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ETA - I was pretty heated when I wrote this (obviously), so in an effort to turn it into something more productive, I wanted to post about another incident that happened just up near Denver, if for no other reason then its been a while since I've seen this. The guards had no chance to put up a fight IMO.
https://youtu.be/QE5f2coQ0wY
Saw this one Facebook but I’m trying to minimize what I say on that platform. Now that I have a little girl, this is even harder to come to terms with. I firmly believe that our system should be based on “innocent until proven guilty,” but if he accepted a plea deal it has to be unlikely that he’s innocent.
Back story is that he faced several (5 I think) charges of various sexual assault crimes against a fourish year old neighbor that he babysat for. Since accepting that plea, two more now teenagers have come forward. He’d also been charged for similar crimes several years ago but IIRC, those were dropped.
The grandmother that was caring for the initial victim said the first red flag she picked up on was when the little girl started crying after he told her that she was going with him. Knowing what was behind that crying, I’d never forgive myself.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191102/076bed525d08f7e98cb03d7ed69cef8e.jpg
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I firmly believe that our system should be based on “innocent until proven guilty,” but if he accepted a plea deal it has to be unlikely that he’s innocent.
Not necessarily...
Innocent People Who Plead Guilty
https://abovethelaw.com/2018/07/innocent-people-who-plead-guilty/
There’s an assumption that when someone pleads guilty to a crime, swearing to tell the truth and allocuting to all the elements, he actually committed it. But this is not necessarily true.
Are Innocent People Pleading Guilty? A New Report Says Yes
https://www.forbes.com/sites/walterpavlo/2018/07/31/are-innocent-people-pleading-guilty-a-new-report-says-yes/#7a417d8e5193
Guilty pleas have replaced trials for a very simple reason: individuals who choose to exercise their Sixth Amendment right to trial face exponentially higher sentences if they invoke the right to trial and lose. Faced with this choice, individuals almost uniformly surrender the right to trial rather than insist on proof beyond a reasonable doubt, defense lawyers spend most of their time negotiating guilty pleas rather than ensuring that police and the government respect the boundaries of the law including the proof beyond a reasonable doubt standard, and judges dedicate their time to administering plea allocutions rather than evaluating the constitutional and legal aspects of the government’s case and police conduct. Equally important, the public rarely exercises the oversight function envisioned by the Framers and inherent in jury service.
Not necessarily...
Innocent People Who Plead Guilty
https://abovethelaw.com/2018/07/innocent-people-who-plead-guilty/
Are Innocent People Pleading Guilty? A New Report Says Yes
https://www.forbes.com/sites/walterpavlo/2018/07/31/are-innocent-people-pleading-guilty-a-new-report-says-yes/#7a417d8e5193
I did say unlikely, not guaranteed.
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titsonritz
11-02-19, 16:16
I believe child rapists should be executed, no plea deal, no mercy, no nothing, throw them in a wood chipper and make sure they won't violate another child ever. If you're stupid enough to plead guilty to something you didn't do, especially this type of crime, we don't that gene pool either.
Well the death penalty is all but gone, anywhere in the US. Thank you defense attorneys, activist judges, and politicians. Is politicians redundant with the other two?
I remember in one of the investigative training classes I took when we were discussing the psyche of a pedophile. The instructor said that just like a guy prefers blondes or brunettes a pedophile prefers children. There is no reforming them and changing their preferences. Which only leaves a couple of options on what to do with them.
Pretty frustrating when prosecutors offer plea deals on cases with a mountain of evidence and multiple similar charges. If their daughter was taped would they still offer a plea deal for 1/8-1/4 the time if went to trial?
Pretty frustrating when prosecutors offer plea deals on cases with a mountain of evidence and multiple similar charges. If their daughter was taped would they still offer a plea deal for 1/8-1/4 the time if went to trial?
There’s only so many hours in the day, it’s impossible to try everything.
I recall reading an article written by a retired federal judge who said the easiest way to collapse the entire judicial system was for everyone charged with a crime to stand firm and demand a jury trial and for those guilty demand jail and refuse to comply with probation.
Not enough jurors and not enough jail space.
The take away is that far too many laws exist and cops are far too busy locking up people for financial reasons instead of real crimes. Gotta pad that general fund and keep the asset forfeiture train on schedule!
I understand the shortage of legal resources but in violent crime cases especially involving child victims plea deals should be no go.
I understand the shortage of legal resources but in violent crime cases especially involving child victims plea deals should be no go.
Ok, but for now that’s just not feasible... I mean after all victims are suing police departments just to get their rape kits tested...
Women Across the US Suing Police For Refusing to Investigate Their Rape Kits
https://www.focusforhealth.org/women-across-the-us-suing-police-for-refusing-to-investigate-their-rape-kits/
Instead, law enforcement in America often chooses profit over people. One particularly egregious example of this choice is the fact that tens of thousands of raids on people for suspected illegal substances take place every year, while hundreds of thousands of rape kits collect dust in police departments across the country.
