View Full Version : J. Allen Stock Information
I cracked the composite stock on my Springfield M1A. I never was able to get the accuracy out of this rifle that I was hoping for. I am considering the J. Allen M1A stock.
Does anyone have first hand knowledge of this stock. I am 6'4" and I like the idea of the modular adjustable abilities of this stock.
The M1A has always been hard to glass bed and even then bedding did not last long. Will this stock secure the action as well as bedding?
Please provide info on this stock if you have first hand knowledge.
Thank you in advance,
Until that day,
Darkop
NinjaMedic
01-11-09, 22:59
Nobody? I am interested as well.
I'm planning to get a M14/M1A this year and JAE100-G2 stock. I guess nobody is biting here, so you might want to ask over at: http://www.m14tfl.com/
~ The JAE is a overly complicated and very heavy stock.
When it come to modern stocks and accuracy consider this.
18.0" and 22.0" are more accurate from SAGE EBR stocks and
16.25" SOCOM rifles perform better in the TROY M14 MCS stock.
M14DW.US (http://m14hdw.us/)
EBRSOPMODS.com (http://ebrsopmods.proboards100.com/index.cgi)
Depending on how you set them up, both the SAGE EBR and
TROY MCS tend to be lighter than a JAE set up in a similar fashion.
The lightest mass produced modern M14 stock is the SAGE EBR
with the AR style receiver extension tube.
http://www.athenswater.com/images/Black-EBR.jpg
New Synthetic/Carbon Fiber M14 stocks will soon be available from LAW483.com
Darkop, I hope this information helps you - good luck.
.
~ The JAE is a overly complicated and very heavy stock.
When it come to modern stocks and accuracy consider this.
18.0" and 22.0" are more accurate from SAGE EBR stocks and
16.25" SOCOM rifles perform better in the TROY M14 MCS stock.
M14DW.US (http://m14hdw.us/)
EBRSOPMODS.com (http://ebrsopmods.proboards100.com/index.cgi)
Depending on how you set them up, both the SAGE EBR and
TROY MCS tend to be lighter than a JAE set up in a similar fashion.
The lightest mass produced modern M14 stock is the SAGE EBR
with the AR style receiver extension tube.
http://www.athenswater.com/images/Black-EBR.jpg
New Synthetic/Carbon Fiber M14 stocks will soon be available from LAW483.com
Darkop, I hope this information helps you - good luck.
.
WOW!, if your saying the Sage stock is lighter than the JAE, then I'm suprised. I held a friends Sage and thought it was very heavy! I guess the JAE must be even heavier than that.
I really don't want something with all of the rails on it and that's why I thought I would go with the JAE.
Anyone have a JAE mounted up that can tell me about the weight difference?
Until that day,
Darkop
WOW!, if your saying the Sage stock is lighter than the JAE, then I'm suprised. I held a friends Sage and thought it was very heavy!
I guess the JAE must be even heavier than that.
I really don't want something with all of the rails on it and that's why I thought I would go with the JAE.
Anyone have a JAE mounted up that can tell me about the weight difference?
Until that day,
Darkop
Make sure you compare the JAE to the M4 style SAGE EBR.
The SAGE EBR with the AR style receiver extension tube is the lightest mass produced modern M14 stock and it's about two
pounds lighter than the original EBR stock with the telescoping butt stock, adjustable cheek rest and butt pad pictured below.
http://www.athenswater.com/images/EBRs020407%20003.jpg
Make sure you compare the JAE to the M4 style SAGE EBR.
The SAGE EBR with the AR style receiver extension tube is the lightest mass produced modern M14 stock and it's about two
pounds lighter than the original EBR stock with the telescoping butt stock, adjustable cheek rest and butt pad pictured below.
http://www.athenswater.com/images/EBRs020407%20003.jpg
Where are they saving the weight between the two? From pictures it looks like there is no difference until you hit the rear of the receiver area.
What's the scoop on the LAW483 stocks?
Spooky
H2OMAN,
Do you happen to know the weight of the Sage stock (M14ALCS/CV). I checked thier web sight but it doesn't list the weight.
The JAE is 3.5 LBS to 6 LBS depending on accessories. I was not going with many
add-ons.
TIA
Darkop
Where are they saving the weight between the two? From pictures it looks like there is no difference until you hit the rear of the receiver area.
What's the scoop on the LAW483 stocks?
Spooky
The tail section on the original is all metal and very heavy, the AR style is much, much lighter.
I home to have some pictures of the LAW483 stocks soon, Tony may send me one for evaluation.
H2OMAN,
Do you happen to know the weight of the Sage stock (M14ALCS/CV). I checked thier web sight but it doesn't list the weight.
