View Full Version : The latest (and greatest) Mid East Peace Plan
Grand58742
01-28-20, 12:40
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/trump-middle-east-peace-plan-includes-two-state-solution-tunnel-to-connect-west-bank-and-gaza-strip
I put greatest in the title since obviously Trump will claim it's going to be the greatest. It is detailed.
Interesting concessions given up by Israel though. Full two-state system with potential land grants to Gaza and Palestine. A US embassy in East Jerusalem for the future Palestinian State. The tunnel thing from the West Bank to Gaza was curious.
Is this going to be yet another "bogged down in negotiations and never go anywhere" type of deal or is there a potential for progress since Israel has now conceded the separate Palestinian State they have longed for?
BoringGuy45
01-28-20, 12:52
Ultimately, the Palestinians aren't going to agree on anything except erasing the State of Israel from existence and the banishment of every last Jew from the Holy Land for always and ever. They agree at first to a two state solution, but they want the whole land. It'll go nowhere, however, unless they the get all of Jerusalem.
Dr. Bullseye
01-28-20, 12:58
Where is the aid for the USA? I don't want Trump spending five minutes worrying about Israel or any other shit-hole country over there. Cut all the aid, cut all the military aid, cut supplying Israel with oil, and just leave and get back to the business of the United States.
Where is the aid for the USA? I don't want Trump spending five minutes worrying about Israel or any other shit-hole country over there. Cut all the aid, cut all the military aid, cut supplying Israel with oil, and just leave and get back to the business of the United States.
That is unrealistic. If we cut bait in the area it would be open season on all things Israeli, ultimately ending with Israel turning something, somewhere into a glass parking lot.
I don't want Trump spending five minutes worrying about Israel or any other shit-hole country over there.
I am dumber for having read that.
Israel is far from a shithole.
titsonritz
01-28-20, 16:30
I would love for to Trump pull it off just to watch the weeping and gnashing of teeth out of the libtards, it would be glorious if by some miracle he could inject peace into the region, but the reality is...
Ultimately, the Palestinians aren't going to agree on anything except erasing the State of Israel from existence and the banishment of every last Jew from the Holy Land for always and ever. They agree at first to a two state solution, but they want the whole land. It'll go nowhere, however, unless they the get all of Jerusalem.
If Palestinians would lay down arms there would be peace, if Israel laid down arms they would be slaughtered. I just don't see how Trump or anyone in my lifetime can fix that.
Ultimately, the Palestinians aren't going to agree on anything except erasing the State of Israel from existence and the banishment of every last Jew from the Holy Land for always and ever. They agree at first to a two state solution, but they want the whole land. It'll go nowhere, however, unless they the get all of Jerusalem.
Yeah, this is DOA. It's not a bad compromise, but the Palestinians will never go for it; they're not geting 125% of what they want, which is required for them to even consider it.
That is unrealistic. If we cut bait in the area it would be open season on all things Israeli, ultimately ending with Israel turning something, somewhere into a glass parking lot.
Ok, and?
Folks in the ME need to get over themselves in earnest or this never ending conflict BS, that we in particular keep sinking blood and treasure into, will never resolve itself.
It’s gotten beyond tiresome.
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Yes of course Israel is a shit hole country, that it's citizens have done nothing. Other than have one of our citizens inventing the code that made the internet work proper and was the first person to die on 9-11, rolled out a 2 week cure for pancreatic cancer in the last week as well as a cure for type 2 diabetes, and figured out to heal damaged kidneys or maybe it was livers. Then we could talk about curing parkinsons, with weed and also some types of lung cancer.
Ok, and?
Folks in the ME need to get over themselves in earnest or this never ending conflict BS, that we in particular keep sinking blood and treasure into, will never resolve itself.
It’s gotten beyond tiresome.
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Agreed. You ought to live through it. But we have no partner for peace, and we have no ability to go Ghenghis Khan.
Sorry it has troubled you.
And the ComDems have accomplished what in the last 3 years? Other than disenfranchise, smear, berate and belittle 67 million Americans? And destroying our political institutions and trampling the Constitution?
Ok, and?
