View Full Version : What really happened to Officer Sicknick?
FromMyColdDeadHand
02-15-21, 09:32
https://amgreatness.com/2021/02/14/the-new-york-times-retracts-the-sicknick-story/
The story never really jived with me. Either the details about it, or how lukewarmly the dems latched onto it. It always seemed like something that you could hang some charges on, but the dems never really stressed it.
Maybe there was a reason?
Now, the guy is dead, for sure. But what caused his death? Maybe you could say that he got hit so hard in the head that he didn't remember it. Maybe.
But now the cause of death is... bear spray? This along with two suicides by security are starting to getting really, really odd.
I almost feel like they are trying to set a 'Q' trap or something- or maybe they just got over their skiis. Maybe the idea that another security officer shooting an unarmed protestor being the only direct death wasn't going to fit their narrative. Sicknick was key to this narrative that this was evil and violent.
What the heck is going on?
PracticalRifleman
02-15-21, 09:38
Autopsy said he died of a stroke.
They are attempting, without proof, to attribute it to bear spray. They can’t prove that, and such a theory wouldn’t stand up to scrutiny.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z9V7gZtiztk
Good take on this topic.
FromMyColdDeadHand
02-15-21, 10:06
And of course this stopped the Pro-trump people from having a funeral parade around the lady that was shot... So the narrative is that the ultra violent Trump people lead to 5-7 deaths, when in reality it is that some literally jumped the gun and shot a lady...
What the heck is going on?
Same thing as usual. Our media telling us straight up lies and then burying those lies the next day with other made up garbage that they are peddling for that day.
Sad thing is that the people dumb enough to even be watching these 'news' channels believe the garbage most times because they are too lazy to consider fact-checking any of it.
90% of the people who know an officer died "know" that pro-Trump forces killed him and that his sacrifice prevented AOC's murder.
EDIT - Questioning the narrative surrounding his death does not disrespect him or his service.
Andy
just a scout
02-15-21, 10:55
Funny how they cremated his body so quickly...
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Funny how they cremated his body so quickly...
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AND will not release the autopsy results / records...
AND will not release the autopsy results / records...
It’s totally dirty, the democrats realized they murdered that woman, need a distraction. The really complicit ones are the media.
Funny how they cremated his body so quickly...
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Yup, that was wayyyy too quick
I'm sorry for officer Sicknick passing and his family's lost.
What I really want to know is, why we don't hear anything about Ashli Babbitt's death, other than she was executed at point blank. The killing was ruled justifiable. But we have not heard anything about her funeral, did they bury her or was she cremated? No interview with her husband.
dwhitehorne
02-15-21, 20:35
I'm sorry for officer Sicknick passing and his family's lost.
No interview with her husband.
I'm guessing the family doesn't want the media spotlight or the sudden IRS audit. David
PracticalRifleman
02-15-21, 20:38
I’m just sick of the politicians politicizing his death.
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Averageman
02-15-21, 21:10
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YeAo0FKlqMQ
More questions that answers...
Ok, at this point I'm kinda feeling "hands up, don't shoot" deva vu. It feels like they got "the story" and the facts can get swept under the rug if they ain't supportive.
I'm gonna assume this guy is a good old "workaday" cop. Good guy doing his job, Veteran, the whole 9. Absolutely sucks that he is dead. If you got evidence he got smacked down, hook em up. Charge em appropriately.
But the political ball games around this are off the charts. Rest in state, for an urn? Really? Interred at at Arlington? That's a hard place to get a table last I heard. Maybe it's not so tough for a niche, not sure.
And you know dang well if they were to suddenly find footage of an antifa or thug life matters type thumping on this poor guy he's gonna go from vic to abuser in record time.
FromMyColdDeadHand
02-16-21, 13:49
Like someone said, there are more cameras in the Capitol than Vegas, there is footage. Frankly, they aren't even claiming anymore that he was hit in the head. Someone needs to chase down that game of 'telephone' as to where it started.
