The New Whats Wrong with the Russian Army [Archive]

mack7.62

05-12-22, 09:29

The Ukrainian Combat Engineer who located the likely river crossing area so that Ukraine had a heads up and was prepared to respond. The guy has a bit of a big head but is rightfully proud I think.

https://twitter.com/kms_d4k/status/1524506107615584256

Максим
@kms_d4k
The context:

I am UA military engineering + EOD officer. I have served one turn in Donbas prior to the recent invasion.
Recently, I have accomplished a mission which made huge impact on Russian losses and completely screwed up their plans to encircle Lysychansk.

Initially, there was intelligence from frontline units that there are Russians on the other side of the river and they gather various vehicles. So, my commander asked on 6th May me as one of the best military engineers to do engineering reconnaissance on Siverskyi Donets river

Together with recon units for backup, I went to explore the area of Hryhorivka and Bilohorivka on 7th May.
Frontline units in Bilohorivka reported multiple RU vehicles gathering on the other side of the river.

I explored the area and suggested a location where Russians might attempt to mount a pontone bridge to get to the other side. And, used rangefinders to figure out river is 80m wide, thus Russians would need 8 parts (10m each) of the bridge connected to get to the other side.

With that flow of the river, I knew they would need motorized boats to arrange such a bridge, and it would take them at least two hours of work.
Took me a day to check everything. And I had to do it on 8th of May as well.
So, reported this information I had to my commanders.

Also, I told the unit who observed that part of the river that they need to be on the look out for sound of motor boats.
Visibility was shit in the area because Russians put fields & forests on fire, and were throwing a lot of smoke grenades. On top of that, it was foggy.

They had to hear the sound. And they did on May 8th early morning. Right at the place I said. I was there to check it as well - and I have seen with my drone as Russians do the pontonne bridge. Reported immediately to commanders.

Looking back, I think my recon + hints to the river unit made the biggest impact. I outplayed RU mil engineers.
Russians attempted to place a bridge RIGHT in the place where I guessed.
River unit didn’t see RU units, but was able to hear motor boats and report it immediately

Artillery was ready.
We have been able to confirm Russians mounted 7 parts of the bridge out of 8. Russians have even succeeded to move some troops and vehicles over the river. Combats started.

In ~20 minutes after recon unit confirmed Russian bridge being mounted, HEAVY ARTILLERY engaged against Russian forces, and then aviation chipped in as well.
I was still in the area, and I have never seen / heard such heavy combat in my life.

mack7.62

05-12-22, 10:02

Russia confiscated their soldiers cell phones before invasion but soldiers kept their SIM cards, then soldiers steal Ukrainian cell phones and install their SIM's and bingo they show up on the Ukraine cell network as roamers.

https://twitter.com/TrentTelenko/status/1524743911817850881

Trent Telenko
@TrentTelenko
This map was direct messaged to me and was taken from a forum. It is a heat map of Russian SIM cards roaming Ukrainian cellphone networks. Logistics Thread��

FriendlyStranger

05-12-22, 11:07

Artillery was ready.
We have been able to confirm Russians mounted 7 parts of the bridge out of 8. Russians have even succeeded to move some troops and vehicles over the river. Combats started.

In ~20 minutes after recon unit confirmed Russian bridge being mounted, HEAVY ARTILLERY engaged against Russian forces, and then aviation chipped in as well.
I was still in the area, and I have never seen / heard such heavy combat in my life.

Interview with Wali.

Google translate:

https://www.lapresse.ca/actualites/2022-05-06/retour-du-tireur-d-elite-wali/la-guerre-c-est-une-deception-terrible.php

"After a few weeks in Ukrainian territory, some of the most experienced Western soldiers ended up being recruited by the Ukrainian Military Intelligence Directorate, and would now participate in special operations behind enemy lines, according to one of them. . Others, less experienced, "jump from one Airbnb to another" while waiting to be recruited by a unit that will take them to the front, says Wali. The majority, however, have decided to return home, say several people interviewed for this article. "Many arrive in Ukraine with their chests bulging, but they leave with their tails between their legs," says Wali. PHOTO PROVIDED BY WALI Fire caused by the bombardment of Ukrainian positions, near Irpin, in the suburbs of Kyiv In the end, he himself said he only fired two bullets into windows "to scare" and never really came within enemy firing range. "It's a war of machines", where the "extremely brave" Ukrainian soldiers suffer very heavy losses from shelling, but "miss many opportunities" to weaken the enemy because they lack knowledge technical military, he summarizes. “If the Ukrainians had the procedures we had in Afghanistan to communicate with the artillery, we could have caused carnage,” he believes. But Wali does not hide his desire to return there despite everything. “You never know when foreign fighters will make a difference on the ground. It's like a fire extinguisher: it's useless until the fire catches."

Russia confiscated their soldiers cell phones before invasion but soldiers kept their SIM cards, then soldiers steal Ukrainian cell phones and install their SIM's and bingo they show up on the Ukraine cell network as roamers.

https://twitter.com/TrentTelenko/status/1524743911817850881

Trent Telenko
@TrentTelenko
This map was direct messaged to me and was taken from a forum. It is a heat map of Russian SIM cards roaming Ukrainian cellphone networks. Logistics Thread��

(NSFW) Russian Troops Blown-Up by Artillery During Instagram Livestream
https://funker530.com/video/nsfw-russian-troops-blown-up-by-artillery-during-instagram-livestream/

Why Ukraine's Artillery is So Effective vs. Russia
https://funker530.com/video/why-ukraines-artillery-is-so-effective-vs-russia-fnn-34/

glocktogo

05-12-22, 16:23

What's wrong with the Russian Army is the exact same thing that's wrong with Russia. Its full of Russians.

pinzgauer

05-12-22, 21:15

Let's try to keep this thread on topic, discussions about whether we should be helping Ukraine, Russia as the good guys, etc should be out of scope.

This should be purely discussions on military performance and news in the war, ideally with confirmed sources.

Wake27

05-12-22, 22:23

The Dumb Gun Collector

05-13-22, 00:58

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2022/05/13/world/russia-ukraine-war-news?smid=url-share

Moscow is withdrawing forces from around Kharkiv, Ukraine’s second-largest city, where it was losing ground, Ukrainian and Western officials said, in one of Russia’s biggest setbacks since its retreat from Kyiv last month.

1168

05-13-22, 13:30

SNIP; read it above. Something interesting is that the Russians did this (the bridge thing) to the Nazis in Ukraine in WWII. They seem to have retained no lessons learned from that conflict, which I guess makes sense, since they executed so many of their own commanders during that phase of the Eastern Front. There was an incredible degree of stupid on display in Ukraine then, as well. There are also similarities between the tactics and concepts used by Ukrainian anti-tank dudes and the ones employed by the Allies against Axis tanks with tank destroyers.

Russia confiscated their soldiers cell phones before invasion but soldiers kept their SIM cards, then soldiers steal Ukrainian cell phones and install their SIM's and bingo they show up on the Ukraine cell network as roamers.

https://twitter.com/TrentTelenko/status/1524743911817850881

Trent Telenko
@TrentTelenko
This map was direct messaged to me and was taken from a forum. It is a heat map of Russian SIM cards roaming Ukrainian cellphone networks. Logistics Thread��
This has been a thing for them in the 20-teens there as well. The Russian Army has very poor security and basically glows in the dark. It is very easy to determine the strength, location, equipment, and vehicles of the Russian army, because of this. Y’wanna know the names and work/home addresses for many of their intel operatives? Just look at their version of Uber Eats. Telephone numbers, home addresses, security protocols at gates, everything.

This is available open source, you don’t even need to be an agency or IC to get this intel.

Johnny Rico

05-13-22, 13:59

1168

05-13-22, 14:11

seb5

05-13-22, 14:17

C-grunt

05-13-22, 16:46

I think the only way the Russians will actually learn and improve from this is after a complete overhaul of their system. I think this would first require a complete overhaul of the government.

C-grunt

05-13-22, 16:47

Im thinking something like post WW2 Germany and Japan. Not necessarily us occupying Russia, but a couple decades of the population living out from under the current regimes rule.

alx01

05-14-22, 01:52

They didn’t win WWII; the Nazis lost. They did learn as the war went on, and definitely improved, and obviously prevailed in the end. But the Stavka (sp?) and NKVD were executing/imprisoning Colonels and Generals by the pile for a) failure and b) not following (bad) orders.

Numbers I recall from official history books: 80% of the German (and probably Italian/Hungarian/Finnish/other axis) troops were on the Eastern front. American/British/French/Canadian forces only faced 20% of German forces in Europe, Africa, and the Middle East.

Equipment % allocation varied, but I recall that Germans definitely had proportionally larger air and naval power allocated to the Western front for obvious reasons.

I disagree with your claim for two reasons:
- a lot of "Superiority of German tactics" were written by and under the direct supervision of Wehrmacht Generals after the war in their attempt to whitewash German military from war crimes/holocaust and provide false reasoning and assurance to U.S. and British that Russians simply won the war by the numbers.
Good reference on this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myth_of_the_clean_Wehrmacht

[sic]
Both myths glorify the Confederate military and the Wehrmacht as superior fighting organisations led by deeply honourable, noble and courageous men who were overwhelmed by inferior opponents by sheer numbers and material together with bad luck.

- By the same logic you can say that Korea, Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan didn't win, it's just we lost. For some reason our failures in any of those countries nobody attributes to poor officer or troop performance. We did everything right, soldiers and politicians. It's just somehow we awarded medals to soldiers for successful operations, spent billions of dollars, magically lost those campaigns and moved on.

Nobody, even Russians, question that NATO equipment and manufacturing power outweigh Russian capabilities. Each military campaign is unique and I think it's not always appropriate to apply U.S.-Iraq experience, and especially often falsified historical WWII references.

IMHO, at the end of the day I think it only depends if Russia is willing to commit another 400k-800k troops to win in Ukraine quickly. If not, some claim it might be a slow burning conflict like in Syria. Regular, non-radicalized Ukrainians, at some point will realize that in a current state they are fully dependent on Europe/NATO and their boys even with Western equipment might not be coming back home.
Attitude in Russia - hard to know for sure, I hear conflicting stories of both strong opposition without objective reasoning and strong support with some political reasoning. Despite Western press showing Ukrainian unity, I heard from a first hand source that at least 25% of Ukrainians strongly support Russia and are not happy at all with their own government (not just now, but overall).

AndyLate

05-14-22, 06:43

Numbers I recall from official history books: 80% of the German (and probably Italian/Hungarian/Finnish/other axis) troops were on the Eastern front. American/British/French/Canadian forces only faced 20% of German forces in Europe, Africa, and the Middle East.

Equipment % allocation varied, but I recall that Germans definitely had proportionally larger air and naval power allocated to the Western front for obvious reasons.

I disagree with your claim for two reasons:
- a lot of "Superiority of German tactics" were written by and under the direct supervision of Wehrmacht Generals after the war in their attempt to whitewash German military from war crimes/holocaust and provide false reasoning and assurance to U.S. and British that Russians simply won the war by the numbers.
Good reference on this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myth_of_the_clean_Wehrmacht

- By the same logic you can say that Korea, Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan didn't win, it's just we lost. For some reason our failures in any of those countries nobody attributes to poor officer or troop performance. We did everything right, soldiers and politicians. It's just somehow we awarded medals to soldiers for successful operations, spent billions of dollars, magically lost those campaigns and moved on.

Nobody, even Russians, question that NATO equipment and manufacturing power outweigh Russian capabilities. Each military campaign is unique and I think it's not always appropriate to apply U.S.-Iraq experience, and especially often falsified historical WWII references.

IMHO, at the end of the day I think it only depends if Russia is willing to commit another 400k-800k troops to win in Ukraine quickly. If not, some claim it might be a slow burning conflict like in Syria. Regular, non-radicalized Ukrainians, at some point will realize that in a current state they are fully dependent on Europe/NATO and their boys even with Western equipment might not be coming back home.
Attitude in Russia - hard to know for sure, I hear conflicting stories of both strong opposition without objective reasoning and strong support with some political reasoning. Despite Western press showing Ukrainian unity, I heard from a first hand source that at least 25% of Ukrainians strongly support Russia and are not happy at all with their own government (not just now, but overall).

It was closer to 66% in Eastern Europe on average, but certainly the bulk of Nazi forces.

It doesn't matter who wrote the texbooks, the staggering number of Soviet battle casualties were absolutely caused by overwhelming Nazi tactical superiority aided by brutality on both sides. Stalin purged the military of any promising leader to remove perceived political threats before WWII even started.

Andy

1168

05-14-22, 09:13

It was closer to 66% in Eastern Europe on average, but certainly the bulk of Nazi forces.

It doesn't matter who wrote the texbooks, the staggering number of Soviet battle casualties were absolutely caused by overwhelming Nazi tactical superiority aided by brutality on both sides. Stalin purged the military of any promising leader to remove perceived political threats before WWII even started.

Andy

And then kept purging the mediocre leaders during the war. Some of Stalin’s generals were chosen for their rabid love of communism, rather than any military potential. The others were babysat by political babysitters with no military experience, who would sometimes call the shots as if they were generals. Hell, one of their generals, who rose via red allegiance, still insisted that horses could not be replaced by tanks in the cavalry. How freaking stupid can one be?

Its certainly not my only source of history on the topic, but I recently watched some videos that were originally produced for a Russian television audience for state media. Even they painted a picture of incompetency for the Russian army and navy in Ukraine and the Black Sea, though that did not appear to be the intent. It also discussed the above executions, but spun it as if these were legitimate legal consequences for their failures in battle. And though they avoided mentioning lend-lease, or any Allied support whatsoever, Russian incompetence showed through, because some of the pictures had American made aircraft in them that the editors must have let slip.

One of the few things the USSR got right in Ukraine during the Nazi offensive was bombing fuel production in Romania. Fuel was a problem for the Nazis, and that problem was growing. Those bombers were based in Sevastopol, or at least they were, until the Nazis destroyed the Russian army and navy there, as the Soviet generals escaped by submarine as their men watched in horror. Afterwards, the Russian army was literally pushed into the sea. Some tried to escape the slaughter by raft, and most of those were shot, as well.

Speaking of the sea, did I mention that even ROMANIA defeated the Soviet navy in at least one battle on the Black Sea? It was a long time before the Russian navy was able to approach the shore with surface vessels again. They tried, but coastal defenses. Sounds kinda familiar.

I disagree with your claim for two reasons:
- a lot of "Superiority of German tactics" were written by and under the direct supervision of Wehrmacht Generals after the war in their attempt to whitewash German military from war crimes/holocaust and provide false reasoning and assurance to U.S. and British that Russians simply won the war by the numbers.

My understanding of Wehrmacht tactics, equipment, logistics, and vehicles comes primarily from US and British analysis when they were coming up with good counters. I never called their tactics superior. By the time they invaded the USSR, their tactics were known, and no longer revolutionary like when they invaded France. And they certainly made some mistakes on the Eastern Front. Some of their generals were stripped of rank and relieved.

- By the same logic you can say that Korea, Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan didn't win, it's just we lost. Our military was not bested on the battlefield in those conflicts. It was saddled with unachievable or unsustainable political objectives. Afghanistan is a great example. We kicked the SHIT out of the Taliban. But once the objective became to build and prop up a central government there, we were doomed to repeat the conclusion of the war in Viet Nam.

BTW, I’m not so sure we really lost the Korean War. At the end of WWII, our goal in our occupation was to establish a sustainable government and to build an economy and infrastructure to support that. The Reds had a different plan, and concentrated their resources on a military buildup. Seoul has done fairly well in comparison with Pyongyang, though the war is not technically over. I think we’ve come closer to achieving our objective there than the Reds did. I’m not calling it a stunning success or anything, but maybe not a loss. Yet.

I heard from a first hand source that at least 25% of Ukrainians strongly support Russia and are not happy at all with their own government (not just now, but overall). even if this is true, it is totally irrelevant in this thread. As I point out above, military performance ≠ politics. If you’d like to discuss whether or not Russia is legally or politically justified in invading Ukraine, go start a new thread. This thread is about the Bear’s military performance, or lack thereof.

The_War_Wagon

05-14-22, 10:20

After watching it again yesterday, maybe Red Dawn wasn't that far off in portraying avg. Russian infantry capabilities.

SeriousStudent

05-14-22, 10:29

WillBrink

05-14-22, 11:01

One thing I wonder about...

Do the Russians have the will and talent in place to learn from their mistakes? The Red Army suffered greatly due to Stalin's purges, and experienced a steep learning curve during the Winter War and Operation Barbarossa, but they learned from their mistakes and ended up steamrolling the Wehrmacht.

Will they come out of this war better and stronger?

Have they ever? What saved them in WWII (yet again...) was the winter, and the Lend Lease Act. That winter has ultimately saved their A$$ in every major conflict they faced to varying degrees. It's their primarily tactical advantage along with a huge land mass.

Hitler made that same deadly assumption others had, would win quickly, didn't need to prep gear and have winter stuff for troops, etc. Along with the massive flood of stuff we sent at great cost to us, allowing them to get their momentum back, for which the miserable commies not only didn't thank us for (like the French did with a nice statue and such), it was banned from even talking about and would see you sent to the Gulags for it.

I really wonder if the right move would have been to have left the Russians to their fate. Even with a win, the Germans could not have controlled and managed the country and would always be a huge resource drain on the Nazi's to deal with.

The Lend Lease Act probably sped up the demise of the Germans a tad faster, but it was very costly and really does not get enough focus and credit.

There's debate as to what impact the Lend Leas Act had among historians, but my reading is it was in fact a major factor to their success, and there's Russian generals quoted from the time they would not have succeeded without it, which was quickly suppressed as you'd expect.

Interestingly, the most important thing sent may have been he Studebaker truck, which allowed them to rapidly redeploy troops to finally counter the German tactics.

I tend to think we should have left the commies to their fate with Hitler as they earned it, unlike say the poor Poles who took it both ends from Germany and Stalin.

I don't have an issue with saving another country from Nazi's, commies, or various despots, but shove your national pride up your A$$ if you're not at least going to show appreciation for it.

Good read on Lend Lease: https://weaponsandwarfare.com/2020/06/08/lend-lease-to-the-ussr/

1168

05-14-22, 12:09

Interestingly, the Germans fought the Russians in Ukraine on at least one battlefield that Napoleon also did. I don’t remember which, but the German commander mentioned the historical significance of the field when he addressed his troops before battle.

Hitler made that same deadly assumption others had, would win quickly, didn't need to prep gear and have winter stuff for troops, etc. Along with the massive flood of stuff we sent at great cost to us, allowing them to get their momentum back, for which the miserable commies not only didn't thank us for (like the French did with a nice statue and such), it was banned from even talking about and would see you sent to the Gulags for it.

I really wonder if the right move would have been to have left the Russians to their fate. Even with a win, the Germans could not have controlled and managed the country and would always be a huge resource drain on the Nazi's to deal with.

I think so, but hindsight is 20/20. Had we not yoked ourselves with them as allies of convenience, they would not be where they are today. They wouldn’t have gotten nuclear weapons, or not as quickly, and perhaps the same with jets.

