View Full Version : I Think I Just Bought a 1903 - Range Results in last post.
I got an email from a vendor with a discount code, and noticed they had a "woodless" 1903 with a good bore for $400. I think I sprained my shoulder pulling my CC out of my wallet to place the order.
It is a Springfield, (edit) built in 1930, a bit newer than my Dad's 1921 dated '03 I that I returned to military configuration and was subsequently gifted.
They are closed on the weekend, so I have to wait until Monday to see if I was the first buyer. Wish me luck.
Andy
P.S. I still have the cut-down scant stock from my Dad's rifle and may just run it like that.
Cool. Restoring 1903s can be a lot of fun. Or a huge headache. Sometimes, both.
Cool. Restoring 1903s can be a lot of fun. Or a huge headache. Sometimes, both.
My Dad's was both.
I have been half-heartedly looking for a drill rifle to re-build, hopefully this is a better starting point.
Andy
An update - the rifle (barreled receiver?) arrived at my LGS but the cannot transfer it yet because the seller didn't include a copy of their FFL.
It is a real mixmaster: 1930 SA receiver, 1942 SA barrel (bore looks good), non-sculpted rear sight collar, Remington marked parkerized or matte blue milled TG, blued but silver worn floorplate, and CC parkerized bolt.
I will replace the poor quality CC bolt. The magazine disconnect is loose - I am pretty sure I have the parts to fix it on hand.
If I buy a NS bolt body and $100 military stock/HG, I will be right at its resale value. On the other hand, a high SN number 1903 with a good bore in a military configuration will be a fun shooter.
Andy
If it does not have a PG stock it is just a shoulder mangler .
If it does not have a PG stock it is just a shoulder mangler .
Yep, my Dad's 1903 has a straight stock. I know it was the most used stock by far but I am not a fan.
The action is currently sitting in the cut scant stock that came with my Dad's rifle and the comb height seems perfect. If I understand, the C (full pistol grip) and scant (semi pistol grip) stocks have a longer LOP and higher comb/less drop than the straight grip stocks. Unfortunately the C stocks are harder to find and the scant stocks are kinda ugly.
I am certain the gun is a mix master that someone assembled. The barrel (SA 42) has a great bore but has pitting under the outside finish, I assume it was re-parked after rusting. The rear sight collar is the late style without lightening cuts and I thought only Remington used them. Remington TG, SA action and barrel. Bolt provided was a very crudely machined Commercial Controls (CC) unit.
I guess I can look at it as being spared the need to keep it "correct".
Andy
m1a_scoutguy
01-19-22, 12:15
Wow, sounds cool Andy! You found just what I want, a mix master with a solid receiver, that's what I wanted cus I didn't want to feel bad about taking a complete rifle and wreaking havoc with the "History" of it, that's all ya need to bring it back and have a great rifle. Depending on what you have laying around & your needs there is no shortage of good 1903 parts out there. I took a basic receiver and went way overboard but it turned into one of my finest rifles & then like a dumb ass I traded it to a buddy that bugged me for a year, LOL By overboard I mean I had a Krieger BBL installed had an EGW scope mount installed and then had the action bedded I also had a Leupold VXIII 4x14x50 scope on it,, man what a rifle! The buddy I traded it to lives in Missouri now and shoots out to 800++ yards with it and holds his own with rifles costing twice as much,LOL Like I say lots of parts out there, CMP Forum, I saw a NIW BBL last week on another Forum and just in general lots of places have parts & pieces, I also got a lot of goodies @ my local gun show when they were going. Keep us posted on when she is ready for the range,I'll be interested in how she shoots for ya.
https://i.imgur.com/6zN5SCR.jpg?1
Wow, sounds cool Andy! You found just what I want, a mix master with a solid receiver, that's what I wanted cus I didn't want to feel bad about taking a complete rifle and wreaking havoc with the "History" of it, that's all ya need to bring it back and have a great rifle. Depending on what you have laying around & your needs there is no shortage of good 1903 parts out there. I took a basic receiver and went way overboard but it turned into one of my finest rifles & then like a dumb ass I traded it to a buddy that bugged me for a year, LOL By overboard I mean I had a Krieger BBL installed had an EGW scope mount installed and then had the action bedded I also had a Leupold VXIII 4x14x50 scope on it,, man what a rifle! The buddy I traded it to lives in Missouri now and shoots out to 800++ yards with it and holds his own with rifles costing twice as much,LOL Like I say lots of parts out there, CMP Forum, I saw a NIW BBL last week on another Forum and just in general lots of places have parts & pieces, I also got a lot of goodies @ my local gun show when they were going. Keep us posted on when she is ready for the range,I'll be interested in how she shoots for ya.
https://i.imgur.com/6zN5SCR.jpg?1
Thats a good looking rifle!
