View Full Version : CMMG .22lr conversion - a brief review
A few weeks back I placed an order w/Brownells for a CMMG .22lr conversion kit w/27-round magazine (http://www.brownells.com/aspx/NS/store/productdetail.aspx?p=26653&st=&s=52397). I got an email on 03NOV that it shipped, and it arrived today :cool:
The planets aligned and I managed to squeeze out of the house this afternoon to try it out. I was in such a hurry I didn't bother to give it a quick once over before heading to the range - specifically I didn't bother to lube it beyond the sparse oil that was on it from shipping (more on that later)... gotm4 was at the range, and I got to meet 9x19, and Pk14 - great to meet you two! LittleLebowski was also there, but he was with someone on the line so I chose not to interrupt/introduce myself...
This is the first conversion unit I've ever used/laid hands on - so I don't know if it's better than any other. It seems to be pretty solid, and functions smoothly. It weighs 10.1oz, ~1.9oz lighter than the Colt BCG that I pulled out of my 6920.
I ran 250 rounds of American Eagle 5022 40gr lead ammo down the pipe with minimal problems. What bobbles I did experience I can almost certainly attribute to the complete lack of lubricant! I only loaded the mags w/20 rounds at a time (it was tough to get 23-25 rounds loaded, and I don't think I'd ever get 27 rounds in there). Once I've got 1-2k down the pipe and it's all settled in I'll try to load the mags to capacity.
After the 250 rounds of .22lr, I switched the 6920 BCG back and fired 20 rounds of XM193 in an effort to clean out some of the funk.
POI was pretty much spot on factoring in the holdover while I was shooting at 10 yards - obligatory pic attached:
http://tinyurl.com/6nebhs
Shooting .22lr from your AR is a hoot :D I can now shoot the snot out of this and not feel guilty about using up my stash or how much it costs. Additionally, my 7yo daughter is going to have a blast with this (heck, I've still got a grin on my face).
Next up is a few more Black Dog magazines and a ton more ammo.
Great to finally meet you in person yesterday - sorry I couldn't stay to see how the CMMG conversion kit worked!
Have you had a chance to see how much residue was left after the 20 rd 5.56 cleaning rounds went through the barrel?
I saw a TacSol dedicated upper last week at NRA - thinking about how much extra $$ it would take to configure that upper into a reasonable clone of my N4 verus the CMMG option - seems like it would be better to go the CMMG route and spend the difference on an SBR upper set-up (which could also use the kit).
That RIS II rail and SF x300 is a great set-up on that 6920!
Cheers,
Pk
Pk,
the barrel cleaned out just fine after the 20 rounds of 5.56; however the chamber and the conversion kit were filthy when I got home. I meant to take pics before I cleaned it but my OCD kicked in... :p
I'm going to experiment with several brands of ammo, and I hope to find a reasonably priced (read cheap) copper plated bullet that the conversion likes. I can't say for certain, but I think the copper plating will give leave less funk in the barrel for me to clean out. No matter what I plan to run 20-40 rounds of 5.56 down the pipe at the end of each .22lr session just to clean junk out.
I was on the fence WRT conversion kit or dedicated upper, and the cost factor pushed me towards the conversion (I look forward to putting the saved $ towards ammo). Brownells has an excellent return policy, so I figured if the CMMG kit didn't work out I could pursue other options.
gotm4 will be installing at least one (maybe two) of those RIS II rails tomorrow. You could always add yours to his assembly line; as of yesterday afternoon VA arms had one brown/one black RIS II rail left on the shelf - you know you want it :cool:
I'm going to experiment with several brands of ammo, and I hope to find a reasonably priced (read cheap) copper plated bullet that the conversion likes. I can't say for certain, but I think the copper plating will give leave less funk in the barrel for me to clean out.
My Buck Mark and Marlin 60 both like Remington Golden, so I am hoping my CMMG, when it arrives in a few days will like it also. I'll post results.
I was on the fence WRT conversion kit or dedicated upper, and the cost factor pushed me towards the conversion (I look forward to putting the saved $ towards ammo).
I was on the fence also, but went with CMMG due to recent positive reviews after it started shipping. And the money I saved went into 1,000 PRVI 5.56. I bought mine directly from CMMG, but I figure if it doesn't work out I can always sell it and go with a TacSol upper later.
FromMyColdDeadHand
11-07-08, 17:52
How does the Bolt open feature work?
The magazine holds the bolt back after the last round, but when you drop the magazine the bolt rides forward - insert a fresh mag and pull the charging handle to go hot...
Pk,
gotm4 will be installing at least one (maybe two) of those RIS II rails tomorrow. You could always add yours to his assembly line; as of yesterday afternoon VA arms had one brown/one black RIS II rail left on the shelf - you know you want it :cool:
Don't be afraid of the light, Caroline! Walk into the light! :D
The conversion kit will certainly offset funds for a dedicated .22 upper, but I've got to queue up the SBR build first. That, PMAGs, ammo, new scope (Thanks for the quick-look Robb!) a 6.5 G upper and a rebuild / upgrade of my CZ-75 are going to keep my discretionary account tied up for a little while. Damn BRD!
Pk
mini update:
I was able to put another ~300 rounds down range last night, and I tried two additional brands of ammunition.
Winchester 36gr copper plated (333-round value pack)
http://www.midwayusa.com/midwayusa/staticpages/highres/952255.jpg
-experienced a moderately high rate of failure to go bang.
Aguila Super Extra 40gr copper plated
http://www.midwayusa.com/midwayusa/staticpages/highres/176566.jpg
- could not get even one round to fire (loaded/tried ~40 rounds).
Weird, the Aguila works like a champ (and is pretty accurate) in my Ruger MKIII 22/45.
It looks like I'll continue the experiment with various types of Federal/American Eagle ammo, as that consistently works so far.
Just got 10 of these kits in. They look pretty clean and have a better finish on them.
C4
Just got 10 of these kits in. They look pretty clean and have a better finish on them.
C4
Maybe this is a dumb question, but are you going to sell them? I can't find them on your site...
Ben
mini update:
I was able to put another ~300 rounds down range last night, and I tried two additional brands of ammunition.
Winchester 36gr copper plated (333-round value pack)
-experienced a moderately high rate of failure to go bang.
Aguila Super Extra 40gr copper plated
- could not get even one round to fire (loaded/tried ~40 rounds).
Weird, the Aguila works like a champ (and is pretty accurate) in my Ruger MKIII 22/45.
It looks like I'll continue the experiment with various types of Federal/American Eagle ammo, as that consistently works so far.
So, if the Aguila works in your Ruger pistol, and it doesn't work in your CMMG-kitted rifle, then there's something wrong with the CMMG kit or your rifle, right?
What would cause these failures-to-fire? Is the hammer not hitting the firing pin hard enough? Is something wrong with the firing pin in the CMMG kit?
Curious minds want to know,
Ben
So, if the Aguila works in your Ruger pistol, and it doesn't work in your CMMG-kitted rifle, then there's something wrong with the CMMG kit or your rifle, right?
What would cause these failures-to-fire? Is the hammer not hitting the firing pin hard enough? Is something wrong with the firing pin in the CMMG kit?
Curious minds want to know,
Ben
I don't think there's anything wrong with the CMMG kit, or my rifle. If I had to guess, I think Federal/American Eagle ammo has a softer primer. I did a bit of research, and Spike's recommends using Federal ammo with their conversion kits/dedicated uppers. I'm checking to see if other manufacturers say the same...
In my limited experience, .22lr pistols/rifles can be picky about ammo. A friend of mine also has a Ruger pistol, and his won't fire my Aguila ammo either :confused: it's just one of those things. Try several brands to see what works and then run with it.
Maybe this is a dumb question, but are you going to sell them? I can't find them on your site...
Ben
Yes we are.
C4
decodeddiesel
11-13-08, 00:23
Man I want one of these. Hopefully they become available again soon.
My question is in regards to barrel life (chrome lining, etc)? With cheaper ammo you're more likely to shoot higher quantities down the barrel. So correct me if I'm wrong, but in essence aren't you shortening the life of your barrel by shooting the .22LR.
I don't know anything, but it seems to me that the much reduced pressure/speed/weight of the .22lr cartridge/bullet would only do a small fraction as much barrel wear as 5.56.
Man I want one of these. Hopefully they become available again soon.
We have them in stock and should get them on the website soon.
C4
decodeddiesel
11-13-08, 09:18
We have them in stock and should get them on the website soon.
C4
Well when you do, I shall order one :D
decodeddiesel
11-13-08, 09:20
I don't know anything, but it seems to me that the much reduced pressure/speed/weight of the .22lr cartridge/bullet would only do a small fraction as much barrel wear as 5.56.
Yeah you're not going to see as much barrel erosion due to the way lower pressures and friction. You could see increased lead fouling due to the jacketed bullets, but that's easily solved with a strict cleaning regiment.
Just took my CMMG .22 kit out this morning. Lubed it up real good and ran 300 rounds flawlessly out of my 1/7 LMT upper. POI was very similar to 5.56...close enough to hit golf balls at 30 yards without adjustment.
Just took my CMMG .22 kit out this morning. Lubed it up real good and ran 300 rounds flawlessly out of my 1/7 LMT upper. POI was very similar to 5.56...close enough to hit golf balls at 30 yards without adjustment.
nice!
I stopped by the range on my way home from work today and put another ~200 rounds of Fed bulk pack .22lr down the pipe. I'm now able to load the mag w/25 rounds without issue, and it functioned well with the Fed bulk pack ammo.
The unit is filthy - I've got some cleaning to do tonight...
I spent a bit of time googling for spare parts for the Atchisson-Ciener/CMMG .22lr conversion. In addition to finding someone that offers spare recoil & firing pin springs (here (http://www.lakesideguns.com/)), I found a few interesting links for troubleshooting the unit.
I had a little bit of free time, and I love to tinker, so I decided to strip it down and give it a good cleaning and see what the innards look like. There's a thread on TOS (http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=2&f=282&t=163180) that shows how to field strip the conversion unit for cleaning.
After reading this thread (http://home.netcom.com/~uzisubgun/id3.html) I decided to venture into the firing pin and clean up that area. After driving out the FP retaining pin, I had to work pretty hard to get the FP out. I figured maybe it was pretty gunky, but after cleaning up the channel with a q-tip and wiping down the FP I inserted it to see if it traveled freely. Oddly enough it did not; there was a lot of binding.
