Primary Weapons Systems - Todd's Tiny Compensator

[USMC03]

In the spring of 2008 I purchased a PWS FSC556 compensator for a project I was working on at that time. Over the past 15 years I have used numerous muzzle different flash hiders, muzzle brakes / compensators. A short list of the flash hiders / muzzle braakes that I have used are: A1 and A2 compensator, Sabre Defense long A2, Noveske Krink, Smith Vortex, Smith Ent. muzzle brake, Gem-Tech A2 and Vortex bi-loc, MSTN QC Comp, Surefire 556k flash hider, EGW A2 muzzle brake, Bushmaster Y-Comp and Mini-Y Comp, Bushmaster AK muzzle brake, JP Enterprises “Tank Brake”, JP Enterprises muzzle brake, Levang linear comp, CavArms Cav Comp, Wilson Combat muzzle brake that looks like the Cav Comp, Phantom flash hider, Ops Inc 2 port brake.

Those are just the muzzle devices that I can think of off the top of my head. What I learned over the course of several years using several different types of muzzle devices is that ……. (to quote Pat Rogers) “There is no free lunch”. If you wanted the best flash suppression it came at the cost of length (ie. Smith Vortex or Phantom) and would offer very little in the way of reducing muzzle rise or felt recoil.

If you wanted something that was effective at reducing muzzle rise and assisted with quicker follow up shots, you would have to deal a design that enhanced muzzle flash and muzzle blast (noise) that bordered on being obnoxious and is uncomfortable for some shooters. By design, most muzzle brakes direct the most of the gases and muzzle blast (noise) out the side of the muzzle brake (3 and 9 o’clock).

I had heard that the FSC556 did a good job at reducing flash, reducing muzzle flip, and wasn’t overly loud / obnoxious. I put the PWS FSC556 on a 16” Noveske N4 mid-length. I have never shot the FSC556 in no light, but I have shot it at dusk and found that the flash suppression was on par with the A2 compensator. The FSC556 did a good job a reducing muzzle flip and follow up shots quick and consistent. Noise was very tame as compared to other muzzle brakes / compensators that I had used in the past. The FSC556 is a little louder than the A2, but not by a wide margin. In my opinion it’s a great product and possess a great balance between flash suppression, reducing muzzle rise, and not being overly loud.

I have been using a 16” barrel with a mid-length gas system and a standard front sight tower as my competition (run and gun) gun for the last couple years and had been running a USGI A2 compensator on it. I really liked the FSC556, but it looked stupid on the mid-length barrel with the standard front sight tower. I wanted something that something that would reduce muzzle flip, but was approximately the same length as the USGI A2 compensator. After a little research I found that the PWS FSC556 was 2.10”, the DNTC was 2.00”, and the USGI A2 compensator was approximately 1.75”.

I was impressed enough with the FSC556 that I approached Todd at PWS about tweaking the FSC556 or the DNTC to be approximately the same size as the USGI A2 compensator. When I approached Todd with my idea, he told me that the product (in a very limited supply already existed). Todd explained that some of the guys had PWS had taken a FSC556, cut off the flash reducing tines, and laser engraved “Todd’s Tiny One” on the wrench flats, and had given it to him as a joke. Todd informed me that “Todd’s Tiny One” performs the same as the FSC556 at reducing muzzle flip, it just doesn’t have the flash reducing properties of the FSC556. I told Todd, that was fine with me as it was going on a competition gun, and flash reduction wasn’t a concern.

I recently received “Todd’s Tiny One” and got it mounted up yesterday. Hoping to hit the range with it on Tuesday.

PWS Todd’s Tiny One (bottom of the muzzle brake):
http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk99/USMC03_photos/Primary%20Weapons/DPP_0004.jpg

PWS Todd’s Tiny One (side of the muzzle brake):
http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk99/USMC03_photos/Primary%20Weapons/IMG_0398_1.jpg

Todd’s Tiny One next to the FSC556:
http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk99/USMC03_photos/Primary%20Weapons/IMG_0390_1.jpg

Top view - Todd’s Tiny One next to the FSC556:
http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk99/USMC03_photos/Primary%20Weapons/DPP_0003.jpg

L to R - Todd’s Tiny One, FSC556, FSC556 Quick Comp for the Gem-Tech G5:
http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk99/USMC03_photos/Primary%20Weapons/DPP_0002.jpg

Todd’s Tiny One next to a USGI A2 Compensator:
http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk99/USMC03_photos/Primary%20Weapons/IMG_0391_1.jpg

L to R - Todd’s Tiny One, A2 Comp, FSC556, Surefire 556k Flash Hider, FSC556 Quick Comp for the Gem-Tech G5:
http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk99/USMC03_photos/Primary%20Weapons/IMG_0392_1.jpg


