View Full Version : Do you consider night sights essential on a carry gun?
thegreyman
07-15-18, 16:59
Do you consider night sights a necessity on a carry gun?
reloader550
07-15-18, 17:01
Yes, all of my carry guns have Trijicon HD sights installed on them.
SamuelBLong
07-15-18, 17:26
No they’re not a necessity, because you should be carrying a handheld light, which will either illuminate or backlight your sight picture and target.
What is more important is a set of sights that zero properly on your gun with your chosen carry / duty ammo, and that they work for your eyes and level of acceptable accuracy / purpose.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
donlapalma
07-15-18, 17:29
Considering that all my carry guns have night sights I suppose my answer is "yes."
Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
In truth no, but all my handguns have them.
In my own limited testing, if you could identify a target, you could at least make out the silhouette of your gun and get on target. But they can help be more precise in lowlight.
Sent from my SM-S327VL using Tapatalk
With increasing age comes an increasing reluctance to use a weapon light in many situations - the proverbial bullet magnet effect. Night sights on all my weapons. YMMV
john
No they’re not a necessity, because you should be carrying a handheld light, which will either illuminate or backlight your sight picture and target.
What is more important is a set of sights that zero properly on your gun with your chosen carry / duty ammo, and that they work for your eyes and level of acceptable accuracy / purpose.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I don't imagine if I ever have to draw my pistol in the dark I'll have time to first draw my handheld light that I may see.
Mine all have NS so I cant say otherwise. But with a flashlight , if you have it will work. But why chance it. They are cheap and everywhere.
PB
I think when they came out we all had to have them. Most of my defensive handguns have them but I think now we have lights and I also think that 25 years ago we were training to be able to hit the target and the main focus now is identifying the target. If there's enough light to ID the target there's enough to hit the same. Now somebody will come along and act as if I said we didn't used to have to ID the targets.........I just think that most training now emphasizes it more than it used to whether it be law enforcement or CCW. So, the answer is that they're probably not always needed but I still prefer them.
All of my carry handguns have them. And they all will always have them.
SamuelBLong
07-15-18, 20:17
I don't imagine if I ever have to draw my pistol in the dark I'll have time to first draw my handheld light that I may see.
how do you know you need to draw & present or make the decision to shoot that shadowy shape in the dark?
How are you sure that you need to apply deadly force... What if what you identified them as a potential threat, but they fall in that “don’t shoot yet” category?
To not PID your threat is a really dumb idea for a multitude of reasons.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
No they’re not a necessity, because you should be carrying a handheld light, which will either illuminate or backlight your sight picture and target.
What is more important is a set of sights that zero properly on your gun with your chosen carry / duty ammo, and that they work for your eyes and level of acceptable accuracy / purpose.
how do you know you need to draw & present or make the decision to shoot that shadowy shape in the dark?
How are you sure that you need to apply deadly force... What if what you identified them as a potential threat, but they fall in that “don’t shoot yet” category?
To not PID your threat is a really dumb idea for a multitude of reasons.
Your first post gave me the impression we were talking about a situation where I already knew deadly force was necessary and immediate, where the night sights would help with making those shots and the light wouldn't - because the threat went from 0 to 10 before a handheld light could be considered. If we're talking about identifying shadowy, unknown figures, then we aren't talking about night sights because night sights can't illuminate anything. The decision to draw is an entirely different subject than the usefulness of night sights after you've already drawn, and I think it wouldn't be fair to assume that shadowy figure scenario would be the reality of that situation often enough to completely negate the necessity of night sights.
I think it's also fair to make the presumption that we've already zero'd our pistols and chosen a reasonable selection of ammo with reliable magazines after which we consider night sights.
themighty9mm
07-16-18, 02:21
Not all my carry guns have them, same story to past carry guns (j frame, ruger lcp, beretta 92 compact). They are a wonderful limited use tool. That being said, if your carry gun will allow for it, no reason to not buy them. On the same note, the odds of shooting in total darkness are low, if there is enough light to identify a threat or a figure to shoot at (thinking paper threat), there tends to be enough light to make out a sight picture from what I have found with fairly few exceptions.
Not on a primary (say, G19 or larger) unless for some reason the frame does not have a rail. I always carry an X300U, so Dawson adjustable sights with a fiber optic front are fine. On my PPS M2, I'd run night sights. Likewise on a G26 or similar.
