View Full Version : The Q Cherry bomb and Plan B
I have a SiCo omega 30 cal can and I switched over to the plan b and the cherry bomb. Since I have done this, I have had nothing but problems with the cherry bomb getting stuck in the plan b, even after I put lube on the threads before shooting.
I am wondering if anyone else is experiencing or has with their Q set up?
Are you using rocksett on the barrel threads ? Are you using a high temp anti-seize on the cherry bomb’s threads and taper? What is your barrel’s diameter behind the muzzle threads?
IMHO, the Q Cherry bomb and Plan B combo really work the best, when paired with a barrel that has a matching taper behind the barrel threads, like Black River Tactical used to or may still offer.
Biggy,
Good questions. I am using Rocksett with my three barrels. DD 10.3, KAC 11.5 and Hodge defense 12.5.
I have been using Lucas gun oil on the threads and that worked some of the time. I used slip 2000 last night and now the can is stuck again.
Have you pinged Q?
If you get some nickel anti seize and lightly put it over the threads this issue will probably go away - https://amzn.to/3cap6p8
Not possible Q and the Cherry bomb are all that is good and holy when it comes to trendy firearms $hizzznit.
:p
themonk,
I contacted them and they were not much help. Said it shouldn't happen and to rocksett the muzzle break, which I did. I will try nickel anti seize or go to Dead Air Keymo
I think the anti seize will solve your problem and should be in every suppressor owners kit.
Apply it all over the threads and the taper and lightly wipe it off with a paper towel. That little bottle will last you forever.
I appreciate the help guys.
jackblack73
05-28-20, 14:25
themonk,
I contacted them and they were not much help. Said it shouldn't happen and to rocksett the muzzle break, which I did. I will try nickel anti seize or go to Dead Air Keymo
FWIW, I have an Omega with KeyMo and it will get stuck if I don't use an anti-seize as well.
Jackblack,
Thank you, that helps. Glad I am not the only one.
Some sort of Anti seize on suppressor mating surfaces is a must on any muzzle device.
With taper mount devices you just make sure it’s properly installed (torque and rocksett or loctite 271)
I wish Q used a qpq finish instead of the raw heat treat. It looks awesome but its more porous and carbon seems to stick more. I also wish they had wrench flats or something on the shoulder side so if the can gets stuck you can get it off.
Viper,
Thank you sir. Yes, it has gotten stuck in the suppressor and taken off of my barrel 3 times now. Not fun at all. Wrench flats would have helped alot.
How much torque is the suppressor being installed with?
It doesn't need to be cranked down; just snug.
Something is up here. Its not like Q is the first or only with threads and a taper. How are you prepping the threads on the barrel and brake? How are you fixing the barrel/upper and torquing the brake? How are you curing the Rocksett? How are you removing the can and with what tools? This thing should not be coming off by hand. I suspect your problem will be in the answer to one of the above questions.
How much torque is the suppressor being installed with?
It doesn't need to be cranked down; just snug.
Exactly. Just snug a little. My first experienced, I know I hand torqued it hard but learned from that and it still has gotten stuck.
Something is up here. Its not like Q is the first or only with threads and a taper. How are you prepping the threads on the barrel and brake? How are you fixing the barrel/upper and torquing the brake? How are you curing the Rocksett? How are you removing the can and with what tools? This thing should not be coming off by hand. I suspect your problem will be in the answer to one of the above questions.
1168,
Good questions.
I rocksett the cherry bomb on the barrel and let it sit for more than two days.
I torque the cherry bomb to 40 ftlbs
I hand tight it with using slip 2000 or lucas gun oil on the threads. Sometimes I successfully take it off with the hands after shooting and sometimes it gets stuck
When I use the tools, that's when my muzzle break comes off with it stuck in the suppressor.
I have the cherry bomb with their trash panda. I haven’t rockset it because I wasn’t sure if it was going to stay on the rifle or not. I probably should since it will stay on that rifle. The only thing i do is silver anti seize on the thread for the suppressor and never had an issue with the device coming off.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
But I thought Q and their stuff was the ANSWER...?
1168,
Good questions.
I rocksett the cherry bomb on the barrel and let it sit for more than two days.
I torque the cherry bomb to 40 ftlbs
I hand tight it with using slip 2000 or lucas gun oil on the threads. Sometimes I successfully take it off with the hands after shooting and sometimes it gets stuck
When I use the tools, that's when my muzzle break comes off with it stuck in the suppressor.
