View Full Version : Suppressor for an 11.5
I'm looking at getting mt first suppressor this coming year and I need some suggestions and guidance. I'm currently in the process of putting together an 11.5 AR pistol, I may SBR it later I haven't decided yet, but what I do want to do is suppress it. This gun will be for HD and for range use the can is more for the HD side of things to take the edge off the gun if needed to be used inside. I'm not looking for a Hollywood quiet can, but what I want is for it to be short and light and not have my ears bleed. The in of the home is quite small so I'm trying to avoid putting on a can and then being back at the 16+ inch spectrum.
So far I have looked at the AAC Mini 4 and the Saker 556k and the Griffin M4SDK, are there others to look at in that size or others that will fit what I'm looking for?
Mike Miller
12-29-18, 14:36
Common advice is to not get a short suppressor for your first, you are likely to be disappointed. I don't think that you would notice the extra 3/4" to 1" with a normal sized can as much as you would notice the sound difference indoors with a smaller can.
I run a Saker 556k on a 11.5" BCM w/.060 GP.
This SBR was assembled as a 150m and in room cleaner, running 75gr Hornady HD SBR loads.
On short barrels (10.5'' to 11.5'') short cans are loud, full size cans are less loud and cans on any AR (short or long) are still loud!!
My rig is set up to NOT blow out my Tympanum in an enclosed space.....thats all, and thats all I expect.
140db to 142db rating on this setup is better then 156db or 165db on a non-suppressed weapon.
again this is expectation, and I'm comfortable with this.
I have many cans and really don't care which one I put on to the the gun tolerable and thats good. So buy a can that has a good deal and you can buy local. The new Sig cans are good and priced right, I have a direct thread sig can in jail, its small and built tuff. The mini 4 is time proven.
I agree with "get the full sized can" for your first. You want to be able to shoot without ears.
PB
So a mini can is still bad outdoors with no ears I gather? Outside with a can or not I'm still going to wear ears if I'm being honest. Are there any suggestions for a first can to use in an HD role that don't add to much length and will keep me from rupturing and ear drum in the even, or is it any quality full size can will do ya kid and the length isn't as bad as you think?
YHM Turbo...
...or YHM Resonator if you have any 30 cal (or 6.5/6.8/etc) hosts.
The mini would be fine for HD in a house with no ears, jut for one or two pops. It will be too loud to practice with inside or outside, but in a Fight or Flight situation that can would make it sooo much better than nothing. And still be scary for a bad guy to hear. Just my thoughts.
PB
PatrioticDisorder
12-29-18, 19:45
Call me the oddball, for an 11.5 id get a mini can. Regardless, a suppressed 11.5 will still be loud, albeit less damaging to your hearing. My priorities are with weight, overall length and point of impact shift over actual sound suppression.
stahljaeger
12-29-18, 21:10
I have a Mini 4 on an 11.5, it actually isn't that bad outside as the shooter. It is really different when someone else is shooting near to you. The shot was actually a lot more noticeable, while less loud, the blast can physically be felt more throughout your body more. I also use it with a 14.5 at the range and do not really notice much difference. I also have not noticed any issues with being gassed, but I run both with adjustable gas and A5 buffer systems so that could be a big help.
I specifically got it for my HD gun but have not shot it inside, the length is very handy in my house though. I got it as my first can as well, if I was doing it today I would still be getting a mini can first as I still think it is the best compromise for me, but I always use ear pro when shooting anyway, as am always around someone else shooting unsuppressed.
There probably better options now than the mini4 though, it is a pretty old design in the suppressor world
medicman816
12-29-18, 21:53
Recently added a Surefire mini to the collection and with my rather poor hearing I can't notice the difference between the regular SOCOM and the mini on a 10.5" barrel. This is outdoors. No access to a rifle caliber indoor range here. I will say that even a suppressed 9mm pistol and subsonic rounds gets uncomfortable indoors after a few rounds without hearing protection.
Even the length difference between the two isn't that noticeable. The biggest thing that I notice is the weight difference, and it's not that much. I would start with your max budget, then find the lightest and shortest can that fits, for the best overall price. And lets be honest here... Its doubtful that this will be your last can... they are addictive.
They all sound the same to the shooter on a rifle
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Thanks for the information guys. I think I’m going to go with the Mini 4, I do have a .308 bolt gun but that’s more of a deer gun and don’t have use for a 30 cal cab though I did think about it.
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I put a socom mini on my 11.5 and love it. Its actually quieter than expected.
You should always wear ear pro, especially rifles. I even wear muffs when using pistol cans most of the time.
