View Full Version : Fort Knox Safes Article
Does this fit under the general discussion section? Mods, please move if necessary.
I've always liked the Fort Knox products particularly the newer line of M2 safes. These are only available through large dealers and are not a catalog item. Not sure why...
The M2 is more like a safe from about 20 years ago. Fairly heavy steel body with a solid plate door. No bells and whistles. Price is comparable to something like Sturdy but arguably with better fit and finish.
https://www.americanrifleman.org/articles/2019/8/21/fortified-defense-fort-knox-gun-safes/
Sent from my SM-G930P using Tapatalk
FlyingHunter
08-21-19, 18:49
That Fort Knox looks like a solid choice. Note: highest quality safes have a higher rated, U.L. TL-15 (Tool Resistant) and U.L. TL-30 ratings. In general, there is a wide margin of difference in security in a UL TL rated safe vs RSC rating, but it comes at a fairly significant cost. Balance the safe costs with the value of what's inside the safe. Always bolt/secure the bottom as most bad guys tip them over 1st and attack either the top w cutting tools or peel the door w heavy prying tools. Additional consideration are movement indicators inside the safe, home security as a layered approach to harden the approach to the safe. Best of luck to you.
All good points.
Yes. TL or higher is better security but at a cost of price as you mentioned. Also size and weight considerations. A 72X40 TL safe will not have much storage space inside, relatively speaking. Also probably weighs in at 3 or 4 thousand pounds. Not lkely something that'll go into a bedroom closet.
TL is probably overkill unless you have a huge Class 3 collection, etc.
Sent from my SM-G930P using Tapatalk
I have an American Security safe that weighs ...I don't even remember but it requires a professional mover to move it. And I have Costco and Browning safes that weigh in the 400 lb range. I like those because they will keep tweakers out and I can move them if needed. IMHO only a professional thief is moving or breaking into a one of my cheaper safes. I dont have 2 million in diamonds in those safes. So Im good with less than a super duper bad-ass safe.
PB
IMHO only a professional thief is moving or breaking into a one of my cheaper safes.
That's probably true of most all the safes out there with the exception of the real budget stuff like some of the "gun cabinets" out there. But those are more like school lockers rather than safes.
Probably anything from Liberty, Ft Knox, Sturdy, etc will do the job just fine during a quick smash and grab. And anyone who's professional enough to come with tools and a torch will get into pretty much whatever it is you have.
I imagine most break-ins occur with whatever tools might be available at the time. Good reason to keep power tools, etc locked up in their own cabinet.
What’s the best way to bolt a safe to the slab?
Layered approach which includes insurance. I have 20k worth of stuff all told maybe. The cost to insure that is like 250 a year. Way cheaper than buying a super duper safe full of stuff that can be replaced with about a day's worth of internet shopping.
Hell, I am thinking of picking up a second safe so I can keep my ammo in it so it probably won't cook off during a fire. Putting them next to each other gives a 50/50 choice for a thief to get the "good stuff" or just stacks and stacks of ammo and no guns.
Whiskey_Bravo
08-22-19, 07:10
Layered approach which includes insurance. I have 20k worth of stuff all told maybe. The cost to insure that is like 250 a year. Way cheaper than buying a super duper safe full of stuff that can be replaced with about a day's worth of internet shopping.
Who are you insuring your guns through? Did you have to provide a list with serials?
What’s the best way to bolt a safe to the slab?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H2IobMMVel0&vl=en
Hell, I am thinking of picking up a second safe so I can keep my ammo in it so it probably won't cook off during a fire. Putting them next to each other gives a 50/50 choice for a thief to get the "good stuff" or just stacks and stacks of ammo and no guns.
Where you a safe is located is more important than spending a fortune on the safest safe IMO. What kills me is the guy with the fancy safe in plain view in his garage.
Whiskey_Bravo
08-22-19, 09:22
Where you a safe is located is more important than spending a fortune on the safest safe IMO. What kills me is the guy with the fancy safe in plain view in his garage.
And OPSEC. Don't tell anybody you need a safe, have a safe or have guns to put in a safe. Short of your best shooting buddies no one should know what you have. Tell your kids to never talk about it. Tell your wife to not tell her friends. If somebody shows up ready to break into a safe/RSC with tools they probably knew you had one and something worth putting inside.
1_click_off
08-22-19, 14:15
Where you a safe is located is more important than spending a fortune on the safest safe IMO. What kills me is the guy with the fancy safe in plain view in his garage.
Amen, I have a buddy that moved his safe (not Fort Knox) into his large metal shop. I told him now thieves don’t have to bring anything except some tin snips to get into the shop. The neighbors will just think you are working on your truck in here AND the thieves can turn down the AC so they don’t sweat while working on entry.