I use them. There is often lighting enough to easily ID threats, but dark enough to make seeing sights slow. Night sights fix that.
SamuelBLong
07-16-18, 08:18
Here’s an excellent analysis by JW Ramp regarding this topic. Food for thought.
http://www.jwramp.com/news/pistol-sights-under-various-lighting-conditions
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
diving dave
07-16-18, 09:11
As my eyes have aged, I've moved away from them and gone to a solid black rear, and a fiber optic front sight. My carry guns have a X300 on them, plus I usually have a handheld also. It hasnt been a problem shooting low light.
sidewaysil80
07-16-18, 09:20
As my eyes have aged, I've moved away from them and gone to a solid black rear, and a fiber optic front sight. My carry guns have a X300 on them, plus I usually have a handheld also. It hasnt been a problem shooting low light.
Plus, the fiber optic actually illuminates when using a light or wml in low/no light. I found this helped when tracking the sights in recoil when it's low light.
Doc Safari
07-16-18, 11:13
I have a Surefire 300X on my house gun, a Glock 17. When the flashlight is lit in the darkened house, I can't see the Tritium in the night sights anyway, so I'm back to just using the silhouette of the sights as I line them up.
YMMV, but that's my experience. I don't know how many carry a gun with a flashlight on the rail, but I imagine they would have a similar experience.
If I'm in a situation where I'm not using the tactical light, then I do consider night sights essential.
MountainRaven
07-16-18, 13:16
No, I do not.
With increasing age comes an increasing reluctance to use a weapon light in many situations - the proverbial bullet magnet effect. Night sights on all my weapons. YMMV
john
I don't imagine if I ever have to draw my pistol in the dark I'll have time to first draw my handheld light that I may see.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZXvKLWSZbM
There are plenty of lighting conditions under which it's quite possible to identify threats, but dark enough that sights can/will blend into clothing (early morning/evening, dimly lit interior spaces, heavily shadowed areas, etc., etc.). "Night sights" aren't intended for use in pitch black conditions. They're useful during those situational or transitional lighting conditions between being able to clearly see the sights unaided on the target and needing artificial illumination (e.g., flashlights, NOD's, etc.).
Alaskapopo
07-16-18, 13:22
You should carry a light however there are plenty of times to where night sights are essential where it would be absolutely stupid to use your weapon light and give away your location.
No they’re not a necessity, because you should be carrying a handheld light, which will either illuminate or backlight your sight picture and target.
What is more important is a set of sights that zero properly on your gun with your chosen carry / duty ammo, and that they work for your eyes and level of acceptable accuracy / purpose.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Doc Safari
07-16-18, 13:31
Isn't part of the theory behind the light is that it is intense enough to blind the attacker and give you the tactical advantage? I think most perps would be taken aback by a sudden face full of 500 lumens. They might just break and run not knowing if the next thing they will experience is the shot.
Ned Christiansen
07-16-18, 13:37
Over the years I've had a lot of guys ask for tritium in the front only. I ask why. They say the rear dot distracts them. I then say we should absolutely take the rear sight completely off because if a little glowing dot in reduced light is a distraction, it must be bloody awful in the daylight when you can see the whole rear sight.
I say it in jest-- pretty much-- because, well, they get to have it their way. And some are way more the real deal than I ever will be. I still don't see how it can be better but.... I try to make the case for having a rear sight as well as a front and if they still don't go for it, I figure they have their preferences and I drop it.
I say 100% not needed in the USA.
Now to clarify, in the USA post shooting you are going to be looked at by the authorities. You will have to answer how you were able to identify your target, this to me says we must use a light to identify a target at night.
Regular sights at night, when used in conjunction with a light are super easy to see, so why do we need night sights.
I say 100% not needed in the USA.
Now to clarify, in the USA post shooting you are going to be looked at by the authorities. You will have to answer how you were able to identify your target, this to me says we must use a light to identify a target at night.
Regular sights at night, when used in conjunction with a light are super easy to see, so why do we need night sights.
Boy these internet myths are something else. The courts don't work that way. The shooting is either justified or it's not. That's it. Night sights have nothing to do with that. Neither does the ammo you use which is another myth.
Name one court case where the defendant was found guilty for using night sights.
