View Full Version : 18 people shot near El Paso Walmart, reports say
Fly - Roughly 300 cops a year for over thirty years, my share of that would have been 100 a year not counting the advanced course I presented; four kids and five grand kids that I've taken shooting. I've hauled kids to Appleseeds, and I've built guns for all of them except the three youngest grand kids. My 'spawn' teach hunter safety classes, raise and train GSR's, guide hunts, and take game with shotgun, rifle and bow. My tow sones (oldest kids) carry - one of them more than I do.
Quite frankly, I get tired of being lectured about how fvcked up America is and being told the principles by which I should live by folks who have contributed little, if any to the furtherance of those principles and our security other than running their yaps on the internet.
I read posts on here by 'ardent' Americans that we are being overtaken by the immigrants, that soon the white Americans will be a minority and things are going to hell because of it. Funny, it turns out that many of those ardent Americans who are bellowing the most haven't procreated any of their own Americans to stem the tide. How many times have you read something like this If I had children?
As the Spartans said 'IF.' I'm more of a 'show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by my deeds.' I'm awaiting my first great grandchild, I'm sure that my grandson will make sure some of the gun DNA I helped instill in him ends up in his child.
You said: The constant vibe I get from "gun people" is that they have had their fun and never showed a younger person how rewarding of a discipline it can be. I agree, although I'd probably couch it in different words.
You kind of touched a hot button.
Not you personally, but like the internet people in general. Too many people want to show off to a neophyte instead of giving them a proper start.
Per that other stuff, you know my situation on that.
What that's from?
On a private thread, another board. I'd like to see verification.
From Sarah Carter's twit feed, buried now.
https://twitter.com/SaraCarterDC/status/1158751505266171904
Looks like Mitch is in their sights now.
https://www.facebook.com/foxandfriends/videos/451656562053903/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hC-4Igj5ass
On a private thread, another board. I'd like to see verification.
I don't know if you will find it. I have read that seemed to be created after the fact, but for sure the listed registration has bounced back and forth a few times since. And in all honesty, what difference does it make on a practical level? Both "sides" net the same outcome.
Probably like Bush free cell phones, since the cell phone hand out began in the summer of 2008 so Obama gets credit for something he didn't start. From what I have heard that all went back to Reagan, possibly prior to Reagan, so there is plenty of blame to go around.
I'd like to see some verification on this..
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EBJVE7NXsAAQ77g?format=jpg&name=900x900
Snopes confirmed it was changed, but does not confirm who did it. They suggest he did not even have a profile till after the shooting.
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/el-paso-suspect-mylife/
if you're afraid of firearms DNA shrinking then it means you haven't been a proper mentor. I say that in general. The constant vibe I get from "gun people) is thst they have had their fun and never showed a younger person how rewarding of a discipline it can be
And out here in the hinterlands of the American Southwest, we are just the opposite - we are a gun loving family. West Point student and youngest son with rebuilt M1A1:
https://i.imgur.com/CccsLOq.jpg
Outlander Systems
08-06-19, 10:38
>snopes as a source
Hahahahahahaha! C’mon my guy.
Snopes confirmed it was changed, but does not confirm who did it. They suggest he did not even have a profile till after the shooting.
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/el-paso-suspect-mylife/Interesting the snopes has now confirmed the dayton scumbag appears to have been a self-avowed satanist, left wing, Warren supporter based on his social media postings
Interesting the snopes has now confirmed the dayton scumbag appears to have been a self-avowed satanist, left wing, Warren supporter based on his social media postings
Fox has the same information pulled from Twitter.
https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/dayton-killer-left-winger-elizabeth-warren
Doc Safari
08-06-19, 13:13
Meanwhile...there may be a shooting in progress at a Baton Rouge Walmart:
https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-08-06/active-shooter-reported-baton-rouge-walmart
May not be a mass shooting but an altercation.
>snopes as a source
Hahahahahahaha! C’mon my guy.
So Dayton turd was none of this?
Interesting the snopes has now confirmed the dayton scumbag appears to have been a self-avowed satanist, left wing, Warren supporter based on his social media postings
Based on your average sterotypes of Texas, everyone including grandma on the hoverround packs heat and yet this wackjob kills almost 20 people. WTF Texas?
Uh, at least eight of the people killed were MEXICAN citizens. MANY of the people in that Walmart were Mexicans, not Texans, not Americans.
The bottom line folks is this:
I haven't killed or massacred anyone. I therefore refuse to be held accountable, or sacrifice my Constitutional rights because of the actions of lunatics, psychopaths, sociopaths, terrorists, and criminals. Period. I have always detested group punishment, and this is no exception.