I grabbed a small strip of 600 grit paper and soaked it with oil, wrapped it around the FP and gently turned it. Every few turns I would insert it into the bolt to see if it dropped free. After a few minutes I massaged the FP so that it rides freely in the bolt.
I wonder if the FP not moving freely in the bolt may have caused some of the failure-to-fire issues that crept up with different brands of ammo. I'm going to run the various ammo again at my next range visit to see if any changes are noted. Additionally, I may try clipping one coil from the FP spring to see if that further alleviates light primer strikes.
I found one small burr on my extractor and I plan to remove it from the bolt and then clean up any rough spots - maybe that'll reduce extraction issues that creep up... I'll post further updates as I continue to get this thing tuned.
It seems that most people running 22 uppers or conversion kits are using some form of high vel ammo such as federal bulk or the similar. Anyone using standard vel ammo reliably both in semi and full? What about sub-sonics?
Littlelebowski
11-17-08, 06:50
LittleLebowski was also there, but he was with someone on the line so I chose not to interrupt/introduce myself...
Say Hi next time! I would have loved to see the .22 conversion.
Say Hi next time! I would have loved to see the .22 conversion.
will do!
another update:
I removed the extractor today and filed down that small bump/burr on the end. I left the firing pin out and reassembled it to see how it extracted during hand cycling and it seemed kind of weak. I'm curious if that small bump on the end of the hook was all that was grabbing the brass... I hope to get some range time in the next day or two to see how it runs.
Either way, I plan to replace the extractor with a BDM (http://blackdogmachinellc.net/ciener-extractor.aspx) piece.
And in the FWIW department, I found that a BCM extractor insert (http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/BCM-Extractor-Spring-Uprade-Kit-p/bcm%20extractor%20spring%20%203pack.htm) fits in the extractor spring on the .22lr kit. I may experiment with the black/blue inserts to see if they have any benefit with extraction as there are no apparent sources of heavy duty extractor springs.
I'll post more updates as I plow ahead :cool:
I was able to hit the range today after work, and my firing pin mod did the trick. I fired ~100 rounds, a mix of Fed Bulk, Aquila and Win Bulk with 100% success!
I compared the firing pin mark on the brass and the indentation was more apparent. Weird to think that the FP was hanging up in stock form. If you're having failure to fire problems you owe it to yourself to check the FP to verify it moves freely in the channel. I forgot to note that my Colt 6920 (as modded by SAW) has a low mass hammer and 'blue' hammer spring (trigger pull weight is ~4.5#).
My extractor mod was on the money too - not one failure to extract. It's nice when it feeds/fires/ejects like it should :cool: I still plan to experiment with blue/black extractor spring inserts to see if it helps or not.
I'll throw some pics up ~Friday to show what I modded - maybe it'll help others.
Since people are now buying .22 LR conversions as fast as they can find them, lets add some clarity to the issue of .22 LR ammo & malfunctions. I've been shooting various conversions for a good number of years & have tested a lot of .22 LR dedicated weapons, conversions & suppressors.
Essentially, expect each individual .22 LR firearm or conversion to "like' or 'dislike' various types & brands of ammo. Some will feed, fire & eject everything while others are very picky as to which ammo they'll digest. This is common within the .22 LR world & similar weapons & conversions lined-up side by side might, or might not, function with the same ammo. The real bitch is when you get one that will only fire one brand & type of ammo. Either stock-up on that ammo or dump the bitch.
Many people spend a lot of money on quality ammo for their centerfire weapons, but when they shoot .22 rimfire, they go for the cheapest bulk ammo available. The trick, if there is one, is to try as many different types & brands of .22 ammo to find out what works best in your gun for accuracy & function. Then, stock-up on it accordingly. Typically, better quality ammo = better performance = higher cost. But, the cost of the .22 conversion & ammo is so much cheaper than the centerfire version, it doesn't pay to go cheap here.
CCI Mini-Mags usually will work in just about anything. They're very reliable & accurate as .22s go. However, I once had several examples of a very nice .22 autoloading pistol to test & one of them would only work with CCI Green Label. I mean, nothing else would function reliably for one magazine - only this brand & type. Generally Ruger 10/22s, Ruger Mk series & Walther P22s work well with lots of different ammo - suppressed or unsuppressed. But, there are examples out there that don't work for crap. Sometimes it's the weapon, the ammo or the shooter.
Advantage Arms conversions come with a list of recommended ammo that usually works best. My personal Glock conversion works best with their recommendation, especially when suppressed. However, I've tried it with other ammo & found that it works fairly well to a point with ammo they don't recommend. It gets dirty faster with the 'non-specified' ammo, & suppressed it will work for short periods of time until it gets too dirty to function properly.
Find what works best for you in your weapon & try as many different types ammo as you can. They're really very cheap & it's well worth it in the end. If it functions fine with Wally World Special Bulk Ammo - so be it! Treat each one individually & find out what shoots best in your example. Then, have at it.
I have been thinking about getting one of these as well just for the fun factor. I "think" I read somewhere that these kits can create problems with LMT lowers. I think it was something about the hammer breaking or something similar to that. I could put it in my Colt LE6920 but was a bit worried when I heard about parts breaking in lowers.
Anyone else heard about this? Seems that I read it here or on AR15.
my BDM extractor arrived in the mail today:
BDM on the left, factory on the right
http://tinyurl.com/5nvo8x
http://tinyurl.com/57cl86
http://tinyurl.com/6zm9gk
I should have taken a pic before I filed on the factory extractor - it had a noticeable bump on the extractor face, which I'm certain caused the FTEs I had initially. After the file/cleanup job it worked like a champ, but the BDM piece looks like it'll perform well.
I have not tried it (yet), but the black insert from a BCM AR15 extractor upgrade fits in the .22lr extractor spring. If you're having extraction problems and have one on hand you could give it a try, otherwise order the BDM replacement extractor.
http://tinyurl.com/6n6r8l
I oiled up 600 grit sandpaper and turned the FP down a little at a time until it fell in/out of the FP tunnel smoothly (it was very rough and would not fall free in factory trim). I think this alone solved the light primer/failure to go bang that I initially experience with Remington and Aguila ammo. I've read that you can trim 1-2 coils off the FP spring (not shown), but I don't intend to go that route as all the ammo I've tried now fires without issue.
Note how ugly the feed ramp is - that's how it came from the factory :eek: At any rate, it feeds fine so I'll leave it be...
http://tinyurl.com/6ru5rs
That's about it for now. I hope to hit the range tonight/tomorrow and see how the new extractor performs.
ETA: I just got back from the NRA range (it was packed) and I was able to put ~100 rounds down range to function check the new extractor. It fed/fired/ejected with zero issues - ammo was a mix of Fed AE 5022, Aguila, Remington bulk pack and Fed bulk pack.
Hey Linder,
I'm the OP, and I really appreciate this. This is a better response than I could have ever hoped for.
Now, back to writing letters to Santa about how good I've been...
Bimmer
Hey Linder,
I'm the OP, and I really appreciate this. This is a better response than I could have ever hoped for...
Bimmer
I thought I started this thread... :p
Robb Jensen
11-23-08, 06:08
I thought I started this thread... :p
Hello me, meet the real (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mudQ-QlFIMk) me.......:p
I thought I started this thread... :p
You did, and I also thank you for it. You have really provided some great info here, which will be of great value to me if my CMMG ever gets shipped.
I ordered it on 11/4 after corresponding with CMMG earlier the same day about availability. I was told they were in stock and shipping so I placed my oder. I waited the CMMG requested 14 days before inquiring and when it hadn't arrived I asked what was up with my order. I received an email back that saying they couldn't tell me exactly when it would ship but that it would be "soon" as they were waiting on inventory.
I thought I started this thread... :p
Oops. This is embarrassing. I'd been going back and forth between this thread and the one I started asking about .22 conversions with 1/7 twist barrels...
No matter who started it, I really DO appreciate this.
no worries Bim - I'm just pullin' your leg :D
I ordered it on 11/4 after corresponding with CMMG earlier the same day about availability. I was told they were in stock and shipping so I placed my oder. I waited the CMMG requested 14 days before inquiring and when it hadn't arrived I asked what was up with my order. I received an email back that saying they couldn't tell me exactly when it would ship but that it would be "soon" as they were waiting on inventory.
CMMG finally charged my credit card for the order yesterday so hopefully it is shipping; however, I haven't received any shipping notice yet.
I did look at their web site today and their message now says:
"Rifle and upper orders are averaging 6-8 weeks to process and ship for items that are in stock. Back orders are being accepted for out of stock items, but we are unable to estimate delivery times on these items."
"ALL order status inquiries must be submitted by email(sales@cmmginc.com) or by fax(660-248-2290). Please do not send order status request until 8 weeks after order is placed. This keeps personnel freed up to fulfill orders as quickly as possible."
Their message previously said not to inquire about your order until after 14 days.
Surprise, surprise - it got delivered this afternoon. Weather permitting, I will run some throught it in the morning before I stuff myself with turkey. Happy T-day all!
Surprise, surprise - it got delivered this afternoon. Weather permitting, I will run some throught it in the morning before I stuff myself with turkey. Happy T-day all!
sweet!
I'm now able to load the mag w/25 rounds without issue,....
What is the secret? I loaded my 4 BDM mags up this afternoon to get ready for the range tomorrow, but I couldn't get more than 20 per mag, and even that was a struggle.
What is the secret? I loaded my 4 BDM mags up this afternoon to get ready for the range tomorrow, but I couldn't get more than 20 per mag, and even that was a struggle.
the secret? several range visits and ~500 rounds :D
Seriously, just leave it at 20-rounds for the first few visits your thumb will thank you...
Well, I got a crack in my chamber adapter last weekend. Not quite sure how that happened but it did. Called up CMMG the next day, they paid for me to send it back and they shipped me a new one. Can't beat the customer service. I'm very glad I bought from CMMG instead of Ceiner!
Well, I got a crack in my chamber adapter last weekend. Not quite sure how that happened but it did. Called up CMMG the next day, they paid for me to send it back and they shipped me a new one. Can't beat the customer service. I'm very glad I bought from CMMG instead of Ceiner!
can you describe the crack? I noted a seam at the top that runs the length of my chamber adapter - just assumed it was manufactured that way. I keep an eye on it, but it hasn't done anything out of the ordinary yet...
can you describe the crack? I noted a seam at the top that runs the length of my chamber adapter - just assumed it was manufactured that way. I keep an eye on it, but it hasn't done anything out of the ordinary yet...
