View Full Version : Cashless Society
Cash transactions are private transactions, and privacy is a civil right. Going cashless means that information for everything you buy electronically likely gets stored on an NSA server in Utah for later use.
I’ve seen a few businesses in my area post signs that they only take a card payment due to COVID because cash is filthy, and/or I’ve seen some places claim that there’s a nation-wide shortage of coins, so they only take card.
This is a serious concern to me, and a precursor to a larger crackdown on our liberty. The mechanism to track buying habits must be in place first, before outlawing a wide range of common use items tomorrow. I don’t like where society is headed. This is a crisis that statists and traitors are not only “never letting go to waste”, but they are charging straight toward the end zone unopposed.
Cash is a two party transaction. No one else needs to know, be involved, or approve. Electronic transactions are at least 5 party transactions. You, your bank, the processor, his bank, him. Government, hackers, etc aside, any of those outside parties could (and many already do) chose to prohibit your transaction as a matter of "policy", let alone law. If cash goes away freedom will follow.
I have knowledge of countries that have switched to their own crypto type currency, and control of the population is always near the top of the list.
The idiots in Congress have passed laws that are supposed to stop money laundering but all it does is make life harder for American citizens doing business internationally. Also not 1 dime less has been laundered due to the stupid laws.
But rest assured even in a cashless society, we have ways to hide transactions.
vicious_cb
07-12-20, 21:54
Wait till people start getting banned from visa, mastercard, paypal ect for their political beliefs. Its already happened to some high profile people, its only a matter of time before they start targeting your average person to make them financially persona non grata.
As Yoni has said. There are ways. Barter system. Gold and silver coins. Art. It's all been / being done. Welcome to the underground economy boys.
Freedom concerns aside, please let this never happen.
I had a screaming deal going on 5 very desirable HK rifles but because my credit card was linked to my bank account the security features prevented the transaction even though my actual balance could have easily covered everything many times over.
Even worse it was out of state and on the weekend so I couldn't get an actual person on the phone with the authority to override the safety feature. But this did completely lock my account even though I asked them specifically not to. That made paying for gas and food on the way home especially interesting.
Monday by the time I got someone on the phone and explained what they did to me, all I got was a "We're very sorry but it was for your own protection." I switched banks that week but found out no matter where you go all banks now basically have the same stupid feature. So right now your money isn't even your money if your are out of your spending pattern.
Pretty sure even if I went to an ATM I would have had the same problem and a withdraw limit. Still really angry about this one more than 10 years later. If I had the foresight to carry $6,000 I would have been fine, but then I had to worry about walking around with 6 grand, you just can't win.
In normal life, I've had my wife call up to dispute a charge (usually some online purchase who accidentally double dipped the card and charged her twice) and bank customer service always does the same thing when you call to dispute, they lock the account until you can "come in Monday" and straighten things out. My favorite is when they decide it's prudent to lock both cards for "safety", I'm out running errands and pop into the hardware store and suddenly I have no spending power and I can't even grab some fries and a coke on the way home despite the actual balance in the bank. All because some minimum wage flunkie ran a card twice because credit cards are hard.
Once upon a time I used to carry $100 on me at all times. I think I'll start doing that again.
titsonritz
07-13-20, 02:03
When it happens lead will become the major currency.
teufelhund1918
07-13-20, 05:33
Everything going on now is about taking away our freedoms and taking control.
I have knowledge of countries that have switched to their own crypto type currency, and control of the population is always near the top of the list.
By all means, enlighten us.
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I have traveled in Scandinavia, especially Denmark and Sweden. The Swedes are going away from cash, and even when I was there 10 years ago, everything was Debit Card transactions or bank to bank movement of currency. Here's a two year old article from NPR, and it discusses the microchip used for transactions. This is not Alex Jones/Info Wars stuff - it's real:
Thousands Of Swedes Are Inserting Microchips Under Their Skin
https://www.npr.org/2018/10/22/658808705/thousands-of-swedes-are-inserting-microchips-under-their-skin
ChattanoogaPhil
07-13-20, 08:21
The main theme of cryptocurrency is being outside of central government control, so I'm not sure what is meant by countries switching to their own cryptocurrency.