As a side, this world'd most dangerous unarmed insurrection, I saw a piece where a MSMer claims that while they didn't use guns, they PLANNED on using guns. Kind of shoots the whole Trump inciting thing to smitherens.... But that they guns were going to be brought across the Potomac in boats???? WTF? Did they have check points going into DC looking for guns, on the morning of the 6th? Why pull a psuedo Washington on Deleware if you could have just brought them in?
I'm starting to realize why the DEms didn't want witnesses. They can control the narrative with the MSM. Trump's lawyers seemed very adept at poking holes in things.
What the heck is going on?
Did you really just ask that question? After all that has gone on, you don't know what's going on here?
WickedWillis
02-16-21, 15:05
I'm sorry for officer Sicknick passing and his family's lost.
What I really want to know is, why we don't hear anything about Ashli Babbitt's death, other than she was executed at point blank. The killing was ruled justifiable. But we have not heard anything about her funeral, did they bury her or was she cremated? No interview with her husband.
Openly verbally threatening to kill the VP was my understanding of the justification for lethal force regarding her death. Secret Service just have to say there was a threat, and that's the end of that story.
PracticalRifleman
02-16-21, 17:42
Openly verbally threatening to kill the VP was my understanding of the justification for lethal force regarding her death. Secret Service just have to say there was a threat, and that's the end of that story.
Weird. There are videos which do not show her screaming for his death.
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WickedWillis
02-16-21, 18:16
Weird. There are videos which do not show her screaming for his death.
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That's the narrative that's being pushed around it
So as long as we're wearing our tinfoil, something about the woman who got shot isn't adding up. Anyone with any medical training whatsoever would have immediately cut off the backpack and everything and started trying to find and plug holes. And when she lost consciousness and stopped breathing, they would NOT have simply said oh well she's dead. **** NO!!! They would have started doing CPR. That guy claiming to be a medic was obviously NOTHING of the kind, and all those cops should have had enough medical training to recognize he was killing her and step in and stop him. That was the most ludicrous shit show I've ever seen. Either he actually had medical training and he's guilty of gross negligence, or he had zero medical training and he's guilty of impersonating a medical professional. She obviously didn't lose enough blood for that to kill her, so it's probably highly likely she died of airway loss, which would have been easily preventable by doing any of several things they failed to but should have done as a matter of reflex.
So as long as we're wearing our tinfoil, something about the woman who got shot isn't adding up. Anyone with any medical training whatsoever would have immediately cut off the backpack and everything and started trying to find and plug holes. And when she lost consciousness and stopped breathing, they would NOT have simply said oh well she's dead. **** NO!!! They would have started doing CPR. That guy claiming to be a medic was obviously NOTHING of the kind, and all those cops should have had enough medical training to recognize he was killing her and step in and stop him. That was the most ludicrous shit show I've ever seen. Either he actually had medical training and he's guilty of gross negligence, or he had zero medical training and he's guilty of impersonating a medical professional. She obviously didn't lose enough blood for that to kill her, so it's probably highly likely she died of airway loss, which would have been easily preventable by doing any of several things they failed to but should have done as a matter of reflex.
There is a word for this sort of thing: Set-up. AKA: Being Clintoned.
Her and the officer that is the subject of this thread had to die to make it look like the "violent attack on the capital", the "insurrection", the "domestic terrorists that wanted to kill everyone" was all a really really bad deal. Now they can condemn Trump and anyone who supported him as violent criminals. That's YOU we are talking about in case you didn't know it, you violent, racist, criminal, coup attempting, legitimate government over throwing, domestic terrorist!
Autopsy said he died of a stroke.
They are attempting, without proof, to attribute it to bear spray. They can’t prove that, and such a theory wouldn’t stand up to scrutiny.
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That's an amazing number of people having strokes and infarcts for a relatively small group of people compared to other huge rallies and riots. Hmmmm.
