause parents gave the keys and said do not forget your cell phone !
should we blame the phones ? the parents ? the cars ?
so yeah a nut case killing kids at a single school is a horrid tragedy BUT it does happen every single day that 11 kids are killed yet not a peep
any needless death is tragic
and 2000 babies murdered by being ripped apart today nobody seems to care about those ?
175 opiod deaths today ? where is the outrage OH WAIT lets make it legal and easier to get ? where is the logic there compared to weapons
and yes drugs like guns save more lives than they take
but when I hear the idiocy I just spout back all the other deaths that happen and ask why are they not doing something about these that are far worse
over 15% of deaths in the US are tied to obesity yet I wont blame McDonalds or other fast food crap but its far worse killer than any weapon and yet energy drink garbage is consumed in mass along with other junk food ?
so around 1500-2000 deaths a day in our country they say are tied to obesity ? problem is its the root cause of so many things
but prescription drug abuse is a far worse thing we are facing these days
Roper v. Simmons (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roper_v._Simmons) says crimes committed by minors aren't eligible for the death penalty.
EDIT: I stand corrected, it wasn't O'Connor, it was Kennedy. He's always been a "swing" vote.
In the state of Texas 17 year olds are considered adults.
Doesn't matter dude. SCOTUS decreed as much.
Moose-Knuckle
05-18-18, 18:20
Doesn't matter dude. SCOTUS decreed as much.
He'll be tried as an adult here but even though activist judges made it to where he can't get a needle in Huntsville there is general population he has to survive.
One can hope.
He'll be tried as an adult here but even though activist judges made it to where he can't get a needle in Huntsville there is general population he has to survive.
One can hope.
Oh absolutely! As soon as I heard the age of the POS that SCOTUS decision was the first thing to pop into my mind. :mad:
titsonritz
05-18-18, 18:36
Roper v. Simmons (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roper_v._Simmons) says crimes committed by minors aren't eligible for the death penalty.
Can't believe I didn't know that. Kind of makes me wonder if it bears any responsibility for an increase in teen murderers.
Can't believe I didn't know that. Kind of makes me wonder if it bears any responsibility for an increase in teen murderers.
I remember hearing about the decision on the radio back then. I recall thinking "WTF? There are PLENTY of deserving scumbags who were not 18 yet". All of their death sentences were negated.
Can't believe I didn't know that. Kind of makes me wonder if it bears any responsibility for an increase in teen murderers.
Doubtful. The Death penalty isn't really a deterrent to crime at all. So it not being able to be applied to minors wouldn't have any real impact.
Doubtful. The Death penalty isn't really a deterrent to crime at all. So it not being able to be applied to minors wouldn't have any real impact.
I believe that. They have no value of life; so that concept is moot. I wish though.
Deterrence would be nice if it actually happened, but I am content with retribution for their acts. Payback.
Moose-Knuckle
05-18-18, 19:11
The Death penalty isn't really a deterrent to crime at all.
It was never meant to be a deterrent.
It is punishment for one's actions that warrant such a thing and to prevent said person from ever hurting anyone else again.
wetidlerjr
05-18-18, 19:22
Deterrence would be nice if it actually happened, but I am content with retribution for their acts. Payback.
Exactly! I care less whether or not the death penalty deters anyone, Sentences (death or otherwise) should be punishments, first and foremost. Any deterrence from a sentence is just icing on the cake.
It was never meant to be a deterrent.
It is punishment for one's actions that warrant such a thing and to prevent said person from ever hurting anyone else again.
Well put.
Maybe my "retribution" comment was over-the-top? Nah...... :)
It worked pretty well up in Montana in the 1860s when things got out of hand. 3-7-77.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Montana_Vigilantes
I just can't understand what is going on in a kids mind that they think shooting up a school is a good idea
Not just shooting up a school, but cold blooded murder. Reports of shooting students in the head after wounding them. That is pure evil and nothing less. That is not human, it is subhuman. When moral absolutes are abandoned and the “self” promoted, monsters are created.
CleverNickname
05-18-18, 20:25
In the state of Texas 17 year olds are considered adults.
That doesn't matter. The feds say 18. If you read the link, literally the first sentence says "Roper v. Simmons, 543 U.S. 551 (2005), was a landmark decision in which the Supreme Court of the United States held that it is unconstitutional to impose capital punishment for crimes committed while under the age of 18."
He'll be tried as an adult here but even though activist judges made it to where he can't get a needle in Huntsville there is general population he has to survive.
One can hope.
While the death penalty appears to be richly deserved in this case, extra-judicial punishments aren't really something that should be desired.
While the death penalty appears to be richly deserved in this case, extra-judicial punishments aren't really something that should be desired.
I really don't care. Hopefully he will soon get what he deserves on this earth, just a facilitation to a quick meeting with his Maker.
Not just shooting up a school, but cold blooded murder. Reports of shooting students in the head after wounding them. That is pure evil and nothing less. That is not human, it is subhuman. When moral absolutes are abandoned and the “self” promoted, monsters are created.
A fallen man given over to depravity.
A fallen man given over to depravity.
We're well on our way.
Here is what the US Counter Intelligence Corps and the MP's use to do to 14 year old German Spies.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Et9TRcysAIw
titsonritz
05-19-18, 00:05
Here is what the US Counter Intelligence Corps and the MP's use to do to 14 year old German Spies.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Et9TRcysAIw
That's some off-the-wall shit to post. How do you equate the execution of a wartime spy to a high school mass murderer?
