View Full Version : Johnny's Reloading Bench temperature sensitivity testing
Should be of interest for those of us shooting in wide temperature ranges.
https://youtu.be/lcy8zqclIns
This is an exciting new powder. I’m very interested in giving it a go, but I’m not sure how valid Johnny’s technique is.
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I watched the video and can say I'm not surprised that a ball powder can't live up to the hype compared to the proven extruded offerings in temp stability. I was skeptical from the first announcement. A man can dream for an easy metering spherical powder that doesn't move with temps though.
This seems like a slower-burning version of dense ball powders like Alliant 2000-MR. These new generation powders are indeed better than older stuff like H335, BLC-2, H414, etc... But they are still are not as good as the extruded powders.
Closest we can get to the pipe dream is short-cut, small grain extruded powders like 8208 XBR
The video’s testing procedure is wrong and real conclusions can’t be drawn. He just picked random loads.
None of the loads were tuned to the gun. If one is outside the node, temperature variation has a greater impact than it does when a load is firmly planted in the middle of the node. I take it with a grain of salt. The powder could be descent or it could be terrible as well.
Before I could decide, I would want to develop a load at a moderate temperature and ensure that +/- 0.2 gr. of my target load did not have a significant impact on my velocity. That would help insulate the load, to some degree, from temperature swings.
While I’ve loaded a fair bit of ammo on progressive presses, even ball powder has proven not to meter up to my expectations with the onboard powder dispensers. I’ve taken to throwing cases in an electronic dispenser/scale combination using a powder funnel die. It’s mildly slower, but something like an Auto Trickler makes it a minor inconvenience.
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It’s mildly slower, but something like an Auto Trickler makes it a minor inconvenience.
Since we're in the reloading forum...
How does the Auto Trickler compare with something like an RCBS Chargemaster?
Since we're in the reloading forum...
How does the Auto Trickler compare with something like an RCBS Chargemaster?
It’s significantly faster and significantly more accurate. I get as much as a half grain drift with the chargemaster. This can be mitigated a few ways and makes “good enough” ammunition. The scale just isn’t up to snuff.
The auto trickler is a true lab grade scale.
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The auto trickler is a true lab grade scale...
I can't even find a price for it... I bet it's way more than $200, right? (That's what a Chargemaster Lite costs.)
I can't even find a price for it... I bet it's way more than $200, right? (That's what a Chargemaster Lite costs.)
Yeah you’re looking closer to a grand.
Area 419 sells them set up. Brownells sells the parts and you can assemble your own.
RCBS has a new version coming out called the Matchmaster or something such which claims 0.02gr accuracy and sub ten second charges which is as fast as I could run my progressive press anyway with manual bullet and case feeding (which I want for Precision loads).
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I can't even find a price for it... I bet it's way more than $200, right? (That's what a Chargemaster Lite costs.)
Like $1400
I can't even find a price for it... I bet it's way more than $200, right? (That's what a Chargemaster Lite costs.)
Yeah Bimmer. We have one that I have set up but need to call for help on the trickler over-shooting the charge. The scale is absolutely amazing.
RCBS has a new version coming out called the Matchmaster...
Yeah, I saw that... Too rich for my blood.
For decades I've been happy enough with my Dillon balance-beam scale and powder measure, but now that I'm doing more load development, constantly twisting the powder measure and manually weighing charges just feels like a PITA.
The powders I use stink in powder throwers and I’m to the point where I’m too busy to do it the old fashion way. My buddies all use the fancy throwers but I have the ole chargemaster that I wait on all day.
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The powders I use stink in powder throwers and I’m to the point where I’m too busy to do it the old fashion way. My buddies all use the fancy throwers but I have the ole chargemaster that I wait on all day.
Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkHere's a dirty little secret that will cause some to wail and gnash teeth. The Frankford Arsenal Intellidropper actually kicks some ass and is cheap. Just don't use the plastic cover and it is quite fast and consistent.
The powders I use stink in powder throwers and I’m to the point where I’m too busy to do it the old fashion way. My buddies all use the fancy throwers but I have the ole chargemaster that I wait on all day.
I set up other tasks to do whilest I wait on the chargemaster. It's a nice tool for poor metering powders, but it's exhausting at times.
For me loading on the progressive there’s not much time for anything by the time I set a bullet and run the ram. But there’s enough time that I sit and wait.
When I single state load, I charge and seat a bullet at the same time so the wait isn’t bad with a chargemaster but the drift and over throws bug me. I can start a session and it will be spot on. By the end there will be so much drift I’m certain I’ll float out of the node.
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I've not seen too much drift on my chargmaster. However, the overthrows drive me effing nuts. I have the MacDonalds straw in there which helps, but it's still annoying.
I've not seen too much drift on my chargmaster. However, the overthrows drive me effing nuts. I have the MacDonalds straw in there which helps, but it's still annoying.
Mark,
Try this setup. I rarely ever have overthrows, maybe one in 500 rounds.
I use these settings and the straw on mine.
Credit to -Primal Rights-
1. Turn the unit on.
2. When 0.0gn is on the display, press BOTH the ENTER and the EDIT MEM keys on the dispenser at the same time. Hold for a second and then release. If done properly ADJUST PARAMETER should scroll across the display followed by HSP 00015.68
At this point you are in the programming menu. The first 3 settings are the ones you need to concern yourself with. HSP settings are basically different speeds for different stages of the powder throw. The setting changes the amount of grains under your desired charge weight where the unit will switch speeds.
HSP A1 - This is the first stage, wide open.
HSP B1 - This is medium speed.
HSP C1 - This is the last stage, slow trickle.