PracticalRifleman
02-17-21, 14:37
That's an amazing number of people having strokes and infarcts for a relatively small group of people compared to other huge rallies and riots. Hmmmm.
I had read that the fatality rate was less than half the general population. You get crowds that big together, people are bound to die of natural causes. I get that the very ill don’t go to rallies, but then trying to pump up “death count” of people dying of natural causes is amazing.
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I can't help but notice that the left/media give zero s#!ts about police suicide until the can try to tie it to "right wing insurrection".
I had read that the fatality rate was less than half the general population. You get crowds that big together, people are bound to die of natural causes. I get that the very ill don’t go to rallies, but then trying to pump up “death count” of people dying of natural causes is amazing.
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Other than the one lady shot, they all died of non violent causes it appears. But I don't recall any such rallies that went south in recent memory where that many people fell over and died. Are Trump supporters more unhealthy than other rally attending population? It's all very weird.
Other than the one lady shot, they all died of non violent causes it appears. But I don't recall any such rallies that went south in recent memory where that many people fell over and died. Are Trump supporters more unhealthy than other rally attending population? It's all very weird.
Weren't there some suicides, too?
PracticalRifleman
02-17-21, 20:50
Other than the one lady shot, they all died of non violent causes it appears. But I don't recall any such rallies that went south in recent memory where that many people fell over and died. Are Trump supporters more unhealthy than other rally attending population? It's all very weird.
I think they happen and aren’t spoken of. I have been to political rallies in the past where people fell out and they were much much smaller than what happened at the Capitol. There was a rally in my town recently, maybe 4,000 people which a physician I work with rendered aide to a person that fell out. If it weren’t for him being involved, I’d never have heard about it. When you get up in the hundreds of thousands and of the demographics that the typical Trump people are, I think it’s inevitable. Just so happens the media can use those numbers this time to deceive the public in support of their evil agenda.
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HardToHandle
02-17-21, 21:01
Other than the one lady shot, they all died of non violent causes it appears. But I don't recall any such rallies that went south in recent memory where that many people fell over and died. Are Trump supporters more unhealthy than other rally attending population? It's all very weird.
I am attempting to be respectful and serious in my tone, but the numbers seem plausible if not artificially low to me as a former EMT and planning participant for dozens of large events.
I gather you do not have much experience in the pre-hospital care/EMS environment. Generally I have worked under the assumption of one heart attack transport an hour for every 15000 persons at large events. If it a hot day, various services may have 10 to 1 heat illnesses to all other medical causes. There are various charts and I recall a federal EMS support planning course dedicated to this many moons ago. That is why they have medical staff onsite at large events, to manage potential emerging medical issues when any large number of people gather. Good example being the Boston Marathon Bombing, which had a volunteer medical tent near the finish line to triage and treat ill persons attending the race without taxing local EMS resources.
One of my observations of the Jan 6 crowd makeup from the contemporary photos and videos of the Rally Crowd was the low amount of attributed deaths. There were a lot of older folks in that crowd, lots overweight/out of shape and a few that had hallmarks of sustained illegal drug use - many of whom were fired up emotionally. I might be wrong in all my glancing assessments of the crowd, but it is getting into Lizard People territory to try to infer questionable numbers on the random chance deaths. YMMV.
Weren't there some suicides, too?
I didn't read of any myself.
I think they happen and aren’t spoken of. I have been to political rallies in the past where people fell out and they were much much smaller than what happened at the Capitol. There was a rally in my town recently, maybe 4,000 people which a physician I work with rendered aide to a person that fell out. If it weren’t for him being involved, I’d never have heard about it. When you get up in the hundreds of thousands and of the demographics that the typical Trump people are, I think it’s inevitable. Just so happens the media can use those numbers this time to deceive the public in support of their evil agenda.
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That makes sense and likely.
I am attempting to be respectful and serious in my tone, but the numbers seem plausible if not artificially low to me as a former EMT and planning participant for dozens of large events.