I forgot to take a picture of it before I mailed it in, but it went almost all the way down the length of the chamber adapter and had cracked through, causing the chamber adapter to expand with any pressure. It definitely cracked when I was firing it. On the top of the chamber adapter, there was a indentation, so perhaps it had been bumped in the factory and cause it to weaken. I was pretty bummed because I only had a couple hundred rounds through it but I was relieved after talking with CMMG.
Keesh,
Here's how mine looks, a portion of it is welded and a portion of it not (note the seam/gap). I can't say for certain, but I think it looked like this since day one...
http://tinyurl.com/5phfn6
I do note that it's a little tough to get the conversion out after shooting ~300 rounds or so, but I figured it may have expanded a little with heat. No bumps/indentations/bulges that I can see or feel. Hrmm, now you got me wondering.
austin12gauge - how does yours look?
Yep, that's pretty much what mine looked like but the crack went all the way down. I compared it to my friend's Ciener kit and his didn't have the crack. I'm shooting this through a brand new 10.5" LMT upper so I didn't wanna take my chances messing with the chamber, since I shoot 5.56 out of the same upper.
Thanks Keesh. I'll mark the ends of the weld with a sharpie and keep track of it to make sure it's holding up.
No offense, lindertw, but that looks nasty. I just looked at mine it it appears to be all one piece as I can't see any weld line at all. I'll check it again after I shoot it and let you know. It is nice to know they have a lifetime warranty and are easier to deal with than JC.
I'll email CMMG a pic of the chamber adapter and see if they'll replace it.
FromMyColdDeadHand
11-26-08, 21:11
I just got mine today. I looked the chamber adaptor and I don't see any weld line at all? If I had to guess, I'd say that it was extruded. Where is the weld on the part (top, bottom?)?
I just got mine today. I looked the chamber adaptor and I don't see any weld line at all? If I had to guess, I'd say that it was extruded. Where is the weld on the part (top, bottom?)?
Looks like we both got ours on the same day. I thought maybe it was extruded also. Maybe we got an improved version?
I just got mine today. I looked the chamber adaptor and I don't see any weld line at all? If I had to guess, I'd say that it was extruded. Where is the weld on the part (top, bottom?)?
it runs along the top.
FromMyColdDeadHand
11-27-08, 11:19
Nuthin', totally seam and weldless.
Linder, everybody,
Is the "Federal bulk" .22 ammo you're shooting "high velocity," or not? I'm starting to collect different types of ammo in anticipation of getting a kit, and my impression was that these kits generally funtion best (most reliably) with "high velocity" ammo.
Or is the "high velocity" label just marketing hype?
Ben
The federal bulk I have on hand is the maroon/black box of 550 from Walmart. Side of the box reads:
high velocity
36 grain
copper plated
hollow point
CarlosDJackal
11-27-08, 21:23
The federal bulk I have on hand is the maroon/black box of 550 from Walmart. Side of the box reads:
high velocity
36 grain
copper plated
hollow point
That's the same one I use through all my .22LR conversion kits and it's been flawless.
Took my CMMG 22LR/Noveske N4 combo to the range yesterday. I put 8 mags of 20 each thru it for 160 rounds total and had numerous failures to feed and fire, both due the bolt not closing all the way. I simply dropped the mag and cycled the bolt (shell stayed in chamber) and it then always locked up and fired. I also wondered if I had mag problems, but it occurred with all 4 BDM mags I had so I doubt it.
I also had a few light strikes but I was able to get all failures to fire to work in my Buck Mark Practical URX (love it) except 2, which I put down to dud ammo. I only had Remington Golden HPs to work with as my Buck Mark and Marlin 60 function well with it and I was hoping the CMMG would also. I am also going to try some other HV as well, probably Federal and CCI.
I am going to clean the the CMMG well today (should have before I took it out, but I didn't - I know, I know) and maybe strip it down to see if I have the same FP problem that lindertw had. The good news is that whenever it went bang I had no extraction problems.
I will say I was pleased with the accuracy out of a 1:7 barrel. I have my Aimpoint Micro zeroed at 50 yards, and at 25 yards it shoots about 1" low with PVRI 55g 5.56. With the 22LR is was shooting about 3" low at 25 yards so about 2" lower than the PRVI, an easy mental adjustment to make without having to change the zero on my Mirco.
Took my CMMG 22LR/Noveske N4 combo to the range yesterday. I put 8 mags of 20 each thru it for 160 rounds total and had numerous failures to feed and fire, both due the bolt not closing all the way. I simply dropped the mag and cycled the bolt (shell stayed in chamber) and it then always locked up and fired. I also wondered if I had mag problems, but it occurred with all 4 BDM mags I had so I doubt it.
I also had a few light strikes but I was able to get all failures to fire to work in my Buck Mark Practical URX (love it) except 2, which I put down to dud ammo. I only had Remington Golden HPs to work with as my Buck Mark and Marlin 60 function well with it and I was hoping the CMMG would also. I am also going to try some other HV as well, probably Federal and CCI.
I am going to clean the the CMMG well today (should have before I took it out, but I didn't - I know, I know) and maybe strip it down to see if I have the same FP problem that lindertw had. The good news is that whenever it went bang I had no extraction problems.
I will say I was pleased with the accuracy out of a 1:7 barrel. I have my Aimpoint Micro zeroed at 50 yards, and at 25 yards it shoots about 1" low with PVRI 55g 5.56. With the 22LR is was shooting about 3" low at 25 yards so about 2" lower than the PRVI, an easy mental adjustment to make without having to change the zero on my Mirco.
Remy Golden Bullet is the WORST .22 ammo on the blanet. I do not fault the CMMG conversion kit for not working with that ammo.
Try some Winchester Dynapoints or Federal bulk pack (much better).
C4
Remy Golden Bullet is the WORST .22 ammo on the blanet. I do not fault the CMMG conversion kit for not working with that ammo.
I didn't fault CMMG, simply reporting on my first outing. I even admitted I didn't clean it first. And since it ran about 85% with the WORST .22 ammo on the blanet I feel pretty good. Plus it was all I had at the time on Thanksgiving Day. :D
I didn't fault CMMG, simply reporting on my first outing. I even admitted I didn't clean it first. And since it ran about 85% with the WORST .22 ammo on the blanet I feel pretty good. Plus it was all I had at the time on Thanksgiving Day. :D
These kits also need a lot of lube to run properly.
C4
Found a new use for a plastic beer can handle. It works great at retaining the bolt under pressure when you remove the chamber assembly:
http://i276.photobucket.com/albums/kk16/austin12gauge/cmmg.jpg
fixed your image--gotm4
These kits also need a lot of lube to run properly.
Well, actually, no, my CMMG didn't.
Forget my first day out on the 27th when I didn't even bother to clean it first. And I was using Remington Goldens, which, as we know, is about the worst 22LR ammo on the planet.
Fast forward to today. Before I took it out today I took the bolt and chamber assemblies off the rails and cleaned everything really well. I did not take the bolt apart.
I lubed the contact areas on the rails and the bolt with a thin coating of Brian Enos Slide Glide and everything else got a very, very thin coat of gun oil. Did I say it was a thin coat?
And I picked up a couple of bulk packs of Federal Load #750 at WalMart for $13.50each.
Today was the true test. I put a whole bulk pack (550 rounds) thru it without so much as a hiccup - no failures to feed, fire or eject at all. And I didn't have to put any additional lube of any kind on the conversion bolt. The kit is pretty dirty and dry now, but the bolt continues to move as smooth as silk - love that Slide Glide. I first started using it on my M&P9FS a year or so ago.
I was loading up my 4 BDM mags to about 25 each and basically doing mag dumps one right after the other, busting up clay targets I had set on the backstop berm of the range. The only rest the gun got was when I was loading the mags. A friend came by with his own BDM mags and ran about another 100 or so thru it, again with no failures of any kind.
I am a happy camper and highly endorse the CMMG conversion kit.
after seeing a pic of my chamber adapter CMMG is sending a replacement.
after seeing a pic of my chamber adapter CMMG is sending a replacement.
Very glad to hear it! I am still not seeing a weld line on my chamber adapter.
Got my replacement today. CMMG got it back to me quick, too bad I don't have any time to take it out this week :mad:
I see no weld line on this one, looks a lot better!
Got my replacement today. CMMG got it back to me quick, too bad I don't have any time to take it out this week :mad: I see no weld line on this one, looks a lot better!
Wow! That was really quick! It is good to know that they stand behind their products and that their turnaround is quick.
I wonder what the deal with the weld line was? lindertw's kit had the weld line also, but several of us that just got our new CMMGs last week can't see a line. Anybody have any intel from CMMG on the issue?
Who has these kits in stock? Is CMMG the best source for ordering them? Not getting much luck with emailing the various online retailers of CMMG products.
Who has these kits in stock? Is CMMG the best source for ordering them? Not getting much luck with emailing the various online retailers of CMMG products.
We have 1 or 2 left in stock.
C4
after seeing a pic of my chamber adapter CMMG is sending a replacement.
Did you receive it yet? And, if you did, does it have the weld line like your old one did?
as of yesterday's today's mail - I have not received a replacement...
Dan Goodwin
12-15-08, 16:49
I am about to pull the trigger on one of these rather than a Nordic Components AR22 setup.
Anyone who has one having qualms yet?
I may well wind up getting a Nordic in the future, but figure I can get the kit and four Black Dog magazines for what it would cost me to rig up the Nordic kit.
Anyone who has one having qualms yet?
Mine is great. I am very happy with it.
Anyone who has one having qualms yet?
still waiting for my replacement chamber adapter, in the meantime my kit is a paper weight.
Been very happy with mine after I got the replacement. Hope you get yours soon lindertw!
after speaking with a live body at CMMG yesterday my replacement chamber adapter arrived today.
lindertw, I am glad you finally got yours. It took what, about 3weeks? That isn't too bad.
Does your replacement have the same weld line as on your original?
no weld line on the replacement!
Dan Goodwin
12-23-08, 18:21
Finally took the plunge and ordered the CMMG w/10 round Black Dog mag, plus two 27-rd BDs from Brownell's today. Can't hardly wait for my Christmas gift to arrive next week!
Plan on running at least one 550 pack through my 6933 before I go back to work!
Will probably get a Nordic kit, too, early in '09; got everything I need but an inexpensive free float tube.
Finally took the plunge and ordered the CMMG w/10 round Black Dog mag, plus two 27-rd BDs from Brownell's today. Can't hardly wait for my Christmas gift to arrive next week!