I used to say that China doesn’t have any cool shit that they didn’t reverse engineer, buy, or steal the designs for. And while that is less true than it was 20 years ago, its an interesting idea to apply to Russia. Off the top of my head:

. The Maxim was purchased from the West.
. The early tanks were supplied by Britain.
. There was a combined/joint tank school shared with Germany. It appears that the Germans pulled more teaching weight there than the Russians.
. DC3s were provided by the US.
. Jet aircraft and plans were captured from the Nazis.
. I’m sure the captured scientists helped with The Bomb.
. The AK47 was almost certainly inspired by the Sturmgewehr, even though the internal design is unrelated. The form and technology was related. I believe it was mechanically closer to American designs. Wonder where they got those.
. MANPADS were developed from Stingers they bought from Pashtuns via Pakistan
. AAMs have frequently mirrored US ones. We can assume UXO in Viet Nam was involved in the developments. Randall Cunningham, and probably others, were known to shoot AAMs at trucks on their way back to base. He is credited with destroying one, but what happened to the misses?
. A ground-launched advanced missile was purchased by Russia from someone in the Middle East recently after it landed mostly intact after being fired by Israel or the US; I don’t recall the details.

pinzgauer

05-14-22, 13:14

Add to that the US invented Christie tank suspension was one of the things that made the T-34 as effective as it was.

mack7.62

05-14-22, 15:32

The Russians don't treat their cannon fodder very well. The second video shows militia armed with Mosin–Nagant's Russia has run out of AK-47's?

https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1525569978379927557

Visegrád 24
@visegrad24
This is amazing. Cannon fodder from the DPR and LPR stuck at the Ukrainian-Russian border near Kharkiv. They had been retreating from Kharkiv together with the Russian Army, but Russian authorities don’t let non-Russians to cross the border.

https://twitter.com/UkrWarLive/status/1525467125296599042

Ukraine in War
@UkrWarLive
With rifles of the 1891 model and helmets of the 50s. But still alive.

1168

05-14-22, 15:46

alx01

05-14-22, 16:06

mack7.62

05-14-22, 16:10

I was surprised to learn that Ukrainian Army still has Political Officers. :) as well as Barrier troops/battalions (aka anti-retreat forces).

Ukrainian version of Nationalsozialistischer Führungsoffizier, I suppose.

I believe you meant to say Russian Army, if not prove it. Or just come in here post a bunch of nonsense and ruin another thread.

Wake27

05-14-22, 16:11

1168

05-14-22, 16:29

I was surprised to learn that Ukrainian Army still has Political Officers. :) as well as Barrier troops/battalions (aka anti-retreat forces).

Ukrainian version of Nationalsozialistischer Führungsoffizier, I suppose.

I’m placing you on ignore for at least one week. After that if I see you post about actually shooting a rifle, I’ll get curious enough to remove that. I hate to do this because I like to see different opinions, but you can’t seem to understand how to stay on topic like an adult.

I hope you have a good day, and I hope you do so elsewhere. This thread is for discussion of the Russian army’s performance.

Mods, can you guys please go back to temp-banning users that habitually shit in threads instead of locking the thread?

FromMyColdDeadHand

05-14-22, 17:55

I remember some history book saying that some huge proportion of the Russian rolling stock for trains in World War II was provided by Lindley‘s. You can make all kinds of stuff, but in a country as big as Russia you’re not gonna be moving stuff without trains.

It’s interesting to see all the Soviet Union red flags with hammers and circles on these Russian troops. I think there even was a video with a guy near an armored personnel carrier with a red baseball cap on. Not quite sure why you would do that.

1168

05-14-22, 19:47

I remember some history book saying that some huge proportion of the Russian rolling stock for trains in World War II was provided by Lindley‘s. You can make all kinds of stuff, but in a country as big as Russia you’re not gonna be moving stuff without trains.

Russia was and is extremely dependent upon trains. Its one of the reasons everyone got so much intel on what units were going where, and what their actual strength was vs doctrine.

The Dumb Gun Collector

05-15-22, 03:13

Hey man. You can start a separate thread and post about this subject if you need to. We aren't going to get this thread locked with bickering.

I was surprised to learn that Ukrainian Army still has Political Officers. :) as well as Barrier troops/battalions (aka anti-retreat forces).

Ukrainian version of Nationalsozialistischer Führungsoffizier, I suppose.

mack7.62

05-15-22, 06:51

Russia was and is extremely dependent upon trains. Its one of the reasons everyone got so much intel on what units were going where, and what their actual strength was vs doctrine.

"Infantry wins battles, logistics wins wars.” So said Army General John J. Pershing

Methinks Ukraine is about to get a bunch of US trucks under lend lease along with who knows what else. Four RO/RO ships being activated. Under Turbo Activation they have 5-10 days to put to sea.

Neil Hauer
@NeilPHauer
Talking to a soldier in Kramatorsk, just back from the Izyum front. "Our main problem is logistics. In the US army, for every 10 tanks, they have 15 supply trucks. Here, with our shitty post-Soviet doctrine, for every 10 tanks we have 3."

Sal Mercogliano (WGOW Shipping)
@mercoglianos
Turbo Activation for @US_TRANSCOM @MSCSealift @DOTMARAD underway with #GemState, #CapeInscription, #CapeKnox & #Gordon.

OSINTdefender
@sentdefender

For anyone wondering Turbo Activation is a no-notice Exercise by the U.S Military Sealift Command and the Department of Transportation's Maritime Administration to test the Ready Reserve Fleets Short-Notice Sealift Capability, I just think it’s interesting it’s taking place now.

mack7.62

05-15-22, 07:15

Germany and French leaders are dickheads. Latvia has given 1/3 of it's defense budget to Ukraine.

Visegrád 24
@visegrad24
Latvian Deputy PM and Minister of Defence
@Pabriks
putting it bluntly:

“The Baltic states used to be one of the most German-friendly regions. The trust in Germany is now close to zero. There is no Baltic policy in Germany”.

WithUkraine 24/7
@With__Ukraine
4/ Latvian President Egils Levits
@valstsgriba
: "Latvia has already spent a third of its annual budget on defense for #Ukraine.

Latvia will also help Ukraine with grain exports so that it can be shipped from Latvian ports. The government is already working in this direction."

mack7.62

05-15-22, 07:29

Hey Russia hows that "keep Ukraine out of NATO" plan working for you. Honestly after seeing Russia's performance in Ukraine I think Finland could take them on alone. A Finn volunteer in Ukraine said the biggest problem with Western and Ukrainian leadership is they have forgotten how to operate in an environment without air superiority. While in the neatly rowed tent camps in Western Ukraine the Finn's tried to tell them they needed to disperse to no avail so the Finn's left the tents, went into the woods and slept in foxholes, shortly thereafter a tent camp got hit by a missile.

Visegrád 24
@visegrad24

Finland’s president Niinistö spoke some Swedish at today’s press conference announcing Finland’s NATO application.

He said: “it was previously said in Sweden that Finland’s cause is ours. Now it can be said that Sweden’s cause is ours too.”

The words are from a WW2 poster

mack7.62

05-15-22, 07:57

Lot's of USSR flags and patches showing up in Ukraine.

https://twitter.com/RALee85/status/1523515648282095616

Rob Lee
@RALee85
Rosgvardia spetsnaz in Kharkiv Oblast with a Soviet flag.
https://t.me/RUSICHZV/3005

https://twitter.com/RALee85/status/1525766818312376320

Rob Lee
@RALee85
Russian tank with a Soviet flag. 11/
https://t.me/Ugolok_Sitha/6272

mack7.62

05-15-22, 09:58

Bad idea to get your tank stuck in the mud.

https://twitter.com/Blue_Sauron/status/1525847125841567752

BlueSauron��️
@Blue_Sauron

Rare combat footage of Ukrainian serviceman finishing off a Russian tank using a FGM-148 Javelin missile.

The Dumb Gun Collector

05-15-22, 10:34

https://www.smh.com.au/world/europe/ukraine-wages-counter-attack-against-russian-forces-in-east-20220515-p5alea.html

London/Kyiv: Russia has probably lost around a third of the ground forces it deployed to Ukraine and its offensive in the Donbas region “has lost momentum and fallen significantly behind schedule”, British military intelligence said.

“Despite small-scale initial advances, Russia has failed to achieve substantial territorial gains over the past month whilst sustaining consistently high levels of attrition,” the British defence ministry said on Twitter.

At this point you have to wonder what Putin can do to get out of this mess. Obviously, he has bitten off more than he can chew and even he has to know this by now. That being said, it isn't like he is totally out of options. A few I can think of are....

1. Try to call it off where he is at now. It isn't like he hasn't gotten anything. The problem with this strategy is Ukraine has no reason to agree to it. They seem to be pushing the Russians back at Kherson and giving them hell at Melitopol. Of course, the Azov brigade is still holed up in Mariupol after months of it being "days from falling". His best bet would be to try and give away a bunch of area around Kherson in exchange for Melitopol and those areas. Still, it is hard to see how Ukraine would agree to this unless Russia shows they can hold it. With ever increasing amounts of very high quality western equipment, training and intelligence, it is hard to Russia really pulling off anything at this point.

2. He can basically threaten to nuke Kiev if they don't come to terms. Frankly, I figured this was the end game months ago. I figured Vlad would basically say I keep everything east of Dnieper and you guys get keep radiation at Chernobyl levels. Given how casual they have been with their nuclear threats this strategy is actually becoming less useful. If they would have kept their cool they could have delivered this threat in a matter of fact way (you have 72 hours to cease fire an retreat west of the Dniepeer, also the west must stop sending equipment, blah blah).

3. Pull a Joe Biden, and say that he has achieved his goals and leave it to the pro-Russian Ukrainians and see how that works out. Do in exchange for a lifting of sanctions and agreement Ukraine won't join Nato for 10 years, etc.

mack7.62

05-15-22, 11:51

Wait this can't be right Russia destroyed 347% of the Ukrainian AF in the first days of the war.

https://twitter.com/Osinttechnical/status/1525858046089510912

OSINTtechnical
@Osinttechnical
More heavy Ukrainian strike aircraft activity in the Izyum area, SU-25s at low level.

WillBrink

05-15-22, 14:33

"Infantry wins battles, logistics wins wars.” So said Army General John J. Pershing

Methinks Ukraine is about to get a bunch of US trucks under lend lease along with who knows what else. Four RO/RO ships being activated. Under Turbo Activation they have 5-10 days to put to sea.

It saved the commies in WWII bigly, now gonna do the same for the Uke's. My sense is, at least the Uke's will show public appreciation for that assist, if/when they survive the current assault on their sovereignty.

The commies didn't even send a Christmas card...

mack7.62

05-15-22, 19:09

Sealift Reserve Fleet updates, all four of the Turbo Activation ships are under way to different ports I assume to take on cargo.

edited the fourth ship is also under way

FromMyColdDeadHand

05-16-22, 07:31

Sealift Reserve Fleet updates, all four of the Turbo Activation ships are under way to different ports I assume to take on cargo.

edited the fourth ship is also under way

How much gear could these guys haul over? I’m assuming that they would be looking at ‘seeding’ Finland and Sweden?

mack7.62

05-16-22, 07:55

Three of the group are Roll On/Roll Off and the other is a crane ship. Ukraine is hurting for tactical trucks so that is what I would think would be the most likely cargo for the RO/RO's lend lease trucks. Or if the US decides to give Ukraine rocket launchers, another possibility is that since Poland gave Ukraine 232 T-72 tanks they might start getting some of the 250 M1 Abrams they have on order. I am not really a ship guy but maybe someone knows how much they can carry, I would guess the RO/RO's can carry tanks but how many I have no idea. Also these ships have a skeleton crew of around 12 and when activated will need to hire more for a full crew of around 45 and will also take on around 50 Navy crew.

Keep in mind that these are four ships from the reserve fleet that were activated, the Navy also has the same type of ships in the active fleet.

mack7.62

05-16-22, 13:36

I have seen several videos showing this, IMO it is not normal but a problem developing due to the extended flight hours and less than ideal maintenance due to combat operations. I suspect sooner or later they will start falling out of the sky all on their own.

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/russias-ka-52-attack-helicopters-have-got-a-serious-vibration-problem

Russia’s Ka-52 Attack Helicopters Have A Serious Vibration Problem

Russian Ka-52 Hokum attack helicopters fighting in the war in Ukraine are suffering from a major vibration issue that could, according to at least one expert The War Zone consulted, decrease reliability and, potentially, be unsafe. At best, according to assessments we’ve received, the vibration is likely to reduce the efficiency of the weapons these helicopters carry, and may also restrict weapon life. In turn, this could have an effect on the capability of the Ka-52, one of the most widely used Russian helicopters of the conflict so far.

Video clips showing Ka-52s operating with their stub wings rapidly bouncing up and down began to appear on social media in recent weeks and there has already been speculation that the issue could lead to “mechanical failures and vibration-induced fatigue.”

FromMyColdDeadHand

05-16-22, 14:47

How to recruit female pilots….

sgtrock82

05-16-22, 16:35

FromMyColdDeadHand

05-16-22, 19:13

mack7.62

05-16-22, 19:42

I remember back around the time the Navy retired the F-14 there was some pretty serious talk going around about buying SU-27 bare airframes, installing US engines and avionics as a replacement and save tens or millions or dollars by doing so.

gsd2053

05-17-22, 10:38

It has no diversity. Diversity is a strength. Just a bunch of White European Males.

utahjeepr

05-17-22, 11:16

FromMyColdDeadHand

05-17-22, 11:26

It has no diversity. Diversity is a strength. Just a bunch of White European Males.

I’ve been waiting for some reporter to ask Gen Miley to compare and contrast the Ukrainian and Russian DEI programs and how that fits into our strategic alliance preference…

WillBrink

05-17-22, 13:11

We shouldn't be surprised since the purpose of weapons these days is more about lining the pockets of those selling them rather than their actual value on the battlefield to the buyer and user.

I bet they get more value out of their flailing helicopter fleet than we will with our littoral combat ships.

I almost laughed at the idea of the Russians potentially calling their helicopters "unsafe". Is there even a Russian word for "unsafe"?

Sent from my BE2028 using Tapatalk

These days? Did you read "War is a racket" ?

Was a book written by Major General Smedley Butler. At the time of his writing the book, he was the most decorated soldier in US history, a 2 time recipient of the MOH and others. If anyone has an inside track on war, it was General Butler. No one can say he was some liberal pacifist type who didn't understand war. When did he write it? 1935. Yes, 1935, well before the term "military industrial complex" was mentioned and warned of by another highly decorated and respected general and then POTUS, Dwight D. Eisenhower who coined the term in 1961 during his farewell speech.

Unfortunately, not all wars can be avoided, some are necessary to the preservation and sovereignty of a nation, but make no mistake about it, those who know war better than most, have been aware a long time it's a racket and $ making machine often driven by people who don't give a damn about how many die in the process.

Lucky for you, General Butler's book is free, and reading it will open some eyes - be you warrior or anti war or something between - to the fact that's not even remotely a new concept. Read it, and view it from the modern lens...

https://ratical.org/ratville/CAH/warisaracket.pdf

FriendlyStranger

05-17-22, 13:43

The Russian Terminator tank is already in Ukraine near the front line

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tCMIFbreaj0

gsd2053

05-17-22, 14:29

I’ve been waiting for some reporter to ask Gen Miley to compare and contrast the Ukrainian and Russian DEI programs and how that fits into our strategic alliance preference…

Yep, Forbes says Ukraine has their own "Brigayd." Complete with Unicorn patches and everything. They cum hardened for battle with big guns.

Sorry yall, butt this is the future. You're just going to man up and bend over and take it.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/jamiewareham/2022/03/16/ukrainian-lgbtq-soldiers-fight-against-darkness-of-russian-invasion/?sh=7ee743983177

mack7.62

05-17-22, 14:30

The Russian Terminator tank is already in Ukraine near the front line

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tCMIFbreaj0

The Terminator is optimized for urban fighting, shooting at the tops of high rises, so they show up 2 1/2 months late and when Russia is no longer fighting in cities, bout right.

1168

05-17-22, 15:18

The Terminator is optimized for urban fighting, shooting at the tops of high rises, so they show up 2 1/2 months late and when Russia is no longer fighting in cities, bout right.

They showed up via rail car very early on but in laughably inadequate numbers. Leaving their tanks unprotected against light infantry, with the expected results. IIRC, they’re supposed to have 1 for every 2 tanks for open, old school battle, and 2 for every tank for urban combat. There are a few reasons they haven’t been fielded on that scale.

10 page, easy read: https://www.benning.army.mil/armor/earmor/content/issues/2020/Fall/4Chesley20.pdf

SeriousStudent

05-17-22, 20:01

Yep, Forbes says Ukraine has their own "Brigayd." Complete with Unicorn patches and everything. They cum hardened for battle with big guns.

Sorry yall, butt this is the future. You're just going to man up and bend over and take it.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/jamiewareham/2022/03/16/ukrainian-lgbtq-soldiers-fight-against-darkness-of-russian-invasion/?sh=7ee743983177

Again, keep the politics out of the thread. Last warning.

Wake27

05-17-22, 21:36

WillBrink

05-18-22, 10:28

They showed up via rail car very early on but in laughably inadequate numbers. Leaving their tanks unprotected against light infantry, with the expected results. IIRC, they’re supposed to have 1 for every 2 tanks for open, old school battle, and 2 for every tank for urban combat. There are a few reasons they haven’t been fielded on that scale.

10 page, easy read: https://www.benning.army.mil/armor/earmor/content/issues/2020/Fall/4Chesley20.pdf

Their best tank, the T90 is not fairing well either. Typical of Russian stuff, it's more show than go. "On paper" the T90 sounds pretty impressive, on par with other MBT from handful of countries. In reality, sounds like typical Russian stuff where corners cut, unreliable systems, armor not actually as good etc as claimed and so forth. I'm biased, but seems to me the Abrams, much less the most recent version, would mop the floor with T90s in battle and survive much of what the Ukes using to take them out, but only conjecture on my end.

glocktogo

05-18-22, 14:26

Their best tank, the T90 is not fairing well either. Typical of Russian stuff, it's more show than go. "On paper" the T90 sounds pretty impressive, on par with other MBT from handful of countries. In reality, sounds like typical Russian stuff where corners cut, unreliable systems, armor not actually as good etc as claimed and so forth. I'm biased, but seems to me the Abrams, much less the most recent version, would mop the floor with T90s in battle and survive much of what the Ukes using to take them out, but only conjecture on my end.

Pretty sure our targeting systems, not to mention command and control are worlds ahead of the Russians. Those are the things it takes to win battles.

WillBrink

05-18-22, 16:30

Pretty sure our targeting systems, not to mention command and control are worlds ahead of the Russians. Those are the things it takes to win battles.

The M1A2 SEP V4 takes it to another level:

https://nationalinterest.org/blog/reboot/coming-soon-newm1a2-sep-v4-abrams-super-tank-187350

Diamondback

05-18-22, 22:49

Their best tank, the T90 is not fairing well either. Typical of Russian stuff, it's more show than go. "On paper" the T90 sounds pretty impressive, on par with other MBT from handful of countries. In reality, sounds like typical Russian stuff where corners cut, unreliable systems, armor not actually as good etc as claimed and so forth. I'm biased, but seems to me the Abrams, much less the most recent version, would mop the floor with T90s in battle and survive much of what the Ukes using to take them out, but only conjecture on my end.

In fact, all T90 is is a rebranded and lightly upgraded T72. Needed a new name 'cuz it's hard to sell a tank that people watched go Jack-in-the-Box every night live on CNN...

mack7.62

05-19-22, 07:37

This war has not been kind to the Russian arms industry foreign sales division, about the only weapon that is working well is their cruise missiles, if you want to blow up high rise apartment buildings from a distance buy Russian. Course they can't build them without Western components but I am sure France and Germany will find a way to keep the supply going.

