View Full Version : I will never forget that Tuesdsy morning, back on September 11, 2001.
I still remember that Tuesdsy morning. I will never forget it. May God bless all those of have perished that day and may he bless all of those who have answered thr call since then. Those who have defended our nation and our people.
Those who have sacrificed and given all.
Those have have returned home, broken.
May God bless us all.
Ashes to ashes,
Dust to dust,
Brother to brother.
https://i.imgur.com/Q5X9LDW.jpeg
My now ex wife, then girlfriend was an American Airlines flight attendant. I picked her up that morning at DFW. She flew in from Boston on a redeye flight that left the same terminal that Muhammad Atta left on Flight 11 shortly after her from.
After I picked her up we went to her APT next to the airport and went to sleep. We had just started to nod off. When the phone rang. She got out of bed. I said let them leave a message. She said what if it's important. I said to my self, it's never important. She started saying WHAT OH MY GOD! I thought oh crap someone died. I said what is it! She said quick tun on the TV. My mom said an American flight has been hijacked. I thought Holy crap, NO WAY.
I turned on the TV to see an Anchorman standing with the World Trade Centers behind him and smoke billowing from one of the buildings. He was talking about a airplane had hit the World Trade Center. Oddly the Anchorman didn't seem to know what size plane for sure. When a few minutes later when the second plane came streaking in and struck the other Tower. It was surreal.
Straight Shooter
09-11-22, 21:05
Had just backed up to a warehouse dock in Westboro NC. The local radio said at first "a small Cessna has apparently collided with the WTC". Took awhile it seems for the news, on radio at least, to catch up with the goings on. It was 4 days later before I could get to a tv to actually see it for myself.
titsonritz
09-11-22, 21:19
Crazy stuff. Fighter pilot was ordered to ram Flight 93.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gaZCnvlMWg8
It took that day for me to understand the people who could never forgive the Japanese for Pearl Harbor.
It does NOT seem like 21 years ago. I can still remember my wife calling me and telling me to turn on the tv. I was still doing morning routines and hadn't checked to computer yet or watched any tv. I think I watched the tv for an entire month after that day.
I remember pulling a rifle and loading 10 mags and some other stuff. Didn't know what was coming next.
Crazy stuff. Fighter pilot was ordered to ram Flight 93.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gaZCnvlMWg8
Geeze, what kind of shitheads authorize a launch to intercept but don't authorize any kind of weaponry.
titsonritz
09-11-22, 21:31
It does NOT seem like 21 years ago.
Hard to believe if 9/11 was a kid born on that day he/she can legally drink now.
Gabriel556
09-11-22, 21:53
They weren’t loaded. The aircraft were sent to get eyes on the unresponsive aircraft and it was after they were airborne that it became clear it was a terrorist attack. There was also further implications of shooting down an airliner with civilians onboard.
Hard to believe if 9/11 was a kid born on that day he/she can legally drink now.
We had Soldiers and Marines fighting in Afghanistan that were born after 9/11 happened.
They weren’t loaded. The aircraft were sent to get eyes on the unresponsive aircraft and it was after they were airborne that it became clear it was a terrorist attack. There was also further implications of shooting down an airliner with civilians onboard.
In that case, they shouldn't have been waiting around for approval to launch. I mean, I get it, just f'ing retarded if you ask me. Also don't see a huge distinction between shooting a commercial airliner down and asking a pilot to ram it with their jet.
FromMyColdDeadHand
09-11-22, 22:20
I thought that the modern fighters needed the gun rounds for weight and balance, or were there dummy rounds loaded...
Lot's of lessons from that day. The one that I always come back to is that AQ sent their best- the most skilled and heartless killers who trained for years and knew that this was their one and only mission. And by the time it came to FLT93, and the passengers were aware of the new reality- they got inside the OODA loop of AQs best. A pick-up team of United Airlines Mileage Plus Frequent flier members handed those goat ****ers their asses. The 300? The Alamo? They have nothing on what the heroes on FLt93 did.