Folks in the ME need to get over themselves in earnest or this never ending conflict BS, that we in particular keep sinking blood and treasure into, will never resolve itself.
It’s gotten beyond tiresome.
I agree about the blood and treasure aspect, but the fact is that there is a high percentage of the population in the ME that just want to be left alone, and are pretty much innocent parties to the chaos.
This is more than Israel has ever agreed to, I hope there is some real arm twisting on going on behind the scenes to get the Palestinians on board.
If this gets done, it should be worth a Nobel.
When I was in the Army, I deployed twice to Israel - 3 months the first time then 6 months the second time. Great place and great people. Other than rockets coming in from the Golan Heights, in some ways it was like being in the US. Advanced, highly educated population, many with family ties to the U.S. One family I got to know via their IDF soldier has a copy of the US Bill of Rights, framed, and hanging on the wall. Of any foreign Nation, these people are the closest to Americans you'll ever meet.
morbidbattlecry
01-28-20, 19:45
Surely, this time it will work.
Never going to happen. The so called leadership of the palestinians is entirely dependent on being the "victims" of the Israelis. Remove that "victimhood" and they would have to stand or fall on their own merits. "Victimhood" makes them relevant, without it they become nothing
A long time ago, I believe it was Rabin (I may be wrong) that essentially gave into every demand that Arafat wanted. Rabin only wanted peace and recognition of Israel. Arafat refused. The victimhood mentioned above plays a part if you are on the lower scale. But for the leaders it would mean a loss of international money and takes away their leverage and power. Arafat embezzled millions to his own account. He lived like a king. (Full disclosure: I was acquainted for a time with a guy that was Arafat's personal driver/bodyguard)
Anyway, as long as Israel exists, there will never be peace. The Palestinians would rather live as they do than ever accept Israel. Culturally, they believe that they are God's chosen race as descendants of Abraham and the first born of Abraham (that gives us the modern Arab) has the greater claim than Isaac (that gives us the modern Jew). And yeah, they hold that belief dearly.
A long time ago, I believe it was Rabin (I may be wrong) that essentially gave into every demand that Arafat wanted.
Ehud Barak at Camp David with Clinton and the deviant Arafat.
Ehud Barak at Camp David with Clinton and the deviant Arafat.
I stand corrected. I knew the story wasn't sure of the Israeli PM.
What are the chances this is one last hoorah, and effort at diplomacy before we tell Bibi that he can annex everything, and unleash the IDF to clear out all the parasitic/psychotic leadership and other true believers, so there can actually be peace.
"We tried to play nice, we gave you one last chance, but you wouldn't listen.... We're done here, give Arafat our regards when you see him in hell"
I'm not sure why we've been tying their hands for so long.
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Israel would need a better leader than Bibi, to go all out with Bibi.
The Yoni peace plan would look something like this. Bearing in mind the best beaches are the beaches in the Gaza.
Israel tells the Saudis and the Emirates, you take over Gaza with our blessing and you get rid of the Palestinians. Then once you have cleaned the place up. We build together the worlds largest mens toy store.
5 star hotels, casinos, and ladies. When you tire of that we have F1 cars, we have Dakar type jeeps, sky diving, shooting.
Israel gets 10% off the top of the revenue.
Regarding Arabs in Judea and Samaria, miscalled by leftist the west bank, they have an option you can stay in Israel with a green card, or you can go join the population in Jordan which is 85% so called Palestinians any way. If you stay you must pay taxes, build any buildings only with permits issued by the government, we will build sewers for all the unchecked building that happen under Arab leadership. If any member of a family engages in violence against Jews the whole family id deported to Jordan.
The Saudis, Emaratis, and Jordanians all get Israeli protection against Iran.
Israel then ends financial aid we receive from the USA, we also will continue the policy of not selling weapons to countries the USA doesn't want us to on one condition. If the USA says don't sell type of equipment X to country Y, and when Israel abides, the USA can't then sell the same equipment to that country. But China, Russia are for sure off the table for deals with Israel.
Peace in the Middle East. Keep the Arab leadership happy, drunk, well sexed, they will forget the Palestinians in a heartbeat. For the dirty secret in the Middle East is Arabs hate Palestinians, more than they ever hated Jews.
