Next step for reliability upgrade

[Ruark]

I have a 2016 S&W M&P 15 Sport that has served me well as a ranch gun and "nightstand AR." Not a lot of fancy furniture: Streamlight, quad rail, red dot, muzzle brake/compensator, etc. Last year I did some reliability upgrades. By "reliability," I mean, "if my life depended on that 10,000th round going off." So far it's been some trigger work, a Sprinco Orange buffer spring (good for 1.5 million cycles), Sprinco Heavy Duty extractor spring (200,000+ cycles), an L J H2 buffer, and a Wolff Extra Power hammer spring.

Alan at Sprinco did a great job of setting me up with the spring/buffer combo after I used his form for analyzing the ejection path. Now it's dead-on at 4 o'clock, and much smoother to shoot. Target re-acquisition is noticeably faster, and holy crap, this baby is reliable. It'll shoot till the cows come home.

I changed to the Wolff Extra Power spring after the stock hammer spring took a slight "set" from being stored in a cocked condition (round in chamber, safety on) for several years and started producing an occasional light strike. Problem solved, but I'm not sure about the lifespan of that Wolff EP spring. Just to be optimal, I'm storing it in an uncocked condition, at least for now.

Any suggestions for a next step for reliability enhancement? I thought about replacing the BCG, but it's my understanding that the M&P BCGs (including the extractor) are about as well built as a BCG can be. The ejector spring seems solid. Anything else you would upgrade? Note I'm focusing on reliability here - "that 10,000th round going off," not cosmetics, accuracy, or what spare parts to have on hand. Those are different things.

Right now I'm thinking about the gas ring, maybe a JP Enhanced.... thoughts?

[Joe Mamma]

Any suggestions for a next step for reliability enhancement? I thought about replacing the BCG, but it's my understanding that the M&P BCGs (including the extractor) are about as well built as a BCG can be. The ejector spring seems solid. Anything else you would upgrade? Note I'm focusing on reliability here - "that 10,000th round going off," not cosmetics, accuracy, or what spare parts to have on hand. Those are different things.


You've done a lot more than I would have done. In my humble opinion, the first area I would focus on for AR15 reliability would be the extractor spring and related parts: extractor, extractor spring, spring insert (if you use one), and O-ring (if you use one).

I think you should figure out what combination of these parts work in your gun. Then, get spares of the same extractor spring you are using (same brand, same number of coils, etc.), along with spare inserts and O-rings if you use them. Also, probably get a few extra extractor pins.

If you really want to be confident and don't mind spending the money, get a few extra extractors (all the same brand at the same time). Test one of them to make sure it works in your gun with the same extractor spring/insert/O-ring setup you want to use.

Personally, I would have a spare bolt (with all of these parts already installed) ready to go.

Joe Mamma

[Straight Shooter]

I have a 2016 S&W M&P 15 Sport that has served me well as a ranch gun and "nightstand AR." Not a lot of fancy furniture: Streamlight, quad rail, red dot, muzzle brake/compensator, etc. Last year I did some reliability upgrades. By "reliability," I mean, "if my life depended on that 10,000th round going off." So far it's been some trigger work, a Sprinco Orange buffer spring (good for 1.5 million cycles), Sprinco Heavy Duty extractor spring (200,000+ cycles), an L J H2 buffer, and a Wolff Extra Power hammer spring.

Alan at Sprinco did a great job of setting me up with the spring/buffer combo after I used his form for analyzing the ejection path. Now it's dead-on at 4 o'clock, and much smoother to shoot. Target re-acquisition is noticeably faster, and holy crap, this baby is reliable. It'll shoot till the cows come home.

I changed to the Wolff Extra Power spring after the stock hammer spring took a slight "set" from being stored in a cocked condition (round in chamber, safety on) for several years and started producing an occasional light strike. Problem solved, but I'm not sure about the lifespan of that Wolff EP spring. Just to be optimal, I'm storing it in an uncocked condition, at least for now.

Any suggestions for a next step for reliability enhancement? I thought about replacing the BCG, but it's my understanding that the M&P BCGs (including the extractor) are about as well built as a BCG can be. The ejector spring seems solid. Anything else you would upgrade? Note I'm focusing on reliability here - "that 10,000th round going off," not cosmetics, accuracy, or what spare parts to have on hand. Those are different things.

Right now I'm thinking about the gas ring, maybe a JP Enhanced.... thoughts?

NEGATIVE on changing the gas ring man-100% unnecessary. Total waste of money & time.
The Wolff spring will last you the rest of your life.
Youre about as good as that rifle can get, not a knock on the rifle, its just to me, goal accomplished.

[Ruark]

You've done a lot more than I would have done. In my humble opinion, the first area I would focus on for AR15 reliability would be the extractor spring and related parts: extractor, extractor spring, spring insert (if you use one), and O-ring (if you use one).

I think you should figure out what combination of these parts work in your gun. Then, get spares of the same extractor spring you are using (same brand, same number of coils, etc.), along with spare inserts and O-rings if you use them. Also, probably get a few extra extractor pins.

If you really want to be confident and don't mind spending the money, get a few extra extractors (all the same brand at the same time). Test one of them to make sure it works in your gun with the same extractor spring/insert/O-ring setup you want to use.