To change the setting, just use the number pad and type in the new setting. If you wanted to change the first setting to 7.00, you would type in 700. When you have the variable set, simply press ENTER to move to the next setting. You'll have to press enter a number of times (20+) to get through the rest of the settings, and then the unit will reboot itself.
Here are my settings:
HSP A1 - 9.00
HSP B1 - 2.00
HSP C1 - 1.00
(Above are my settings that work great.)
So, it will run wide open until 9grns under my desired charge, then go at medium speed until 2gr under, then it will stop for a slow trickle at 1gr under.
Changing this cut my charge time in half. Getting two of them up side by side has reduced that by an additional 1/3. One running on default settings would dump one 44.5gr charge of varget every 20-35 seconds. Reprogramming cut that down to about 10-15 seconds. While running two reprogrammed units, I don't wait for much of anything now.
I've resisted messing with this. But I may go ahead an give it a try Sunday. Thanks.
It is WELL worth it......Night and day difference for me.
I did mine years ago. Couldn’t imagine running it in factory configuration. A friend of mine used mine and then bought one. He thought his was broken when compared to a programmed unit.
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When I single state load, I charge and seat a bullet at the same time so the wait isn’t bad with a chargemaster but the drift and over throws bug me. I can start a session and it will be spot on. By the end there will be so much drift I’m certain I’ll float out of the node.
Wipe the chargemaster down with an anti-static dryer sheet. I was having problems with it starting spot on and then drifting/overcharging. Called RCBS customer service. That's their recommendation.
Mark,
Try this setup. I rarely ever have overthrows, maybe one in 500 rounds.
I use these settings and the straw on mine.
Credit to -Primal Rights-
[I]1. Turn the unit on.
2. When 0.0gn is on the display, press BOTH the ENTER and the EDIT MEM keys...
Is the ChargeMaster Lite programmable the same way?
(I don't have one, but I'm looking at the manual, and it doesn't mention programming.)
Is the ChargeMaster Lite programmable the same way?
(I don't have one, but I'm looking at the manual, and it doesn't mention programming.)
No clue. I don't own one either.
Wipe the chargemaster down with an anti-static dryer sheet. I was having problems with it starting spot on and then drifting/overcharging. Called RCBS customer service. That's their recommendation.
I do that periodically. RCBS told me try it back when I first got it ten years ago.
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fedupflyer
11-14-19, 12:57
On the Chargemaster,, make sure you use the plastic cover when despensing and weighing. Those load cells are very sensitive and even a slight breeze (that you cannot feel) or your breathing can affect it.
Seen way too many vids about people complaining about the drift and they are not using the cover.
On the Chargemaster,, make sure you use the plastic cover when despensing and weighing. Those load cells are very sensitive and even a slight breeze (that you cannot feel) or your breathing can affect it.
Seen way too many vids about people complaining about the drift and they are not using the cover.
You should see the scale that comes with the Auto trickler deal. Makes the chargemaster scale look like kids' stuff.
I've not seen too much drift on my chargmaster. However, the overthrows drive me effing nuts. I have the MacDonalds straw in there which helps, but it's still annoying.
What is the “McDonald’s straw” that you are talking about? I bought an RCBS Charge master lite and it seems very accurate. Only used it for a short time though.
What is the “McDonald’s straw” that you are talking about? I bought an RCBS Charge master lite and it seems very accurate. Only used it for a short time though.
The McDonalds straw deal is where you cut a piece of McDonalds straw and slide it into the output tube. It smooths the flow rate of powder kernels. Less clumping at the mouth of the output tube. The chargemaster can't see that there's a big pile of kernals ready to drop when it's nudging the load up to weight. I'll some flick the output tube if I can see that it's getting ready to Eff me with an over dump.
What is the “McDonald’s straw” that you are talking about?
The McDonalds straw deal is where you cut a piece of McDonalds straw and slide it into the output tube. It smooths the flow rate of powder kernels...
WAG here, but I thought I read somewhere that RCBS had fixed the design of the output tube with the (newer) "Lite" and the McDonalds straw was no longer necessary...
I am too impatient to wait on the Chargemaster to throw a full charge so I set the powder measure on the Dillon a couple of grains under, dump that in the pan and thus use the Chargemaster as a trickler to finish off. Works for me and cuts the time considerably. I also use the MacDonalds straw and reset the times and really like the way mine works.
The McDonalds straw deal is where you cut a piece of McDonalds straw and slide it into the output tube. It smooths the flow rate of powder kernels. Less clumping at the mouth of the output tube. The chargemaster can't see that there's a big pile of kernals ready to drop when it's nudging the load up to weight. I'll some flick the output tube if I can see that it's getting ready to Eff me with an over dump.
Ok, thanks. I have the Charge master “Lite” and have had very few over charges (3, maybe 4 out of a 100). I am also curious about the “programming” of the charge master mentioned earlier and does it apply to the newer “Lite” version of the machine.
Ok, thanks. I have the Charge master “Lite” and have had very few over charges (3, maybe 4 out of a 100). I am also curious about the “programming” of the charge master mentioned earlier and does it apply to the newer “Lite” version of the machine.
Good Grief... the other night I swear I was getting 50-60% over charges by 2 to 4 tenths. I was so close to smashing that mother f@#ker to pieces.
Good Grief... the other night I swear I was getting 50-60% over charges by 2 to 4 tenths. I was so close to smashing that mother f@#ker to pieces.
Ha, maybe my CM lite isn’t “broken” in yet. Lol.
Does the CM have the trickler function of the output tube like the Lite version does? The output tube rotates slowly as the charge weight that is set and desired is approached.
BTW....JRB sure has some informative videos for sure on YT. Except one of his .300 Blk videos where subsonic reloads are being tested without a suppressor. All kinds of FTFs. Can’t figure out why someone would NOT test subsonic reloads/work ups with out the gun being suppressed.
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