Adrenaline_6
07-16-18, 14:28
Boy these internet myths are something else. The courts don't work that way. The shooting is either justified or it's not. That's it. Night sights have nothing to do with that. Neither does the ammo you use which is another myth.
Name one court case where the defendant was found guilty for using night sights.
I don't think Yoni meant that night sights would be questioned in court, I read it as him meaning you should id your target and might be questioned about it, so if you are using a light to positive id anyway, night sights aren't necessarily required.
No. I used to, and I've had some classes that involved shooting in dark. But they aren't a necessity for me.
If it's dark but I can see the threat, I can see my front sight that is brightly colored. If it's too dark to see/identify the threat, I can't see my sights, either. If I'm already being attacked at contact distance in the dark, I don't need to see their face or my sights. When illuminated by a flash light, I can see the threat and I can see my sights in silhouette. Problems solved.
I like a front site about .125-.115 wide and bright. White, but brass/gold can work, so can bright green, yellow-green, or something fiber-optic.
Tritium sights seem to lose by day (they don't "pop" in sunlight), and no/little gain by night, for me.
Police Officers absolutely need a light mounted on their pistols. And another on their belt/pocket.
If I know I'm going to be out in a city after dark (festival or whatever) I'll be sure to bring a bright light. If I end up in a dark area I carry the light in my support hand. If I go condition Orange I can grip my pocket gun and still look very casual. (And have a bigger gun on my belt)
556BlackRifle
07-16-18, 15:59
I do have night sights on my carry weapons (Trijicon HD) and I also carry a light. The HDs are great for daytime and low light. In darkness, up close and personal, I'd probably use my light and point shoot. Longer distances, I'd try to evade.
I’ve got nightsights on all my carry guns...mostly the ones I carry at night. You have to be prepare for every situation possible.
Bravo Sierra
07-16-18, 17:26
Night sights cool, lasers better.
Night sights cool, lasers better.
Please don't take this wrong, but your first two posts have not been questions, or answers to questions which contain useful substance.
As I said, don't take this wrong, I just kind of wanted to warn you that generally folks don't look kindly on post what they feel are just to get your post count up.
You could have explained why you think night sights are cool, and why lasers are better, if you were off course in your reasoning someone would give you some insight from their knowledge base.
Welcome to the forum, and good luck!
Yes. 31 years in Law Enforcement with the vast majority being night shift. I have had numerous occasions where I could make out a potential threat or area that needed to be searched without added light but my sights would not have been visible without night sights. Light conditions are not always all encompassing, IE: the lighting where you are may be different then the area you are looking into/searching so the argument of "If I can't see my sights I'll have to be using my flashlight, so then I can see my sights anyway" doesn't really hold water.
In the end it all comes down to user preference. Like I tell my students, it's your gunfight, you're only going to get one chance to win. Make sure you do everything you can to be the winner.
My belief is that a duty pistol, or a pistol carried for self-defense should have some sort of high visibility sights, whether they be traditional night sights or fiber optics which gather available light is up to the individual.
I personally prefer a tritium front and plain rear. I particularly like the Ameriglo Defoor sights. Why just the front? Because I have seen too many people spending time trying to align three dots when they should have been shooting, or moving.
The major problem with night sights, which has been mentioned several times in this thread, is that they allow you to align and fire on a target you have not identified as a threat. We ought not be shooting at shapes and shadows.
Generally, if there is enough light to ID the target there will be enough light to see your sights, especially a fiber optic or tritium front.
If you have a WML or a hand carried light, when you hit the target with the light, the light reflecting off the target will bring your sights into sharp contrast with the target, which is really an optimal sight picture. In that situation, I find anything but black sights somewhat distracting. Unfortunately, there are no guarantees that is the situation I will find myself in, so compromises must be made. The DeFoor's fill that nich for me.
Night sights are just another form of insurance that we need to take advantage of if we are using pistols for HD, CCW, or duty.
Bravo Sierra
07-16-18, 18:27
Please don't take this wrong, but your first two posts have not been questions, or answers to questions which contain useful substance.
As I said, don't take this wrong, I just kind of wanted to warn you that generally folks don't look kindly on post what they feel are just to get your post count up.
You could have explained why you think night sights are cool, and why lasers are better, if you were off course in your reasoning someone would give you some insight from their knowledge base.
