View Full Version : Steiner P4xI/Vortex Viper pst 1-6 - defensive grade?
Hey, new to the forum here. As a civilian, I’m interested in either of these optics for a SHTF, heavy duty/do-all rifle (BCM recce 16 is the rifle it’s going on). I’m gonna get a larue mount for it. Are these two optics up to par for a optic I can trust my life to? Thank you in advance.
Straight Shooter
04-04-20, 05:48
Ive owned the Steiner now a long time. Well reviewed, EXCELLENT optic. Its just superb. USA made to boot, no China bullshit. Those days are over for me.
I know nothing of the Vortex, but youll be happy with the Steiner I guarantee.
Here’s how I feel about the P4Xi:
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?219169-My-P4xi-journey&highlight=
I have not used it personally, but I would guess that the Steiner P4xi is possibly the best budget friendly practical LPVO you can buy.
They should be, but the price on the Steiner has been creeping up over the years to you should likely look for a Vortex Razor II 1-6 as well.
I have the PST 1-6x, currently on a SCAR 17 and it's doing fine - so I imagine it would hold up quite well to 'SHTF', however you define that. Eventually it'll likely get replaced by a Vortex III 1-10x on that rifle, but that'll be awhile.
Personally my 3 x duty grade rifles have an Aimpoint T2 (SBR), Nightforce NXS 2.5-10x24/RMR (semi-precision rifle), and Nightforce NX-8 (do all rifle). So you can take that for what it's worth.
OP, I’ve had a P4xi on my a BCM Recce 14 for 3 years and I think it is outstanding. It’s not the best at one thing anything, but it balances weight, cost, capability and durability really well.
Personally, I really like the reticle. The single illuminated dot is simple and it has a generous eye box. It’s easy to use without the illumination as well. I ran this set up in a Shrek McPhee class last year and I am just as quick with it at 1x as I am with my aimpoint, although I do a fare amount of practice with it (dry fire and range).
For reference my 2 other guns have a Aimpoint H2 (SBR) and my NF NX8 1-8 (GP DMR). I have previously owned a Razor 1-6, but don’t have any experience with the Viper 1-6. While the Razor has some fantastic glass, the optic’s weight threw the balance of the rifle off for me. I run the P4xi in Geissele 2.04 mount on my Recce 14 and the balance is just right.
I don’t think you’d go wrong with either, but from my experience I’d recommend the P4xi 100%.
titsonritz
04-04-20, 17:13
Here’s how I feel about the P4Xi:
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?219169-My-P4xi-journey&highlight=
Great write up BTW.
titsonritz
04-04-20, 17:15
Well reviewed, EXCELLENT optic. Its just superb. USA made to boot, no China bullshit. Those days are over for me.
This is where I stand on the subject.
Ive owned the Steiner now a long time. Well reviewed, EXCELLENT optic. Its just superb. USA made to boot, no China bullshit. Those days are over for me.
I know nothing of the Vortex, but youll be happy with the Steiner I guarantee.
Could I ask how hard you ran this optic? Just looking to see whether it would hold up to harsh conditions that I intend to put it through.
Straight Shooter
04-05-20, 09:52
Could I ask how hard you ran this optic? Just looking to see whether it would hold up to harsh conditions that I intend to put it through.
Many thousands of rounds. If I recall correctly- it is meant to be sighted in at 200 yards, then the hash marks line up out to 400. But, Ive got mine sighted in dead on at 50, and shot 200 dead on, and can hold a tad high for 300.
About the only complaint Ive heard/read is with "mushy" click adjustments, but mine are fine, but this aint a long range scope, Ive got mine dialed in, and unless I change ammo, wont be adjusting any further.
Its been bumped around & jarred some, but Im no recon ranger or anything, but itll take whatever I dish out. I love the thing, and am blessed to have bought it when they were CHEAP for what they are-got mine from DSG with a USA American Defense QD mount for well under$500.
They seem to have increased dramatically late last year, Ive seen the scope alone at a couple place for $900! And several have it at $800.
Is it worth that? YOU gotta get behind one and decide.
But, as for me & MY house- WE AINT BUYING NO MORE FVCKIN CHINA OPTICS_EVER.
UPDATE: I gave $589 for scope/mount back in March of 2017...scope itself was about $469, fyi.
