CSAT COMBAT SIGHT on LT103? [Archive]

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Submariner

12-01-08, 19:06

markm

12-01-08, 19:25

Someone sent me a link to the video of this thing. Without having tried it, I can't completely trash the thing.

I mean... the basic concept is what I already do, and the reason I don't need a red dot sight to make fast contact shots. I just look over the top of the rear app and use the front sight post the same way a shooter would with a red dot... only faster. The steep elevation of the sight alignment is a good offset to the holdover requirement for a contact distance shot. That's why my system works so good for center of mass shots.

The proximity of the rear app to the eye ball makes a notch rear sight a bad idea from the get go. And in general I find the idea of a notch sight on the AR15 completely appalling.

USMC03

12-01-08, 20:37

Sub,

I have one installed on this gun:

http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk99/USMC03_photos/Stag%20Mid-Length%20Coyote/IMG_0041.jpg

I was taught Howe's method of CQB shooting with irons at MCSF Battalion in 1990 and it's how we used irons in CQB enviornments in the early 90's.....it works.

I haven't been able to get any trigger time on the CSAT irons because I'm not cleared hot to shoot due to shoulder surgery I had a couple months ago.

Conndcj did a review of the sights on the Lightfighter Stud Board a month or so ago.

Contact "RRTX" over on LF and he can walk you though the install process on the LaRue BUIS. molson / ASSBAGS installed my CSAT sight in the LaRue BUIS for me, as I was still in a sling at the time......I can't change the oil in my truck, but I could have changed out the appeture in a LaRue BUIS......RRTX can walk you though it.

S/F,
Jeff

Submariner

12-01-08, 20:42

Thanks, Jeff.

It looks worth trying.

Do you know if the apertures are same plane?

All I have to do now is get back on LF.:rolleyes:

USMC03

12-01-08, 21:46

Appetures are same plane.

"RRTX" works for XS sights.......Call XS, they can walk you though the install......One of those things where it's hard to explain on the internet, but if you are talking with someone on the phone and have the LaRue BUIS in hand, it's pretty easy to figure out.

Look at the front of the LaRue BUIS....You'll see a set screw. There are 2 set screws in that hole....after you pull the first one out, you back the second set screw off and turn the windage knob until the screw backs off the the point where you can take the A2 appeture off the screw, replace it with the CSAT........and reverse to reasseble.......I don't recall any other steps in the process, but I have been wrong in the past. ;)

S/F,
Jeff

Parabellum9x19mm

12-01-08, 22:05

forgive my ignorance, i don't know much about this stuff at all, but what's the advantage over the LT same plane BUIS?

is there tritium on the rear aperture? what's the pattern? is it only on the close range aperture? do you use a tritium FSP with this set up too?

sorry for all the questions, but i know nothing about high speed sights. all my pistols that have Trijicon tritium night sights came that way from the factory. ...so yeah, i know nothing about the differences from one system to the next....straight 8s, XS, Heine single dot...i've never used any of that stuff. i've just heard about them. only ever used 3- green dots on pistols.

never used tritium on a rifle. why do you like it? what are the downsides?

tjcoker

12-01-08, 22:19

I found this sight to be very easy to use while training with Paul a couple weeks a go. I found no issues with it and had a shot on target from the low ready at seven yards consistently in under a second. I'm no speed shooter with the AR platform so I considered that a good time for myself.

YMMV

NCPatrolAR

12-01-08, 22:40

Anyone happen to know what size that set screw is? None of my allen wrenches will fit it.

Pat.c

12-02-08, 00:52

Heres a video on youtube for the standard M4/M16 sight.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uqoZOcUon8U

Parabellum9x19mm

12-02-08, 02:19

cool video. i can see how it differs from the standard sight now.

interesting...not sure i could get used to it tho.

Iraqgunz

12-02-08, 06:47

Here's my thoughts on the install.

1. I find it much easier to remove and reinstall the sight aperature when the roll pin is at the top vice sideways.

2. Smaller roll pins generally aren't as strong as larger ones and depending on various factors can be harder to remove, thus taking a little beating.

3. Unless I absolutely had to I would not reuse any roll pin. I was given that advice years ago and I stick with. It would be sad to a have something take shit when you needed it most because of a part that is usually under 2 dollars.

Aubrey

12-02-08, 11:26

Sub,
If you run into a dead end, Borebrush should be able to hook you up.

nickdrak

01-04-09, 09:28

Any idea if it is possible to install one of the CSAT aperatures in a Troy rear sight? The Troy rear looks easy enough to disassemble, but I am curious if the CSAT ap will work....

nickdrak

03-26-09, 21:45

Anyone happen to know what size that set screw is? None of my allen wrenches will fit it.

+1 What the hell size is that damn set-screw on the LaRue BUIS???!!!

NCPatrolAR

03-26-09, 22:16

I had to stop at a local gunsmith and just start trying different sizes until I got one that fit.

RogerinTPA

03-26-09, 22:41

I have that notch on my ARMS40L sight thats about 5 or 6 years old on one of my ARs. It is a good concept for fast engagements just using the irons.