Moose-Knuckle
05-19-18, 01:50
While the death penalty appears to be richly deserved in this case, extra-judicial punishments aren't really something that should be desired.
In the Eastern philosophies it's called Karma.
The very worse punishment our society can muster up is a minuscule prick from a needle then nighty-night time. If we could all be so lucky.
This 02 thief will escape a lethal injection but he might have a train ran on him family style via his HIV positive roommates night after night. Some things are worse than death.
That's some off-the-wall shit to post. How do you equate the execution of a wartime spy to a high school mass murderer?
Perhaps he's saying that we use to do what was needed to be done and didn't let people hide from their actions behind their age.
I saw nothing wrong in that vid, an enemy spy caught in the act of spying on Allied troop positions was given a cigarette (American tobacco no less), last rights with a priest, and shot expertly in the heart. Way better treatment than what Allied spies received when caught.
Averageman
05-19-18, 07:00
We've tried many ways to stop school shootings, we've even had the removal of all guns put in the table as a solution.
At this point we have a guilty party caught red handed doing murder.
We can go the traditional route that we have continued to use for decades and we can also expect the same results.
I'm about ready to forego his "rights" in order to obtain a severe type of justice that may get different results for the future.
Ten murders and a head shot to one of the wounded ?
No, it's about time to get all medieval on this one.
I'm about ready to forego his "rights"............
Slippery slope - which right do we forego next?
Slippery slope - which right do we forego next?Exactly. They can just as easily can forego our rights to prevent the next one.
However, forgoing his rights won't stop anything or anyone in the future. Throughout history there have a much worse punishment even for minor crimes and people still committed them
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I'm about ready to forego his "rights" in order to obtain a severe type of justice that may get different results for the future.
How is that different than “the government” foregoing your rights in order to achieve the end result that they think is best for the future?
Exactly. They can just as easily can forego our rights to prevent the next one.
However, forgoing his rights won't stop anything or anyone in the future. Throughout history there have a much worse punishment even for minor crimes and people still committed them
Uh, that is exactly what they'd like to do. If given a choice of running roughshod on MY rights for something I had nothing to do with, or forfeiting HIS (the guilty party), the choice would be a no-brainer. Of course we won't be given a choice, but we can always hope.
How is that different than “the government” foregoing your rights in order to achieve the end result that they think is best for the future?
That is their plan Hmac. I think Averageman was just lamenting that if someone's rights had to be infringed upon it sure shouldn't be ours.
Averageman
05-19-18, 09:52
Give him a trial. He was caught red handed.
How long should that take?
I'm pretty sure you could find a dozen adults on that parking lot yesterday who are qualified.
Get it done execute him on the spot.
Giving him life in prison for multiple murders isn't stopping this. Taking years to make the system move at a snails pace isn't working
If the system requires him to be tried and retried a half dozen times, what is justice?
There is no doubt that he is guilty of this crime.
"What is justice?"
Pretty damn uppity of you to ask a question like that, peasant.
There is no doubt that he is innocent.
?? I would have agreed if you had said either guilty, or not innocent.
Averageman
05-19-18, 11:17
?? I would have agreed if you had said either guilty, or not innocent.
Not how I meant it, fixed now.
The point I'm trying to make is that we ether have a legal system, or a justice system. One seems to perpetuate legal actions, the other applies penalties for criminal acts.
These guys crimes are copy catted again and again and at what cost in lives and freedoms?
We do the same things over and over and are surprised when we get the same results?
Perhaps he's saying that we use to do what was needed to be done and didn't let people hide from their actions behind their age.
I saw nothing wrong in that vid, an enemy spy caught in the act of spying on Allied troop positions was given a cigarette (American tobacco no less), last rights with a priest, and shot expertly in the heart. Way better treatment than what Allied spies received when caught.
Your exactly right!!
However, our justice system as well as the justice process needs to always be protected. This 17 year old should be given a lawyer if he cant afford one, be sent straight to court with the evidence that has been obtained so far which is enough to put him on the stand. If convicted or capital murder or conspiracy to commit capital murder for 1 count or all 10 counts, he should walk out of the court room following his conviction to his execution where he will be offered a priest, cigarette and option to give last words. The quicker it happens, the quicker we can get over this and move on. It will also help the grieving process.
Averageman
05-19-18, 12:32
Your exactly right!!
However, our justice system as well as the justice process needs to always be protected. This 17 year old should be given a lawyer if he cant afford one, be sent straight to court with the evidence that has been obtained so far which is enough to put him on the stand. If convicted or capital murder or conspiracy to commit capital murder for 1 count or all 10 counts, he should walk out of the court room following his conviction to his execution where he will be offered a priest, cigarette and option to give last words. The quicker it happens, the quicker we can get over this and move on. It will also help the grieving process.
This.
FromMyColdDeadHand
05-19-18, 12:34
How is that different than “the government” foregoing your rights in order to achieve the end result that they think is best for the future?
Exactly. Right now they are saying there were no warning signs, but you don’t go into a school and shotgun people, and supposedly skip some, and not have some kind of flag flying.
Retribution doesn’t solve anything, and if we are looking to de-incentivize people from doing this, taking away the fame motive would be more powerful than anything.
Exactly. Right now they are saying there were no warning signs, but you don’t go into a school and shotgun people, and supposedly skip some, and not have some kind of flag flying.
