View Full Version : Closed Threads and Moderators
It seems like there have been many threads closed recently because 2-3 members refuse to stay on topic and enjoy antagonizing the rest of the membership with their views on abortion.
Many of us really want and need an outlet to discuss what’s happening to our country right now, and these certain members that invade each discussion with off-topic lectures are given the power to continue to do it again and again.
I respectfully request that the mods consider putting those members in a time out, rather than continuing to close threads and shut down discussion for everyone else. Unless of course you’re actively trying to destroy participation on your forum.
How about:
“Feel free to start a new thread about abortion and pro-life discussions. But if you participate in other discussions, stay on topic. If you cannot, you will be locked out of GD for a week. “
I can not be the only one who feels this way.
Thank you for hearing me out.
I agree 100%.
This is the most important and yet questionable election in modern history, yet a thread on it specifically was locked. That is bullshit, if someone can't stick to the subject then ban their ass. It begins to border on Facebook/Twitter when someone sees a thread closed about the election itself. Lock the miscreants down, not the thread and everyone else as a result.
I agree 100%.
This is the most important and yet questionable election in modern history, yet a thread on it specifically was locked. That is bullshit, if someone can't stick to the subject then ban their ass.
I don’t even disagree with them. Just stop beating us over the head with it when we are talking about other things. And I don’t want to see anyone permabanned, just a limit for a bit to reset and chill out.
I don’t even disagree with them. Just stop beating us over the head with it when we are talking about other things. And I don’t want to see anyone permabanned, just a limit for a bit to reset and chill out.
Ban/lock, tomatoe/tomato.
I guess I used the terms interchangeably in error. Whatever, abortion and other morality things like that (agree or not) need their own threads.
In the election thread Firefly was the first to bring up the topic by blaming pro-life Republicans for wasting four years and dividing the party.
In the election thread Firefly was the first to bring up the topic by blaming pro-life Republicans for wasting four years and dividing the party.
I pretty much stayed out of that thread until he threw down on the Bible, then it was on. Aren't we just one big happy family though. Carry on.
I can not be the only one who feels this way.
Oh, you definitely aren't alone. Your thoughts mirror mine as I read through that thread.
I actually hold a very strong opinion on the topic that got that thread locked, but purposely did not comment as it was not the purpose of the thread. I REALLY wish others would do the same out of respect for those that are interested in 2020 Election information.
M4C is typically a low signal to noise ratio information hub, and that's not just limited to weapons and training. There are members here from varying backgrounds and areas of expertise who often have an outlook different than my own. In times such as these, I believe that to be of great value.
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In the election thread Firefly was the first to bring up the topic by blaming pro-life Republicans for wasting four years and dividing the party.
In the one Yoni started, someone else brought it up and it was locked in 3 pages. Maybe the point should be: chill out, we are all on the same side. Not a one of us wants the constitution done away with. We’re under attack on a dozen fronts. We don’t have the luxury of bickering right now
While there will always be some morphing of subjects within an individual thread, let's keep them relatively separate shall we?
Re-open the 2020 Election thread mods!
Coal Dragger
11-13-20, 20:18
Yeah, keep your religious views and abortion views out of GD unless the thread is specifically about either topic.
The individuals who cannot wrap their thinky thinky bits around this concept need a time out. Maybe the time out will allow their smooth brains to evolve a bit in the meantime.
SWATcop556
11-13-20, 20:21
Honestly sometimes the cleanup in a specific thread isn't worth the time it takes to do it. We all have full time jobs and odd schedules and can only check in from time to time. By the time we get there it can be three pages of bullshit to wade through.
If someone says something OT that you don't agree with report the post and ignore it. Replying because you feel you have the "correct or moral view" doesn't make you right and just feeds trolls.
More often than not in times like these GD becomes the equivalent to a pissing section in a swimming pool.
In the one Yoni started, someone else brought it up and it was locked in 3 pages. Maybe the point should be: chill out, we are all on the same side. Not a one of us wants the constitution done away with. We’re under attack on a dozen fronts. We don’t have the luxury of bickering right now
Do you actually know why it was locked? Was it because someone brought up abortion as a troubling aspect of the present condition of the US, or was it the vicious personal attack(s) on that person for merely giving his opinion on "the topic"? I don't advocate banning anyone, never have, never will. People can grow up, stop acting like Pavlov's dog whenever a "gasp" Christian gives his opinion. Just think what a bloodbath it would have been in the election if all those actual believers stayed home. There have been plenty times I just let the Christian bashing go....sometimes not.
