Feeling a bit intimidated here...lol

[ghosttwofive]

I've been a member here for quite a while, but the amount of knowledge everyone seems to have here is a bit intimidating so I wanted to ask a few things about my AR-15 yet not incur the wrath of those who know more than me which is quite a few....

Anyway, if anyone has any good info for me, please let me know.

I'm getting away from a forward grip I had on my Colt LE6920 SOCOM. The forward grip, I've tried several, never did feel right. The most recent grip I had had a built in tac light which was very handy. I'm now shopping around for some other type of setup and I came across a UTG Gen 2 flashlight/laser combo. It looks nice, generally good reviews but I'm wondering if anyone has any experience with this model, how long the pressure switch cord is for the flashlight and what's a good method for hiding the excess wire but not showing all the wire all over the place. I prefer my rifle to have a "clean" look to it so I'd hope to not have pressure switch wire all over the place. I have a Larue 10-inch rail so it's got plenty of space to run the wire between but, just being honest, I've never ran a flashlight/laser combo before.

I'm also getting a Sig Sauer Juliet 4x magnifier to go with my Eotech EXPS2-0. Has anyone ran this setup on their rifle? Here's my stupid story. I had the HHS II combo Eotech sight and G33 magnifier back in 2016 which, like a dumbass, I traded back in to Eotech when all the bad press came about the return and the lawsuit. Probably the biggest rifle related mistake I've ever made, I freely admit, it was a very nice setup. I've finally gotten the funds to get myself an Eotech EXPS2-0, which I love, I like it better than the one I had with the combo due to this one only has one dot in the middle of the ring. It's a great site, but I'm curious if I should just go back and get an Eotech G33 magnifier which is 3x or go with the Sig Juliet 4x magnifier. My eyes have gotten worse, so the 4x is attractive but not sure if it would link up with the Eotech sight as well as the G33?

Anyway, I very much appreciate any info anyone out there might have. Thank you for your time.

[PrivateCitizen]

We all come out sometime … er … ;)

Anyhow, I'd suspect the general consensus is to not use a laser for non-night-vision purposes (invisible only only). I suppose it could be a foundation for training for night work, but otherwise I'd avoid it.

On the magnifier, be honest with yourself … what does your heart want? I'd guess the G33 … but you are maybe seeing the 4x as a justifier. The 1X probably shouldn't make that much dif, especially in use as intended.

You already seem to regret losing the Eotech setup once …

I don't have any personal experience with the SIG, so I am not commenting on quality, per se. Just saying don't play mind-games with yourself over it.

[ghosttwofive]

Thank you sir. The Eotech G33 was my one and only thought at first, but then when I compared length, specs, etc I started considering the 4x as it is pretty close in size and weight to the G33. For continuity sake, yeah, the G33 and sight combo really was a bad ass sight as far as both tactically and aesthetically, but I do like the thought of having a bit more magnification. As far as the laser, I appreciate the info. Other than just watching videos, I've never used or had much experience with laser on handguns or rifles, I could never see the use in them, but this combo I'm purchasing has a very ergonomic look to it so I guess I might try it. Anyway, I appreciate your info sir, thanks.

[Wake27]

UTG is typically regarded as junk. I had some when I played paintball back in high school (2010ish) and it was junk then. I doubt they’ve come very far, so I really wouldn’t recommend that route. I like the BCM stubby grip as a VFG due to the angle. I use it kind of like the AFG/hybrid concept as opposed to a traditional vert grip like in 2002. I wouldn’t be opposed to ditching the VFG altogether, but mobility issues in my wrist and shoulder make it difficult to really pull the gun into my shoulder without it. I have various setups for lights, either activated by my thumb just above the grip or from a pressure pad on the top rail.

Can’t comment much on the optics, I liked my G33 a lot and want one again some day. But the newer Vortex micro is also tempting due to price and size. I never used the magnifier much, YMMV.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[ghosttwofive]

Thanks for the info. I may go another route than the UTG. I had a forward grip with a tac light built in for years and it's been sturdy, but left shoulder issues are making me not want to use a forward grip these days. I had to have some major surgeries to repair my shoulder and for some reason, either the way I grip the forward grip or something makes my shoulder hurt like hell, but when I just use my left hand to grip the rifle on the rail, it doesn't hurt at all. Not sure what the deal with that is. I've heard good things about Vortex but I've never used any of their products. I've always trusted Sig Sauer equipment but it's hard to beat the Eotech G33. Mainly I'm considering the Sig due to the 4x over the 3x. My eyes suck. I previously has an Aimpont PRO on my Colt, but as the astigmatism condition has gotten worse in both eyes, the Aimpoint PRO dot looks looks like a starburst unless I remove my contacts. The Eotech sight picture is much easier on my eyes but definitely want a magnifier to go with it, I've always like the holo + magnifier set up, it seems to work better for me than a LPVO. I used a friend's rifle that had a Burris LPVO and I just couldn't get used to it. I'm much more comfortable shooing a holo sight with a magnifier. I very much appreciate it.