I think maybe my timing is just lousy when it comes to C stocks - the aftermarket stocks available seem to need skills I don't have to fit, CMP will supply and fit a stock for about what I paid for the rifle but have a waiting list, military C stocks seem to run about $100 over that.
I am pretty much convinced a scant stock is fine for this rifle.
I picked up 2 NOS SA bolts from the same '42 date range as the barrel. The price was good and I figure it doubles the chance of headspace being correct.
Other than stock and handguard, I seem to only be short a milled lower band spring and the totally redundant bolt stop.
Just like with my Dad's rifle, I marvel at the attention to detail and complete disregard for economy on the 1903s.
Of course, then OLIAR15 posts pics of a K31 that puts nearly any military rifle to shame when it comes to quality.
Andy
m1a_scoutguy
01-29-22, 17:41
Thats a good looking rifle!
I think maybe my timing is just lousy when it comes to C stocks - the aftermarket stocks available seem to need skills I don't have to fit, CMP will supply and fit a stock for about what I paid for the rifle but have a waiting list, military C stocks seem to run about $100 over that.
I am pretty much convinced a scant stock is fine for this rifle.
I picked up 2 NOS SA bolts from the same '42 date range as the barrel. The price was good and I figure it doubles the chance of headspace being correct.
Other than stock and handguard, I seem to only be short a milled lower band spring and the totally redundant bolt stop.
Just like with my Dad's rifle, I marvel at the attention to detail and complete disregard for economy on the 1903s.
Of course, then OLIAR15 posts pics of a K31 that puts nearly any military rifle to shame when it comes to quality.
Andy
Thanks, it was a great project and I enjoyed the hell out of building it and finding all the parts I needed. I bought my stock from the CMP, my Membership had run out but you can still buy new items like BBLs, Stocks, etc, just not "surplus" parts I guess. I will admit I totally f**ked up the stock in-letting but in the end, I sent the whole rifle to Chuck In Denver,(look him up, he is a master @ 1903/A3 rifles". He fixed my cut-off and fixed my stock debacle by bedding it and man that thing could shoot!
I bought tons of "extra" everything but not sure if I have a lower band spring hangin around, I'll go check and get back at ya. There's tons of them around but shipping will cost ya as much as the dam spring probably, LOL There is a guy kinda local to me that has a Sportarized 1903 and it looks OK but he had shitty pic's on the Forum, all I care about is if the receiver is solid and not in the suspect number of being overheat treated, I guess I'll go snoop and see if it's still around,LOL I'll look for the spring Andy and get back at ya soon. Keep plugging away the rifle will be a fun and historic piece for sure.
Thanks, it was a great project and I enjoyed the hell out of building it and finding all the parts I needed. I bought my stock from the CMP, my Membership had run out but you can still buy new items like BBLs, Stocks, etc, just not "surplus" parts I guess. I will admit I totally f**ked up the stock in-letting but in the end, I sent the whole rifle to Chuck In Denver,(look him up, he is a master @ 1903/A3 rifles". He fixed my cut-off and fixed my stock debacle by bedding it and man that thing could shoot!
I bought tons of "extra" everything but not sure if I have a lower band spring hangin around, I'll go check and get back at ya. There's tons of them around but shipping will cost ya as much as the dam spring probably, LOL There is a guy kinda local to me that has a Sportarized 1903 and it looks OK but he had shitty pic's on the Forum, all I care about is if the receiver is solid and not in the suspect number of being overheat treated, I guess I'll go snoop and see if it's still around,LOL I'll look for the spring Andy and get back at ya soon. Keep plugging away the rifle will be a fun and historic piece for sure.
I apreciate the offer, don't look too hard, please. I know I have a stamped lower band spring.
I have heard of Chuck, I want to say he is the one who said the commercial C stocks are a real gamble right now. For whatever reason, the CMP only sells the C stocks if they install them now. I think minor fitting and finishing a NOS military scant stock is within my abilities. I put a used straight grip stock on my Dad's '03 and learned a little doing that.
Andy
I have it put together with the exception of the upper band screw (have to get brave and drill the hole). It is not correct or perfect, but I plan to enjoy shooting it for years to come. With my H&R M1/CMP Special Rack.
https://i.imgur.com/VmgNThT.jpg
P.S. The stock is pretty dark. It is a NOS stock made in 1945, so it was a bit mottled after I got it cleaned up. I used Dark Walnut stain on it, which certainly lived up to its name. The finish is pure tung oil cut 50/50 with mineral spirits. It needs a few more coats down the line.