WillBrink

05-19-22, 10:55

In fact, all T90 is is a rebranded and lightly upgraded T72. Needed a new name 'cuz it's hard to sell a tank that people watched go Jack-in-the-Box every night live on CNN...

I'd read that about the T80, didn't know it applied to the 90. They have a new "super tank" that makes all kinds of claims it will match or exceed the Abrams, but the Russians lie bigly about the capabilities of their kit, and for some reason, people believe it.

1168

05-19-22, 11:06

That's crazy, I've never actually heard of that.

Yeah, there’s no Western equivalent that I can think of off the top of my head. Experience getting ambushed in mountain passes or in urban terrain in Afghanistan, Chechnya, and Syria made them want something that can traverse and elevate rapidly like a ZSU 23-4, but with tank armor and no radar. Also, autocannons are good for destroying infantry/irregulars inside residential/commercial type structures without dropping the whole structure or breaching the shit out of walls (making loopholes for more enemy to take advantage of) like tank main guns and arty.

Also, I seem to remember hearing about some agreement or treaty or whatever that limited the number of tanks, sorta like Versailles, so they found creative uses for T72 hulls. I’ll try to figure out later if thats rumor bullshit or not and get back to you.

The ATGMs would be useful in open tank combat, I would think.

Retrofit kits could be aimed at the export market, perhaps someone buying newer tanks and looking for something to do with their older ones.

A uniquely Russian technique of avoiding having competent Infantry and Cav Scouts. They try to use armor or arty for everything. Even the VDV uses tanks.

Diamondback

05-19-22, 11:24

Yeah, there’s no Western equivalent that I can think of off the top of my head. Experience getting ambushed in mountain passes or in urban terrain in Afghanistan, Chechnya, and Syria made them want something that can traverse and elevate rapidly like a ZSU 23-4, but with tank armor and no radar. Also, autocannons are good for destroying infantry/irregulars inside residential/commercial type structures without dropping the whole structure or breaching the shit out of walls (making loopholes for more enemy to take advantage of) like tank main guns and arty.

Also, I seem to remember hearing about some agreement or treaty or whatever that limited the number of tanks, sorta like Versailles, so they found creative uses for T72 hulls. I’ll try to figure out later if thats rumor bullshit or not and get back to you.

The ATGMs would be useful in open tank combat, I would think.

Retrofit kits could be aimed at the export market, perhaps someone buying newer tanks and looking for something to do with their older ones.

A uniquely Russian technique of avoiding having competent Infantry and Cav Scouts. They try to use armor or arty for everything. Even the VDV uses tanks.

2S6 Tunguska, IIRC... I hated those damn things in combat flight sims.

Johnny Rico

05-19-22, 12:06

Question for those more familiar than I.

Is any MBT's active protection system capable of defeating a swarm ATGM attack? Like 4-6 Javelins fired at once upon a single target?

1168

05-19-22, 12:32

2S6 Tunguska, IIRC... I hated those damn things in combat flight sims.
Tunguska is focused on shooting flying things; its the successor to Shilka, I think. Terminator is focused on shooting ground targets.

Diamondback

05-19-22, 12:39

Question for those more familiar than I.

Is any MBT's active protection system capable of defeating a swarm ATGM attack? Like 4-6 Javelins fired at once upon a single target?

If you have enough tanks with the Arena system clustered together, each tank picks its own missile to engage.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arena_(countermeasure)

One tank probably not, a platoon close together maybe.

glocktogo

05-19-22, 16:19

2S6 Tunguska, IIRC... I hated those damn things in combat flight sims.

You mean like this one? :)

http://players.brightcove.net/77374810001/HLNhtvNKjM_default/index.html?videoId=3303670006001

utahjeepr

05-19-22, 17:41

I'd read that about the T80, didn't know it applied to the 90. They have a new "super tank" that makes all kinds of claims it will match or exceed the Abrams, but the Russians lie bigly about the capabilities of their kit, and for some reason, people believe it.

Nah, the T80 is another old Soviet Era tank. Turbine powered tank built parallel with the T72. T90 is the "improved and modernized" T72, and there are legit improvements albeit minor ones. Still, for all intents and purposes it's a "T72A2" not a new design.

Their new "Bad Boy" tank is the T14 "Armata" but only a small number were built, they are basically smoke.

fred

05-19-22, 19:10

Now that we're sending shiploads of heavy equipment, I am far more worried about the Russian Navy. While their naval tradition isn't one of glorious victories, their subs can still sink giant merchant ships.

The Dumb Gun Collector

05-19-22, 21:59

1168

05-20-22, 04:12

Question for those more familiar than I.

Is any MBT's active protection system capable of defeating a swarm ATGM attack? Like 4-6 Javelins fired at once upon a single target?
The info you seek is here:
https://mwi.usma.edu/on-killing-tanks/
Russian tank vulnerabilities include: overwhelming attacks, rear of turret, or vertical top attack.

Alpha-17

05-20-22, 08:16

I'd read that about the T80, didn't know it applied to the 90. They have a new "super tank" that makes all kinds of claims it will match or exceed the Abrams, but the Russians lie bigly about the capabilities of their kit, and for some reason, people believe it.

I'm pretty sure I've posted this before, but it definitely is worth posting again.

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52085465712_ced4eecaec_z.jpg

Question for those more familiar than I.

Is any MBT's active protection system capable of defeating a swarm ATGM attack? Like 4-6 Javelins fired at once upon a single target?

Nope. Any active protection system can be overwhelmed by the volume of incoming fire, even assuming it has a good computer and is capable of tracking and making the decision to fire at multiple incoming threats. It only has so many counter charges to fire, and can only fire so many in a limited time.

mack7.62

05-20-22, 09:13

Well given the number of tank loses Russia has suffered in Ukraine the Russian APS either:
A. Doesn't work very well
B. Is only installed on tanks that are used for the Victory Day Parade
C. All of the above

1168

05-20-22, 10:09

FromMyColdDeadHand

05-20-22, 13:31

FriendlyStranger

05-20-22, 14:31

So the Russians air assets have neither been able to prevent the flying of UKR planes and at the same time haven’t been able to exploit even temporary dominance to leverage ground advances. But in a bigger picture, or Putin menacing NATO, how could the Russians be expected to do any better than the Iraqi Air Force against the Western Airforces? And that was with out F22s? I know there are IFF issues in the Ukrainian theater, but after hearing how awesome their advanced fighters are and how the S-2/3/400 systems keep birds from flying - they sure seem to have a lot of underperforming. Faced with AWACS support, F22 running CAP, F15E/F35 strike/interdiction, A10s slinging lead, and F16s just generally jacking with stuff, it sure seems like the Russians would be having a hard time coping with that?

The Red army has a lot of artillery which forced Azov underground.

Ukraine doesn't seem to have that kind of firepower in some locations to do the same to Red army fallback positions and artillery emplacements.

Pro Red army youtube channel:

Statement from Ukrainian 3rd Battalion of the 115th Brigade: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5YrrdDtycrk

If Ukrainians had the kind of support you're talking about we all know what the results would be:

About 40 US soldiers held off hundreds of Russian mercenaries in a brutal firefight in Syria
https://www.businessinsider.com/us-soldiers-held-off-hundreds-of-russian-mercenaries-in-syria-firefight-2018-5

Roughly 40 US commandos held off about 500 forces loyal to the Syrian government and President Bashar Assad — including Russian mercenaries — in an intense firefight in early February, The New York Times reported Thursday, citing interviews and newly obtained documents.

According to the report, the February 7 battle lasted four hours, and by the end 200 to 300 of the pro-government forces had been killed, while all the US troops involved emerged unharmed.

The Russian government says only four of its citizens were killed in the battle, but other reports suggest dozens died.

Most of the forces the US commandos faced in the firefight, which took place at an outpost next to a Conoco gas station in eastern Syria, were Russian mercenaries thought to be linked to the Wagner Group, The Times reported.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDWw-Zjwxaw

FriendlyStranger

05-20-22, 21:24

Pro Red army youtube channel is saying Denys Prokopenko had to be taken away in an armored vehicle for safety reasons. No images released so far.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0GaoTJ4lKA

https://twitter.com/KyivIndependent/status/1527612106899705862

The Kyiv Independent
@KyivIndependent
⚡️Azov commander says wounded Azovstal defenders evacuated to Russian-occupied cities received necessary medical treatment.

In his video address published on May 20, Denys Prokopenko didn’t specify whether it was provided before or after the evacuation.

The Kyiv Independent
@KyivIndependent
·
14h
Replying to
@KyivIndependent
As for the evacuation of the dead soldiers from Azovstal, “the process continues,” he said. “I hope that in the near future relatives and the whole of Ukraine will be able to bury the soldiers with honors,” Prokopenko said.

Azov battalion releases another video amid questions over how many fighters remain in Mariupol
https://www.bostonglobe.com/2022/05/20/world/azov-battalion-releases-another-video-amid-questions-over-how-many-fighters-remain-mariupol/

The Dumb Gun Collector

05-20-22, 21:38

How dumb and incompetent are the Russians??

This was the super-stronk elite Russian cops OMON and SOBR who used to put on shirtless displays (much to the excitement of the Russophiles). These guys got F'd up bad....

KNOW NO MERCY: THE RUSSIAN COPS WHO TRIED TO STORM KYIV BY THEMSELVES

https://thedebrief.org/know-no-mercy-the-russian-cops-who-tried-to-storm-kyiv-by-themselves/

The lead Tiger armored truck suddenly exploded as Hell’s fury rained against a dissonant clear sky just as the armored truck crossed over the bridge. Chunks of metal and body parts were flung in all directions. Sweltering flames angrily lashed out from the contorted truck’s remains.

The pursuing BTR and trucks screamed to a halt as their driver’s desperately tried to avoid the same fate. This was futile. The officers had ensnared themselves within a fatal funnel on the bridge, and now it was just a turkey shoot for Kyiv’s defenders.

Next, the BTR collapsed in agony as an anti-tank missile gashed open its hull, transforming the armored personnel carrier into a scalding metal sarcophagus.

Machine-gun fire crackled from the opposite bank while well-placed mortars joined in the symphony of destruction. Shell fragments, sizzling bits of metal, and clumps of concrete rained down as Kyiv’s defenders poured out their indignation.

Roughly 100 feet back, the lead KaMaz truck filled with OMON officers sat idly watching the carnage unfold. The vehicle’s driver had already been shot dead or was perhaps rendered immobile by fear.

It didn’t matter. A massive fireball tore through the truck in the next instant, blowing its armored shell to pieces and twisting its carbon steel frame like Silly Putty.

Kyiv
Remains of KaMaz armored truck on the Irpin River Bridge. (Image Source: Anonymous citizen/ Dattalion)
At least five OMON officers, fully engulfed, made it out of the truck. Only one would make it as far as the opposite guardrail before succumbing to the inferno. The misshapen corpse lay smoldering on the payment, an RPK machine gun still clutched within the blackened remains.

The remaining OMON and SOBR officers quickly dismounted, widely firing their rifles in the general direction of Kyiv, desperate to avoid war’s insatiable appetite for death.

One-by-one, the remaining vehicles were engulfed by a hornet’s nest of varied ordnance. The cool pavement stained bright red as 7.62 mm bullets and burning shrapnel tore through those officers who were “fortunate” enough to make it out of the inferno.

In all, the Kemerovo Officers had lasted less than 24-hours in war. Their Battle for the Irpin River Bridge was mere minutes.

Smoldering in a cacophony of violence, what had once been a convoy of military vehicles and nearly 80 specialized police officers, had been rendered to an unrecognizable heap of burning debris and twisted scrap metal.

A single pale blue smog-camo jacket lay destitute on the pavement amongst shards of broken glass. Streams of thick black smoke poured skyward, temporarily shielding onlookers from the carnage.

Though asinine at this point, the Kemerovo Officers never actually achieved their singular, albeit ambiguous, primary goal. Half a mile from Kyiv’s city limits, the group’s remains lay in a burning waste.

68129

alx01

05-21-22, 02:34

Christo Grozev, a Russia expert, believes GRU and FSB elites are the most likely to try and topple Putin, because they know the truth of what is happening on the ground.
And those elites are already looking for ways to move their money and families out of the country in anticipation of Putin falling, Grozev claims.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10833839/Ukraine-war-Putins-security-officials-know-war-lost-analyst-says.html

Let me summarize the article. Feel free to correct:
Cancer stricken Putin who has dementia and gone crazy (according to earlier dailymail articles) with only a few months to live, only refrains from using nuclear weapons because he's not sure if the command chain complies. Meanwhile, incompetent top intelligence officers (again, according to some earlier dailymail articles) are planning a coup against Putin alone and not the whole Russian leadership, while trying to move their families and corruption money overseas. They have not done so yet, because they first need to convert their corruption money to Dollars and Euros while under sanctions and exclusion of Russian banks from the international transaction system.

And Russian intelligence officers are trying to do that, not because they disagree with the war; or the use of nuclear weapons; or because they repented their corruption and other sins and want to lead a righteous life, but "because they know the truth of what is happening on the ground."

Totally sounds like a reliable story for an adult audience... A Zombie apocalypses in The Walking Dead is closer to reality than this nonsense.

EDIT: To give a benefit of the doubt - if claims in this article do turn out to be true and my skepticism proves wrong; I really wish somebody would write a book about a first hand experience in that environment.

1168

05-21-22, 06:12

Also, I seem to remember hearing about some agreement or treaty or whatever that limited the number of tanks, sorta like Versailles, so they found creative uses for T72 hulls. I’ll try to figure out later if thats rumor bullshit or not and get back to you.

OK, I found it. Its called the Treaty on Conventional Armed Forces in Europe, Paris 1990. Treaty limited equipment (TLE) include, but are not limited to, Tanks, Arty, Armored Combat Vehicles (ACVs). Ceilings are:
20k tanks
20k arty pieces
30k ACVs
Popping the turret off a T72 and turning it into a Terminator would change its category from Tank to ACV. It looks like Russia experimented with finding other (non-mil) uses for tank hulls to comply with that treaty, although it also appears as though they never intended to comply with other parts of the treaty, so their motives in converting may have had nothing to do with the treaty. For example, they tried to be slick and say they only needed to reduce their arty by 500 to get in compliance, with western intel expecting them to need to reduce by 5,000 instead. They also provided less than the number of known sites for inspection, and failed to facilitate and comply with inspections. And they are known to have possessed more than 30k ACVs at a time, and less than 20k tanks at the same time. Its hard for me to dredge up useful numbers to compare by year right now, because a)Russia lies, so all numbers are estimates and b)all current thoughts on Russian armored strength are focused on 2022, which is well after they left the treaty.

There were other vehicle types, like airplanes, listed as TLE, also.

The Dumb Gun Collector

05-21-22, 19:18

SIR! HE IS AN EXPERT!!!

I share your skepticism. But since I hate Putin and his thugs I posted it for y'all's consideration.

Let me summarize the article. Feel free to correct:
Cancer stricken Putin who has dementia and gone crazy (according to earlier dailymail articles) with only a few months to live, only refrains from using nuclear weapons because he's not sure if the command chain complies. Meanwhile, incompetent top intelligence officers (again, according to some earlier dailymail articles) are planning a coup against Putin alone and not the whole Russian leadership, while trying to move their families and corruption money overseas. They have not done so yet, because they first need to convert their corruption money to Dollars and Euros while under sanctions and exclusion of Russian banks from the international transaction system.

And Russian intelligence officers are trying to do that, not because they disagree with the war; or the use of nuclear weapons; or because they repented their corruption and other sins and want to lead a righteous life, but "because they know the truth of what is happening on the ground."

Totally sounds like a reliable story for an adult audience... A Zombie apocalypses in The Walking Dead is closer to reality than this nonsense.

EDIT: To give a benefit of the doubt - if claims in this article do turn out to be true and my skepticism proves wrong; I really wish somebody would write a book about a first hand experience in that environment.

Leuthas

05-21-22, 21:33

M4C's standard for what are 'verifiable sources' has gone way the **** down. Came looking for thoughts on the subject from resident SMEs and I find links to anonymous twitters and politcal clickbait like daily mail.

mack7.62

05-21-22, 22:19

This is the social media war, don't know how much more verifiable you can get than drone footage of Russian tanks actually blowing up. There are reliable sources on twitter but no it's nowhere near 100%, but you can find recent video footage and judge for yourself.

mack7.62

05-22-22, 07:59

They showed up via rail car very early on but in laughably inadequate numbers. Leaving their tanks unprotected against light infantry, with the expected results. IIRC, they’re supposed to have 1 for every 2 tanks for open, old school battle, and 2 for every tank for urban combat. There are a few reasons they haven’t been fielded on that scale.

10 page, easy read: https://www.benning.army.mil/armor/earmor/content/issues/2020/Fall/4Chesley20.pdf

Well turns out Russia doesn't have enough Terminator's to make much of a difference, only 10.

https://twitter.com/KyivIndependent/status/1528269048831787009

The Kyiv Independent
@KyivIndependent
⚡️ UK Defense Ministry: Sieverodonetsk area remains Russia’s tactical priority.

According to the U.K., Russia’s only operational company of BMP-T Terminator tank support vehicles has likely been deployed to the Sieverodonetsk axis of the Donbas offensive.

The Kyiv Independent
@KyivIndependent
The U.K. intelligence added that with a maximum of 10 Terminators deployed, they are unlikely to impact the campaign drastically.

1168

05-22-22, 09:26

Well turns out Russia doesn't have enough Terminator's to make much of a difference, only 10.

https://twitter.com/KyivIndependent/status/1528269048831787009

The Kyiv Independent
@KyivIndependent
⚡️ UK Defense Ministry: Sieverodonetsk area remains Russia’s tactical priority.

According to the U.K., Russia’s only operational company of BMP-T Terminator tank support vehicles has likely been deployed to the Sieverodonetsk axis of the Donbas offensive.

The Kyiv Independent
@KyivIndependent
The U.K. intelligence added that with a maximum of 10 Terminators deployed, they are unlikely to impact the campaign drastically.

9 was the number observed moving to the border at the beginning. Its been a hilarious inside joke. Along with their aircraft carrier being in drydock, it was clear that they were questionably prepared for an invasion.

mack7.62

05-22-22, 10:13

Diamondback

05-22-22, 10:23

Don't forget the T-14 Armata that has been showing up at the Victory Parade for 8 years now. Also recent reports of more and more BMP-1's showing up in Ukraine, appears Russia is running low on the newer/better equipment.

There is also the fact that historically Russian strategy has been to lead with the second-line stuff--they expect heavy casualties early so hold the good stuff back until they see where the thicker fighting is. My suspicion is their really top-tier, at least what they pass for it, stuff is all in very limited numbers and primarily held back for the parades.

I still think we should arrange with Elbit or whoever owns the A-10 design after Fairchild's various mergers and sales to reopen the line and flood Euro skies with 'em.

"Nice toys... Mr. Hog will see them and raise with BRRRRT."

1168

05-22-22, 11:22

Don't forget the T-14 Armata that has been showing up at the Victory Parade for 8 years now. Also recent reports of more and more BMP-1's showing up in Ukraine, appears Russia is running low on the newer/better equipment. The T-15 version of the Armata is the excuse for not getting enough Terminators. I say excuse, not reason, for a reason.

There is also the fact that historically Russian strategy has been to lead with the second-line stuff--they expect heavy casualties early so hold the good stuff back until they see where the thicker fighting is. My suspicion is their really top-tier, at least what they pass for it, stuff is all in very limited numbers and primarily held back for the parades.

