View Full Version : Centurion Arms midweight CHF barrels are back.
Centurion Arms has their midweight chf barrels back in stock on their site. FCD also has them listed at a slightly cheaper price. Trajectory Arms had them listed, but they're out of stock. Pics up on Trajectory's site for those that don't know what CA's midweight profile looks like.
https://www.centurionarms.com/hammer-forged-barrel-midlength-p/hfb-mw-ml.htm
https://www.forwardcontrolsdesign.com/Centurion-Arms-mid-weight-hammer-forged-barrel-midlength-gas-system_p_258.html
https://www.trajectoryarms.com/product/centurion-cold-hammer-forged-lightweight-5-56-barrel/
Leonidas24
06-10-20, 22:19
Trajectory Arms' website doesn't appear to be working at the moment...
Trajectory Arms' website doesn't appear to be working at the moment...
Works for me. It's just really slow in loading.
I’ve heard it’s mentioned that their barrels have progressive rifling. Any insight to this and exactly what it means? An increasing twist?
I’ve heard it’s mentioned that their barrels have progressive rifling. Any insight to this and exactly what it means? An increasing twist?
From the Centurion website:
"Our barrels have a slight taper to the bore during the hammer forging process to ensure better accuracy."
So I guess that’s progressive depth of the rifling? Interesting, they used to cut rifle muskets like that in the 1800’s
Coal Dragger
06-11-20, 23:22
I’ve heard it’s mentioned that their barrels have progressive rifling. Any insight to this and exactly what it means? An increasing twist?
Tapered bore, which hammer forging can accomplish due to mandrel taper. Gain or progressive twist is not possible on a hammer forging machine, and is a cut rifling proposition only.
Tapered bore, which hammer forging can accomplish due to mandrel taper. Gain or progressive twist is not possible on a hammer forging machine, and is a cut rifling proposition only.
The tapered bore is a function of the CH Forging process; ie, removal of the mandrel.
A quote from Monty posted on another forum.
I was given a link so I figured I’d come over and respond.
Looks like you guys pretty much have the concept. The bore gets slightly smaller as it moves to the muzzle end of the barrel.
I did not come up with the concept and it is not new. So why have you not seen taper bores in the AR platform before?? Probably because using hammer forged barrels is a fairly new thing in the AR rifles. Taper bore is something that is only realistically done by the hammer forging process. The mandrel that is used to put the rifling in the barrel is slightly tapered and this leave the tapered dimension in the barrels as the forging machine beats the blank around the mandrel.
So what does it offer you? Taper bore gives you a slight boost in velocity over a non-taper bore barrel and it help negate any potential accuracy issues caused by chroming the bore since it is not always a consistent thickness.
Taper bore does not extend the life of the barrel our barrels last longer because they are hammer forged and made from a different spec material that was engineered for machine guns. Hammer forging work hardens the material and the chrome is thicker than a normal barrel. The barrel steel is the same used on the MAG58, 240, M249, MK46, and MK48 machine guns it is also the same barrel material and process used on the 1/2moa sniper rifles FN won the FBI contract with and that are still in service. The FN SPR sniper rifles use hammer forged hard chrome lined taper bore barrels to get ½ moa accuracy and this is the same barrel specs and processes I have done to my barrels.
So who else uses this?
Obviously FN, who has the time, money, and resources to do the research to find this type of barrel steel and proof out this type of process and specs. FN hands down manufactures the best machine guns in the world and there isn’t even a close second in this field there isn’t even any two companies you can combine that has as much institutional knowledge as they do in making beltfed machine guns.
HK also taper bores their hammer forged barrels for all their rifles.
So why do I use it?
Well I didn’t really think much about hammer forging and taper bore before I was sent to work doing combat systems development and operational testing for SOCOM. There I worked on several weapons programs one that used these barrels on one of the rifles we were testing. I got to observes millions of dollars worth of R&D and testing that was done and got to see hundreds of thousands of rounds run through these weapons and got to see firsthand that these barrels did indeed last allot longer and on a whole shoot better than standard button rifled barrels that were chrome lined. The difference was significant and I wondered why the hell no one made these barrels for the M4/AR rifles so I figured I would bring them to market myself. I have over 20 years of service and have shot out plenty of M4’s in my time and can with full confidence say this is a improvement I’ve seen it first hand.