I'm not sure your plan works Yoni. I'd love to see it, but they essentially had all you describe in Beirut and they let that go to crap.
You certainly have a deeper knowledge of the situation than I. I hope someone can find a workable plan.
I'm pretty cynical. I believe that if the Israelis announced tomorrow that they were going to pack their trash, police their butts, and GTFO, leaving the entire place to the palistinians; that the palistinians would STILL object and demand more.
sundance435
01-29-20, 11:25
I'm pretty cynical. I believe that if the Israelis announced tomorrow that they were going to pack their trash, police their butts, and GTFO, leaving the entire place to the palistinians; that the palistinians would STILL object and demand more.
Yeah, I believe they would. They would rather live in squalor, or at least their overlords (Hamas, PLO, etc.) would rather most of them live in squalor, than give ground (literal and figurative) on almost anything. As soon as I saw this plan maintained Israeli enclaves in the West Bank, I knew it was DOA with the PLO. Half-baked ideas like BDS (Boycott, Divest, Sanctions) have only emboldened them.
For Israel, I think this is practically as far as they're willing to go under the current administration - I don't know where the opposition in the Knesset stands on it.
sundance435
01-29-20, 11:25
Double tap.
I'm not sure your plan works Yoni. I'd love to see it, but they essentially had all you describe in Beirut and they let that go to crap.
You certainly have a deeper knowledge of the situation than I. I hope someone can find a workable plan.
.
What caused Beirut to go to crap?
The mass movement of Arafat and Palestinians into Lebanon, after they tried to over throw the King of Jordan in Sept 1970 .
Palestinians causing problems since they were invented, to Arab and Jews alike.
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/trump-middle-east-peace-plan-includes-two-state-solution-tunnel-to-connect-west-bank-and-gaza-strip
I put greatest in the title since obviously Trump will claim it's going to be the greatest. It is detailed.
Interesting concessions given up by Israel though. Full two-state system with potential land grants to Gaza and Palestine. A US embassy in East Jerusalem for the future Palestinian State. The tunnel thing from the West Bank to Gaza was curious.
Is this going to be yet another "bogged down in negotiations and never go anywhere" type of deal or is there a potential for progress since Israel has now conceded the separate Palestinian State they have longed for?
It's mostly reasonable, which is why it'll go nowhere. PLO leadership & HAMAS aren't interested in peace.
I wouldn't discount the possibility of Trump doing something unexpected to put pressure on the Palestinians.
Mexico laughed about paying for the wall, now they are Trump's wall #2 keeping caravans out of Mexico.
Non invasive method that defeats brain cancer developed in Israel now approved.
Evil Jews, don't they understand climate change and we have too many people in the world. Yet they keep figuring ways to cure people that would have died in earlier times.
Non invasive method that defeats brain cancer developed in Israel now approved.
Evil Jews, don't they understand climate change and we have too many people in the world. Yet they keep figuring ways to cure people that would have died in earlier times.
Link?
Adrenaline_6
01-31-20, 14:52
Link?
I think he's referring to Keytruda, which was developed here but tested in Israel. Although they did develop the new treatment for pancreatic cancer that looks promising. It's in pre-clinical trials.
No it isn't Keytruda, I deleted the link when clearing out my weekly book marks I will look for it after the Jewish sabbath. It was a hat kind of thing that killed the tumor with electronic waves.
Found it.
https://www.ynetnews.com/health_science/article/B1VRUZMb8
Adrenaline_6
01-31-20, 19:19
No it isn't Keytruda, I deleted the link when clearing out my weekly book marks I will look for it after the Jewish sabbath. It was a hat kind of thing that killed the tumor with electronic waves.
Found it.
https://www.ynetnews.com/health_science/article/B1VRUZMb8
Interesting.
I am dumber for having read that.
Israel is far from a shithole.
And we are all saved from double digit IQs for this reality check. Well played.
"When I am weaker than you, I ask for freedom, because that is according to your principles; when I am stronger than you, I take away your freedom, because that is according to my principles."
-Dune, Frank Herbert.
The Israeli-Palestinian issue (among other issues) reminds me of this quote. There probably isn't going to be any peace, but faith springs eternal.
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