I hope you enjoy yours as much as i enjoy mine. Let us know how long it took from order to arrival. And we also expect a review after you have shot it. And don't make my mistake, clean it well and lube it before you shoot it and use clean ammo.
Took my CMMG kit out in 10F snowy weather and it ran like a clock for the couple hundred rounds I put through it :D
Back from a Christmas Day range session. The real reason I went was to test a trigger job I did on my Browning Buck Mark to make sure it wasn't going to double. And I took my Marlin 60 along for fun. And then I decided to make an all 22LR day of it and also took my AR with the CMMG conversion bolt in it.
I tried an experiment with the CMMG. I shot 100 rounds (4 BDM mags) of Ferderal #750 thru it first, and again had no faiures to feed, chamber, fire or extract. Then I loaded the same 4 BDM mags with Remington Goldens to see it they would work better now that my CMMG had about 1,100 rounds thru it.
The short answer is no. About halfway thru the first mag I started having failures to chamber again. Those Goldens are just too waxy to chamber reliably. The bolt picks the Goldens from the mag just fine but they would not fully chamber, thereby jamming the action. At least I can shoot them up in my Buck Mark and Marlin where they run fine, but once they are gone I will have no more.
Dan Goodwin
12-25-08, 16:26
I am a big believer in hunting with work guns, so am wondering about use of the conversion kits for hunting small game.
I keep hearing accuracy is less than stellar because .22 LR is a bit skinny for a 5.56mm bbl. Not wanting "match" accuracy but it would be nice to be able to headshoot a squirrel inside 30-40 yards.
So (and maybe this is best posted in ammo section), has anyone tried running their conversion ammo through a sizing die that bumps LR up to .224? If so, did it improve accuracy in an AR barrel any flavor and twist?
took out my kit out today and the replacement chamber adapter worked well, and stayed much cleaner than the old part :p glad to have it back online...
took out my kit out today and the replacement chamber adapter worked well, and stayed much cleaner than the old part :p
Well, yeah! It doesn't have holes in the chamber adapter! :D
If any need some help with your CMMG, Ciener, Spikes 22lr kits and using
Standard vel and Subsonic ammo here is some tuning tips.
http://home.netcom.com/~uzisubgun/id3.html
.
These kit are made for Hi Vel ammo but after some fine tuning they run great
with most any ammo you feed em.
I have 3 Cieners, 2 CMMG, 2 TacSols and 2 Spikes kits and all run Great
after fine tuning.
To make loading those BlackDog mags easy, take the mag apart and use
600 grit wet/dry sandpaper on the grooves that the follower rides in until
smooth.
If you run your finger nail down the grooves you will feel little bumps,
and when removed the mags loads and feeds better.
If you would like to use a lube to realy improve loading use Dryphite not a
wet lube or the mag will collect alot of blowback crap.
http://www.midwayusa.com/Search/#dryphite____-_
.
http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa166/redtazdog/AR22pistolwebsized.jpg
.
http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa166/redtazdog/AR22pistol4websized.jpg
.
http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa166/redtazdog/AR22TacSolSBX7websized.jpg
.
http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa166/redtazdog/22LRAR15small.jpg
.
http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa166/redtazdog/AR22TacSolSBX13websized.jpg
Dan Goodwin
12-29-08, 11:43
Christmas Delayed is OK by me!
Computer was done for a couple days so I finally got back on after doing an unsuccessful deer hunt this morning. Checked my SO email address to see progress on delivery of my CMMG unit and running the tracking no. showed it had been delivered to my front porch while I was in a tree stand!
Yep, it was there.
The chamber insert appears flawless and I'm going to have to head back up the the farm to get some trigger time this afternoon.
The Brownell's instructions state no subsonic or hyper-velocity, but I've got to see what the Aguila SSS do just for kicks.
Checked my SO email address to see progress on delivery of my CMMG unit and running the tracking no. showed it had been delivered to my front porch while I was in a tree stand!
You got it already, good! We need to know 2 things - how long from order to delivery, and how does it shoot?
Dan Goodwin
12-29-08, 16:15
Ordered 12/23. Received 12/29.
The day I ordered Brownells had 200 of the CMMG + 10-round Black Dog kits. They had the 27-rounder mags available separately.
Don't know how it shoots yet cuz I got stuck going grocery shopping with the commandant of Stalag 1369!:mad:
Did lube the rails well with 10-8 Performance Lube so have high hopes for the morrow.
As stated, the kit came with a 10-rounder and I ordered two 27-rounders. Will probably try to pick up a couplefew more next paycheck.
Stole a minute while at Wally World and found out the Fed 550 Bulk Packs were out! Dude said they won't get re-upped till after New Year's.
They had the Fed 510 AutoMatch load @ $14.35 for 375 rounds, but I am loathe to stray from my favorite .22 ammo.
Ordered 12/23. Received 12/29.
The day I ordered Brownells had 200 of the CMMG + 10-round Black Dog kits. They had the 27-rounder mags available separately.
Don't know how it shoots yet cuz I got stuck going grocery shopping with the commandant of Stalag 1369!:mad:
Did lube the rails well with 10-8 Performance Lube so have high hopes for the morrow.
As stated, the kit came with a 10-rounder and I ordered two 27-rounders. Will probably try to pick up a couplefew more next paycheck.
Stole a minute while at Wally World and found out the Fed 550 Bulk Packs were out! Dude said they won't get re-upped till after New Year's.
They had the Fed 510 AutoMatch load @ $14.35 for 375 rounds, but I am loathe to stray from my favorite .22 ammo.
.
That 10 rnd mag can be changed to a 27 rnd easy, take the mag apart and
remove the 2 plastic pegs that stop the follower.
Dan Goodwin
12-29-08, 17:04
Thanks! So it has the same mag spring, etc.?
Thanks! So it has the same mag spring, etc.?
Yes, only diference is the round plastic stubs inside the mag that need
to be filed or dremel out.
That 10 rnd mag can be changed to a 27 rnd easy, take the mag apart and remove the 2 plastic pegs that stop the follower.
Although I only bought 27 rounders, that is good info. Thanks!
Ordered 12/23. Received 12/29. The day I ordered Brownells had 200 of the CMMG + 10-round Black Dog kits.
More good info, thanks! Now we just need that range report.
BTW, I have now been thru 2 bricks of Federal 750 (1,100 rounds) and not had one single failure to fire. Very, very good reliabilty for $13.50 bricks. With Remington, I was getting 3 to 5 duds about every 100 rounds, not just with my CMMG, but with my Buck Mark and Marlin 60 as well.
Dan Goodwin
12-30-08, 17:40
Ummm, yeah, the range report.
The good news is it put 5 Aguila Sniper Subsonics into less than an inch at 25 yards about 1.5 inch under the Aimpoint dot on my 6933...and no tipping.
The bad news: It didn't feed fire or function worth a popcorn fart with Fed HiPwr bulk pak..brand new purchased today.
Sometimes the trigger wouldn't reset.
Sometimes the unit apparently didn't go into battery, it would click and nothing would happen.
Every once in awhile it looked like a light strike on the rim.
I should have paid more attention to Linder's trials and tribulations and assumed the worst.
I AM NOT a tinkerer; when I pay more than two bills for a device I expect it to work right out of the box (or well lubed as was suggested). I shouldn't have to take it apart, sand the parts down, etc.
Needless to say, I'm pissed.
I am going to clean the crap out of it tonite, relube it and try again tomorrow (another 50-mile round trip to the range).
If it is still crapping out I'm calling Brownells and demand they swap it even for a Nordic kit.
Had my 25-year-old 10/22 along and it ran through 250 rounds like it was eating popcorn at a horror movie.
Any suggestions appreciated, but I'm feeling burnt.
What you described is what happened to me my first time out, all except for the trigger reset. But, I had not cleaned and relubed it first. And I was using the crappy Remington Golden ammo.
I went back to your post of yesterday and see you said you lubed the rails. Did you clean all of the shipping gunk off it first?
After my first outing I took the unit apart except for the firing pin scrubbed all the gunk off it with tooth brush and solvent, and dryed everything.
I then put a very light coat of Slide Glide everywhere the rails and bolt contact each other. And I lubed everywhere else with a very light coat of gun oil.
Since I also changed ammo before I took it out the second time I can't say for sure which made it work better, but it has run great every since with little to no maintenence. Good luck!
bummer Dan - you'll enjoy it once everything settles in...
If you have a small punch, try removing the firing pin retaining pin and see if the firing pin falls out under it's own weight. I've got a hunch it could use a little 'polishing' so that it travels freely in the bolt; pay attention to the end of the pin where it strikes the primer. I found that mine would sometimes hang up in the hole in the bolt face. The minor tweaking I did made a significant difference.
Don't load your magazine(s) to capacity until you have 300-500 rounds through it; heck I couldn't load it to capacity if I tried the first few range visits, the magazine spring was very stiff. Now that mine is broken in I can load it up and run it with no issues.
Best of luck!
I have a Ciener kit that runs perfectly with 2 different ARs and refused to run at all with another gun for some reason. Same ammo, same time, same place.
Dan Goodwin
12-30-08, 19:46
OK. Brake Cleaner. Lube. Aand a Good Act of Contrition. Still think it's wrong to have to re-manufacture small parts to ensure proper function.
I have a Ciener kit that runs perfectly with 2 different ARs and refused to run at all with another gun for some reason. Same ammo, same time, same place.
The AR that dousnt work has a stronger hammer spring than the 2 guns that work.
Thats my guess because this is a common problem, not all trigger springs,
hammer springs, disconector springs have the same strength.
If the hammer spring is to strong it wont always let the bolt come back far enough
to cycle the gun.
My replacement chamber adapter from CMMG has cracked. No pics, but it looks just like the original that went south on me. I put ~100 rounds down range tonight, for a total of ~200 since receiving the replacement adapter.
I'm calling Brownells on Monday to discuss return of the item, and I'll email CMMG to let them know that their part failed again.
Dan Goodwin
01-08-09, 15:18
Home computer has been beset by goblins, but sent unit back to CMMG via UPS on Monday with their call tag.
Praying the replacement works right when it arrives!
My replacement chamber adapter from CMMG has cracked. No pics, but it looks just like the original that went south on me. I put ~100 rounds down range tonight, for a total of ~200 since receiving the replacement adapter. I'm calling Brownells on Monday to discuss return of the item, and I'll email CMMG to let them know that their part failed again.
That really sucks. Please let us know what happens. You too, Dan. Mine is still working fine.
