U.S. appeals court strikes down ban on bump stocks

[Sidneyious]

Jan 6 (Reuters) - A U.S. appeals court on Friday struck down a rule the Trump administration had adopted following a 2017 Las Vegas mass shooting that banned "bump stocks," devices that allow people to rapidly fire multiple rounds from semi-automatic guns.

In a 13-3 decision, the New Orleans-based 5th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals said that despite "tremendous" public pressure to impose a ban, it was up to the U.S. Congress rather than the president to take action.

While the federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms (ATF) and Explosives had interpreted a law banning machineguns as extending to bump stocks, U.S. Circuit Judge Jennifer Walker Elrod said the law did not unambiguously prohibit them.

Elrod, writing for the majority, said the law also did not give "fair warning that possession of a non-mechanical bump stock is a crime."

One of the dissenting judges, Stephen Higginson, wrote that the majority employed reasoning "to legalize an instrument of mass murder."

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/us-appeals-court-strikes-down-ban-bump-stocks-2023-01-07/

[crosseyedshooter]

5D Chess! 5D!!!!

[Ron3]

So who's gonna take out a buisness loan to start making & selling them again?

I still don't want one I'm just curious.

[Averageman]

This came about because of a knee jerk reaction to a shooting event in Las Vegas, a shooting event with lots of shady stuff going out.
I less intreseted in the bump stock than the shady back story.
We will never know.

[prepare]

Hopefully most of the people that were interested enough to purchase bump stocks still have them.

[flenna]

So does that mean that the manufacturer and bump stock owners that destroyed thousands of dollars worth of bump stocks to comply with this obvious unconstitutional rule will be reimbursed by the .gov? But, if I had to guess, it will be just like every other illegal government overreach where the guilty officials just shrug, say “my bad” and walk away.

[SteyrAUG]

In a 13-3 decision, the New Orleans-based 5th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals said that despite "tremendous" public pressure to impose a ban, it was up to the U.S. Congress rather than the president to take action.

While the federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms (ATF) and Explosives had interpreted a law banning machineguns as extending to bump stocks, U.S. Circuit Judge Jennifer Walker Elrod said the law did not unambiguously prohibit them.


That must have been painful for the Dems.

And clearly another brilliant 12D chess move by Trump who knew how this would play out.

[Averageman]

Bump stock equals Arm brace.

[Alex V]

If given the ability, I would pass a new Federal law which would apply equally to federal, state and local levels.

Any legislator who proposes for or votes for a law which is later found to be unconstitutional or any executive who signs such law if and when it is passes will be tried under 18 USC Section 242 - Deprivation of Rights Under Color of Law. Punishments being up to and including capital punishment. I know some politicians think they are above the law, but it may scare the poop out of enough of them to stop the stupidity.

Sadly, I will not be given such abilities.

[markm]

Bump stock equals Arm brace.

Both are F&*King RETARDED!

Bumps should be banned based on stupidity, not government overreach.

[Hank6046]

Both are F&*King RETARDED!

Bumps should be banned based on stupidity, not government overreach.

Bump stocks shouldn't be banned, nothing should be banned, and the NFA needs to be abolished.

[Alex V]

Bump stocks shouldn't be banned, nothing should be banned, and the NFA needs to be abolished.

Amen!

[GTF425]

Bump stocks shouldn't be banned, nothing should be banned, and the NFA needs to be abolished.

Based.

[prepare]

Bump stocks are mostly silly.

However what is the role of automatic fire?
1. When an individual or unit has used either terrain or urban features to draw personnel into a no way out ambush except through your fully automatic field of fire.
2. To lay down suppressive fire to allow for maneuver on enemy positions.

What does this have to do with bump stocks?

A bump stocked AR15 on a bipod fills both of those roles surprisingly well especially with a Magpul drum magazine.

Of course the likelihood of deploying it that way is low, sometimes it's more about just having the capability.

[markm]

Bump stocks shouldn't be banned, nothing should be banned, and the NFA needs to be abolished.

Of course I'm being dramatic. But ammo is too valuable for booger eating nonsense like bump stocks. They shouldn't be banned, but they are level 10 retardation.

[MA2_Navy_Veteran]

The whole bumpstock thing is rather Meh as it is. It's not like you can't bumpfire most semiautos without using a bumpstock anyways.

[BrigandTwoFour]

Bump stock equals Arm brace.

I really do wonder what's going on in the AFT's offices right now as they stare at this loss. The parallels are obviously there, whereby the agency is torturing established criminal code and "interpreting" it to include more than the law actually says. Between this and WV vs EPA, the courts are being pretty damn clear that agencies can't fabricate new criminal law.

So the question is, will AFT go ahead and do it anyway under political pressure or will they hold off?

[1168]

If given the ability, I would pass a new Federal law which would apply equally to federal, state and local levels.

Any legislator who proposes for or votes for a law which is later found to be unconstitutional or any executive who signs such law if and when it is passes will be tried under 18 USC Section 242 - Deprivation of Rights Under Color of Law. Punishments being up to and including capital punishment. I know some politicians think they are above the law, but it may scare the poop out of enough of them to stop the stupidity.

Sadly, I will not be given such abilities.
I’ll vote for you.

And capital punishment for this offense should be the norm, not the exception, and should be carried out immediately without appeal.

[kerplode]

So the question is, will AFT go ahead and do it anyway under political pressure or will they hold off?

I think there's a better than average chance they'll do it anyway. By the time the dust settles and it's overturned 2 years from now, all of the brace manufacturers will have been forced out of business and a good number of braces will have been removed from firearms in circulation.