Retribution doesn’t solve anything, and if we are looking to de-incentivize people from doing this, taking away the fame motive would be more powerful than anything.
Whatever. Sure makes ya feel good though! Yeah, really it does.
Averageman
05-19-18, 12:59
How do we know it doesn't solve anything?
So far all we have achieved is giving these guys a kind of infamy that seems to grow the next shooter.
It would seem the rights of the guilty, even in cases like this are more important than yours.
I'm not sure that the humiliation and degredation of public execution might be impressive enough to put a stop to this.
FromMyColdDeadHand
05-19-18, 13:08
Anything more on the second person of interest? Was it just another unrelated kid at school with a weapon or something? Someone bringing a pressure cooker to school for Home Ec?
Anything more on the second person of interest? Was it just another unrelated kid at school with a weapon or something? Someone bringing a pressure cooker to school for Home Ec?
Was wondering the same thing and have heard no explanation.
That is their plan Hmac. I think Averageman was just lamenting that if someone's rights had to be infringed upon it sure shouldn't be ours.
Of course it is. It's the natural history of all governments since the beginning of governments. My point is that no one's rights should be infringed, including those of this latest example of sub-humanity.
Averageman
05-19-18, 14:58
Let's face it; because of his age most of us here will likely pass before he does.
There will be trials and more trials.
When he's in his sixties someone will move to have him released because we are humane after all.
He will live and grow old and likely enjoy some small parts of his life.
I'm sorry, that's not justice.
Let's face it; because of his age most of us here will likely pass before he does.
There will be trials and more trials.
When he's in his sixties someone will move to have him released because we are humane after all.
He will live and grow old and likely enjoy some small parts of his life.
I'm sorry, that's not justice.Meanwhile having good AND free medical care.
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Meanwhile having good AND free medical care.
And, most important of all, LOVIN'! Lots and lots of LOVIN' over the ensuing decades.
POS :mad:
It's hard to be a super villain when your dragged by your hair to a lamp post screaming.
It's even more difficult to be a cool kid example for the next psycho when, as you slowly die because the rope around your neck is choking the life out of you, you're urinating and defecating all over yourself.
Sometimes vigilantes had a real purpose to serve.
Your exactly right!!
However, our justice system as well as the justice process needs to always be protected. This 17 year old should be given a lawyer if he cant afford one, be sent straight to court with the evidence that has been obtained so far which is enough to put him on the stand. If convicted or capital murder or conspiracy to commit capital murder for 1 count or all 10 counts, he should walk out of the court room following his conviction to his execution where he will be offered a priest, cigarette and option to give last words. The quicker it happens, the quicker we can get over this and move on. It will also help the grieving process.
This. So much this. The whole world should see this PODS last breath as he's twitching and jerking, and know that is what happens when you're convicted of murder in these here United States. Nothing would please me more than waking up in the morning to find out that this PODS died a horrible death at the hands of his cell mates.
Then again, something like this would much more fitting...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_PUE8fYxjq8&t=7s
How do we know it doesn't solve anything?
So far all we have achieved is giving these guys a kind of infamy that seems to grow the next shooter.
You mean like this?
52068
Moose-Knuckle
05-20-18, 03:28
You mean like this?
52068
LOL, that is exactly what I was going to post in response to post #101.
He had a commie pin on his lapel, eventually someone in the fourth estate will hero worship him.
This. So much this. The whole world should see this PODS last breath as he's twitching and jerking, and know that is what happens when you're convicted of murder in these here United States. Nothing would please me more than waking up in the morning to find out that this PODS died a horrible death at the hands of his cell mates.
Then again, something like this would much more fitting...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_PUE8fYxjq8&t=7s
That's all fine and well, but the reality of the situation is this..He'll no doubt be found guilty, and very possibly be given the death sentence. But even then he'll likely spend the next decade (or more) on death row playing video games.. the public's memory of what happened will be long gone.. In cases like this, the wheels of justice grind too slowly..
That's all fine and well, but the reality of the situation is this..He'll no doubt be found guilty, and very possibly be given the death sentence. But even then he'll likely spend the next decade (or more) on death row playing video games.. the public's memory of what happened will be long gone.. In cases like this, the wheels of justice grind too slowly..
Texas shooting suspect won’t face death penalty, could be paroled
Nick Penzenstadler, USA TODAYPublished 10:18 p.m. ET May 19, 2018 | Updated 10:20 p.m. ET May 19, 2018
But the 2005 high court ruling that bans execution of criminals younger than 18 and a 2012 ruling about juveniles facing life in prison mean that Pagourtzis could be up for parole after 40 years.
“The courts ruled based on the idea that those 17 and younger don’t have the cognitive development to appreciate right from wrong,” said Michael Radelet, a University of Colorado at Boulder sociology professor who has testified in more than 75 death-penalty cases. “Cases like this that are especially violent and an enigma make some people think they are more deserving of death, but the ruling is about the development of the juvenile brain.”
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2018/05/19/texas-shooter-no-death-penalty/626609002/
Texas shooting suspect won’t face death penalty, could be paroled
Nick Penzenstadler, USA TODAYPublished 10:18 p.m. ET May 19, 2018 | Updated 10:20 p.m. ET May 19, 2018
But the 2005 high court ruling that bans execution of criminals younger than 18 and a 2012 ruling about juveniles facing life in prison mean that Pagourtzis could be up for parole after 40 years.