I gather you do not have much experience in the pre-hospital care/EMS environment. Generally I have worked under the assumption of one heart attack transport an hour for every 15000 persons at large events. If it a hot day, various services may have 10 to 1 heat illnesses to all other medical causes. There are various charts and I recall a federal EMS support planning course dedicated to this many moons ago. That is why they have medical staff onsite at large events, to manage potential emerging medical issues when any large number of people gather. Good example being the Boston Marathon Bombing, which had a volunteer medical tent near the finish line to triage and treat ill persons attending the race without taxing local EMS resources.
One of my observations of the Jan 6 crowd makeup from the contemporary photos and videos of the Rally Crowd was the low amount of attributed deaths. There were a lot of older folks in that crowd, lots overweight/out of shape and a few that had hallmarks of sustained illegal drug use - many of whom were fired up emotionally. I might be wrong in all my glancing assessments of the crowd, but it is getting into Lizard People territory to try to infer questionable numbers on the random chance deaths. YMMV.
For dehydration/heat exhaustion generally. The race used to go right by my house and had EMT pals working it on the city side, etc. Obviously a different population, and as above, perhaps just simply not reported. Would be an interesting study, if not already done, how many per thousand people at large rallies die from an infarct related death.
It just sounded unusually high to me.
Weren't there some suicides, too?
Two cops punched their own tickets, days later. We're said to have been at Capitol and therefore "continued fallout of the insurrection". Not like they could have been kicked to the curb by the wife, or diagnosed with some evil death cancer, or any of the thousands of other reasons folks tap out over.
ETA: I also recall that some guy the fleebs were looking for in connection decided to tap out as well. Also days later.
Averageman
02-18-21, 10:03
So as long as we're wearing our tinfoil, something about the woman who got shot isn't adding up. Anyone with any medical training whatsoever would have immediately cut off the backpack and everything and started trying to find and plug holes. And when she lost consciousness and stopped breathing, they would NOT have simply said oh well she's dead. **** NO!!! They would have started doing CPR. That guy claiming to be a medic was obviously NOTHING of the kind, and all those cops should have had enough medical training to recognize he was killing her and step in and stop him. That was the most ludicrous shit show I've ever seen. Either he actually had medical training and he's guilty of gross negligence, or he had zero medical training and he's guilty of impersonating a medical professional. She obviously didn't lose enough blood for that to kill her, so it's probably highly likely she died of airway loss, which would have been easily preventable by doing any of several things they failed to but should have done as a matter of reflex.
I believe there were enough Antifa/BLM/Anarchists working in the crowd.
I believe these people were trained and staged in place that allowed them to derail some folks and amp up the tempo hoping it would go out of control.
I believe as a LEO, shooting through a door, or a window with the intent to kill is criminal.
I believe the people around the victim were actively working against a "Peaceful Protest" and were a part of a plan.
I believe Nancy Pelosi needes to answer some pretty tough questions and then be impeached and charged with treason. She Knew.
HardToHandle
02-18-21, 10:29
No intention to be a d-bag or to criticize Will, but there is real risk in these demonstrations/protests. We all love the First Amendment, but any big gathering of people is a potential disaster in the making. Whether Donald J Trump, BLM or Antifa, I do not think that risk calculus is often applied.
To Will’s specific questions, here are two scholarly works discussing patient presentation rates at mass gatherings:
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/15310046/
https://www.tandfonline.com/eprint/yxvtqiwxmiusi8k7gi7q/full
Washington DC is considered the best in the US at large event management. While folks may debate that, I have had training from US Park Police and MPDC personnel on large event management. There is a good Obama Inaugural article detailing EMS issues.
“Crews -- that include six EMS task forces -- handled 1,148 responses between 4 a.m. and 4 p.m. Personnel in first aid stations on the Mall treated 490 people, and transported 31.