For the most part, they engaged their upper-tier early on.

mack7.62

05-22-22, 13:40

I sure would hate to be a Russian tanker. Looks like 3 guys were riding on top, possibly another tank crew, survived the hit that set the turret ammo on fire and it looks like the driver managed to bail out so that is 4 lucky tankers.

https://twitter.com/Blue_Sauron/status/1528436675663241219

BlueSauron��️
@Blue_Sauron
Russian T-72B3 tank chased down by the Ukrainian 79th Air Assault Brigade in Donetsk Oblast.
#Russia #Ukraine

FromMyColdDeadHand

05-22-22, 14:08

I sure would hate to be a Russian tanker.

https://twitter.com/Blue_Sauron/status/1528436675663241219

BlueSauron��️
@Blue_Sauron
Russian T-72B3 tank chased down by the Ukrainian 79th Air Assault Brigade in Donetsk Oblast.
#Russia #Ukraine

What is that song in the background? I hear it a lot in these videos.

mack7.62

05-23-22, 08:06

Looks like Russia "broke into the wrong damn rec room".

https://twitter.com/ukraine_world/status/1528652522403004417

UkraineWorld
@ukraine_world
In the first 3 months of its so-called "special military operation" in Ukraine, Russia has likely suffered a similar death toll to that experienced by the Soviet Union during its 9-year war in Afghanistan.
Quote Tweet
Ministry of Defence ��
@DefenceHQ

United Kingdom government organization
· 8h
Latest Defence Intelligence update on the situation in Ukraine - 23 May 2022

Find out more about the UK government's response: http://ow.ly/TRRL50Jf6E5

�� #StandWithUkraine ��
Show this thread

mack7.62

05-23-22, 08:16

Another case of Russia breaking it's word, again.

https://twitter.com/PaulNiland/status/1528724714625159172

Paul Niland
@PaulNiland
There's no such thing as the "Donetsk People's Republic", quoting this non-entity as a source gives them recognition and status that is undeserved. They're Russian puppets. This move comes from Moscow, not Donetsk.
Quote Tweet
Samuel Ramani
@SamRamani2
· 37m
BREAKING: The Donetsk People's Republic confirms that it will hold tribunals for Azovstal steel fighters

mack7.62

05-24-22, 09:05

Interesting. What does this say about the Russian AF that they are giving mercenaries ground attack planes.

https://twitter.com/RALee85/status/1529099517005639682

Rob Lee
@RALee85
The BBC confirmed Ukraine's claim that retired Russian Major General Kanamat Botashev was shot down, possibly by a Stinger MANPADS, in a Su-25 aircraft near Popasna on Sunday and killed. It appears he was flying for Wagner.
https://bbc.com/russian/features-61559430

Rob Lee
@RALee85
Botashev was a former regimental commander but was forced to retire after he decided to take a Su-27 fighter for a joyride and crashed it while performing acrobatics. 2/

mack7.62

05-24-22, 12:01

Dang it's getting harder to be a war criminal now days.

https://twitter.com/KyivIndependent/status/1529143929077121025

The Kyiv Independent
@KyivIndependent
⚡️Prosecutors identify 8 Russians involved in war crimes in Ukraine.

Prosecutor General Iryna Venediktova said that they had taken part in the murder of the mayor of Motyzhyn in Kyiv Oblast and the torture of Ukrainian civilians.

These include Oleg Krikunov, Chingis Gonchikov, Alexander Vanchikov, Magomedmirza Suleymanov and Vitaly Dmitriev, who belong to Russia’s 37th motorized infantry brigade, as well as Sergei Sazanov, Sergey Sazonov and Alexander Stupnitsky from Wagner, a Russian military contractor.

Wake27

05-24-22, 12:31

mack7.62

05-24-22, 12:50

I don't believe Wagner is really a PMC, more like a de facto private army of Russian President Vladimir Putin so yeah they get whatever Putin wants them to have. But if the Russian AF was performing up to snuff there would be no need to hire a retired General to perform CAS. Of course him getting shot down does prove the AF was right to be timid, I bet the Russian pilots were happier than the Ukrainians that he got shot down "see we told you it's not safe".

mack7.62

05-25-22, 08:26

Documented Russian tank losses. Likely hundreds more with no photo or video record or that can't be identified as Russian or Ukrainian.

(711, of which destroyed: 389, damaged: 22, abandoned: 54, captured: 243)

https://twitter.com/oryxspioenkop/status/1529379155028152322

Oryx
@oryxspioenkop
#UkraineWar: Russia is now visually confirmed to have lost 700 tanks since it began its invasion of Ukraine three months ago.

This includes:

- 18 T-64s
- 417 T-72s
- 133 T-80s
- 20 T-90s
- 112 Unknown tanks

Full list: https://oryxspioenkop.com/2022/02/attack-on-europe-documenting-equipment.html

mack7.62

05-25-22, 08:31

See above.

https://twitter.com/UAWeapons/status/1529404520828133380

Ukraine Weapons Tracker
@UAWeapons
#Ukraine: Videos recently appeared showing ancient T-62M & T-62MV tanks being moved from military storage in Rostov Oblast & Crimea, for possible use in UA.

These are stored in the Russian mobilisation reserve- but most were already donated to Tajikistan, LNA (Libya) & Syria.

It is quite possible that these relics will be transferred to LNR/DNR forces, as previously other vintage equipment was delivered to them from Russia, including Grad-1 MLRS and MT-12 AT guns.

But we can't rule out that in the end they will be used by Russian troops.

The T-62 series is inferior to others in UA in many ways- armour, gun, optics/FCS & 4-man crew.

The latter is quite a serious issue, as all other Russian MBT have 3 crew members, but to normally operate a T-62 a loader is required- how many trained crews Russia has is uncertain.

FriendlyStranger

05-25-22, 19:17

Apparently things aren't looking so good in Ukraine.

Hope everyone has a good drone or knows a good drone operator.

Red army taking Ukrainian trenches.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3P9iTRq58fo

The red army has apparently decommunized Svetlodarsk: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gVzxQb2UorE

(NSFW) Russian Filmmaker's Mariupol Documentary Trailer Already Released
https://funker530.com/video/nsfw-russian-filmmakers-mariupol-documentary-trailer-already-released/

The trailer for a Russian filmmaker's documentary about the Siege of Mariupol has already been released. The footage is brutal and surprisingly honest from this perspective.

Currently, we don't know what the full tone of this documentary is going to be. If I were a betting man, I would have my money on the fact that the filmmaker's bias will bleed through in almost every way. I hope that I am wrong however, and what we end up with is a shocking and real tale from the Russian perspective, showing the challenges the average Russian Soldier faced day-to-day during the Siege of Mariupol.

FriendlyStranger

05-25-22, 19:30

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6s_ZvzXzPT8

Extracts from Putin's speech on Ukraine
https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/extracts-putins-speech-ukraine-2022-02-21/

"As a result of Bolshevik policy, Soviet Ukraine arose, which even today can with good reason be called 'Vladimir Ilyich Lenin's Ukraine'. He is its author and architect. This is fully confirmed by archive documents ... And now grateful descendants have demolished monuments to Lenin in Ukraine. This is what they call decommunisation. Do you want decommunisation? Well, that suits us just fine. But it is unnecessary, as they say, to stop halfway. We are ready to show you what real decommunisation means for Ukraine."

ON UKRAINIAN STATEHOOD

"Ukraine never had a tradition of genuine statehood."

The Dumb Gun Collector

05-25-22, 20:58

MAN! That trench video was intense. RIP to the Ukrainian defenders.

The Dumb Gun Collector

05-25-22, 21:01

That is an insane amount of destroyed armor.

Documented Russian tank losses. Likely hundreds more with no photo or video record or that can't be identified as Russian or Ukrainian.

(711, of which destroyed: 389, damaged: 22, abandoned: 54, captured: 243)

https://twitter.com/oryxspioenkop/status/1529379155028152322

Oryx
@oryxspioenkop
#UkraineWar: Russia is now visually confirmed to have lost 700 tanks since it began its invasion of Ukraine three months ago.

This includes:

- 18 T-64s
- 417 T-72s
- 133 T-80s
- 20 T-90s
- 112 Unknown tanks

Full list: https://oryxspioenkop.com/2022/02/attack-on-europe-documenting-equipment.html

The Dumb Gun Collector

05-25-22, 21:40

Russia’s Shrinking War
The goals of Russia’s invasion keep getting smaller. But its depleted military is still failing to make major advances, and time is on Ukraine’s side.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2022/05/24/world/europe/russia-shrinking-war-ukraine.html?name=styln-russia-ukraine&region=TOP_BANNER&block=storyline_menu_recirc&action=click&pgtype=LegacyCollection&variant=show&is_new=false

Also...

Russia raises army age limit to 50

Olga Ivshina
BBC Russian senior correspondent
Russian soldiers
Getty ImagesCopyright: Getty Images
The Russian parliament has passed a law raising the age limit for people signing up to the army to 50.

It follows ongoing attempts by Russian officials to recruit more soldiers as Russian casualties in Ukraine mount.

Under current legislation, only Russians aged 18 to 40 and foreigners aged 18 to 30 can enlist as professional soldiers in the Russian military.

“Highly professional specialists are needed to use high-precision weapons and operate weapons and military equipment” and such specialists may be aged 40 to 45, said a note accompanying the draft bill.

According to the new law Russian citizens and foreigners up to the age of 50 will be able to sign a contract with the military.

The note said the amendment would also help attract those in civilian professions to join the army, including medics, engineers and communications experts.

Since the start of the war in Ukraine, the Russian Ministry of Defence and the so-called Wagner private military company have launched a vast and persistent campaign to recruit new soldiers both officially and unofficially.

Based on open sources, BBC Russian has identified at least 46 Russians aged over 45 who have been killed in Ukraine after the start of the invasion. This includes a 63-year-old retired general, who was shot down operating a Su-25 fighter jet.

mack7.62

05-25-22, 22:04

Two interesting tidbits about Russian tanks, possible pulling ancient T-62's out of mothballs because all their more modern tanks use Western electronics. But they are going to have to train up a lot of loaders in a hurry. And two the reason they have not built more T-14 Armata's is because they have limited numbers of the very large Western supplied machine tools needed and since 2014 sanctions they could not get more so they have been used on T-90 production.

Trent Telenko
@TrentTelenko
It looks like the Russians are going for T-62M's because they don't require western electronics for their fire control like the T-90 or updated T-72 tanks.

The T-62M was an early 1980's upgrade so there are likely warehouses of that era Russian electronics available.

Ryan C
@LIM49Spartan
Replying to
@LIM49Spartan
and
@TrentTelenko
This explains why no new Bumerang or Armata production for eight years -- all the machine tools of required size are tied up in the T-90 program; and there's no way to import more to set up a new line thanks to 2014+ sanctions.

FromMyColdDeadHand

05-26-22, 11:21

There is a lesson here for our weapon systems that rely on Chinese, or other countries that could be compromised by the ChiComs, for our electronics.

mack7.62

05-26-22, 12:03

The Stinger is a good example, don't make any for 15 years then all of a sudden use a bunch of them and want more but the components used to build Stingers are no longer made.

glocktogo

05-26-22, 13:55

The Stinger is a good example, don't make any for 15 years then all of a sudden use a bunch of them and want more but the components used to build Stingers are no longer made.

Further evidence that the US Government is stupendously incompetent. :(

Diamondback

05-26-22, 13:57

Further evidence that the US Government is stupendously incompetent. :(

Hence the importance of at least minimum-rate perpetual production on critical systems...

FriendlyStranger

05-27-22, 00:39

Total decommunization

Russia pounds Ukraine’s Donbas as war hits ‘maximum intensity’ on eastern front
https://www.cbc.ca/player/play/2037302851659

The fighting in Eastern Ukraine’s Donbas region has reached ‘maximum intensity,’ according to Ukrainian officials who say their troops are being outnumbered by Russian forces, which are heavily shelling supply lines and escape routes in the east.

Russian forces move closer to encircling Ukrainian troops in the east
https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/ukraine-invasion-day-92-1.6466343

"Recent Russian gains offer a sobering check on expectations for the near term," tweeted defence analyst Michael Kofman, director of Russian studies at the U.S.-based CNA think-tank.

Russian troops have broken through Ukrainian lines at Popasna, south of Severodonetsk, and are threatening to encircle Ukrainian forces, he wrote.

Ukrainian interior ministry adviser Vadym Denisenko told a briefing that 25 Russian battalions were attempting to surround the Ukrainian forces.

The head of Ukraine's armed forces, Valery Zaluzhny, called for more help from the West, particularly "weapons that will allow us to hit the enemy at a big distance," using the social media platform Telegram.

Russia's foreign minister, Sergei Lavrov, later warned that any supplies of weapons that could reach Russian territory would be a "a serious step towards unacceptable escalation."

Russia Uses Incendiary Munitions Against Ukrainian Forces
https://funker530.com/video/russia-uses-incendiary-munitions-against-ukrainian-forces/

FriendlyStranger

05-27-22, 10:31

The Red army is looking battle hardened and gaining valuable experience.

Do some of you still think it was a bad decision for Westerners to go over there?

https://funker530.com/video/american-volunteer-knocks-out-russian-btr-with-rgw90-launcher/

Helmet cam footage shows an American foreign volunteer hitting a Russian BTR-80 armored personnel carrier with a German RGW-90 HH rocket propelled grenade type launcher. A second angle of the incident is recorded by a drone and shows the Russian vehicle come to a halt inside the woodline while its stored ammo begins cooking off.

While no massive secondary blast ensues like often seen with Russia's poorly designed tanks. The RGW-90 Heat/Hesh round is designed to easily penetrate over 23 inches of steel armor and would have had no problem punching through the light armored APC.

Interestingly, another volunteer appears to have a misfire with a Czech RPG-75M launcher seconds before the RGW-90 is fired.

FriendlyStranger

05-27-22, 10:55

A lot of these videos popping up on pro Red army channels: https://www.youtube.com/c/NNC99/videos

In Stunning Shift, WaPo Admits Catastrophic-Conditions, Collapsing-Morale Of Ukraine Front-Line Forces
https://www.zerohedge.com/military/wapo-stunning-first-admits-catastrophic-conditions-collapsing-morale-ukraine-forces-front

The report references a video widely circulating online this week wherein a group the size of a platoon declares they simply can't fight for lack of weaponry, ammunition, food and proper command support:

“We are being sent to certain death,” said a volunteer, reading from a prepared script, adding that a similar video was filmed by members of the 115th Brigade 1st Battalion. “We are not alone like this, we are many.”

Ukraine’s military rebutted the volunteers’ claims in their own video posted online, saying the “deserters” had everything they needed to fight: “They thought they came for a vacation,” one service member said. “That’s why they left their positions.”

In the wake of the video, the Ukrainian troops featured are being accused of 'desertion':

And in recent weeks, he said, the situation has gotten much worse. When their supply chains were cut off for two days by the bombardment, the men were forced to make do with a potato a day.

They spend most days and nights in trenches dug into the forest on the edges of Toshkivka or inside the basements of abandoned houses. “They have no water, nothing there,” Lapko said. “Only water that I bring them every other day.”

They must be guarding their artillery better than anyone expected or the Ukrainians don't have enough troops/weapons/supplies to go around looking for the emplacements.

That's the only explanation I can come up with.

The Dumb Gun Collector

05-27-22, 17:57

tn1911

05-27-22, 18:18

US preparing to approve advanced long-range rocket system for Ukraine as Russian TV host warns of crossing a ‘red line’

https://www.cnn.com/2022/05/26/politics/us-long-range-rockets-ukraine-mlrs/index.html

The Dumb Gun Collector

05-27-22, 18:22

We definitely need to do that. I don't give $## if the Russians are unhappy about it. In fact, the more they bitch, the more I think we should do it.

US preparing to approve advanced long-range rocket system for Ukraine as Russian TV host warns of crossing a ‘red line’

https://www.cnn.com/2022/05/26/politics/us-long-range-rockets-ukraine-mlrs/index.html

tn1911

05-27-22, 18:53

The HIMARS system they’re going to send is impressive, with an effective range of up to 300 miles with certain munitions.

FriendlyStranger

05-27-22, 19:09

The HIMARS system they’re going to send is impressive, with an effective range of up to 300 miles with certain munitions.

Russian Mercenary Attack In Syria Reportedly Meant To ‘Test’ US Military Resolve
https://taskandpurpose.com/news/russian-mercenary-test-us-military-syria/

CNN also reported that HIMARS and MQ-9 drones were used in the attack.

“First of all the bombers attacked, and then they cleaned up using Apaches (attack helicopters),” Yevgeny Shabayev, a Cossack paramilitary leader with ties to Russia's military contractors, told Reuters.

An anonymous source told Reuters that Bloomberg's report that 300 Russians died was “broadly correct.” The U.S. reported more than 100 dead.

The Pentagon maintains that only one SDF fighter was injured in the attack.

ABNAK

05-27-22, 19:27

Damn, those Rooskies like them some missiles/rockets don't they? Reminds me of the old WWII "Stalin's Organ" Katyushas firing side-by-side.

1168

05-27-22, 19:36

Damn, those Rooskies like them some missiles/rockets don't they? Reminds me of the old WWII "Stalin's Organ" Katyushas firing side-by-side.
The Russian army can be described as an artillery army with a pile of tanks.

DG23

05-27-22, 21:02

Zero Hedge is a known source of Russian disinformation.

Its a news story pointing to and repeating a news story published by the Washington Post. They even gave a link to the original story...

So the Washington Post is now 'Russian Disinformation'???

ABNAK

05-27-22, 21:09

Its a news story pointing to and repeating a news story published by the Washington Post. They even gave a link to the original story...

So the Washington Post is now 'Russian Disinformation'???

No, the Washington Post is a tool of the Left.

I always remember it this way: the NY Times is libtard, the NY Post not so much. In D.C. it's the opposite, with the Post being the Left-leaning paper and the Times like the NY Post. (Confused yet?)

DG23

05-27-22, 21:23

“We are being sent to certain death,” said a volunteer, reading from a prepared script, adding that a similar video was filmed by members of the 115th Brigade 1st Battalion. “We are not alone like this, we are many.”

Ukraine’s military rebutted the volunteers’ claims in their own video posted online, saying the “deserters” had everything they needed to fight: “They thought they came for a vacation,” one service member said. “That’s why they left their positions.”

In the wake of the video, the Ukrainian troops featured are being accused of 'desertion'

'Volunteers'?

Could have sworn I read something about them prohibiting what they call 'men of military age' (18 to 60 there) from leaving the country.

Think about that shit for a minute...

What if Canada told YOU that you 'HAD' to fight for THEM for whatever bullcrap reason you may or may not agree with?

And then they prevented you from even leaving the damn country if you decided that you had enough and that their shit was just not quite right for you...

You don't agree to fight for crap you may not really believe in and now you are a draft dodger and subject to a bigger world of shit.

FriendlyStranger

05-27-22, 21:40

'Volunteers'?

Could have sworn I read something about them prohibiting what they call 'men of military age' (18 to 60 there) from leaving the country.

Think about that shit for a minute...

What if Canada told YOU that you 'HAD' to fight for THEM for whatever bullcrap reason you may or may not agree with?

And then they prevented you from even leaving the damn country if you decided that you had enough and that their shit was just not quite right for you...

You don't agree to fight for crap you may not really believe in and now you are a draft dodger and subject to a bigger world of shit.