“The courts ruled based on the idea that those 17 and younger don’t have the cognitive development to appreciate right from wrong,” said Michael Radelet, a University of Colorado at Boulder sociology professor who has testified in more than 75 death-penalty cases. “Cases like this that are especially violent and an enigma make some people think they are more deserving of death, but the ruling is about the development of the juvenile brain.”
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2018/05/19/texas-shooter-no-death-penalty/626609002/
That's just wonderful...What that article does do is in general, lay out to the next copy cat, or wannabe that they have to do their school shooting before they are 18, knowing that no matter what, they're never going to face a death sentence, and at the very most, life in prison after failing to make parole, or parole after 40 years or so. To some of these bastards, knowing this in advance, suddenly the juice becomes worth the squeeze..After all, if they play ball while in the pen, at some point there's a chance they'll get out, and be alive and well, the people they killed will still be dead, and for many of these killers, that will be enough, because in their mind, they "won".... I'm assuming this would also apply to young gang members..MS-13 is gonna love this...No wonder this country is a mess....
The law enforcement people need to make an announcement of the place and time of the murderer's release, and soon. Make sure it's in all social media, local tv and radio stations. The animal won't last long.
Texas shooting suspect won’t face death penalty, could be paroled
But the 2005 high court ruling that bans execution of criminals younger than 18 and a 2012 ruling about juveniles facing life in prison mean that Pagourtzis could be up for parole after 40 years.
“The courts ruled based on the idea that those 17 and younger don’t have the cognitive development to appreciate right from wrong,” said Michael Radelet, a University of Colorado at Boulder sociology professor who has testified in more than 75 death-penalty cases. “Cases like this that are especially violent and an enigma make some people think they are more deserving of death, but the ruling is about the development of the juvenile brain.”
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2018/05/19/texas-shooter-no-death-penalty/626609002/
Roper vs Simmons clearly states that anyone under the age of 18 is off limits to capital punishment because the court fount it unconstitutional. The decision overruled Stanford vs Kentucky which ruled that 16 was the minimum age. However, that was applicable to juvenile courts.
This will take place in a criminal court. As of December 31, 2004, 71 juveniles were on death row for juvenile crimes. These 71 condemned juveniles constituted about 2% of the total death row population of 3,487. Texas had by far the largest death row for juvenile offenders, holding 29 (40%) of the national total of 71 juvenile offenders.
I am 100% certain he will get the needle.
Roper vs Simmons clearly states that anyone under the age of 18 is off limits to capital punishment because the court fount it unconstitutional. The decision overruled Stanford vs Kentucky which ruled that 16 was the minimum age. However, that was applicable to juvenile courts.
This will take place in a criminal court. As of December 31, 2004, 71 juveniles were on death row for juvenile crimes. These 71 condemned juveniles constituted about 2% of the total death row population of 3,487. Texas had by far the largest death row for juvenile offenders, holding 29 (40%) of the national total of 71 juvenile offenders.
I am 100% certain he will get the needle.
I am confused by the 2 parts in bold. Are you saying that because he will tried as an adult he misses out on the protection of Roper vs Simmons?
https://www.fairsentencingofyouth.org/court-case/roper-v-simmons-2005/
Roper v. Simmons (2005)
"In the landmark decision in Roper v. Simmons, issued on March 1, 2005, the United States Supreme Court ruled 5-4 that it is unconstitutional to impose the death penalty for a crime committed by a child under the age of 18. The Court ruled that a death sentence imposed on a minor violates the Eighth and Fourteenth Amendments."
PatrioticDisorder
05-20-18, 13:29
What responsibility does everyone believe the father of the shooter has in this event? I know in my state of Florida there is a statue making it illegal to allow minors access (unsupervised) to a firearm. Albeit only a misdemeanor, but what about the kid that goes shooting up a school with the parents firearms that did not reasonably secure them, should they be facing serious charges? Are members of M4C OK with laws holding people accountable that do not secure their weapons reasonably?
Florida statue 790.174 (in case anyone wants to view the law).
Under Texas law, if a child under 17 years of age gains access to a readily dischargeable firearm (i.e., loaded with ammunition, whether or not a round is in the chamber), a person is criminally liable if he or she, “with criminal negligence:”
http://lawcenter.giffords.org/child-access-prevention-in-texas/
***************************************************
Note, it says under 17, which is not the case in this instance.
I would say none without knowing the details. Maybe the kid knew the safe combination! Maybe he knew where the keys were..... assuming it was secure. Maybe that was the father's nightstand gun?
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What responsibility does everyone believe the father of the shooter has in this event? I know in my state of Florida there is a statue making it illegal to allow minors access (unsupervised) to a firearm. Albeit only a misdemeanor, but what about the kid that goes shooting up a school with the parents firearms that did not reasonably secure them, should they be facing serious charges? Are members of M4C OK with laws holding people accountable that do not secure their weapons reasonably?
Florida statue 790.174 (in case anyone wants to view the law). I am completely o.k. with parents not securing firearms and ammunition. Within minutes my kid (he's now 21) had access to over 5 vehicles, 4 pieces of heavy equipment, 500 gallons of diesel, 500 gallons of unleaded, 100 gallons of propane, and countless tools that could be used as weapons. Firearms safety was just a small segment of the safety training my kid received growing up. I have tools in my shop that could easily gain entrance into my gun safes if he had gone nuts and decided to shoot up the world.
My kid was also pretty damn smart. When he was 16 he broke into my cheap Sentry gun safe to prove how crappy it was.
