View Full Version : Current events and your CCW weapon
Have mulled this over for a couple years but this recent spate of shootings (certainly no worse than others have been) has me seriously reconsidering my CCW options. This FedEx thing last night and the thought of facing a semi-auto/30rd rifle with a handgun kind of jerked me out of complacency.
I've always been a "smaller is better" kind of guy with regards to a CCW choice; not meaning caliber mind you, but physical size. This last decade+ it's been 9mm with 147gr HST. Be it the likes of a Glock 43, P365, S&W Shield, Walther PPS M2, etc. you get my drift. Sure, the Ruger LCP is soooo easy to just drop in the pocket of your comfy summer shorts for a quick run up to the gas station, but it's only a .380.
I have carried the Glock 19 before but I prefer IWB and it isn't the most slim or compact of pistols for that mission. Not horrible mind you, but it reminds you it's there. The Glock 19 (especially it's capacity) is the direction I'm thinking in this CCW "epiphany". The only drawback I see is the aforementioned relative comfort. However, 15rds of ammo beats 6 or 7.
That leads me to a choice which is dependent on an "odd-man-out factor": the magazine. I like the thought of the Glock 43X with 15rd Shield Arms magazines. The pistol itself feels good in the hand and is nice and slim. The Shield Arms mags offer Glock 19 capacity but aren't the proven OEM mags the 19 uses, so there's that. Plus, those Shield Arms mags are $70+ if you can find them (company is perpetually out of stock and Gunbroker is your only resort). Assuming the mags are thoroughly vetted and tested I might look in the general direction of a Glock 43X + 15rd mags.
Thoughts?
Inkslinger
04-16-21, 20:39
Comfort is last on my list when it comes to CCW. My edc is a G19 with RMR and a surefire. I carry it in an AIWB sidecar with a 15 in the gun and 17 for a reload. I don’t find it to be horribly uncomfortable, but ymmv. I also don’t find it hard to conceal. I’m pretty fit, and I don’t have a problem wearing a form fitting shirt. There are very rare occasions where I’ll carry a G43 with a reload.
I have a 48 with shield magazines. I have a 15 and 2 x 20’s. I typically just carry with the 15. I ran them through a Bob Keller 2 Day Advanced Pistol Operator Course three weeks ago- 800 rounds through 3 magazines and zero issues of any kind.
The most important part of your equation is you and your ability to be rigorously honest about your capabilities. 25 yards looks pretty damn close off the range. Put a target up at 25 and see what you can do static with your carry gun.
Indian > Arrow. Training over everything.
I know a local guy that told me he is really liking the 43x + Shield Arms mags and he does shoot a lot.
Limited testing, but so far a used ETS 12rds G43 mag I picked up from a 2nd hand bin out of curiosity followed a factory new one have been reliable with a couple hundred semi wad cutter handloads if you still have a 43.
All the "any gun is better than no gun" stuff aside, you gotta decide where comfort ranks on your list, and what "enough" is as far as capacity. I did the micro 9mm game (for me it was a Kahr), I got into a G43, but the Sig is a game changer, and the capacity and form factor made me sell the G43 and pick up a pair of 365s
I havent found a way to be comfortable with a G19 and 15+1, but a P365XL with 12+1 or 15+1 might be a good spot to sit at (yeah, mags are $50, but they have a lot higher round count reliability track record than Shield Arms).
New Shield Plus or Hellcat are also bringing a lot of capability to the table as well. Im not saying the G19 isnt the best option, but you have a lot more alternatives than you did a few years ago.
Give it a year for recalls to get cleared and the Ruger Max 9 may be a good option.
ViniVidivici
04-17-21, 04:32
Forget comfort. Clint Smith said something like "it's not there to be comfortable, it's there to comfort you". As in the comfort of knowing you have a decent fighting pistol, as opposed to something else.
Been carrying a G23, G17, or G19 for YEARS, nary a problem concealing, with good holsters. 1911s before that.
G19 is actually one of the more concealable fighting pistols out there. That's what I'm employing most these days, in a JMCK AIWB rig. Concealed, and I can meet the 2 second standard with it any time.
You can carry it with a 19 round mag in, and a 21 rounder for spare. I do it all the time.
The late unpleasantness makes me think BUG, extra mags, possibly soft armor. Solid fighting pistol? Been there for a while....
You'll feel better once you're there too. And train like hell with it. Shoot real drills, meet standards, learn to truly fight with it. Run it close-in, at retention. Integrate combatives with its use. Practice running to cover, then engaging.
All of that is more easily done with a duty pistol than a mouse gun.
Mainly a Glock23 but sometimes I switch out the barrel for a Glock32 one and carry 357 Sig....