I don't use cash for purchases and seldom write a check. CC discounts and extended warranties are attractive incentives. I'm more concerned with government knowledge of purchases and restrictions on the exercise of liberties via NFA and GCA 1968/FFL system than manner of payment.
and/or I’ve seen some places claim that there’s a nation-wide shortage of coins, so they only take card.
.
Has anyone else heard this?
I get it but I'm not seeing the big deal in this specific case.
Private transactions are between private parties. No private party takes cc, check or anything but cash, unless a deal was was made a head of time for trade.
Store purchases....well.....yea.... except for all those cameras and sales receipts. How many cameras can link at least 90% of your drive from home to store. Then store parking lot, inside the store, at the register paying with a time stamped video and receipt! And let's not forget that phone in your pocket that knows what you're thinking before you think it!
But let's not forget the thousands of rounds of ammo, mags and gun accessories bought online.... obviously not with cash
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I buy almost everything with cash. Each Friday, I get cash out and TRY to force myself into a spending limit. It was a tip from a financial advisor a few years back.
I laugh when people cry about the card skimmers at the gas pumps, etc. The idea of paying cash doesn't even enter their pea brain.
Has anyone else heard this?
There are signs in some of the businesses here that there is a nationwide coin shortage. Its either pure BS or the media can't work out a way to blame the President so they don't cover it.
Andy
Has anyone else heard this?Yes. Saw this at WAWA (7/11 style convenience store). They even took out their coin dispenser machine thing. For those who don't know, before they cashier would give you your paper change and the coin dispenser would shoot out your coin change. They deal with a lot of small change. People coming in to buy coffee, sandwiches, cigarettes, drinks....etc...
And at Best Buy the other day but I paid cash and got change back. The guy there said it was mainly for large bills. People paying with a $50 for something that's like $7 and change. Mine was $30. I paid $40 and got change back.
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ChattanoogaPhil
07-13-20, 08:52
The coin shortage was the result of less activity with coin recyclers and the US Mint operating at less than capacity in April and May, all during the COVID lockdown. As lockdowns eased there was more demand among retailers creating a temporary shortage which will soon resolve as the US Mint is back to full production. Some conspiracy nuts were hyping it as the coming of the new world order... blah blah blah.
PracticalRifleman
07-13-20, 08:55
I buy almost everything with cash. Each Friday, I get cash out and TRY to force myself into a spending limit. It was a tip from a financial advisor a few years back.
I laugh when people cry about the card skimmers at the gas pumps, etc. The idea of paying cash doesn't even enter their pea brain.
That works great but buying gas when there is no manned register is impossible. The stations in my sleepy area close down at 2000 and open at 0600 or 0700, which means I have to pay at the pump.
Also a guy needs reloading components and gun parts. You gotta get most of that online around here unless you have the local guy order it, charge you above retail and shipping, but you don’t get it until “he has enough to make an order from that vendor”.
I also prefer to play with cash when I can. It just makes sense and it’s what we should do. But I did develop a good solution. I keep a second bank account with no overdraft. I electronically transfer enough cash to that card to make a specific purchase then leave less than $1.00 after it’s processed. It’s like loading a prepaid card I can do with my bank app.
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I buy almost everything with cash. Each Friday, I get cash out and TRY to force myself into a spending limit. It was a tip from a financial advisor a few years back.
I laugh when people cry about the card skimmers at the gas pumps, etc. The idea of paying cash doesn't even enter their pea brain.Depends on what you want out of your money. The gas skimmer is a irritating but irrelevant. One call to the CC company and its not your problem. Besides the chances of that happening.......
On the other hand a coworker puts EVERYTHING on CC. EVERYTHING! car payments, mortgage, groceries, kids stuff, EVERYTHING! He carries a little cash....a few dollars.... because sometimes cash is needed! His logic is what's the difference who I give the money to? Car payments aren't going to change, neither is the mortgage. Still have to buy everything that I'll buy during that month. But now instead of spreading payments around and writing half a dozen different checks I now do one monthly payment and it's still the same amount of money spent. On the other hand though I get discounts. Gas is 3% cheaper, so are groceries and the amount of points I get on the card I take the whole family on vacation every year with free flights, discounted hotels and sometimes free car rentals.