I guess my point is that somebody sick enough to shoot up a school is likely to find the ability to gain access to weapons regardless how well they are secured by their parents'.
I am completely o.k. with parents not securing firearms and ammunition. Within minutes my kid (he's now 21) had access to over 5 vehicles, 4 pieces of heavy equipment, 500 gallons of diesel, 500 gallons of unleaded, 100 gallons of propane, and countless tools that could be used as weapons. Firearms safety was just a small segment of the safety training my kid received growing up. I have tools in my shop that could easily gain entrance into my gun safes if he had gone nuts and decided to shoot up the world.
My kid was also pretty damn smart. When he was 16 he broke into my cheap Sentry gun safe to prove how crappy it was.
I guess my point is that somebody sick enough to shoot up a school is likely to find the ability to gain access to weapons regardless how well they are secured by their parents'.I'm guessing the point is that an attempt was made to secure the guns. Kinda like we lock our doors but anyone can kick it in
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I'm guessing the point is that an attempt was made to secure the guns. Kinda like we lock our doors but anyone can kick it in
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Exactly..If I remember correctly, the Sandy Hook shooter also used his mothers gun(s) mom tried to secure the guns in a gun safe, trouble was, tard-boy knew the combo, and the first thing he did with them, was to shoot her in the back of the head 4 times while she was sleeping..
I am confused by the 2 parts in bold. Are you saying that because he will tried as an adult he misses out on the protection of Roper vs Simmons?
https://www.fairsentencingofyouth.org/court-case/roper-v-simmons-2005/
Roper v. Simmons (2005)
"In the landmark decision in Roper v. Simmons, issued on March 1, 2005, the United States Supreme Court ruled 5-4 that it is unconstitutional to impose the death penalty for a crime committed by a child under the age of 18. The Court ruled that a death sentence imposed on a minor violates the Eighth and Fourteenth Amendments."
The death sentence for a minor does violate the 8th and 14th amendments, but ONLY in juvenile court! The Texas shooter will be tried in Criminal court. In this case, the shooter killed 8 children and 2 teachers and wounded another 13 including a police officer in a mass shooting spree that was pre meditated, planned and conspired in both a written and online journal.
This isn't about spur of the moment bad decision making or weather or not the shooter had the capacity to think rational or logical for a brief second. This is about a 17 year who kept a diary about his intentions and took loaded firearms as well as improvised explosives to his school for the sole purpose of killing fellow classmates.
The defense will argue age but I doubt the court will allow him being 17 as a "get out of lethal injection free card".
That doesn't mean he will be sentenced to death, he could get life in prison, but most certainly, they will try hard for the death penalty. Dylann Roof killed 9 people and got the death penalty, James Holmes killed 12 and got 12 life sentences and an additional 3,318 years. I know both these examples are of men who are above the age of 18 but it does show that in each case, the prosecutors were going for the death penalty and some get it and some don't. But Texas is Texas.
The defense will argue age but I doubt the court will allow him being 17 as a "get out of lethal injection free card".
Good!
LMT Shooter
05-20-18, 16:18
While I feel that we gun owners ought to properly secure our firearms, I strongly believe that no one should be held criminally liable for misuse by others of our lawfully owned property. Laws penalizing gun owners for that kind of thing would be an open door for a gun owner to be charged criminally after their home is burglarized. How could a law reasonably proscribe the manner in which firearms be secured?
It isn't any of my business how anyone else secures, or fails to secure, their firearms. It ain't the government's, either.
on the secure guns ? well maybe they should be making all adults have a secure medicine cabinet instead and any adult with any kinda scrip of abused substances on a watch list and mandatory checks of them and the kids ! you know common sense accountability
(yes sarcasm)
but the truth is this is much larger a issue then guns
The death sentence for a minor does violate the 8th and 14th amendments, but ONLY in juvenile court! The Texas shooter will be tried in Criminal court. In this case, the shooter killed 8 children and 2 teachers and wounded another 13 including a police officer in a mass shooting spree that was pre meditated, planned and conspired in both a written and online journal.
This isn't about spur of the moment bad decision making or weather or not the shooter had the capacity to think rational or logical for a brief second. This is about a 17 year who kept a diary about his intentions and took loaded firearms as well as improvised explosives to his school for the sole purpose of killing fellow classmates.
The defense will argue age but I doubt the court will allow him being 17 as a "get out of lethal injection free card".
That doesn't mean he will be sentenced to death, he could get life in prison, but most certainly, they will try hard for the death penalty. Dylann Roof killed 9 people and got the death penalty, James Holmes killed 12 and got 12 life sentences and an additional 3,318 years. I know both these examples are of men who are above the age of 18 but it does show that in each case, the prosecutors were going for the death penalty and some get it and some don't. But Texas is Texas.
What part of that SCOTUS decision aren't you understanding? (not that I agree with it)
FromMyColdDeadHand
05-20-18, 19:13
The liability is first a step towards making people have insurance for firearms ownership, then they will attack the insurance companies for writing it. It also is a way to try to get the liability for sellers and manufacturers back on the table.
This one will go out of the headlines fast. No AR = no coverage.
What part of that SCOTUS decision aren't you understanding? (not that I agree with it)
The SCOTUS decision ONLY applies to JUVENILE COURT! The Texas Shooter will be tried in CRIMINAL COURT even though he is under the age of 18! The Juvenile court system and the Criminal court system are NOT the same.