They'll lose in court later, but so what...Since there are no real penalties to ATF, it's all upside.

[The_War_Wagon]

Here’s hoping they do the same with arm braces – then strike down the entire Biteme Insurrection while they’re at it!!!

[titsonritz]

Bump stocks shouldn't be banned, nothing should be banned, and the NFA needs to be abolished.

I'll agree with that, I don't care if they're stupid.

[titsonritz]

If given the ability, I would pass a new Federal law which would apply equally to federal, state and local levels.

Any legislator who proposes for or votes for a law which is later found to be unconstitutional or any executive who signs such law if and when it is passes will be tried under 18 USC Section 242 - Deprivation of Rights Under Color of Law. Punishments being up to and including capital punishment. I know some politicians think they are above the law, but it may scare the poop out of enough of them to stop the stupidity.

Sadly, I will not be given such abilities.

I'll take it a step further, any of these assholes that vote for the BS but have zero what they are voting on should get the same treatment. Like this stupid bitch...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ospNRk2uM3U

[TMS951]

Elrod, writing for the majority, said the law also did not give "fair warning that possession of a non-mechanical bump stock is a crime."


https://www.reuters.com/world/us/us-appeals-court-strikes-down-ban-bump-stocks-2023-01-07/

My state just passed a law banning anything over ten round mags. No grandfather. Felony to own them. How the average person is meant to know this is beyond me. I’m hoping it gets struck down.

[Averageman]

My state just passed a law banning anything over ten round mags. No grandfather. Felony to own them. How the average person is meant to know this is beyond me. I’m hoping it gets struck down.

States keep sitting this laws up there and the Supreme Court keep knocking them down, at what point do they face penalties for going against established Federal Law with BS like a magazine ban, when magazine bans have already been shot down?
From what I understand the State of New York is now in open difiance against Supreme Court decisions.
Someone needs to scoop up and couple of Lawyers, Judges and District Attorneys and lock them up without bail until this is all worked out as directed by the SCOTUS.

Edit to add
Bump Stocks and Arms Braces are the same thing. If Bump Stocks are okay, under what circumstances could an Arm Brace be illegal? Under No Circumstances as far as I can tell, and yet, here we go again.

[BrigandTwoFour]

States keep sitting this laws up there and the Supreme Court keep knocking them down, at what point do they face penalties for going against established Federal Law with BS like a magazine ban, when magazine bans have already been shot down?
From what I understand the State of New York is now in open difiance against Supreme Court decisions.
Someone needs to scoop up and couple of Lawyers, Judges and District Attorneys and lock them up without bail until this is all worked out as directed by the SCOTUS.

Edit to add
Bump Stocks and Arms Braces are the same thing. If Bump Stocks are okay, under what circumstances could an Arm Brace be illegal? Under No Circumstances as far as I can tell, and yet, here we go again.

Honestly, I don't think there is an enforcement action other than seeking a hell of a lot of damages from the states for people who were wrongly arrested/property confiscated.

[jsbhike]

States keep sitting this laws up there and the Supreme Court keep knocking them down, at what point do they face penalties for going against established Federal Law with BS like a magazine ban, when magazine bans have already been shot down?
From what I understand the State of New York is now in open difiance against Supreme Court decisions.
Someone needs to scoop up and couple of Lawyers, Judges and District Attorneys and lock them up without bail until this is all worked out as directed by the SCOTUS.

Edit to add
Bump Stocks and Arms Braces are the same thing. If Bump Stocks are okay, under what circumstances could an Arm Brace be illegal? Under No Circumstances as far as I can tell, and yet, here we go again.

Deaths and kidnappings have occurred soooo....

https://www.justice.gov/crt/deprivation-rights-under-color-law#:~:text=Summary%3A,laws%20of%20the%20United%20States.

[Hush]

Commence mag dumping into trash piles.

Sent from my SM-A326U using Tapatalk

[FromMyColdDeadHand]

My state just passed a law banning anything over ten round mags. No grandfather. Felony to own them. How the average person is meant to know this is beyond me. I’m hoping it gets struck down.

That is a feature, not a bug. It costs nothing to implement these laws. The laws are like land mines, even if you own the stuff, as long as you don’t have a fire or an Red Flag thrown at you, who knows you have them- but they are there. Not sure how your law is structured, but for a box of standard mags and each one is count, your legal exposure is worse than if you had an unregistered machine gun….

All these laws are to make owning guns to onerous and complex.


States keep sitting this laws up there and the Supreme Court keep knocking them down, at what point do they face penalties for going against established Federal Law with BS like a magazine ban, when magazine bans have already been shot down?
From what I understand the State of New York is now in open difiance against Supreme Court decisions.
Someone needs to scoop up and couple of Lawyers, Judges and District Attorneys and lock them up without bail until this is all worked out as directed by the SCOTUS.

Edit to add
Bump Stocks and Arms Braces are the same thing. If Bump Stocks are okay, under what circumstances could an Arm Brace be illegal? Under No Circumstances as far as I can tell, and yet, here we go again.

Well, the safe answer is that these politicians should be voted out. Frankly, I’d like to take a page from the climate people and their ‘pie-ing’ of people to start throwing cold tar and turkey feathers on these people as a modern version of taring and feathering.

I think the actual legal answer is to put an Injunction in place that stops any law concerning the 2A from being implemented with out a court approving it- and that court being SCOTUS. Kind of like the pre-clearance for voting law changes for Southern states that showed continued illegal hostility to other civil rights.