The_War_Wagon
11-02-19, 18:51
WHY would a grown man, babysit kids who are NOT his? :confused:
I see this M.O., MORE than I care to. :mad:
I understand the shortage of legal resources but in violent crime cases especially involving child victims plea deals should be no go.
And then the child victims are re-traumatized as they have to testify and be cross-examined, after being deposed, investigated, etc.
Or, the victims don't participate, so accuseds walk.
And then the child victims are re-traumatized as they have to testify and be cross-examined, after being deposed, investigated, etc.
Or, the victims don't participate, so accuseds walk.
I am no legal beagle but if our court system has no way to prosecute child rape/murder crimes without resume to the kids then that is FUBAR. As a society do we value our kids or not? If we won’t protect them when we easily can, then we should all (society) STFU about “for the kids” in any matters. Make it official policy that we either go above and beyond for kids safety or that we don’t give a damn.
I’ve seen this crap in family court. A person will face criminal charges and face serious consequences for animal abuse. Kids are routinely put back in the “care” of seriously abusive parents do parental binding can start again. A kid as almost no protection in family court until they have suffered multiple abuses and will likely to be forced to spend parenting time with their abuser.
Sorry for the rant it just irks the hell out of me how poorly our legal system treats kids. And the legislatures that pass weaker family laws than animal laws.
LMT Shooter
11-02-19, 21:58
Looking at his photo, the colloquial word that comes to mind is "molestache."
And all pedophiles should be executed, period. Why do they have to register? Because we know they are HIGHLY prone to do it again. Why take the chance with children as the vulnerable, and unable to defend themselves, pool of potential victims? I'd like to see legitimate statistics on which is more likely, being shot at school or molested. My experience in corrections tells me, based on the number of incarcerated suspects/convicts, that a child is probably >100 times more likely to be the victim of a pedophile than shot at school.
I’ve seen this crap in family court. A person will face criminal charges and face serious consequences for animal abuse. Kids are routinely put back in the “care” of seriously abusive parents do parental binding can start again. A kid as almost no protection in family court until they have suffered multiple abuses and will likely to be forced to spend parenting time with their abuser.
Sorry for the rant it just irks the hell out of me how poorly our legal system treats kids. And the legislatures that pass weaker family laws than animal laws.
And if the government moved to sever parental rights more quickly, many folks would be bitching about Hilary Clinton using trhe quote 'it takes a village to raise a child' and governemtn getting into the parenting business.
And, just so you know, we've done foster care, and we've adopted out of foster care. That system is 1) overwhelmed; and 2) full of lazy, money hungry losers who do as little as possible for the kids entrusted to them.
There isn't a perfect answer, and yes I agree: As a society do we value our kids or not? If we won’t protect them when we easily can, then we should all (society) STFU about “for the kids” in any matters. Make it official policy that we either go above and beyond for kids safety or that we don’t give a damn.
We need to protect the kids.
FromMyColdDeadHand
11-03-19, 01:16
It seems that the people that act this way are more prevelant than before, but then I think in the past, 50-60 years ago this didn't get reported as much. Before that, people acting this way would have probably ended up in the funny farm. If that didn't work, I really think that it was dealt with quietly and out in the woods- but that usually people like this were dealt with earlier.
Now we don't put people in the state institutions, we don't drug them up, we slap wrists and put them back in circulation. I'd like to think that it isn't swept under the rug, but from Penn State to the Women's Olympic teams it still baffles me why there is silence around some of these guys. And the number of public school female teachers working up students for extra credit is baffling.
Ok, but for now that’s just not feasible... I mean after all victims are suing police departments just to get their rape kits tested...
Women Across the US Suing Police For Refusing to Investigate Their Rape Kits
https://www.focusforhealth.org/women-across-the-us-suing-police-for-refusing-to-investigate-their-rape-kits/
Well, that wasn't a biased story at all.
Before you go crazy, I think asset forfeiture is wrecking the ethical culture at many agencies and ruining officers.
One of the issues with the rape kits (sexual assault examination kits - as my friend the sex crimes investigator used to say pointing to the appropriate body part - 'this is a rape kit') is that DNA examination is costly and time consuming IF you are going to have the chain of evidence intact and admissable results, as opposed to the check swab you send to ancestry.com.
In many states crime labs are tremendously overburdened and the funding doesn't exist to expand them and hire new analysts. You do notice that the story mentioned that when funding was made available it was grabbed up to reduce the backlogs.
In terms of the homicide statistics, thanks to our global adventures and the resulting advances in trauma care, it is a heckuva lot harder to kill someone today than it was 50 years ago - so, arguably, the homicide rate has dropped as a result. If you survive, it's more likely you are to point the finger, huh? Plus you aren't listed as a homicide statistic, you're listed as a battery statistic.
In terms of rapes - what percentage of actual rapes were reported 50 years ago? You know, back in the days where 'look at the way she was dressed, she was asking for it' was a pretty common sentiment? Compare that rate with today's rate.