Welcome to the forum, and good luck!
Very quick and accurate target acquisition without the need to line up front and rear sights. Lasermax offers an internal guide rod replacement laser. I can shoot very quickly and accurately without even bringing the pistol to eye level.
As for my first post, he asked about a sub $300 blackout barrel and mentioned bcm, i found my response quite relevant.
Worth noting: if you flash a wml and move, tritiums are picked up much faster while your eyes adjust than plain sights.
I dots make lining up dots a non-issue. Get them close and start smashing the trigger.
Lastly, id say a laser is a good supplement, but not replacement for night sights- although my experience is very limited with them.
titsonritz
07-16-18, 21:52
I would rather have them than not. I also prefer an X300 series WML.
No, but I consider a carry gun essential at night!
I stopped spending the money on tritium sights when I discovered that when I needed them most I could hardly see them because of the coating of dust and dirt they got in the holster. Yes, I tried cleaning them every day, but I found many times they were dirty again at the end of the day (I have a dirty job) and it gets dark at the end of the day. I've moved to fiber optic now and don't have the same issue. If I can positively identify a threat, I can see the fiber optic. If I can't identify the target I have to use my light anyway... so they are good enough then as well.
Beat Trash
07-17-18, 08:08
Yes...
thegreyman
07-17-18, 08:55
I really appreciate responses. I always have a light; I want a light in daytime or night; there are lots of dark places in the daytime. I carry a light not simply to define a potential threat, but to assess surroundings and avoid confrontations that really demand the cavalry. I am not a police officer or operator. I have always had night sights, but feel drawn to fiber optic front sight and black rear sight. Now, I have more interest in double/single action pistols; well, that's another topic!
regarding your new interest in double/single action pistols, look no farther than Cajun Gun Works CZ P07/09
buckshot1220
07-18-18, 21:31
regarding your new interest in double/single action pistols, look no farther than Cajun Gun Works CZ P07/09
Good taste, but I'm more a fan of the PCR!
On topic, like others have stated they are cheap and everywhere. If you want something that bridges the gap between Tritium and FiberOptic, you might look at some of the Ameriglo and Trijicon setups that have a large orange or lime colored paint surround the tritium vial. I'm using Ameriglo Pro I-dots on about 8 pistols now with great success in varying conditions.
Highly, highly desirable but not a deal breaker for me.
voiceofreason
07-20-18, 11:13
Essential, no. Even a white light isn't essential, just smart.
But NS definitely work to one's advantage in some circumstances.
If one wants to be able to see their sights BEFORE white lighting the subject.
I've used 2 dot vertical, 3 dot horizontal, 3 dot different colors, single front dot...
I don't like different colors, I don't like single dot. Can make other ones work easily.
Night sights essential on a carry gun? Not so much. All my carry rotation guns have them, but I find them more useful to help me identify the location of my carry gun as it sits on the nightstand when I go to bed. Being able to find it without turning on the light is advantageous in my mind.
Nope, but a white light is
Nope, but a white light is
On a primary carry gun, I'd agree with you. On one's backup (or rule #1 gun), less so. On that gun, I'd prefer some sort of luminescent sights because by its nature, it doesn't have a U-boat on it.
On a primary carry gun, I'd agree with you. On one's backup (or rule #1 gun), less so. On that gun, I'd prefer some sort of luminescent sights because by its nature, it doesn't have a U-boat on it.
Should have clarified, meant white light on your person. Handheld, wml whichever
Truth, for sure. That said, if one is running a light-capable primary weapon without a weapon-mounted light, one is most likely wrong. (Exceptions for the guy who's running what would normally be his backup as a primary because of circumstances.)
MountainRaven
07-26-18, 16:36
Is there someone who makes a traditional IWB holster for a Glock 34 with an MRDS and an X300? Because all I can find are AIWB holsters.
Raven Vanguard 3 would work. That's what I run when I have to run IWB. I, however, run OWB most of the time.
MountainRaven
07-26-18, 17:18
Raven Vanguard 3 would work. That's what I run when I have to run IWB. I, however, run OWB most of the time.
Vanguard 3 doesn't work with the G34.
Vanguard 3 doesn't work with the G34.
Edit - deleted question-
Check out trex arms, raptor or sidecar for appendix, nomad for other.
El_Chingon
07-26-18, 23:29
a straight and simple "YES"!!!!