Looks good. You sure didn't drag your feet getting it done.
m1a_scoutguy
02-15-22, 21:29
I have it put together with the exception of the upper band screw (have to get brave and drill the hole). It is not correct or perfect, but I plan to enjoy shooting it for years to come. With my H&R M1/CMP Special Rack.
https://i.imgur.com/VmgNThT.jpg
P.S. The stock is pretty dark. It is a NOS stock made in 1945, so it was a bit mottled after I got it cleaned up. I used Dark Walnut stain on it, which certainly lived up to its name. The finish is pure tung oil cut 50/50 with mineral spirits. It needs a few more coats down the line.
Very nice Andy looks great! I'm working on a guy that has a Smith Corona 1903A3 that's Sportarized but he is asking $600 for it,,,:laugh::laugh: I am interested in "only" the receiver and figure I'll sell off anything I don't want/need but still working on him. I'm thinking more along the lines of $300 so we will see! If I even get it I won't be as quick as you but I'll keep you posted if I get the rifle or if my search continues! Again great looking set, now a range report is due! :D
Thank you both!
I will be at the range with the rifle this weekend for sure.
Oof, $600 seems high, but everything Milsurp seems high to me nowadays.
This is how mine looked in the seller's ad:
https://i.imgur.com/XgLHGTB.jpg
Its kind of funny, none of the pictures showed it but the floorplate was so shiny when I got it that it looked chromed.
So far, I have replaced or installed:
Stock/handguard (bought)
Buttplate (on hand)
Bolt (bought)
Bolt sleeve (on hand)
Striker Assy (on hand)
Follower (bought)
Floorplate (bought)
Grooved trigger (bought)
Magazine cut-off spring and detent (on hand)
Bolt stop/spring (bought)
Rear sight parts (on hand)
Lower band and swivel (on hand)
Lower band spring (bought)
Upper band (on hand)
Stacking swivel (bought)
Wow - I guess I could have just said I replaced everything except the barreled action and trigger guard. :)
I replaced some things that were functional because I had them on hand or they were priced low enough to add them to the cart when I was buying other stuff.
Andy
Made it to the range this morning and shot just over 40 rounds at 50 yards from the bench using the peep sight.
The rifle operated smoothly and the trigger is pretty good, though it has a bit of smooth creep. Recoil didn't bother me a bit because I slipped a piece of 1/2" stiff foam in my jacket before I started.
The sun was shining brightly from the front right and I struggled a bit with that. Target has one 3 shot group and one 4 shot group - orange bull is 2".
https://i.imgur.com/rpQDnjj.jpg
Terrible lighting for a rifle pic
https://i.imgur.com/TRTxVPl.jpg
Man that looks promising.
Also the stock looks really good.
That turned out very nice sir. Thank you for saving a piece of 'America'!
-Rainman
m1a_scoutguy
02-21-22, 10:18
Thank you both!
I will be at the range with the rifle this weekend for sure.
Oof, $600 seems high, but everything Milsurp seems high to me nowadays.
This is how mine looked in the seller's ad:
https://i.imgur.com/XgLHGTB.jpg
Its kind of funny, none of the pictures showed it but the floorplate was so shiny when I got it that it looked chromed.
So far, I have replaced or installed:
Stock/handguard (bought)
Buttplate (on hand)
Bolt (bought)
Bolt sleeve (on hand)
Striker Assy (on hand)
Follower (bought)
Floorplate (bought)
Grooved trigger (bought)
Magazine cut-off spring and detent (on hand)
Bolt stop/spring (bought)
Rear sight parts (on hand)
Lower band and swivel (on hand)
Lower band spring (bought)
Upper band (on hand)
Stacking swivel (bought)
Wow - I guess I could have just said I replaced everything except the barreled action and trigger guard. :)
I replaced some things that were functional because I had them on hand or they were priced low enough to add them to the cart when I was buying other stuff.
Andy
Very cool !! Yea if the $600 was for a rifle in somewhat "original" or should I say traditional configuration then $600 would be OK, but it's Sportarized, and everything will go except the receiver! I threw an offer of $250 plus shipping at him and he got back and wants at least $400 or he will keep it. I get it and understand & I am probably a douche for offering so low but I only need the receiver, LOL nuttin else! I'll keep looking and maybe the guy will get tired of sitting on a rifle he will never use & I'll get lucky. Again ya did good Andy and that's a great-looking rifle and an awesome piece of history, BIG congrats !!
Very cool !! Yea if the $600 was for a rifle in somewhat "original" or should I say traditional configuration then $600 would be OK, but it's Sportarized, and everything will go except the receiver! I threw an offer of $250 plus shipping at him and he got back and wants at least $400 or he will keep it. I get it and understand & I am probably a douche for offering so low but I only need the receiver, LOL nuttin else! I'll keep looking and maybe the guy will get tired of sitting on a rifle he will never use & I'll get lucky. Again ya did good Andy and that's a great-looking rifle and an awesome piece of history, BIG congrats !!
