Baton, which one

[Pappabear]

My son has taken an interest in Batons. Which one to get? Are the pricy ones that much better than the cheaper ones. I bought a cheap pone off Brownells, seems decent.

PB

[LowSpeed_HighDrag]

Duty or hobby?

I used an ASP repeatedly once on a very combative suspect. He told me to "f*ck off", and I broke my hand to pieces in that fight.

I have since bought a Kogawood Straight Baton and it does the trick.

For collapsible batons, the Peacekeeper RCB is the minimum that should be carried.

[jpmuscle]

Peacekeeper is the KAC of batons. X2 there

Loved my 24” staff of justice.

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[Gunnar da Wolf]

I carried an ASP for years, they work but they’re not as good as 24” of hickory. I was in a Bruce Siddle class where he opined that most average cops were only effective for one or two strikes then things went downhill precipitously. After that there was much flailing and fodder for law suits with little positive effect.

[ggammell]

In my experience the best batons looks a lot like Streamlight SL-20s.

[26 Inf]

I think the Peacekeeper is just about the best expandable baton.

I believe that one of the most useful things I learned was to 'stick' the strike. For some reason the concept of hitting 2 inches deep and letting it 'lay' for a moment made a real difference in felt impact.

I think it has to do with folks pulling the strike at impact to cock back for the next strike.

[LowSpeed_HighDrag]

This is an older pic, lots of things have changed on the belt. The 29" Kogawood Baton has not. It remains, at least in a way, my safety blanket lol. Plus, it gets lots of glances from people who may be hit with it soon, and maybe changes some minds.

https://i.imgur.com/e0XHrkk.jpg?1

I owned a Peacekeeper RCB when I was a county deputy, and I thought it was too bulky. It wasn't, carrying a straight stick is the definition of bulky.

[titsonritz]

These are supposed to be pretty good, but I don't know...
http://www.deenside.co.uk/deenside-product-catalogue.php?pid=2734

I like the PR-24.

[usmcvet]

The aluminum expandable PR-24 is the hardest hitting baton I’ve ever used. It’s also wicked heavy!


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[Pappabear]

Thank you for the replies guys. Good info in an area I have no experience.

PB

[Pappabear]

This is an older pic, lots of things have changed on the belt. The 29" Kogawood Baton has not. It remains, at least in a way, my safety blanket lol. Plus, it gets lots of glances from people who may be hit with it soon, and maybe changes some minds.

https://i.imgur.com/e0XHrkk.jpg?1

I owned a Peacekeeper RCB when I was a county deputy, and I thought it was too bulky. It wasn't, carrying a straight stick is the definition of bulky.

LOL mi amigo. Its a nice deterrant ehh? ha

PB

[T2C]

A 26" hardwood baton would serve anyone well. In the right hands, it can be used to control someone considerably larger in size than the person using the baton.

[26 Inf]

IDK what use/need the OP's son is trying to meet with a baton.

While straight sticks are nice, the problem is that very often, they are in the unit when you need them. The best thing about the expandable baton is that it is always with you.

On DV calls I would have mine out and concealed (collapsed) until I knew it wasn't needed.

For civilian usage, I don't think that a straight stick is more low profile than a tee-ball bat, and if push came to shove I'd rather have the tee-ball bat. As a civilian I'm not going for joint locks or pressure points with a baton.

[just a scout]

This

http://american-rattlesnake.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/Chicago_Police_helmet__billy-club.jpg

Or this is even better

https://www.sportsmansguide.com/product/index/used-german-police-spring-baton-with-case?a=151174


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[WillBrink]

Duty or hobby?

I used an ASP repeatedly once on a very combative suspect. He told me to "f*ck off", and I broke my hand to pieces in that fight.

I have since bought a Kogawood Straight Baton and it does the trick.

For collapsible batons, the Peacekeeper RCB is the minimum that should be carried.

Never thwacked anyone with an ASP or similar, but always amazed at the complete lack of effect when watching vids of their use by LE. I'm sure they hurt, but appear of little value with a person who does not care about some pain, at least where LEOs are authorized to strike people with them.