That really sucks. Please let us know what happens. You too, Dan. Mine is still working fine.
Contacted CMMG to let them know my replacement cracked, and provided ammo info to include lot # (which they requested). Spoke with Brownells and they said there shouldn't be any problems returning it for a refund. Should Brownells refuse the return (as it's well used and now 2x broken chamber adapters) CMMG said they would accept the return.
Guess I'll do another 10/22 build to get my .22lr fix...
Guess I'll do another 10/22 build to get my .22lr fix...
It is a lot more money, but you could go with a dedicated upper (Spike's or TacSol) as no chamber adaper is required.
Put another 250 rounds thru my CMMG today and still no failures to feed, chamber or extract.
I finally had 1 failure to fire with the Federal #750 but it wasn't the CMMG's fault. The round wouldn't fire in my Buck Mark either. That is only 1 FTFire out of nearly 1,650 rounds (3 bricks) of the Federal. I was getting 3 to 5 per 100 with the Remington Goldens.
Dan Goodwin
01-14-09, 10:23
Received replacement unit yesterday; one week after sending original back to CMMG. May not get to shoot it till this weekend. No explanation letter about original unit or anything else. Just the part in the box.
Also emailed Tech Support Monday asking if they knew what the problem was with the first one and have not yet received answer.
Sure hope it works!
Can anyone tell me is the CMMG .22cal conversion the Same as Spikes Tactical .22cal converson or is CMMG made to be stronger?
Grant, I can't find CMMG .22 conversion kit on your web site?
Can anyone tell me is the CMMG .22cal conversion the Same as Spikes Tactical .22cal converson or is CMMG made to be stronger?
Spikes is a little different, nickel plated, o-ring on the chamber adapter, maybe some other little things as well. The CMMG looks to be a direct copy of the original Ceiner unit. I doubt the CMMG is made stronger than the others.
Dan Goodwin
01-16-09, 19:45
Got the replacement unit in couple days back. Got a brief chance to fire it today. Two mags, 20 rds ea., only one FTE (stovepipe...sideways).
This is a big improvement. Hope to try running the rest of that 550-round box through it this weekend.
CMMG said the unit I sent back ran fine on the same Fed BulkPak I use.
Who knows???
Shot mine today and it ran through 380 rounds like fecal matter through a goose....except for a light primer strike.
Dan Goodwin
02-19-09, 10:37
Just an update. Finally got to run a couple hundred through the replacement unit sent directly by CMMG and it appears to be running fine; just one stovepipe in first mag full.
Gonna try to get a serious round count going as warmer/DRIER weather arrives.
It was a real pleasure firing double-taps on the move at steel without worry about 60 cents per trigger squeeze.
Contacted CMMG to let them know my replacement cracked, and provided ammo info to include lot # (which they requested). Spoke with Brownells and they said there shouldn't be any problems returning it for a refund. Should Brownells refuse the return (as it's well used and now 2x broken chamber adapters) CMMG said they would accept the return. Guess I'll do another 10/22 build to get my .22lr fix...
lindertw, what did you decide to do and how did it work out?
I'm anxiously awaiting the arrival of my CMMG kit at the end of the month. Hearing about all of your experiences has been a big help.
I'll be closely inspecting the chamber inserts for seams or cracks, and I've got a stock of Federal bulk pack and CCI Mini-Mags...
Bimmer
I encountered problems tonight with my CMMG kit, but I think it's magazine related (cracked).
I've shot around 70-100 rounds so far with it in a 6920. Tonight, the rounds started flipping nose up and backwards into the top of the bolt group. I had to pry them out. It seems that the magazine has developed a crack that runs up into the top of the opening. I'm hoping that's what the problem is, and will try and order a replacement this weekend.
Was a BDM mag? Did you drop it? Do you only have one mag?
It's a Black Dog mag, never dropped. It appears that the top rear screw was tightened too much during assembly. Stress fracture emanating from that screw at a 45* angle through the middle of the feed opening where the notch is for the rear of the round. Magazine is cracked on both sides of the plastic.
This is the only magazine I have for the conversion kit.
Wanted to sight in my new DPMS M4 Upper recently received at my local pistol range which of course forbids centerfire rifle shooting but allows .22 rimfire ;)
I have a CMMG Bargain Bin (Gun#1) rifle bought a while back that I run a Ciener kit in and it runs flawlessly. I have a new spare Ciener and recently bought a new CMMG kit.
So I get to the range and take out the BCG and spray the CMMG with breakfree and slide it in. SNUG fit, and the chamber insert doesn't go it as easily as my other Gun #1 kit did but I figured it was just new and needed breaking in. Keep in mind the DPMS M4 Upper (1/9 Twist, 14.5" with Vortex perm attached, chrome lined) was clean as a whistle. So I got the unit seated and closed the upper and started sighting in.
Fired about 60-70 rounds, one failure to fire (I attributed to Fed Bulk Pack ammo) and I had it zeroed in ready to go.
So I broke open the upper and proceeded to try and remove the CMMG kit - NO GO :mad: I went WTH and proceeded to try to muscle it out. Again, no go. :rolleyes:
So crap, put it in my case. Did some other things at the range, had another shooter look at it and try and remove it - no go.
Got home that evening and took it out on my porch and figured I'd try using a brass punch to try and get it out. Still couldn't get the SOB out. :mad:
Now I'm really irritated. So I get a GI Cleaning rod with the patch tip on the end, slide it down the barrel and figure I can tap it out. Using my light brass hammer I proceeded on banging on it until the TIP BENT AND LODGED ON THE BREECHFACE. The thing still wouldn't budge. So I got a bigger hammer :)
I finally managed to get the thing out, it looked a little bent, and managed to mangle my charging handle, but nothing else any worse for the wear.
I got my cleaning rod extracted from the unit and examined it for damage, couldn't see anything but the thing clearly was not working right, wouldn't slide nice. Disassembled, futzed with it and got it back functional.
So I thought that was weird, and shouldn't have caused me that much grief. So I took the kit out of Gun #1 and tried to put it in this DPMS - same thing, tight fit, not easy snap in. So I took my NEW Ciener kit, tried it, same thing, too tight.
So I go get a "few" of my other ARs and tried the kits in them - some they slide in easy and snap in place easily - some are tight and won't go in like my DPMS rifle.
So now I'm saying to myself, I've either got a lot of AR's with out of spec chambers or these Kits are "not so universal" in installation.
Lesson learned: Check your uppers for easy installation - if it don't slide in, snap in easily, and remove easily - don't try using it :rolleyes: I'll stick with my Gun#1 for now as it is my go-to rimfire AR, and if I need another one, I'll make sure to find the right upper that works.
Thoughts?
James
If the kit fits easily in one gun but not another, the difference is in the guns, not the kit.
If the kit fits easily in one gun but not another, the difference is in the guns, not the kit.
Right, but the old Ciener kit fits in the CMMG upper just fine, but the CMMG kit doesn't fit in the CMMG upper...
I'm finally receiving my kit next weekend (birthday present). Crossing my fingers...
If the kit fits easily in one gun but not another, the difference is in the guns, not the kit.
I understand - I'm just surprised with the variation between supposed "standard" 5.56 Nato chambers. :mad:
James
I understand - I'm just surprised with the variation between supposed "standard" 5.56 Nato chambers.
Don't be. There have been numerous discussions here about supposed NATO chambers that weren't.
Wait, I don't get it.
Was it the DPMS (famous for .223 chambers labelled 5.56) upper or the CMMG upper that's such an impossibly tight fit?
I understood that it was the CMMG upper which worked with the Ciener kit that was the problem with the new CMMG kit, i.e., there's something wrong with the CMMG .22 kit.
And is the chamber insert the problem? Or is it that the whole unit is tight in the upper receiver? Maybe the chamber insert needs a close examination and maybe some polishing?
Please clarify this. I'm crossing my fingers, hoping that mine will be one of the ones that really does just drop in and work, but I'm trying to prepare myself to do some trouble-shooting if it doesn't.
Bimmer
I'm crossing my fingers, hoping that mine will be one of the ones that really does just drop in and work, but I'm trying to prepare myself to do some trouble-shooting if it doesn't.
I appreciate your concerns. My CMMG fits my upper and chamber easily and runs like a swiss watch on Federal #750 bulk.
lindertw, what did you decide to do and how did it work out?
sorry, hadn't checked this thread in a while... I returned the CMMG conversion kit to Brownells and picked up a 10/22 to plink with.
this may be an obvious question,
but am I correct to assume that any of the magazines on the Black Dog website for Atchisson/Ciener will work with the CMMG kit?
For example, if I want a tan 27 round, shouldn't be any problem should there?
but am I correct to assume that any of the magazines on the Black Dog website for Atchisson/Ciener will work with the CMMG kit?
Yes they will.
James
Was it the DPMS (famous for .223 chambers labelled 5.56) upper or the CMMG upper that's such an impossibly tight fit?
Gun #1: CMMG 5.56 Upper works fine with all three of my kits (2 x Ciener and 1 x CMMG)
Gun #2: DPMG 5.56 Upper will not work with any of my three kits.
Gun #3: Colt LE6920 Upper works fine with all three kits
Gun #4: CMMG 5.56 Upper will not work with any of my kits.
Haven't tried any of my other rifles yes to see if they fit.
BTW, shot my DPMS Gun #2 tonight in a match with 5.56 LC ammo and it worked flawlessly. So the chamber is up to spec for that ;)
James
Another brick of Federal # 750 bulk down range today - 50 out of my Buck Mark and 500 out of my CMMG 22LR AR conversion. Not one hiccup with either gun and no failures to fire due to bad ammo. I am still a happy camper with the CMMG. That makes about 2,300 trouble free Federal rounds thru the CMMG to date.
I bought one of these kits yesterday at the gunshow. Just a bolt and one Black Dog mag. We took it to the 25 yard range today. Weapon is a Noveske N4 with a T1, uncleaned since god knows when, we ran a couple hundred rounds of Wolf through it a few weeks ago.
Anyhow, lubed the bolt with Miltec and put her in. With the help of my 12 year old we put around 100 rounds through it. Not a lot of rounds but we had fun. Ammo was all high velocity. Federal Champion (blue box, 40 grain solid) 45 rounds no problems at all. Winchester Super X (silver box, 40 grain HP) 40 rounds no problems. Older Winchester Super X (white box, 40 grain solid) 20 rounds, two stovepipes. I have no idea how old the Winchester solid ammo is, it's been in my gargage for 10 years and I got it from someone else. For the record it shot fine out of a Buckmark I had with me. Most of the rounds were fired in 10 and 5 round strings just to try it out. We did run a mag of 20 rounds Win HP and Federal solid mixed with no issue. The T1 is zeroed at 50 yards with 5.56 and was hitting about 1.5 inches low at 25 yards. Like I said not a lot of rounds today but a lot of fun and we will definitely get some use out of it with ammo costs the way they are.