And DD, if that is too unbending or inflexible then so be it. I don't care. It's where I stand on the issue. You have to know that those on the Left don't give one shit about "protecting" innocent people. This is a vehicle to remove any possible form of push-back to them implementing their agenda; I absolutely refuse to give them that smooth-sailing into a libtard Utopia.
You ain't alone.
TX says "bring it" F heads. Now that's what we wanted to see:
Ten new pro-gun laws will take effect in Texas in four weeks, less than a month after 22 people died in a mass shooting at a Walmart in El Paso.
Gov. Greg Abbott signed the measures after they were passed in a 2019 legislative session that the National Rifle Association, or NRA, called "highly successful" at the time, celebrating that the measures "will further loosen Texas' permissive gun laws" and would send the "gun control crowd home empty-handed."
Texas is home to almost 1.4 million holders of active firearm licenses, and five of the 20 deadliest mass shootings in the United States since 1900 have occurred in the state. Among them is the rampage in El Paso, where authorities said Monday that the number of deaths had risen to 22.
The NRA said its "deepest sympathies are with the families and victims" of the shootings in El Paso and in Dayton, Ohio, where nine people were killed Sunday. The organization said it wouldn't "participate in the politicizing of these tragedies."
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/many-call-tighter-gun-laws-texas-set-loosen-n1039481?fbclid=IwAR2Nr8TJzLWGZHvqgbpd5uTJfsi6ogXZflEDdg7vsBCM1uZTfFU9am31_ms
Based on your average sterotypes of Texas, everyone including grandma on the hoverround packs heat and yet this wackjob kills almost 20 people. WTF Texas?
Many folks think the first rule of surviving a gunfight is to bring a gun. This is incorrect, the first rule is to avoid places where a gunfight is likely to occur. And that WM is pretty high on the list.
jerrysimons
08-07-19, 01:41
No, just no. Its just going be like another #metoo movement just with gun owners this time. At first they catch the 1 or 2 people who are actually dangerous then will just become Jim reporting John because he doesnt like his political beliefs. How many innocent gun owners are going to get jacked by a SWAT team because some liberal called in some fake "red flags".
DO YOU REALIZE HOW INSANE LEFTISTS ARE THESE DAYS? THEY ACTUALLY THINK WORDS ARE VIOLENCE.
This. And it is deeply troubling. Some of these Red flag laws are being written with grants for data mined profiling for LE agencies. Ever joke (or not) about the boogaloo on Instagram? Ding, knock knock.
I'm not 'okay with it' I just am past the stage of denial in the grief process. Now I want to focus on minimizing the restrictions. I feel the best we can hope for are red flag laws.
I don't know if you caught my comments about our shrinking firearms DNA, but that is our reality.
If this were 80 years ago, here is what you are saying: "C'mon guys... Hitler is going to take over the world and when he does, I want to minimize the the restrictions he imposes upon us. Let's offer him this so he doesn't take that..."
Appropriately, what was the line from the recent Winston Churchill movie? "You can't negotiate with a lion when your head is in its mouth."
It seems your strategy is to request some lube as you are forced to take it in the ass. Me? I'm not taking it in the ass. Not one way, and not the other. I don't know how or when this situation will resolve itself, but it always does. We've seen this before, and we'll see it again after this bout.
And I don't know how things seem in your part of the world, but "firearms DNA" around here is growing by leaps and bounds. I've introduced dozens of people into our gun culture, and I'll introduce dozens more in the coming years. Did you miss all those stats for all those years about BHO being the best gun salesmen of all time and repeatedly breaking his own records for gun sales? Where do you think all those guns went? We've got more new shooters now than ever. I know some of them personally and have sent them to my school after taking them to my range.
ramairthree
08-08-19, 09:46
Familiarize yourself with your state’s current version of red flag laws.
I spent about 14 years at Fort Bragg.
In NC,
A family member, Friend, etc. could go to the magistrate-
State someone is suicidal, going to hurt someone else, dangerous, crazy, etc.
LE will then take them to an ER for their psyc eval.
It may take a few days.
There is already a process to involuntarily commit crazy, dangerous people in some version everywhere.
It is rife with abuse already.
Mixing it with guns will turn it into something fully weaponized like sexual assault and pedophilia claims are now.
Now there is a movement to add being red flagged for gun violence one will likely never be able to fully recover from, just like regular false commitment, false sexual assault, and false pedophilia claims are now.
And those others are already to the point that real victims claims are eye rollers because there are so many false ones.