Extra mag as well...but also carry a knife or two
I have a 48 with shield magazines. I have a 15 and 2 x 20’s. I typically just carry with the 15. I ran them through a Bob Keller 2 Day Advanced Pistol Operator Course three weeks ago- 800 rounds through 3 magazines and zero issues of any kind.
The most important part of your equation is you and your ability to be rigorously honest about your capabilities. 25 yards looks pretty damn close off the range. Put a target up at 25 and see what you can do static with your carry gun.
Indian > Arrow. Training over everything.
Yes, the 48 with Shield Arms mags is another option. It basically gives you Glock 19 ballistics with a slimmer profile, so win-win. [note I stopped short of saying it was essentially a skinny Glock 19]
The 48/43X route is one I may pursue. I have 8 of the 15rd Shield Arms mags I accumulated and since the $$$ has already been spent my path may be set.
Why not the 365xl? Mags are available AND cheaper than the Shield Arms.
If you already have the 365 I believe you can play mix and match with slides and frames.
My CCW has always been a duty size gun. When I started carrying I didn't know any better. I assumed all guns were that size. Started with Ruger P89 then Taurus's Beretta 92 copy, Korean P51 (forget actual name) there was a S&W 5906, 4506, 4566, Sig 226, 220.....you get the idea. It's been G19 for a while now with a few exceptions. However, after picking up both Sig 365 versions I'm probably going to switch to the 365xl for some of summer's activities
Sent from my moto z4 using Tapatalk
I’ve been using a 17 cut for 19 mags (username checks out:rolleyes:) since ‘07 or so. I think it’s the best balance of concealment and firepower/shoot ability as a 17 has always been a noticeable improvement over the 19 in every way for me.
I have also been pretty heavy on the Glock 43 since ‘15 and have been pretty impressed by it’s accuracy capabilities but it is a little bitty thing and is not as tolerant of bullet shape and modification as the double stack ones.
How much are you gonna need when you need it? Nobody knows.
I went to the 365 for easy run to the gym or grocery store trips. Any other time it's a 365xl with rmr. Mags aren't the cheapest, but osage County guns usually has them for mid to high 30's.
Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk
About this time last year I switched from a VP9SK to carrying a G45. I had been having some ergonomic issues with the VP9SK for a while. The gun was very reliable, but with the 10-rd mags it never felt completely “secure” in my hand while shooting, and with the extended 13rd mags it pinched the shit out of my pinkie finger. So I had bought a G48 with the intention of making that my new carry gun. Not long after I also acquired a G45 in a trade.
At the time there was still talk of supply chain disruptions and potential for attendant civil unrest. So eventually I started thinking I wanted more firepower on tap and switched my focus from the G48 to the G45, vetted the gun to my satisfaction, and started carrying it exclusively last April. The Covid-related unrest never materialized aside from the toilet paper shortage, and the beginnings of a run on ammo but I had developed a liking for the G45.
Then came the riots of summer. Quite often in hot weather I’ll opt to pocket-carry my J-Frame, but with things the way they were in the summer of 2020 I ended up just carrying my G45 all year. Between spreading unrest, not having to be as mindful about concealability because I wasn’t going out in public as much, and the fact that the ammo panic had really gotten into full swing and I couldn’t get .38 Special to practice with, I didn’t bother with the J-Frame at all.
So my decision to up the ante with regard to my carry gun was motivated in large part by concerns of being outgunned if society went to shit I guess. Which, considering I live in one of the safest states, and one that experienced almost zero civil unrest, was maybe a bit alarmist on my part. But I also legitimately like the G45 a lot.
EDIT: double tap, again.....
I'm not worried about "society going to shit," whatever that means. I'm worried about a multi-gangster jacking or jugging, or a mass shooter in a grocery store.
I'm not doing anything new, but here's what I do:
Glock 17 with one spare mag, whenever possible: suit coat, winter jacket, big shirt. Total 35 rounds.
When I can't carry the Glock 17, I carry a P365, with one spare 15 round magazine. Total 26 rounds.
And in the car is a Sub 2000 and two Glock stick mags loaded to 30 rounds each.
No games with .40 or .45; I want 9mm because it is just as effective and can be shot faster and more can be carried.
No piddling around with revolvers. Five or six shots and you're done.
G26 with a 12 round mag is like a bob tailed G19 in my opinion. I carry the 26 aiwb with a 15 round spare in the sidecar holster.
I'm so lazy about carrying. I don't get out and about much at all. I haven't carried my pistol in forever. I used to be fanatical about it.