And the new Bravo Company USA stainless mid-length barrel with the PWS Todd’s Tiny One:
http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk99/USMC03_photos/BCM%20Stainless%20Mid-Lenght/DPP_0009.jpg

http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk99/USMC03_photos/BCM%20Stainless%20Mid-Lenght/DPP_0010.jpg


If I could build “Todd’s Tiny One” scratch ….. the only thing I would change would be, instead of having the wrench flats at 12 o’clock and 6 o’clock, I would make the bottom portion of the Todd’s Tiny One brake, identical to the USGI A2 flash hider (ie. the two rings and the wrench flats at 3 and 9 o’clock) and ensure that the overall length did not surpass the overall length of the USGI A2. This serves no functional purpose, but aesthetic stand point, it would be an awesome looking (and very functional) muzzle brake.




S/F,
Jeff

[Magsz]

What about a middle ground?

If they were to add half length tines to the tiny one that would bring it to about the same length as the A2 and might add the benefit of some flash suppression?

It might be a useless product, im honestly not sure. Do we need/want a middle ground between the full size and the tiny one?

I know that the tiny one would look a hell of a lot better than the full size on the FN scars that are shipping. ;)

[Failure2Stop]

What about a middle ground?

If they were to add half length tines to the tiny one that would bring it to about the same length as the A2 and might add the benefit of some flash suppression?

It might be a useless product, im honestly not sure. Do we need/want a middle ground between the full size and the tiny one?

I know that the tiny one would look a hell of a lot better than the full size on the FN scars that are shipping. ;)

I recall the exact thing you are describing. IIRC PWS is either making it in house or someone else is modifying the PWS FSC556 to have 1/2 length tines, which are rounded off as well.

I can't for the life of me remember who is selling them.

[Loner]

There is a shortened version of the FSC Quickcomp made by PWS for Addax, its called the bulldog. A bulldog version of the standard FSC would make it shorter, say the same length as an A2 but with the flash suppressing capability.

[Failure2Stop]

There is a shortened version of the FSC Quickcomp made by PWS for Addax, its called the bulldog. A bulldog version of the standard FSC would make it shorter, say the same length as an A2 but with the flash suppressing capability.

That's the one. Cheers dude.

LINK to Addax (http://www.adxtactical.com/store/pc/viewPrd.asp?idcategory=51&idproduct=1069)

[USMC03]

I thought the Addax Bulldog was shorter as well. After looking at both the Addax and PWS websites....both sites list the Bulldog at 2.10", which is the same lenth as the FSC556.

On the PWS site it shows two different length for the Bulldog: 2.10" and 2.05" .... if the Bulldog is 2.05", the DNTC is 2.00" and the FSC556 is 2.10", so it would make the length of the Bulldog right in between the length of the DNTC and the FSC556 and no where close to being the same length as the USGI A2 compensator (1.75").

I wonder if they didn't have to make the back end of the comp longer to accomidate the Gem-Tech Halo.



S/F,
Jeff

[twodollarbill]

Why is the Bulldog $20 cheaper than the FSC556????....or am I missing something?

[Failure2Stop]

I thought the Addax Bulldog was shorter as well. After looking at both the Addax and PWS websites....both sites list the Bulldog at 2.10", which is the same lenth as the FSC556.

On the PWS site it shows two different length for the Bulldog: 2.10" and 2.05" .... if the Bulldog is 2.05", the DNTC is 2.00" and the FSC556 is 2.10", so it would make the length of the Bulldog right in between the length of the DNTC and the FSC556 and no where close to being the same length as the USGI A2 compensator (1.75").

I wonder if they didn't have to make the back end of the comp longer to accomidate the Gem-Tech Halo.


I noticed the same. For some reason I thought the tines were 1/2 the length of the FSC556 and of insufficient length to bring a 14.5 to 16" once threaded on. Though the PWS site lists two different lengths for the Bulldog and a pic of the FSC556 in lieu of one of the actual Bulldog I assume that one of the OALs is correct. Check out this pic from Military Morons (CLICK ME (http://www.militarymorons.com/weapons/img/gpu8.jpg))- the bulldog seems to be visably shorter.

Maybe somebody from PWS or Addax can jump in and straighten it out.

Sorry about the hijack USMC03- I think the Todds Tiny One looks great on your stick- I am now thinking about one for an 18" Noveske instead of the FSC556 or just the DNTC. No reason to be any longer than it needs to be.

[UVvis]

USMC03,

Is there a crush or peel washer on the BCM SS Middy?

[USMC03]

I noticed the same. For some reason I thought the tines were 1/2 the length of the FSC556 and of insufficient length to bring a 14.5 to 16" once threaded on. Though the PWS site lists two different lengths for the Bulldog and a pic of the FSC556 in lieu of one of the actual Bulldog I assume that one of the OALs is correct. Check out this pic from Military Morons (CLICK ME (http://www.militarymorons.com/weapons/img/gpu8.jpg))- the bulldog seems to be visably shorter.