BangBang77
09-11-22, 22:42
...by the time it came to FLT93, and the passengers were aware of the new reality- they got inside the OODA loop of AQs best. A pick-up team of United Airlines Mileage Plus Frequent flier members handed those goat ****ers their asses. The 300? The Alamo? They have nothing on what the heroes on FLt93 did.
This right here. All day long.
I thought that the modern fighters needed the gun rounds for weight and balance, or were there dummy rounds loaded...
Lot's of lessons from that day. The one that I always come back to is that AQ sent their best- the most skilled and heartless killers who trained for years and knew that this was their one and only mission. And by the time it came to FLT93, and the passengers were aware of the new reality- they got inside the OODA loop of AQs best. A pick-up team of United Airlines Mileage Plus Frequent flier members handed those goat ****ers their asses. The 300? The Alamo? They have nothing on what the heroes on FLt93 did.
There were hundreds of hopeful candidates. Muslims men here in the United States taking flight lessons. Racing to get to the flight training level of being proficient in flying 757 and 767 aircrafts.
I thought that the modern fighters needed the gun rounds for weight and balance, or were there dummy rounds loaded...
Lot's of lessons from that day. The one that I always come back to is that AQ sent their best- the most skilled and heartless killers who trained for years and knew that this was their one and only mission. And by the time it came to FLT93, and the passengers were aware of the new reality- they got inside the OODA loop of AQs best. A pick-up team of United Airlines Mileage Plus Frequent flier members handed those goat ****ers their asses. The 300? The Alamo? They have nothing on what the heroes on FLt93 did.
If ever there was a group of underdogs I WISH could have prevailed, it should have been them.
I also wish the CIA and FBI had been more focused on the many intelligence opportunities that existed, that might have prevented this instead of looking into whatever group had been deemed racist that week by the SPLC.
I also remember when I learned of the complete event of Flight 93, I arrived at "passengers should be allowed to board and carry live firearms IF they have a CCW." The creation of TSA and a plan to "more completely disarm passengers" was shocking to me as their solution to 9-11.
One person with a real weapon could have taken back the plane. They had the will, they just weren't allowed to have the stuff.
Hammer_Man
09-12-22, 06:19
I remember driving to work that morning listening to the Mark and Brian show. Their tone was different from their usual joviality, and I could tell something really bad was happening. At the time I was working a temp job at the distribution center for a large online retailer, and when I got there all the TVs were turned on to the news. Seeing the images on all those TVs was surreal. I called my dad and told him what happened, and to turn on the news. That day the city of Portland took on a somber demeanor not seen since. When I got home that night, I helped my dad put up our flag on the outside column of our house. Several of our neighbors had done the same.
Pacific5th
09-12-22, 07:38
I was 19 and supposed to go to boot camp on the 13th or 14th. My dad woke me up and I saw the second plane hit. I remember telling him “well my 4 may be more interesting then I thought”. Because of the Airline shut down we didn’t get to MCRD San Diego tell the 17th. While waiting in Seattle to fly out I remember my parents coming down and we went over to the Seattle Center and the main fountain had been turned into a huge makeshift memorial with lots of flowers, letters and pictures of people everywhere. It was very moving. I also remember how quite the sky's got. Living between Seattle and Everett we had lots of commercial birds. Within a few hours it was quite except for the occasional scream of F15’s out of Portland and F18’s and 14’s out of Oak Harbor.
Fordtough25
09-12-22, 08:49
I will never forget or forgive either, I was service manager at a yamaha dealership when it happened. The owner came back and told us to stop what we were doing and come up front to see the TV, I was shocked.
Within a half hour the brand new murphys gas station across the road was completely packed with cars in line for a good bit outside the lot, and to think all three of my kids were born after 2001. Crazy
was working at a ski resort in sw Colorado on the brush crew. was waiting for the final member of the crew to show up so we could go to work on the hill. when he showed up he just went straight to the tv and switched it on, we stood and watched the news feed for about 10 minutes before I finally said let's go to work. about 4 days later while on break was watching the sky as Purgatory was a busy flight route for military training flights. there had been no air traffic since the 11th then I spot a lone KC-135 refueling a lone B-1 way above the typical altitude that training flights would do. they covered the line of sight that I had in less than a minute my guesstimate would be 10 miles so they KC had all it's hamster's on maximum
FromMyColdDeadHand
09-12-22, 09:15
I remember the lack of planes, but when you did see a plane or contrails, you knew it was someone, going somewhere, to do something...