[LowSpeed_HighDrag]

OP,

If you are having shoulder issued using your vertical foregrip, there are solutions!

BCM Stubby Grip, BCM KAG, Magpul AFG, or really any handstop out there will aid in your desired hand placement without hurting your shoulder.

As far as UTG goes, if budget allows, please stay away from it. UTG is Chinese made for airsoft guns, how it ever made it into the firearm world I do not know.

I own an Aimpoint 3xC magnifier and an Eotech G33. The Eotech is a far superior magnifier to anything else on the market, especially some cheap Sig glass.

Lasers are fairly worthless if you are actually aiming, which you will be with your Eotech. Get a BCM KAG grip, and a Streamlight HLX/LCS kit and your grip and shoulder issues will be gone, plus you'll have a helluva setup for not alot of money. See links below, and pics of my carbines setup with what I mentioned.

KAG
https://bravocompanyusa.com/bcmgunfighter-kag-1913-picatinny-rail-version-black/

HLX/LCS
https://clouddefensive.com/product/lcs-streamlight-hlx-kit/

https://i.imgur.com/XjPuIbw.jpg

[ghosttwofive]

Thank you so much for the info. So the Sig uses cheap glass? That's disappointing. If you have time, can you give me some tips on the grip you referenced? The only relief i seem to get when I use my left arm now is when I grip the rifle itself like you would hold a normal deer rifle. Any forward grip I've tried starts making my shoulder sing soprano pretty quickly, even a year post surgery which the doc said would be about as good as it's going to get, I suppose it's just the position my shoulder is at. I've never used the kind of stop your link references. So do you use that type of grip to "pull" the weapon into your shoulder more securely? Also, starting to lean toward canceling the UTG, not a lot of good reviews here. I'm on a bit of a budget but I think I can do better. I'm thinking of ditching the laser part and just getting a tac light set up. BTW, both of your rifles are bad ass. So between the Aimpont and Eotech magnifier, the Eotech wins out?

[LowSpeed_HighDrag]

Thank you so much for the info. So the Sig uses cheap glass? That's disappointing. If you have time, can you give me some tips on the grip you referenced? The only relief i seem to get when I use my left arm now is when I grip the rifle itself like you would hold a normal deer rifle. Any forward grip I've tried starts making my shoulder sing soprano pretty quickly, even a year post surgery which the doc said would be about as good as it's going to get, I suppose it's just the position my shoulder is at. I've never used the kind of stop your link references. So do you use that type of grip to "pull" the weapon into your shoulder more securely? Also, starting to lean toward canceling the UTG, not a lot of good reviews here. I'm on a bit of a budget but I think I can do better. I'm thinking of ditching the laser part and just getting a tac light set up. BTW, both of your rifles are bad ass. So between the Aimpont and Eotech magnifier, the Eotech wins out?

I'm trying to picture what you are talking about as far as the deer rifle comparison. If you mean you are basically resting the rail in your palm, then I don't think any grip is gonna solve that. If you mean that you need to wrap your hand around the rail instead of a vertical grip, then any of the above mentioned grips will work as they simply help you pull your rifle tighter into your shoulder.

I wouldn't use UTG for anything. Save the pennies if need be, we've all had to do it too, but get the best quality you can afford. UTG aint it chief!

Sig Glass, especially the Romeo line, is not quality stuff. I've seen enough Romeo's go down to know to stay away from it. And yes, the Eotech is the better magnifier. However, if you want to save some money, the Aimpoint 3xC and Larue combo is pretty affordable for what you get:

https://www.larue.com/products/aimpoint-3x-c-magnifier-with-larue-qd-mount/

[1168]

I've never used the kind of stop your link references. So do you use that type of grip to "pull" the weapon into your shoulder more securely?

If you are most comfortable with your grip parallel to the bore, like a slick handguard, but you want something to help you pull the rifle into your shoulder, you can try a small fingerstop between your index and middle finger. Which Larue rail do you have?