[26 Inf]

Never thwacked anyone with an ASP or similar, but always amazed at the complete lack of effect when watching vids of their use by LE. I'm sure they hurt, but appear of little value with a person who does not care about some pain, at least where LEOs are authorized to strike people with them.

Like anything, you need to practice - it takes me three times as many hits with a hammer to drive the same nail as someone who does it for a living.

Most police officers don't practice enough to ingrain good technique. There components of technique at work - hitting someone with an unlocked wrist and letting the baton bounce, versus hitting them with the intent to drive the baton through the appendage.

[titsonritz]

Or this is even better

https://www.sportsmansguide.com/product/index/used-german-police-spring-baton-with-case?a=151174


Those just piss people off more.

[just a scout]

Yeah, but they sure hurt like hell when you’re a drunk GI in a bar fight.


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[NWPilgrim]

Like anything, you need to practice - it takes me three times as many hits with a hammer to drive the same nail as someone who does it for a living.

Most police officers don't practice enough to ingrain good technique. There components of technique at work - hitting someone with an unlocked wrist and letting the baton bounce, versus hitting them with the intent to drive the baton through the appendage.

I imagine where you hit makes a world of difference. Side of knee versus thigh, rib versus bicep, elbow versus shoulder, kidney versus glute.

[SeriousStudent]

I wonder if we need a "Staff of Learning" picture thread?

Hmmmm.....

[26 Inf]

I imagine where you hit makes a world of difference. Side of knee versus thigh, rib versus bicep, elbow versus shoulder, kidney versus glute.

Generally, police are trained to strike large muscle mass areas (arms and legs) and avoid joints. The Koga method is the only one I'm familiar with that really used the butt end of the baton to aggressively strike (from the ring techniques), although the PR-24 did use jabs to deflate in conjunction with other techniques. And most riot control formations use a jab to move rioters.

https://www.safariland.com/products/more.../crowd-control/batons/training-batons-and-accessories/baton-trauma-zone-chart-1000321.html

[T2C]

Generally, police are trained to strike large muscle mass areas (arms and legs) and avoid joints. The Koga method is the only one I'm familiar with that really used the butt end of the baton to aggressively strike (from the ring techniques), although the PR-24 did use jabs to deflate in conjunction with other techniques. And most riot control formations use a jab to move rioters.

https://www.safariland.com/products/more.../crowd-control/batons/training-batons-and-accessories/baton-trauma-zone-chart-1000321.html

I found using the butt end of the baton quite effective for strikes to large muscle masses, and when necessary other parts of the anatomy. I found the side of the baton better suited for blocks and pushing.

[Mr. Greene]

I miss my SAP:sad:

[Hammered_Pair]

I carried a 26 in ASP, used it mostly for search, moving stuff rarely ever actually hit anything or anyone with it.

[Pappabear]

IDK what use/need the OP's son is trying to meet with a baton.

While straight sticks are nice, the problem is that very often, they are in the unit when you need them. The best thing about the expandable baton is that it is always with you.

On DV calls I would have mine out and concealed (collapsed) until I knew it wasn't needed.

For civilian usage, I don't think that a straight stick is more low profile than a tee-ball bat, and if push came to shove I'd rather have the tee-ball bat. As a civilian I'm not going for joint locks or pressure points with a baton.

He wants a concealable baton, He is at a University and it drives him crazy I won't let him role with his G19. They have many break ins and tons of shifty BS. No gun is happen. So, its collapsable and that is it.

PB

[LowSpeed_HighDrag]

I carried a 26 in ASP, used it mostly for search, moving stuff rarely ever actually hit anything or anyone with it.

I've used a baton once on someone in a USOF, once on a dog, a few times for pressure points or arm extraction, and hundreds of times for going through homeless people's belongings or poking at wild animals that wont get off the road. It seems to be a tool of the bygone days for sure, and more often than not used in other ways than striking.