Averageman
09-12-22, 09:28
I had retired from the Army in May and was Teaching HS that day.
My first and only thought was that I had to get back in to the Military.
My memory from that day and even the next day was how eerily quiet the roads, highways and expressways around me were. These roads were normally packed/jammed with cars, but not that morning after 10 or 11am. I mean it was like driving at midnight. I guess everyone went home to watch their TVs. A lady that rent office space from our company had a tv in her office and I went over to watch the live coverage. At lunch time I drove to the electronic superstore to buy a small tv, they were totally out except for one 5" black and white. The highway electronic traffic sign was blinking something like national emergency and the airport was closed.
Diamondback
09-12-22, 10:24
It was actually a frat brother's 21st birthday, and our return-home date from Portland on the last roadtrip before Fall Quarter. Literally a "Wakeup Call From Hell." JBLM security measures had I-5 backed up across several counties, so in order to get back up to Seattle we took backcountry and Forest Service roads east toward Mt. St. Helens then north from there.
Getting out of PDX, the roads were creepy empty... like The Day The Earth Stood Still.
We indefinitely postponed that "first legal beer" I was gonna buy him...
BangBang77
09-12-22, 11:04
I was working as a plant maintenance technician at the time, going to school at night to get my engineering degree. Working at one of the largest Whirlpool applicance plants in the central US.
Was driving down the main plant aisle on the way to a call, and my buddy's wife waved me down and said "we're under attack". I drove to the engineering office where we had TVs set up and watched the 2nd plane hit. Watched in disbelief at the carnage.
I had just ETS's out on a med board after a night jump accident in 1998 (broken back and femoral neck). I was recently married to a woman with 2 kids and had two younger brothers, one a medic at 2nd Batt and another was a Cav Scout at Hood. I knew I was fixing to miss the Super Bowl and my younger brothers would be working up to head out to get some. I've never had such a feeling of helplessness, anger, and envy, full knowing my old unit and my younger brothers would be in the mix.
I had a old buddy that hooked up with Blackwater and tried to get me in but I was still recovering from a recent VA hip surgery and passed on the opportunity. To this day, I've felt guilty that my younger brothers deployed, one of which lost a leg on his 3rd deployment, while I sat at home and headed up the corporate ladder. Not sure I'll ever shake that guilt...
To those of you did get the chance to deploy, I appreciate it.
I was working as a plant maintenance technician at the time, going to school at night to get my engineering degree. Working at one of the largest Whirlpool applicance plants in the central US.
Was driving down the main plant aisle on the way to a call, and my buddy's wife waved me down and said "we're under attack". I drove to the engineering office where we had TVs set up and watched the 2nd plane hit. Watched in disbelief at the carnage.
I had just ETS's out on a med board after a night jump accident in 1998 (broken back and femoral neck). I was recently married to a woman with 2 kids and had two younger brothers, one a medic at 2nd Batt and another was a Cav Scout at Hood. I knew I was fixing to miss the Super Bowl and my younger brothers would be working up to head out to get some. I've never had such a feeling of helplessness, anger, and envy, full knowing my old unit and my younger brothers would be in the mix.
I had a old buddy that hooked up with Blackwater and tried to get me in but I was still recovering from a recent VA hip surgery and passed on the opportunity. To this day, I've felt guilty that my younger brothers deployed, one of which lost a leg on his 3rd deployment, while I sat at home and headed up the corporate ladder. Not sure I'll ever shake that guilt...
To those of you did get the chance to deploy, I appreciate it.
I don't expect this will help any but I don't see any need for you to feel any guilt, you gave a lot with your injury. I'd say more than many.
That morning I was home, in AK, sleeping in and my wife woke me up after her mother called.
I had recently gotten a new position at work, had a new wife and a house payment.
If it had happened two years earlier I'd have been trying to get back in the Navy.