If this were 80 years ago, here is what you are saying: "C'mon guys... Hitler is going to take over the world and when he does, I want to minimize the the restrictions he imposes upon us. Let's offer him this so he doesn't take that..."
IMO that is a poor analogy, although I would agree that both the far right and the far left are getting Leni Riefenstahlled.
Appropriately, what was the line from the recent Winston Churchill movie? "You can't negotiate with a lion when your head is in its mouth."
I think the answer is that you do everything you can to get your head out of the Lion's mouth, right now. Instead, it seems you are advocating keeping your head in there and arguing. You pick the hill you want to die on, mine is not the Red Flag law hill.
I'm convinced that when it comes down to it, Red Flag Acts have overwhelming support, some of the polling I've read indicates over 80% of all recognized parties in all areas of the country.
It seems your strategy is to request some lube as you are forced to take it in the ass. Me? I'm not taking it in the ass. Not one way, and not the other. I don't know how or when this situation will resolve itself, but it always does. We've seen this before, and we'll see it again after this bout.
And I don't know how things seem in your part of the world, but "firearms DNA" around here is growing by leaps and bounds. I've introduced dozens of people into our gun culture, and I'll introduce dozens more in the coming years. Did you miss all those stats for all those years about BHO being the best gun salesmen of all time and repeatedly breaking his own records for gun sales? Where do you think all those guns went? We've got more new shooters now than ever. I know some of them personally and have sent them to my school after taking them to my range.
Your last paragraph caused me to consider what I would classify as 'gun DNA' - I was thinking in terms of the 'our family has always had guns and hunted, no big deal, it is part of our heritage, my sons and daughters will follow the practice' and actually didn't consider things I have quoted in the past - the increase in shall issue states over the last 20 years, the increase in constitutional carry states, etc.
President Obama's administration did set records for gun sales because people were scared, some were first time buyers, but just as many, if not more were stockpiling in case of a ban. So in answer to your question, 'where do you all those guns went?' I'd have to say most of them went into safes with other guns. I certainly went on a buying/building spree during that time period.
And I do have to agree, we have a lot of new shooters, our club sponsors/allows 4H shooting sports (bb, air rifle, rimfire, shotgun) and two high school trap squads to use our ranges.
Familiarize yourself with your state’s current version of red flag laws.
I spent about 14 years at Fort Bragg.
In NC,
A family member, Friend, etc. could go to the magistrate-
State someone is suicidal, going to hurt someone else, dangerous, crazy, etc.
LE will then take them to an ER for their psyc eval.
It may take a few days.
There is already a process to involuntarily commit crazy, dangerous people in some version everywhere.
It is rife with abuse already.
Mixing it with guns will turn it into something fully weaponized like sexual assault and pedophilia claims are now.
Now there is a movement to add being red flagged for gun violence one will likely never be able to fully recover from, just like regular false commitment, false sexual assault, and false pedophilia claims are now.
And those others are already to the point that real victims claims are eye rollers because there are so many false ones.
In my AOR the petition prompts a LEO to make contact with the subject. If they detect any possible threat of violence or self-harm, they maintain the scene and call for COPES (Community Outreach Psychiatric Emergency Services), who come to the scene to conduct an assessment. If they feel an involuntary observation is necessary, they sign the paperwork and the LEO takes the individual to the facility.
Obviously if the subject becomes combative, violent or attempts self-harm, or has done something like a drug overdose, the LEO takes immediate action without calling COPES. At that point they can either proceed with criminal charges or allow the medical treatment facility to further process the subject.
In most cases this is enough to get an out of line subject back within legal and societal norms. That's one reason I don't support ERPO laws which will force more aggressive action by the authorities and further alienate or ideate someone on the fence. Yes we need some reforms, but it needs to be done thoughtfully. Much more thoughtfully than the histrionic political cycle will allow. :(
titsonritz
08-08-19, 22:57
Some open carry dolt with an AR walks into a SPRINGFIELD, MO Walmart, films reaction on cell phone with predictable results. Lucky they didn't just shoot his dumb ass.
The Springfield Police Department arrived on scene within three minutes of the call. Police stated that a young white male, appearing to be in his twenties, pulled up to the Walmart, where he donned body armor and military fatigues. Police say the man had tactical weapons.
Police then say the man walked into the Walmart: Neighborhood Market where he grabbed a cart and began pushing it around the store. Police say the man was recording himself walking through the store via a cell phone.
https://www.ky3.com/content/news/Heavy-police-presence-at-Walmart-Neighborhood-Market-in-south-Springfield-528602951.html
Why do the majority of gun owners NOT support red flag laws? Is it because we don't care if dangerous wackos have guns? No, it is because we do not trust ANYONE on the Left to be honest and do the right thing. They think nothing of doxxing those they disagree with politically. They refuse to disavow the Left wing domestic terrorist group Antifa and in some cases support them. So why would we expect red flag laws to be used in good faith?