Do you actually know why it was locked? Was it because someone brought up abortion as a troubling aspect of the present condition of the US, or was it the vicious personal attack(s) on that person for merely giving his opinion on "the topic"? I don't advocate banning anyone, never have, never will. People can grow up, stop acting like Pavlov's dog whenever a "gasp" Christian gives his opinion. Just think what a bloodbath it would have been in the election if all those actual believers stayed home. There have been plenty times I just let the Christian bashing go....sometimes not.
I have you banned, because you came at me a while back putting words in my mouth, acting like you know what I believe and disrespecting me.
Having said that, you make a good point. Everyone takes pot shots at everyone else. It’s probably not justified to single out the born-again caucus here.
I agree with SWATcop, we should just turn the other cheek and refuse to get in the pit with asshats.
We’re under attack on a dozen fronts. We don’t have the luxury of bickering right now
Quite so.
Is it not ok to talk about political issues in a thread about an election, which is obviously a political thread. It's hard to separate the election forme the political issues that the election is about.
Nobody complains if the 2A is brought up, or taxes, socialism ECT. Probably because we all agree on those issues.
There obviously is disagreement when it comes to certain moral social issues. If we can't talk about these issues, how can we as conservatives move forward? I don't think pretending the difference of opinion doesn't exist is the way to go.
I have taken part in the abortion discussion a few times, but only after one of the few voices starts slandering Christianity. I am not going to stand by and be silent about my core beliefs.
I don't want Tom silenced, and I don't want firefly silenced. Perhaps we can be adults and listen to dissenting opinion and offer our argument in a polite and respectful manner?
Or you can silence us.....it is the popular thing to do these days.
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I have you banned, because you came at me a while back putting words in my mouth, acting like you know what I believe and disrespecting me.
Having said that, you make a good point. Everyone takes pot shots at everyone else. It’s probably not justified to single out the born-again caucus here.
I agree with SWATcop, we should just turn the other cheek and refuse to get in the pit with asshats.
And I have a different opinion of that exchange.
SeriousStudent
11-13-20, 21:15
Would you like to guess how many people I have banned (both temporary and permanent) in the last 30 days? It's positive two-digit integer.
SWATCop556 is pretty much on-target. A lot of the mods/staff are juggling a lot of real-life commitments right now - as are all of you. And it can take an hour to review a thread, and then another half-hour to perform surgery.
And let's not forget the people who quote the aforementioned asshattery. When I edit or delete that post, I get angry PM's from them. Then I have to explain why I did so, because they quoted Cletus saying "durr durr durr".
Please - don't quote the assholes and preserve them for posterity.
If you hit report post, it is doing everyone a favor. But sometimes we just flat do not have time for delicate surgery, so that particular bleeder's gonna get a TQ.
So yes, please do hit report post. If it's a self-inflicted wound, we know who the "frequent flyers" are. I'm pretty much going to take that into account.
I worked with Chuck Petrie to write some of the sticky threads people have mentioned, and he also asked me to write a couple on my own regarding forum behavior.
Bluntly put, any grown-ass man who is responsible enough to own firearms should not need a babysitter on a public forum. Yet here we are.
If someone is consistently behaving like an ass, I'll happily vote them off the island and sleep just fine.
SWATcop556
11-13-20, 21:16
Is it not ok to talk about political issues in a thread about an election, which is obviously a political thread. It's hard to separate the election forme the political issues that the election is about.
Nobody complains if the 2A is brought up, or taxes, socialism ECT. Probably because we all agree on those issues.
There obviously is disagreement when it comes to certain moral social issues. If we can't talk about these issues, how can we as conservatives move forward? I don't think pretending the difference of opinion doesn't exist is the way to go.
I have taken part in the abortion discussion a few times, but only after one of the few voices starts slandering Christianity. I am not going to stand by and be silent about my core beliefs.