Thanks
Monty
Makes me wonder how anyone in their right mind would pay $250 for a nitrided Black River Tactical barrel when they could have a hammer forged and chrome lined barrel from Centurion for $11 more.
everready73
06-13-20, 21:32
Makes me wonder how anyone in their right mind would pay $250 for a nitrided Black River Tactical barrel when they could have a hammer forged and chrome lined barrel from Centurion for $11 more.
I think it would depend on application. BRT is quality stuff
I think it would depend on application. BRT is quality stuffBRT is quality stuff, completely agreed. However, in what application do you envision a nitrided AR barrel being superior to this hammer forged, chrome lined one, especially this particular Centurion barrel that likely excels in accuracy and longevity? Honest question.
everready73
06-13-20, 21:44
BRT is quality stuff, completely agreed. However, in what application do you envision a nitrided AR barrel being superior to this hammer forged, chrome lined one, especially this particular Centurion barrel that likely excels in accuracy and longevity? Honest question.
They offer their gas system and different sized ports etc.. for a suppressed only gun I would likely go with them over centurion. I would also consider brt over them for a more precision based build. I think a little more accuracy potential. That being said centurion's recce would be an even better option but it is around $400.
I love Centurion and for a hard use gun would pick them all day, but quality options are good.
Several here have posted some impressive results with the BRT barrels in the ongoing thread
I do like the has port options they offer, but that's easily fixed on another barrel with one of their gas block inserts or gas tubes. Either way, I don't see a nitrided AR barrel being worth $250. Especially compared to this awesome Centurion option for essentially the same price. The BRT barrel is definitely overpriced IMO.
If one has to use a gas volume reducer from BRT to correct gas port sizing, then any price comparison between barrels would have to consider the additional $50 cost to purchase the item to get what you really wanted anyway.
They are different products. I’ll hazard a guess that BRT does a lower volume than Centurion, so any pricing has to be higher to be viable.
This is an unnecessary comparison. I like and have purchased directly from both companies. And will do so again.
What I’m really curious about is any relationship between BRT’s and Geissele’s over-midlength gas systems on 16” carbines.
Makes me wonder how anyone in their right mind would pay $250 for a nitrided Black River Tactical barrel when they could have a hammer forged and chrome lined barrel from Centurion for $11 more.
Amen!
Too bad there aren’t any 16” in stock.
Is this Centurion barrel made by FN? How's it compare to the Noveske FN barrels?
Makes me wonder how anyone in their right mind would pay $250 for a nitrided Black River Tactical barrel when they could have a hammer forged and chrome lined barrel from Centurion for $11 more.
Centurion has good quality barrels, but BRT offers features that, to me, are more important than CHF and chrome lining.
Centurion has good quality barrels, but BRT offers features that, to me, are more important than CHF and chrome lining.They do offer nice features. But the price/performance doesn't make sense to me.
doesn't make sense to me.
Nothing against you, but this summarized the comparison.
jared-stark
06-16-20, 11:37
Trajectory Arms' website doesn't appear to be working at the moment...
I apologize for that inconvenience! I am the website guy for TA and we were having some hosting issues, so the few days around the time this thread started I was in the process of moving us over to new hosting. Its working great now!
Hammer_Man
06-16-20, 12:41
I apologize for that inconvenience! I am the website guy for TA and we were having some hosting issues, so the few days around the time this thread started I was in the process of moving us over to new hosting. Its working great now!
On an unrelated tangent, do you guys have a store front? I notice you're down in Springville.
jared-stark
06-16-20, 12:56
On an unrelated tangent, do you guys have a store front? I notice you're down in Springville.
We are currently a basement operation, hoping to move into a commercial space soon. Feel free to give Alex a call though (435-401-4070) , and he can help you out!
What are the gas ports on these? It would make a great surprise or host barrel, but notnif its over gassed like other centurion barrels.
My 16” mid centurion is way over gassed at .80
crosseyedshooter
06-24-20, 11:27
Does anyone happen to know if these lightweight barrels also have the keyhole to align with the Centurion Arms keyed gas block? Their stainless barrels have the key and their pinned gas block is a feature that separates them from their competitors.