I’ll throw a curveball in this discussion and ask what’s your real mission? Do you need something to keep you and yours in your immediate vicinity safe? Or do you expect to be the hero and go hunting down a dude shooting fish in a barrel in the other room or across the building? Are you really up to that job?
And part two, what’s the aftermath? Do you have enough funds or carry insurance to cover court costs? Will you be viewed as the good guy or not? Are you ok with risking everything for people you don’t know and may not really appreciate what you did or the level of work you put in to have the skill to be able to solve that issue?
Even living in Texas, I’m at the point of questioning whether even doing the right thing, gets me hemmed up with the current societal “standards” we live in. I question whether the court system will even care what is right and either roll me up in the process or impact me financially, my employment, my FREEDOM, etc. I used to be all gung ho about hunting down a bad guy in an active shooter situation. Now, not so sure about that. Pretty sad state of reality TBH.
Regarding the hardware, it’s either a G19 or G26 because those are my only options and only what I train with. And it’s 99.9% of the time a G19 for training and carry for me. But that’s not a decision relating to my perceived mission. It’s just simply because it’s what I have, and have carried for a long time, and I have no issues concealing it AIWB.
Look for this Summer to be even “livelier” than last.
Have been carrying a CZ P10c with RD with spare 20 rd. Or a P365 with spare 15 rd. concealed.
OWB with loose shirt is STI with spare 20 rd.
I packed a 5" gov't model 45 acp for 25 years (off duty). With the right belt & holster you can carry anything comfortably. I made the switch to 9mm M&P's when they first were introduced. Much lighter & I shot them just as well as my trusty 45. Bought the single stack Shield when it first came out. Carried it plus spare mag for two years but never was comfortable with the capacity. I guess I prefer enough firepower to end the situation or break contact.
Anyway, FF a few years & my EDC rotates between a M&P compact (15 rd) with two spare 17's on the belt. Or a Beretta compact (15rd) with two 18's on the belt. (sometimes a 3rd mag in a snagmag holder in my pocket). Both with RDS. I'm a bigger guy so big guns are not hard for me to carry or conceal.
As was said, I'm more focused on multiple criminals attacking in packs. I've seen upwards of 15+ do home invasions or just on the street. Maybe I'm overloaded but an empty gun is just an expensive club.
Carry what your comfortable with (that includes spare ammo) & shoot the best. I'll wager no one who survived a gunfight ever said "I wish I had brought less ammo".
I mostly carry the Glock 43x with the Shield Arms SA15 15 rd mags these days. This combination has been 100% reliable for me.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cjkbIHx-yzw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZn0SHN52i8
I’ll throw a curveball in this discussion and ask what’s your real mission? Do you need something to keep you and yours in your immediate vicinity safe? Or do you expect to be the hero and go hunting down a dude shooting fish in a barrel in the other room or across the building? Are you really up to that job?
And part two, what’s the aftermath? Do you have enough funds or carry insurance to cover court costs? Will you be viewed as the good guy or not? Are you ok with risking everything for people you don’t know and may not really appreciate what you did or the level of work you put in to have the skill to be able to solve that issue?
Even living in Texas, I’m at the point of questioning whether even doing the right thing, gets me hemmed up with the current societal “standards” we live in. I question whether the court system will even care what is right and either roll me up in the process or impact me financially, my employment, my FREEDOM, etc. I used to be all gung ho about hunting down a bad guy in an active shooter situation. Now, not so sure about that. Pretty sad state of reality TBH.
Regarding the hardware, it’s either a G19 or G26 because those are my only options and only what I train with. And it’s 99.9% of the time a G19 for training and carry for me. But that’s not a decision relating to my perceived mission. It’s just simply because it’s what I have, and have carried for a long time, and I have no issues concealing it AIWB.
Staying alive, be it an active shooter scenario or being pulled from my vehicle to be beat on.
I live out in the sticks, but work in the city M-F. I don't go to rallies or protests, and if I knew there was trouble brewing I'd avoid the area. Avoiding trouble is the first priority in the "plan". That said, sometimes trouble finds you. Be it an active shooter when I go to Publix for my weekly shopping or being trapped on a freeway as traffic stacks up around and behind you by assholes intentionally blocking the road. I doubt I'd actively pursue a mass-shooter, but instead seek an escape route. Obviously that may not be possible, so then you'll have to deal with it or die (and still might anyway). And I'll NEVER be pulled from my vehicle and beat on by some crowd of scum.
The old-fashioned robbery at an ATM or Quickie Mart is still a possibility (that hasn't changed) but the mass shooter and riot situations have me rethinking things [again].