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China is moving to 100% digital currency. No cash what so ever. Alibaba and Tencent have been using their own digital payment platforms which users fund themselves, but China as a nation will be moving their entire economy to digital currency.
The Federal Reserve has been kicking this around, too.
Digitizing currency is both about central banks staying competitive and maintaining absolute control of flow of currency. The bottom link explains this better than I can.
https://www.businessinsider.com/didi-to-pilot-china-digital-currency-2020-7
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/28/china-starts-major-trial-of-state-run-digital-currency
https://www.cnbc.com/2019/09/13/chinas-new-cryptocurrency-and-yuan-rmb-internationalization.html
[URL="https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/stocks/the-federal-reserve-is-looking-into-developing-digital-currency-us-2019-11-1028705211?op=1#[/URL]
https://www.forbes.com/sites/norbertmichel/2020/06/19/digital-dollar-project-promotes-federal-reserve-digital-dollar/#21f3388338ae
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lkgV7LJv5Os
teufelhund1918
07-13-20, 09:33
Just ran across this on the news. Chips in the hand.... hummm....
https://www.npr.org/2018/10/22/658808705/thousands-of-swedes-are-inserting-microchips-under-their-skin
opps, old story, but part of the plan! Thanks for pointing it out Arik.. lol...
I am unalterably opposed to the elimination of cash in favor of a plastic/digital substitute. The first reason is as has been well stated by Mozart and others. All the bank controls and restrictions, along with the whim of Bravo Sierra policy, with no basis in law, just some virtue signaling idiot. What about power outages? We've been without power for a week after a serious hurricane. Know what they did in the market? Yes, the old fashioned way, on the back of a paper bag. But, if you didn't have cash, you learn the meaning of SOL. All the nonsense about blockchain, etc. depends on electronic communication, without which you need to trade off the wife's necklace (the commercial for some game) if you don't have cash. I do like Steyr says, carry $100 in cash, the rest on a card which gives me spendable back.
I am unalterably opposed to the elimination of cash in favor of a plastic/digital substitute. The first reason is as has been well stated by Mozart and others. All the bank controls and restrictions, along with the whim of Bravo Sierra policy, with no basis in law, just some virtue signaling idiot. What about power outages? We've been without power for a week after a serious hurricane. Know what they did in the market? Yes, the old fashioned way, on the back of a paper bag. But, if you didn't have cash, you learn the meaning of SOL. All the nonsense about blockchain, etc. depends on electronic communication, without which you need to trade off the wife's necklace (the commercial for some game) if you don't have cash. I do like Steyr says, carry $100 in cash, the rest on a card which gives me spendable back.
This was my biggest concern about buying Bitcoin, etc...advocates say it is decentralized and free of outside influence. When I counter with "Who controls the access to power and the internet?" I never get a solid answer.
Also, just like digital rights to media, some one controls the license keys. If you sign a EULA to down load music and then pirate it, the license can be revoked, and access to that file is lost. Future access on that platform can be denied. How hard would it be to restrict access to digital currency for people who are not playing by the rules?
Life's a Hillary
07-13-20, 09:53
Depends on what you want out of your money. The gas skimmer is a irritating but irrelevant. One call to the CC company and its not your problem. Besides the chances of that happening.......
On the other hand a coworker puts EVERYTHING on CC. EVERYTHING! car payments, mortgage, groceries, kids stuff, EVERYTHING! He carries a little cash....a few dollars.... because sometimes cash is needed! His logic is what's the difference who I give the money to? Car payments aren't going to change, neither is the mortgage. Still have to buy everything that I'll buy during that month. But now instead of spreading payments around and writing half a dozen different checks I now do one monthly payment and it's still the same amount of money spent. On the other hand though I get discounts. Gas is 3% cheaper, so are groceries and the amount of points I get on the card I take the whole family on vacation every year with free flights, discounted hotels and sometimes free car rentals.