$400 is right at what I paid. You are not a douche for offering what you feel is fair for you to pay, though.
Andy
m1a_scoutguy
02-21-22, 12:45
$400 is right at what I paid. You are not a douche for offering what you feel is fair for you to pay, though.
Andy
LOL, thanks. The difference is you received a working/correct BBL on yours, the one I'm looking at is cut-down with no front sight slot, it's gone so it's not useful for me.:( There are lots of 1903 & 1903A3 rifles out there complete but I don't want to take a piece of history and configure/change it the way I want it. While many are complete and in the correct configuration most are NOT correct or original so it really wouldn't be that big a deal but I just can't bring myself to do it, LOL Plus I like the pursuit and building it the way I want it, all part of the fun/challenge. I can go over to the CMP Forum and buy a rifle most any day for $800ish up to $1500ish but that's not what I want. I'll keep looking and maybe hit this guy up again in a while if he doesn't sell what he has.
I understand you completely. It is unfortunate that folks don't understand the monetary difference between a "correct" and sporterized '03/'03A3.
Andy
P.S. I'm not saying mine is correct, of course.
m1a_scoutguy
02-21-22, 23:04
I understand you completely. It is unfortunate that folks don't understand the monetary difference between a "correct" and sporterized '03/'03A3.
Andy
P.S. I'm not saying mine is correct, of course.
Right on Andy,, I get it, out of all mine I have 1 M1 that is correct as it came off the line, it's awesome & it cost me but that's OK, all the rest are mix masters & I'm content with that. it's funny when ya see a Mil-Spec rifle @ a gun shop & the guy behind the counter is pretty fast to say check this baby out it's all "correct" !! Ah, yea, OK. Just because it's a Springer/Winchester/H&R etc and all the parts are the same manufacturers it's normally a looooong way from actually correct, as in how it came off the manufacturing line! There are so many changes, updates, improvements on all Mil-Spec rifles its mind-boggling to even try and figure it out, LOL Especially on 1903 & the 1903A3 manufacturers shared parts! Many Smith Coronas have Remington parts & that's how they should be! Winchester had trouble with their M1s making some parts so SA gave them parts off their line,soooo Winchester M1s can have SA parts. Myself included I'm just happy to have a safe, functioning/accurate piece of history that I always feel saw some action and could tell a story if it could only talk! That's my fascination and thrill of owning Mil-Spec, Surplus rifles, its History in your hand ++10 !! Keep the range reports coming and when winter finally goes away in my neck of the woods I'll be out myself with plenty of pic's and range reports myself. :D
Made it to the range Sunday and shot another 40 rounds - 20 Turkish M2 (1963) and 20 Federal blue box 180 SP. The 180 grain rounds have noticeably more recoil, of course. I like this rifle more every time I shoot it, but I really need to work out shooting iron sights again. I drilled out the aperture on the rear sight a bit when I put it together so I don't have trouble getting a sight picture, I just shoot too many fliers. This is 20 rounds of Turk surplus M2 at 50 yards and I am sure the rifle and ammo are both capable of better results (bull is 2").
https://i.imgur.com/E76paVa.jpg
I thnk I will break out a .22 with a peep sight for a couple of range sessions and shoot the Springfield at 100 yards the next time I take it out.
Andy
Something to consider when selecting ammunition is the warning the CMP issued about shooting modern ammunition in 1903 Springfields and M1 Garands.
"The CMP advises to not use .30/06 ammunition in M1 Garands, 1903s, and 1903A3s that is loaded beyond 50,000 CUP and has a bullet weight more than 172gr. These rifles are at least 70 years old and were not designed for max loads and super heavy bullets. Always wear hearing and eye protection when firing an M1 Garand, 1903 and/or 1903A3 rifle."
The CMP advice on ammunition for the '03/'03A3s is interesting. Yes, they are old rifles, but the nature of steel doesn't change over time. SAAMI was quite aware of the number of surplus rifles chambered in 30-06 when they set their pressure specification. A late production 1903 or any 1903A3 is certainly as capable of handling modern commercial ammunition as a Winchester model 70 of the same vintage and you don't see the same caution with the model 70s.
I "think" the CMP advice is the result of simplification. Modern, slower burning, powders that take full advantage of the 30-06's capacity change the pressure curve from the ammunition the M1 gas system was designed around and will accelerate wear or damage parts. There is also concern with primers and slam fires in the M1. In a perfect world, we would have tons of modern US surplus M2 ball or AP to shoot in our M1s.
I cannot help but think the CMP just lumped the 1903/1903A3 in with the M1 in their advice. On the other hand, I have newer 30-06 rifles with less historical significance if I feel the need to stretch the round's capabilities. Better I launch parts from my Ruger M77 or Interarms Mark X than a 1903.
Andy
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