I'll also say this regarding the riot situation: the ramifications of defending yourself in that scenario these days is no doubt not pretty. At the time of the incident I can assure you that my wife's and mine survival will be foremost and will dictate my actions, consequences be damned. If an attempt is being made to drag me out of my vehicle and be beaten to a pulp by a rabid crowd simply because of the color of my skin I will promise you that my house, retirement, job, etc. will NOT be my first concern. I'll just leave it at that.
Carry a comprehensive First Aid kit in your vehicle. Be prepared to live in your vehicle for one week. Weapon selection is important, but these factors are critical.
Tomahawk_Ghost
04-18-21, 00:40
If you find yourself in a bad situation you are going to have to fight with what you have on you. "Truck guns" need to be secured. Had a family member shot by a gangster who had a gun stolen from a cop's car of all things. When they are secured they are harder to get into action. If you are at the park with your kids and some asshole comes walking up dressed like the Joker carrying a shotgun it a very long run back to the minivan to get your fighting gun. Find something that works for you and go with it. Keep an eye out for trouble and avoid if possible
ViniVidivici
04-18-21, 00:48
Carry a comprehensive First Aid kit in your vehicle. Be prepared to live in your vehicle for one week. Weapon selection is important, but these factors are critical.
Absolutely, food, water, shelter, IFAK, minimal tools. Hell, I carry 3 ways to make fire too.
Remember that ugly scene during Rodney King, the lone truck driver? I am not going down like that.
Think of how that would have played out if he'd lit that crowd up with 17 rounds of 9mm,reloaded, and laid down another 19....methinks on the 2nd reload, the crowd might've dispersed a bit...
My lighter carry is a 43X with a factory ten round mag, with a spare ten rounder, AIWB. As a note, the shorter barrels on the 43X and G26 make them tip outboard a little on me, a problem that can rectified by a longer holster. I’m also a hair squishy so that doesn’t help.
My normal carry is a G19, with a 15 rounder, and a spare 22 rounder. I also just have a Sub2K and spare happy sticks a lá Firefly, nicely packaged in a sweet messenger bag with an IFAK, TQ, gloves, bandana and a few other goodies I won’t mention. This bag is in case I have ditch my vehicle and evac on foot in a “contested” area.
Eurodriver
04-18-21, 07:58
Nobody cares. Let’s talk gear instead.
Why not the 365xl? Mags are available AND cheaper than the Shield Arms.
If you already have the 365 I believe you can play mix and match with slides and frames.
My CCW has always been a duty size gun. When I started carrying I didn't know any better. I assumed all guns were that size. Started with Ruger P89 then Taurus's Beretta 92 copy, Korean P51 (forget actual name) there was a S&W 5906, 4506, 4566, Sig 226, 220.....you get the idea. It's been G19 for a while now with a few exceptions. However, after picking up both Sig 365 versions I'm probably going to switch to the 365xl for some of summer's activities
Sent from my moto z4 using Tapatalk
Based on the models you listed, during that time frame that really was about it for 9×19 and up cartridges. Smaller off the shelf full power pistols that I can recall were some AMT models and early Kahrs that were steel frame and close to the weight of alloy frame versions of full size pistols. I think Keltec had the first lightweight compact 9mm, but the trigger was truly staple gun level followed by the .40 S&W version that was just about always unreliable.
This is how I roll when I go to the mall.
https://i.imgur.com/MFdAIBW.jpg
Based on the models you listed, during that time frame that really was about it for 9×19 and up cartridges. Smaller off the shelf full power pistols that I can recall were some AMT models and early Kahrs that were steel frame and close to the weight of alloy frame versions of full size pistols. I think Keltec had the first lightweight compact 9mm, but the trigger was truly staple gun level followed by the .40 S&W version that was just about always unreliable.
S&W had their Chief's Special 9mm semi autos. I think they were called 3913?!? Keltec P11 I think you're thinking of. G26. I guess the Sig 239 maybe. It's "small" in the sense that it's smaller than the 226 and other full size guns of it's day but it's really about the same size as a G19
There's probably one or two other guns but I just don't remember ever even seeing any of them. I'm sure I just glanced right over them but all I can remember what was available was G19 - G17 size guns.
Sent from my moto z4 using Tapatalk
This is how I roll when I go to the mall.
https://i.imgur.com/MFdAIBW.jpgYou're supposed to have your mask over your nose!
Sent from my moto z4 using Tapatalk
S&W had their Chief's Special 9mm semi autos. I think they were called 3913?!?