I don't want Tom silenced, and I don't want firefly silenced. Perhaps we can be adults and listen to dissenting opinion and offer our argument in a polite and respectful manner?
Or you can silence us.....it is the popular thing to do these days.
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Talk about all the political topics you want. No one is being silenced. You are being told to act like civilized adults.
If a thread is headed down a specific rabbit hole start a new thread. I don't want to come to read a thread for a few minutes to catch up on election updates and have to sift through 4 pages of who's more right on abortion or womens right or anything else.
The thread being discussed is an election thread not a politics and beliefs thread.
Is it not ok to talk about political issues in a thread about an election, which is obviously a political thread. It's hard to separate the election forme the political issues that the election is about.
Nobody complains if the 2A is brought up, or taxes, socialism ECT. Probably because we all agree on those issues.
There obviously is disagreement when it comes to certain moral social issues. If we can't talk about these issues, how can we as conservatives move forward? I don't think pretending the difference of opinion doesn't exist is the way to go.
I have taken part in the abortion discussion a few times, but only after one of the few voices starts slandering Christianity. I am not going to stand by and be silent about my core beliefs.
I don't want Tom silenced, and I don't want firefly silenced. Perhaps we can be adults and listen to dissenting opinion and offer our argument in a polite and respectful manner?
Or you can silence us.....it is the popular thing to do these days.
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All good points.
Let’s work backwards:
We don’t want anymore closed threads.
How do we get there?
Everyone has to agree to do 2 things:
1) suppress your inner asshat that wants to insult and antagonize people, just to push buttons.
2) ignore/block/ don’t engage with the asshats.
Through a combo of those things, perhaps we can keep discussions going without any problems . . . . All beliefs and opinions welcome.
Bluntly put, any grown-ass man who is responsible enough to own firearms should not need a babysitter on a public forum. Yet here we are.
Give a man a public platform and anonymity, and watch the devil come out of him.
I’m guilty of it too, not gonna lie. Sometimes I say terrible things on Twitter or in the YT comments just to be a dick. Mostly my dark humor, but sometimes to be a dick.
Talk about all the political topics you want. No one is being silenced. You are being told to act like civilized adults.
If a thread is headed down a specific rabbit hole start a new thread. I don't want to come to read a thread for a few minutes to catch up on election updates and have to sift through 4 pages of who's more right on abortion or womens right or anything else.
The thread being discussed is an election thread not a politics and beliefs thread.I understand what you are saying about staying on topic, but I honestly can't say I've ever seen a thread that stayed on topic. That one had hundreds of posts and only a handful were actual updates.
If I act in an uncivilized manner, then I am fine with being banned. This isn't my house, I am just a guess.
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SeriousStudent
11-13-20, 21:37
Which brings me to another point.
It does seem like the vast majority of posters causing problems are not site sponsors. Not that paying money entitles you to be a jerk, but seriously?
You are a guest in someone else's place, and you can't even be polite and follow simple conduct rules?
We seem to have this happen periodically. All the mods and staff I know here have been on this site since the beginning, 14 years ago. We're familiar with the culture the founders created here.
I can pretty much tell you how this ends. Some people get the hint, others don't. The slow learners get permanently banned, or leave a overly-dramatic "Internet Suicide Note" about how horrible we are, then they grab their purse and stomp off in a huff.
It's always a lot better if people use the ignore button and show restraint/thought/brains when posting. Failing that, restraint can be supplied at no extra charge.
I am speaking very candidly. I hope that helps.
Yeah, keep your religious views and abortion views out of GD unless the thread is specifically about either topic.
No. You cannot post a super-broad thread topic such as "Assessment of where we are at, as a country", ask for opinion on how we got here, how we fix it, etc., and then ask people to not respond to that based on their strongly held beliefs, in an open forum. At least 3 or 4 Christian believers posted something in that particular thread today, to the effect that what got us to this point is the decline of belief in God, and the subsequent decline of morality (as evidenced by things like abortion). If you look at what our founders thought--a well known quote by John Adams was added to that thread--Christian belief is HIGHLY relevant to the health of our society, how we got here, and is in fact influential in our elections. If you look at what party is preserving your 2A rights today, it's 99% the Republican party. And what group is the single largest voting bloc within the Republican party? Christians.
