View Full Version : Muzzle Device Shimming - How Much is Too Much
Doing a 13.7 build. I have a Wilson three prong I really like and want to use on this build. It is 1.99 inches. I would have to shim this thing .31 inches to make length. I've got about .62 worth of threads on the end of the barrel to play with. Advisable or no?
jackblack73
09-28-21, 18:11
Your math isn’t working out. You’re looking to be about an inch short. You’re not taking into account the overlap.
Your math isn’t working out. You’re looking to be about an inch short. You’re not taking into account the overlap.
.93 less the crush washer to be exact.
Your math isn’t working out. You’re looking to be about an inch short. You’re not taking into account the overlap.
.93 less the crush washer to be exact.
I actually am. The overall length of the muzzle device is 2.4 ish. Taking into account the overlap reduces the effective added length to 1.99 which also aligns with Wilson's spec.
1.99 + 13.7 = 15.69 leaving me .31 to shim
.31” is a lot of shim.
I’d consider a different MD that would require minimal shim.
El Vaquero
09-28-21, 19:13
Too much for my preference. Look at the Surefire Closed Tine as an option or the Closed Tine Warcomp version. Might get you there.
I had a 14.5 barrel cut down and the closed time Warcomp pin and welded on. Can’t remember how much he cut off to make it 16” overall. I think it was at least a 1/2” that was cut off.
Thanks. You guys are confirming what I suspected to be the case. I do like the NOX but will also check out those suggested. Stupid NFA.....
Get a shim piece that size and see how it looks and how the thread engagement feels. I’ve stacked three crush washers to get the look I needed for pics, and then fired it. No longer term info, but there really wasn’t a need in my case.
Get a shim piece that size and see how it looks and how the thread engagement feels. I’ve stacked three crush washers to get the look I needed for pics, and then fired it. No longer term info, but there really wasn’t a need in my case.
One of my ideas was to cut an aluminum spacer to .31" and then put the crush washer on top of that and time it. I'm going to have to pin and weld it anyway so........ Or I could just stop being a cheap ass and spend the hundy on a NOX.
I really like my WC three prong, I wish I had a pile of them. However, the real one I wish I had more of is the BE Meyers M249F, thats my favorite extended beast.
I wish they still made the M249F. Or any other alternative for that matter. I have the WC on a 10.5 inch gun now and really like it. And for the price they are dam hard to beat too. However the 10.5 is destined for a can so going to pull the WC off of that one and try and put it on this 13.7 if I can make it work. This is an "I found a barrel on sale so why not try it" build.
I wish they still made the M249F. Or any other alternative for that matter. I have the WC on a 10.5 inch gun now and really like it. And for the price they are dam hard to beat too. However the 10.5 is destined for a can so going to pull the WC off of that one and try and put it on this 13.7 if I can make it work. This is an "I found a barrel on sale so why not try it" build.
BE Meyers sold their technology to JP, as far as I can tell this is the new M249F. But I don't know when it was introduced, nor have I ever used it to compare with my existing M249F. The M249F is my favorite as well, but alas I only have one.
https://www.jprifles.com/buy.php?item=JPFH-556L
BE Meyers sold their technology to JP, as far as I can tell this is the new M249F. But I don't know when it was introduced, nor have I ever used it to compare with my existing M249F. The M249F is my favorite as well, but alas I only have one.
https://www.jprifles.com/buy.php?item=JPFH-556L
Only $60 to boot! Supposed to be the most effective flash hider on the market, according to that big TTAG test they did a few years ago.
Lots of options to consider here. Thanks Gents.
El Vaquero
09-29-21, 16:57
When I was figuring out my situation I ended up purchasing one of these. https://www.wingtactical.com/firearm-parts/ar-15-parts/muzzle-devices/strike-industries-1-2-28-jam-nut/
Decided on not using it after doing some research. Can’t remember all of the reasons I found to not use it but they were something like strength, as the muzzle device isn’t biting on as many threads, and maybe accuracy. . There was nothing I remember that was grave about doing it. I just decided to error on the side of caution.
Deadman William
09-29-21, 16:59
does drastically gapping out a muzzle device from the crown not adversely affect ballistics? seems like a third of an inch of bare thread and gap between the crown and the muzzle device would be an invitation for walking zero, over many rounds.. but it's not something ive researched or heard many opinions on. i guess because nobody gaps their muzzle devices out a third of an inch...
does drastically gapping out a muzzle device from the crown not adversely affect ballistics? seems like a third of an inch of bare thread and gap between the crown and the muzzle device would be an invitation for walking zero, over many rounds.. but it's not something ive researched or heard many opinions on. i guess because nobody gaps their muzzle devices out a third of an inch...
I would think there is a natural gap between the inside of the muzzle device bore and the crown. If not you would be timing the device against the crown which could damage it (instead of against the crush washer.) Not sure on what, if any, impact increasing that gap could have.
When I was figuring out my situation I ended up purchasing one of these. https://www.wingtactical.com/firearm-parts/ar-15-parts/muzzle-devices/strike-industries-1-2-28-jam-nut/
Decided on not using it after doing some research. Can’t remember all of the reasons I found to not use it but they were something like strength, as the muzzle device isn’t biting on as many threads, and maybe accuracy. . There was nothing I remember that was grave about doing it. I just decided to error on the side of caution.
I understand the concept, but like you, don't think I like that for a muzzle device. What's to keep the jam nut from working it's way loose?
Deadman William
09-30-21, 13:00
What's to keep the jam nut from working it's way loose?
the pinned and welded muzzle device, no?
the pinned and welded muzzle device, no?
But if it's pinned and welded then why do you need the jam nut? I was actually thinking in terms of non pinned and welded applications.
Deadman William
09-30-21, 16:13
But if it's pinned and welded then why do you need the jam nut? I was actually thinking in terms of non pinned and welded applications.
to give you the spacing flexibility you need. im not endorsing this option, just answering your question. i wouldnt want a visible gap between the shoulder and the muzzle device. but i also wouldnt want a third of an inch gap anywhere. that would give you less than half of the available thread engagement, and... the gap. not acceptable, to me. id be using a longer barrel or a longer muzzle device.
to give you the spacing flexibility you need. im not endorsing this option, just answering your question. i wouldnt want a visible gap between the shoulder and the muzzle device. but i also wouldnt want a third of an inch gap anywhere. that would give you less than half of the available thread engagement, and... the gap. not acceptable, to me. id be using a longer barrel or a longer muzzle device.
It's not acceptable to me either. On any application. That's why I said it wasn't an option I would choose.
titsonritz
09-30-21, 18:50
How much is too much? That's too much.
Only $60 to boot! Supposed to be the most effective flash hider on the market, according to that big TTAG test they did a few years ago.
I wrote JP and asked about those flash hiders and they confirmed they are indeed the M249F they bought from BE Meyers.
Hi,
We've purchased the IP to their design and have incorporated it into the 2 flash hiders you mention.
Hope this helps.
Adam Burt
General Manager
JP Enterprises, Inc.
I wrote JP and asked about those flash hiders and they confirmed they are indeed the M249F they bought from BE Meyers.Nice. About as close to zero flash as it gets. And for a fraction of the M249F cost. I looked around and they're available for a few bucks under MSRP at a few different sites.
I understand the concept, but like you, don't think I like that for a muzzle device. What's to keep the jam nut from working it's way loose?
Proper installation & torque.
Proper installation & torque.
We've all seen what can happen to unstaked castle nuts.....
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