I can see it happening, and being sent to either Eastern Europe, Taiwan or South Korea.

https://lynnwoodtimes.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/02/trudact-800x445.jpg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A95yLXVgrn4

Are you believing the morning papers?
War is coming back in style
There's generals here, advisers there
And the Russians nibbling everywhere
The chessboard's filling up with red
We make more profits when we blow off their heads
Economy is looking bad
Let's start another war (when ya get drafted)
Fan the fires of racist hatred
We want total war (when ya get drafted)
Drooling fingers, panic buttons
Playing with missiles like they're toys
There's easy money, easy jobs
Especially when you build the bombs
That blow big cities off the map
Just guess who profits when we build 'em back up
Yeah, what Big Business wants Big Business
Gets it wants a war (When ya get drafted)
Trilateral Commission goonies
Laugh and scheme for more (when ya get drafted)
Call the Army, call the Navy
Stocked with kids from slums (when ya get drafted)
If you can't afford a slick attorney
We might make you a spy
Forget your demonstrations
Kids today sit on their ass (when ya get drafted)
Just a six-pack and you're happy
We're prepared for when ya get drafted
When ya get drafted

"Build back better" - Biden

The way I look at it:

There will be good guys out there doing what they can.

Matthew 24

6 And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.

Psalms 24
8 Who is this King of glory? The LORD strong and mighty, the LORD mighty in battle.

Psalms 18

34 He teacheth my hands to war, so that a bow of steel is broken by mine arms.

35 Thou hast also given me the shield of thy salvation: and thy right hand hath holden me up, and thy gentleness hath made me great.

36 Thou hast enlarged my steps under me, that my feet did not slip.

37 I have pursued mine enemies, and overtaken them: neither did I turn again till they were consumed.

38 I have wounded them that they were not able to rise: they are fallen under my feet.

39 For thou hast girded me with strength unto the battle: thou hast subdued under me those that rose up against me.

40 Thou hast also given me the necks of mine enemies; that I might destroy them that hate me.

41 They cried, but there was none to save them: even unto the Lord, but he answered them not.

42 Then did I beat them small as the dust before the wind: I did cast them out as the dirt in the streets.

43 Thou hast delivered me from the strivings of the people; and thou hast made me the head of the heathen: a people whom I have not known shall serve me.

44 As soon as they hear of me, they shall obey me: the strangers shall submit themselves unto me.

45 The strangers shall fade away, and be afraid out of their close places.

46 The Lord liveth; and blessed be my rock; and let the God of my salvation be exalted.

47 It is God that avengeth me, and subdueth the people under me.

48 He delivereth me from mine enemies: yea, thou liftest me up above those that rise up against me: thou hast delivered me from the violent man.

49 Therefore will I give thanks unto thee, O Lord, among the heathen, and sing praises unto thy name.

50 Great deliverance giveth he to his king; and sheweth mercy to his anointed, to David, and to his seed for evermore.

FriendlyStranger

05-28-22, 01:00

He makes a good point. The media stopped covering the war so people have lost interest.

They are now finding it harder to get support.

https://youtu.be/H4_prsxjfF4?t=46

Pro Red army yt channel: Archive | April 2022 | Lugansk People's Militia advancing in Novotashevka LPR (Donbass)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PD3fqAn3IhI

mack7.62

05-28-22, 06:15

The Kyiv Independent
@KyivIndependent
⚡️Putin extends age limit for joining Russian military.

Under the new law, signed by Russian dictator Vladimir Putin on May 28, Russians under 50 are entitled to sign their first contract for military service. Prior to that, the age limit was under 40.

Alpha-17

05-28-22, 06:24

Zero Hedge is a known source of Russian disinformation.

That being said, I think it is clear now that the Russians actually have a plan and a MUCH smaller goal they are doing a lot better. Hopefully they aren’t able to keep it up with the Ukrainian military getting better equipped by the day and the Russians being forced to break out tanks from before desegregation. But we shall see. I’m concerned for sure.

Makes sense. One of the primary reasons for the failure around Kyiv was the breakdown of logistics. With much shorter supply lines, and far fewer troops to try and supply, it's bound to work out better for them.

FriendlyStranger

05-28-22, 18:58

"Come with us and let's try and hit this tank"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LHd4Ip14Hk

FriendlyStranger

05-29-22, 16:16

Zelensky: Conditions in Donbas ‘indescribably difficult’
https://thehill.com/policy/international/3505174-zelensky-conditions-in-donbas-indescribably-difficult/

Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky said conditions in the Donbas region are “indescribably difficult” as Russia’s invasion of his country entered its 95th day.

In a presidential address Saturday evening, Zelensky noted battles in areas with heavy Russian occupancy, including Sievierodonetsk, Lysychansk, Bakhmut and Popasna.

“But our defense holds on,” he said. “It’s indescribably difficult there. And I am grateful to all those who withstand this onslaught of the occupiers.”

Zelensky added that Russia had launched “absolutely senseless, openly barbaric strikes at the Sumy region,” leaving one person dead, seven wounded and two in critical condition. He noted that the shells hit a residential area that was 20 meters from a kindergarten.

Russia-Ukraine war: situation in Luhansk ‘extremely escalated’ amid intense shelling
https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2022/may/29/russia-ukraine-war-battle-in-donbas-indescribably-difficult-says-zelenskiy-live

Situation in Luhansk has 'extremely escalated', says governor

A dispatch here from Reuters reporters in Ukraine, as Russia continues its assaults to try to capture the Donbas region.

Ukrainian forces were on Sunday resisting a Russian assault on Sievierodonetsk, the largest city they still hold in the eastern Donbas region, but were weathering heavy artillery barrages, Ukrainian officials said.

The shelling was so intense it was not possible to assess casualties and damage, the governor of Luhansk region, Serhiy Haidai, said. Dozens of buildings have been destroyed in the past few days.

“The situation has extremely escalated,” Haidai said.

The Ukrainian government meanwhile urged the west to provide it with more longer-range weapons in order to turn the tide in the war, now in its fourth month.

The battle for Sievierodonetsk, which lies on the eastern side of the Siverskyi Donets River, has become the focus of attention as Russia ekes out slow but solid gains in the Donbas, comprising of the Luhansk and Donetsk regions.

Russia’s fixation on Sievierodonetsk had drawn resources from other battlefronts and as result they had made little progress elsewhere, according to the Washington-based Institute for the Study of War.

The Dumb Gun Collector

05-29-22, 19:45

The Ukrainian military said on Sunday that hospitals in Crimea had been ordered by Moscow to stop treating civilians to attend to the needs of wounded soldiers.

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2022/05/29/world/russia-ukraine-war/1b3e0d14-1345-564f-a754-b32fb96f8398?smid=url-share

Ukraine has declared that it is mounting a counteroffensive to reclaim territory around the southern port city of Kherson, as Russia devotes the bulk of its forces to pounding eastern Ukraine and capturing Sievierodonetsk, the last Ukrainian controlled city in the Luhansk region.

Kherson was the first major city to fall as Russian forces swept north out of Crimea more than three months ago, and it has provided a key staging ground for Russian operations across southern Ukraine. In recent weeks, Russian forces — stretched thin and taking heavy losses as they gain ground in the eastern Donbas region — have concentrated their efforts in the south on fortifying defensive positions.

“Hold on Kherson,” the Ukrainian military said on Twitter on Sunday morning. “We’re coming.”

Ukrainian officials have for weeks telegraphed plans to launch a new southern counteroffensive threatening Russia’s supply routes into Kherson on bridges over the Dnipro River. But they said the maneuver would require the delivery of Western artillery systems that had been promised by the United States and other allies.

The Biden administration has approved sending long-range multiple launch rocket systems to Ukraine, a significant transfer that could hugely aid the country, U.S. officials said on Friday. Mr. Zelensky has suggested an official announcement could come this week.

In other developments:

Russian forces are trying to gain a foothold on the northeast edge of Sievierodonetsk and are moving in the direction of the city center, Ukraine’s military said on Sunday evening. Russian forces also are pounding route T1302, which runs into the city. Route T1302 has been called the “road of life” given its critical role in getting supplies in and giving fleeing civilians a means of escape.

Ukraine’s defense minister, Oleksiy Reznikov, said that sophisticated Harpoon anti-ship cruise missiles had arrived. He said the Harpoons came courtesy of Denmark and would be used to try to break Russia’s Black Sea blockade and to protect the port city of Odesa.

DG23

05-29-22, 20:50

The battle for Sievierodonetsk, which lies on the eastern side of the Siverskyi Donets River, has become the focus of attention as Russia ekes out slow but solid gains in the Donbas, comprising of the Luhansk and Donetsk regions.

Russia’s fixation on Sievierodonetsk had drawn resources from other battlefronts and as result they had made little progress elsewhere, according to the Washington-based Institute for the Study of War.

We should print more money to help them out... :rolleyes:

But in the end they will still lose the Donbass, and Crimea. No way they are getting any of that back.

The Dumb Gun Collector

05-29-22, 22:13

We should print more money to help them out... :rolleyes:

But in the end they will still lose the Donbass, and Crimea. No way they are getting any of that back.

Early on I would definitely have agreed with you. If I had to bet I would still guess you are right. But after seeing the performance of the Russian military over the past few months I am no longer as confident.
o

Alpha-17

05-30-22, 08:39

For anyone interested, Perun did a pretty decent video showing just how corruption can rot a military organization. Nothing earth-shattering in it, but a decent analysis.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9i47sgi-V4&t=2926s

DG23

06-01-22, 21:37

For anyone interested, Perun did a pretty decent video showing just how corruption can rot a military organization. Nothing earth-shattering in it, but a decent analysis.

You have been realllly quiet since Russia has been slowly but steadily gaining ground here lately...

:)

Wake27

06-01-22, 23:46

You have been realllly quiet since Russia has been slowly but steadily gaining ground here lately...

:)

Anything Russia does at this point is not success. By almost all estimations, this should’ve been over weeks to months ago so there is nothing Russia can do that they should be proud of. Similarity, POS supporters of Russia in this war should never be talking shit because of how pathetic it is.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

mack7.62

06-02-22, 06:46

So Russia masses forces, launches massive artillery barrages, attacks with 7:1 advantage and makes small gains and this counts as success? Meanwhile sucking in troops from other regions opens them up to Ukrainian counter offensives in Kharkov and now Kerson.

mack7.62

06-02-22, 06:55

Warfare in the age of social media, kudo's to Baykar Tech for donating the drone and using to money for humanitarian aid.

Oryx
@oryxspioenkop
Answering The Call: Heavy Weaponry Supplied To #Ukraine 🇺🇦

Updated with:

- 1 Bayraktar TB2 UCAV (Crowdfunded by the Lithuanian public. Subsequently given by Baykar Tech free of charge with the €6 million collected used for humanitarian aid)

Alpha-17

06-02-22, 07:15

You have been realllly quiet since Russia has been slowly but steadily gaining ground here lately...

:)

If there had been anything worth commenting on lately, I would have. I could also share the articles talking about Ukrainian success in the south, but we've likely all seen those as well, so, what's the point? If you would like me to comment on either, here it is: Let's not blow taking small bits of territory with the majority of a nation's combat power out of proportion. We're seeing WWI level of territorial gains with modern weapons and resources. The entire war has bogged down, and while both sides certainly are capable of taking territory, how much territory they can take seems to be very limited, and the casualties they take are ridiculously high in the process.

Once more, however, the glee that you show when talking about a dictatorial regime attacking an independent country is sickening.

mack7.62

06-02-22, 16:12

Warfare in the modern era.

Steve Beynon
@StevenBeynon
A Washington state Guardsman received a phone call from a Ukrainian who has an issue with the Javelin. Guardsman talked him through it. 30 minutes later, Guardsman gets a call from the Ukrainian who just blew up a Russia vehicle.

This Guardsman and Ukrainian befriended each other during a relatively recent Washington deployment to the country before the war.

alx01

06-02-22, 17:13

Warfare in the modern era.

Steve Beynon
@StevenBeynon
A Washington state Guardsman received a phone call from a Ukrainian who has an issue with the Javelin. Guardsman talked him through it. 30 minutes later, Guardsman gets a call from the Ukrainian who just blew up a Russia vehicle.

Yes, sounds like a true story.

Next up - Ukrainian dials a call center in India, they launch a ballistic missile on his behalf and in 15 minutes completely stop a Russian offensive and destroy a statue of a communist leader in some unknown and abandoned Ukrainian coalmine town.

alx01

06-02-22, 18:51

You have been realllly quiet since Russia has been slowly but steadily gaining ground here lately...

:)

Then a losing side does not have any actual victories, they create virtual ones.

News claim that Ukrainians didn't lose territory while having 5.5:1 advantage in manpower; instead they've disposed of combat ineffective troops and equipment, straightened their defense lines and moved into a more advantageous position for a counteroffensive against Russian forces.

grnamin

06-02-22, 18:55

mack7.62

06-03-22, 09:33

Then a losing side does not have any actual victories, they create virtual ones.

News claim that Ukrainians didn't lose territory while having 5.5:1 advantage in manpower; instead they've disposed of combat ineffective troops and equipment, straightened their defense lines and moved into a more advantageous position for a counteroffensive against Russian forces.

You must be correct, things must be going swimmingly well for the Russians because the winning side just replaced the overall commander...again.

The Kyiv Independent
@KyivIndependent
⚡️ CIT: General Dvornikov dismissed from leading Russian troops in Ukraine.

According to the Conflict Intelligence Team, General Alexander Dvornikov was replaced by General Gennady Zhidko, former commander of the Eastern Military District and Russia’s deputy defense minister.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/russias-top-commander-for-the-ukraine-war-hasnt-been-seen-for-2-weeks-report/ar-AAXWHJS

Russia's war chief in Ukraine hasn't been seen for weeks, NYT reported, citing US officials.
Some officials speculate he may have been removed from his post as top commander.
Gen. Alexander Dvornikov was dubbed "The Butcher of Syria," and was assigned to Ukraine in April.

alx01

06-03-22, 12:38

Gen. Alexander Dvornikov was dubbed "The Butcher of Syria," and was assigned to Ukraine in April.

I don't know who gave him this nickname. I suspect he must be one tough mo-fo to get it, especially AFTER the whole ISIS thing in Syria and Iraq. I wouldn't want to mess with him that's for sure.

Just to give you a comparison baseline - Eddie Gallaher did not get anywhere close to being called that after allegedly (according to wikipedia) killing dozens of civilian including children and elderly, decapitating POWs, and threatening to murder his team members.

mack7.62

06-03-22, 16:03

The Dumb Gun Collector

06-03-22, 18:42

https://www.understandingwar.org/backgrounder/russian-offensive-campaign-assessment-may-31

Moscow’s concentration on seizing Severodonetsk and Donbas generally continues to create vulnerabilities for Russia in Ukraine’s vital Kherson Oblast, where Ukrainian counter-offensives continue. Kherson is critical terrain because it is the only area of Ukraine in which Russian forces hold ground on the west bank of the Dnipro River. If Russia is able to retain a strong lodgment in Kherson when fighting stops it will be in a very strong position from which to launch a future invasion. If Ukraine regains Kherson, on the other hand, Ukraine will be in a much stronger position to defend itself against future Russian attack. This strategic calculus should in principle lead Russia to allocate sufficient combat power to hold Kherson. But Russian President Vladimir Putin has chosen instead to concentrate all the forces and resources that can be scraped together in a desperate and bloody push to seize areas of eastern Ukraine that will give him largely symbolic gains. Continuing successful Ukrainian counter-offensives in Kherson indicate that Ukraine’s commanders recognize these realities and are taking advantage of the vulnerabilities that Putin’s decisions have created.

The Ukrainian leadership has apparently wisely avoided matching Putin’s mistaken prioritization. Kyiv could have committed more reserves and resources to the defense of Severodonetsk, and its failure to do so has drawn criticism.[1] Ukrainian forces are now apparently withdrawing from Severodonetsk rather than fighting to the end—a factor that has allowed the Russians to move into the city relatively rapidly after beginning their full-scale assault.[2] Both the decision to avoid committing more resources to saving Severodonetsk and the decision to withdraw from it were strategically sound, however painful. Ukraine must husband its more limited resources and focus on regaining critical terrain rather than on defending ground whose control will not determine the outcome of the war or the conditions for the renewal of war.

Sound Ukrainian prioritization of counter-offensive and defensive operations pushed the Russians almost out of artillery range of Kharkiv City and have stopped the Russian advances from Izyum—both of which are more important accomplishments than the defense of Severodonetsk. Ukraine’s leadership has had to make incredibly difficult choices in this war and has generally made the right ones, at least at the level of strategic prioritization and in the pace, scale, and ambitiousness of its counter-offensives. That is why Ukraine still has a good chance to stop and then reverse the gains Russia is currently making.

Russian forces are likely attempting to exploit Belarusian equipment reserves to compensate for heavy material losses in Ukraine. The Ukrainian General Staff reported on May 31 that Belarusian forces are moving tanks and infantry fighting vehicles from storage facilities in Belarus to Russia to replenish combat losses.[3] This report corroborates previous reporting that Russian forces have largely exhausted their own reserves and indicates that the Kremlin is still leveraging its influence over Belarus in order to use Belarusian equipment.

DG23

06-03-22, 19:36

You must be correct, things must be going swimmingly well for the Russians because the winning side just replaced the overall commander...again.

You may want to tell Zelensky how bad the Russian armed forces suck 'cause he is telling everyone how much territory they (Ukraine) have already lost and it is a lot... (pretty sure his claims are underestimated as well - that guy lies about everything he can so others will continue to throw 'help' (money) his way)

As the Russian invasion has entered its 100th day, Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky has confirmed that Russian forces are now in control of 20% of Ukraine's territory.

"As of today, about 20% of our territory is under the control of the occupiers, almost 125 thousand square kilometers. This is much larger than the area of all the Benelux countries combined," he said in a virtual address before Luxembourg lawmakers.

Not to mention Russia is very near to having driven the AFU completely out of the city of Severodonetsk in the Donbass. That would put the Russian army in control over all of Luhansk province.

The BBC has meanwhile cited UK defense officials who say most of the city is currently in Russian control and that Kremlin forces are making "steady local gains, enabled by a heavy concentration of artillery.

All of that territory is gone and Zelensky is not going to be getting any of it back.

DG23

06-03-22, 19:40

Seriously that's all you've got, unsubstantiated accusations...

:)

Against your 'twitter' info...

LOL!

utahjeepr

06-03-22, 20:13

Saw a report out of Israel that a Russian amphibious assault fleet is pulling out of Sevastopol.

Given Russia's recent naval fortunes, and the Ukes having recieved a good number of anti-ship capable missles lately this has almost got to be a feint. Seems like a real dumb idea otherwise.

Nothing confirmed, just a report. I guess we'll see what comes of it.

mack7.62

06-03-22, 20:18

:)

Against your 'twitter' info...

LOL!

Twitter link to Kyiv Independent and just for you I included link to MSN story from NYT's backing up that said butcher has not been seen for two weeks.

The Dumb Gun Collector

06-03-22, 20:19

All of that territory is gone and Zelensky is not going to be getting any of it back.

We shall see. A few months ago there was a whole lot more territory the Russians had that the Ukrainians weren't getting back. At this point the Russians have switched from taking over the whole shebang, disarming Ukraine and keeping Nato off their borders to claiming it was all about taking over a few regions around what they already had.I guess they can keep moving the goal posts back and declare victory wherever they want. But realistically the Russians probably won't be able to hold out long term because they are being devastated economically and the Ukrainians are steadily arming to modern standards while the Russians are breaking out 60s era tanks and begging the Belorussians for some old gear to replace what they have lost.

mack7.62

06-03-22, 20:28

You may want to tell Zelensky how bad the Russian armed forces suck 'cause he is telling everyone how much territory they (Ukraine) have already lost and it is a lot... (pretty sure his claims are underestimated as well - that guy lies about everything he can so others will continue to throw 'help' (money) his way)

Not to mention Russia is very near to having driven the AFU completely out of the city of Severodonetsk in the Donbass. That would put the Russian army in control over all of Luhansk province.