So, while I'm agreeing that people should respect threads as always, and post on-topic (that's just forum rules, nothing new there, and as Mod says, you have the options to tune it out, reply, or you can use your Ignore list), I don't believe it's right to arbitrarily try to silence people who reply to broad general topics based on their Christian beliefs. And if people go on off-topic rants (like Firefly did, in the Election thread, calling Christians the "Christian taliban" and blaming them for election losses because of beliefs on abortion, etc.), then you cannot blame Christians for sending a thread off-topic. And you can't be surprised if folks are going to defend themselves, vigorously.
I'm all for civility, and try hard to practice it. In cases where I've been ungracious/uncivil, I would gladly apologize. However, it would help me a lot, if folks would avoid rants like the following, scapegoating entire classes of people. I don't see how that helps our threads stay on topic, nor all of us in working together to preserve our 2A rights.
Vic79 Vic79 is offline
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Shut the **** up about abortion, Jesus Christ you ****ing morons no one cares!You guys are literally worse than the Dickheadz on this very forum that voted for Biden because Trump was a big meanie head and their Memaw got sick. Shut up.
Firefly Firefly is offline
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[...] But these four years were totally wasted with the Republicans whining about Abortion. You underestimate how many people honestly believe that it will literally be like Handmaids Tale “any day now” because Republicans absolutely will NOT STFU with the Abortion and God bothering.
Roe v. Wade will never be repealed and doesn’t need to be. If we, as a nation, can put people do death with a clean clear conscience then we can have abortions.
One thing I Fing HATE is a ‘good Christian’ leading a weep wagon over Abortion but cheers “justice is served! justice is served!” when someone is put to death by the State. The State will jam that needle in your arm all hinging on 12 people too stupid to get out of jury duty.
I CHALLENGE you heroes to do an honest homicide investigation and you will see how less than clear cut it can be. You have the right guy, but it’s not always as simple as SVU or NCIS makes it out to be. Very few murderers are “evil” or crazy. Most are just stupid and ignorant. Or high.
But no. Christian Taliban running their suck over muh holy buuk
Give a man a public platform and anonymity, and watch the devil come out of him.
(language warning) https://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2004/03/19
Maximus:
I hear you, but I also didn’t see Fly reference any members here specifically in his rant. So that should be a case of saying to yourself “wow what an ignorant thing to say” and then perhaps block him or ignore him. He’s allowed to think there’s a Christian taliban, you’re allow to think that’s ****tarded nonsense.
Idk man. Everyone is on edge right now. Will there be more lockdowns? Will I still have a job in March? Are we going to see trump eek out a victory via the courts and have The Purge become a documentary? Where am I gonna get my meth now that my cousin is in jail? Etc. We’re all on short fuzes I think
An attack on Christianity, isn't just an attack on a bunch of abstract ideas, it's not an attack on me personally. TO ME, it's always an attack on our Lord...He is Christianity. I'm never surprised by these attacks, I expect them. So to me again, the attacks would be worse than calling my wife and mother a whore. That tends to put me in a certain frame of mind. And that frame of mind isn't "turn the other cheek".
SeriousStudent
11-13-20, 22:24
,,,,,,
Where am I gonna get my meth now that my cousin is in jail? Etc. We’re all on short fuzes I think
Bruh - all the cool kids are doing opiates now. Get with the times.
Nobody was attacking anyone for their beliefs or merits there of in the other thread. We were trying to drive home the point that it’s chess not checkers when it comes to the general election every four years.... you need to actually win elections to make policy and legal changes and running campaigns that will purposefully inflame and enrage the opposition is just poor tactics.
Not sure how to make it any simpler than that.
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Maximus:
I hear you, but I also didn’t see Fly reference any members here specifically in his rant. So that should be a case of saying to yourself “wow what an ignorant thing to say” and then perhaps block him or ignore him. He’s allowed to think there’s a Christian taliban, you’re allow to think that’s ****tarded nonsense.