Some open carry dolt with an AR walks into a SPRINGFIELD, MO Walmart, films reaction on cell phone with predictable results. Lucky they didn't just shoot his dumb ass.
The Springfield Police Department arrived on scene within three minutes of the call. Police stated that a young white male, appearing to be in his twenties, pulled up to the Walmart, where he donned body armor and military fatigues. Police say the man had tactical weapons.
Police then say the man walked into the Walmart: Neighborhood Market where he grabbed a cart and began pushing it around the store. Police say the man was recording himself walking through the store via a cell phone.
https://www.ky3.com/content/news/Heavy-police-presence-at-Walmart-Neighborhood-Market-in-south-Springfield-528602951.html
Even if he violated no gun laws, I consider this to be the equivalent of yelling "FIRE" in a crowded building. The manager even pulled the fire alarm because of this asshat. So I'd cite him on breach of the peace at least. I think it would stand up to legal scrutiny. Seriously, how stupid do you have to be doing something like this right now. :(
Why do the majority of gun owners NOT support red flag laws? Is it because we don't care if dangerous wackos have guns? No, it is because we do not trust ANYONE on the Left to be honest and do the right thing. They think nothing of doxxing those they disagree with politically. They refuse to disavow the Left wing domestic terrorist group Antifa and in some cases support them. So why would we expect red flag laws to be used in good faith?
Trusting anyone on the right hasn’t helped the cause of freedom either.
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What's interesting is that with ordinary murders, the unWhites have a per capita higher murder rate.
But when it comes to mass murders and serial killings, Whites take the cake.
What's interesting is that with ordinary murders, the unWhites have a per capita higher murder rate.
But when it comes to mass murders and serial killings, Whites take the cake.
Whites are more efficient killers?
Sounds racist.
Trusting anyone on the right hasn’t helped the cause of freedom either.
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You are correct. Maybe I should rephrase it as "do not trust anyone on the government payroll" to do the right thing and not abuse a red flag law.
You are correct. Maybe I should rephrase it as "do not trust anyone on the government payroll" to do the right thing and not abuse a red flag law.
if anyone thinks big gov is going to fix anything they need to be red flagged
Rules of Bureaucracy
Rule #1: Maintain the problem at all costs! The problem is the basis of power, perks, privileges, and security.
Rule #2: Use crisis and perceived crisis to increase your power and control.
Rule #3: If there are not enough crises, manufacture them, even from nature, where none exist.
Rule #4: Control the flow and release of information while feigning openness.
Rule #5: Maximize public-relations exposure by creating a cover story that appeals to the universal need to help people.
Rule #6: Create vested support groups by distributing concentrated benefits and/or entitlements to these special interests, while distributing the costs broadly to one's political opponents.
Rule #7: Demonize the truth tellers who have the temerity to say, "The emperor has no clothes."
Belmont31R
08-09-19, 21:28
Even if he violated no gun laws, I consider this to be the equivalent of yelling "FIRE" in a crowded building. The manager even pulled the fire alarm because of this asshat. So I'd cite him on breach of the peace at least. I think it would stand up to legal scrutiny. Seriously, how stupid do you have to be doing something like this right now. :(
Its actually not that big of deal. I haven't been to Israel but Ive been to Switzerland and saw the guard people out walking around with 'assault weapons' slung over their backs. No one cared, gave a **** or batted an eye. The only reason people here go ballistic with a firearm in any public place is because the left's demonization of gun ownership and self defense has worked better than our side's shitty attempts to normalize it have been.
SomeOtherGuy
08-09-19, 21:58
What's interesting is that with ordinary murders, the unWhites have a per capita higher murder rate.
Vastly higher rate for two specific groups, much lower for another specific group (the same group that gets really good SAT/ACT scores, in case you couldn't guess).
But when it comes to mass murders and serial killings, Whites take the cake.
Whites are more efficient killers?
Sounds racist.
Not so fast guys. Non-white serial killers are much more common than the media would have you believe. As for mass murders, what's your criteria? If it's 4+ then there's tons of non-white killers. If it includes Islamic terrorism, ditto (including the Orlando nightclub, and no one really knows but possibly including Las Vegas since ISIS claimed it). If it includes weapons other than guns, ditto (bombings, arsons, Europe's truck-of-peace problem). It's only if you look at spree killings of 8+ using firearms, without Islamic terrorist motivation, that you get whites as your main perp. And even then, one of the deadliest US shootings was by an asian (VA Tech) and some of ones in the last year while supposedly "white" aren't necessarily white in the sense of Anglo-Saxons.