MountainRaven
07-27-18, 01:47
Edit - deleted question-
Check out trex arms, raptor or sidecar for appendix, nomad for other.
I don't see an option on their website for a WML-compatible Nomad.
Nightstalker865
07-27-18, 05:25
I don't see an option on their website for a WML-compatible Nomad.
Why not just use the Raptor?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Raven Vanguard 3 would work. That's what I run when I have to run IWB. I, however, run OWB most of the time.
That's lotsa running fella.
I don't consider it a must, but it is highly recommended.
I've not used night sights on some of my pistols, but a light is another good companion. For Target identification you'd need to see who you are pointing your firearm at; if you are in a dark area or if the lights/electricity are out, you may not be able to identify your target with just night sights.
Ideally night sights and a light combined is best.
grizzlyblake
07-27-18, 14:26
The language "carry gun" to me means a civilian carrying out and about for personal protection. In that case I'd say night sights are great for quick and close shooting in low light as a reaction to an attack, but not essential at all. If you're pulling a pistol as a response to a physical attack you're not going to be pulling a flashlight for target ID or any of that and it's really just point shooting I'd imagine.
MountainRaven
07-27-18, 18:48
Why not just use the Raptor?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Because they list it as an appendix holster, and I didn’t bother to read the description about how it can be carried IWB on/behind the hip.
Although it doesn’t appear to have an adjustable cant, which I would want it to have a little of.
Since the discussion is about NIGHT shooting, ?who here has tested his ammo for flash at night. Might be surprised at how much or little a particular round makes. It can be enough to blind you temporarily.
We are not talking police type of shooting . At what distance do you expect to have to shoot some one to stop the attack?
I've never been in a gun fight at night, but have shot matches at night. For me the first shot on the night sights is all that I got, after that I could not see the night sites. There was no huge fire ball, just a smallish dull orange glowing ball. That was enough to blind me to the night sights. I use a flashlight with no night sights.
Isn't part of the theory behind the light is that it is intense enough to blind the attacker and give you the tactical advantage? I think most perps would be taken aback by a sudden face full of 500 lumens. They might just break and run not knowing if the next thing they will experience is the shot.
I have heard of simunitions/paint ball where the person who got lit up getting blinded, but popping a round off toward the last thing they saw and getting a hit.
Breaking and running from a bright light would likely be dependent on past experiences in much the same way that not every intruder knows what a pump shotgun chambering a round sounds like And others that do not being bothered by it.
Over the years I've had a lot of guys ask for tritium in the front only. I ask why. They say the rear dot distracts them. I then say we should absolutely take the rear sight completely off because if a little glowing dot in reduced light is a distraction, it must be bloody awful in the daylight when you can see the whole rear sight.
I say it in jest-- pretty much-- because, well, they get to have it their way. And some are way more the real deal than I ever will be. I still don't see how it can be better but.... I try to make the case for having a rear sight as well as a front and if they still don't go for it, I figure they have their preferences and I drop it.
It's an eyesight thing. I can kind of handle 2 rear lamps if they are dimmer than the front...and the times I have had them they got a sharpie swipe to dull them....but prefer plain black rear and never have liked 2 white rear dots. Interestingly, Sig 6 o'clock white dots and tritium bar/straight 8 don't bother me.
I think it is a more acute version of people who like a tritium front rifle/shotgun sight, but abhor the 2 dot rears due to overwhelming the front. I assume someone somewhere really does like a 3 dot long gun sight picture, but don't see that recommendation pop up often.
Do you consider night sights a necessity on a carry gun?
Yes. They are.
The_War_Wagon
08-30-18, 07:13
Do you consider night sights a necessity on a carry gun?
Yes. Especially if you carry in the dark. Ditto for any OTHER home defense gun, which I suppose, is ALL of them.
Not at all. Not on any gun.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Gunsnguitars
09-01-18, 17:42
I do not consider them to be essential. I like to be able to see what I'm shooting at, but that's not to say that NS aren't practical in some applications. I've noticed standing near or under a street light, for example, I can see a considerable distance and NS are much easier to pick up under this condition. I work in a major city, downtown, outside, at night. That's how I am certain NS are good for my particular situation, much of the time. That's just one example. I leave my kitchen light on every night, while the rest of the house is dark. I can see from my bedroom door all the way into the kitchen, so I am in the dark looking into the light, and can easily see what I'm aiming at, and again, the NS are much easier to pick up with my eyes in this scenario.