No, the DA/SA Chief Special 9mm was called the CS9, it had a 3" barrel and 7 round magazine. It is actually smaller than the 3913 which had 3.5" barrel and 8 round magazine. The 3913 and its Ladysmith version were shortened versions of the full size 39 single stack. For size comparison, the 3913 actually fits in a S&W Shield holster perfectly. The 3913 weighs just under 25 ounce while the Shield weighs just under 21 ounce. I'm talking about the gen 1 shield with the 7 and 8 rounds magazines. Outside of nostalgia, the Shield make more sense than either the CS9 or 3913. And now you have the Shield Plus that hold 10 or 13 rounds, depending on the magazine.
After taking a low light, no light defensive pistol class a couple of years I’m a proponent of having a light on my CCW in addition to having a hand held light. With my aging eye I find a RDS extremely useful.
My current preferred CCW is a G43X MOS slide with Holosun 507K and Ameriglo Bold front sight on a standard G43X lower with a Streamlight TLR6, NDZ mag release and SA 15rd mags with 147gr HST in a G-Code INGOG. Suits me much better than my G19 with RMR and TLR7 for daily use, although the TLR6 isn’t the brightest.
I just got the new Surefire XSC Micro yesterday. Once I get a compatible holster that for the MOS XSC combo that will replace the current lower half.
Lots of dry fire practice and having the ability to shoot and move on a 25 x 25 yard range help too.
I carry my CZ P07 "Roland Special". The only thing I switch out if I am in just a T shirt or button up shirt with tails out is that I will use the 15 round mag in the pistol verse the 19 round mag.
I think this is a serious pistol that will allow me to deal with anything I come up against.
This FedEx thing last night and the thought of facing a semi-auto/30rd rifle with a handgun.
I am curious if there is any kind of evidence that handgun's capacity is important in that ^^^ kind of situation.
My buddy fully vetted that Glock with the after market high cap mags, and he loves it. I have been running the Sig P365XL with RDS. I feel that 15+1 and slim configuration is perfect for me. I still like my M&P Shield but lacks round count.
I too have felt an increased need to be more cognizant of my CCW activities with increased shootings and increased flood of Illegals in AZ. They are busing illegals from the border and just dropping them in a park in Ajo AZ. Halfway from Mexico to Phx, its insane. They just bus and DROP, no food, no extra clothes, no jack squat and what do you expect these people to do. Its insane.
PB
I’ll throw a curveball in this discussion and ask what’s your real mission? Do you need something to keep you and yours in your immediate vicinity safe? Or do you expect to be the hero and go hunting down a dude shooting fish in a barrel in the other room or across the building? Are you really up to that job?
And part two, what’s the aftermath? Do you have enough funds or carry insurance to cover court costs? Will you be viewed as the good guy or not? Are you ok with risking everything for people you don’t know and may not really appreciate what you did or the level of work you put in to have the skill to be able to solve that issue?
Even living in Texas, I’m at the point of questioning whether even doing the right thing, gets me hemmed up with the current societal “standards” we live in. I question whether the court system will even care what is right and either roll me up in the process or impact me financially, my employment, my FREEDOM, etc. I used to be all gung ho about hunting down a bad guy in an active shooter situation. Now, not so sure about that. Pretty sad state of reality TBH.
Regarding the hardware, it’s either a G19 or G26 because those are my only options and only what I train with. And it’s 99.9% of the time a G19 for training and carry for me. But that’s not a decision relating to my perceived mission. It’s just simply because it’s what I have, and have carried for a long time, and I have no issues concealing it AIWB.
It really really sucks that we have to be very careful about doing anything but trying to get you and yours out of harms way due to a potentially over zealous court system. Can you imagine hitting a bystander, even if you didn't kill them, your hosed. I'm almost ashamed to think of leaving victims to slaughter but I cant leave my home fatherless either. AZ is pretty gun friendly but no court Sytem is 100% gun friendly and could cost you everything. It really sucks.
PB
The meanest G34 you have ever seen with the cleanest G45 money can buy and a lot of mags loaded with Gold Dots to include some G18 mags. Gas tank full every day.
Plus my usual bag of tricks.
pointblank4445
04-18-21, 17:43
I’ll throw a curveball in this discussion and ask what’s your real mission? Do you need something to keep you and yours in your immediate vicinity safe? Or do you expect to be the hero and go hunting down a dude shooting fish in a barrel in the other room or across the building? Are you really up to that job?
A respected industry guy and former LE and former mod here gave a very candid take in a recent podcast. Pretty much, unless he could "screw the muzzle into the bad guy's ear" he wouldn't assume to do any "hunting" and his priority is him and his own...no more, no less. Liability issues noted, he raised a valid point that likely as not, you would be engaged by the first responding uniformed officers*.
