View Full Version : Should Christians support BLM
A short concise answer.
http://bylogos.blogspot.com/2020/06/should-christians-support-black-lives.html
You really have to wonder if all those "Christians" out there supporting BLM are really Christians.
The_War_Wagon
07-19-20, 21:20
https://i.ibb.co/dKk2DSq/NO-1.jpg
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PracticalRifleman
07-19-20, 21:36
https://i.ibb.co/dKk2DSq/NO-1.jpg
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This^
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BoringGuy45
07-19-20, 22:11
We talked about this in church. The answer was simple: They are NOT a civil rights group. They are a communist group that is openly hostile towards Christianity. The answer is NO.
vicious_cb
07-19-20, 22:18
In case you didnt notice. They didnt stop at confederate statues...
https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fassets.infowars.com%2F2020%2F07%2F7-16-20-headless.jpg&f=1&nofb=1
I believe statues of Jesus to be wrong, but I get your point.
We talked about this in church. The answer was simple: They are NOT a civil rights group. They are a communist group that is openly hostile towards Christianity. The answer is NO.
I agree, they are hostile to Christianity, even intensely anti-Christian, but then communists from Marx on have been extremely hostile to religion in general and Christianity in particular. For those "Christians" that support this movement, it certainly doesn't speak well of their loyalties.
The idea sure. Or at least the better idea that "black lives ALSO matter", but the movement which is a thin veneer for marxists, anarchists, black supremacists, anti law enforcement subversives and other extremists radicals...no.
It is sad and depressing that in 2020, more than 50 years after the civil rights movement restated their goals of "true equality" that we are now as far removed from that goal as we were in the 1960s. I know it isn't as endemic as activists would have you believe and that mainstream America has largely gotten past racial conflict, but many still allow extremists to drive the narrative that we must engage in radical racism to eradicate racism.
The idea sure. Or at least the better idea that "black lives ALSO matter", but the movement which is a thin veneer for marxists, anarchists, black supremacists, anti law enforcement subversives and other extremists radicals...no.
It is sad and depressing that in 2020, more than 50 years after the civil rights movement restated their goals of "true equality" that we are now as far removed from that goal as we were in the 1960s. I know it isn't as endemic as activists would have you believe and that mainstream America has largely gotten past racial conflict, but many still allow extremists to drive the narrative that we must engage in radical racism to eradicate racism.
It's strange indeed that the segregationists now are on the black side. It's not about equality anymore, but the use of power to destroy the great enemy.....whiteness.
It's strange indeed that the segregationists now are on the black side. It's not about equality anymore, but the use of power to destroy the great enemy.....whiteness.
I guess if we achieved true equality, all those black leaders and social activists would have to find something different to do.
I can't and will not comment on what Christians should do, when it comes to Christianity.
Having said this, BLM is a terrorist organization, run by terrorist, dedicated to destroy the USA, the traditional family.
If Christians support the idea that all lives matters, for we are all created in the image of G-D. Then it comes down to should Christians support a terrorist marxist group, that if they take over the country, Christians and Jews will be brothers in reeducation camps.
Christian churches used to sack socialists.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis_Bellamy
The word "Christian" is too broad of a brush. There are current mainstream "Christian" Churches who support far left causes or are what we used to call "Bleeding Heart Liberals".
The main reason for the importation of Somalis, Hmong and others to Minnesota is due to the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America, and their clergy have gone certainly left of center. There used to be talk of a silent "Moral Majority" in the United States - quiet Christians who vote Conservative, but keep a low profile. I think that block may have had more influence in the past, but there's still considerable numbers of them.
As a "Believer", I find my beliefs incompatible with BLM.
I guess if we achieved true equality, all those black leaders and social activists would have to find something different to do.
When you don't have and really never have had a real job, race/oppressed huckstering is your only "job" security.
Christian churches used to sack socialists.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis_Bellamy
Bellamy sounds like in many ways he would fit right in with the apostatizing church of today. Although at one point he seem to be against racism, then later sounded like a virulent eugenicist/racist.
Averageman
07-20-20, 11:15
I have a pretty conservative view of Christianity, while attending Church, I found that view isn't shared by my former fellow partitioners.
It took one incident to see the true colours when I did I got up and left.
Would be more poignant to ask if MLK would support BLM. Their philosophy is largely opposed to his, regardless of some contingent similarities.
Would be more poignant to ask if MLK would support BLM. Their philosophy is largely opposed to his, regardless of some contingent similarities.
I’m not so sure about this. MLK had a career, and his approach/views were not uniform throughout.
Each side like to remember the views of a respectable person in history...or at least those particular views that are not at variance with their own.
My guess is that he would have tacitly supported them while not expressing direct support for their less mainstream goals. The friend of my friend...