A couple of examples of why I like them, but I have never considered them a necessity, and in my experience most are not very good for daytime. If anyone has suggestions for good NS during daytime or nighttime, I'm all ears.
I do not consider them to be essential. I like to be able to see what I'm shooting at, but that's not to say that NS aren't practical in some applications. I've noticed standing near or under a street light, for example, I can see a considerable distance and NS are much easier to pick up under this condition. I work in a major city, downtown, outside, at night. That's how I am certain NS are good for my particular situation, much of the time. That's just one example. I leave my kitchen light on every night, while the rest of the house is dark. I can see from my bedroom door all the way into the kitchen, so I am in the dark looking into the light, and can easily see what I'm aiming at, and again, the NS are much easier to pick up with my eyes in this scenario.
A couple of examples of why I like them, but I have never considered them a necessity, and in my experience most are not very good for daytime. If anyone has suggestions for good NS during daytime or nighttime, I'm all ears.
For me the Trijicon HD "Lime" front sight works well for daytime use, and I still have working night sights.
Gunsnguitars
09-01-18, 19:58
For me the Trijicon HD "Lime" front sight works well for daytime use, and I still have working night sights.
Thanks. I've never tried those, so I'll be sure to check them out.
I thought they were a necessity...until I actually shot a low-light course.
I’ll never put another set on a carry gun, because—for me—they are simply unnecessary.
Don Robison
09-02-18, 16:42
No, they fit in such a narrow niche of lighting that they are IMHO unnecessary. If it's bright enough for me to PID then it's bright enough to see my sights. If it's dark enough that I can't PID then I need a light either handheld or weapon mounted; either way I get enough light to both PID and highlight my sights more than adequately to use accurately.
I thought they were a necessity...until I actually shot a low-light course.
I’ll never put another set on a carry gun, because—for me—they are simply unnecessary.
Agreed. Shot low light stuff and found out I didn't need the dots after all. Given the option, I go plain sights now.
Black rear sight and fiber optic front. If it’s too dark to use sights it’s probably too dark to ID a target. X300u on my full size and a handheld malkoff 1000 lumen handheld for a compact.
I can see the utility for some lighting conditions but I like black rear, fiber optic front. I've done a ton shooting in the dark and never really missed night sights.
LowSpeed_HighDrag
09-08-18, 12:37
I used to consider them a necessity. I still think Glock plastic sights need immediate replacing. With that said, here's an example of why I don't believe in them anymore...
I was clearing a house, backyard, and shed last night. Somebody called in that there was a light turned on in a vacant house, and a back door open. It was probably 2300, and totally dark out. As we were searching, I'd turn my X300 on and off. When the light was on, it washed out my night sights. When it was off, they helped me focus on my front sight, but I wouldnt have been able to ID a target if I had to shoot without a light.
bigger_hammer
09-08-18, 18:31
Yes, Not every one of my pistols has them, but any pistol I would wear or grab for "Serious Uses" (Not punching paper targets) will have them.
Mysteryman
09-13-18, 15:59
I used to consider them a necessity. I still think Glock plastic sights need immediate replacing. With that said, here's an example of why I don't believe in them anymore...
I was clearing a house, backyard, and shed last night. Somebody called in that there was a light turned on in a vacant house, and a back door open. It was probably 2300, and totally dark out. As we were searching, I'd turn my X300 on and off. When the light was on, it washed out my night sights. When it was off, they helped me focus on my front sight, but I wouldnt have been able to ID a target if I had to shoot without a light.
Are you sure? what about shooting from a darkened area with night sights into a lit area where positive ID could be made? Think about standing behind your cruiser(presuming you're an LEO) where the headlights and possibly the spot light are illuminating the scene. Use of the pistol mounted light would likely be washed out by the other lights and might give away your position. Seeing the night sights would be a benefit in such a scenario.
Perhaps you're working containment and the suspect appears under a street light or in the headlights of a cruiser, or under a porch light and poses a threat. No need to illuminate the suspect with a mounted light, positive ID has been made. Seeing your sights from your darkened position becomes critical and where night sights come into effect.
