View Full Version : Pretend You Are Sitting On an Interview Panel
Nightvisionary
12-04-19, 17:58
to select a candidate for a supervisory public safety position. Along with his resume one candidate includes a copy of a 15 year old letter on white house letterhead signed by the POTUS thanking him for his assistance during a presidential visit. Would you view the inclusion of the letter as proper, improper, useful or irrelevant in making a decision?
just a scout
12-04-19, 18:02
Mostly irrelevant but it does provide some background.
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to select a candidate for a supervisory public safety position. Along with his resume one candidate includes a copy of a 15 year old letter on white house letterhead signed by the POTUS thanking him for his assistance during a presidential visit. Would you view the inclusion of the letter as proper, improper, useful or irrelevant in making a decision?
I think I'd view it as a desperate attempt by someone with relatively few actual accomplishments to pad their resume with whatever they could.
It would depend on what the candidate was like during the interview but including that would probably rub me the wrong way and they would have to work a bit harder to win me over than if they hadn't included it.
Wreaks of desperation and a career civil servant who is probably pretty worthless. Hence the lengthy career in civil service.
Well I’m of two minds.
If he put it in as a conversation starter about like his function at that event and how he handled supervision but makes his point and moves on then not bad.
If he talks endlessly about it then he’s a glory hound.
Also he’s not the only person to get letters like that. It’s not like him and Dubya shared Mexican hookers and got High together while watching Scooby Doo.
I certainly wouldn't view it as improper.
In terms of relevance, was it a pro forma letter sent to every officer who assisted, or is it personalized as in 'your assistance with making the arrangements for the security detail' etc.
Or, are you looking at it from a political perspective?
ETA: During our hiring processes you would be surprised at the number of resumes of application that get rejected simply because they don't hit all the prerequisites for the position. For us, if that letter was an attempt to meet some prerequisite, it might be the difference between getting an interview and not getting an interview. To the point - if one of the prerequisites for a job was a background in adult education, I'd damned sure indicate I had taught adult Sunday School and was a Coach in my job at McDonald's if I didn't have anything to throw at that prerequisite.
Nightvisionary
12-04-19, 18:16
I certainly wouldn't view it as improper.
In terms of relevance, was it a pro forma letter sent to every officer who assisted, or is it personalized as in 'your assistance with making the arrangements for the security detail' etc.
Or, are you looking at it from a political perspective?
ETA: During our hiring processes you would be surprised at the number of resumes of application that get rejected simply because they don't hit all the prerequisites for the position. For us, if that letter was an attempt to meet some prerequisite, it might be the difference between getting an interview and not getting an interview. To the point - if one of the prerequisites for a job was a background in adult education, I'd damned sure indicate I had taught adult Sunday School and was a Coach in my job at McDonald's if I didn't have anything to throw at that prerequisite.
Political implications aren't a consideration but the feedback already in this thread has been very helpful.
It's probably not improper...It's probably not all that relevant either.
The more I think about this, he sounds like a douche. I wouldn't hold it against him, but I'd take a closer look at the resume and see if he's done anything other than be a pulse, especially during critical incidents.
I'm young guy early in my career and I want to work for guy who leads from the front. Someone who is going to be direct but not in a dickish way. I know our promotional panel turned away someone for bombing the oral, so maybe if he makes it that far, it will come out then. Hope you find who/what you're looking for. I don't envy the position bosses are put in.
Irrelevant. Carries no weight with me and has no bearing.
Averageman
12-04-19, 18:45
I look at it as a history of service, good decision making and decorum.
Proper yes. Relevant sure.
Such letters are rubber stamped to entities in jurisdictions hosting visits and the like however.
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A 15 year old letter brings nothing to the table. It wouldn't be a negative, perhaps, but it would be on the applicant to show some relevance. I retired from the military 11 years ago, and it is only mentioned on my resume, not emphasized.
If it is relevant to the position, or answers a specific question, include it. If it’s completely unrelated, pass on the applicant.
Irrelevant.
If the interview goes well and has solid experience and clean background (as necessary for the position) it doesn’t matter.
If he is equally qualified with another candidate, based on his presentation in his interview, it might be a clue about how he relates with people.
It’s not something I would do in most circumstances. As others have mentioned, my immediate thought is “semi-desperate,” but that absolutely doesn’t have to be a bad thing. The greatest motivator in the world is hunger.
From outside that business, i would say it depends on context.
If it supports other achievements or a proven record good.
A one-off as the only thing with “merit” id pass.