Is it completely ambient temp when you’re removing it?
It kinda sounds as if the oil is helping you crank the can on with more tension than you intend, and then when it cooks off, your can is stuck. Does that sound accurate?
Don't use oil on the threads or the taper. 1168 is correct, you will get a wet torque and the oil will cook off leaving you locked together.
I generally clean all threaded surfaces of the muzzle threads and the muzzle device with acetone or alcohol. Then add fresh rockset and torque to 20lb. Let sit at least 24 hours muzzle down. Then add anti seize to the threads and taper and remove excess (just takes a little). 99% of the time no problems.
Is it completely ambient temp when you’re removing it?
It kinda sounds as if the oil is helping you crank the can on with more tension than you intend, and then when it cooks off, your can is stuck. Does that sound accurate?
I would say that you are correct except when it does come off at times when I put lube. It is interesting. I will try the anti seize and go from there.
Is the barrel tapered or square shouldered? If it's square maybe consider having the barrel tapered for the Cherry Bomb, not a huge investment and if you move away from the cherry bomb in the future you can use an adapter ring to get a square shoulder again.
Had a barrel tapered by Class 3 Machining for $50, that included return shipping a few days later and my Cherry Bomb hasn't moved.
Is the barrel tapered or square shouldered? If it's square maybe consider having the barrel tapered for the Cherry Bomb, not a huge investment and if you move away from the cherry bomb in the future you can use an adapter ring to get a square shoulder again.
Had a barrel tapered by Class 3 Machining for $50, that included return shipping a few days later and my Cherry Bomb hasn't moved.
I have a DD, Hodge and KAC barrel I would have to do this with. Sounds scary lol
I have a DD, Hodge and KAC barrel I would have to do this with. Sounds scary lol
I did it with a 10.5 Noveske and I'm happy with the results.
https://i.imgur.com/nN2S4yK.png
https://i.imgur.com/XaHZpfa.png
https://i.imgur.com/pYtH5FW.jpg
I did it with a 10.5 Noveske and I'm happy with the results.
https://i.imgur.com/nN2S4yK.png
https://i.imgur.com/XaHZpfa.png
https://i.imgur.com/pYtH5FW.jpg
How would that help my situation?
How would that help my situation?
Adds surface area for the Cherry Bomb's internal taper geometry, they claim +/- 20% more force to remove than to install, so may help keep the Cherry Bomb from coming off with the suppressor.
I would say that you are correct except when it does come off at times when I put lube. It is interesting. I will try the anti seize and go from there.
Contrary to everyone else, I’d try it dry. Additionally, make sure you clean and prep the muzzle threads and internal brake threads prior to Rocksetting. That stuff should be pretty strong if prepped right.
I would like to expand on a point already made regarding weapon lube on suppressor threads/taper mounts. Lube isn't designed for the heat that develops in a suppressor. Add a bit of carbon from leakage/blowby at the threads and taper, and you get something approaching concrete. Running the mount dry makes removal much easier than if you have used gun oil.
I've found that high temp anti-seize works best. ALG go-juice is a close second. For whatever reason it doesn't turn to "concrete" on suppressor threads/tapers like other gun oils I have tried.
--JoshNC, Clint, Biggy: care to share your experience?
Try some anti-seize and report back for us.
We've only had Cherry Bombs get momentarily "stuck" in the mount while farting around with loose pieces that aren't even assembled.
No issues In normal use, other than difficulty removing the suppressor while hot.
This includes both square and tapered shouldered barrels where the CB was installed using torque only, no Rocksett.
We run the tapers and threads dry but clean and use only light hand torque to install the suppressors (50% full value).
I’ve only ever installed my Trash Panda on my cherry bomb totally dry and hand tight. It’s never been a problem.
But if Q was as perfect as Kevin B thinks he would have used LH threads on the cherry bomb to suppresser
But if Q was as perfect as Kevin B thinks he would have used LH threads on the cherry bomb to suppresser
And put the tapers behind the threads. I look at my high end Sata and Iwata spray gun fluid nozzles and they have the taper behind the thread in relation to the paint. I’ve also seen more issues with Q cans vs other brands kB trashes. But that’s Part of the NFA game, you can boast and claim anything you want and no one will call you out for it until tax stamps clear in 6 to 9 months.