*(assuming police response continues as such in the post-Columbine tactics way) Given the attempts to reduce "warrior" training, inevitable lowering of hiring standards and reduced candidate pools to meet minimal staffing, and other impending ripples from the current climate may very well cause unforeseen changes in rapid response tactics.
If you already have the 365 I believe you can play mix and match with slides and frames.
Sent from my moto z4 using Tapatalk
I have a Sig P365, and recently bought a XL frame (frame only) at Optics Planet.
I moved the trigger mechanism and the P365 slide to the XL frame to build something like a Sig P365X. It works great, better grip, and still a compact gun that one can even pocket carry.
12+1 with a spare 12 or 15 rounds magazine.
Nobody cares. Let’s talk gear instead.
I read your post before you edited it. What was wrong with it? You hit on the non-gear subjects, certainly as important. I alluded to those in my last post. All part of the equation.
Since when are you shy? :secret:
S&W had their Chief's Special 9mm semi autos. I think they were called 3913?!? Keltec P11 I think you're thinking of. G26. I guess the Sig 239 maybe. It's "small" in the sense that it's smaller than the 226 and other full size guns of it's day but it's really about the same size as a G19
There's probably one or two other guns but I just don't remember ever even seeing any of them. I'm sure I just glanced right over them but all I can remember what was available was G19 - G17 size guns.
Sent from my moto z4 using Tapatalk
The 3913 pre-dated the Chief's Special line of handguns.
Inkslinger
04-18-21, 18:16
I read your post before you edited it. What was wrong with it? You hit on the non-gear subjects, certainly as important. I alluded to those in my last post. All part of the equation.
Since when are you shy? :secret:
Nobody jumped on his post to give him “attaboys” quick enough.
I am curious if there is any kind of evidence that handgun's capacity is important in that ^^^ kind of situation.
Not sure about "evidence" per se, but common sense dictates that if you have 15rds as opposed to 7rds it at a minimum gives you the ability to keep his head down longer as you hopefully di di mau the fvck outa there!
Evel Baldgui
04-18-21, 18:32
Given the current social environment; circumstances, training, fitness, and location determine the individuals equipment and response. I'm a minimalist. EDC is simple and easy while walking to work, wandering about the city, going to restaurants, grocery shopping, and the like. EDC is G19 RMR aiwb and spare 17 rd mag in left pocket, fixed blade iwb left, Bic lighter, small flashlight, plus usual keys/ wallet /cell phone. All carried comfortably on person, shirt always untucked so concealment is easy. I have two residences, so I drive from the city to the outer outer suburb twice per week. In my vehicle is a small discreet sling bag with water bottle, two spare 30 rd mags, ear pro, eye pro, gloves, small first aid kit, baseball cap, and multitool on top of very light weight black zip-up hoodie. I also carry actual AAA maps of the areas between both homes, as they are 40 miles apart. Nothing is a carried in my vehicle, if it has to be abandoned for whatever reason, grab the sling bag, hoodie and go. Vehicle docs like registration and insurance are carried in wallet. If untoward situations arise, I avoid the areas whenever possible. Highway protest/ blocks? I stay in the city and go back following weekend, and vice versa. Lets say riot scenario, severe social unrest arises,
and am caught in traffic, alternate route sought. Rioters engulf cars, grab bag and leave, join crowd with raised fist and and shout whatever slogan and disappear from crowd. All hell breaks loose and am physically attacked, well that's what the spare mags are for. IF things get really tense and dangerous in my locale, may add pepper spray, smoke to sling bag and a bike helmet. But that sounds extreme :-)
I’ll throw a curveball in this discussion and ask what’s your real mission? Do you need something to keep you and yours in your immediate vicinity safe? Or do you expect to be the hero and go hunting down a dude shooting fish in a barrel in the other room or across the building? Are you really up to that job?
And part two, what’s the aftermath? Do you have enough funds or carry insurance to cover court costs? Will you be viewed as the good guy or not? Are you ok with risking everything for people you don’t know and may not really appreciate what you did or the level of work you put in to have the skill to be able to solve that issue?
Even living in Texas, I’m at the point of questioning whether even doing the right thing, gets me hemmed up with the current societal “standards” we live in. I question whether the court system will even care what is right and either roll me up in the process or impact me financially, my employment, my FREEDOM, etc. I used to be all gung ho about hunting down a bad guy in an active shooter situation. Now, not so sure about that. Pretty sad state of reality TBH.
Regarding the hardware, it’s either a G19 or G26 because those are my only options and only what I train with. And it’s 99.9% of the time a G19 for training and carry for me. But that’s not a decision relating to my perceived mission. It’s just simply because it’s what I have, and have carried for a long time, and I have no issues concealing it AIWB.