In terms of clearance off both crimes - we often mention on here how folks have their noses buried in technology. How many shows on TV semi-accurately depict police crime scene work and police investigations? Any chance that watching those shows and googling 'how to get away with murder' might give a guy a leg up on the deal?
It isn't just numbers, it's numbers in context.
In response to the Brinks hold up video. I used to work for them in Buffalo, NY, when I went through the new hire instruction, they told us if such an event were to occur, to hand over the money and once the perp turns around and starts walking away to shoot them. The instructor said that corporate had an army of lawyers on retainer just waiting to deal with such a situation. Thankfully I was never put in that situation, and most of the stories he related to us of trucks being held up turned out to be inside jobs.
But getting back to that video, the messenger (dude who leaves the truck and handles the money) looked completely unaware of his surroundings, didn't look like he was scanning and looking for threats. I also believe that is why I was never bothered, my head was on a swivel at all times and (being back from Iraq a year or so earlier) I probably gave off a vibe that kept people in check, or maybe I was just lucky. So either the messenger and or driver were in on the heist, or his lack of situational awareness led to the perps deciding to go for it. Granted, given that one had a draco, if the messenger looked switched on, they might have just gunned him down as soon as they got out of the SUV, or they could have decided to abort the mission and go find a Loomis or Wells Fargo truck instead.
And if the government moved to sever parental rights more quickly...
You have a point here, I believe they should be severing parental rights more often. What most people inside the conservative bubble cannot grasp is the supermajority of people having kids today are simply not the ones we want breeding for a multitude of reasons.
Kids having kids that end up in the care of overwhelmed grandparents who are still trying to work towards retirement.
Females looking to find a good daddy types... popping out a kid with each piece of trash she can get to bed her with the idea... "oh he's definitely the one..."
People simply too stupid or lazy to use any form of birth control.
Welfare types looking for another child tax credit fat payout at the end of the year.
All of these types end up using some form of .gov assistance to raise their children from food stamps to section 8 housing vouchers to daycare assistance. We all end up paying for them. If we didn't could you imagine the scene, how would that look. These folks aren't gonna stop screwing now are they?
Those kids would just keep on coming and no one to feed, cloth, house them or provide medical care.
I know I'll catch hell for the following but its what I believe.
I'm about as antigovernment as one can get and still be considered a libertarian, BUT... the one (unique) area I wish the .gov was involved in is child birth. To have a child I think the bar should be considerably high. From age/education (maturity), drug and health screenings, financial situation/employment, criminal history, immediate and extended family to be considered should something happen to you we need to know the family is capable and willing to take and raise said child.
Absent all this, no kids for you. But should you choose to breed anyways, you are forced to give birth where the child is taken from you and placed into the custody of the state, you have no rights to this child. Both mother and father are tried and jailed for a given term and they are sterilized permanently.
Extreme? Absolutely... but I feel that far too many useless humans are breeding. If you want a family, fine. But make yourself a better, productive person first.
Before you go crazy
Not gonna go crazy, your points are valid and well taken.
Pleading guilty does not necessarily equal guilt. Not defending this guy, but our justice system can get pretty f'd up.
I have a personal friend who due to a wild misunderstanding was accused of sexualy abusing a child. Not going into the particulars, but once the dust settled and the truth was known no one wanted him to be prosecuted. Not the police, not the parents, nobody. However, he had been arrested and charged. The prosecutor absolutely refused to drop it. He was planning a run for political office and was not willing to have a less than 100 percent conviction record for child sex abuse. My friend was given the choice of pleading out for 0 time, no probation, and most importantly no issue about keeping custody of his son; or he could go to trial and face the wrath of a prosecutor intent on coming away with a conviction. He pled out. He is on the sex offender registry for however long he has left (he has ALS) but he got to raise his son and that is all he really cares about. Not saying this is common, but ...
Pleading guilty does not necessarily equal guilt. Not defending this guy, but our justice system can get pretty f'd up.
I have a personal friend who due to a wild misunderstanding was accused of sexualy abusing a child. Not going into the particulars, but once the dust settled and the truth was known no one wanted him to be prosecuted. Not the police, not the parents, nobody. However, he had been arrested and charged. The prosecutor absolutely refused to drop it. He was planning a run for political office and was not willing to have a less than 100 percent conviction record for child sex abuse. My friend was given the choice of pleading out for 0 time, no probation, and most importantly no issue about keeping custody of his son; or he could go to trial and face the wrath of a prosecutor intent on coming away with a conviction. He pled out. He is on the sex offender registry for however long he has left (he has ALS) but he got to raise his son and that is all he really cares about. Not saying this is common, but ...
An alarming number of prosecutors especially federal prosecutors are a special kind of evil. Thats why anytime I hear or read about any prosecutor finding themselves on the wrong side of a court room or worse, I smile a little inside. Because you know on some level they deserve it.
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