View Full Version : Building a non-firing BCG?
Diamondback
04-02-21, 17:15
I'm toying with the idea of building an inert BCG for teaching admin handling, thinking to make it inert by shortening the firing pin. (Idea being to take enough off the FP that only God Himself could hit it hard enough to fire, leaving just enough to hold the BCG assembly together.) If this proceeded, the BCG would of course be marked with safety red or orange to indicate Non Firing status.
Two questions:
1. Are there any potential pitfalls I'm overlooking? I'm well aware that "just because you COULD doesn't mean you SHOULD," and the idea is something where I can tell a student "prove you can handle the four rules and the TTP's with dead metal before we graduate you to Live Iron."
2. IF this idea gets past Question 1... well, three parter: first, what would y'all suggest for a cheap BCG? Second, how much would I need to take off for an "Un-Firing Pin"? Third, if I spritz the BCG with Krylon will it still leave enough room for it to fit and cycle without flaking off and leaving crap that needs to be cleaned out before switching to a live BCG and heading to the range?
Defaultmp3
04-02-21, 17:24
If it's admin handling, why not just remove the firing pin completely?
Alternatively, be truly safe and get a Sim bolt or the SIRT bolt; the latter can be useful for other things.
You could shorten and re-finish a standard firing pin by a quarter-inch and it will look very close to standard. Weld the firing pin hole in the bolt face shut, drill a short hole in the front (not going through the weld), then have it finished.
A good Samaritan can't make it functional with a new firing pin unless he replaces the complete bolt.
Diamondback
04-02-21, 18:14
If it's admin handling, why not just remove the firing pin completely?
Alternatively, be truly safe and get a Sim bolt or the SIRT bolt; the latter can be useful for other things.
Good points--my recollection (which admittedly could be wrong) was the FP literally holds the entire bolt/carrier assembly together; I want the lesson to include charging/racking/clearing and the SIRT module specifically indicates "not for racking."
Thanks, guys.
chamber143
04-02-21, 19:16
Good points--my recollection (which admittedly could be wrong) was the FP literally holds the entire bolt/carrier assembly together; I want the lesson to include charging/racking/clearing and the SIRT module specifically indicates "not for racking."
Thanks, guys.
There may be some sort of simulations bolt but I don't think I would modify anything and train with it like that cause a freak incident could happen. Idk if removing the firing pin would impede charging of the weapon. I just would not in any way try to do what you are talking about no matter how inert it may be. Shit happens and if you remove the shit before it happens, then it can't happen.
Good points--my recollection (which admittedly could be wrong) was the FP literally holds the entire bolt/carrier assembly together; I want the lesson to include charging/racking/clearing and the SIRT module specifically indicates "not for racking."
Thanks, guys.
Well the cam pin would rotate freely and could fall out (if well-worn) without the firing pin in place.
Double tap.
What is with this place the last couple of days? It acts like it doesn't take your post then it turns out it did or even double taps.
The little "nib" on the end of the firing pin is all that protrudes out of the bolt face. The rest of the pin is too big to fit. You could simply grind that off and be done. You should be able to paint the bolt except for the rails on the bottom and be fairly safe from transfer in the rifle for handling purposes.
Alternatively you could leave the FP out. Cam pin won't fall out while the BCG is in the rifle, and it ain't like it's gonna see the high bolt speeds of a firing cycle. Another marking option would be to only paint or mark as INOP in the recessed area of the bolt carrier for the ejection port cover.
I saw a red anodized aluminum bolt carrier once. I have no idea what it was for or how you might find one but it would be great for this purpose.
I can see Sinister's point regarding FP replacement by others in a large user group. That's a ton of work for a training device though. (OK, not really. I could do it in less than an hour. But I have all the tools at hand, YMMV) This isn't going into the rack like this is it? I would think it would be much simpler to "control custody" of the training device.
Diamondback
04-03-21, 10:06
I can see Sinister's point regarding FP replacement by others in a large user group. That's a ton of work for a training device though. (OK, not really. I could do it in less than an hour. But I have all the tools at hand, YMMV) This isn't going into the rack like this is it? I would think it would be much simpler to "control custody" of the training device.
No, it's not--in fact, anything not in the Ready Rack I store as separated upper/lower assemblies. I'm not a pro instructor, and even though I have ambitions of NRA Instructor certs I prefer to work with one or two people at a time, usually only friends/family. (Though in college I had one class so horrible that as a "wrap party," all 20 of us decided to head to the range and conduct an experiment on ballistic protection from textbooks since Prof. Painintheass insisted on a book not eligible for buyback.)
Sounds like chop the skinny part, maybe just paint the recess and mark it "INOP" is the Easy Button here. Thanks, guys!
For SHOT Show, most tables cut the firing pin down in the manner you mention above. If it is going to be a "demo only", why not paint it orange while you are at it? That way there is no question about what is being used.
Alternatively you could leave the FP out. Cam pin won't fall out while the BCG is in the rifle, and it ain't like it's gonna see the high bolt speeds of a firing cycle. Another marking option would be to only paint or mark as INOP in the recessed area of the bolt carrier for the ejection port cover.
Just for giggles you should try this out in your rifle (leaving the firing pin out), cycle it by hand several times and then report back to us after you try to remove that carrier and reinstall the firing pin.
If that cam pin turns while you are performing this experiment (and it will), you will have a problem. The sort of problem that would make you want to kick my ass for suggesting you do such a thing...
Would not suggest nubbing an otherwise good firing pin either if I only wanted to make it inoperable for a short period of time.
Dry fire gadget.
https://www.creedmoorsports.com/product/ar-15-m16-rifle-dry-fire-device/Parts-and-Accessories
Just for giggles you should try this out in your rifle (leaving the firing pin out), cycle it by hand several times and then report back to us after you try to remove that carrier and reinstall the firing pin.
If that cam pin turns while you are performing this experiment (and it will), you will have a problem. The sort of problem that would make you want to kick my ass for suggesting you do such a thing...
Already tried that as a result of this thread. Do not recommend.
Already tried that as a result of this thread. Do not recommend.
Surprised that 'advice' was not called out sooner. Would have saved you and possibly others a headache.
Diamondback
04-03-21, 18:43
Cam pin having undesirable rotation was the very FIRST thought I had about trying to hand-cycle without an FP. Snap-caps are a simple "single point" solution, but I'm a "suspenders-AND-belt" kinda guy. Have a primary safety, and then a failsafe--for example, on a 1911 I'm penciling out I'm thinking combining the Colt Series 80 FP block AND the Springfield light-pin/heavy-spring combo, AND reverting to the older-style "positive capture" half-cock notch.
Creedmoor gadget looks promising, as does their 10%-off Easter sale; I had a hundred bucks of books and crap loaded into a cart before I knew what all I'd looked at. LOL
Surprised that 'advice' was not called out sooner. Would have saved you and possibly others a headache.
It was a good April Fools prank, I'll give 'em that.
If you can scrounge a bolt, I will send you a carrier (rough bore, eats gas rings).
Andy
If you can scrounge a bolt, I will send you a carrier (rough bore, eats gas rings).
Andy
That would be even cooler if you have a friend with a mill to turn it all in to a cut away.
Obviously the cutaway cool factor would go up with a crapped out barrel & upper.
That would be even cooler if you have a friend with a mill to turn it all in to a cut away.
Obviously the cutaway cool factor would go up with a crapped out barrel & upper.
I have a dremel...
you could dremel off the front end of the firing pin about 4mm and it should not fire.
I'd be tempted to powder coat the carrier red or orange so you know it's not gonna go BANG when you need it.
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