Here is a sample of the hashmark/BDC values for the P4xi with a 200 yard zero and a generic 5.56 muzzle velocity of 2700 fps from iSterlok:
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200405/90e519e06ceeb378da9592ca3c5ee0ed.png
With your 16” gun and a velocity of 3100 fps here is what it would look like:
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200405/c5f083860afb76c0e37f42295c171cc2.png
The hashmarks are the width of a man (18”) at 300, 400, 500 & 600 yards.
Korgs130 thanks for the info, looks like it matches up pretty good with 77 grain ammo.
They seem to have increased dramatically late last year, Ive seen the scope alone at a couple place for $900! And several have it at $800.
Snip
UPDATE: I gave $589 for scope/mount back in March of 2017...scope itself was about $469, fyi.
At $450-550 I was very interested... planned to put one on a 308 gas gun I was building. (Now built)
They've gone up quite a bit, so I'm on hold now just using a Eotech for fun and break-in / testing.
The new norm seems to be $800 scope only. Quite a dramatic increase.
I’ve been on the fence about buying one of these for a couple of years now. I just checked and the price has gone up $200. What gives?
Great write up BTW. thank you.
Here is a sample of the hashmark/BDC values for the P4xi with a 200 yard zero and a generic 5.56 muzzle velocity of 2700 fps from iSterlok:
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200405/90e519e06ceeb378da9592ca3c5ee0ed.png
With your 16” gun and a velocity of 3100 fps here is what it would look like:
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200405/c5f083860afb76c0e37f42295c171cc2.png
The hashmarks are the width of a man (18”) at 300, 400, 500 & 600 yards.
Yup. Strelok is your friend.
Has anyone use Eurooptic.com? I just ordered a “like new demo” P4Xi from them.
Has anyone use Eurooptic.com? I just ordered a “like new demo” P4Xi from them.
No, but I’ve seen positive things so should be GTG.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
No, but I’ve seen positive things so should be GTG.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Good to hear. Thanks.
Has anyone use Eurooptic.com? I just ordered a “like new demo” P4Xi from them.
They are legit, ordered a couple of NightForce and Trijicon things from them over the years; zero issues.
They are legit, ordered a couple of NightForce and Trijicon things from them over the years; zero issues.
And for the record, the PST Gen 2 1-6x24 is made in the Vortex Factory in the P.I., not China - that's their Strike Eagle line.
Just posted in “what did you do today to prepare for the end of the world”- or whatever.
Pertains to Steiner...
“Checked zero on a truck gun (rides in security vault) for first time in 2 years. Felt it was prudent.
Held zero, no issues. <1.5”/5 rds benched. More than adequate for purpose.
BCM 14.5” P/W, ADM QD Mount, Steiner 1-4x, 64 gr. G.D.
This speaks well for the parts.“
I was pleasantly surprised.
Although the carbine rides in a “cradle” in vault, it is banged around badly on section roads and off road at the ranch.
Straight Shooter
04-05-20, 18:02
Just posted in “what did you do today to prepare for the end of the world”- or whatever.
Pertains to Steiner...
“Checked zero on a truck gun (rides in security vault) for first time in 2 years. Felt it was prudent.
Held zero, no issues. <1.5”/5 rds benched. More than adequate for purpose.
BCM 14.5” P/W, ADM QD Mount, Steiner 1-4x, 64 gr. G.D.
This speaks well for the parts.“
I was pleasantly surprised.
Although the carbine rides in a “cradle” in vault, it is banged around badly on section roads and off road at the ranch.
I have about 120 rounds of 64gr. GD...and run the Steiner PXi 1x4.
How do you have yours sighted in, if I may ask?
Using a 200 yd zero.
It’s “on” at 300 yd, few inches low at 400. I hold neckline at 400 using the 400 hash mark.
Haven’t tried 500, but it’ll be substantially low from experience and according to Strelok.
61584
Straight Shooter
04-05-20, 23:21
Using a 200 yd zero.
It’s “on” at 300 yd, few inches low at 400. I hold neckline at 400 using the 400 hash mark.
Haven’t tried 500, but it’ll be substantially low from experience and according to Strelok.
61584
I appreciate that my friend, thank you!
Has anyone use Eurooptic.com? I just ordered a “like new demo” P4Xi from them.
I’ve had the same experience as Rhino. I definitely recommend them.
I appreciate that my friend, thank you!