The difference is:
Juveniles are prosecuted for delinquent acts rather than crimes (unless it is a serious offense and the minor will be tried as an adult).
Juveniles don’t have a right to a public trial by jury. Rather, a judge hears the evidence in an adjudication hearing and rules on whether the juvenile committed a delinquent act. I assure you, this will be a public trial with a jury.
If the juvenile is found to be delinquent, appropriate action in the form of rehabilitation will be taken. In the adult criminal system, action is taken that is intended to punish the defendant.
Juvenile courts are more informal than the adult court system, and may have more lenient rules regarding courtroom procedure.
The SCOTUS decision ONLY applies to JUVENILE COURT! The Texas Shooter will be tried in CRIMINAL COURT even though he is under the age of 18.
Christopher Simmons, the defendant in that SCOTUS decision, was tried as an adult (in criminal court, not juvenile court). Texas can charge him and try him however they want but since he’s 17 at the time of the crime he can’t be executed (just like Simmons). And according to Texas law, he’ll be eligible for parole at age 67.
Always interesting to see a brilliant legal mind at work, but I think you’re wrong, counselor. The issue is the defendant’s age.
While I feel that we gun owners ought to properly secure our firearms, I strongly believe that no one should be held criminally liable for misuse by others of our lawfully owned property. Laws penalizing gun owners for that kind of thing would be an open door for a gun owner to be charged criminally after their home is burglarized. How could a law reasonably proscribe the manner in which firearms be secured?
It isn't any of my business how anyone else secures, or fails to secure, their firearms. It ain't the government's, either.
Yep. It's like training being a requirement to own a gun. Good idea, yes....mandatory...no. Ranks right up there with aptitude tests to vote. Sounds good, but you'd soon find yourself in the "can't vote" group no matter how smart you actually are.
FromMyColdDeadHand
05-21-18, 02:54
So we get the Parkland shooter, the NJ shooter recently that everyone forgot and now this guy all seem to be kids that couldn't handle the harsh realities of high school- I'm being a bit facetious there; I know it can be psychologically tough on teenagers, but is is small potatoes compared to adult life. I thought all these no-score, participation trophy, everyone is a winner psycho BS was supposed to make kids feel better about themselves. Looks like it isn't helping. These kids now are the ones that have been fully raised in the new manner and they are whacking each other way more than any other generation. No ever seems to talk about that failure mode when it comes to these outbursts.
The SCOTUS decision ONLY applies to JUVENILE COURT! The Texas Shooter will be tried in CRIMINAL COURT even though he is under the age of 18! The Juvenile court system and the Criminal court system are NOT the same.
The difference is:
Juveniles are prosecuted for delinquent acts rather than crimes (unless it is a serious offense and the minor will be tried as an adult).
Juveniles don’t have a right to a public trial by jury. Rather, a judge hears the evidence in an adjudication hearing and rules on whether the juvenile committed a delinquent act. I assure you, this will be a public trial with a jury.
If the juvenile is found to be delinquent, appropriate action in the form of rehabilitation will be taken. In the adult criminal system, action is taken that is intended to punish the defendant.
Juvenile courts are more informal than the adult court system, and may have more lenient rules regarding courtroom procedure.
No, it doesn't.
HE CANNOT BE EXECUTED NO MATTER WHAT TEXAS WANTS.
Christopher Simmons, the defendant in that SCOTUS decision, was tried as an adult (in criminal court, not juvenile court). Texas can charge him and try him however they want but since he’s 17 at the time of the crime he can’t be executed (just like Simmons). And according to Texas law, he’ll be eligible for parole at age 67.
Always interesting to see a brilliant legal mind at work, but I think you’re wrong, counselor. The issue is the defendant’s age.
Yes, this is what it boils down to.
So we get the Parkland shooter, the NJ shooter recently that everyone forgot and now this guy all seem to be kids that couldn't handle the harsh realities of high school- I'm being a bit facetious there; I know it can be psychologically tough on teenagers, but is is small potatoes compared to adult life. I thought all these no-score, participation trophy, everyone is a winner psycho BS was supposed to make kids feel better about themselves. Looks like it isn't helping. These kids now are the ones that have been fully raised in the new manner and they are whacking each other way more than any other generation. No ever seems to talk about that failure mode when it comes to these outbursts.
This is the part that drives me mad. The folks making the most noise about this publicly appear to be completely unconcerned that we are rearing adolescents that are filled with rage, have no regard for human life or common decency and can't cope with the trials of day to day life. I'm sure if I empty my gun safe and destroy everything in there it will cure all of those concerns right?
FromMyColdDeadHand
05-21-18, 07:31
Oh, crap...
But it's unclear whether all the victims were shot by the suspect, or whether some were shot by deputies during the crossfire. Trochesset said authorities are waiting for the medical examiner's autopsies to make that determination.
https://www.cnn.com/2018/05/21/us/texas-santa-fe-school-shooting/index.html
25 minute shoot out with the kid? When he has a shotgun? That pegs the odd meter.
Kudos to the Lt. Gov Dan Patrick for sticking to not his guns. Change the narrative. If the other side wants to talk about nothing but guns, we can not talk about guns- it is just as rational.
I see he was yelling "Wooo hooo" as he was shooting- not your normal zorked out mass shooter, but it was Texas. All this over a girl who dissed him? When it seems like the blond girl in the CNN video that says he was sweet and funny probably would have gone out with him? Crazy is crazy, that's why its crazy- it doesn't make sense.