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I put everything I can on my credit card but my mortgage would not be one of them. For one I don’t even think I can pay my mortgage with a credit card and if a bank allowed that I would assume they would charge a substantial fee. The only time I don’t use a credit card is when the fee to do so outweighs the rewards I get. I get 2% cash back directly into my brokerage account for every dollar I spend, I would be a fool to not take advantage of that as it will easily add up to five figures at the end of the day. I pay it off every month so it’s free money.
I also don’t see any chance that we remove cash from society anytime soon. It is still very much necessary in many aspects and while more and more of the world moves towards cashless payments it’s going to take a long time before cash is a thing of the past. I still require cash for most in person transactions be it selling a gun or something else. It’s too easy to reverse something like Venmo but it’s a lot harder to get scammed with cash.
Just ran across this on the news. Chips in the hand.... hummm....
https://www.npr.org/2018/10/22/658808705/thousands-of-swedes-are-inserting-microchips-under-their-skinYes, from 2 years ago
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I put everything I can on my credit card but my mortgage would not be one of them. For one I don’t even think I can pay my mortgage with a credit card and if a bank allowed that I would assume they would charge a substantial fee. The only time I don’t use a credit card is when the fee to do so outweighs the rewards I get. I get 2% cash back directly into my brokerage account for every dollar I spend, I would be a fool to not take advantage of that as it will easily add up to five figures at the end of the day. I pay it off every month so it’s free money.
I also don’t see any chance that we remove cash from society anytime soon. It is still very much necessary in many aspects and while more and more of the world moves towards cashless payments it’s going to take a long time before cash is a thing of the past. I still require cash for most in person transactions be it selling a gun or something else. It’s too easy to reverse something like Venmo but it’s a lot harder to get scammed with cash.I never tried paying mortgage via a cc but I don't know why it would matter. If you're cc can cover the payment then it's just a payment.
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Life's a Hillary
07-13-20, 10:08
I never tried paying mortgage via a cc but I don't know why it would matter. If you're cc can cover the payment then it's just a payment.
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I just can’t imagine many banks accepting it as payment, at least not without a 3%+ fee associated with it. Considering they would take a hit on each payment since the CC companies make sure to get theirs and banks aren’t in the business of giving money away for nothing. It’s why most big purchases have a large fee attached to credit card use. Also why you can get a discount on gas purchases with cash at times given their margins are typically razor thin on gasoline.
Cashless economy is coming sooner than you think. Covid is just one way they will justify it. Get ready.
Cashless economy is coming sooner than you think. Covid is just one way they will justify it. Get ready.
I'm not finding references but I believe there was language about this in the COVID economic relief plans.
ChattanoogaPhil
07-13-20, 11:45
Private transactions are between private parties. No private party takes cc, check or anything but cash, unless a deal was was made a head of time for trade.
eBay changed that many years ago. Today, Apple Pay and others make it very easy for individuals to send and receive money between each other for purchases or whatever else.
A cashless society will impact all sorts of things, including illegal drug sales.
teufelhund1918
07-13-20, 12:01
eBay changed that many years ago. Today, Apple Pay and others make it very easy for individuals to send and receive money between each other for purchases or whatever else.
A cashless society will impact all sorts of things, including illegal drug sales.
CIA won't like that. :smile:
Beast System 666
“And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name (https://www.chick.com/products/tract?stk=0007).”
Revelation 13:16-17, King James Version
eBay changed that many years ago. Today, Apple Pay and others make it very easy for individuals to send and receive money between each other for purchases or whatever else.
A cashless society will impact all sorts of things, including illegal drug sales.Yea ok. I guess eBay wasn't what I was thinking about. Haven't used that site since probably late 90s.
Private party to me means face to face.
https://youtu.be/lkgV7LJv5Os
ChattanoogaPhil
07-14-20, 06:44
Yea ok. I guess eBay wasn't what I was thinking about. Haven't used that site since probably late 90s.