MountainRaven
09-13-18, 16:24
Are you sure? what about shooting from a darkened area with night sights into a lit area where positive ID could be made? Think about standing behind your cruiser(presuming you're an LEO) where the headlights and possibly the spot light are illuminating the scene. Use of the pistol mounted light would likely be washed out by the other lights and might give away your position. Seeing the night sights would be a benefit in such a scenario.
Perhaps you're working containment and the suspect appears under a street light or in the headlights of a cruiser, or under a porch light and poses a threat. No need to illuminate the suspect with a mounted light, positive ID has been made. Seeing your sights from your darkened position becomes critical and where night sights come into effect.
In that scenario, you will (or should) be able to see the outline of your sights.
In that scenario, you will (or should) be able to see the outline of your sights. Yep. After taking a night shoot class using that exact same scenario, if your target is lit your sights will be lit as well. The other thing I discovered in those low light classes is that my night sights got dusted over and dirty rather quickly, rendering them virtually useless. Standing in the dark, looking into the light I can see my sights. Standing in the light, looking into the dark I can see my sights. Light low enough that I can identify may target, but things are murky my night sights work less well than my fiber optic front.
LowSpeed_HighDrag
09-13-18, 19:51
Are you sure? what about shooting from a darkened area with night sights into a lit area where positive ID could be made? Think about standing behind your cruiser(presuming you're an LEO) where the headlights and possibly the spot light are illuminating the scene. Use of the pistol mounted light would likely be washed out by the other lights and might give away your position. Seeing the night sights would be a benefit in such a scenario.
Perhaps you're working containment and the suspect appears under a street light or in the headlights of a cruiser, or under a porch light and poses a threat. No need to illuminate the suspect with a mounted light, positive ID has been made. Seeing your sights from your darkened position becomes critical and where night sights come into effect.
I think Frank Proctor just posted on IG about this. He mentioned something to the effect of, if there's light you can see your sights, if there's no light use your flashlight to see your sights and the target.
if there's no light use your flashlight to see your sights and the target.
This isn't clear - is he advocating using your light behind the sights in order to illuminate them, or using your light to front light the target allowing the reflected light to provide contrast?
Because if he is advocating the former, you need to be listening to someone else - although I can't believe anyone who has shot much at night would say that.
LowSpeed_HighDrag
09-14-18, 01:15
This isn't clear - is he advocating using your light behind the sights in order to illuminate them, or using your light to front light the target allowing the reflected light to provide contrast?
Because if he is advocating the former, you need to be listening to someone else - although I can't believe anyone who has shot much at night would say that.
I wasn't clear, use your light to illuminate the target and you will be able to see your sights.
Frank Proctor has probably shot once or twice at night.
Working in an urban area at night before the advent of WMLs I distinctly remember many situations where the green glow of 3 lined up Trijicon lamps was the perfect targeting aid. Mysteryman noted some of them like when you are in the dark and the suspect is under a porch light, which happens more than you think if you are trying to keep a low vis signature and be a sneaky patrol cop. Nowadays I am content with just an irradiated front sight and a mounted X300U.
Night sights are just another tool that can be helpful in certain situations depending on your needs.
Dennis.
Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
Essential?
No.
Do I have them on all my carry guns (and most of my other guns)?
Yes.
I'm surprised I haven't seen any other country folk post with anecdotes of dispatching possums and other annoying/destructive critters with their carry pistols.
I have dispatched many critters under low/no light conditions and found that the night sights were essential for getting an accurate hit for that first shot.
Now it may not be what I think it is, but I consider it some extremely valuable "training" and almost look forward to the next time I hear a possum trying to get into the trash.
Of other note... I think that this is a bit subjective as well.
Who's got the same level of clarity or night vision as anyone else?
Eyes' abilities are almost unique as the individual who owns them.
Of other note... I think that this is a bit subjective as well.
Who's got the same level of clarity or night vision as anyone else?
Eyes' abilities are almost unique as the individual who owns them.
That is a good point.
The receptors that are most useful at night (the rods) are most densely located outside the point of central vision (macula lutea) at the back of the eye. As a result at night our vision is less acute because the receptors that best help us see at night are off the point of central focus.
The rods are extremely sensitive to light (as opposed to the cones) and as a result of this we best pick up movement (changes in light, right?) out of our peripheral vision. This is also why it is so important to keep our eyes moving and use off center viewing techniques at night.