Access to a 200+ yd range being a luxury for a lot of us, my Ballistic program gives me this for a 200 yd Zero; (it proved out in the field)
50 yd.= + .33"
100 yd.= +1.80
200 = 0.00
LowSpeed_HighDrag
04-06-20, 07:09
Just months ago, the P4Xi was nearly $200 less. They seem to be pricing themselves out of the category they dominated: cost vs benefit. The P4Xi is not a $700 optic, and one would do much better to go with a Viper for the cost vs benefit optic choice.
Straight Shooter
04-06-20, 21:20
Access to a 200+ yd range being a luxury for a lot of us, my Ballistic program gives me this for a 200 yd Zero; (it proved out in the field)
50 yd.= + .33"
100 yd.= +1.80
200 = 0.00
Useful info-again..thank you sir!
Just months ago, the P4Xi was nearly $200 less. They seem to be pricing themselves out of the category they dominated: cost vs benefit. The P4Xi is not a $700 optic, and one would do much better to go with a Viper for the cost vs benefit optic choice.
I noticed the price increase too. Thanks for the perspective, that’ll definitely influence my decision.
joedirt199
04-06-20, 21:50
Wish the steiner had notches for the reddot. It just turns with no feel for the on/off positions. Ran it in a run and gun and while running slung on the back the, the knob turned just from rubbing. Vortex is very stiff with notches for the postions. No way that thing is coming on by accident. Love them both so no real wrong answer. Watch the used sections for steiners and pst 2's as people will be upgrading with some of the new scopes coming out.
I've bought from Eurooptic several times with no issues. Like others, I like the dot, weight, and glass of the Steiner.
Thanks. I got a demo model for $599. I have quality AR’s and quality red dots, but only cheaper LPVO’s. I have developed an astigmatism. I can still use my Aimpoints effectively, but I would like to have something with an etched reticle for my go to rifle so I won’t be dependent on a battery. My P4Xi will be going in an AD QD mount that I already have.
joedirt199
04-08-20, 22:08
Will be able to attest to the durability of the steiner in a few days. Had the scope off to move some rear sights around and sight them in. Well it took a fall from the top of the safe and now the objective bell has a huge ass dent in it. Image is still round on 1x and illumination works so we will see how far off it is if the zero shifted. It's mounted in a bobro qd and is wearing a scope cap for an eye patch to hide my shame.
I just got my demo model in from Eurooptic.com. It looks brand new.
Glass looks fantastic. I’d like to find another demo model for sale.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200409/63a0c67b64a2caf86f05ee17df3a1568.plist
FWIW - I originally bought the P4Xi as my low-budget entry into LPVO's. I liked it so much that I ended up going back to it after trying a few higher-end scopes. It's not JUST a 1-4x. It's a superb 1-4x.
https://i.imgur.com/IKPDveE.jpg
FWIW - I originally bought the P4Xi as my low-budget entry into LPVO's. I liked it so much that I ended up going back to it after trying several higher-end scopes. It's not JUST a 1-4x. It's a superb 1-4x.
https://i.imgur.com/IKPDveE.jpg
What else did you try?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I tried -
NF NX-8 - awesome size/ weight, but the eye box was very unforgiving, and the reticle at 8x left a lot to be desired.
Vortex Razor 1-6 - awesome - but waaay too heavy. Completely upset the balance and feel of the rifle.
joedirt199
04-10-20, 16:46
Steiner took a black eye from falling 4' onto concrete. Re-zeroed today and it was only off a couple clicks up and left. Zeroed up and shooting small groups again.
Steiner took a black eye from falling 4' onto concrete. Re-zeroed today and it was only off a couple clicks up and left. Zeroed up and shooting small groups again.
That’s good to know. Few variables though; Could have moved in the mount? What type of mount? Mount moved from the upper receiver?
joedirt199
04-10-20, 19:48
Scope was in a bobro mount by itself and fell right on the objective from the top of the safe on concrete. I would say 4' up. Reciever is marked so I know what slot my scope was at before. After fall, sighted scope in then removed to sight the backup sights and replaced scope to verify again. Returned to zero after sighting and reinstallation.
I was in your place back in November. I choose the Vortex PST mainly because of the 4x vs 6x for the same price. I also went through EuroOptic to buy mine because they offer discounts to Black Rifle Coffee Co. club members on all Vortex products. I paid $509 shipped. The weight difference is only 5oz. between the two. LPVO's aren't the best option if you're looking for a lighter setup.
Edit: Forgot to mention that the Vortex customer service/warranty can't be beat based on what I've read. Thankfully, I haven't had to test that process.
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