And put the tapers behind the threads. I look at my high end Sata and Iwata spray gun fluid nozzles and they have the taper behind the thread in relation to the paint. I’ve also seen more issues with Q cans vs other brands kB trashes. But that’s Part of the NFA game, you can boast and claim anything you want and no one will call you out for it until tax stamps clear and 6 to 9 months.
No, you should never do this with a suppressor. Taper in front of the threads to keep carbon away from the threads.
No, you should never do this with a suppressor. Taper in front of the threads to keep carbon away from the threads.
I think there are valid arguments for both methods. YHM seems to agree with Q.
What is the benefit of that arrangement?
And put the tapers behind the threads.
In what way are these applications similar?
I look at my high end Sata and Iwata spray gun fluid nozzles and they have the taper behind the thread in relation to the paint.
Threads seal against the paint from entering the air cap and the tapers are for alignment. Fluid nozzles have to have perfect alignment for the needle or else your spray pattern will be off. Same principle with suppressor mounts, threads seal and the taper aligns and locks the can. When you put tapers first, especially with the cherry bomb, carbon fouling can cause the suppressor to stick as the cherry bomb and the Q cans create a 90° shoulder that carbon builds up and can cause it to stick.
Here’s a photo of one of my muzzle devices that has the taper behind the threads, look how clean the taper is even though it’s seen thousands of rounds. https://www.instagram.com/p/Btzq1yqHs7L/?igshid=xqu6c95sx772
Yea man, that's old tech and Knights will tell you the same thing. Any new QD mount should have the taper in front of the threads.
4k rounds:
https://i.imgur.com/GLtXYrQl.jpg
Yea man, that's old tech and Knights will tell you the same thing. Any new QD mount should have the taper in front of the threads.
4k rounds:
https://i.imgur.com/GLtXYrQl.jpg
That kinda proves my point. Look how dirty your tapers are which is critical as the taper provides the bore alignment.
Tapers align and seal; threads pull mating tapers together. Threads are not generally thought of as seals. Tapers don't take much mating force to lock up pretty tight. Anyone who's used a Bridgeport with an R8 collet knows you may have to smack the drawbar pretty hard to break the taper's seal.
And put the tapers behind the threads. I look at my high end Sata and Iwata spray gun fluid nozzles and they have the taper behind the thread in relation to the paint. I’ve also seen more issues with Q cans vs other brands kB trashes. But that’s Part of the NFA game, you can boast and claim anything you want and no one will call you out for it until tax stamps clear in 6 to 9 months.
I think the taper in front of the threads is one of the best things going for the cherry bomb.
I’m sure that if we took a poll, most would agree that the taper in front of the thread is better to avoid sticking the can. But, what about the OP? Has he gotten his Cherry Bomb to not stick yet?
I took a hest gun to my stuck can and I got it off last night. My anti seize came in yesterday as well soni will be putting it on my threads.
Two questions:
1. Do I need to clean off my cherry bomb before I apply anti seize?
2. Do I put anti seize in the plan b threads?
The thing to remember when using anti seize:
A little bit goes a LOOOONG way.
Anti-seize on the threads, or just the taper??
I took a hest gun to my stuck can and I got it off last night. My anti seize came in yesterday as well soni will be putting it on my threads.
Two questions:
1. Do I need to clean off my cherry bomb before I apply anti seize?
2. Do I put anti seize in the plan b threads?
Anti-seize on the threads, or just the taper??
https://www.liveqordie.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/Q-Manual-TrashPandaandThunderChicken-WEB.pdf
https://www.liveqordie.com/products/plan-b/
The installation instructions for the Trash Panda and the Plan B make no mention of grease or anti-seize, only Rocksett. You’ve tried it with stuff applied, and that did not work out; why not try it dry?
Anti-seize on the threads, or just the taper??
Both. I typically paint it on with a small brush and then lightly wipe it off. As Clint says, it goes a long way.
I have the opposite problem...
All of my Plan B suppressor mounts come loose from the muzzle device after getting them hot from either rapid fire, or longer strings of firing.
Rearden FHD / Rearden Atlas
Q Cherry Bomb / Q Bottle Rocket
Q Cherry Bomb / Q Saker
Q Cherry Bomb / Rearden Atlas
You get the idea...
I'd hand tighten the can with the Atlas onto the FHD/Cherry Bomb, after maybe 5-12 shots, I can feel it work loose. When it is piping hot, I can easily remove the can.