All of that territory is gone and Zelensky is not going to be getting any of it back.

Wow somebody better tell the Ukrainians about Severodonetsk because the Russians were sucked into a trap, took 70% of the city but then took heavy losses during Ukrainian counterattack and were pushed back and now only control 50%.

ISW
@TheStudyofWar
Eastern #Ukraine Update Thread:

#Russian forces made minor gains in the eastern part of #Severodonetsk, but #Ukrainian forces continues to launch localized counterattacks in Severodonetsk and its outskirts. 2/3
https://isw.pub/RusCampaignJune3

mack7.62

06-03-22, 20:43

Meanwhile being totally focused on Severodonetsk.

ISW
@TheStudyofWar
More toplines:

- A Russian milblogger claimed Russian commanders did not account for combat challenges in the Izyum woods, leading to significant losses in the 64th and 38th Separate Guard Motor Rifle Brigades, which he alleges now have less than 100 servicemen in total.

ISW
@TheStudyofWar
Eastern #Ukraine Update Thread:

#Russian forces conducted unsuccessful assaults southeast and southwest of #Izyum and west of #Lyman and remain unlikely to secure major advances towards #Slovyansk. 1/3
https://isw.pub/RusCampaignJune3

ISW
@TheStudyofWar
·
54m
Southern Axis Update:

#Russian forces unsuccessfully attempted to regain lost positions in northeastern #Kherson Oblast and continued to defend previously occupied positions.
https://isw.pub/RusCampaignJune3

DG23

06-03-22, 22:03

Wow somebody better tell the Ukrainians about Severodonetsk because the Russians were sucked into a trap, took 70% of the city but then took heavy losses during Ukrainian counterattack and were pushed back and now only control 50%.

This is going to end up like your claims about the guys at Asovstal.

Give it a bit and see...

Has Zelensky disclosed their losses so far yet?

(hell no)

Why is that?

glocktogo

06-03-22, 22:04

The Dumb Gun Collector

06-03-22, 22:15

Absolutely.

The awesome part is that Ukraine is bleeding Russia hard. Putin will be dead soon and whoever is left to pick up the pieces, will never be able to rebuild their military to the levels they had before the Ukraine War. Especially not with international sanctions choking their economy to death.

Putin really screwed the pooch by biting off more than he could chew. Even of he takes and retains additional Ukrainian territory, Russia will suffer terrorist attacks in the region for the next 20+ years. His legacy is going to be relegating Russia to 2nd world status for the next half century. They’ll be lucky to keep China from annexing all their territory in Asia.

The schadenfreude here is superb! :D

alx01

06-03-22, 22:40

Seriously that's all you've got, unsubstantiated accusations against a SEAL vs a Russian General dubbed the Butcher of Syria who it now appears won't be earning the title Butcher of Ukraine since he couldn't hack it against a real army and has been relieved?

I don't understand what is your suggestion here? You want him to take both titles? Or do you want the Russian General to take "Butcher of Ukraine" and hand over "Butcher of Syria" to somebody else (like Gallaher)?
Who would assign a second title to him - Ukrainians via a twitter poll, the Russian government, or a western press? If he keeps two titles it would be somewhat unfair to other Russian generals who do not yet have nom de guerre.

I don't have a stake in it either way. Just trying to understand the arrangement.

Just to point out, I don't completely agree with your insinuation that Eddie Gallaher could not fight "a real army" just because he was in a NAVY branch.

C-grunt

06-04-22, 02:45

I don't understand what is your suggestion here? You want him to take both titles? Or do you want the Russian General to take "Butcher of Ukraine" and hand over "Butcher of Syria" to somebody else (like Gallaher)?
Who would assign a second title to him - Ukrainians via a twitter poll, the Russian government, or a western press? If he keeps two titles it would be somewhat unfair to other Russian generals who do not yet have nom de guerre.

I don't have a stake in it either way. Just trying to understand the arrangement.

Just to point out, I don't completely agree with your insinuation that Eddie Gallaher could not fight "a real army" just because he was in a NAVY branch.

Serious question. Do you actually read what people write? This is not the first time you posts have been completely off target.

Averageman

06-04-22, 04:04

I've been away a month and wonder how we keep getting new guys with obviously counter opinions for almost everything I thought this place stood for.
I really don't understand.

WillBrink

06-04-22, 10:54

The awesome part is that Ukraine is bleeding Russia hard. Putin will be dead soon and whoever is left to pick up the pieces, will never be able to rebuild their military to the levels they had before the Ukraine War. Especially not with international sanctions choking their economy to death.

Putin really screwed the pooch by biting off more than he could chew. Even of he takes and retains additional Ukrainian territory, Russia will suffer terrorist attacks in the region for the next 20+ years. His legacy is going to be relegating Russia to 2nd world status for the next half century. They’ll be lucky to keep China from annexing all their territory in Asia.

The schadenfreude here is superb! :D

What happens in Ukraine is almost secondary the fact that Putin has set Russia back 50 years or so, and unless they were to retreat in full to prior lines, and play nice with the west, they are screwed. "Win" or lose in Ukraine, they have lost: Economically, militarily, politically, lost on all fronts, to at best, obtain Ukraine who I suspect will be grinding them down via guerilla warfare without end.

It has also woken the world up to the fact the commies by another name are still commies under the hood, and defense spending and waking the F up to the realities of Russia and China, etc can't be ignored.

Unless Putin is playing some 5D chess here we are not privy to and above our pat grades, he screwed up bigly for a massive net loss.

WillBrink

06-04-22, 10:54

The awesome part is that Ukraine is bleeding Russia hard. Putin will be dead soon and whoever is left to pick up the pieces, will never be able to rebuild their military to the levels they had before the Ukraine War. Especially not with international sanctions choking their economy to death.

Putin really screwed the pooch by biting off more than he could chew. Even of he takes and retains additional Ukrainian territory, Russia will suffer terrorist attacks in the region for the next 20+ years. His legacy is going to be relegating Russia to 2nd world status for the next half century. They’ll be lucky to keep China from annexing all their territory in Asia.

The schadenfreude here is superb! :D

What happens in Ukraine is almost secondary to the fact that Putin has set Russia back 50 years or so, and unless they were to retreat in full to prior lines, and play nice with the west, they are screwed. "Win" or lose in Ukraine, they have lost: Economically, militarily, politically, lost on all fronts, to at best, obtain Ukraine who I suspect will be grinding them down via guerilla warfare without end.

It has also woken the world up to the fact the commies by another name are still commies under the hood, and defense spending and waking the F up to the realities of Russia and China, etc can't be ignored.

Unless Putin is playing some 5D chess here we are not privy to and above our pay grades, he screwed up bigly for a massive net loss.

DG23

06-04-22, 12:33

What happens in Ukraine is almost secondary to the fact that Putin has set Russia back 50 years or so...

They moved the collapse of the US Dollar as the preferred reserve currency forward here.

Once that day comes, we are screwed. No more 'printing our way to prosperity' and tossing US dollars at every problem that comes our way expecting it to work as it has in the past.

When about 1/2 the population of the planet says 'No, We are not participating in your 'sanction' shit you are trying to pull off with respect to our trading partner...' - And the other half sees first hand how their 'reserves'
can be frozen at the will and whim of the US whenever...

We are pushing our potential enemies closer together day by day.

glocktogo

06-04-22, 12:56

They moved the collapse of the US Dollar as the preferred reserve currency forward here.

Once that day comes, we are screwed. No more 'printing our way to prosperity' and tossing US dollars at every problem that comes our way expecting it to work as it has in the past.

When about 1/2 the population of the planet says 'No, We are not participating in your 'sanction' shit you are trying to pull off with respect to our trading partner...' - And the other half sees first hand how their 'reserves'
can be frozen at the will and whim of the US whenever...

We are pushing our potential enemies closer together day by day.

Yeah, Russia didn’t do that. We did. Russia isn’t strong enough to topple us, only we are.

tn1911

06-04-22, 13:00

When about 1/2 the population of the planet says 'No, We are not participating in your 'sanction' shit you are trying to pull off with respect to our trading partner...' - And the other half sees first hand how their 'reserves'
can be frozen at the will and whim of the US whenever... .

I guess you don’t have any real understanding of just how much of the global financial system is controlled directly by the US... 90% of global access flows thru us at any one time.

1/2 the population can’t risk refusing to take part in lawful economic sanctions against a rogue nation. And keep in mind the sanctions we are enforcing against Russia is akin to Saturday detention. If we wanted to we could crush their entire economy in hours.

If you want to understand how devastating electronic drawdowns on a financial system can be just look at the events of September 18, 2008...

The Dumb Gun Collector

06-04-22, 13:01

Here is a cool video on the structure of Russian forces.

https://youtu.be/W_EszahY844

FromMyColdDeadHand

06-04-22, 13:29

And the fact that a ‘modern’ country is using nuclear weapons to blackmail other countries to concede to their aggressions is a game changer that I don’t think people have fullly integrated.

tn1911

06-04-22, 13:40

And the fact that a ‘modern’ country is using nuclear weapons to blackmail other countries to concede to their aggressions is a game changer that I don’t think people have fullly integrated.

Realistically that’s all they have. The conventional military force is a joke, made up of conscripted kids and leftover Soviet relics. Their Air Force has proven to be ineffective at best at the most basic of western capabilities. They lost their flagship to a country with no navy. Their SF guys were slaughtered in the initial stages of the war because they were either inept or sent to die by incompetent commanders.

I’m not entirely sure their nukes are not in worse shape than the conventional side. Corruption has bled their military budgets for decades. They most certainly would need to spend some money on conventional forces with the understanding they were 100% going to need them at some point. So money could easily be diverted from nuke forces with the assumption they probably won’t be needing to use them, just the threat of their existence would be enough.

We spend roughly $40 Billion a year on our nukes, a lot of which goes towards routine maintenance, periodic repair, replacement of limited life components, etc...

The entire Russian military budget is somewhere around $50 to $60 billion, not nearly enough to maintain everything plus nukes...

mack7.62

06-04-22, 13:54

Well gee wiz things are going so well for the Ruskies in Severodonetsk.

Dmitri ��
@mdmitri91
Igor Girkin: "Information about enemy (Ukrainian) counter-attack in Severodonetsk is confirmed "..." The enemy is advancing, our units (Russians) are retreating. The specific information about the advance varies so I'll keep it for later."

tn1911

06-04-22, 15:17

Russia will strike West if US rockets hit us.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/russia-will-strike-west-if-us-rockets-hit-us-says-putin-ally-l3gd673lh

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LpvqWnOVEtk

tn1911

06-04-22, 16:21

Vladimir Putin's Russia faces genocide probe over alleged abduction of 200,000 Ukrainian children

https://www.scottishdailyexpress.co.uk/news/world-news/vladimir-putins-russia-faces-genocide-27144535

Prosecutors investigating war crimes cases in Ukraine are examining allegations of the forcible deportation of children to Russia since the invasion as they seek to build a genocide indictment, the country's top prosecutor has said.

International humanitarian law classifies the forced mass deportation of people during a conflict as a war crime.

"Forcibly transfering children" in particular qualifies as genocide, the most serious of war crimes, under the 1948 Genocide Convention that outlawed the intent to destroy - in whole or in part - a national, ethnic, racial or religious group.

Prosecutor General Iryna Venediktova, who is overseeing multiple war crimes inquiries in Ukraine, said "we have more than 20 cases about forcible transfer of people" to Russia from various regions across the eastern European country since the invasion began on Feb. 24.

"From the first days of the war, we started this case about genocide," Venediktova said.

She said that, amid the chaos and destruction wrought by Russia's assault, focusing on the removal of children offered the best way to secure the evidence needed to meet the rigorous legal definition of genocide:

"That's why this forcible transfer of children is very important for us."

Venediktova declined to provide a number for how many victims had been forcibly transferred.

However, Ukraine's human rights ombudswoman Lyudmyla Denisova said in mid May that Russia had relocated more than 210,000 children during the conflict, part of more than 1.2 million Ukrainians who Kyiv said have been deported against their will.

A Kremlin spokesman did not respond to a request for comment on Venediktovas remarks nor the figures on Ukrainians on Russian soil.

Russia in the past has said that it is offering humanitarian aid to those wishing to flee Ukraine voluntarily.

Russia's TASS state news agency on Monday quoted an unnamed law enforcement official as saying that "more than 1.55 million people who arrived from the territory of Ukraine and Donbas have crossed the border with the Russian Federation.

Among them, more than 254,000 children."

Russia calls its actions in Ukraine a "special operation" to disarm Ukraine and protect it from fascists.

Ukraine and the West say the fascist allegation is baseless and that the war is an unprovoked act of aggression.

The Genocide Convention - a treaty adopted by the U.N. General Assembly in the wake of the Nazi Holocaust - specifies five acts that could each constitute the crime, if committed with genocidal intent: killing members of a group, causing them serious bodily or mental harm, imposing living conditions intended to destroy the group, preventing births, and forcibly transferring children out of the group.

Venediktova said the investigations to build a genocide case - covering the forced deportation of children and other acts - were targeting areas from northern Ukraine down to Mykolaiv and Kherson on the southern coast.

But the gathering of evidence was being complicated by the war, she said.

"To this day we don't have access to territory. We don't have access to people who we can ask, who we can interview," she said. "We are waiting when this territory will be de-occupied."

Aside from genocide, other alleged war crimes are being examined in the regions of Kyiv, Kharkiv, Lviv, Sumy and Zhytomyr, the prosecutor generals office said.

tn1911

06-04-22, 17:18

FromMyColdDeadHand

06-04-22, 17:51

Russia will strike West if US rockets hit us.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/russia-will-strike-west-if-us-rockets-hit-us-says-putin-ally-l3gd673lh

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LpvqWnOVEtk

Paywall and a youtube restriction….

I guess they say that if a Ukrainian missile falls on Russia, they will hit the West? Maybe time to put up a viable peace plan before your Russian citizens start getting their city centers targeted. Did Putin think that this was going to go one-way assymetrical forever?

I think that as soon as the winter is over Ukraine should start destroying pipelines between Russia and the EU..

It is only a matter of time before those crafty Ukranians start turning light aircraft into large drones and start putting the smack down on Russian energy infrastructure.

Alpha-17

06-05-22, 08:25

And the fact that a ‘modern’ country is using nuclear weapons to blackmail other countries to concede to their aggressions is a game changer that I don’t think people have fullly integrated.

I heard it described in a video that Russia is a country-sized, nuclear armed trailer park. Considering how they have behaved, and their general lack of competency at pretty much all levels, that comparison seems to be spot on. Well, possibly slightly unfair to nicer trailer parks.

mack7.62

06-05-22, 09:11

Russian threats are turning into a big joke, "forget MAD we're totally going to nuke you if you don't do what we want" "Finland you better not join NATO we will totally invade you even though we can't even beat Ukraine and have already used up most of out advanced weapons, hey we might nuke you".

flenna

06-05-22, 09:58

I heard it described in a video that Russia is a country-sized, nuclear armed trailer park. Considering how they have behaved, and their general lack of competency at pretty much all levels, that comparison seems to be spot on. Well, possibly slightly unfair to nicer trailer parks.

Yes, the ONLY reason they are (were?) considered one of the world’s few superpowers was because they had a large nuclear arsenal. Other than that, they have the army and economy of a minor third world country.

mack7.62

06-05-22, 12:08

Another Russian General will be growing sunflowers. Russian propaganda site, they are only admitting to 4 dead Generals, loving the way they frame it.

https://windowstorussia.com/4th-general-of-the-russian-armed-forces-has-died-general-roman-kutuzov.html

The commander of the 5th army, General Roman Kutuzov, was killed in battle in the Donbass…

Unlike the west, Russian Generals fight side by side with their men. They expect nothing more than what they would give…

☦️ The Kingdom of Heaven for the the warriors whom have fallen in battle…

Only few generals (4 now) have been killed if a general dies on the battlefield it is unfortunate, but because he is fighting with his men, and that is a huge moral booster for the troops…

alx01

06-05-22, 16:33

Russia ‘suffering huge casualties’ as troops retreat: Ukraine

The Ukrainian forces reversed a Russian advance in Severodonetsk and recaptured about 20 percent of the strategic eastern city over the past couple of days, the governor of Luhansk province said.

Moscow, meanwhile, said Ukraine forces were retreating from the city after suffering heavy casualties.

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/6/4/fighting-rages-in-two-key-eastern-ukrainian-cities

Interesting article. Thank you.

Something stood out at me, which I've seen in the news previously about 17-20 years back:

The Institute for the Study of War, a Washington-based think-tank, said Russian-installed officials and troops faced growing resistance among the local population and “an increase in partisan activity in southern Ukraine”.

The institute cited accounts on Russian Telegram channels of threats against locals who received Russian passports.

Isn't this exactly what Sunni terrorists (i.e. predecessor of ISIS) did in Iraq and to some degree in Afghanistan during our invasion? I recall they targeted for assassination anyone who either cooperated with American forces or simply tried to lead normal lives under the American control (i.e. teachers, doctors, municipal services, city officials and etc.).

mack7.62

06-05-22, 16:40

More like what the French Resistance did against the Germans during WWII, your anti American bias is showing comrade.

glocktogo

06-05-22, 16:44

Interesting article. Thank you.

Something stood out at me, which I've seen in the news previously about 17-20 years back:

Isn't this exactly what Sunni terrorists (i.e. predecessor of ISIS) did in Iraq and to some degree in Afghanistan during our invasion? I recall they targeted for assassination anyone who either cooperated with American forces or simply tried to lead normal lives under the American control (i.e. teachers, doctors, municipal services, city officials and etc.).

You mean like the Vichy French government? Those types of things never turn out well for the losers.

mack7.62

06-05-22, 17:37

Lot of chatter that another Russian General was killed today or yesterday, if true that makes two in one day Major General Roman Kutuzov and Lieutenant General Roman Berdnikov. Russian General ranks are kind of weird, Major General is a one star and Lt. General is a two star.

https://ukrainetoday.org/2022/06/05/highest-ranking-russian-general-so-far-lieutenant-general-roman-berdnikov-commander-of-the-29th-army-of-rf-has-been-killed-in-ukraine-this-morning-near-severodonetsk/

Highest ranking Russian general so far, lieutenant general Roman Berdnikov, commander of the 29th Army of RF, has been killed in Ukraine this morning near Severodonetsk

Alpha-17

06-06-22, 07:32

because he is fighting with his men, and that is a huge moral booster for the troops…

Yes, general officers dying in battle always raise the morale of armies. :blink:

At best you might get a boost of rage as they attempt to avenge his death, but "huge morale boost"? Yeah, that's not happening, especially once the rage wears off.

FromMyColdDeadHand

06-06-22, 08:00

Yes, general officers dying in battle always raise the morale of armies. :blink:

At best you might get a boost of rage as they attempt to avenge his death, but "huge morale boost"? Yeah, that's not happening, especially once the rage wears off.