I encountered problems tonight with my CMMG kit, but I think it's magazine related (cracked).
I've shot around 70-100 rounds so far with it in a 6920. Tonight, the rounds started flipping nose up and backwards into the top of the bolt group. I had to pry them out. It seems that the magazine has developed a crack that runs up into the top of the opening. I'm hoping that's what the problem is, and will try and order a replacement this weekend.
Update
I ordered a new magazine from BD and finally got a chance to try it tonight. Shot 8 Mini-Mags through it. Flawless. I'll try and get out and do some more later this week but I saw an immediate improvement. Bad magazine is my guess, all related to that crack.
steppenwolf
03-26-09, 06:12
Probably a stupid question, but is anyone running the CMMG .22 unit with BDM mags in an LMT MRP upper?
Spikes offers a dedicated .22 MRP barrel in 16" and 11.5", and separately a .22 bolt for use with the .22 MRP barrels. The cost-out difference between the Spikes set-up and the CMMG unit is obviously substantial.
I'd like to go with the CMMG, but was curious about its reliability in an MRP, if anyone knows.
Thanks ...
I finally got my kit, and I finally took it to the range last weekend and shot 100+ trouble-free rounds through it.
My kit came totally dry, so I liberally oiled it with Mobil 1, 15w50.
Per the recommendations here and elsewhere, I shot 70 rounds of CCI Mini-Mags, interspersed with 30-40 rounds of Federal "value pack" copper-plated high-velocity.
I've got a 1/7 14.5" CMMG upper.
I used the three 15-round mags that I bought with my kit, though I only loaded 10 rounds in them at a time (I wanted to keep very careful track of how much I was shooting, and I run out of fingers at 10).
There was no trace of any seam or crack on the chamber insert before or after shooting it.
My impressions:
It IS "drop in" (knock on wood). I had to give mine a good shove to get the chamber insert to go forward the last 1/2", but I had NO problems with mine at all (mine slipped right back out).
It's fun. Recoil is minimal, but there's a real "crack" when it fires a .22lr. Shooting without ear protection wasn't painful, but wasn't pleasant (I did this for a couple rounds out of curiosity).
Accuracy sucks. At 20yds I shot 1-1/2" and 2" 10-round groups, with one flier. At 50yds my 10-round groups were 6" or so. I was kneeling, shooting off a rest (the hood of my car). By comparison, my Marlin bolt-action .22 shoots 1-1/2" groups at 50yds.
It's dirty. After only 100 or so rounds, there's carbon and powder fouling throughout. The regular BCG doesn't look anywhere near this dirty after 100 rounds of 5.56.
Now, where can I get another box of the Federal "value pack!?"
Bimmer
Another brick of Federal # 750 bulk down range today - 50 out of my Buck Mark and 500 out of my CMMG 22LR AR conversion. Not one hiccup with either gun and no failures to fire due to bad ammo. I am still a happy camper with the CMMG. That makes about 2,300 trouble free Federal rounds thru the CMMG to date.
It has been awhile since I have been shooting, but I put another 200 trouble free rounds of Federal #750 thru my CMMG conversion this morning.
What is all the more remarkable is I didn't clean it after my last session of 500 rounds in March. It has just been sitting. I didn't even oil it before shooting today!
That brings my trouble free round count to 2,500.
Somehow I had missed this thread.
Very informative! Thanks to all who have contributed.
Great info here! I just bought one from Rainier arms and cant wait for it to show up!
Ok, I have an UPDATE on several tips suggested within this thread I have tried.
First, as with all new guns, I start with the feed ramp and polish that sucker up. I noticed my feed ramp was cut kinda cock-eyed, more deeper cut on the right side (defect?) I used a dremel grinding tool to even this out and then polish. With the ramp left that alone, I think I would have had a FTF.
Second, when inserting the conversion unit, the last 3/4 to 1/2 inch would not go in with out serious pressure. Since some of the folks here has had problems getting the unit back out, I decided not to push it in too deep. When I pulled it back out, I noticed some scraping marks along the phosphate coating where it was catching. Using 1000 wet/dry sandpaper, I sanded the entire insert area and removed the phosphate coating. The unit is made of SS so rusting is a not concern. I applied a small amount of anti-seize lube (choke tube lube) to the insert and it fit like a glove. Removal was much easier. Anti-seize lube must be cleaned from .233 chamber prior to shooting .223 ammo again.
Third, with the 1000 grit again, I sanded the rails as I always do to a new gun. This is equivalent to shooting 500-1000 round break-in. All sliding rail parts, inside and out, get a drop of oil and then sanded. The phosphate coating CMMG uses is great on the parts that don't touch but when in contact they actually grip each other much like taking two pieces of sandpaper and rubbing together. Removing this 'tooth' from both parts, then lubed, will make it slicked than snot.
Fourth, after reading how others where having firing pin problems, I decided to remove mine and check it. Lo and behold, my FP would not fall straight through either and hung up. Following the advice of others here, I sanded the pin with 1000 grit, removing most of the phosphate coating, dropped it in again and BAM, slid right through, no hang up.
Now I am convinced the phosphate coating is causing most of people's problems with these units. A little sandpaper on the right areas and these puppies will be smoking.
The BDM Big Dog magazines also were causing some folks problems. One person suggested taking the magazine apart and sanding out the bumps, so I did. Along the way a figured out a few more tips to these mags. My mags were new and I could barely load 20 rounds, a thumb buster for sure.
After taking the mag apart (careful not to lose any of the 3 red plastic parts and 2 springs) and sanding the inside channels where the followers ride until almost smooth, I liberally spread powdered graphite in the channels with a Qtip. Looking at the red plastic follower I noticed mold marks and bit of plastic left on from where it squeezed out during manufacture. These were grabbing the inside of the mag when I was loading and making it bind up, sooo I sanded them off, too and applied graphite. I reassembled, and I'll be a monkey's uncle if I couldn't load all 26 rounds and without hardly any pressure. Worked like a charm! I even sanded the outside corners and side ends of the mag where it contacts the mag well insides for a smoother insertion.
Anyway, I hope this helps. The CMMG is an inexpensive way of shooting but like all higher volume companies, final finish is very subjective and may require addition fine tuning. Otherwise, if they did the fine tuning themselves, they would become a lower volume, higher quality but with a much higher price tag!
Rob
Freedom Firearms of Kentucky
FromMyColdDeadHand
09-26-09, 21:25
No offense, but what drunk hillbilly monkey does CMMG have making their kits? The only thing good about their tooling marks is that someone had to have worked on it to make them. My feed ramp looked almost like it was dimpled on purpose. The bore was Rough, and even with some bore paste it seems like there are weld marks in the bore? I used up to 6000 wet sand paper and while the rails are smooth, the bolt still doesn't 'slide'. I even tried bore paste, which I've used on crappy AR BCs to slick up, and that didn't really help much.
I've used the unit once and after about 100 rounds it started to not extract. Had lubed pretty generously and I think it was HV American Eagle ammo. Looking forward to trying it after the polish job I've done, it does seem a bit slicker.
I really enjoyed the kit while it ran. Nothing like pulling out a UBR Stocked AR with 18in JP upper with a TA11 Acog at the indoor range and watch people give you odd looks. I only shot it offhand and it was about an inch or so at 15 yards.
I don't mind tweaking things when I get them, but to me, the CMMG kit is just built to a poor standard. Hopefully I can get it to run.
Ok, so I went to the range and tried out my 'modified' CMMG and I've got to agree, monkeys must have made these.
Even after the 'mods',I had made described in this thread, I still had major extraction problems AND FTF because of light primer strikes. I never did get to finish a full mag. After the mag was removed and gun recocked, the round fired and ejected. It seems the bolt does not close with enough force to allow the ejector rod to 'catch' the rim of the .22. Either this is caused by not enough blowback force OR the ejector rod spring is too tight and/or the ejector rod needs to be removed and cleaned up to operate more smoothly. The mags could also be rubbing on the underside of the CMMG unit and causing it to slow down when closing the bolt. I did try CCI Stingers, which are 1640 FPS and had the same problems as with MiniMags at 1280 FPS. Honestly, I didn't remove the ejector rod or lube it when I did my mods; I'm now thinking this needs to be done.
As far as the light primer strikes, I think this could be caused by the bolt not being in battery as far as it should because the ejector being too tight and can't make it over the .22 rim when it closes. The only other thing I can think of right now if all this fails is to stretch the main spring a bit to give it more 'umph' when closing. I know this is a hillbilly way of doing it, but short of sending it back... Somebody in this thread mentioned cutting a link out but wouldn't that actually make the spring weaker and the opposite of what is needed?
When I did get my AR to fire the whole unit was accurate and I had fun shooting it. I'm not ready to give up yet, but Brownells should be prepared for a return.
Rob
Ok, so I went to the range and tried out my 'modified' CMMG and I've got to agree, monkeys must have made these.
I am sorry you are having problems with your CMMG kit, but if monkeys made mine they were good monkeys. My CMMG keeps right on ticking with narry a problem. And no sanding either. Same goes for my BDM mags - no sanding here either and they run fine.
I am not making fun of your problems, but I didn't want someone searching for info to think they all had problems.
Did your's have problems before you modified it, or did you do the mods before you shot it?
Thanks Austin, I know you're not making fun, although some would have. ;) The quality control must have gone down from the time you got yours last year OR I got unlucky and had one made by an inexperienced person.
Truthfully, the firing pin did not 'fall thru' the hole until I sanded it smooth; the feed ramp was definitely not cut right and the unit would not slide in all the way until I sanded the insert. As far as sanding the rails, I admit I did that on my own, but only from past experience with other gun stuff coated with that type of finish.
What I noticed last night when I took it apart after the test firing was the bolt itself moved side to side while in the complete rail assembly and was kinda binding up when closed. When I took off the insert portion, the bolt became tight side to side in the rails, like I would expect. The cutouts in the rail where the insert sits are somewhat rough cut. So, either the grooves in the 223 insert are cut too shallow or the rail cutouts are too shallow. Either way the rails are being forced out, side to side, maybe making contact with the inside of the upper receiver and making insertion and extraction harder AND making the bolt sloppy and not locking up properly to extract the empty. I could file the rail down until the bolt becomes tight.
