View Full Version : CNN admits: armed civilians making a difference in Ukraine
I felt this one deserved it's own thread and discussion. Best part, At 50 seconds: one of the main reasons they were able to do that was armed civilians... Gee, where have we heard that before as a reason why an armed civilian population is an essential aspect of countering aggression from enemies both foreign and domestic? I can't quite put my finger on it...yes, that's sarcasm. CNN having no clue the irony of that comment, but it will come back to bite them in the a$$, and this event has demonstrated, yet again, what we all know.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PAyl2XiWZyo
I still lean towards turning our guns in to the authorities just to be safe.
I still lean towards turning our guns in to the authorities just to be safe.
"It's for your own good..." - Stalin
I felt this one deserved it's own thread and discussion. Best part, At 50 seconds: one of the main reasons they were able to do that was armed civilians... Gee, where have we heard that before as a reason why an armed civilian population is an essential aspect of countering aggression from enemies both foreign and domestic? I can't quite put my finger on it...yes, that's sarcasm. CNN having no clue the irony of that comment, but it will come back to bite them in the a$$, and this event has demonstrated, yet again, what we all know.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PAyl2XiWZyo
Silly, that's in that part of the world. They have a history that dates back enough to make our country a new country in comparison.
But somehow we have evolved beyond any and everyone else. Why we are so advanced and civilized. Nothing like that could never happen here. We're a freedom loving country with a Government that knows what's best for us. So when they tell us we can't do things. They are only looking out for our best interests. We all can agree that anyone who doesn't agree with them is a threat to our democracy. There for they are OUR ENEMY. So don't be an enemy and do what is best for everyone and do as your masters tell you.
Silly, that's in that part of the world. They have a history that dates back enough to make our country a new country in comparison.
But somehow we have evolved beyond any and everyone else. Why we are so advanced and civilized. Nothing like that could never happen here. We're a freedom loving country with a Government that knows what's best for us. So when they tell us we can't do things. They are only looking out for our best interests. We all can agree that anyone who doesn't agree with them is a threat to our democracy. There for they are OUR ENEMY. So don't be an enemy and do what is best for everyone and do as your masters tell you.
My response to those dingbats that use that line of logic is:
No four words has lead to the death of more people in all human history than "It can't happen here."
Diamondback
04-07-22, 11:20
My response to those dingbats that use that line of logic is:
No four words has lead to the death of more people in all human history than "It can't happen here."
With "For your own good/safety/etc." hot on its heels.
I still lean towards turning our guns in to the authorities just to be safe.
"Safe"...I like safe, because safe is so darn safe. "Safe" makes me think of puppies and pretty flowers...they're safe too. If you could see me...I have a big smile on my face...thanks to todays word..."Safe".
titsonritz
04-07-22, 13:55
I still lean towards turning our guns in to the authorities just to be safe.
...after all, nothing like Ukraine would ever happen here.
Covid 19 protocols, procedures, pandemic, people control has made "Safe" an abomination. Safe has become a code word for being censored.
That had to hurt.
But they still will manage to never put the pieces together.
"We must respect Islam because that is their culture even if we don't agree with their views", but somehow cannot apply that same metric to US conservatives.
"By criminalizing drugs, we are making criminals out of people who normally would be law abiding citizens", but somehow they cannot apply that same metric to gun owners.
No four words has lead to the death of more people in all human history than "It can't happen here."
That’s sig line material.
It STILL fits the narrative. Correct me it I am misinformed...
Before the invasion, Ukrainian citizens could not own handguns, and their rifle magazines were maxed at ten rounds. The gold standard for a country that can still have private firearms...
Maybe that's one reason WHY they got invaded.
It STILL fits the narrative. Correct me it I am misinformed...
Before the invasion, Ukrainian citizens could not own handguns, and their rifle magazines were maxed at ten rounds. The gold standard for a country that can still have private firearms...
Maybe that's one reason WHY they got invaded.
Sounds like you are kinda right but not completely...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_law_in_Ukraine
Ukraine is the only country in Europe where firearms are not regulated by statute. Everything related to firearms is regulated by Order №622 of the Ministry of Internal Affairs.
Citizens are permitted to own non-fully automatic rifles and shotguns as long as they are stored properly when not in use.
Handguns are illegal except for target shooting, those who hold concealed carry permits, and handguns awarded for service.[1] Concealed carry licenses are available, but are not normally issued unless a threat to life is present and can be proven.[2]
Because of the lack of statutes regarding firearm ownership, authorities have great discretion when giving firearm licenses. The president and ministers often give guns to members of the elite, while making it hard for ordinary people to obtain them. It is estimated that more than 50,000 guns have been issued as presents from authorities.[3]
Gun owners are required by order to renew their licenses and registration of their guns every three years. Failure to comply will result in revocation of the license, as well as confiscation of guns. There is a 10-round magazine limit for rifles.[4]
Armed civilians make a difference here too !