When flights were grounded there were many hunting and fishing parties out in the bush, they get flown out in small planes, then picked up at a predetermined time in the future.
I think the float plane company's got permission to go get those parties, many of them only had enough supplies for the short time they were going to be out.
I just started my Freshman year of high school, we lived about a half mile away from where Moussaoui trained to be a Pilot in Eagan Mn, we used to skateboard and attempted BMX tricks in the parking lot of the facility during the weekends. I remember taking the dog for a walk after that day and swore I would join the Military.
I had just gotten to the plant in Mexico & everyone was standing around the tv instead of working...first tower had just been hit. Everyone started screaming for me to get back across as they were going to shut down the POE's & about that time got a text from the Maquilla Assn saying just that. 2nd got hit while listening to the radio heading back home.
Border did get shut down after I got across but didn't last too long.
I was at home, still a young teen. My dad was at an elderly neighbors doing some work on their house.
We didn't have real TV back then because it was 'the devil' (well, maybe there was some truth to that after all... :laugh: ), but we had an old external antenna in the attic we could plug into and get the mainline news channels, if really necessary, like if we were 'allowed' to watch the olympics or whatever. Anyway...
A short while after my dad left, he comes back, comes tearing ass into the house, said "There's something going on in New York!" and made a beeline for the attic without saying anything else.
A few minutes of fiddlef***ing around later, he got the antenna hooked up. TV pops on to the first news channel to get signal - couldn't tell you who it was- and Tower 1 is on screen smoking from the top, and the heads are saying a plane hit it.
Always having been a history dweeb, I was already familiar with previous events like the first bombing, the fire, that time a B24 flew into the empire state in a fog, etc. So I thought "Oh wow, someone really forgot to set their altimeter this time" given NYC is busy with aircraft, only a matter of time.
A couple minutes after that reasonable explanation settled into my head, Plane 2 appears out the corner of the screen, BLAM, straight into tower 2.
Honestly, I didn't really feel anything. I always hear on the yearly rehash-fest of documentaries and interviews about how people were "terrified" and "stunned" and just totally out of their whits. I never got that; I never felt any of those things.
I simply instantly knew three things: This was not an accident, those towers were going to fall, and we were going to war.
Don't know what prompted the last two, I just knew. Same way I knew Bush was full of shit when trying to justify Iraq a few years later. Gut feeling I guess.
Sure enough, a little while later....there goes Tower 1...then Tower 2.
I think that's the thing that got me the most - watching people who had been standing in the streets for, what was it, almost an hour? with planes being flown at them, suddenly realizing that standing in the street was a really bad idea, and then trying to outrun a falling mega-skyscraper. That and the dance-party[s] this event spawned.
You don't realize you're watching in real-time a historical event that's going to change everything until a few years later. I wonder if that's the way it's been for other people living during similar upheavals in the past...
Anyway, I remember we had like a week or two of national solidarity afterwards; that was the last time I've ever seen this country universally united about anything. Then they rammed the [un]Patriot Act/TSA crap through and it's all been downhill from there. At least the flag makers made a few bucks off the hype.
In case you missed this one. Best Robert O'Neill interview. Must at watch 23:00 to 26:00. And 35:20 to 36:00.
https://youtu.be/MkUI7CFdG4g
But watch it all.
In case you missed this one. Best Robert O'Neill interview. Must at watch 23:00 to 26:00. And 35:20 to 36:00.
https://youtu.be/MkUI7CFdG4g
But watch it all.
That whole thing must have been surreal from start to finish.
ThirdWatcher
09-12-22, 23:50
Living on the left coast, I was getting ready for work when the towers came down. We really didn’t know the extent of the attack, in my gut I believe the enemy had more planned for us that day, but POTUS grounding non-military aircraft thwarted those plans.
The girls were getting ready for school, both ultimately served in the Army, one for eight and the other fifteen years.
When I arrived at work, I issued extra ammo to my Troopers and told them I didn’t care if they stopped a single car, just keep an eye on the infrastructure, especially the bridges.
BTW, it’s kinda stupid to have unarmed Military fighters on alert, kinda like the unarmed NG’s at the airports to make the sheeple “feel safe”. What B.S.