I’m in a different predicament. I will be specifically targeted. All of my stuff (that I will admit to) is 9mm centric as it is the du jour round in my area. I am prepared for large crowds and swarms and potentially limited access to my longarms/SMG.
I have chemical irritants and other less lethal crowd dispersal devices but it’s going to be sporty to get away. I just want sheer violence of action try to get the crowd to lose its stomach because as big as I am; I simply cannot fight 50 people.
My main thing is that I don’t go out so much and limit who knows what.
Really you just want to be the not worth the trouble to swarm on.
That’s what happens is the swarm.
Used to I would be happy with a G19.
Now I carry heavier stuff and travel with my real friends.
Traveling with two other adult males will make you less of a walking lick.
At work, God help them.
Carry the highest capacity you can hide
Train to make the fastest most accurate shots possible, 0-100yds
Current events haven't changed any of this for me.
Evel Baldgui
04-18-21, 19:38
Also to note, the current social norms are, for lack of a better term politically sanctioned violence, a common term in use now. Self defense may not be that at all. YOU may or will be considered the 'bad guy' not the blm/antifa scumbag that's threatening you. The best way to deal with these instances of social unrest should you unfortunately find yourself in one, is just leave and avoid confrontation if at all possible. Everyone has a 'line in the sand" ... where is yours ? When you do cross it, don't get caught.
G26 with a 12 round mag is like a bob tailed G19 in my opinion. I carry the 26 aiwb with a 15 round spare in the sidecar holster.
I’ve been known to carry a G26 with two G17 reloads when wanting to ‘go lite’.
And, two 33 rd ‘happy sticks’ are in the door pocket of my twuk:).
FWIW - I’ve won man-on-man shootoffs using the G26 with happy stick reloads!!!!!! Pissed off some folks , but wasn’t technically against the rules. Kinda like the street:)
geezer john
I read your post before you edited it. What was wrong with it? You hit on the non-gear subjects, certainly as important. I alluded to those in my last post. All part of the equation.
Since when are you shy? :secret:His post was very relevant but more people than not dont have the time, money and space for that. I can go running, I can go shooting but I can't go run and shoot. Places like that don't exist here.
Sent from my moto z4 using Tapatalk
I’ll throw a curveball in this discussion and ask what’s your real mission? Do you need something to keep you and yours in your immediate vicinity safe? Or do you expect to be the hero and go hunting down a dude shooting fish in a barrel in the other room or across the building? Are you really up to that job?
And part two, what’s the aftermath? Do you have enough funds or carry insurance to cover court costs? Will you be viewed as the good guy or not? Are you ok with risking everything for people you don’t know and may not really appreciate what you did or the level of work you put in to have the skill to be able to solve that issue?
...
Excellent questions. I have been asked that before by a few people I know. Years ago my answer was 'It would really depend on the situation itself.'
Now I have a son and I don't expect myself to be the good guy going after or tracking down the bad guy.
I have a short carry history, only 5 years now. I started with a single stack Springfield XDS seven rounder. I quickly yearned for more capacity and now carry a Springfield XD Mod 2 with a flush fit 13 round mag and carry a backup 13 rounder.
A long time ago, I was running towards a house and got hit in the rifle. The rifle saved my life, but it was DOA. When I got up to the house I dropped my piece of junk rifle and transitioned to my Hi Power and entered the house.
Gun fight ensued.
We won, they didn't.
I later was doing research with an other officer and we interviewed every civilian in Israel, that was in a gun fight with terrorist. One ultra Orthodox man with a Star PD and 6 rounds total disrupted a terrorist take over of a bus. One dead terrorist on the spot and the others fled.
My father in law was the subject of a kidnap attempt by terrorist, he was able to break contact and get away. His pistol a Beretta 32 caliber .
As I have said I now carry my CZ P07 Roland Special most of the time. I used to carry for just running round a Glock 26 with plus 2 so 13 rounds in the pistol and a magpul 21 round for back up. I would fight the bad guys no mater which pistol I had with me.
I watched a youtube on the Beretta 71 a .22 cal pistol that was used back in the day, long before my time. An ElAl sky marshal fought off a terror attack with 4 terrorist armed with AK47's and grenades. He later was part of the take over of the Sabena plane that was hijacked to Tel Aviv. In both incidents he killed terrorist with his .22 cal Beretta.
It is the size of the fight in the man, that many times carries the day.
Not sure about "evidence" per se, but common sense dictates that if you have 15rds as opposed to 7rds it at a minimum gives you the ability to keep his head down longer as you hopefully di di mau the fvck outa there!