Private party to me means face to face.
eBay spawned PayPal which is now mobile and used between individuals face to face or wherever. Apple Pay and others are entering the market. The idea that cash is necessary for face to face transactions is a thing of the past.
eBay spawned PayPal which is now mobile and used between individuals face to face or wherever. Apple Pay and others are entering the market. The idea that cash is necessary for face to face transactions is a thing of the past.Doubt it. As long as people don't want to pay taxes there's going to be an untraceable form of payment.
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I put everything I can on my credit card but my mortgage would not be one of them. For one I don’t even think I can pay my mortgage with a credit card and if a bank allowed that I would assume they would charge a substantial fee. The only time I don’t use a credit card is when the fee to do so outweighs the rewards I get. I get 2% cash back directly into my brokerage account for every dollar I spend, I would be a fool to not take advantage of that as it will easily add up to five figures at the end of the day. I pay it off every month so it’s free money.
I also don’t see any chance that we remove cash from society anytime soon. It is still very much necessary in many aspects and while more and more of the world moves towards cashless payments it’s going to take a long time before cash is a thing of the past. I still require cash for most in person transactions be it selling a gun or something else. It’s too easy to reverse something like Venmo but it’s a lot harder to get scammed with cash.
I also use a card when possible. It about pays for my ammo each month, saves me over $1,000/yr.
I also keep cash on-hand.
So all the silver I've been hoarding over the years may or may not be of any value? I hoard silver, I stash ammo. Maybe the ammo will have just as much value in an underground barter economy? I can see a license or permit required in the future just to buy ammo, in pre-determined quantities. I guess those sealed Comm Block spam cans will have been a great investment.
ChattanoogaPhil
07-14-20, 07:43
Doubt it. As long as people don't want to pay taxes there's going to be an untraceable form of payment.
Sure... lawbreakers do what lawbreakers do but that wasn't what was being addressed: "No private party takes cc, check or anything but cash, unless a deal was was made a head of time for trade."
In addition PayPal mobile, Apple Pay and others, individuals also accept credit cards face to face using Square.
Lawbreakers? You never sold a used lawnmower? Helped your neighbor move? Furniture? Tools? Garage sale? Computer or phone? TV? An extra refrigerator sitting in the garage unused and taking up space....etc ...etc...those are private party sales. Cash and carry.
ChattanoogaPhil
07-14-20, 08:43
Lawbreakers? You never sold a used lawnmower? Helped your neighbor move? Furniture? Tools? Garage sale? Computer or phone? TV? An extra refrigerator sitting in the garage unused and taking up space....etc ...etc...those are private party sales. Cash and carry.
Uh... your original assertion was not accurate, then you switched it to tax evasion. Selling a refrigerator in my garage to an individual isn't a taxable event. It would be taxable for a business sale but your argument pertained to private sales transactions. Anything else?
PracticalRifleman
07-14-20, 08:50
Could you imagine how much tax revenue we’ll be getting from black market and drug traffickers?
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Walmart turned off the cash option on self checkout this morning. I asked the attendant why, and she said we're in a national coin shortage. Good God the bullshit is getting even deeper.
I’m surprised nobody has pushed the cashless scheme more publicly under the guise of Covid safety. Or maybe I just haven’t seen it.
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teufelhund1918
07-14-20, 11:10
Walmart turned off the cash option on self checkout this morning. I asked the attendant why, and she said we're in a national coin shortage. Good God the bullshit is getting even deeper.
They did that a couple of weeks ago in my neck of the woods.
Start at 19:25 and watch through 22:06.
https://youtu.be/vCuvym3h14U
They did that a couple of weeks ago in my neck of the woods.
Did they re-activate the option??
I saw my first mention of the so called coin shortage at Harbor Freight over the weekend. Smells of total BS to me
Another cash related topic; a few years back Bank of America started asking for my ID whenever I deposited cash in my moms checking account. This was not big cash amounts, just a hundred or so at a time several times a year. When I questioned the reason I got some gobbledygook about the feds trying to prevent cash being transferred between accounts in the US and south of the border by immigrants. Whaaaaat???? So I asked Wells Fargo if they were doing this and they said no and couldn’t give an idea why BoA would do this. Of course they started the same thing a year or so later. Just the feds starting to track our cash transactions in my opinion.
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