I look for people with a trail of achievements (size and number depends on career-time).
For example, someone with 3 years experience may have 5 good small victories that increase in importance over time- good sign. A dude with 10 years experience and a few small things and 1 letterhead- no-go. Gotta take the full context into account.
It depends on what the letter says and if it's the only thing presented or if it's part of a series of supporting documents. If the Officer quarterbacked a Presidential visit for the local organization, I'd say that shows the ability to coordinate/supervise a complex multiagency effort. If said officer is good at it, they should have newer instances that shows that proficiency as well.
to select a candidate for a supervisory public safety position. Along with his resume one candidate includes a copy of a 15 year old letter on white house letterhead signed by the POTUS thanking him for his assistance during a presidential visit. Would you view the inclusion of the letter as proper, improper, useful or irrelevant in making a decision?
Would very much depend what kind of "supervisory public safety position." Will impress some but seem desperate for others. If it's related to Federal government, I'd personally include it just to show you have played on this field before and understand a lot about the environment as a result.
But most importantly, you are the candidate and you have to sell yourself, letters of recommendation are just supporting documents. And I'm sure you knew that already.
What Circle 10 said. Reeks of "insider/team" as well.
Would very much depend what kind of "supervisory public safety position." Will impress some but seem desperate for others. If it's related to Federal government, I'd personally include it just to show you have played on this field before and understand a lot about the environment as a result.
Were it worded as a personal reference and personal letter, I might agree with you. But 'thank you' notes are basically etiquette documents. The "t-shirt" for the upper crust. A participation award.
The inclusion of the letter gives me the impression of someone that is concerned about being believed. OR.. maybe they thought it would keep their resume from being tossed and that was it's only purpose. In that case, it got them in the door which is the desired goal.
I have a single line on my resume from when I was selected to do an executive protection detail for then Senator Biden in 2001.
I thought this was relevant to add to my resume because I was selected by my Chief and I was a young 26 year old officer that he selected over many other senior officers to do this detail.
I don’t talk about this detail unless asked about it and it’s certainly not a primary point in my resume. So I do believe that there may be some relevance depending on the circumstances.
What have you done for me recently?
I know people who actively collect these types of letters, but more in a souvenir of the job way than trying to impress people way. I've worked on a PSD in the past and coordinated VIP visits. I've also worked visits from presidential candidates and the VP in my AOR. I don't have letters from those and just look at it as part of the job.
The one letter I do have is more memorabilia than anything, but it might have merit at a job interview of the type we're discussing here (if I were an applicant). It's from the management team operating the Iron Maiden "The Book Of Souls World Tour" in 2016. I was cold called by them when they were in the planning phase of the tour. It was a call I could've easily passed along to someone else as "not my circus, not my monkeys", but I didn't. I took a lead role in both planning and execution of their visit in my AOR. It involved a lot of local coordination, international conference calls, pre and post clearing locally and at follow on destinations, etc. When an unexpected obstacle cropped up mid-visit, I mobilized assets to mitigate the issue and smoothly transition operations so there was no interruption noticed by the tour or the regular customers.
I'd only bring it up in an interview as an example if it were relevant to the position I was applying for, and provide the personalized appreciation letter as documentation because it's an example where I went above and beyond the requirements of my position. I only did it because I wanted our team to be recognized for their professionalism. Well, that and the fact that their 747, "Ed Force One" was damaged and two people injured at their next stop. Obviously someone didn't do the prep work as well there.
I believe things like this have an expiration date though. I'd try to use a more recent example than something from 15 years ago.
Iron Maiden?
YOU’RE HIRED!
Iron Maiden?
YOU’RE HIRED!
I have a pic where Bruce is verifying his identity as Captain to the security coordinator on the air stairs, and I'm in his plane. :)
I have a pic where Bruce is verifying his identity as Captain to the security coordinator on the air stairs, and I'm in his plane. :)
Hey buddy, you made the sale. You got the job.
Hey buddy, you made the sale. You got the job.
Yeah, but I gotta humblebrag a bit! ;)
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49173655128_d5c73aa0f4_k.jpg
Yeah, but I gotta humblebrag a bit! ;)
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49173655128_d5c73aa0f4_k.jpgThats pretty sweet! Bruce Dickinson is probably the only Rock star Id want to actually meet and talk to.
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Thats pretty sweet! Bruce Dickinson is probably the only Rock star Id want to actually meet and talk to.
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The entire tour were chill and very appreciative of the welcome we put on. They were a pleasure to work with and it was a great experience all around.
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