For what it's worth, I make a Plan B compatible flash hider that has wrench flats behind the mount so you can wrench on it if it were to seize up.
https://www.wolfpackarmory.com/product-page/plan-b-flash-hider
I have the opposite problem...
All of my Plan B suppressor mounts come loose from the muzzle device after getting them hot from either rapid fire, or longer strings of firing.
Rearden FHD / Rearden Atlas
Q Cherry Bomb / Q Bottle Rocket
Q Cherry Bomb / Q Saker
Q Cherry Bomb / Rearden Atlas
You get the idea...
I'd hand tighten the can with the Atlas onto the FHD/Cherry Bomb, after maybe 5-12 shots, I can feel it work loose. When it is piping hot, I can easily remove the can.
In my experience you need to treat the plan b the same way you would a direct thread. Screw the can on till it stops back it off a 1/4 turn and snap you hand around with a lot of torque. I have not had an issue since I learned that.
For what it's worth, I make a Plan B compatible flash hider that has wrench flats behind the mount so you can wrench on it if it were to seize up.
https://www.wolfpackarmory.com/product-page/plan-b-flash-hider
How does your offering compare to reardens?
In my experience you need to treat the plan b the same way you would a direct thread. Screw the can on till it stops back it off a 1/4 turn and snap you hand around with a lot of torque. I have not had an issue since I learned that.
Thank you! I will try that the next time.
How does your offering compare to reardens?
I actually bought the Night Howler (the WolfPack Plan B flash hider). It's like an A1 birdcage. Uses 3/4" wrench flats (smaller than Rearden's 13/16" flats).
For what it's worth, I make a Plan B compatible flash hider that has wrench flats behind the mount so you can wrench on it if it were to seize up.
https://www.wolfpackarmory.com/product-page/plan-b-flash-hider
I was looking at this just yesterday. Do you make a version that will take a 14.5 to 16?
One other question. For you guys who have devices locking up are you using the nitride or the raw finished versions? I thought I had read someplace that the non nitride versions were more susceptible to carbon lockup.
One other question. For you guys who have devices locking up are you using the nitride or the raw finished versions? I thought I had read someplace that the non nitride versions were more susceptible to carbon lockup.
I have both and it doesn't seem to matter. The first thing I do when I get a new muzzle device is put some anti-seize on the mating surface of the muzzle device and spin the can on and off. I originally had the same issue as metroplex but now with the snap method I have had it lock up a few times but I purchased a cheap wrench that I throw in my range bag and just twist it off at the plan b side if needed- https://amzn.to/3KgOPAa. I don't use the cherry bomb, only readon.
I was looking at this just yesterday. Do you make a version that will take a 14.5 to 16?
Unfortunately we do not. We started making these so that we could offer a silencer mount on a new project that were working on without paying out the ass. I started selling them as a stand alone product but don't currently have plans to offer a longer version. Maybe if we get a ton of request and nobody else makes one.
I have both and it doesn't seem to matter. The first thing I do when I get a new muzzle device is put some anti-seize on the mating surface of the muzzle device and spin the can on and off. I originally had the same issue as metroplex but now with the snap method I have had it lock up a few times but I purchased a cheap wrench that I throw in my range bag and just twist it off at the plan b side if needed- https://amzn.to/3KgOPAa. I don't use the cherry bomb, only readon.
Agree on the snap method and treating it like a direct thread. I believe they even have torque specs for attaching the can.
I have been direct threading my OCL Polonium now for a few months (its in jail and I get conjugal visits) until I could decide which attachment method I want to use. Put it on manually and they cinch it tight with a wrench. Interestingly enough the phosphate barrel never works loose. The stainless barrel does.
Unfortunately we do not. We started making these so that we could offer a silencer mount on a new project that were working on without paying out the ass. I started selling them as a stand alone product but don't currently have plans to offer a longer version. Maybe if we get a ton of request and nobody else makes one.
Gracias. The only one I can find so far is the Rearden. Not very many options for a 14.5. Or should I say ones that are of the standard A2 design. There are a few out there that look like they should be on the business end of a Transformer.
Gracias. The only one I can find so far is the Rearden. Not very many options for a 14.5. Or should I say ones that are of the standard A2 design. There are a few out there that look like they should be on the business end of a Transformer.
Liberty Precision Machine makes a couple. I have the readon R2C on one of my 14.5.
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