Maybe somebody from PWS or Addax can jump in and straighten it out.

Sorry about the hijack USMC03- I think the Todds Tiny One looks great on your stick- I am now thinking about one for an 18" Noveske instead of the FSC556 or just the DNTC. No reason to be any longer than it needs to be.


No hijack at all.......I looked at 2 pics on Military Morons site and took a piece of paper, using hash marks I attempted to measure both comps....As unscientific as this may be, in both pics the overall length of the Bulldog and the FSC5556 seemed to be very close.

To the naked eye the Bulldog does appear to be shorter, but based on my unscientific test and the specs on both Addax and PWS' sites, I'll guess that the Bulldog is just over 2" in length.


I really like the design of the DNTC, in a perfect world PWS could make the DNTC the same length as the USGI A2 compensator. ;)



USMC03,

Is there a crush or peel washer on the BCM SS Middy?

Peel washer (sorry for the cell phone quality pic):
http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk99/USMC03_photos/BCM%20Stainless%20Mid-Lenght/DPP_0011.jpg


S/F,
Jeff

[USMC03]

This morning I received an email from Todd at PWS who saw this review. It appears that there has been enough interest in "Todd's Tiny One" that PWS is going to offer the comp on their website:

http://primaryweapons.com/store/pc/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=88&idcategory=2

Product Details:

This is a pre-buy for "Todd's Tiny One" as seen on various forums.
These products will ship on or before February 15th.

This version of the FSC556 has had the flash suppressing tines removed and recrowned for those looking for the performance of the DNTC in the shortest possible package.

This unit is approximately 1.60" in length, .875" in diameter and is threaded 1/2x28 RH. This device is not suitable to be used as a suppressor mount and therefore ships with a crush washer.




http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk99/USMC03_photos/BCM%20Stainless%20Mid-Lenght/DPP_0012.jpg



Thanks to Todd and the folks at PWS for making such an awesome product!!!



S/F,
Jeff

[12131]

Hey, what happened to your always great pics? These pics are kinda grainy. :D

[Jim D]

Jeff, I saw on your website that you have some EGW A2 based brakes. Would you might comparing the performance of the EGW to this, after you get a chance to shoot it?

Thanks.

[USMC03]

Jeff, I saw on your website that you have some EGW A2 based brakes. Would you might comparing the performance of the EGW to this, after you get a chance to shoot it?

Thanks.

The review you saw was from around 2003. I haven't had an EGW A2 brake on a gun since 2004 when the Assault Weapons Ban sunsetted.

During the Assault Weapons Ban, the EGW A2 was a good option as it did a better job at reducing muzzle flip than other muzzle brakes that were simular in size (ie. Cav Comp, Wilson Combat's muzzle brake, etc), wasn't obnoxious or offensive to other shooters, was the same length as the A2, and was Assault Weapons Ban legal.

The Primary Weapons DNTC and FSC556 comps were built from the ground up as muzzle brakes. The EGW A2 was a modified flash hider that worked as a muzzle brake and was made comply with the Assault Weapons Ban.



S/F,
Jeff

[Jim D]

The review you saw was from around 2003. I haven't had an EGW A2 brake on a gun since 2004 when the Assault Weapons Ban sunsetted.

During the Assault Weapons Ban, the EGW A2 was a good option as it did a better job at reducing muzzle flip than other muzzle brakes that were simular in size (ie. Cav Comp, Wilson Combat's muzzle brake, etc), wasn't obnoxious or offensive to other shooters, was the same length as the A2, and was Assault Weapons Ban legal.

The Primary Weapons DNTC and FSC556 comps were built from the ground up as muzzle brakes. The EGW A2 was a modified flash hider that worked as a muzzle brake and was made comply with the Assault Weapons Ban.



S/F,
Jeff

Ok. I was still wondering if you'd be willing to comment on the performance differences between the two.

While I undertstand that the EGW isn't a dedicated brake, that's kind of what attracted me to it. I didn't want something obnoxious that'd piss everyone around me off, but wanted to get a little edge is sight recovery time if possible.

I got the impression that the EGW would be suitable for such a task, but if after shooting the Tiny Comp, you feel it trumps the EGW, then I'll have to take a look at it. I'm having the EGW installed now...so I'm gonna shoot it as soon as I can. Using it as a frame of reference, I'd be interested to hear in the difference in performance.

Thanks again.

[USMC03]

Cool Breeze,



The correct way to compare two products is a side by side comparison done back to back at the same time with both products on identical guns (ie. both muzzle brakes on the same length barrel, with the same gas system, same stock, etc).