The JAE is 3.5 LBS to 6 LBS depending on accessories. I was not going with many
add-ons.
TIA
Darkop
About 4 lbs. with a Magpul CTR installed.
A USGI synthetic stock weighs about 3 lbs. with a cleaning kit stored in the butt stock.
About 4 lbs. with a Magpul CTR installed.
A USGI synthetic stock weighs about 3 lbs. with a cleaning kit stored in the butt stock.
I just received an e mail from Sage Int'l. Here is what they had to say.
Dear
Thank you for inquiring on our EBR Stock. I have included a brochure for you on the ALCS/CV. The Weight of the M14ALCS is 6.25-6.5 lbs. I am referring you to our distributor. Here is their contact information:
US TACTICAL SUPPLY
PHONE: 541-928-8645
FAX: 541-791-2965
PO BOX 811
ALBANY, OR 97321
WWW.USTACTICALSUPPLY.COM
Decisions Decisions Decisions
Until that day,
Darkop
Like I said, the 6.25+ lb. M14ALCS is about 2 pounds heavier than the 4.0 lb M14ALCS/CV.
The SAGE EBR distributor that I recommend is Clyde Armory (http://www.policeguns.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=28_225&osCsid=dnsak309cd37kqkh9p459ur5q7) in Bogart/Athens, Georgia.
I have a first generation JAE stock. It is nice, especially if your M1A is scoped, but it is definitely heavy. If you're shooting off the bench or prone or a fixed position its great. I wouldn't want to tote it around very long.
http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c270/dspipes/Precision%20Rifles/DSC00930.jpg
http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c270/dspipes/Precision%20Rifles/DSC00931.jpg
I'd say that a JAE stock's utility really depends on what you're using the rifle for.
My JAE improved accuracy, and was extremely comfortable. I loved the cheekweld.
FEDERALE
Did the gen 1 JAE's have the barrel tensioner? if so, do you have it?
STEVE-OH
Do you have the gen 1 or gen 2 stock. Does yours have the barrel tensioner?
My Springfield stock has a crack running under the action so I'm fairly sure that is why I can't get it to consistently group very well.
FEDERALE and STEVE-OH what kind of accuracy improvements did you see when you went to the JAE stock.
Thanks in advance,
until that day,
Darkop
FEDERALE
My Springfield stock has a crack running under the action so I'm fairly sure that is why I can't get it to consistently group very well.
Have you tried to get your stock replaced under warranty?
Have you tried to get your stock replaced under warranty?
No. It is several years old and has used pretty hard. (Not abused)
I'm trying to figure out if I should just place this in another stock (JAE or SAGE) and then buy a precision bolt gun or put more money into this M1A.
Until that day,
Darkop
No. It is several years old and has used pretty hard. (Not abused)
I'm trying to figure out if I should just place this in another stock (JAE or SAGE) and then buy a precision bolt gun or put more money into this M1A.
Until that day,
Darkop
What does your M1A shoot like now?
And J.Allen is pretty responsive to emails. Maybe you should just contact them?
They are very responsive to emails. As in, same day answers in my experience.
Barrel tensioner, I'm not sure - it has little (titanium?) clamps that tighten down on the bottom of the reciever to free float the barrel, if thats what you mean.
I saw a half inch reduction with mine. (TRW barrel, GI trigger group). Here's the weird thing, and I don't know if anybody else experienced this, but it also made my trigger feel lighter, which I'm sure helped with shrinking the groups.
Federale, what does your rig weigh as pictured?
No. It is several years old and has used pretty hard. (Not abused)
I'm trying to figure out if I should just place this in another stock (JAE or SAGE) and then buy a precision bolt gun or put more money into this M1A.
Until that day,
DarkopSAI has a real nice lifetime warranty... they may surprise you.
You can make your M1A a reliable sub MOA performer and the SAGE EBR is an excellent step in that direction.
http://www.athenswater.com/images/M21A5_Crazy-Horse_EBR.jpg
Anyone shoot their JAE in 3 Gun Heavy Metal division?
What does your M1A shoot like now?
And J.Allen is pretty responsive to emails. Maybe you should just contact them?
My M1A shoots 1.5" to 2.0" on an average. This is bagged from a steady bench. The problem and reason that I think it is the stock is that there is NO consistency to the groupings at all. I have tried FGMM and hand loaded but can not get any consistency in the groups.
i think I will contact Springfield and see what they say about the stock.