Rayrevolver
12-30-18, 07:54
I think I am the only proponent of direct thread suppressors. The mini cans + mounts all weigh around 17-18oz. I have an old Trek, also 18oz, but suppresses much better than the Mini 4.
My money is on a new direct thread like the GP5 at 12.5oz or what I really want, the Vox S direct thread. Also 12.5oz.
I have a mini 4 and run it primarily on my 11.5 upper. Definitely takes the edge off. Good little can from 10.3" - 16". Its a little heavy though for its size. I would look at the surefire. minis as they have much better muzzle devices. I would strongly look at the 762 cans as 556 will never be hearing safe and you are then not limited 556. Opens up a ton of calibers that you may use in the future. Once you start shooting with suppressors you will always want to be shooting with suppressors.
I’ve come to the conclusion that any can on a SBR is still going to be loud (especially indoors), so sound suppression is not really my main goal with that type of setup. Length added and weight are far more important to me. POI shift would be third if I planned on shooting it unsuppressed.
For my uses, I’ve been running one of the older Ops Inc. M4S cans (now called AE Suppressors). It’s an over the barrel (reflex) design, so it keeps added length down much more than a standard suppressor. It’s older tech and some say it’s less efficient than a standard front mounted suppressor, but even for its short size, it does a great job taking the bark and blast out of it.
It’s an SBR because you wanted a shorter more maneuverable rifle indoors, and this fills that roll perfectly.
DeadAir Sandman S is the best current option IMO when weighing performance, the mount design, back pressure, cost, durability, and factory support. Surefire, DeadAir, and KAC offer the best mount designs at present. Low back pressure is far more important than performance. I love Surefire. For me they check off all the right boxes, with one caveat - they are more costly than most. DeadAir is the best option across all criteria.
AAC and SiCo cans have higher back pressure than SF, DA. They are very durable and offer great performance. But they are gassy with more back pressure. No experience with Griffin. My impression of them is that they tend to look eerily similar to KAC.
Keep in mind, the above is based solely on my own opinions. This is not gospel.
They all sound the same to the shooter on a rifle
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The videos and reviews of the new 2018 OSS suppressors are very persuasive. I’d love to see feedback from someone here about them and I even posted a dedicated thread. Nothing yet.
I’m currently deciding on a 11.5” suppressed HD rifle build as well and don’t want to pull the trigger on a suppressor until I see more on these. If they work as advertised they should be quieter at the shooters ear than most and have almost no blowback issues negating the need to use AGBs and BCGs, etc
kaltesherz
12-31-18, 21:57
I ran a Mini4 on my 11.5 and thought the sound suppression was ok, but the fireball was distracting. I then switched to a Surefire SOCOM RC and love it- no fireball, better noise suppression, and less gas blowback.
Thanks for the information guys. I think I’m going to go with the Mini 4, I do have a .308 bolt gun but that’s more of a deer gun and don’t have use for a 30 cal cab though I did think about it.
Did you look at the Turbo? ~1” longer, weighs the same, and about half the price. (Or at least enough of a difference to pay for the stamp)
Silencer shop has Sandman-K cans for 569 before stamp. I picked up a -K and a ghost-m for less than $1000 through silencershop through some sort of add-on deal. I am tempted to buy another just so I can have a dedicated suppressed gun and one can that moves around. The -k is cheap compared to the -S and -L.
I did look at the YHM line, I was jut afraid of it being too long for indoors, I was also looking at the Sandman-K. My other question is should I be looking at a reduced gas port barrel? It's not going to suppressed all the time, I'm currently looking at a standard 11.5 barrel from Roscoe Manufacturing.
gunnerblue
01-01-19, 10:14
I did look at the YHM line, I was jut afraid of it being too long for indoors, I was also looking at the Sandman-K. My other question is should I be looking at a reduced gas port barrel? It's not going to suppressed all the time, I'm currently looking at a standard 11.5 barrel from Roscoe Manufacturing.
I’m not familiar with Roscoe Mfg., but you’d be hard-pressed to beat the Sionics RGP barrel. The gas port is 0.069” as I recall and works splendidly with or without a suppressor.
To be more clear, is a RGP barrel required?
No, you just might get a more gassy gun if you don’t buy a barrel with smaller gas port. Or appropriate sized port.
It will still run, maybe just ruffer and smellier
PB
Gemtech SBC solved all of my issues and made it smooth as a pussycat.
No GIF...no ejection issues...cycled fine in FA and semi for 300 rds of WWB 55gr x193.
No issues at all.
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That's a good idea, this is all new to me here and I don't want to build a gun that only runs one way and not the other.