Dr. Bullseye
07-20-20, 12:27
We talked about this in church. The answer was simple: They are NOT a civil rights group. They are a communist group that is openly hostile towards Christianity. The answer is NO.
...and white people.
...and white people.
You forgot they are more hostile to Black people, than white people.
LowSpeed_HighDrag
07-20-20, 13:34
Well, black lives DO matter, and (I am certainly no christian) the religion that touts itself as one for love should be espousing that IMO. But, the BLM organization is not the same as supporting and loving the black community, and the fact that people can't make that distinction is alarming.
BuzzinSATX
07-20-20, 14:00
When you don't have and really never have had a real job, race/oppressed huckstering is your only "job" security.
Lots of folks got rich and powerful from the “job”...Jessie, Al, et al.
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Lots of folks got rich and powerful from the “job”...Jessie, Al, et al.
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And I believe they'll have to answer for that one day soon.
Well, black lives DO matter, and (I am certainly no christian) the religion that touts itself as one for love should be espousing that IMO. But, the BLM organization is not the same as supporting and loving the black community, and the fact that people can't make that distinction is alarming.
Love has a specific definition in biblical theology and it's not primarily a feeling, but an action. And yes, black lives do matter.
A short concise answer.
http://bylogos.blogspot.com/2020/06/should-christians-support-black-lives.html
You really have to wonder if all those "Christians" out there supporting BLM are really Christians.
No. Blm is a communist organization. Communisms goal is to replace religion, and is incompatible with christianity.
I’m not so sure about this. MLK had a career, and his approach/views were not uniform throughout.
Each side like to remember the views of a respectable person in history...or at least those particular views that are not at variance with their own.
My guess is that he would have tacitly supported them while not expressing direct support for their less mainstream goals. The friend of my friend...
Would MLK support the organization BLM? Hard to say for sure, of course, but my understanding of history says he was a bit sympathetic to socialism/communism. I do know this, since I have read his actually writings, he wasnt a Christian. He denied the deity of Christ, the resurrection, and I believe the substitutionary atonement.
No, no , no , Fck no. I can’t believe people with more than a 6th grade education can get behind this moronic, smoke and mirrors movement.
My prediction is in “X” years or “XX” years, we will find out “X” numbers of BLM folks are multi millionaires. And will have done nothing for inner city black kids.
PB
FromMyColdDeadHand
07-20-20, 17:03
I do what I do. Not that I condone fascism, or any -ism for that matter. -Ism's in my opinion are not good. A person should not believe in an -ism, he should believe in himself.
What's in a name?
Alliance Defending Freedom
American Family Association
Creativity Union
American Freedom Party
All are designated hate groups by the SLPC. Are you against family, freedom, and creativity?
What's in a name?
So the NAZIs were socialists, not fascists?
So you have a catchy name, so what
5/3 Bank? That doesn't sound sketchy at all. Where are the other two-thirds from? Who does their accounting?
titsonritz
07-21-20, 02:33
I can't see why any freedom loving American, Christian or otherwise, would knowingly support a Marxist/Socialist/Communist organization unless they were just plain ignorant stupid ****s or are Marxist/Socialist/Communist.
It pisses me off all of the big corporations tripping over each other to kowtow before BLM, its just gross.
https://These 18 Corporations gave money to Black Lives Matter group/ (https://www.dailysignal.com/2020/07/07/these-18-corporations-gave-money-to-black-lives-matter-group/)
Black lives do matter, just as all lives matter, or do they?
At Least 89 Shot, Including Multiple Children, in Chicago Over Fourth of July Weekend (https://www.nbcchicago.com/news/local/at-least-89-shot-including-multiple-children-in-chicago-over-fourth-of-july-weekend/2300375/)
At least 6 children were killed by gun violence across the nation this holiday weekend (https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/06/us/children-killed-holiday-weekend/index.html)
If all lives matter then surely Uncle Tom Voices Matter, BLM doesn't hold a candle to them...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eOykWDw-LtY
teufelhund1918
07-21-20, 05:27
This is my take from reading the Bible and my study. As far as Christians accepting or supporting BLM, absolutely not. Bible says not to accept corrupting influences into your Christian life and church. Those things will lead you away and churches away from Christ. Ideally you live your life as Jesus's example by praying for, loving people and proving your faith with your good works. Also by setting the example by living a life that reflects not on you, but Christ so that your deeds reflect not yourself, but Jesus Christ. But we are not perfect people or ever will be here on Earth. Gandhi said it pretty good when he stated,“I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.” We all fall short of Jesus's example, continuing to live in our sin. Which is why God gives us his grace to be forgiven of our sins. You can't earn it, it is given freely by accepting it into your life.
FromMyColdDeadHand
07-21-20, 07:57
BLM intersects with religion in the concept of collective sin. Outside of original sin, is there any other kind of collective sitting in Christianity? There are scenes that we are all guilty of, but not in a collective way. To me that is the real theological question about the BLM.