Doesn’t it depend on the officer?

tn1911

06-06-22, 08:08

FromMyColdDeadHand

06-06-22, 09:20

'Nuclear war is coming' Putin's mouthpiece threatens west with 'World War 3' warning

https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1620877/Putin-Russian-propaganda-nuclear-WW3-threat-warning-weapons-Ukraine-US-NATO-vn

They really are losing it over there. They will go after the decision makers, not Kyiv? So they are going to nuke Berlin, London and DC?

When this is over, we need to take every Russian that uttered the word “Nuke”, put them and their friends against a wall, and shoot them. You can’t start a war of aggression, botch it up, and then threaten nukes and not have any consequences. Like a nuke expert in IRan, these guys need to meet timely deaths to let people know that you can’t play that card with out sacrificing your life. Mossad that problem.

tn1911

06-06-22, 09:27

Is Vladimir Putin dead?

https://www.newstatesman.com/world/europe/ukraine/2022/06/is-vladimir-putin-dead

To be clear, there is no verifiable evidence that Putin is seriously ill. Still less so that he is dead. The unnamed sources who are quoted in these articles do not offer definitive proof, perhaps unsurprisingly given the secrecy surrounding the president’s health and security. Instead, they rely largely on rumours swirling within the intelligence community and the old Soviet-era practice of Kremlinology, in which analysts scrutinise the leader’s public appearances for signs of physical decline and clues as to who might be in favour or out, in the absence of reliable information.

glocktogo

06-06-22, 11:34

WillBrink

06-06-22, 13:08

Well he is overdue for a bout of the "Russian Flu". :confused:

As only Putin wants that conflict it seems, if he was flued out, I don't think they'd waste a lot of time before pulling troops back and or communicating the intent to do so.

mack7.62

06-06-22, 14:21

Way to go Russia!

Expat in Kyiv
@expatua
·
4h
Insane.

Mariupol, the once vibrant Ukrainian city of 530,000 that Russia completely destroyed now has a CHOLERA epidemic due to destroyed sewage infrastructure and has been quarantined.

CHOLERA!

Russia, bringing the 17th century to you.

tn1911

06-06-22, 16:28

Russia's Cyber Warfare Reputation Lies In Ruins As Anonymous Hacktivists Raid Central Bank Again

https://www.ibtimes.com/russias-cyber-warfare-reputation-lies-ruins-anonymous-hacktivists-raid-central-bank-3530912

Anonymous, a decentralized international hacktivist and activist collective, launched a cyber war against the Kremlin following the invasion, and staying true to its promise that it will not stop its crusade until the war ends, launched another attack on Russia.

This time it has directed its fury at the Central Bank of the Russian Federation (CBR). And in what is seen as a slap on Russia's supposed prowess in the cyber warfare space, the collective has managed to — yet again — intrude into the bank's cyber innards.

CBR, whose primary responsibility is to protect the stability of Russia's national currency, the ruble, has taken cyber damage courtesy of the hacktivist Rootkit_sec. Unlike previous attacks, the Anonymous operative's latest exploit allowed them to gain control of the "Russian software system" used in running the CBR.

In addition to taking control of the system, the hacktivist also leaked some data that belongs to the central bank. This is not the first time that Anonymous launched an attack against the CBR, but that previous experience has not helped the bank stop this latest incursion.

Russia is known as one of the countries with an army of hackers but despite this, the hacktivist collective has launched countless attacks, including breaches and defacement of websites of supposedly highly secure government facilities and private institutions, among others.

tn1911

06-11-22, 19:26

alx01

06-12-22, 01:53

Russia has been launching heavy 1960s era anti-ship missiles into Ukraine. UK officials say Russia is using these missiles because they are running short of modern ones.

https://www.businessinsider.com/russia-launching-1960s-era-anti-ship-missiles-into-ukraine-2022-6?utm_source=reddit.com

Hitting a moving aircraft carrier in the ocean is a pretty small target. How can the missile be considered inaccurate?

Using older stockpiles of weapons is a smart move in any case. You hit your targets, dispose of your old stocks and don't need to spend money to recycle/destroy them, free up space in storage, and give yourself a lead time on manufacturing new stocks. Win-win-win.

Same fake news are being regurgitated every 2-3 weeks by clowns at British MOD and various "experts". As time has shown any article referring to British or Ukrainian sources is a fake by default.

Anyone else has Déjà vu reading those articles?

> Feb 26
Russia Could Run Out Of Money And Weapons In 10 Days, Estonian Defense Chief Estimates
https://biselliano.info/2022/02/26/breaking-russia-could-run-out-of-money-and-weapons-in-10-days-estonian-defense-chief-estimates/

> March 22
Western officials believe Russia may have used hypersonic missile in Ukraine because it is running out of other precision weapons...
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10641417/Officials-believe-Russia-used-hypersonic-missile-running-weapons.html

> April 2
Putin ‘running out of missiles’ because all the parts are made in Ukraine
https://metro.co.uk/2022/04/02/putin-running-out-of-missiles-because-key-parts-are-made-in-ukraine-16393098/

> May 5
Putin could be running out of missiles
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10787917/Putin-running-missiles-waging-logistics-war-forces-supplied.html

> May 16
Is Russia running out of missiles?
https://www.jpost.com/international/article-706826

When you see a clickbait article with a question "Is Russia running out of missiles?". Skip it - don't waste your time reading another fake propaganda piece. The true, correct, and the only answer is "No" regardless when you see it.

vicious_cb

06-12-22, 02:54

Hitting a moving aircraft carrier in the ocean is a pretty small target. How can the missile be considered inaccurate?

Using older stockpiles of weapons is a smart move in any case. You hit your targets, dispose of your old stocks and don't need to spend money to recycle/destroy them, free up space in storage, and give yourself a lead time on manufacturing new stocks. Win-win-win.

Same fake news are being regurgitated every 2-3 weeks by clowns at British MOD and various "experts". As time has shown any article referring to British or Ukrainian sources is a fake by default.

Anyone else has Déjà vu reading those articles?

> Feb 26
Russia Could Run Out Of Money And Weapons In 10 Days, Estonian Defense Chief Estimates
https://biselliano.info/2022/02/26/breaking-russia-could-run-out-of-money-and-weapons-in-10-days-estonian-defense-chief-estimates/

> March 22
Western officials believe Russia may have used hypersonic missile in Ukraine because it is running out of other precision weapons...
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10641417/Officials-believe-Russia-used-hypersonic-missile-running-weapons.html

> April 2
Putin ‘running out of missiles’ because all the parts are made in Ukraine
https://metro.co.uk/2022/04/02/putin-running-out-of-missiles-because-key-parts-are-made-in-ukraine-16393098/

> May 5
Putin could be running out of missiles
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10787917/Putin-running-missiles-waging-logistics-war-forces-supplied.html

> May 16
Is Russia running out of missiles?
https://www.jpost.com/international/article-706826

When you see a clickbait article with a question "Is Russia running out of missiles?". Skip it - don't waste your time reading another fake propaganda piece. The true, correct, and the only answer is "No" regardless when you see it.

Pretty much any western news source is a Ukrainian propaganda mouthpiece. I like how the media spouts nothing but lies about the election and the coof for 2 years then all of a sudden people want to believe all this Ukraine is winning BS. People need to open their eyes, Ukraine is getting its shit pushed in and no flow of money or weapons we send is going to make a difference. This no different than shoveling money into Iraq or Afghanistan, its just another $40 billion racket that politicians will line their pockets with.

mack7.62

06-12-22, 06:43

Here you go Russia lovers, Putin spells it out, Poland Baltic States you're next.

https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1535803994831994880

Visegrád 24
@visegrad24
·
9h
Putin revealed his face when he said that Russia is new returning to itself areas that “are theirs” and fortifying them.

His propagandists on State TV all embraced it.

Talk about war with Poland & the Baltic states & new annexations.

flenna

06-12-22, 06:46

I thought the war was over since it is no longer in the news……

DG23

06-12-22, 09:00

I thought the war was over since it is no longer in the news……

It is not in the news YOU read because the 'news' does not fit the narrative those media sources want you to believe.

Ukraine is steadily losing ground in the Donbass...

Regardless of the weapons and dollars we have been throwing their way they continue to lose ground, surrender forces (and weapons that we sent them), and in general get their asses handed to them.

All of those 'sanctions' that were supposed to 'bring Putin to his knees' and end the conflict have done nothing but backfire spectacularly. As the western and european nations that are imposing the 'sanctions' suffer higher and higher prices for energy products (and everything related to the costs of energy) - Russia is sitting back laughing as they shift the sales elsewhere to countries that do not give a damn what the west says.

China, India, Africa, Mexico, Turkey, etc. (a LONG list of countries that adds up to more than half the population of the freaking planet) are enjoying closer ties with Russia and cheaper energy products while the west (and countries supporting the sanction garbage) get to pay more for less!

Even considering the discounts given to sell their energy products Russia is bringing in MORE revenue currently than they did before this conflict started...

Way to go Brandon! Push our potential adversaries closer together, strengthen their economic ties, help them understand the US Dollar is NOT a 'safe' place to store their reserves all while sticking it to our allies with higher prices and LESS energy and financial security! :)

flenna

06-12-22, 09:12

It is not in the news YOU read because the 'news' does not fit the narrative those media sources want you to believe.

Ukraine is steadily losing ground in the Donbass...

Regardless of the weapons and dollars we have been throwing their way they continue to lose ground, surrender forces (and weapons that we sent them), and in general get their asses handed to them.

All of those 'sanctions' that were supposed to 'bring Putin to his knees' and end the conflict have done nothing but backfire spectacularly. As the western and european nations that are imposing the 'sanctions' suffer higher and higher prices for energy products (and everything related to the costs of energy) - Russia is sitting back laughing as they shift the sales elsewhere to countries that do not give a damn what the west says.

China, India, Africa, Mexico, Turkey, etc. (a LONG list of countries that adds up to more than half the population of the freaking planet) are enjoying closer ties with Russia and cheaper energy products while the west (and countries supporting the sanction garbage) get to pay more for less!

Even considering the discounts given to sell their energy products Russia is bringing in MORE revenue currently than they did before this conflict started...

Way to go Brandon! Push our potential adversaries closer together, strengthen their economic ties, help them understand the US Dollar is NOT a 'safe' place to store their reserves all while sticking it to our allies with higher prices and LESS energy and financial security! :)

I guess I should have put “sarcasm” after my post…..

DG23

06-12-22, 09:34

I guess I should have put “sarcasm” after my post…..

No, I got it brother. :)

My post was mostly for Mack and the others that get their 'news' mostly from Twatter and other western 'MSM' sources.

They remind me of the Black Knight from the Monte Python skit. Missing both arms, both legs, laying on the ground unable to do shit while insisting 'Tis but a fleshwound'.

mack7.62

06-12-22, 11:25

The fat lady ain't sung yet dumb ass, and if Russia's doing so well where's the big breakthrough, how come they are putting so much effort into the second and third defensive lines, how come they're throwing T-62's into the battle, how come they're rushing 1950's artillery to the front. And by the way my last twitter link was to translated Putin and Russia media taking about invading Poland and the Balkans and rattling the nuke saber again in your mind that should be super trustworthy.

mack7.62

06-12-22, 11:34

DG23

06-12-22, 12:20

IMO the war is not going good for anyone, Russians and Ukrainians are dying in large numbers every day, war is stalemating into trench and artillery and urban battles. German, French and Hungarian leaders want to appease Putin and cede him territory, need to remember how that worked out with Hitler before WWII. Ukraine could win this if given the support but too many are dragging their feet.

You are right. We really should step up the sanctions and somehow speed up the US Dollar printing presses until this goes the way we want it to...

Why only shoot ourselves in one leg when we can go for both and REALLY show them who is boss! :)

How is our 'Assad must go' crap working out after so many years of trying?

How about those 'sanctions' on Iran to stop them and bring them into line?

What is up with the Guaido guy we said / proclaimed is the 'legitimate' president of Venezuela?

We really showed Afghanistan, didn't we...

Thank goodness our 'sanctions' worked against North Korea...

The same people telling you (and obviously convincing) that we need to go even deeper into debt to 'secure' THEIR border are at the same time telling you to disregard OUR border and look the other way as they allow illegal immigration to not only continue but to grow to levels never seen before in our history.

Either of those 'border decisions' helps your life how?

What does Twatter say about any of that? :)

georgeib

06-12-22, 15:49

I read an article a while ago written by an former SEAL regarding the efficacy of sanctions. His take was that they don't work, as evidenced by the fact... well that they don't work. He explained that they pretty much serve to entrench the political base and power of the people in charge. He mentioned Cuba, North Korea, and Iran as examples. He made solid points.

He suggested that the way to truly effect "regime change" was to open up imports, in the target countries. And basically show the populace what they're missing, and that they themselves would initiate the change from a grassroots organic effort.

I expect sanctions on Russia to work no better than they have any other time they've been tried. They will serve to consolidate Putin's base, and prove to them that the West is not their friend. Those in charge will use this momentum to consolidate greater control and ally with others against us. They will increase their efforts to undermine us internationally, and will do everything they can to accelerate the already inevitable $ collapse.

The people running this country will get the destruction of America they've been working so diligently towards. Useful idiots in tow.

tn1911

06-12-22, 23:24

Russia Threatens Poland with Nuclear Strike

https://news.yahoo.com/foreign-ministry-russia-threatens-poland-131547257.html

Alpha-17

06-13-22, 09:08

I read an article a while ago written by an former SEAL regarding the efficacy of sanctions. His take was that they don't work, as evidenced by the fact... well that they don't work. He explained that they pretty much serve to entrench the political base and power of the people in charge. He mentioned Cuba, North Korea, and Iran as examples. He made solid points.

I tend to agree with that. Sanctions have a piss-poor track record. Of course, I don't think open trading does a damn thing either, because the tyrants in power will just take credit for the increase in goods and standard of living.

Another good analysis by Perun, is this one of the issues of infantry shortage that even the most rabid propagandist has to admit hurt the Russians early on. Even with all the talk of artillery dominating the current battle in the Donbas region, it warms my infantryman's cold heart to hear even a civilian recognize the crucial role grunts play.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AKewF8_SiIs&t=1204s

mack7.62

06-15-22, 17:32

Well the Ruskies are in trouble now, the M14 has shown up.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxfCz-vkcvs

DG23

06-15-22, 17:52

Well the Ruskies are in trouble now, the M14 has shown up.

You keep saying they are in trouble but the Ukrainians are the ones that keep losing ground and surrendering in mass...

A waste of good rifles is all we just did.

mack7.62

06-15-22, 19:11

Oh I don't think killing Russian invaders is such a waste and they didn't get them from the US, we gave the Balkan States around 160,000 during the late 90's.

Alpha-17

06-16-22, 06:45

You keep saying they are in trouble but the Ukrainians are the ones that keep losing ground and surrendering in mass...

A waste of good rifles is all we just did.

We're letting obsolete rifles have a chance to do what they were designed to do, kill Russians. Not seeing the waste. Certainly better than letting them sit in storage.

DG23

06-16-22, 21:59

We're letting obsolete rifles have a chance to do what they were designed to do, kill Russians. Not seeing the waste. Certainly better than letting them sit in storage.

Russian speaking civilians that actually LIVE and reside in the area (as they have for many, many, many years) or actual combat troops that came over recently from Russia proper? (no doubt in my mind that you know the truthful answer but will not dare speak of it)

Currently about 2,500 Ukrainian troops are encircled by Russian armed forces and sheltering in underground bunkers at the Azot plant in Severodonetsk. (Does this sound familiar to you?)

No chance of retreat or resupply for any of them as the Russians pretty much have fire control of / on every road around them AND air superiority... All of that AND the nearby bridge that other Ukrainians blew up to HELP prevent any retreat or resupply...

Like last time (the Azovstal steel plant being the most recent example), these Ukraine troops are intentionally holding civilians down there with them and refusing to allow them (the civilians) to leave as they are nothing more than human shields to the cowardly Ukraine forces. (Yes, Only cowards hide behind civilians)

In a week or two Zelensky will reluctantly (just like last time) announce they have been 'successfully extracted'.
(to Russian captivity :))

https://i.imgur.com/RBAPquR.jpg

Picture those cubs as the Russian speaking people that LIVE in those particular regions (that declared independence from the ****ery that is Ukraine BTW) and the spear as some weapon that the US, NATO, or Britain drug out from the closet to send to them to 'help' them out...

Notice how the US, NATO (not ALL of NATO but most of them), and Britain are hiding behind that rock and won't actually get on up in there and stand 'side by side' with their 'friend' Ukraine while he screws with that bear?

Aside of the banning of pretty much any and all opposition parties - the Zelensky regime not allowing any 'breathing' males to even leave the country (You are in the ARMY now boy / old man! :rolleyes:) speaks volumes about what the actual citizens of Ukraine really want here.

Hint: When your 'leaders' have to use special decrees / laws and force against the local citizenry to be able to even get them to stay in the country, AND to have to use even more force to get them to get their asses out there on the front lines and really fight for them - Something is definitely wrong with your 'leaders'...

Wake27

06-17-22, 00:23

Russian speaking civilians that actually LIVE and reside in the area (as they have for many, many, many years) or actual combat troops that came over recently from Russia proper? (no doubt in my mind that you know the truthful answer but will not dare speak of it)

Currently about 2,500 Ukrainian troops are encircled by Russian armed forces and sheltering in underground bunkers at the Azot plant in Severodonetsk. (Does this sound familiar to you?)

No chance of retreat or resupply for any of them as the Russians pretty much have fire control of / on every road around them AND air superiority... All of that AND the nearby bridge that other Ukrainians blew up to HELP prevent any retreat or resupply...

Like last time (the Azovstal steel plant being the most recent example), these Ukraine troops are intentionally holding civilians down there with them and refusing to allow them (the civilians) to leave as they are nothing more than human shields to the cowardly Ukraine forces. (Yes, Only cowards hide behind civilians)

In a week or two Zelensky will reluctantly (just like last time) announce they have been 'successfully extracted'.
(to Russian captivity :))

https://i.imgur.com/RBAPquR.jpg

Picture those cubs as the Russian speaking people that LIVE in those particular regions (that declared independence from the ****ery that is Ukraine BTW) and the spear as some weapon that the US, NATO, or Britain drug out from the closet to send to them to 'help' them out...

Notice how the US, NATO (not ALL of NATO but most of them), and Britain are hiding behind that rock and won't actually get on up in there and stand 'side by side' with their 'friend' Ukraine while he screws with that bear?

Aside of the banning of pretty much any and all opposition parties - the Zelensky regime not allowing any 'breathing' males to even leave the country (You are in the ARMY now boy / old man! :rolleyes:) speaks volumes about what the actual citizens of Ukraine really want here.

Hint: When your 'leaders' have to use special decrees / laws and force against the local citizenry to be able to even get them to stay in the country, AND to have to use even more force to get them to get their asses out there on the front lines and really fight for them - Something is definitely wrong with your 'leaders'...

Jesus Christ just stop. You don’t know anywhere near as much as you think you do and the bullshit you just keep pushing isn’t convincing anyone.