BTW, it’s kinda stupid to have unarmed Military fighters on alert, kinda like the unarmed NG’s at the airports to make the sheeple “feel safe”. What B.S.
So I remember when Hurricane Andrew took out Miami they deployed the National Guard with empty magazines, and then on top of that Lawton Chiles then gave an interview for the Miami Herald where he told people they didn't need to be scared because the National Guard wasn't carrying loaded weapons.
So for a couple weeks gang bangers were rolling up on guardsmen with LOADED glocks and getting a brand new M16A2 for their efforts.
When my uncle (living in Homestead) found out about that, we drove around to guard posts handing out 5.56 battlepacks. We only had one refusal, a gentlemen who informed us "Son...I'm from Texas...do you really think this weapon isn't loaded?"
That said, following 9-11, about 2 weeks later a M1 Abrams was parked on perimeter road at the Ft. Lauderdale airport just off the interstate. That made an impression. But guardsmen at the airport with M16s I barely noticed, several time early 80s I flew into Frankfurt and cops walking the gates with dogs and MP5s were a regular thing back then due to Baader/Meinhof aholes.
ThirdWatcher
09-13-22, 04:28
... When my uncle (living in Homestead) found out about that, we drove around to guard posts handing out 5.56 battlepacks. We only had one refusal, a gentlemen who informed us "Son...I'm from Texas...do you really think this weapon isn't loaded?"...
I grew up in DFW, the MP Co. I was assigned to in the ROK had a policy of no mags in M1911A1 Pistols when on patrol. (Too many ND’s, I guess.) One night I inserted my mag (as I always did) as I was leaving the main gate on foot patrol in the ville (forgetting my PSG was with me) and he noticed and complimented me for my initiative.
Nonetheless, three years was enough for me. Five round mags, one spare five round mag (at Bragg, the most violent place I ever worked), and no off-duty weapons was enough for me. Dumb@$$es...
I think that day when viewed through the lens of history, will be the start of the descent of freedom and liberty in the USA.
To this day the biggest backers and allies in that terrible day have gone untouched.
Think of our world with no patriot act, in and out of A-stan in about 15 months and a complete takeover of the country that did this to the the USA. Saudi Arabia. The USA should have invaded the kingdom and we should still be there, minus the whole so called royal family. Yes I mean kill them all.
I think that day when viewed through the lens of history, will be the start of the descent of freedom and liberty in the USA.
To this day the biggest backers and allies in that terrible day have gone untouched.
Think of our world with no patriot act, in and out of A-stan in about 15 months and a complete takeover of the country that did this to the the USA. Saudi Arabia. The USA should have invaded the kingdom and we should still be there, minus the whole so called royal family. Yes I mean kill them all.
Rather than fight ever Muslim on the planet for invading their holy Mecca, we should have required the Saudi Royal family to suppress, control and subjugate the wahabist in their land.
I was the service manager at a car dealership and will never forget the little scream/gasp that came from a customer who was watching the tv in the waiting room with me when the second plane hit. Up until then it was told that it was a Cessna or small, private aircraft of some sort.
Being close to NYC, friends described the scene from the bridges and closer. Another said how chilling it was seeing the F16s flying up and down the Hudson afterwards.
Only planes in the sky after that were going into or out of MaGuire AFB; seeing nothing in the skies headed to NY, DC or Phila was just eerie.
Anyway, I decided that day, at 32 years old, that I'd get involved one way or the other and applied to as many different agencies as I could picture having a part in America's response. Finished the FBI's police unit hiring process first and ended up here. Obviously, looking at that choice differently in light of the last 6 years in particular.
Visited some friends on HRT down at Quantico this year and they have a beam from the towers as a monument right outside their "barracks" that serves as a reminder. I wish that more of our employees came here for similar reasons but, sadly, in what I'm seeing, that ain't happening.
Remember after 9/11 when America celebrated patriots?
Now they're the enemy.
Straight Shooter
09-13-22, 20:04
I think that day when viewed through the lens of history, will be the start of the descent of freedom and liberty in the USA.