Armed civilians make a difference here too !
Yep, it ain't the cops that are keeping the criminal element from simply walking into any house and taking whatever they feel like taking and doing whatever they feel like doing. Criminals do that any place they feel very comfortable doing it, which is why your "gun control" areas have such comfortable criminals.
in 1984 people in NYC literally took their life in their hands when they rode the subway and there was an expectation to be mugged on par with an expectation that you might have an accident if you drive the interstate every day. Then right before christmas a guy named Goetz decided "no more" and shot up four attackers without regard.
And for a time subway criminals were less bold. As a result, in 1985 NYC adopted the Fixing Broken Windows policy, which proposed to stop large-profile crimes by prosecuting quality of life crimes, which took the focus away from the subway shooter.
It STILL fits the narrative. Correct me it I am misinformed...
Before the invasion, Ukrainian citizens could not own handguns, and their rifle magazines were maxed at ten rounds. The gold standard for a country that can still have private firearms...
Maybe that's one reason WHY they got invaded.
I don't know about handguns, but magazines definitely don't seem to have been limited to 10 rounds. Remember the granny who bought an AR to defend her home back in January?
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/see-it-ukrainian-mother-buys-huge-gun-and-says-shes-ready-to-fight-for-kyiv#:~:text=A%20Ukrainian%20mother%20of%20three,her%20kitchen%20with%20the%20rifle.
Definitely looks like a 30 round mag to me.
And that's still not factoring in the literal truckloads of AKs that were dumped off by the government to arm the militias on the first days of the war. Civilian possession of arms, no matter the source, made a difference.
To be honest, the somewhat non-standard method of Ukrainian defense units, dating back to 2014, are what drew my interest to the conflict. Without the volunteer battalions that stepped up in 2014, chances are the entire eastern portion of the country would have been annexed to Russia by now. Those same battalions, and international volunteers from units like the Georgian National Legion, have made a very, very strong case for a modern, civilian armed, and organized militia force. We've already seen some countries, such as Lithuania, reconsidering their stance on civilian ownership/possession of arms. It's a shame we won't have a similar "seeing the light" movement.
That’s sig line material.
Not sure how to embed that one, but I made a meme I like to share to drive the point of that reality home:
https://imgflip.com/i/480xkt
That’s sig line material.
Not sure how to embed that one, but I made a meme I like to share to drive the point of that reality home:
https://imgflip.com/i/480xkt
That had to hurt.
But they still will manage to never put the pieces together.
"We must respect Islam because that is their culture even if we don't agree with their views", but somehow cannot apply that same metric to US conservatives.
"By criminalizing drugs, we are making criminals out of people who normally would be law abiding citizens", but somehow they cannot apply that same metric to gun owners.
I don't think it hurt because they're too dumb understand the gravity of what they just admitted to and when it's pointed out to them, and it will be, they will deflect with the "that's different, can't happen in the US" yada yada. It would be great it "hurt" them in the sense they were aware they just admitted armed civilians likley made the difference contrary to previous claims, they're not even aware of it.
Yep, it ain't the cops that are keeping the criminal element from simply walking into any house and taking whatever they feel like taking and doing whatever they feel like doing. Criminals do that any place they feel very comfortable doing it, which is why your "gun control" areas have such comfortable criminals.
in 1984 people in NYC literally took their life in their hands when they rode the subway and there was an expectation to be mugged on par with an expectation that you might have an accident if you drive the interstate every day. Then right before christmas a guy named Goetz decided "no more" and shot up four attackers without regard.
And for a time subway criminals were less bold. As a result, in 1985 NYC adopted the Fixing Broken Windows policy, which proposed to stop large-profile crimes by prosecuting quality of life crimes, which took the focus away from the subway shooter.
I was there at the time and remember it well. Crime also dropped sharply for a short time after that, due to that one single act of self defense. NYC was a very different place then and everyone was supportive of him, which likley one reason they didn't throw the book at him.
Sounds like you are kinda right but not completely...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_law_in_Ukraine
Close, but wiki is going to wiki.
I don't know about handguns, but magazines definitely don't seem to have been limited to 10 rounds. Remember the granny who bought an AR to defend her home back in January?
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/see-it-ukrainian-mother-buys-huge-gun-and-says-shes-ready-to-fight-for-kyiv#:~:text=A%20Ukrainian%20mother%20of%20three,her%20kitchen%20with%20the%20rifle.