I also told him he would have rust issues. He swore up and down his split unit would prevent that. I asked him where all the humidity would condense when he opens the bay doors.....
He pulled a nice 1911 out the other day with some flash rust on it. He said “don’t know how that got there!”
I just kept quite.
And yes, Fort Knox makes a nice product.
Mine is in the garage [emoji20] that’s the only place they deliver it.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
1_click_off
08-22-19, 14:41
Mine is in the garage [emoji20] that’s the only place they deliver it.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Golf balls, moving blankets, floor sliders from hardware store, if you go up/down stairs it gets trickier. 2x4’s with boat trailer carpet and pulley system.
Some places rent walking dolly’s that are great.
Extra $20 for each delivery guy will work wonders on placement as well.
There is even a guy on YouTube that delivers safes that shows you a bunch of tricks for moving them.
Does this fit under the general discussion section? Mods, please move if necessary.
I've always liked the Fort Knox products particularly the newer line of M2 safes. These are only available through large dealers and are not a catalog item. Not sure why...
The M2 appears a decent RSC. I have a write up on the issue here:
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?51518-General-safe-gun-safe-info
My research suggests the best RSC on the market, as good or better then some companies safes, is the AMSEC BF series. Tad more $, I'd go with the BFII series. AMSEC is the largest maker of safes in the US I believe and their experience, R&D, and economy of scale = impossible to beat for $ spent in my opinion.
AMSEC is what you see in commercial applications more than any brand for a reason.
Mine is in the garage [emoji20] that’s the only place they deliver it.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I'm talking about the guy with the high gloss lacquer paint job and gold hardware embezzled safe out in the open for all to see. The average crackhead is breaking into your house looking for a safe. Around here they rifle through the medicine cabinet for dope and grab a flat screen TV on the way out. Something as simple an old blanket draped over the safe and a few yard tools leaned against it is all the camoflauge you need.
Mine is in the garage [emoji20] that’s the only place they deliver it.
Something like this might help you.
https://www.amsecusa.com/product/safe-cloak/
I've often wondered about painting a safe bright yellow and then getting some "FLAMMABLE" stickers for it. Make it look like a paint cabinet.
Something like this might help you.
https://www.amsecusa.com/product/safe-cloak/
I've often wondered about painting a safe bright yellow and then getting some "FLAMMABLE" stickers for it. Make it look like a paint cabinet.
Way too polished to be camo IMO. Clutter hides something way better than polished. Think about hiding 10 pounds of gold in the bottom of a clothes hamper full of shit stained underwear or a trash can filled with used tampons. Maybe in the toilet tank with 4 adult dumps in the bowl without being flushed.
And OPSEC. Don't tell anybody you need a safe, have a safe or have guns to put in a safe. Short of your best shooting buddies no one should know what you have. Tell your kids to never talk about it. Tell your wife to not tell her friends. If somebody shows up ready to break into a safe/RSC with tools they probably knew you had one and something worth putting inside.
This times 1000.. I had a false wall in my house that slid out where I could hide some lower priced self defense weapons. I never go to even use it before I caught my 10 yr old son showing it to his neighborhood buddies. It became a broom and cleaning supply closet after that.. and I get great joy out of asking him to grab me a broom even 13 years later. He still feels bad about it.
Way too polished to be camo IMO. Clutter hides something way better than polished. Think about hiding 10 pounds of gold in the bottom of a clothes hamper full of shit stained underwear or a trash can filled with used tampons. Maybe in the toilet tank with 4 adult dumps in the bowl without being flushed.
Not sure what a dirty hamper or an unflushed toilet have to do with a cloth cover that looks like a wooden cabinet or painting a safe to look like something else. What are you suggesting homeowners do to camouflage a safe?
Sent from my SM-G930P using Tapatalk
Who are you insuring your guns through? Did you have to provide a list with serials?
USAA and yes, I did provide serial numbers.
USAA and yes, I did provide serial numbers.
I’ve done the same. I don’t know if all banks do it but I like that I can upload pictures too so I usually do one of the serial number with my ID in it and one of the whole gun, plus invoice/receipt.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
USAA and yes, I did provide serial numbers.Do they provide any sort of policy discount with a gun safe?
Sent from my SM-G930P using Tapatalk
I’ve done the same. I don’t know if all banks do it but I like that I can upload pictures too so I usually do one of the serial number with my ID in it and one of the whole gun, plus invoice/receipt.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
USAA does full replacement value minus deductible. When I made a renters insurance claim in the past, it didn't matter what I paid for the items, it was just MSRP on everything and they paid it out since they couldn't prove that the item is worth less than MSRP. It was the happiest/worst day when I had $2000 worth of range gear stolen out of my car.