To this day the biggest backers and allies in that terrible day have gone untouched.
Think of our world with no patriot act, in and out of A-stan in about 15 months and a complete takeover of the country that did this to the the USA. Saudi Arabia. The USA should have invaded the kingdom and we should still be there, minus the whole so called royal family. Yes I mean kill them all.
Myself- I really believe when we saw how evil our own government was at WACO..then shortly after Ruby Ridge...the curtain was lifted on MY personal veil of ignorance. Burning children... a sniper shooting an unarmed mother HOLDING A BABY standing in a doorway...young kids in the back? Yeah- NorthKorea, Iran, Iraq, China, ect ect got NOTHING on us.
I just read that the FBI surounded Mike Lindell today while he was in a Hardees drive thru- & took his phone. IF THAT AINT GESTAPO SHIT-WHAT IS?
Straight Shooter
09-13-22, 20:05
Remember after 9/11 when America celebrated patriots?
Now they're the enemy.
For 6 months? Yeah- that was awesome.
Diamondback
09-13-22, 20:08
Myself- I really believe when we saw how evil our own government was at WACO..then shortly after Ruby Ridge...the curtain was lifted on MY personal veil of ignorance. Burning children... a sniper shooting an unarmed mother HOLDING A BABY standing in a doorway...young kids in the back? Yeah- NorthKorea, Iran, Iraq, China, ect ect got NOTHING on us.
I just read that the FBI surounded Mike Lindell today while he was in a Hardees drive thru- & took his phone. IF THAT AINT GESTAPO SHIT-WHAT IS?
Yeah, I'm gonna say the real enemy wasn't the Enemy Foreign but the Enemy Domestic of the Deep State and the Gov-Industrial Complex (remember, Ike warned us!) who needed an outside threat to make us clamor for an authoritarian autocracy.
https://youtu.be/EyF_XafkUCk
How many see this as less nazi like than the Mar-a-Lago raid?
Diamondback
09-13-22, 21:24
https://youtu.be/EyF_XafkUCk
How many see this as less nazi like than the Mar-a-Lago raid?
I dunno, but my German fiend observed that Team Biden's ramp-up of violent warlike rhetoric is uncannily similar to Hitler's along the road to Kristallnacht.
Start rereading William L. Shirer, folks, that's just about where we are.
Myself- I really believe when we saw how evil our own government was at WACO..then shortly after Ruby Ridge...the curtain was lifted on MY personal veil of ignorance. Burning children... a sniper shooting an unarmed mother HOLDING A BABY standing in a doorway...young kids in the back? Yeah- NorthKorea, Iran, Iraq, China, ect ect got NOTHING on us.
I just read that the FBI surounded Mike Lindell today while he was in a Hardees drive thru- & took his phone. IF THAT AINT GESTAPO SHIT-WHAT IS?
Minor point, Ruby Ridge (August 21–31, 1992) preceded Waco (February 28 – April 19, 1993). Also Ruby Ridge went down on Bush 41's watch and he resigned his NRA membership when they criticized the ATF as "jack booted thugs" following WACO.
We also shouldn't forget it was William Barr who was AG during Ruby Ridge when the FBI adopted what would later be considered illegal rules of engagement. And I don't believe for a second that Lon Horiuchi (HRT sniper) missed his intended victim when he shot and killed Vicki Weaver.
We should also remember Bush 41 was very culpable in this crap, he enacted the 1989 assault weapon ban when then drug czar Bill Bennett asked for it under the presumption that "only drug dealers use these weapons."
Clinton and Reno simply picked up where Bush 41 and Co. began and took it to even greater extremes.
Diamondback
09-13-22, 22:01
Minor point, Ruby Ridge (August 21–31, 1992) preceded Waco (February 28 – April 19, 1993). Also Ruby Ridge went down on Bush 41's watch and he resigned his NRA membership when they criticized the ATF as "jack booted thugs" following WACO.
We also shouldn't forget it was William Barr who was AG during Ruby Ridge when the FBI adopted what would later be considered illegal rules of engagement. And I don't believe for a second that Lon Horiuchi (HRT sniper) missed his intended victim when he shot and killed Vicki Weaver.