Until that day,
Darkop
It looks like a well equipped JAE stock is a little more than one pound heavier than a similarly equipped M4 style SAGE EBR stock.
olds442tyguy
01-14-09, 22:27
It looks like a well equipped JAE stock is a little more than one pound heavier than a similarly equipped M4 style SAGE EBR stock.
I'd hardly call a CTR stock equipped SAGE comparable to the JAE. Add on an extra pound in the form of a PRS and that claim becomes more valid.
Your CTR stocked SAGE is 4 pounds. The basic JAE is 3.5. A fully loaded JAE is also lighter than a fully loaded SAGE.
If the OP is looking to increase accuracy as well as extend his comfort, I just don't see how a CTR equipped SAGE is going to be better than the JAE. To top it off, the JAE is lighter, contrary to what you're saying.
If the OP is looking to increase accuracy as well as extend his comfort, I just don't see how a CTR equipped SAGE is going to be better than the JAE.
Don't be mislead by the JAE sales pitch, the basic JAE weighs in at about 5.5 pounds and the M4 style SAGE with a CTR butt stock weighs in at about 4.0 pounds.
The SAGE is the lighter stock.
The SAGE semi free floats the barrel beyond the op rod guide block and adjustable barrel tension while the JAE uses the original barrel band with an adjustment screw.
Both use tension bedding but the JAE has movable plates while the SAGE is solid.
The SAGE is the more accurate stock.
olds442tyguy
01-14-09, 23:53
Don't be mislead by the JAE sales pitch, the basic JAE weighs in at about 5.5 pounds and the M4 style SAGE with a CTR butt stock weighs in at about 4.0 pounds.
The SAGE is the lighter stock.
The SAGE semi free floats the barrel beyond the op rod guide block and adjustable barrel tension while the JAE uses the original barrel band with an adjustment screw.
Both use tension bedding but the JAE has movable plates while the SAGE is solid.
The SAGE is the more accurate stock.
Do you have any financial ties to Sage International?
I'd like to see you prove that JAE is intentionally misleading people, as well as accuracy results. I've not heard any complaints with either stock in regards to accuracy, and my comment was based on the fact that NO ONE in their right mind is going to use a CTR on a long range rifle intended for accuracy.
442, Do you own either of the stocks in question?
What is your actual hands on experience with these stocks?
Find a basic JAE that weighs 3.5 lbs., find one that weighs less than the M4 style SAGE.
The SAGE M14ALCS/CV is an excellent stock for long range accuracy as is the JAE and the SAGE is lighter than the JAE.
Well, I have handled both of them and my money went to JAE. They're BOTH heavy but for a scoped M1A, JAE's design made a whole lot more sense to me. The Sage stock looked and felt like a "contraption" as opposed to a rifle stock. If the OP is really looking to accurize his M1A and scope it (like I was) then I believe you go buy a McMillan stock and get it bedded properly or you buy a JAE stock and almost get the same performance. Personally, I think the Sage stock is more hype and CDI factor than anything.
I've used a few TROY MCS, many SAGE EBR and a properly bedded walnut stock and it's my personal
experience that the EBR chassis stock is the better choice for those wishing to accurize the M14.
One exception: short 16.25" SOCOM barrels are more accurate in the TROY than in the SAGE.
Their are many contraptions on the market for the M14, invest your money wisely.
olds442tyguy
01-15-09, 10:50
442, Do you own either of the stocks in question?
What is your actual hands on experience with these stocks?
Find a basic JAE that weighs 3.5 lbs., find one that weighs less than the M4 style SAGE.
The SAGE M14ALCS/CV is an excellent stock for long range accuracy as is the JAE and the SAGE is lighter than the JAE.
No, I don't own either stock, but all one has to do is read to prove you wrong.
An M4 stock is not a good target stock, pure and simple. Throw a PRS on your Sage to get it up to par with the JAE and you're a full pound and a half heavier.
You should contact site staff as it's apparent you have financial interest in Sage International's products. Shill accounts are not welcome here, but manufacturer input is.
You should contact site staff as it's apparent you have financial interest in Sage International's products. Shill accounts are not welcome here, but manufacturer input is.
It's clear that you are here to make false claims and accusations.
You are a troll - piss off.
OK guys take it else where, unless you ONLY want to talk stocks.
I know a guy who has an M1A in a Sage. I am going to shoot it and see what I think. I have held the Sage and don't care for all of the rails. I don't really care for VFG's and this gun won't have a light or laser. This is why I initially thought about the JAE, I don't need a bunch of rails. I have plenty of CQB guns to do that job. This rifle has always been scoped and always been shot with glass. I am not really too concerned about the weight.
Back on point here. Has anyone shot both? if so chime in and give us your opinions.
until that day,
Darkop
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