Robb Jensen

03-27-09, 07:11

You can read about Paul Howe's CSAT Combat sight here:

http://www.combatshootingandtactics.com/published/The%20Battlefield%20Zero%20Full%20Pictures.pdf

Brownells has them:

http://www.brownells.com/aspx/NS/store/ProductDetail.aspx?p=26948&title=AR-15/M16%20CSAT%20COMBAT%20SIGHT

I have previously asked LaRue for instructions on replacing the standard leaf sight on an LT103 with an XS same plane rear sight or if I could pay them to install it. They declined to provide instructions and suggested I contact XS directly to install it.

I am interested in putting one of these sights in an LT 103. Has anyone disassembled one? Any tips?

Has anyone tried Paul Howe's sight? Are the apertures one each leaf in the same plane?

Sub,

It's actually easier to install it on a LaRue BUIS, well easier than a A1 or A2 rear sight. If you'll pay return shipping I'll install it into your LaRue free of charge.

Here's my Daniel Defense BUIS and I installed a Ashley same plane aperture.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/gotm4/03pics009.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/gotm4/03pics010.jpg

thopkins22

03-27-09, 23:34

I got to shoot (and watch way better shooters use) with this sight at Paul's carbine class back in Feb.

It's very fast up close, in fact I think the better(professional) shooters were able to take advantage of it more than the amateurs like myself. The notch is so close to your eye that it's pretty natural to center the post. Lots of pros at the class, lots of sights sold.

Paul only uses it at very close range...like less than 10 meters. Everything past that is sighted with the aperture. The idea was that he wanted a sight that he could engage everything from 0-300 yds without flipping touching the sight at all. He explained that in the fights he participated in(dominated;),) you needed to make a shot RIGHT NOW, at various distances.

I plan to buy one for the new DD rear sight.

BobM

03-28-09, 21:33

Any idea if it is possible to install one of the CSAT aperatures in a Troy rear sight? The Troy rear looks easy enough to disassemble, but I am curious if the CSAT ap will work....

Nick, I think this came up elsewhere on the forum and the answer was no. If I remember correctly there was talk of XS possibly making one if there was demand. I wouldn't mind trying one out; both of my ARs are M&P15As with the Troy sights.

nickdrak

03-30-09, 14:45

Thanx, yeah the CSAT ap is currently a no-go in the Troy.

I called and spoke to Cody @ LaRue. He let me know that the set screw on the LT BUIS uses a 1/16" hex key, and that during assembly they use red Loctite to secure the set screw, so it must be heated up prior to attempting removal. He suggested a torch or touching a soldering iron to the head of the screw for a few seconds. I will try it out later tonight.

usmcvet

08-08-10, 16:11

How have your CSAT sights worked for you and how have they held up. I have a Troy, LMT and LT 103 on my guns. I would like to try it on the LaRue mout first to see how I like it. As you probably know they are avaliable for the Troy now too.

Also do you know if the same plane offered byLaRue is the CSAT? Their web site said it is now avaliable with XS Rear apperatures.

krm375

04-07-11, 13:09

Any idea if it is possible to install one of the CSAT aperatures in a Troy rear sight? The Troy rear looks easy enough to disassemble, but I am curious if the CSAT ap will work....

I just found these, through a friend, I guess they are making them for the Troy flip ups now.

usmcvet

04-07-11, 14:19

I bought a pair for my Troy rear sights. I sold one of my Troy BUIS and have a spare CSACT shoot me a PM if you're interested.

WS6

09-15-13, 04:36

usmcvet

09-15-13, 11:45

Just stumbled across this. Any further opinions on this, after its been out? Is this a good name pushing a gimick product? Is it a solid, useful, KISS addition to a BUIS?
Also, I can see no mention that this is same plane in XS site. Where did that information come from?
Also...are these. Better option than the regular XS same plane aperature?

It works well at 7-25 yards. With this sight there is no need to compensate and aim high. It's actually a well thought out addition and you can use it with what ever sights you have now, no need to buy a new BUIS just the aperture.

Paul Howe says it better:

"I have been shooting the AR/M-4 platform for over 25 years. My goal in developing the CSAT Combat Sight was to develop a simple system that would allow the shooter to engage targets from 0-300 yards without taking their hands off the weapon to flip sights.

The CSAT sight accommodates the shooter in CQB situations and long-range engagements without taking your head or hands off the weapon. At close range, the sight takes the thinking and calculation out of the equation and allows the shooter to fire point of aim and to surgically engage targets with ease.

Further, it is a snap to zero, and train shooters. You start at seven yards and shoot it like a pistol sight to get a baseline zero and then confirm it at 100. It will cut your zero time in half. I believe in simple is best."

Paul Howe
CSAT Owner/Lead Instructor Combat Shooting and Tactics
Developer of the CSAT Combat Sight

thopkins22

09-15-13, 12:17

Five years later, it's a good thing. Most of my rifles have flip ups and I don't use it on them, but the ones with fixed rears have the CSAT aperture.

Worst case scenario and it doesn't work for you, you still have the two normal apertures available on the rifle. Adds no weight, doesn't force you to do something new if you don't want to, and in my opinion it's a smart addition with no downside.

The fact that it allows you to shoot much closer to POA/POI inside of 25 yards is no gimmick...and the reasoning behind it seems very sound and in line with Paul's whole philosophy on shooting bad people with rifles(it was his experience in combat that you might shoot someone at bad breath distance, step out a door, and be forced to make a shot at 200.)

It's simple, rugged, accurate, and easy to use. To me it's a no brainer.

Jason Weekley

09-15-13, 13:48

Larue installed the Csat on my LT-103, cost was $10 for return shipping.