We should also remember Bush 41 was very culpable in this crap, he enacted the 1989 assault weapon ban with then drug czar Bill Bennett asked for it under the presumption that "only drug dealers use these weapons."
Clinton and Reno simply picked up where Bush 41 and Co. began and took it to even greater extremes.
Never forget that these sick freaks in the Alphabet Soup jack off to fantasies of murdering YOU and YOUR loved ones--"Women & Children First!"
Straight Shooter
09-14-22, 00:25
Minor point, Ruby Ridge (August 21–31, 1992) preceded Waco (February 28 – April 19, 1993). Also Ruby Ridge went down on Bush 41's watch and he resigned his NRA membership when they criticized the ATF as "jack booted thugs" following WACO.
We also shouldn't forget it was William Barr who was AG during Ruby Ridge when the FBI adopted what would later be considered illegal rules of engagement. And I don't believe for a second that Lon Horiuchi (HRT sniper) missed his intended victim when he shot and killed Vicki Weaver.
We should also remember Bush 41 was very culpable in this crap, he enacted the 1989 assault weapon ban when then drug czar Bill Bennett asked for it under the presumption that "only drug dealers use these weapons."
Clinton and Reno simply picked up where Bush 41 and Co. began and took it to even greater extremes.
Not a minor point..thank you. Wow how the years will make you forget things, I thought Waco first, then RR. sorry. The rest-I REMEMBER.
Not a minor point..thank you. Wow how the years will make you forget things, I thought Waco first, then RR. sorry. The rest-I REMEMBER.
I only remember it because we all thought Ruby Ridge was as bad as it could get, then Waco proved we were wrong. Waco was also back when I knew a lot of people in Federal law enforcement and as a consequence learned a lot of things about Waco, most of which I eventually wished I didn't know.
To say that the entire matter was preventable and could have easily been addressed without violence to anyone innocent is an understatement. When Grade A aholes like Charles Schumer feel compelled to investigate the incident, you know everything has gone wrong.
Sadly what we'd see on 9-11 would dwarf both incidents. I always wondered what the FBI was investigating that took priority over the many warnings they got about 9-11 actors, especially since the WTC had already been bombed back in 1993.
titsonritz
09-14-22, 18:32
If you have not already heard this episode of the Shawn Ryan where talks with Bernie Kerik - NYPD Police Commissioner on 9/11/2001, it is worth a listen. He and the mayor came within second of dying.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PmHQ8YPjLH0
So I remember when Hurricane Andrew took out Miami they deployed the National Guard with empty magazines, and then on top of that Lawton Chiles then gave an interview for the Miami Herald where he told people they didn't need to be scared because the National Guard wasn't carrying loaded weapons.
So for a couple weeks gang bangers were rolling up on guardsmen with LOADED glocks and getting a brand new M16A2 for their efforts.
When my uncle (living in Homestead) found out about that, we drove around to guard posts handing out 5.56 battlepacks. We only had one refusal, a gentlemen who informed us "Son...I'm from Texas...do you really think this weapon isn't loaded?"
That said, following 9-11, about 2 weeks later a M1 Abrams was parked on perimeter road at the Ft. Lauderdale airport just off the interstate. That made an impression. But guardsmen at the airport with M16s I barely noticed, several time early 80s I flew into Frankfurt and cops walking the gates with dogs and MP5s were a regular thing back then due to Baader/Meinhof aholes.
During Hurricane Irma, the FLNG was assigned to my AO. They were in full battle rattle and had 10rds of 5.56 with 100mph tape over the feed lips of the mag. Their orders were if anything happened, run to LE (like me).
ThirdWatcher
09-15-22, 04:37
As a retired LEO, I’m not sure the average citizen knows how unprofessional the aforementioned abuses are. Thirty armed up Agents, including a helicopter and a boat to arrest an unarmed old man (after ensuring the MSM is there to videotape the event)? Most LEO’s do better police work with a lot less resources.
The assault on Mar-A-Lago reminded me of The Night of the Long Knives (FBI vs. Secret Service). Good riddance.
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