Moose-Knuckle
05-21-18, 13:35
Oh, crap...
https://www.cnn.com/2018/05/21/us/texas-santa-fe-school-shooting/index.html
25 minute shoot out with the kid? When he has a shotgun? That pegs the odd meter.
Kudos to the Lt. Gov Dan Patrick for sticking to not his guns. Change the narrative. If the other side wants to talk about nothing but guns, we can not talk about guns- it is just as rational.
I see he was yelling "Wooo hooo" as he was shooting- not your normal zorked out mass shooter, but it was Texas. All this over a girl who dissed him? When it seems like the blond girl in the CNN video that says he was sweet and funny probably would have gone out with him? Crazy is crazy, that's why its crazy- it doesn't make sense.
I miss the good old days back when a weak simpleton would blow their own brains out when rejected by a girl rather than gun down as many of his fellow students as he can.
titsonritz
05-21-18, 13:45
According to his attorneys, he's "having a hard time". Poor baby.
According to his attorneys, he's "having a hard time". Poor baby.Say it ain't so!
Should have eaten that bullet. Maybe he can figure out how to make a rope out of bed sheets
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Moose-Knuckle
05-21-18, 14:34
According to his attorneys, he's "having a hard time". Poor baby.
He has no idea how hard of time he is going to have once his virgin mangina is in TDC.
Thought you guys would appreciate...one of our member's son on TBH got shot. JJ was kind enough to make a visit to the hospital. I also heard he assisted with funeral costs for the victims.
http://discussions.texasbowhunter.com/forums/showthread.php?t=692942
I'm getting sappy in my old age & puts a lump in my throat to see kindness pour it's way in & help dilute some of the stench of so much evil.
Moose-Knuckle
05-21-18, 17:24
Thought you guys would appreciate...one of our member's son on TBH got shot. JJ was kind enough to make a visit to the hospital. I also heard he assisted with funeral costs for the victims.
http://discussions.texasbowhunter.com/forums/showthread.php?t=692942
I'm getting sappy in my old age & puts a lump in my throat to see kindness pour it's way in & help dilute some of the tench of so much evil.
Such events have a way of bringing out the best and worse of people.
Thought you guys would appreciate...one of our member's son on TBH got shot. JJ was kind enough to make a visit to the hospital. I also heard he assisted with funeral costs for the victims.
http://discussions.texasbowhunter.com/forums/showthread.php?t=692942
I'm getting sappy in my old age & puts a lump in my throat to see kindness pour it's way in & help dilute some of the stench of so much evil.
Kindness can never erase such evil, but it can greatly help take the sharp edges off it, and kindness does accumulate.
LMT Shooter
05-21-18, 17:49
I saw JJ doing pregame stuff on TV once. He was going around the field, passing the ball back & forth with kids in the stands. They said he does this every game. By all accounts, the gentleman has class.
platoonDaddy
05-21-18, 20:02
We had some stupid seniors, who are lucky they weren't friggin shot with their prank!
Dumb asses!
Masked seniors rushed into school with water guns and firecrackers.
May 21, 2018 09:58 AM
Three days before 10 people died in a school shooting in Santa Fe, Texas. a small group of students at Bowie High School in Maryland pulled a senior prank that the local police chief called "reckless."
They wore black masks covering their faces. Some wore dark clothing.
School was already in session when the band of students rushed into Bowie High School in Maryland armed with water guns and fireworks in a stunt that simulated a school shooting.
The pranksters sprayed students and staff with the squirt guns and set off fireworks in the hallway, the school's principal, Robynne W. Prince, wrote in a letter to parents after the incident.
http://www.kansascity.com/news/nation-world/national/article211575619.html
FromMyColdDeadHand
05-22-18, 02:53
Any word on the 2nd person of interest?
Saw some stuff on Jordan Peterson and thought about this kid down in Texas and all the other young male shooters and the new PoundMeToo and Heroine-over-hero in modern storytelling (movies).
So we had stories where the man was the hero who had to face adversity with character and bravery. The feminists took this to mean that women weren't heroes- so they started to push up female heroes. Not a bad thing. Outside of war, women face about as many opportunities to be a hero as men. Not a bad thing to stress that women can be heroes.
Then they jumped the shark. It went from hero, to hero-heroine, to heroine-dolt. Look at Star Wars ANH and the The Last Jedi. In trying to build-up the heroine, they decided in a zero-sum way that the hero must be diminished to make room for the heroine.
The problem is that when we had stories with hero or hero-heroine, the emphasis on the hero rising to the task isn't about that the heroine is inferior- it has nothing to do with the heroine at all. It is all about signaling to men (really boys) that when crap hits the fan, you'd better step up and do the right thing- damn your fear, the danger or the cost.
The heroine-dolt model now (women need men like fish need a bicycle) takes that pressure and signaling off of men/boys to step up and put others before themselves- in fact it even goes the opposite way and saying that men really can't do anything right (lazy, stupid, corrupt).
So back to the shooters- is it any surprise that young men seem to be more likely to act out in selfish and self-centered ways- against the society that holds them in such low regard? Heap on the overall lack of respect for life, others, and society in general and you have created amoral, narcissistic monsters.
Then you wonder why they shoot up schools. They hate society because they are told that society hates them. It only takes 1 in 10,000,000 to take this too far.
Not saying we can't have heroines in movies, far from it- but ultra-violent movies that stress the lack of responsibility, value, and importance of young men is a serious problem.