Does anyone happen to know if these lightweight barrels also have the keyhole to align with the Centurion Arms keyed gas block? Their stainless barrels have the key and their pinned gas block is a feature that separates them from their competitors.
Email them, Corrie replied within like 15 mins when I emailed them.
Just based on product photos, the shorter carbine gas barrels have the index for their keyed gas blocks. The mid length barrels might not, or the product photos are from their older barrels without the index.
vicious_cb
06-24-20, 13:32
Gas port is .075"
On both 14.5" and 16"? What happened, was it for suppressor optimization? These are Hodge barrel gas port sizes as stated above the old Centurion mids were all running .080" ports
On both 14.5" and 16"? What happened, was it for suppressor optimization? These are Hodge barrel gas port sizes as stated above the old Centurion mids were all running .080" ports
I only asked about the 14.5". I believe I read the .080" barrels where from a contract for 12.5" mid barrels that were cut down from 16".
Does anyone happen to know if these lightweight barrels also have the keyhole to align with the Centurion Arms keyed gas block? Their stainless barrels have the key and their pinned gas block is a feature that separates them from their competitors.
The 12.5" mid weight mid length barrel that I received about two weeks ago does have the keyed gas block. I ordered it with the pinned gas block option, so it is pinned and does not have set screws, because the key is used to center the block on the barrel.
I’m anxious to see how the socom’s perform.
Leonidas24
07-02-20, 23:16
On both 14.5" and 16"? What happened, was it for suppressor optimization? These are Hodge barrel gas port sizes as stated above the old Centurion mids were all running .080" ports
The new run of 16" and 14.5" mid length gassed barrels have been changed to .075. The 14.5" carbine SOCOM profile barrels are ported at .062.
Makes me wonder how anyone in their right mind would pay $250 for a nitrided Black River Tactical barrel when they could have a hammer forged and chrome lined barrel from Centurion for $11 more.
There are many barrel makers in that price range, it strikes me as oddly specific that you make the comparison between BRT and Centurion.
I don't really have a dog in this fight - I have 1 BRT barrel installed and my 18" 5.56 would have a Centurion barrel if Rainier didn't clearance their HF/CL Mountain barrels out for $150.
Andy
There are many barrel makers in that price range, it strikes me as oddly specific that you make the comparison between BRT and Centurion.
I don't really have a dog in this fight - I have 1 BRT barrel installed and my 18" 5.56 would have a Centurion barrel if Rainier didn't clearance their HF/CL Mountain barrels out for $150.
Andy
The Rainier Mountain Series barrels are made by Either Criterion or FN, not Centurion.
Makes me wonder how anyone in their right mind would pay $250 for a nitrided Black River Tactical barrel when they could have a hammer forged and chrome lined barrel from Centurion for $11 more.
Please show me the data providing evidence that chrome lined is superior to nitrided.
Please show me the data providing evidence that hammer forged is superior to button rifled.
Please show me the data providing evidence that chrome lined is superior to nitrided.
Please show me the data providing evidence that hammer forged is superior to button rifled.I don't have to show you squat. Buy what you want.
I don't have to show you squat. Buy what you want.
Thanks for contributing nothing other than parroting BS you read on the internet.
Thanks for contributing nothing other than parroting BS you read on the internet.Well, if that was all I did, it was still more than you contributed.
Chris17404
07-07-20, 13:02
The new run of 16" and 14.5" mid length gassed barrels have been changed to .075. The 14.5" carbine SOCOM profile barrels are ported at .062.
Yes, this is what Corrie related to me as well. When they switched to a new barrel maker (no longer FN) for this latest run, they transitioned to a .075 gas port.
I wonder who the new maker is. The last 2 orders I placed were due to the well known fact that they used FN as a supplier for their Chrome Lined barrels.
Same for me. I'm curious who their new supplier is, but I'm confident in Centurion's standards and QC.
Maybe Monte or Corrie will chime in.
Leonidas24
07-08-20, 16:00
Yes, this is what Corrie related to me as well. When they switched to a new barrel maker (no longer FN) for this latest run, they transitioned to a .075 gas port.
On the Centurion FB forum I mentioned that Corrie has to be thankful for that, what with the number of emails I'm sure she answers on a weekly basis.