I’d skip the UTG, and suggest an Arisaka Scout with one of their mounts, a Surefire tape switch and a Cloud Defensive LCS. I think Weapon Outfitters has a build-your-light tool to set this up. Also consider the Cloud Defensive OWL or Elzetta. Although, I do not recommend the Elzetta remote switch.

[uffdaphil]

I changed all my forward grips out for Arisaka finger stops. I mount so index finger rests in front and thumb is in position to click a scout light. I’ve only used Mlok and Keymod so can’t say if picatinny version is as comfy. But it’s cheap enough. And if you don’t like it I’d buy it from you for my quad rail that needs one.

https://arisakadefense.com/products/finger-stop-picatinny

[Boba Fett v2]

I've been a member here for quite a while, but the amount of knowledge everyone seems to have here is a bit intimidating so I wanted to ask a few things about my AR-15 yet not incur the wrath of those who know more than me which is quite a few....

Anyway, if anyone has any good info for me, please let me know.

I'm getting away from a forward grip I had on my Colt LE6920 SOCOM. The forward grip, I've tried several, never did feel right. The most recent grip I had had a built in tac light which was very handy. I'm now shopping around for some other type of setup and I came across a UTG Gen 2 flashlight/laser combo. It looks nice, generally good reviews but I'm wondering if anyone has any experience with this model, how long the pressure switch cord is for the flashlight and what's a good method for hiding the excess wire but not showing all the wire all over the place. I prefer my rifle to have a "clean" look to it so I'd hope to not have pressure switch wire all over the place. I have a Larue 10-inch rail so it's got plenty of space to run the wire between but, just being honest, I've never ran a flashlight/laser combo before.

I'm also getting a Sig Sauer Juliet 4x magnifier to go with my Eotech EXPS2-0. Has anyone ran this setup on their rifle? Here's my stupid story. I had the HHS II combo Eotech sight and G33 magnifier back in 2016 which, like a dumbass, I traded back in to Eotech when all the bad press came about the return and the lawsuit. Probably the biggest rifle related mistake I've ever made, I freely admit, it was a very nice setup. I've finally gotten the funds to get myself an Eotech EXPS2-0, which I love, I like it better than the one I had with the combo due to this one only has one dot in the middle of the ring. It's a great site, but I'm curious if I should just go back and get an Eotech G33 magnifier which is 3x or go with the Sig Juliet 4x magnifier. My eyes have gotten worse, so the 4x is attractive but not sure if it would link up with the Eotech sight as well as the G33?

Anyway, I very much appreciate any info anyone out there might have. Thank you for your time.

When you overthink your setup you're bound to question and second guess your decisions.

You've already identified something that does not works for you. You've also identified something that did work for you, but you decided to ditch it due to internet hype surrounding an issue that you may or may not ever experience.

Only you know what your intended purpose for your rifle is and you should set it up accordingly. The only way to really know is if you invest more time training. Through continuous training activity, you will discover what works best, what doesn't, what's reliable, what fails, the max capabilities and limits of your system as a whole, and then you will work to address those shortcomings (is it a training issue or equipment issue?), either through more training or new equipment. No need to be intimidated. Knowledge is gained through experience, trial and error, failure and success. Log off this forum and go get some. Then bring that knowledge with you here to share with others starting down this path. Namaste.

[Hmac]

I've been a member here for quite a while, but the amount of knowledge everyone seems to have here is a bit intimidating so I wanted to ask a few things about my AR-15 yet not incur the wrath of those who know more than me which is quite a few....

Anyway, if anyone has any good info for me, please let me know.

I'm getting away from a forward grip I had on my Colt LE6920 SOCOM. The forward grip, I've tried several, never did feel right. The most recent grip I had had a built in tac light which was very handy. I'm now shopping around for some other type of setup and I came across a UTG Gen 2 flashlight/laser combo. It looks nice, generally good reviews but I'm wondering if anyone has any experience with this model, how long the pressure switch cord is for the flashlight and what's a good method for hiding the excess wire but not showing all the wire all over the place. I prefer my rifle to have a "clean" look to it so I'd hope to not have pressure switch wire all over the place. I have a Larue 10-inch rail so it's got plenty of space to run the wire between but, just being honest, I've never ran a flashlight/laser combo before.

I'm also getting a Sig Sauer Juliet 4x magnifier to go with my Eotech EXPS2-0. Has anyone ran this setup on their rifle? Here's my stupid story. I had the HHS II combo Eotech sight and G33 magnifier back in 2016 which, like a dumbass, I traded back in to Eotech when all the bad press came about the return and the lawsuit. Probably the biggest rifle related mistake I've ever made, I freely admit, it was a very nice setup. I've finally gotten the funds to get myself an Eotech EXPS2-0, which I love, I like it better than the one I had with the combo due to this one only has one dot in the middle of the ring. It's a great site, but I'm curious if I should just go back and get an Eotech G33 magnifier which is 3x or go with the Sig Juliet 4x magnifier. My eyes have gotten worse, so the 4x is attractive but not sure if it would link up with the Eotech sight as well as the G33?