Then switch it to non suppressed when not using.
I got tired of the stupid adjustable gas block and other crap.
The gemtech bolt carrier works well.
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I have the bootleg suppressed bolt carrier. It works on my SPR/M4 dedicated gun.
A properly ported barrel really enhances the suppressed shooting experience.
This goes double for a barrel with a dedicated suppressor port like our OPTIMUM CQB - Suppressor Gas Drive (https://www.blackrivertactical.com/concrete5/store/#!/BRT-11-5-OPTIMUM-CQB-S-Barrel-Suppressor-Gas-Drive/p/110419568/category=1852006).
MIDGAPATRIOT
01-26-19, 15:09
I have a Saker 556 on my BCM 11.5. I love it, but I've never shot it indoors.
The one on the right.
55692
Edit to add: I don't know why the picture ended up sideways.
fedupflyer
01-27-19, 14:43
They all sound the same to the shooter on a rifle
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Um yeah.
No they don't.
First hand experience.
I think I am the only proponent of direct thread suppressors. The mini cans + mounts all weigh around 17-18oz. I have an old Trek, also 18oz, but suppresses much better than the Mini 4.
My money is on a new direct thread like the GP5 at 12.5oz or what I really want, the Vox S direct thread. Also 12.5oz.
You’re not the only one. I’ll likely be getting a Turbo K for a gun that never gets used without a can, anyway.
Yes.
The only potential issue with a direct thread suppressor is loosening under fire.
A tapered shoulder barrel (and DT adapter) will take care of this.
You’re not the only one. I’ll likely be getting a Turbo K for a gun that never gets used without a can, anyway.
fedupflyer
01-27-19, 18:10
You’re not the only one. I’ll likely be getting a Turbo K for a gun that never gets used without a can, anyway.
Personally, I would not recommend a mini suppressor especially on a sbr. Too me, it nothing more than a fancy flash hider.
I was able to stand between to rifles that were alternating fire and the mini cans don't do much for sound suppression.
Personally, I would not recommend a mini suppressor especially on a sbr. Too me, it nothing more than a fancy flash hider.
I was able to stand between to rifles that were alternating fire and the mini cans don't do much for sound suppression.
What barrel lengths?
The 11.5 with mini vs 14.5 with sf3p is not even close.
11.5w/can sounds like an unsurpressed 22lr, maybe quieter. Ill have to do a side by side with 22 next trip.
ginzomatic
02-28-19, 11:09
I run an M4-2000 on a Noveske 11.5" and love it
I use a Saker 762 on my 11.5"...Don't really have any complaints.
edit: I actually do have one sorta minor complaint...The old Trifecta mount is kinda janky, but I have those things rocksetted to a several rifles and don't feel like assing around with switching them over to ASR or KeyMo. This is not really an issue if you buy a new Saker, though...It'll be ASR out the gate.
My only centerfire can is a Dead Air Sandman-K. I have no regrets with the small can, it does everything I needed and expected it to do. Yes, it's loud. It's still more comfortable to shoot my 11.5" with the can than my 14.5" without it, though.
I have a Specwar K mounted to a brake on my 11.5. I like it for size and durability compared to my Omega but I don't think it sounds as good which is to be expected given the size difference between the two. I would probably not buy another dedicated .223/5.56 can even tho it lives on the rifle and I mostly shoot that caliber and it's the only rifle caliber I reload. There's a lot of crying related to SilencerCo's ASR system but I don't have an issue with it.
I ordered an OSS HX-QD 762 Ti last year for my new Hunting rifle in 6.5 CM. But I will be using it on a Colt 6933, 11.5" barrel. I will also use that same 6933 upper on my Colt M16. In the near future I will be using my new OSS can on a Smith Ent. M21. I spent a little more and got the can in Titanium. It is only 14 oz. and at the time that I bought it OSS had a special on two free mounts of your choice when you purchased an OSS Suppressor. I got one muzzle brake in 762 and one in 556.
I made the choice of an OSS suppressor due to their low blow back. My sons have AAC cans in 556 & 30 cal. Blow back is always an issue.
I strongly suggest that you consider a 30 cal can if you have more then one rifle that you want to suppress that is larger then 556.
Good Luck with your choice.
Boris_the_Blade
03-13-19, 13:11
I have a Sandman-S that I run on my 11.5” SBR. Not the quietest set up, but pleasant to shoot.