BLM intersects with religion in the concept of collective sin. Outside of original sin, is there any other kind of collective sitting in Christianity? There are scenes that we are all guilty of, but not in a collective way. To me that is the real theological question about the BLM.
I'm not aware of any. The bible does talk about the sins of the fathers, that is a previous generation, but my understanding is that the present generation is also committing those same sins. The present view in orgs like BLM is actually proposing a sin sin worst than original in a sense...it is essential unforgivable. Oringinal sin can and is forgiven by God. The sin of past slavery and whiteness is foisted upon this generation and later ones and is never going to be forgiven.
This thread is getting heavy into some philosophical Biblical concepts. Remember, there are the sins of Omission and sins of Commission. In other words, you can commit sin by even not doing something in addition to active sin committing. So how many sins are there you can be guilty of by inaction?
teufelhund1918
07-21-20, 10:41
BLM intersects with religion in the concept of collective sin. Outside of original sin, is there any other kind of collective sitting in Christianity? There are scenes that we are all guilty of, but not in a collective way. To me that is the real theological question about the BLM.
God punished the whole nation of Israel for their unbelief through out time. It's all through the Bible. That included punishing believers and non believers collectively. The whole BLM/ANTIFA movement is something completely different IMHO. It's all about submitting to their whims regardless of the issue. They will use any issue that will shut the mouths of opposition up. There is nothing religious about BLM. It is all about hate. They took a legitimate issue, the death of George Floyd, and are using it to their advantage. If they cared about black lives, they would be up in Chicago, New York and other cities where 100's of black men, women and children have been shot and killed over the last few months. And they would be doing it in a respectful and peaceful manner.
The problem with any religion is that, "The Devil may quote Scripture for his purpose ".....Doesn't matter which religion. There are huge numbers of Christians who believe in Liberation Theology, Jews who are anti Zionist etc....
Religion is a personal thing, people will find whatever harmonizes their world view.
Me personally, my Church is virulently anti communist, very Old Line Protestant. I have a picture on my desk of the float we entered in the 1950 County Fair Parade. Two guys with rifles are surrounding a barb wire pen full of people holding Bibles....There is a banner on the trailer--"Communism or Christ What is Your Choice?"
Would MLK support the organization BLM? Hard to say for sure, of course, but my understanding of history says he was a bit sympathetic to socialism/communism. I do know this, since I have read his actually writings, he wasnt a Christian. He denied the deity of Christ, the resurrection, and I believe the substitutionary atonement.
I think getting mired in the weeds of doctrine comparison would be to miss the larger point. MLK was a moral realist who believed in individual value. His favorite books included Plato’s Republic and the Bible. Moral realism and individualism is a fundamental and automatic separation from BLM. When you read his words of sympathy toward socialism it was not because he wanted to erase the individual nor consider his enemy sub-human (a la BLM), but to gain back ground for the black communities in which they were excluded from some of America’s most prosperous times.
My point is that you don’t even need Christianity, per say, to stand in opposition to the ideals of BLM... you only need the most famous black social reformer in American history, whom BLM has reappropriate, to demonstrate the stark issue at hand. The biblical story is deeply grounded in moral realism. I do question those who claim to be moral realists why they would support orgs that are moral anti-realists. The contradiction severe.
Edit to add that the Bee coincidentally just posted on this too.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200721/394f658b81ba8b4bc2dfcadd51453f04.jpg
BLM intersects with religion in the concept of collective sin. Outside of original sin, is there any other kind of collective sitting in Christianity? There are scenes that we are all guilty of, but not in a collective way. To me that is the real theological question about the BLM.
“Collective” needs to be defined. We are collectively found on planet earth but that’s not the same as political collectivism. The Christian story says while in the same lot (“sin”) the individual matters and is responsible for her/himself. Never is the collective more important than the individual. I believe we are in agreement that with BLM the pragmatic outcome (moral anti-realism) is more important than the expendable individual. If BLM ideology has control, even black lives would be expendable. The collectivist mob gets what it wants and is never restrained by real justice.
teufelhund1918
07-21-20, 11:10
Just read this on Billy Graham's Daily Devotional and thought it was relevant to the conversation. Believe I agree with the sentiment 100%:
"In a decadent society the will to believe, to resist, to contend, to fight, to struggle, is gone. In place of this will to resist, there is the desire to conform, to drift, to follow, to yield, and to give up. This is what happened in Rome, but it also applies to us. The same conditions that prevailed in Rome prevail in our society. Before Rome fell, her standards were abandoned, the family disintegrated, divorce prevailed, immorality was rampant, and faith was at a low ebb. As Gibbon said, “There was much talk of religion, but few practiced it.”