Would you mind checking to see if your bolt move side to side?
What do you think, should I just say 'hell with it' and send it back for replacement to try to keep fixing it?
What I noticed last night when I took it apart after the test firing was the bolt itself moved side to side while in the complete rail assembly and was kinda binding up when closed. When I took off the insert portion, the bolt became tight side to side in the rails, like I would expect. The cutouts in the rail where the insert sits are somewhat rough cut. So, either the grooves in the 223 insert are cut too shallow or the rail cutouts are too shallow. Either way the rails are being forced out, side to side, maybe making contact with the inside of the upper receiver and making insertion and extraction harder AND making the bolt sloppy and not locking up properly to extract the empty. I could file the rail down until the bolt becomes tight.
Would you mind checking to see if your bolt move side to side?
What do you think, should I just say 'hell with it' and send it back for replacement to try to keep fixing it?
Maybe your's was built on a Monday, LOL.
When my kit is fully together and the bolt is closed on the 22LR chamber there is some very, very slight side to side movement of the bolt on the rails but you need to have some or the bolt won't be able to freely slide on the rails.
But, all in all, mine fits very nicely on the rails and there is no binding at all when I cycle the bolt by hand out of the rifle or with the charging handle in the rifle. It cycles very smoothly either way. And the contact areas on my rails still have finish on them; allbeit, you can see wear marks where the bolt rides on the rails.
The slight movement I get is at the rear of the bolt since when the bolt is closed on the 22LR chamber the extractor makes another contact point between the bolt and the chamber adaptor and it is pretty solid at the point.
Also, you have the recoil spring housing part of the bolt that rides in the charging handle channel providing additional stability to the whole conversion bolt assembly so it shouldn't be able to bind up that much. Mine fits in my rifle just as nicely as does my 5.56 BCG.
No offense, but are you sure you got the 22LR chamber assemble back on the rails correctly? It is a bugger to get on sometimes.
In answer to your last question, yes I would send it back in a heartbeat. I would think that the more you work on it and if that work is obvious you might be voiding the lifetime warranty from CMMG.
FromMyColdDeadHand
09-28-09, 13:44
I am sorry you are having problems with your CMMG kit, but if monkeys made mine they were good monkeys. My CMMG keeps right on ticking with narry a problem. And no sanding either. Same goes for my BDM mags - no sanding here either and they run fine.
I am not making fun of your problems, but I didn't want someone searching for info to think they all had problems.
Did your's have problems before you modified it, or did you do the mods before you shot it?
Give enough monkeys a typewriter and time....
There is engineering and there is execution. The units engineering seems fine, it is the assembly that seemed to be actively not executed right, hence the monkey comment. I've had a Ceiner kit before that I sold off at one point, so I am very familiar with the units. I agree, the phosphating on these is a bit rough. I didn't do anything that a couple of thousand rounds wouldn't do. It was the feed ramp that got me. I have to say I didn't really pay attention when I cleaned it the first time so I didn't notice the marks, I hope a lead bullet and brass case didn't do that ;) At least my unit didn't rupture.
I understand that it is a 22 kit, and my standards were low to start, so I'm not saying it is a bad unit. I just wish they had followed the Hippocratic oath and 'do no harm' ;)
Give enough monkeys a typewriter and time....
Are you referring to me?? The quote you posted was in response to RVGP.
FromMyColdDeadHand
09-28-09, 17:39
Are you referring to me?? The quote you posted was in response to RVGP.
I started the monkey reference, but if you and RVGP have something going on between the two of you, I'm sorry I interfered.
Give enough monkeys a typewriter and time....
Sill trying to figure out this reference.
I started the monkey reference, but if you and RVGP have something going on between the two of you, I'm sorry I interfered.
I wasn't trying to slight you - sorry you got your feelings hurt.
FromMyColdDeadHand
09-28-09, 18:43
A million monkey, with a million typewriters for a million years and you eventually get "A Tale of Two Cities". Even a monkey can get it right by chance. It was in the Simpsons.
A million monkey, with a million typewriters for a million years and you eventually get "A Tale of Two Cities". Even a monkey can get it right by chance. It was in the Simpsons.
Sorry, I didn't get the reference, not a Simpsons guy - thanks for clarifing. And sorry you are having trouble with your CMMG. I guess they either run right out of the box or they don't. I got lucky and got a good one. I bought mine last November directly from CMMG.
FromMyColdDeadHand
09-28-09, 21:18
I bought mine in the same time frame. I won't be dissapointed till I put another 500 or so rounds thru it. With ammo as hard and expensive as it is, I'm willing to put up with some hassle.
OK, so Austin, you got yours directly from CMMG, Dead Hand where did you buy your CMMG? I got mine thru Brownells. Brownells has a LIFETIME no BS guarantee on ALL their products they sell, like Dillon Precision, if it breaks 5 years down the road they will replace it, no matter the manufacturers warranty. I like this policy, which is why I reload on two of the Dillon machines, and buy from Brownells. Sportsmans Guide is a bit like that too.
Anyway, I took Austins advice and returned it to Brownells for an exchange. What I hope is that Brownells didn't receive a tainted lot and mine was a 1 in 10 or so bad unit.
I understand, from customizing guns with aftermarket parts, that 'universal fit' doesn't always mean a perfect fit in ALL cases and a little 'smithing might be needed from brand to brand, but mine was beyond that.
Worse case scenario, if the replacement still is fubar'd, I'll contact CMMG directly for a replacement. I really want this unit to work for me, it is much cheaper than buying a dedicated AR .22lr.
Thanks for your help, I'll give an update when I get the replacement.
FromMyColdDeadHand
09-29-09, 22:03
CMMG direct for me. I didn't know that about Brownells, makes their premium make sense.
Brownells has retail and wholesale prices. The wholesale prices are for their dealers, like myself, who resell their products. Wholesale prices can be as much as 40% off retail price on some products, still other items wholesale and retail price are the same. Usually, for example, I can save someone an average of 10-12% off their entire order not including shipping, which is my goal. The items are then dropped shipped from Brownells to my customers door. I usually make about a 5-10% profit, not much but it helps pay the bills.
Anyway, I have found Brownells prices on most items cheaper retail than USAMidway. Brownells opened a reloading division call Sinclair International, haven't ordered anything from them yet.
UPDATE on CMMG .22lr conversion. I returned my unit to Brownells, explained that the spent cartridge would not eject and other problems. Brownells 100% satisfaction no-matter-when-you-bought-it is the BEST. Not only did they replace the unit with no questions, they even had one of their Tech guys actually TEST FIRED a new unit before they shipped it. This took a couple of extra days but I didn't mind. Brownells even sent me a check for my return shipping automatically! This is customer service at it's finest!
The new unit simply dropped it like you would expect it to and cycled just fine. The new unit was tight, unlike the first one, when removed and in your hands. The phosphate finish was not overdone like the first one and the overall final finishing was much nicer.
At the range, the mags fed well (same Big Dog mags I had to clean up though to work, these were not replaced) and the CMMG unit functioned almost perfectly through 100 rounds with only one failure to fire (bad round as the firing pin hit hard) and one failure to eject (again maybe the cheap Federals I used).
So, my conclusion, I must have gotten one made either on a Monday, made by a newbie or a monkey did it, because there was a noticeable difference between the two units.
Nonetheless, the replacement unit is a very nice and I'm glad I purchased it. So is my son! And Brownell's has made me a customer for life!
RVGP
dialM4murder
07-07-10, 19:47
Any updates on these kits? Just bought a stainless one.
With a couple thousand rounds through this conversion unit, in a Colt 6520, it now runs without problems. Took about two hundred break in rounds, but now it zips right along firing Walmart Federal bulk pack ammo.
I've got the stainless version. It runs absolutely great. I had 2 fte's in the first mag. The only other fte was after firing 300+ rounds. Pulled the bolt, spray it with cleaner, dropped it in and ran for another 200 or so with no issues. CMMG will tell you NOT to take them apart for cleaning. The rails can distort.
Best running conversion I've had, and I've had 3. 2 Spikes, 1 Ciener.
The Evolution is coming out soon. It will be the shzzz. Real last round bolt hold, working forward assist, locking mechanism from chamber to barrel locking lugs. Really looking forward to it.
Quiet-Matt
10-03-10, 07:33
My old CMMG kit has served me well for about 5k rounds. I had a little trouble removing it after my last range trip. I found that the chamber adaptor was cracked. I e-mailed CMMG's customer service to let them know. Garson shot me an e-mail back within minutes asking what kit I had (black or silver), and my address. UPS delivered a new chamber adaptor to my door 2 days later. 2 thumbs up for CMMG and their customer service. :happy:
Another tid bit about the new kits.
The old chamber inserts were stamped steel. The new chamber inserts are machined from a block of steel.
Even though the general look of the old vs. new are close, the performance, options, and quality of the new kits are very different.
CMMG has taken a lot of time and effort, going through the original design, fixing flaws and adding upgrades.
If you liked the original Atchinson design at all, you will loves these.
greyman556
03-03-11, 09:13
The Stainless CMMG .22 Conversion Unit that I recently purchased has damaged my upper receiver. After shooting, I literally had to forcefully
yank out the unit and discovered a 1.25 inch cut on the left side of the S&W M&P 15A receiver extending rearward from the chamber.
Would really appreciate recommendation from AR 15 savvy moderators. Don't plan to re-install unit anytime soon.
The Stainless CMMG .22 Conversion Unit that I recently purchased has damaged my upper receiver. After shooting, I literally had to forcefully yank out the unit and discovered a 1.25 inch cut on the left side of the S&W M&P 15A receiver extending rearward from the chamber. Would really appreciate recommendation from AR 15 savvy moderators. Don't plan to re-install unit anytime soon.
Have you tried talking to CMMG about the problem? If not, you probably won't get a lot of sympathy around here.
Forum Rules: http://m4carbine.net/faq.php?faq=vb_faq#faq_new_faq_item
4) Contact The Manufacturer or Dealer First – Internet forums have a large global audience and unsubstantiated or ill-informed comments will affect the livelihoods of a lot of hard working people in the industry. If you have an issue with a manufacturer or dealer that you would like to resolve, we ask that your first contact them to resolve it.
The Stainless CMMG .22 Conversion Unit that I recently purchased has damaged my upper receiver. After shooting, I literally had to forcefully
yank out the unit and discovered a 1.25 inch cut on the left side of the S&W M&P 15A receiver extending rearward from the chamber.