Idk man. Everyone is on edge right now. Will there be more lockdowns? Will I still have a job in March? Are we going to see trump eek out a victory via the courts and have The Purge become a documentary? Where am I gonna get my meth now that my cousin is in jail? Etc. We’re all on short fuzes I think
FWIW, that's not what I was getting at. I'm not arguing for silencing Fly or anyone else, provided they're within forum rules (the first example I cited above, definitely was not). I'm arguing for VOLUNTARY civility: avoiding scapegoating, and stereotyping comments designed to intentionally troll or inflame a whole (very) large group of people that are a constituency here on M4c. That is most certainly designed to provoke, and against forum rules, but I'll leave the interpretation of that to Mods. My point is only, if you engage in civility voluntarily, and if you don't like what someone says, use the existing mechanisms like the Ignore list or do what I do (don't reply in the first place), then we're all good and nobody ever has to be "silenced", banned, or told to "STFU." Mods never have to get involved, threads never have to be closed, people are free to state their case and their convictions.
I've been here 13 years and we've had these little kerfluffles from time to time. We always get thru it and we always manage to keep working together for the same common goals, while agreeing to disagree on matters of faith and social issues.
FWIW, that's not what I was getting at. I'm not arguing for silencing Fly or anyone else, provided they're within forum rules (the first example I cited above, definitely was not). I'm arguing for VOLUNTARY civility: avoiding scapegoating, and stereotyping comments designed to intentionally troll or inflame a whole (very) large group of people that are a constituency here on M4c. That is most certainly designed to provoke, and against forum rules, but I'll leave the interpretation of that to Mods. My point is only, if you engage in civility voluntarily, and if you don't like what someone says, use the existing mechanisms like the Ignore list or do what I do (don't reply in the first place), then we're all good and nobody ever has to be "silenced", banned, or told to "STFU." Mods never have to get involved, threads never have to be closed, people are free to state their case and their convictions.
I've been here 13 years and we've had these little kerfluffles from time to time. We always get thru it and we always manage to keep working together for the same common goals, while agreeing to disagree on matters of faith and social issues.
Agreed
It seems like there have been many threads closed recently because 2-3 members refuse to stay on topic and enjoy antagonizing the rest of the membership with their views on "literally dozens of unrelated topics."
One small correction. But yeah, I get you.
Yeah, keep your religious views and abortion views out of GD unless the thread is specifically about either topic.
The individuals who cannot wrap their thinky thinky bits around this concept need a time out. Maybe the time out will allow their smooth brains to evolve a bit in the meantime.
I may not be current, but last I checked this forum was owned and operated by "church folks" and honestly they are being pretty christian in their toleration of us non religious folks. It's very, very easy to end up with a forum like Assault Web and they have resisted that temptation in remarkable fashion.
Sometimes I forget and I think most people understand my particular views of ancient beliefs, but saying they need to keep their stupid views to themselves is pretty intolerant in and of itself, especially if we are technically in their house.
So while I disagree with Tom on great and many things I try and keep in mind that he was probably specifically invited to the forum by those who run it. I also try not to get too worked up about disagreements, while we have them if we were at a BBQ gathering we'd probably get along just fine. Only the conversations would get more interesting because actual inflection would exist and it's easy to have polite debate when everyone understands how they are coming across.
I'm all for civility, and try hard to practice it. In cases where I've been ungracious/uncivil, I would gladly apologize. However, it would help me a lot, if folks would avoid rants like the following, scapegoating entire classes of people. I don't see how that helps our threads stay on topic, nor all of us in working together to preserve our 2A rights.
In fairness it should be noted that FF screws with everyone but not necessarily in an unfriendly way. I think if he was on a forum with 50 clones of himself he would have constant disagreements with himself.
Coal Dragger
11-14-20, 01:02
I should have chosen my words more wisely.
If someone wants to post a thread in GD about philosophy, religion, morals, or things of that nature I’m all for it. I was raised as a Christian and although I rarely attend church services I still have beliefs. I was perhaps inarticulately pointing out that not bringing up religious beliefs or religion based policy positions in a discussion not specifically dedicated to that topic might not be a great idea.
In a perfect world no one would get bent out of shape, but with a topic that sensitive even though it’s not supposed to be the center of the original discussion; often times it will take over a discussion online or in person. In my opinion, it is best left alone unless everyone understands going in that religion is going to be the topic.
I should have chosen my words more wisely.