Sen. Ted Kennedy was taken to Washington Hospital Center after suffering a seizure during the luncheon....
EMS crews were busy at the L'Enfant Plaza Metro station when several people required medical assistance after escalators broke down under the weight of the crowd. In addition to several suffering chest pains and difficulty breathing after climbing the stairs, others were complaining of heat issues, officials said.
A woman fell onto a Metro track near Gallery Place, but was not seriously injured.”
https://www.emsworld.com/news/10339793/crowds-cold-challenge-dc-responders-inauguration
Lots of other good debriefs on EMS World as well as resources on the HHS ASPR site - https://asprtracie.hhs.gov/technical-resources/85/mass-gatherings-special-events/0
No intention to be a d-bag or to criticize Will, but there is real risk in these demonstrations/protests. We all love the First Amendment, but any big gathering of people is a potential disaster in the making. Whether Donald J Trump, BLM or Antifa, I do not think that risk calculus is often applied.
To Will’s specific questions, here are two scholarly works discussing patient presentation rates at mass gatherings:
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/15310046/
https://www.tandfonline.com/eprint/yxvtqiwxmiusi8k7gi7q/full
Washington DC is considered the best in the US at large event management. While folks may debate that, I have had training from US Park Police and MPDC personnel on large event management. There is a good Obama Inaugural article detailing EMS issues.
“Crews -- that include six EMS task forces -- handled 1,148 responses between 4 a.m. and 4 p.m. Personnel in first aid stations on the Mall treated 490 people, and transported 31.
Sen. Ted Kennedy was taken to Washington Hospital Center after suffering a seizure during the luncheon....
EMS crews were busy at the L'Enfant Plaza Metro station when several people required medical assistance after escalators broke down under the weight of the crowd. In addition to several suffering chest pains and difficulty breathing after climbing the stairs, others were complaining of heat issues, officials said.
A woman fell onto a Metro track near Gallery Place, but was not seriously injured.”
https://www.emsworld.com/news/10339793/crowds-cold-challenge-dc-responders-inauguration
Lots of other good debriefs on EMS World as well as resources on the HHS ASPR site - https://asprtracie.hhs.gov/technical-resources/85/mass-gatherings-special-events/0
Good intel, thanx! I was focused specifically on the route/manner of death in my Qs, and expect falls, dehydration, crush injuries, etc. But, also sounds like the numbers from this event not a major difference from other events of a similar nature. I will check out some of those sources you provided also.
FromMyColdDeadHand
02-18-21, 12:22
And now it comes out that the plastic hand-cuffs weren't brought to the Capitol to try to facilitate taking hostages, but rather they were govt plasticuffs that were left out and the protestors picked up to prevent their use. Pretty cool souvenir too..
Pretty much everything that we've been told about that day by the MSM is false. I don't see why the Antifa angle is any different. Those were not TEA Party tactics.
I think the chances of a 9/11 style commission are slim to none based on what we already know. The DEms would rather this stew in the shadows, rather than get the light of truth destroying their narrative.
just a scout
02-18-21, 13:30
Good intel, thanx! I was focused specifically on the route/manner of death in my Qs, and expect falls, dehydration, crush injuries, etc. But, also sounds like the numbers from this event not a major difference from other events of a similar nature. I will check out some of those sources you provided also.
Having worked many special events, concerts, etc. I can tell you I’ve seen everything from heart attacks, strokes, rapes, overdoses, gunshots and stabbings, delivered a couple babies, and everything else you can imagine. It’s was just another two days in the ghetto, compressed into 8-12 hours.
Even car accidents needing extrication tools in the parking lot.
Concerts and special events are great training grounds for new paramedics.
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Grand58742
02-18-21, 13:48
I think the chances of a 9/11 style commission are slim to none based on what we already know. The DEms would rather this stew in the shadows, rather than get the light of truth destroying their narrative.
I think you're wrong on this one. Pelosi and Schumer will push this issue because how dare the people make their voices heard?
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