MountainRaven
08-09-19, 22:24
Its actually not that big of deal. I haven't been to Israel but Ive been to Switzerland and saw the guard people out walking around with 'assault weapons' slung over their backs. No one cared, gave a **** or batted an eye. The only reason people here go ballistic with a firearm in any public place is because the left's demonization of gun ownership and self defense has worked better than our side's shitty attempts to normalize it have been.
I doubt very much that the guy carrying his AR-15 wearing fatigues and a vest looked anything like an Israeli or Swiss citizen-soldier in their every day civies with a completely unloaded service weapon slung over their back.
Belmont31R
08-09-19, 22:35
I doubt very much that the guy carrying his AR-15 wearing fatigues and a vest looked anything like an Israeli or Swiss citizen-soldier in their every day civies with a completely unloaded service weapon slung over their back.
I didn't say anything about fatigues or a vest. If people here in the US saw a group of people in civies with slung 'assault rifles' they'd freak out just the same as a dude with a vest and BDU pants on. People are completely conditioned to 'weapon in public' = threat and I don't think the accessories really matter all that much. On the contrary if you were in Israel and saw someone in green BDU's with a slung M4 it'd be like 'cool...look at how they do things here'. If I had a slung M4 and walked into town no matter the attire there would be lockdowns and SWAT call outs. Doesn't even matter what the open carry laws are. People here are just put on edge by the constant media rhetoric and blue areas acting like mass shootings happen every 5 minutes.
titsonritz
08-10-19, 00:11
Making an example of the fool...
SPRINGFIELD, Mo. – A man has been charged with a felony for allegedly walking through a Missouri Walmart store with a body armor and a loaded rifle.
Dmitriy N. Andreychenko, 20, of Springfield was charged Friday with making a terrorist threat in the second-degree. That's a felony punishable by up to four years in prison. He is being held in the Greene County Jail.
Andreychenko allegedly said he was testing whether Walmart "honored the Second Amendment."
Armed man arrested at Walmart in Springfield, Missouri, charged with felony (https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2019/08/09/springfield-missouri-walmart-armed-man-identified/1966660001/)
He should have studied harder if he wanted to pass that test.
Sounds like Russian collusion considering
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Sounds like Russian collusion considering
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Its actually not that big of deal. I haven't been to Israel but Ive been to Switzerland and saw the guard people out walking around with 'assault weapons' slung over their backs. No one cared, gave a **** or batted an eye. The only reason people here go ballistic with a firearm in any public place is because the left's demonization of gun ownership and self defense has worked better than our side's shitty attempts to normalize it have been.
Oh I don’t disagree with the sentiment, but the rules we’re currently operating under don’t include Swiss guards.
The 2nd Degree terrorist threat charge is an overreach. If he gets even a halfway decent attorney he’ll get off with a misdemeanor at most.
The point is we’re he not stupid, he wouldn’t need to be paying for an attorney.
Oh I don’t disagree with the sentiment, but the rules we’re currently operating under don’t include Swiss guards.
The 2nd Degree terrorist threat charge is an overreach. If he gets even a halfway decent attorney he’ll get off with a misdemeanor at most.
The point is we’re he not stupid, he wouldn’t need to be paying for an attorney.
Absolutely. Just because you CAN do something doesn't necessarily mean you SHOULD do it. A little prudence would be in order, don't ya think?
FromMyColdDeadHand
08-10-19, 20:01
Oh I don’t disagree with the sentiment, but the rules we’re currently operating under don’t include Swiss guards.
The 2nd Degree terrorist threat charge is an overreach. If he gets even a halfway decent attorney he’ll get off with a misdemeanor at most.
The point is we’re he not stupid, he wouldn’t need to be paying for an attorney.
There is zero chance that he kept his mouth shut....
Mouth shut and a good lawyer, he probably could have walked....
Diamondback
08-10-19, 20:38
Sounds like Russian collusion considering
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To assclowns like Dems and Vichytards, if you've ever eaten Russian dressing on a salad, or beef Stroganoff, or drank vodka you're guilty of "collusion."
Belmont31R
08-10-19, 22:46
Absolutely. Just because you CAN do something doesn't necessarily mean you SHOULD do it. A little prudence would be in order, don't ya think?
And that's my point. In many states you could walk around with an AR good luck despite the laws. The left already won the the battle of relegating guns to 2nd class citizen status where they have to be hidden away and you can't actually do something legal.
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