Anyway, I very much appreciate any info anyone out there might have. Thank you for your time.

I have a G33 magnifier that I use with my Aimpoint PRO, my Aimpoint Micro, and a couple of Eotech EXPS's...it works great for my needs, which is all inside of 50 yards. I'm a big fan of the G33 and it's eliminated my need (or desire) for any of the magnified optics.

I also have ditched all my forward grips and just go with a little hand stop to help me grab the same part of the rail every time.

[CrowCommand]

+1 on UTG being junk. Stick with a magnifier that has been vetted a la Aimpoint or EOTech, or better yet, find one at a LGS and try it in person first. All of this if you are utilizing the rifle for serious use.

I'll +1 the hand/fingerstop as well....At the recommendation of RoberttheTexan, I believe, I have a Naroh Arms one in M-Lok that is very nicely machined and comfortable.

[ghosttwofive]

Yes sir, basically I'm resting the rail in my palm, that's exactly right, sorry I wasn't clear on that.

https://www.larue.com/products/larue-quad-rail-handguard/

That's my rail sir, the 10-inch option.

Thank you for the options on the light. I should have come here earlier, I'm getting some really good info on tac lights. Thanks a bunch.

I've never even considered a finger stop to be honest, I've never known anyone who used them. That one looks very ergonomic. I'm going to have to do something, holding the rail in my palm is going to get warm, the heavier barrel in my SOCOM handles heat very well but usually when I shoot, I shoot a bunch of rounds so it does get a little warm.

Thanks for the info. I've rectified the Eotech issue, half way anyway, the feedback I'm getting here seems to suggest I would be better suited buying a Eotech magnifier also. There will be no trading it off this time. Back when I did have the HHS II combo, it was sighted in at 50 yards and as far as anything up to and including 50 yards the sight system was completely dialed in. I really don't know what my mindset was back then that would have let me rationalize trading in a $1000+ optics system on the best rifle I've ever had. I guess the divorce at the time may have clouded my judgement a bit. Anywho, I'm hearing that the Sig Sauer Juliet 4x magnifier doesn't have very good glass so I'm leaning toward the Eotech G33 to keep my optics all Eotech at this time. It'll be a few weeks before I get my funds together but everyone's input here has been invaluable.

Thank you. I'm starting to agree that I need to get the G33 magnifier to go with my EXPS2-0. Do you mind if I ask what kind of hand stop you use? I'm trying to get a consensus on which models work for people and buy accordingly. Thank you sir.

[Diamondback]

Welcome to the party! If it helps, remember that everyone here started the same way as you did somewhere or another, and we all put our pants on the same way one leg at a time. :)

"Give it a chance, you'll get used to it... or have a psychotic episode."
--Agent Zed, MIB

:)

[ghosttwofive]

My use on the rifle is limited usually to 50 yards or less. My vision is not very good which is why I like the Eotech sight. I do like a light on my rifle, never used a laser, but the tac light is something I'm definitely going to invest in, just trying to find the right set up vs. budget.

LOL, thank you sir. I've been reading posts here for a long time, but there is SO much experience on the forum although I've been shooting all my life and I consider myself familiar with the M4 rifle, I'm usually humbled pretty damn quickly when I come here...lol.

[LowSpeed_HighDrag]

Don't be afraid to ask questions here, just read alot and learn what you can from the already established information. We all started off clueless, especially me. Look at any member's first threads and posts and you'll see lots of woeful ignorance...

Here's my first thread ten years ago. Boy, I have learned a ton here and made lots of mistakes along the way.
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?65123-A-few-Q-s-before-I-buy&highlight=

[Tx_Aggie]

Props for asking questions and being sincerely interested what other members have to offer.

As for a weaponlight, I agree that it's probably best to avoid anything UTG for anything other than a range toy. If you'd like a rail mounted light but don't want to or can't afford to spring for something like a Surefire, Streamlight has a series of rail mounted lights that both durable and a great value. I've had a couple for a few years now and have been very happy with them.

https://www.streamlight.com/en/products/detail/index/protac-rail-mount-2

https://www.streamlight.com/en/products/detail/index/protac-rail-mount-hl-x

[ghosttwofive]

There's a bunch of very helpful members on this forum, much more so than on some others where I've gotten beaten up over just asking questions so I appreciate everyone's feedback.