Here is a long video that discusses using suppressors on short barreled rifles. It is geared to the OSS HX-QD line of suppressors. I found it to be informative. I currently have a Titanium Model HX-QD 762 going through the ATF process.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wj4WVy7_qtU
Boogieman2
03-15-19, 19:49
I was thinking about getting a KAC qdc cqb 5.56 for my 11.5 or 12.5 certainly after reading this thread
My only centerfire can is a Dead Air Sandman-K. I have no regrets with the small can, it does everything I needed and expected it to do. Yes, it's loud. It's still more comfortable to shoot my 11.5" with the can than my 14.5" without it, though.
I'm thinking of buying the Sandman K as my first can as well. Same purpose as OP. Strictly for firing a couple of rounds without ears in the event of a HD scenario or while hunting. No long strings of fire. Host will be 11.5 556. Have you fired yours without ears?
I'm thinking of buying the Sandman K as my first can as well. Same purpose as OP. Strictly for firing a couple of rounds without ears in the event of a HD scenario or while hunting. No long strings of fire. Host will be 11.5 556. Have you fired yours without ears?
Yes, but only outdoors. I was able to get a couple rounds off without pain but make no mistake, it's extremely loud and right on the threshold of discomfort. Being indoors is another thing entirely... an 11.5" shooting full power 5.56 from a 5" can is not going to be a pleasant experience no matter what, but I think I'd still rather shoot an SBR with a K-can than an unsuppressed 16" gun if I had to let one rip without ears on. Sound is one thing, concussive force is another to consider and that's where even short suppressors shine.
Yes, but only outdoors. I was able to get a couple rounds off without pain but make no mistake, it's extremely loud and right on the threshold of discomfort. Being indoors is another thing entirely... an 11.5" shooting full power 5.56 from a 5" can is not going to be a pleasant experience no matter what, but I think I'd still rather shoot an SBR with a K-can than an unsuppressed 16" gun if I had to let one rip without ears on. Sound is one thing, concussive force is another to consider and that's where even short suppressors shine.
yeah, that's what I figured as well. better to have something that is short and maneuverable that helps mitigate the disorientation versus trying to think i'll achieve that zero dark thirty quiet with 556 in the house.
yeah, that's what I figured as well. better to have something that is short and maneuverable that helps mitigate the disorientation versus trying to think i'll achieve that zero dark thirty quiet with 556 in the house.
Pretty much. It's enough to take some of the edge off the sound signature without adding as much weight and bulk as a larger can, and unlike something like the Surefire Warden, it actually contains the blast instead of just redirecting it. And if you use the 5.56 flash hider front cap, it does pretty well with controlling muzzle flash as well... that is, until you start building up unburned powder inside during longer courses of fire, and then occasionally you end up with the scenario below. In a home defense scenario, that type of event is pretty unlikely and it should perform well as a flash hider.
https://i.ibb.co/jy6DQMJ/Capture15.jpg
Pretty much. It's enough to take some of the edge off the sound signature without adding as much weight and bulk as a larger can, and unlike something like the Surefire Warden, it actually contains the blast instead of just redirecting it. And if you use the 5.56 flash hider front cap, it does pretty well with controlling muzzle flash as well... that is, until you start building up unburned powder inside during longer courses of fire, and then occasionally you end up with the scenario below. In a home defense scenario, that type of event is pretty unlikely and it should perform well as a flash hider.
https://i.ibb.co/jy6DQMJ/Capture15.jpg
awesome! haha!
Falshooter
03-30-19, 02:22
I have a specwar 556k on my 11.5”, not the smallest of the K cans but no regrets. I would have gone smaller (socom mini, sandman-k if it were available at the time) but I got a “could not pass up” price on the specwar. I wear plugs all the time with my suppressed guns so even the K cans offer enough dB reduction with minimal weight/length added.
masenomics
03-30-19, 07:46
Another advocate for a sandman k, great mount in the keymo mounts deadair has, good repeatability in my experience. Mine works great on my BCM 11.5” sbr short and light, like others have said the k cans take the edge off but are still loud can’t beat the supersonic boom of the 5.56 round. I was pleasantly surprised, though, how well my sandman k works on my 26” barrel 6.5 creedmoor bolt gun. Get one before the price of the sandman k goes up in price Monday.
I have an AAC 51 tooth Brake Mount on my Colt 6933 and it is loud. I also get some huge flashes from it. Here is a picture of a flash from my Colt 6933 upper with the AAC Brake Mount on my Colt M16. Shooters tell me that it is not real pleasant shooting next to me when I am firing. I usually warn them first and wait till they are done shooting. I will be replacing that AAC Mount with an OSS Muzzle Brake Mount in the near future.
https://imagizer.imageshack.com/img922/2619/v8nQ7G.jpg
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