This doesn't make sense to me. Photos would help here.
The regular cycling of the bolt in the conversion kit's rails shouldn't bring it into contact with the upper receiver at all. It sounds like you somehow jammed the conversion in your upper, and then by removing it you gouged your upper.
BTW, I have several 100s of rounds through my early-production CMMG conversion, with no problems whatsoever.
I like it so much that I now want to buy some .22 spinner targets to make shooting more entertaining than punching paper...
greyman556
03-03-11, 14:12
Good luck with your spinner targets; don't spin them too much!
greyman556
03-03-11, 16:31
Austin, I have already contacted Tech@CMMG and described damage in detail (with photo); he described slice as normal.
At the recommendation of Palmetto Armory, I contacted Logan at
CMMG. I described situation in detail. I volunteered to return upper receiver and unit to them for inspection; I also said I would pay
cost of shipping if what I described were not true.
Logan indicated his committment to customer service; he said he would speak to owners, but I have not heard from him.
I am seeking more info on CMMG conversion units and alerting others to problem I am having which is clearly within pervue of site.
I think your comment was really inappropriate and presumptive for a "senior member." If there is one thing I do not need, it is your sympathy; however, now, others are aware of your ministry.
The only two things I could think of that might cause this are:
The conversion was put in at an angle, or the rail chamber adapter was not snapped onto the rail on one side.
A slight amount of anodizing might wear off from metal on metal but there is no reason for the kit to make a cut on the inside of the upper, especially if it slid in with no issues.
Dave
Austin, I have already contacted Tech@CMMG and described damage in detail (with photo); he described slice as normal...
I think your comment was really inappropriate and presumptive for a "senior member."
You're wrong. Austin's comment was entirely appropriate.
You should have explained in your first post that you had already contacted CMMG and that they blew off whatever "damage" their kit did to your receiver.
There are too many knuckleheads on forums like this who first complain to the www, and only later (or never) contact the manufacturer/retailer in question. You should have made it clear from the start that you're NOT one of those.
As for the "damage," I'd still like to see some photos. As to the cause, see shadow's post here, or mine, above.
greyman556
03-03-11, 18:13
He began with a presumption that was insulting. You are doing something similar; you are using knucklehead to someone you have never met. I hope that you are not involved in PR, the ministry like Austin, or neuro surgery. Are you a knucklehead? You sound combative and reactive.
I left my camera when I visited my newborn son last week.
However, I sent Jordan at CMMG a photo of the damage, and I will ask him to post it. Interested and intelligent people will
be able to see the damage, and CMMG will be able to show
what NORMAL WEAR from their unit looks like.
You still have not answered if you had trouble installing the kit or any problems cycling.
Something very out of the ordinary happened here.
1000's of these have been sold and no telling how many Atchison style bolts over the years but you have one that caused damage to your upper receiver.
Wearing some anodizing off, I could understand. Other than that, there is nothing to "cut" your receiver. Maybe you did it when you pryed it out.
You have went to several forums trying to state that CMMG's conversion kit damaged your upper but there seem to be parts left out.
He began with a presumption that was insulting. You are doing something similar; you are using knucklehead to someone you have never met. I hope that you are not involved in PR, the ministry like Austin, or neuro surgery. Are you a knucklehead? You sound combative and reactive.
I read your post. In no way did you indicate that you had contacted any CS entity, nor is Austin or anybody here capable of reading you mind. You PRESUMED that it was understood, when it was clearly not, but instead of simply saying that you had contacted CS, you decided to start flailing about wildly and namecalling.
That finger you're pointing at the folks you're calling 'knucklehead'...?
...bear in mind that there's three other fingers on that hand that are pointing back at you. Knucklehead.
Your next post in this thread will be one that hosts the pictures of the damage. Period.
Just recieved my CMMG conversion kit today! No time to shoot it,but I'll get out tomorrow and try it in my 16" carbine first as it has 1:9 and a rounded hammer already! I'll try the Colt as well in 1:7 but it has a notched hammer! I'll let you know how it goes with targets! :D
PS mine is the parkerized version!:)
The parkerized may take a little more breakin. One of the best things you can do to that kit is buzz the chamber.
Chuck a brass .22 bore brush in a drill, put some oil on it and run it in and out of the chamber until it's warm. This will polish the chamber and help insure feeding.
My kits have worked with notched and un notched hammers. You just have to try it.
If you have any questions or issues, let me know.
Dave
Shadow65
Went out and did a quick shoot with the 16" Carbine 1:9"! Used Fed 36 gr High Vel and Standard Win 40 gr target loads ! Other then a couple weak rounds in the Feds ( barely ejected) everything fed perfectly!
Shot two targets at 27 yards (lasered)! I did not adjust my optic for these so thats why the 40 gr are low on the target used the KW to get the 36 gr to print higher! I hope to get out with the Colt 20" 1:7" tomorrow as this is the one I'll use most with the Convert !
Good to hear.
Try some CCI Mini Mags.
Naw those rounds are way too expensive- if they sold them in bulk yea but they never have! Used to use them when they first come out now they are like $6 for 100!! :rolleyes:
I use Federal #750 bulk pack from Wally World. They cost me $16 for 550 and works great in my kit.
2nd A+ on
I use Federal #750 bulk pack from Wally World. They cost me $16 for 550 and works great in my kit.
I definetly agree. I'm not shooting Mini Mags just to plink. They do provide better accuracy but the Fed bulk and Winchester bulk from Walmart is what I shoot for "shooting";)
Shadow65
I think I still have a few CCI mini mags lying around I'll give them a go!:D Yep got 15 rounds left in one box!:rolleyes:
Hi, this is my first CMMG and it has 1/7 twist. No problems thus far. I read something about the 22lr not being suited for a 1/7 twist. Any truth to that?
:confused:
Not suited in respect of accuracy. 1/7 is on the low end for accuracy with a .22. 1/16 twist is the proper twist.
Different barrels and ammo combo's will produce different results. Ball park for a 1/7 with .22 is about 1.5" to 2" at 25 yards.
60 gr. Aguila should work well.
Perhaps I got a good one, I got about 500 rounds thru the conversion kit (non- stainless) using Winchester 36 gr HP, some old Hanson 40 gr solid point, some Federal 37 HP. Just 1 failure to fire, otherwise not a bobble. The kit has slid in and out without trouble (just 2x) to take a look and wipe down w/ SLIP EWL. A previous post made me pay particular attention to the inside of the upper receiver, no damage, no scratches inside. Got mine from Brownells on sale $189 or $199 I recall w/ 3 25 rnd. smoke mags. Set into a carbine parts kit I put together about 16 years ago w/ a 1/7 bbl. Big fun for less than $200, I feel lots better about running some drills for less than .75 a mag :laugh:
I bought the Atchisson AR15K10 kit today at Cheaper than Dirt along with a 333 brick of Winchester in McKinney, Tx for 130 bucks I think it was. Bought a Black Dog magazine to go with it but found out later that its not the correct magazine. I figured out alittle while ago that its for the Olympic Arms kit. Exchanging it tomorrow.
Anyway. I took it from the store to the range. Installed it in my 6920LE, cycled it about fifteen times, loaded a magazine and off I went. 333 rounds later, with a dry bolt kit fresh from the box, I had five failures. Im reasonably impressed. Accuracy off hand was better than expected, even the RO commented on it. He uses the same kit.
I got back to the "Fortress of Solitude" and cleaned it, fluffed it up some, now its even smoother.
Im going to switch out the BD magazine for the correct one and hit the range next weekend as well. Loving it.
I shoot more .22 than anything else these days. And it does significantly help with my skills shooting other weapons.
I can afford to run 2000 rounds a month of .22. No way I could do that with 5.56.
Recoil isn't there but trigger function and time is the same.
Dave
Bitterclinger
04-18-11, 18:28
Used mine for the first time this last weekend. It installed and functioned flawlessly with Federal Bulk 36 gr High Velocity. With my bullet drop compensator set for 300 yards, it is sighted perfectly for those 50 yard whistle pig shots!!!!
What an inexpensive blast!!
For some real fun get yourselves the Black Dog 50 round drums, they're super easy to load alot better than the stick mags. The only down side is it doesn't have the BHO option. I have had very good results with my CMMG conversion though I have the Stainless steel version and the stick mags and drums work fine also. I think the SS version stays cleaner longer as my buddy's non SS kit builds up more carbon sooner than my SS kit does. Midway is where I got my 50 round drum.
I shoot more .22 than anything else these days.
+1
For about the same reasons. I only seem to shoot centerfire when I'm shooting for accuracy at 100yds and beyond...
SpyderMan2k4
04-19-11, 16:44
I've had my CMMG stainless conversion kit since about the middle of last summer (8-9 months). I've put roughly 2,000 rounds through it (some CCI Standard Velocity, but mostly Winchester and Federal bulk packs from Wal-Mart). My ammo of choice is the Winchester- it's reasonably accurate (usually 1-1.5" at 25 yards out of a 1/7 twist), and pretty reliable. If I don't clean it all the time I'll usually end up with a jam at about 300-400 rounds, which is pretty acceptable reliability in my eyes for how dirty .22 can get.
While it doesn't simulate recoil in any manner, it's excellent for breaking in new FCGs and just flat out trigger time. Not to mention it's a blast to shoot- and amazingly cheap. It paid for itself long ago. I have no experience with the with any of their other kits, but the stainless cleans up pretty easily and runs great.
I've been shooting Remington golden bullets out of my Cmmg .22 kit and I'm pleased so far. The only gripe I have is with all the "gold" residue from the bullets coming off on my hand and then transferring to my rifle and everything else I touch.
MarshallDodge
06-02-11, 22:38
I picked up the CMMG kit in the "Bargain Cave" at Cabelas about a month ago. With the reduced price, a coupon, and some points I had on my card it was $10 so I figured I would give it a try.
So far it has been near perfect with about 700 rounds fired and one hiccup. Mostly Federal Bulk but I have tried Remington Golden Bullets with success. I have yet to clean it but I do shoot some 223 through the gun every couple hundred rounds.
I have not tried to see what kind of accuracy it will really do but shooting offhand through a Sabre Defense 1:8 twist 16" barrel I was able to get a 1" group at 10 yards and emptied a complete mag into a 5" steel plate at 40 yards. This is adequate for what I am want to use it for.
Great fun and wish I had picked one up a long time ago.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.