Those Streamlight models keep coming up. I'll have to check into them, I've never used these kind of lights before, always had the Crimson Trace vertical grip with the build in tac light but it's not going to work for me anymore, thanks for the tip.

[Tx_Aggie]

Those Streamlight models keep coming up. I'll have to check into them, I've never used these kind of lights before, always had the Crimson Trace vertical grip with the build in tac light but it's not going to work for me anymore, thanks for the tip.

No problem. You won't regret buying one.

[CrowCommand]

Don't think it's been mentioned yet, but looking Arisaka lights as well. They are very well built Surefire clones. I have a 300 on my 11.5" pistol.

[Wake27]

No problem. You won't regret buying one.


Don't think it's been mentioned yet, but looking Arisaka lights as well. They are very well built Surefire clones. I have a 300 on my 11.5" pistol.

Agreed on the Arisaka. Not significantly cheaper than Surefire like Streamlight is, but I do regret purchasing the latter. My Arisaka M300 on the other hand, I’m pretty happy with.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[sdacbob]

Seriously, if you are just a casual shooter and not in the Military or Law Enforcement, do you really need a $500 G33 when you can get a cheap Chinese knock off for $50 off Ebay that will do the trick, albeit not with the same clarity.

[LowSpeed_HighDrag]

Seriously, if you are just a casual shooter and not in the Military or Law Enforcement, do you really need a $500 G33 when you can get a cheap Chinese knock off for $50 off Ebay that will do the trick, albeit not with the same clarity.

PArtS iS pARts

Why buy a Glock when you could just get a Hi Point?

[Boba Fett v2]

Seriously, if you are just a casual shooter and not in the Military or Law Enforcement, do you really need a $500 G33 when you can get a cheap Chinese knock off for $50 off Ebay that will do the trick, albeit not with the same clarity.Even casual shooters should invest in quality if they have the means. Why are we supporting Chicom knockoffs here?

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[ghosttwofive]

I've got it down to two choices. The Eotech G33 3x or the Sig Sauer Juliet 4x magnifier. I was able to get hands on a Juliet 3x at my local gun store yesterday and I was pleasantly surprised at how clear it was. Not sure it's as clear as the Eotech, but I've found the Sig Sauer 4x on a site for $325 after coupon. That's a pretty good deal. I'm just debating on whether I want my optics all Eotech or if I can handle an Eotech/Sig Sauer combo...lol

[titsonritz]

If you are most comfortable with your grip parallel to the bore, like a slick handguard, but you want something to help you pull the rifle into your shoulder, you can try a small fingerstop between your index and middle finger. Which Larue rail do you have?

I’d skip the UTG, and suggest an Arisaka Scout with one of their mounts, a Surefire tape switch and a Cloud Defensive LCS. I think Weapon Outfitters has a build-your-light tool to set this up. Also consider the Cloud Defensive OWL or Elzetta. Although, I do not recommend the Elzetta remote switch.

Sound setups. I also like the Modlite OKW with a Reptilia body, a Surefire DS-07 cap and a Cloud Defensive LCS.

[AO777]

+1 on the UTG = junk. I’d look into running a pressure pad as opposed to the light foregrip combo. Stream light Protac line is very affordable for the quality. I run steam lights on all my work guns with no issues. They’ve been submerged, dropped, etc.. you also can use the Arisaka adapter if you want the surefire pressure pad which is a bit more durable. Depending on what you decide to do for your grip a simple HSP Thorntail with a steam light/surefire light and tail cap would work well too. Can’t get much simpler than that unless you want to spend $350 for the Cloud OWL

As for your foregrip situation take a look at the following video. Seems like the operator has similar issue to you maybe it’ll be helpful.

https://youtu.be/Eo3gUbSh4mg

[Dr. Bullseye]

I changed all my forward grips out for Arisaka finger stops. I mount so index finger rests in front and thumb is in position to click a scout light. I’ve only used Mlok and Keymod so can’t say if picatinny version is as comfy. But it’s cheap enough. And if you don’t like it I’d buy it from you for my quad rail that needs one.

https://arisakadefense.com/products/finger-stop-picatinny

I did this too. I have bad shoulders and California mandated no vertical grips. The Arisaka finger stop fits between my little and ring fingers at the 6:00 position. It is great, light, unobtrusive and gives you that traction you may want. I mounted mine on a mil spec dual insulated handguard with a MOE to Mlock (or vice versa I forget) conversion nut.