ETA: I asked USAA about tax stamps for stolen NFA stuff. They cover the tax stamp for each item too since you cannot replace the item without getting the stamp.
sundance435
08-23-19, 13:29
And OPSEC. Don't tell anybody you need a safe, have a safe or have guns to put in a safe. Short of your best shooting buddies no one should know what you have. Tell your kids to never talk about it. Tell your wife to not tell her friends. If somebody shows up ready to break into a safe/RSC with tools they probably knew you had one and something worth putting inside.
This is the single most important security aspect of storing guns. Tweakers and burglars generally ain't looking for guns, unless they know to be. Even if they find the safe, many of them might make a minimal attempt to gain entry, but they're not sticking around. All of this "axe attack" crap is just marketing garbage. If they want the guns that bed, either they're going to get them, or I'm not spending the kind of money it takes to prevent that kind of attack. That said, there aren't many reasons to buy a 12ga. body safe anymore, which is little more than a gun locker with drywall. It just takes a little bit more time to find a better, heavier duty one.
This is the single most important security aspect of storing guns. Tweakers and burglars generally ain't looking for guns, unless they know to be. Even if they find the safe, many of them might make a minimal attempt to gain entry, but they're not sticking around. All of this "axe attack" crap is just marketing garbage. If they want the guns that bed, either they're going to get them, or I'm not spending the kind of money it takes to prevent that kind of attack. That said, there aren't many reasons to buy a 12ga. body safe anymore, which is little more than a gun locker with drywall. It just takes a little bit more time to find a better, heavier duty one.The majority of the 12g stuff is imported and made to meet a price point. Another cost savings is stitch welding the body and then filling the gaps with Bondo.
There was a picture floating around a few years ago of a stitch welded safe that had had the top beaten off (phrasing) with a heavy hammer. It took a short time to break the few welds and get the entire top plate off.
Edit to add pics. These are off the Sturdy website.
Sent from my SM-G930P using Tapatalk
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190823/e4ac873a42731e10e96070a838d7ceb9.jpg
This is the single most important security aspect of storing guns. Tweakers and burglars generally ain't looking for guns, unless they know to be. Even if they find the safe, many of them might make a minimal attempt to gain entry, but they're not sticking around. All of this "axe attack" crap is just marketing garbage. If they want the guns that bed, either they're going to get them, or I'm not spending the kind of money it takes to prevent that kind of attack. That said, there aren't many reasons to buy a 12ga. body safe anymore, which is little more than a gun locker with drywall. It just takes a little bit more time to find a better, heavier duty one.
I think the amount of $ you invest on that should be somewhat proportional to what you're trying to protect.
I think the amount of $ you invest on that should be somewhat proportional to what you're trying to protect.
I agree. I really didn’t want to spend money on a safe, especially as much money as I did. But when I thought about everything that was going to go inside (emergency cash, jewelry, and documents) on top of the guns, it seemed stupid not to spend more money for better protection.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I agree. I really didn’t want to spend money on a safe, especially as much money as I did. But when I thought about everything that was going to go inside (emergency cash, jewelry, and documents) on top of the guns, it seemed stupid not to spend more money for better protection.
A balance has to be struck to be sure, but putting high end firearms, cash, jewelry, documents etc into a cheap box that will only stop your basic snatch and grab type makes no sense to me. Another mistake I see a lot is, someone spends big $ on a legit safe (vs RSC) and decides that's all they need. I think people are better off with a high quality RSC, an alarm, and some motion alerted cameras, and good locks properly installed make robbers look elsewhere as the most effective and cost effective way to protect your chit. Legit pros willing to get passed all that, are working on big $ targets.
If I had the $, I'd own some monster TL30 safe just cuz I could.
I'm fortunate to have a monster TL30 that I got for a song...cost more to move it than what I paid. It broke the movers wench on the first attempt & weighs between 4k-5klbs. Hinges on the door are as big a beer can & the thing comes from Pretoria South Africa & they think it was made to store diamonds. Google didn't have much 411.
The AMSEC B&F series are where you should spend the $$$$ if you have decent collection.
I'm fortunate to have a monster TL30 that I got for a song...cost more to move it than what I paid. It broke the movers wench on the first attempt & weighs between 4k-5klbs. Hinges on the door are as big a beer can & the thing comes from Pretoria South Africa & they think it was made to store diamonds. Google didn't have much 411.
The AMSEC B&F series are where you should spend the $$$$ if you have decent collection.
I would dig that!
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.