MountainRaven
07-21-20, 15:21
Black lives do matter, just as all lives matter, or do they?
At Least 89 Shot, Including Multiple Children, in Chicago Over Fourth of July Weekend (https://www.nbcchicago.com/news/local/at-least-89-shot-including-multiple-children-in-chicago-over-fourth-of-july-weekend/2300375/)
At least 6 children were killed by gun violence across the nation this holiday weekend (https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/06/us/children-killed-holiday-weekend/index.html)
I have seen this violence being used recently in calls for more gun control in Chicago - and probably nationwide.
It’s not to difficult to imagine, “Black Lives Matter, end gun violence now!” Becoming a rallying cry of the left.
Evel Baldgui
07-21-20, 15:29
NO !
.....
that says it all
I think getting mired in the weeds of doctrine comparison would be to miss the larger point. MLK was a moral realist who believed in individual value. His favorite books included Plato’s Republic and the Bible. Moral realism and individualism is a fundamental and automatic separation from BLM. When you read his words of sympathy toward socialism it was not because he wanted to erase the individual nor consider his enemy sub-human (a la BLM), but to gain back ground for the black communities in which they were excluded from some of America’s most prosperous times.
My point is that you don’t even need Christianity, per say, to stand in opposition to the ideals of BLM... you only need the most famous black social reformer in American history, whom BLM has reappropriate, to demonstrate the stark issue at hand. The biblical story is deeply grounded in moral realism. I do question those who claim to be moral realists why they would support orgs that are moral anti-realists. The contradiction severe.
Edit to add that the Bee coincidentally just posted on this too.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200721/394f658b81ba8b4bc2dfcadd51453f04.jpg
“Collective” needs to be defined. We are collectively found on planet earth but that’s not the same as political collectivism. The Christian story says while in the same lot (“sin”) the individual matters and is responsible for her/himself. Never is the collective more important than the individual. I believe we are in agreement that with BLM the pragmatic outcome (moral anti-realism) is more important than the expendable individual. If BLM ideology has control, even black lives would be expendable. The collectivist mob gets what it wants and is never restrained by real justice.
Staying out of the doctrinal weeds might be appropriate if all we were discussing was MLK's civic "good works", but I think in the context of what Christians should do concerning their relationships to various organizations that are supposedly fighting racism, doctrinal precision is of help. MLK is the Big Kahuna of race relations that everyone seems to appeals to for validation of their particular point of view, at least it seems that way to me. So as long as he was brought up in a what should Christians do context, I believe it to be pertinent that Christians ought to know that he was not a Christian, I believe you that he was a moral realist, but there are many unbelievers in that category, some right here on this board. Doctrine is the life blood of the Christian's walk, without it we would definitely be lost in the weeds of worldly philosophy. Even though a Christian might agree with many things that MLK thought or did, I would not hold him up as any kind of authority as to the right path to follow on pretty much anything, there are vastly better people to listen to...he was a religionist or a moralist, and I don't think took hold of the bible he so favored. It's a book of God's self revelation and he said "no thank you". And now he, like many mere men of the past (even what many believe to be great men) is losing his power of persuasion in the present. Orgs like BLM couldn't care less about what he actually said concerning race, he is just to be used as a prop, a beginning, in the great revolution to destroy the U.S. and to bamboozle as many people as possible into believing their lies. He isn't remotely radical enough for these people. As for Christianity not being needed, I see zero hope for the world without Christ and His gospel. One thing for sure...Jesus wasn't a religionist or a moralist...He is the creator and our savior, and I believe Him when said "We can not do anything without Him".
BURN
LOOT
MURDER?
absolutely not.
Tom, I understand what you are saying. I’m afraid my point wasn’t clear enough. Let me try again...
If a high jumper needs to qualify by jumping over a certain threshold, those who take MLK seriously would need a 5 from the jumper. Those who take Jesus seriously would need a 10. BLM as the jumper can’t even muster a 1 and therefore should not be supported by either.
In the world of persuasion, I find it helpful to use examples the hearer is sympathetic to in order to show them the contrast. As it is today, “Christian,” especially of the evangelical flavor, is just a white man disease to be discounted before the conversation begins.
I’ll bow out now. I’m sure someone here will find value in my comparison.
The idea sure. Or at least the better idea that "black lives ALSO matter", but the movement which is a thin veneer for marxists, anarchists, black supremacists, anti law enforcement subversives and other extremists radicals...no.
It is sad and depressing that in 2020, more than 50 years after the civil rights movement restated their goals of "true equality" that we are now as far removed from that goal as we were in the 1960s. I know it isn't as endemic as activists would have you believe and that mainstream America has largely gotten past racial conflict, but many still allow extremists to drive the narrative that we must engage in radical racism to eradicate racism.
Agreed.
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