You’ve been wrong in such critical ways that it’s actually starting to blow my mind how stubborn you are because you won’t even admit that you were wrong even though it’s in this thread.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

mack7.62

06-17-22, 04:59

Hey DG things are going so well that the Commanding General of the VDV (Russian Airborne Forces) just "retired" sure sign they are winning.

https://twitter.com/RALee85/status/1537693387494674432

Rob Lee
@RALee85
A VDV VK page and one of the moderators of the Lost Armour website are both claiming that Andrey Serdyukov has been replaced by Colonel-General Mikhail Teplinskiy as the commander of the Russian VDV. (h/t
@666_mancer
)
https://vk.com/russia_desant?w=wall-106160452_311357

mack7.62

06-17-22, 07:32

Appears Snake Island has claimed another Russian ship, the tug Vasily Bekh was reported struck by two Harpoon missiles while on a resupply run. Fairly new entered service in 2017 and I believe she was around 67 meters, 1600 ton and had a TOR air defense missile launcher strapped to her helo deck which did not help.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/sebastienroblin/2022/06/17/ukraine-blasts-russian-tug-near-snake-island-with-land-based-missiles/?sh=160863e8408c

Alpha-17

06-17-22, 08:31

*gurgle gurgle, Putin's the best, gurgle gurgle**
(Edited your quote down to save space. I think I saved the gist of it.)

You know, you're the only one of the propagandists on here I haven't set to ignore because for a while you were the only one occasionally making a point worth reading. Posts like that one are going to force me to reevaluate that opinion.

That cartoon is laughably bad, and it was laughed off months ago when it was first posted. Not sure what you think you're accomplishing by posting it, other than it supports your bizarre worldview. But, hey, let's break your argument down, shall we?

Putin, who's totally not a totalitarian dictator hell-bent on conquest, invaded, wait, and conducted a special military operation to liberate his fellow ethnic Russians who were being persecuted and killed by Neo Nazis. Those poor, picked on ethnic Russians hated the evil Neo Nazis so much that they declared independence, but the Neo Nazis just wouldn't let them go, and kept throwing everything (including their own unwilling male population, who all would rather run away rather than fight) at these poor people for no reason than their undying hatred of the Russians. Or something. That about the sum of it?

Except, Putin's lackeys invaded before independence was declared. Russian citizens, recently living in Russia, were the early leaders of the "independence" movement. In reaction to military defeats, Russia intervened directly and prolonged the war by turning it into a stalemate. 8 years later, Putin invades the entire country, after claiming the Ukrainians were trying to conduct genocide. The evidence for this just happened to be discovered in territory the Russians had controlled for 8 years, and just happened to be discovered while the Russians were conducting massive wargames in Belarus. Yep, totally seems legit. After failing to secure the entire country, the Russians have now resorted to bombing the hell out of every inch of ground they take, which just happens to be the cities and homes of the people they are trying to "liberate." As has already been said, the number of civilian casualties inflicted by the Russians has now drastically outstripped those that can be blamed on the Ukrainians during the 8 years before Feb 24. That's pretty piss poor "liberation" if you destroy more homes and property and kill more people in a few months than the evil "occupiers" did in 8 years of "genocide".

How about the people? You love to talk about the Ukrainian government forbidding men from leaving the country as if that's not relatively common for countries fighting for survival. (hell, the US has a long history of conscription, and other than the South during the Civil War, has never faced an existential threat of this scale) If that's so damning, what about this?

https://www.reddit.com/r/ukraina/comments/vdk403/russian_fighter_laughs_about_the_high_casualties/

We've got a Russian soldier joking about how they are using draftees from these "republics" as cannon fodder. Yep, they really give a crap about them, don't they? Clearly, the Russians are liberators and not brutal invaders. I'm sure you'll say that's just Ukrainian propaganda, but remember, he's a Russian soldier, and this isn't from any Ukrainian or Western media.

And what's sad is we've already seen a discussion about this before. The last video I shared from Perun talked about this quite considerably. Since I doubt very much that you bother to even try and inform yourself on non-propaganda reports, here it is again, skipped forward to the relevant section:

https://youtu.be/AKewF8_SiIs?t=1889

He quotes Separatist leadership to make his points, so again, you can't claim it's just Western Propaganda. Old men, with no training and WWII surplus, are being thrown into the fight and the Russians don't give a **** what happens to them. Yeah, they're definitely Russia's beloved cubs, who Putin is trying desperately to save from the evil west. Because remember, Putin started this. No one else. You were wrong about Russian intentions, you were wrong about Russia holding Ukraine to the Minsk agreements, you were wrong about Russian intentions in regards to both regime change and "avoiding civilian casualties" and now you are wrong about this.

tn1911

06-24-22, 11:26

Dramatic moment Russian missile fails during launch and boomerangs back before ‘blowing up Putin’s troops’

https://www.the-sun.com/news/5630803/russian-missile-fail-launch-ukraine-war/

:lol:

tn1911

06-24-22, 16:29

Russia’s republics, bled dry by Putin, begin to demand independence from his rule

https://inews.co.uk/news/world/putin-using-ukraine-war-russia-independence-moscow-1698699

In the fourth month of an ever-bloodier conflict with no foreseeable prospect of resolution, the idea of downsizing Russia is enjoying a resurgence. Hawks at European think tanks argue it is both viable and desirable and US officials have expressed support for the idea. Russian dissident newspaper The Moscow Times recently published a column predicting the war would “lead to the end of the country itself.”

There are also signs of independence movements stirring in the Russian republics. The Federation is made up of 85 provinces of which 22 are republics, each representing a different ethnicity. Most were independent territories before being conquered and absorbed into Russia. They were granted autonomy after the fall of the USSR.

tn1911

06-25-22, 19:49

Russia will soon exhaust its combat capabilities, Western assessments predict

https://www.msn.com/ru-xl/news/newsworld/russia-will-soon-exhaust-its-combat-capabilities-western-assessments-predict/ar-AAYQXFi

The Russian military will soon exhaust its combat capabilities and be forced to bring its offensive in Ukraine’s eastern Donbas region to a grinding halt, according to Western intelligence predictions and military experts.

“There will come a time when the tiny advances Russia is making become unsustainable in light of the costs and they will need a significant pause to regenerate capability,” said a senior Western official, speaking on the condition of anonymity to discuss a sensitive issue.

But the “creeping” advances are dependent almost entirely on the expenditure of vast quantities of ammunition, notably artillery shells, which are being fired at a rate almost no military in the world would be able to sustain for long, said the senior Western official.

Russia, meanwhile, is continuing to suffer heavy losses of equipment and men, calling into question how much longer it can remain on the attack, the official said.

But conditions for Ukrainian troops are only likely to improve as more sophisticated Western weapons arrive, while those of Russian forces can be expected to deteriorate as they dig deeper into their stocks of old, outdated equipment, said retired Gen. Ben Hodges, a former commander of U.S. forces in Europe who is now with the Center for European Policy Analysis. At some point in the coming months, the Ukrainians will have received enough Western weaponry that it is likely they will be able to go on the counteroffensive and reverse the tide of the war, he said.

vicious_cb

06-26-22, 02:10

DG23

06-26-22, 07:37

Russia will soon exhaust its combat capabilities, Western assessments predict

Looks like they took the city of Severodonetsk before any of that garbage you are spouting. The Ukraine troops somehow managed to beat a retreat from that one.

Remember what Zelensky said about that city?

Earlier this month, Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky called Severodonetsk “an epicenter of the confrontation in the Donbass.”

“In many ways, the fate of our Donbass is being decided there,” he claimed.

Remind us again how Ukraine is 'winning' here...

DG23

06-26-22, 07:39

Imagine believing MSN news. Really inhaling the copium there bro.

Slightly better than the other guy with his 'news' from random twatter idiots.

The Dumb Gun Collector

06-26-22, 08:32

Guys! Remember, we are all going to discuss this like adults. As far as I know none of us are in the trenches so keep it cool.

We need to remember, at the start of this the Ukrainians were going to fall within days or weeks. They were going to take Kiev, were going to roll through Odesa and perhaps even roll into Moldova to join up with Transnistria. Now we are talking about a couple of individual towns and being amazing victories for the Russians. This is a war and a huge mess. Clearly the Russians started this war with a decapitation/regime change based on mistaken intelligence (I guess we aren't the only ones). Both sides have lost an unbelievable amount of material and men for a land corridor along the eastern side of the country. Now, the Russians have found their footing as they have selected more realistic goals. If things keep grinding along like this I would assume that the Russians will be able to sue for peace and consolidate some material gains in the Donbas . This will certainly be a victory for the Russians (at huge cost to their military and their economy, but Putin knew this at the outset, even if he wasn't expecting what he got). If the Ukrainians are able to integrate the new gear that they are getting into their military they might be able to claw back some of this territory. Because I am not Nostrodamas, I can't say for sure which of these two will happen. However, I will say, and you can come back and mock me later, there is no way the Russians take the Ukraine. It is clear they just don't have the capacity.

So here is what I predict (screen shot for later mockery!).

1. Ukraine will still be an independent country, permanently aligned with the EU and NATO. It will also be several orders of magnitude better armed and permanently sympathetic to the west.

2. Ukraine will probably have to give up land roughly starting at Kherson in the South, curving back to Donetest and up a little past Luhansk. This is a win for Russia. Whether it was worth all this is up to debate. I certainly don't think so, but I am not Vladimir Putin.

3. Sweden and Finland will be part of Nato, making Putin's stated goal of creating a buffer between Nato and the Russian empire a colossal failure. (Yes, I know Turkey is slowing the process down, but they will back down after they get bought off).

4. The Russians are headed for dark days when the price of oil collapses. He is already dependent on selling oil at cut rate prices to India and China. They will come back for further discounts when the market price of oil drops.

5. I am not sure how the Russians are going to deal with things like the collapse of their domestic airlines (as just one example). They will not be able to lease aircraft, get parts, etc. If this doesn't come to and end soon they won't be able to support their aircraft. The lessors have already written of the aircraft. It's a huge mess. I can't imagine anyone leasing them new aircraft one the next decade. Maybe they will think of something.

6. I don't care how much you think they will win, nobody can say Russian military equipment or tactics have made any kind of good showing. Russia has been dependent on the sales of this equipment to (mostly) poor countries. It's going to be a while before they are able to trick serious people into believing their equipment is anything other than 70s surplus.

EDITED TO ADD

7. I am interested to see if they will default on their debts tonight. The story from Russia is that they are fine because of the uptick in the price of oil (although they haven't been able to charge the full amount since purchasing from them is complicated by sanctions, etc). They are at the end of their 30 days frame period tonight, and I don't think anyone will accept their propped-up Rubles. Definitely something to watch.

Alpha-17

06-26-22, 09:26

6. I don't care how much you think they will win, nobody can say Russian military equipment or tactics have made any kind of good showing. Russia has been dependent on the sales of this equipment to (mostly) poor countries. It's going to be a while before they are able to trick serious people into believing their equipment is anything other than 70s surplus.

I agree largely with the rest, though I tend to disagree with this one. Never forget the Lazer Pig loop, because it will make a massive comeback if Russian propaganda spouts "we won! We're so great!" long enough.

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52085465712_ced4eecaec_z.jpg

On the plus side, that means Russian sympathetic countries will continue to buy crap, and the Russian military may fail to learn lessons long term from their opening disasters.

tn1911

06-26-22, 12:31

Remind us again how Ukraine is 'winning' here...

No one expected Ukraine to last days from the initial invasion. The mighty Russian army backed up by the mighty Russian Air Force was supposed to crush them in hours...

Yet here we are 4 months later and Russia has suffered huge losses of troops, generals, tanks, equipment, aircraft and even its prized flagship of the Black Sea...

All from a country of farmers.

Russia may never recover their losses just from not having the money or infrastructure to source parts and build replacement equipment. No one in the west will trust them for a very very long time. Their actions has strengthened NATO and rallied the EU to get serious about defense.

Despite the wishful thinking of a few pro pootin fanboys here Russia has been cutoff from the global financial system and will probably default soon driving them further into economic isolation.

Yeah I’d say that the Ukrainian farmers are making this special military operation very very costly for Russia.

Slava Ukraini!!!

tn1911

06-26-22, 14:36

G-7 Commits to Supporting Ukraine’s Defense Indefinitely

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-06-26/g-7-draft-commits-to-supporting-ukraine-s-defense-indefinitely

“We will continue to provide financial, humanitarian, military and diplomatic support and stand with Ukraine for as long as it takes,” according to the text of a draft statement on support for Ukraine. “As we do so, we commit to demonstrate global responsibility and solidarity through working to address the international impacts of Russia’s aggression, especially on the most vulnerable.”

tn1911

06-26-22, 14:43

Commando Network Coordinates Flow of Weapons in Ukraine, Officials Say

A secretive operation involving U.S. Special Operations forces hints at the scale of efforts to assist Ukraine’s still outgunned military.

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/06/25/us/politics/commandos-russia-ukraine.html?smid=url-share

tn1911

06-26-22, 14:51

Several Russian generals removed by Kremlin over course of conflict - UK defence intelligence says

https://news.sky.com/story/ukraine-war-several-russian-generals-removed-by-kremlin-over-course-of-conflict-uk-defence-intelligence-says-12640134

The commander of Russia's airborne forces and of another major armed forces group are the latest to lose their positions due to Russian forces' lack of progress in Ukraine, the MoD's intelligence arm says in its daily report.

Do you keep removing generals if you think you are winning?

tn1911

06-26-22, 14:53

Canadian special forces operating in Ukraine, New York Times reports

https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/canadian-special-forces-operating-in-ukraine-new-york-times-reports/wcm/fa2ac3b7-cdb7-40a3-b956-5bf9d2f28cfb/amp/

Canadian special forces are in Ukraine as part of a NATO network to provide weapons, training and gather intelligence about the Russians, the New York Times is reporting.

vicious_cb

06-26-22, 15:28

Yes just keep news dumping the same sources that have been lying to you since 2016.

Guys! Remember, we are all going to discuss this like adults. As far as I know none of us are in the trenches so keep it cool.

We need to remember, at the start of this the Ukrainians were going to fall within days or weeks. They were going to take Kiev, were going to roll through Odesa and perhaps even roll into Moldova to join up with Transnistria. Now we are talking about a couple of individual towns and being amazing victories for the Russians. This is a war and a huge mess. Clearly the Russians started this war with a decapitation/regime change based on mistaken intelligence (I guess we aren't the only ones). Both sides have lost an unbelievable amount of material and men for a land corridor along the eastern side of the country. Now, the Russians have found their footing as they have selected more realistic goals. If things keep grinding along like this I would assume that the Russians will be able to sue for peace and consolidate some material gains in the Donbas . This will certainly be a victory for the Russians (at huge cost to their military and their economy, but Putin knew this at the outset, even if he wasn't expecting what he got). If the Ukrainians are able to integrate the new gear that they are getting into their military they might be able to claw back some of this territory. Because I am not Nostrodamas, I can't say for sure which of these two will happen. However, I will say, and you can come back and mock me later, there is no way the Russians take the Ukraine. It is clear they just don't have the capacity.

So here is what I predict (screen shot for later mockery!).

1. Ukraine will still be an independent country, permanently aligned with the EU and NATO. It will also be several orders of magnitude better armed and permanently sympathetic to the west.

2. Ukraine will probably have to give up land roughly starting at Kherson in the South, curving back to Donetest and up a little past Luhansk. This is a win for Russia. Whether it was worth all this is up to debate. I certainly don't think so, but I am not Vladimir Putin.

3. Sweden and Finland will be part of Nato, making Putin's stated goal of creating a buffer between Nato and the Russian empire a colossal failure. (Yes, I know Turkey is slowing the process down, but they will back down after they get bought off).

4. The Russians are headed for dark days when the price of oil collapses. He is already dependent on selling oil at cut rate prices to India and China. They will come back for further discounts when the market price of oil drops.

5. I am not sure how the Russians are going to deal with things like the collapse of their domestic airlines (as just one example). They will not be able to lease aircraft, get parts, etc. If this doesn't come to and end soon they won't be able to support their aircraft. The lessors have already written of the aircraft. It's a huge mess. I can't imagine anyone leasing them new aircraft one the next decade. Maybe they will think of something.

6. I don't care how much you think they will win, nobody can say Russian military equipment or tactics have made any kind of good showing. Russia has been dependent on the sales of this equipment to (mostly) poor countries. It's going to be a while before they are able to trick serious people into believing their equipment is anything other than 70s surplus.

EDITED TO ADD

7. I am interested to see if they will default on their debts tonight. The story from Russia is that they are fine because of the uptick in the price of oil (although they haven't been able to charge the full amount since purchasing from them is complicated by sanctions, etc). They are at the end of their 30 days frame period tonight, and I don't think anyone will accept their propped-up Rubles. Definitely something to watch.

The problem I have with people just dumping obvious propaganda is that it screws up everyone's decision making things more uncertain. Look what happened to the Russians outside of Kiev when they believed their own propaganda when they thought the Kiev government was just going to fold after a few Thunder Runs. Now its the opposite, the Ukrainians are believing their own propaganda trying to hold on every inch of territory in the east no matter how untenable it is. Now we are seeing 10k+ troops encircled Lysychansk, another 2k troops killed or captured when Zolote got encircled. This is no doubt a top down policy that is going to see massive numbers of highly experienced troops in the east lost. All the BS propaganda is just making this a more bloody affair for everyone involved.

Ive been watching the day by day exchanges of every town and territory for the last 2 months and making my own conclusions of whats happening on the battlefield. The fact people like tn1911 are doing everyone a disservice by posting clear lies and propaganda so the people that read this NYT schlock will make decisions based on the wrong information. Whats more a adult like discussion? Presenting reality as it is no matter how unsavory or spam posting more fantasy Ghost of Kiev Avengers bullshit articles?

tn1911

06-26-22, 15:59

Yes just keep news dumping the same sources that have been lying to you since 2016.

The problem I have with people just dumping obvious propaganda is that it screws up everyone's decision making things more uncertain. Look what happened to the Russians outside of Kiev when they believed their own propaganda when they thought the Kiev government was just going to fold after a few Thunder Runs. Now its the opposite, the Ukrainians are believing their own propaganda trying to hold on every inch of territory in the east no matter how untenable it is. Now we are seeing 10k+ troops encircled Lysychansk, another 2k troops killed or captured when Zolote got encircled. This is no doubt a top down policy that is going to see massive numbers of highly experienced troops in the east lost. All the BS propaganda is just making this a more bloody affair for everyone involved.

But you’re ok with Russia invading Ukraine?

That part don’t bother you... what exactly is the driver behind all of y’all cheering for Putin? Because trump told you he’s the world leader he most admired?

Y’all have strayed so far from the reservation y’all support a murderous ex-KGB agent who’s the mafia leader of a nuclear armed gas station...

What’s next, y’all gonna toss your heart and soul behind Xi Jinping when he moves on Taiwan?

Outlander Systems

06-26-22, 16:13

Not my circus, not my monkeys.

But you’re ok with Russia invading Ukraine?

What’s next, y’all gonna toss your heart and soul behind Xi Jinping when he moves on Taiwan?

vicious_cb

06-26-22, 18:28

But you’re ok with Russia invading Ukraine?

That part don’t bother you... what exactly is the driver behind all of y’all cheering for Putin? Because trump told you he’s the world leader he most admired?

Y’all have strayed so far from the reservation y’all support a murderous ex-KGB agent who’s the mafia leader of a nuclear armed gas station...

What’s next, y’all gonna toss your heart and soul behind Xi Jinping when he moves on Taiwan?

Just because I don't support one corrupt oligarch state over another corrupt autocratic state means Im somehow pro-Putin? The question is why are you think things are so black and white? Maybe you are liberal or something. Or maybe you have son that works for Barisma just like every hardcore pro-Ukrainian politician out there. You arent the only one who can question motivations.

Not my circus, not my monkeys.

Bingo, I like how being anti this conflict and not picking one side over the other somehow makes you the bad guy. We sure GD hasnt turned into a liberal echo chamber?