If someone wants to post a thread in GD about philosophy, religion, morals, or things of that nature I’m all for it. I was raised as a Christian and although I rarely attend church services I still have beliefs. I was perhaps inarticulately pointing out that not bringing up religious beliefs or religion based policy positions in a discussion not specifically dedicated to that topic might not be a great idea.
In a perfect world no one would get bent out of shape, but with a topic that sensitive even though it’s not supposed to be the center of the original discussion; often times it will take over a discussion online or in person. In my opinion, it is best left alone unless everyone understands going in that religion is going to be the topic.
This. Agreed.
I come here for no non-sense straight up talk and info about current issues from intelligent people who view the world similarly to the way I do.
I enjoy reading the spirited posts from Tom, FF, and everyone else, and I find the ways that they express themselves to be interesting, informative, helpful, and entertaining at times. I want to know their views on religion, abortion and other controversial topics, but I don't want four pages of that in a thread that supposed to be on the election debauchery.
Rather than banning or silencing anyone, rather than turning the other cheek, I'd propose that after a few tangental back and forth posts, the parties interested in the tangental discussion take it to a new thread. Don't want to know about Disciple's views on the Bible and our society are? Stay out of that thread. Easy peasy. There are lots of thread titles I don't click on. Doesn't seem that difficult.
Everyone has their own "hot button" issues. Its up to each of us to not over run a thread because a button pusher pushed our button. Take your button and your button pusher to your own thread while I go make up some popcorn. And I invite anyone to remind me of my own advice here when my button gets pushed.
FF is the very definition of ass hat.
Y’all need to start making better use of the ignore function. It self cleans most of the ass hats, without needing moderator intervention.
See ass hat, ignore ass hat. Pretty simple.
FF is the very definition of ass hat.
Y’all need to start making better use of the ignore function. It self cleans most of the ass hats, without needing moderator intervention.
See ass hat, ignore ass hat. Pretty simple.
For you he is. I am sure we all have our least favorite posters.
FF is the very definition of ass hat.
Y’all need to start making better use of the ignore function. It self cleans most of the ass hats, without needing moderator intervention.
See ass hat, ignore ass hat. Pretty simple.
Meh, he's alright most of the time. He did kind of fly off the handle about the election results, which was sort of surprising.
FF is the very definition of ass hat.
Y’all need to start making better use of the ignore function. It self cleans most of the ass hats, without needing moderator intervention.
See ass hat, ignore ass hat. Pretty simple.
I disagree. To me, he’s endlessly entertaining. Reminds me of a few of my real world friends that say horribly dark things with an ironic detachment, just for laughs. Just assume he’s busting chops most of the time, and it puts much of what he says in a better light.
LoL, reminds me of this one buddy of mine: we were in a group of maybe 7-8, and he was saying something but being kinda long-winded about it. And you could literally see the exact point at which people started tuning him out, one by one, but he was still talking. Eventually enough of the group had tuned out that they started having a different conversation. Did my buddy get his feeling hurt? Nah. He turned to me and said “I think you’re the only one still listening to me. Hmm. I could say anything”. Then proceeded to tell a story about how he just started dating a 90 year old woman and described the sex in vivid detail. After about 30 seconds of this, everyone wondered what happened and why he and I were tearing up from laughing so hard. “What happened? What did I miss?”
What was really unfortunate about the "20/20 election" thread (happily reopened, thanks) and the "gun rights after the election" thread is it was completely off topic stuff that got them locked.
And what really makes me mad is the forum members who rather than ignoring or unsubscribing from the thread start wailing "lock the thread mods, lock the threads. it burnsss my eyes, I can't handle it".
Use the ignore function. Unsubscribe from the thread.
Being a mod is a thankless task. I've done it in other areas.
My view is they should happily and silently give people timeouts for posting off topic stuff, especially if it's contentious. And infractions, especially for personal attacks.
And we should report posts and members that are contentiously off topic or personal attacks to make it easier for the mods.
This whole "mods, you need to lock the thread" mindset to me is a uniquely M4C thing that is both sad and annoying.
If a mod decides it needs to be locked that's fine. It's the whining and wailing from members asking for the thread to be locked rather than just ignoring or moving on that hurts the forum and signal/noise more than it helps.
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