Would have been nice for them to disclose that they are using a new maker. Their description on the website still describes the FN barrels. It could influence purchase decisions and is a little misleading unless the new maker is tapering the bores, using the same barrel steel, and double chrome lining.
Would have been nice for them to disclose that they are using a new maker. Their description on the website still describes the FN barrels. It could influence purchase decisions and is a little misleading unless the new maker is tapering the bores, using the same barrel steel, and double chrome lining.
Why even care? If you want an FN barrel, but from FN.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Why even care? If you want an FN barrel, but from FN.
I bought from Centurion due to the fact that they are a forum vendor that was selling FN barrels. Why even care?
I bought from Centurion due to the fact that they are a forum vendor that was selling FN barrels. Why even care?
PSA sells “FN barrels”...
PSA sells “FN barrels”...
Be funny....so does Noveske and Hodge.
We all know that FN builds to customer specs. Comparing Centurion to PSA is laughable.
Be funny....so does Noveske and Hodge.
We all know that FN builds to customer specs. Comparing Centurion to PSA is laughable.
Why does it matter where Centurion has their barrels made if the quality remains the same or is improved? Corrie, Monty and team know what they are doing and would never sacrifice their name or reputation.
Why does it matter where Centurion has their barrels made if the quality remains the same or is improved? Corrie, Monty and team know what they are doing and would never sacrifice their name or reputation.
I think guys are making this a bigger deal than it is. It would've been nice to know that they switched barrel manufacturers as a discerning buyer, but I'm more than willing to give Centurion the benefit of the doubt considering their reputation. That's also the impression I got from the other posters wanting to know who the new supplier is.
Monty has stated on several forums and interviews that FN offers advantages over other makers due to materials and processes that are exclusive to FN. These advantages are, in his own words, the reason he used FN and what made them the best. Until now, you knew what you were getting when you ordered from him. What are you getting now? Is the product equal, greater, or less than what was previously sold. Myself and several others have purchased a product of unknown quality and origin. That’s why it bothers me.
If You purchased a Nightforce or Razor HD 2/3 and later found out production had been moved from LOW in Japan to another manufacturer would you feel you’d ordered the same product even though it carried the same name?
I purchased one of the barrels in question and it arrived today. They are marked as follows “CHF/CL/LW 1-7 5.56 NATO CENTURION ARMS.” No other markings to speak of except an S and 4 on either side of the barrel extension. I do not have the opportunity to currently post pictures.
For those that are concerned and have purchased a barrel, have you attempted to reach out to Centurion? They have responded in a timely fashion to my emails this week.
For those that are concerned and have purchased a barrel, have you attempted to reach out to Centurion? They have responded in a timely fashion to my emails this week.
Yes. I sent an email on the 7th and got an auto response stating they were out of the office and shipping could be belayed until the 10th. One of my orders have already shipped despite the message warning of delayed shipping. If they respond, I’ll be sure to share what they say.
Monty has stated on several forums and interviews that FN offers advantages over other makers due to materials and processes that are exclusive to FN. These advantages are, in his own words, the reason he used FN and what made them the best. Until now, you knew what you were getting when you ordered from him. What are you getting now? Is the product equal, greater, or less than what was previously sold. Myself and several others have purchased a product of unknown quality and origin. That’s why it bothers me.
If You purchased a Nightforce or Razor HD 2/3 and later found out production had been moved from LOW in Japan to another manufacturer would you feel you’d ordered the same product even though it carried the same name?
I have both a Razor 1-6 and 1-10. Idgaf the actual factory that made it because it really doesn’t matter.
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I don't see these available anywhere. Anyone know where I can still get one?
I have both a Razor 1-6 and 1-10. Idgaf the actual factory that made it because it really doesn’t matter.
This right here ^
I made a big deal over nothing it seems.
Corrie’s response to my email stated that all specs were the same except the smaller gas ports across the board. She also stated that they haven’t sourced from FN for many years.
jackblack73
07-10-20, 12:46
This is a good example of why some manufacturers don't list their sources. Why give yourself the burden of having to answer questions every time a supplier is changed. Of course, if they were advertising a particular supplier and using it as a selling point, they need to provide what they advertised.
I made a big deal over nothing it seems.
Yeah, we know.
titsonritz
07-13-20, 02:05
Yeah, we know.
:sarcastic:
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