From what I observed in events that have been reported in open sources, pistol users didn't get too many chances to sling a lot of lead against determined rifle users. I dunno if I am going to prioritize something that I could use to lay down a suppressive fire vs something that would allow me to hit their head at beyond just a contact distance. For some these two somethings could be all the same, for others they may differ.
This is not much different than
A respected industry guy and former LE and former mod here gave a very candid take in a recent podcast. Pretty much, unless he could "screw the muzzle into the bad guy's ear" ...
except maybe thinking of screwing the muzzle into the ear from a bit afar.
Leaveammoforme
04-19-21, 01:21
A long time ago......
Man...reading your posts....as you add tidbits of your career here and there...You've had a wild ride. Good stuff.
ViniVidivici
04-19-21, 02:07
This is how I roll when I go to the mall.
https://i.imgur.com/MFdAIBW.jpg
That's that SAS guy in Kenya a while back that went in first and alone to get hostages out and smoke check muldoons while the local yokels stood around bein' perplexed.
Absolute bada$$.
Man...reading your posts....as you add tidbits of your career here and there...You've had a wild ride. Good stuff.
The family members that are just a bit older than me had the wild rides. I don't remember what Jewish holiday it was but a bunch of us were sitting together in the sun on the porch.
Oldest brother in law was part of the putting down of Gaza in 1968, it was crazy. He also fought in 6 day war, Yom Kippur war, and first war in Lebanon.
Next oldest brother in law in Yom Kippur war was part of a recon unit that just disappeared for a while and about 3 weeks after the end of the war they walked back to Israeli lines.
Cousin took part in the big tank battles on Golan in 73, he had multiple tanks blown out from under him.
One more cousin was at Entebee and Sabena .
We all fight because we have no choice. Israel turned 73 this last week, we no longer face nation states around us that want to kill us all and rape the women. Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Lebanon will not go to war with Israel in the near future. But we still face a threat, today it is Iran and it's proxies.
The ride is worth, the price of a ticket.
I have had the honor to serve with some of the best people ever, to have mentors that would be like having Aaron Bank and Charlie Beckwith as mentors.
The people I have met from the USA units that we had contact with, are some of my best friends.
The family members that are just a bit older than me had the wild rides. I don't remember what Jewish holiday it was but a bunch of us were sitting together in the sun on the porch.
Oldest brother in law was part of the putting down of Gaza in 1968, it was crazy. He also fought in 6 day war, Yom Kippur war, and first war in Lebanon.
Next oldest brother in law in Yom Kippur war was part of a recon unit that just disappeared for a while and about 3 weeks after the end of the war they walked back to Israeli lines.
Cousin took part in the big tank battles on Golan in 73, he had multiple tanks blown out from under him.
One more cousin was at Entebee and Sabena .
We all fight because we have no choice. Israel turned 73 this last week, we no longer face nation states around us that want to kill us all and rape the women. Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Lebanon will not go to war with Israel in the near future. But we still face a threat, today it is Iran and it's proxies.
The ride is worth, the price of a ticket.
I have had the honor to serve with some of the best people ever, to have mentors that would be like having Aaron Bank and Charlie Beckwith as mentors.
The people I have met from the USA units that we had contact with, are some of my best friends.
Yes, that's one wild ride ! All the best to you and your family.
His post was very relevant but more people than not dont have the time, money and space for that. I can go running, I can go shooting but I can't go run and shoot. Places like that don't exist here.
Sent from my moto z4 using Tapatalk
There are a ton of uspsa matches in your area. And a range close to where I think you are that allows it for pistols. PM me and I can give you a list if interested.
I've been carrying a P365XL with a RMR and an extra magazine and given recent events I haven't had any 2nd thoughts about my choice of weapon.
My threat environment hasn't changed. As a result my carry choices have not changed. Mostly my 3-1/2" 1911 and a spare mag. Otherwise my SP101 and a speed strip or two.
My highest risk is working. Then I am generally flying regularly, and aboard .gov installations so I'm ****ed for personal arms. If trouble finds me without a firearm, there is expedient weaponry pretty much everywhere. Creativity, good decision making skills, and a willingness to be the most violent and ruthless man on the scene can go a long way.
As was mentioned earlier, you need clarity of mission. If you find yourself involved in a mass casualty event, stick to your mission. If you ain't the Cavalry don't go acting like the Cavalry. Your mission is to survive, you and yours. If you go "hunting" you expose yourself to the bad guy, the aforementioned Cavalry, and anyone else on the scene. Evac if you can, otherwise stay put and find cover, be inconspicuous, and engage the bad guy "with great vengeance and furious anger" if he comes to you.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.