(This info came from our night shoot handout - I'm not an optometrist)
IIRC, if there is just enough light to see objects, our night acuity is in the area of 20/400. Most drivers handbooks will tell you visual acuity is reduced 25% at night.
I purchased an M&P 9 several years ago that has them, and I think they are an asset, but not a necessity.
One thing I will say is that if one runs an RDS on his carry pistol, one should definitely NOT have night sights. That leads to too many dots you see in the dark, especially under NODs.
MountainRaven
09-17-18, 18:57
One thing I will say is that if one runs an RDS on his carry pistol, one should definitely NOT have night sights. That leads to too many dots you see in the dark, especially under NODs.
I don't know about how they look under NODs, but I have no issue with (and in fact prefer) to use night sights in conjunction with an RDS, as I don't have any reference on the pistol's orientation otherwise.
LowSpeed_HighDrag
09-17-18, 19:00
One thing I will say is that if one runs an RDS on his carry pistol, one should definitely NOT have night sights. That leads to too many dots you see in the dark, especially under NODs.
I have Trijicon Suppressor Night Sights with my RMR and have no issues....
Essential?
No.
Do I have them on all my carry guns (and most of my other guns)?
Yes.
I'm surprised I haven't seen any other country folk post with anecdotes of dispatching possums and other annoying/destructive critters with their carry pistols.
I have dispatched many critters under low/no light conditions and found that the night sights were essential for getting an accurate hit for that first shot.
Now it may not be what I think it is, but I consider it some extremely valuable "training" and almost look forward to the next time I hear a possum trying to get into the trash.
Of other note... I think that this is a bit subjective as well.
Who's got the same level of clarity or night vision as anyone else?
Eyes' abilities are almost unique as the individual who owns them.
I far prefer to use a weapon light to make precision shots on critters in the dark.
I have Trijicon standard/regular night sights (green) on all my carry pistols, G19, G22, G26 and G34. I only have a weapon light on my G22. It's my secondary home HD gun. My Colt M4 (6920) is my primary, it has a weapon light as well.
I have to get night sights for my 1911 one of these days.
NYH1.
I do not consider night sights essential. Nice to have maybe, but not essential. I think a WML is a better choice for home defense, but not necessary on EDC.
MadAngler1
09-23-18, 10:45
Do you consider night sights a necessity on a carry gun?
Absolutely.
Mysteryman
09-23-18, 20:55
I do not consider night sights essential. Nice to have maybe, but not essential. I think a WML is a better choice for home defense, but not necessary on EDC.
Why not both???
...I'm surprised I haven't seen any other country folk post with anecdotes of dispatching possums and other annoying/destructive critters with their carry pistols...
A red dot-equipped 10/22 “pocket rifle” dispatches nighttime prowlers here.
I’m not wasting perfectly good defensive ammo on a raccoon. ;-)
Yes... But I also like contrasting colors so I focus more on the front sight... I like Ameriglo for my Glocks.. My USP compact has orange rear sights and a green front sight, it makes a bit of difference.
I have Trijicon standard/regular night sights (green) on all my carry pistols, G19, G22, G26 and G34. I only have a weapon light on my G22. It's my secondary home HD gun. My Colt M4 (6920) is my primary, it has a weapon light as well.
I have to get night sights for my 1911 one of these days.
NYH1.
I never answered the question. Yes, I find night sight necessity on carry guns.
Just my $0.02, NYH1.
I prefer Warrens or Dawsons plain Black rear/ FO front. I do have Glock night sights on a G26 that I carried for Six years. For the last Four years I’ve carried a G19 with Warrens.
On my newest pistol (M&P 2.0 Compact) I decided to try the HD XR’s. I prefer the Warrens because I shoot with them better. They have a thinner front post and a more precise aiming point. I thought that since the XR’s had the thinner front post I would like them better. I don’t. I would like to have the advantage of tritium, but not at the cost of less accuracy.
A red dot-equipped 10/22 “pocket rifle” dispatches nighttime prowlers here.
I’m not wasting perfectly good defensive ammo on a raccoon. ;-)
I can't shoot coons...
Had one as a pet once and now I'm a little partial to the sneaky bastards!
Possums on the other hand...
no , at low light conditions as soon as light comes on night sights go dark
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.