Personally, I would have a spare bolt (with all of these parts already installed) ready to go.

Joe Mamma

Thanks, Joe. I fully understand and agree with your advice, and indeed I DO have some spare parts, but again, I'm focusing on the reliability of what's installed, not what spare parts to have available. Sort of like focusing on the most dependable tires on your car, and not the quality of your spare tire. Again, thanks.

[Ruark]

NEGATIVE on changing the gas ring man-100% unnecessary. Total waste of money & time.
The Wolff spring will last you the rest of your life.
Youre about as good as that rifle can get, not a knock on the rifle, its just to me, goal accomplished.

Thanks, but how do you figure? I've read numerous reports of gas rings failing after 2,000 - 3,000 rounds, and I've read that optimally they should last 6,000 - 8,000 rounds before replacement.

[Straight Shooter]

Thanks, but how do you figure? I've read numerous reports of gas rings failing after 2,000 - 3,000 rounds, and I've read that optimally they should last 6,000 - 8,000 rounds before replacement.

Brother- reality check. Do you HAVE that much ammo? Can you afford that much ammo? Will you EVER actually shoot that much ammo?
EVEYTHING "fails" at some point. That JP ring? Itll fail at some point too. If youve got quality rings in there..and keep them lubed...you gonna be AWHILE before you need new ones.
Last set I bought from a known source was like $3 & change. Im all about building durability into my weapons, but at some point it becomes a waste of time & money when youve done all thats actually needed. Ive got a 13 year old LMT Defender thats got a shit ton of rounds thru it...the rings are fine, looked at them recently.
About 11 or so years ago- after the original RS started losing length..I put in a RED Sprinco & never looked back. I think Ive changed the Sprinco extractor springs once..after several years & many rounds. It was running fine...but I did it as a precaution.
And Ive so many Wolff springs in so many rifles & pistols for DECADES now...and I know how good they are. Got about 3 now using them. Youll never wear it out.
Im telling you..buy some good mags and load up on whatever ammo you can, youve got the rifle gtg in my opinion.

[TomMcC]

Thanks, but how do you figure? I've read numerous reports of gas rings failing after 2,000 - 3,000 rounds, and I've read that optimally they should last 6,000 - 8,000 rounds before replacement.

Just buy some spares to have on hand. 2-3k isn't that many rounds on gas rings. Before the ammo drought of 20-21, I was shooting 2-3k a year and never had a gas ring failure. If the BCG is built right they should last a good while.

You might want to lay in a good amount of PMAGS or good GI type mags. A good mag is really important to reliability.

[jackblack73]

It sounds like you’re trying to build a rifle where you don’t have to do anymore maintenance for 10,000 rounds. Instead, I would just inspect the gas rings while cleaning every now and then (doesn’t have to be excessively cleaned) and replace when needed.

[1168]

That Sprinco Orange might last forever (or not) but does the weapon cycle reliably while dirty?

[turnburglar]

My recipe for a reliable AR is as follows:

1. BRT barrel OR gas tube. Proper gas port sizing is important for not only smoothness but reliability as well.

2. 5 coil extractor spring and sometimes the donut insert.

3. spring co white or white hot buffer spring behind a H2 buffer.

4. Pmags or the tan follower Gi mags.

I have a 10.5" and a 16" set up this way and they are fantastically smooth shooters that have never skipped a beat.

[17K]

The ONLY extra power springs I would even consider are a Sringco extractor spring.

I would use a stock carbine spring with an H2 or H3, or a stock rifle spring and an A5H2 or 3.

The stock hammer springs are stout and will reliably light any primer in any ammo good enough to trust your life to.

[Joe Mamma]

Thanks, Joe. I fully understand and agree with your advice, and indeed I DO have some spare parts, but again, I'm focusing on the reliability of what's installed, not what spare parts to have available. Sort of like focusing on the most dependable tires on your car, and not the quality of your spare tire. Again, thanks.

Sorry Ruark, you're right. For some reason, I didn't finish my thought in what I wrote. I meant to say replace your current extractor/spring setup (what is in your gun now) with the new parts you buy. Test the new parts to make sure they work together, and if they do, keep them in the gun. Since you bought multiples, you will have identical spares that you know work.

I know this might seem wasteful to some, but that's why I said "if you don't mind spending the money."

Joe Mamma

[JediGuy]

I like what you are doing, but if you are focused on utter reliability, having a spare bolt handy that can immediately be dropped into your carrier if the other one breaks seems like the best insurance.

Like though you bought the best tires, you know that sometimes a pothole screws up your day, so your spare isn’t just a spare but a full size wheel that will run forever until you get to Discount Tire to get a new tire to use on your original wheel as the new “spare.”

[markm]

Any suggestions for a next step for reliability enhancement?

You've cleaned up a few problems for sure in their buffer parts. We fixed a BUNCH of failures on one of those guns that a guy brought out to shoot with us. The mag catch actually broke on his. The buffer roll pin walked out and was raking the action spring. I might consider replacing the entire Lower parts kit.

[MegademiC]

I'm a big fan of the sprinco blue with an h2.
Might be overkill, but I like the balance of mass and force.

For carbine springs, stick with known good ones like colt.

Only other suggestion would be a spare bolt, also from a known quality source