For me to try to compare a muzzle brake that I am currently using to a muzzle brake that I haven't shot in over 4 years would be foolish and irresponsible on my part, and be a dis-service to anyone that wanted a true comparison of two products. Hope you understand.





S/F,
Jeff

[USMC03]

Got some range time with Todd's Tiny Comp ... I wasn't able to shoot a PWS FSC556 and the Todd's Tiny Comp side by side, but from memory of shooting both comps.....performance the same with both in regards to controlling muzzle flip.

I'm really diggin' it
http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk99/USMC03_photos/BCM%20Stainless%20Mid-Lenght/DPP_0056.jpg



S/F,
Jeff

[frbowers]

Jeff,

This is completely off topic, but is that ACOG a TA11? I've got a BCM mid-length with Daniel Defense 12" Lite Rail coming and thought the TA11 would not look out of place on a mid-length and 3.5X is about what I need for this carbine.

Thanks.

Forrest

[Kaos]

hmmm, me want.

Any equivalent a normal folk could obtain?

[USMC03]

Jeff,

This is completely off topic, but is that ACOG a TA11? I've got a BCM mid-length with Daniel Defense 12" Lite Rail coming and thought the TA11 would not look out of place on a mid-length and 3.5X is about what I need for this carbine.

Thanks.

Forrest

Correct, TA11



hmmm, me want.

Any equivalent a normal folk could obtain?


Read my post dated 01-11-09, above ..... even has a link ..... :D



S/F,
Jeff

[Kaos]

thanks!

I was reading briefly while I was in the basement building my new workbench...which will also feature reloading stuff once I get around to buying a press.

[USMC03]

http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk99/USMC03_photos/BCM%20Stainless%20Mid-Lenght/DPP_0046.jpg


S/F,
Jeff

[Kaos]

Thanks for posting this, Im building a middy currently and was looking for something to use that was effective but small at the same time. I have a thread protector on for the moment, but will definitely consider this.

[Jim D]

Is it essentially a shortened version of this?
http://stores.homestead.com/Laruetactical/catalog/P1011918200.JPG
http://stores.homestead.com/Laruetactical/Detail.bok?no=105

[USMC03]

Is it essentially a shortened version of this?
http://stores.homestead.com/Laruetactical/catalog/P1011918200.JPG
http://stores.homestead.com/Laruetactical/Detail.bok?no=105


Yes and no.

Todd's Tiny One is just a FSC556 with the flash supressing tines cut off. Todd's Tiny One (left) and the FSC556 right:
http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk99/USMC03_photos/Primary%20Weapons/IMG_0390_1.jpg


It's my understanding that the DNTC and FSC556 use the same compensator design, and muzzle flip reduction performance is the same between the DNTC and Todd's Tiny One.



http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk99/USMC03_photos/BCM%20Stainless%20Mid-Lenght/DPP_0062.jpg



S/F,
Jeff

[twodollarbill]

I'm a real fan of the FSC556......I got to get me one of these TINY"S

[lumpia]

How loud is it for the shooter and/or bystanders compared to say just a thread protector?

[Addax]

I noticed the same. For some reason I thought the tines were 1/2 the length of the FSC556 and of insufficient length to bring a 14.5 to 16" once threaded on. Though the PWS site lists two different lengths for the Bulldog and a pic of the FSC556 in lieu of one of the actual Bulldog I assume that one of the OALs is correct. Check out this pic from Military Morons (CLICK ME (http://www.militarymorons.com/weapons/img/gpu8.jpg))- the bulldog seems to be visably shorter.

Maybe somebody from PWS or Addax can jump in and straighten it out.

Sorry about the hijack USMC03- I think the Todds Tiny One looks great on your stick- I am now thinking about one for an 18" Noveske instead of the FSC556 or just the DNTC. No reason to be any longer than it needs to be.

Our FSC Bulldog (based on the PWS FSC556) is 1.95" long. The front Prongs are machined down just a little for that more aggressive look.

http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc137/addax/IMG_0154.jpg

[USMC03]

Sorry about the hijack USMC03- I think the Todds Tiny One looks great on your stick- I am now thinking about one for an 18" Noveske instead of the FSC556 or just the DNTC. No reason to be any longer than it needs to be.

Failure2Stop,


Yet another option. Same length as the USGI A2 flash hider, and looks simular to the USGI A2 flash hider:

https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=26802


http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk99/USMC03_photos/Primary%20Weapons/IMG_1631_edited.jpg
Side by side of the USGI A2 flash hider and the custom Primary Weapons DNTC


http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk99/USMC03_photos/Primary%20Weapons/IMG_1647_edited.jpg
The custom Primary Weapons DNTC on a Bravo Company 16" stainless mid-lenght barrel





S/F,
Jeff