Probably at least once a month I point out to my son where he could have stepped up- not big things usually. From helping some one to as simple as holding a door and being aware. I travel 20+ times a year and every time since my son was 3 years old I tell him "Take care of your mom and your sister until I come back". ( I also whisper that in my daughter's ear too by the way- she is actually more hard core than her older brother). If I had a dollar for every time another parent told me a story about how my son did the right thing, that KAC rifle still wouldn't be paid for, but it would help.
Every time my son gets wobbly on something, I just tell him in shorthand "Be the man". To many people today, that is a toxic statement. But look at the toxic society we have and I wonder who the real problem is.
ETA:
I was looking for synonyms for "hero" and here is what thesaurus.com gave me:
Synonyms for hero
noun submarine sandwich
grinder
hoagie
sub
submarine
torpedo
We are soooo screwed.
Moose-Knuckle
05-22-18, 03:42
Any word on the 2nd person of interest?
Oh I wouldn't worry about that, just like the guy in camo running in the woods near Sandy Hook. Just a hunter folks, just a hunter.
Saw some stuff on Jordan Peterson and thought about this kid down in Texas and all the other young male shooters and the new PoundMeToo and Heroine-over-hero in modern storytelling (movies).
So we had stories where the man was the hero who had to face adversity with character and bravery. The feminists took this to mean that women weren't heroes- so they started to push up female heroes. Not a bad thing. Outside of war, women face about as many opportunities to be a hero as men. Not a bad thing to stress that women can be heroes.
Then they jumped the shark. It went from hero, to hero-heroine, to heroine-dolt. Look at Star Wars ANH and the The Last Jedi. In trying to build-up the heroine, they decided in a zero-sum way that the hero must be diminished to make room for the heroine.
The problem is that when we had stories with hero or hero-heroine, the emphasis on the hero rising to the task isn't about that the heroine is inferior- it has nothing to do with the heroine at all. It is all about signaling to men (really boys) that when crap hits the fan, you'd better step up and do the right thing- damn your fear, the danger or the cost.
The heroine-dolt model now (women need men like fish need a bicycle) takes that pressure and signaling off of men/boys to step up and put others before themselves- in fact it even goes the opposite way and saying that men really can't do anything right (lazy, stupid, corrupt).
I have this "friend" on social media who is a third-wave feminist stay at home mom while her white husband goes to work everyday. She has three kids, one son. Every time one of these events happen she SJW's her keyboard about why white males do this and how we should be raising them differently. Then I point out to her ALL of the anti-white male bullshit she has posted publicly for the last x amount of months and tell her she should start there. Then I ask her why so many white women murder their own children....
Will we ever find out if the killers are doped up on SSRIs?
Will we ever find out if the killers are doped up on SSRIs?
You will hear about it if they weren't, but won't hear about it if they were.
Such is the state of the union these days.
FromMyColdDeadHand
05-24-18, 10:08
Hear about what?
This is already gone.
Wrong guns, wrong kids, wrong motive.
Hear about what?
This is already gone.
Wrong guns, wrong kids, wrong motive.
Amen, brotha.
It took a whole week and some plubbed up legislations to get knocked down for everyone to forget.
Hell, Parkland had a neo-army of kids going before people were cold.
I guess they had a harder time in Texas when the MO didn't fit.
platoonDaddy
05-24-18, 10:18
Hear about what?
This is already gone.
Wrong guns, wrong kids, wrong motive.
Amen, brotha.
It took a whole week and some plubbed up legislations to get knocked down for everyone to forget.
Hell, Parkland had a neo-army of kids going before people were cold.
I guess they had a harder time in Texas when the MO didn't fit.
At the range this am, we had the same discussion. It doesn't fit their agenda (of the evil black weapon) therefore they moved back to Russia or whatever.
Will we ever find out if the killers are doped up on SSRIs?
Don’t pay attention to the man behind the curtain. Keep looking at the big shiny thing on the big screen.
Texas AG: Gun control won't work
"After so many tragedies, we should consider everything to protect schools, not waste our time with futile and unconstitutional new gun control. The Santa Fe shooter, who had also built operational bombs, was apparently ready to kill using any means necessary, with guns or without.
"Moreover, not even the most avid mainstream gun-control proponents have proposed banning the guns he used: a shotgun and a revolver. Whatever one thinks of the Second Amendment, even repealing it wouldn’t erase the roughly 300 million guns already in the country — it would simply disarm the law-abiding. In other words, nothing of practical use — only cheap political points — can come from muddying the waters with more gun control propaganda."
More at: https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2018/05/24/santa-fe-parkland-school-shootings-terrorism-gun-control-ken-paxton-column/637216002/
*********************************************
He has my vote! AN4
Moose-Knuckle
05-24-18, 12:16
I was going to post in this thread about how this one has already been swept on the rug.
Didn't fit the narrative so it's as if it never happened.
FromMyColdDeadHand
05-24-18, 13:00
When you look at this event and Las Vegas, the oddity of Parkland increases in contrast. Not saying that in a conspiracy way, since there are so many problems with the Parkland shooting with the discipline and law enforcement failures, but the booming echo from that event resonates - like a rouge wave.
With all the irons the man has in the fire, Trump made time to visit Clay...post 299. Dad is sorta vague so far, but I highly suspect the 'opinions shared' were pro-gun related.
Just a little more good all the way around right here from something so horrible...it makes me smile.
http://discussions.texasbowhunter.com/forums/showthread.php?t=692942&page=6
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