^^^ Not a valid comparison. By January, I'm sure the government was HAPPY with it's citizens arming up. They are handing guns out like candy now, which makes my point. If there was a rifle behind every blade of grass to begin with, this would not be happening now.
Great resource. https://www.gunpolicy.org/firearms/region/cp/ukraine
Sounds like they are very NYC-ish with their hand gun laws. Yes, you can get one... BUT.
In the end, it sounds like they were complying with the UN gun control treaty playbook that BHO and brandon want us to sign on to... As I said, the gold standard. Like I said, ALL bets are off now, but BEFORE the Russian troop build up, it does NOT sound easy to get a firearm... This wreaks of NYS/NYC.
Regulation of private firearms in Ukraine is categorised as permissive.24 Rifles and shotguns are allowed for hunting, target shooting, collection, protection of person or property and private security.25 26 Although Ukraine reported to the United Nations that civilian possession, import and export of handguns is prohibited for any use,26 ‘revolvers and pistols’ — and in one example, ‘sporting revolvers and pistols’ — are subject to regulation, but apparently not banned in Ukrainian firearm legislation.27 In December 2001, in response to a spate of attacks on reporters, the Interior Ministry allowed some investigative journalists to carry handguns that fire rubber bullets.28
According to a report presented by its government to the UN in 2003,29 'Ukraine has enacted adequate legislation and has put in place appropriate structures and procedures to exercise effective control over the small arms and light weapons.’ Since 1996, a series of presidential edicts and decrees have regulated licensing bodies, controlled goods, inter-agency processes and enforcement.30 31
Gun Owner Licensing
Firearm licences are available in Ukraine for hunting, target shooting, collection, protection of person or property and private security.36 A 1997-99 UN survey reported 640,615 licensed gun owners, with 7.6 per cent of households holding at least one firearm.37 By 2018 the total number of legally (and illegally) privately owned firearms was estimated at just under 4.4 million.3 The minimum age to obtain a gun licence is 21, and non-citizens, applicants with a criminal record or a history of domestic violence or mental illness can be denied possession of a firearm.38 39 Ukraine's licensing requirements, include the need for identification, training certification, fees, background checks, a genuine reason for obtaining a licence, permits to purchase, a photograph, and planned storage.
Close, but wiki is going to wiki.
^^^ Not a valid comparison. By January, I'm sure the government was HAPPY with it's citizens arming up. They are handing guns out like candy now, which makes my point. If there was a rifle behind every blade of grass to begin with, this would not be happening now.
Great resource. https://www.gunpolicy.org/firearms/region/cp/ukraine
Sounds like they are very NYC-ish with their hand gun laws. Yes, you can get one... BUT.
In the end, it sounds like they were complying with the UN gun control treaty playbook that BHO and brandon want us to sign on to... As I said, the gold standard. Like I said, ALL bets are off now, but BEFORE the Russian troop build up, it does NOT sound easy to get a firearm... This wreaks of NYS/NYC.
Not to mention that had there already been a rifle behind every blade of Ukrainian grass, the true non-combatants in Eastern Ukraine wouldn't have been subject to the whims of Russian separatists OR the Azov Bn over the past 10-12 years. It's much harder to oppress a populace which is willing to shoot you in the face for your troubles.
I was there at the time and remember it well. Crime also dropped sharply for a short time after that, due to that one single act of self defense. NYC was a very different place then and everyone was supportive of him, which likley one reason they didn't throw the book at him.
Well at least until he opened his mouth in court and dropped N bomb after N bomb. He was too stupid to understand that all of the black commuters also supported him UNTIL he started talking stupid shit.
The Dumb Gun Collector
04-08-22, 18:40
No doubt none of us would have been happy to live in a country with Ukraine's gun laws before this conflict. But this conflict has definitely (for the millionth time) showed the benefits of an armed populace.
Ned Christiansen
04-08-22, 19:45
This guy makes a good case for "it mightn't have happened if they'd had less restrictive gun laws and not sold off thousands of AK's years back".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M1G6nXpz18I
Not sure if this is the one but-- this guy's vids are all good. He has great creds as a pro-gun pundit.
Edit: it's this one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5OgIcaiz2Q0 Ukraine disarmed..... under Obama's influence: "we need to eliminate these stockpiles for the safety of the Ukrainian people."
But again-- they're all good.
My suggestion to my Ukrainian friends was to grind the selector for semi-auto only upon issue. I mean the usefulness of full-auto is limited and beast applied by-- well, not by citizens who never handled one before. I hope when this guy gets kicked out-- what's his name again, well you know who I'm talking about, he's basically Ukraine's little bitch, after that happens I say "let them keep those guns" but require some further training and maintenance of those perishable skills. It's in everyone's interest, there..... and here.
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