View Full Version : Fun With FEDEX Employees!
So the other day I had an issue with an AR that I recently bought. After talking to customer support they said that I should sent it back to them so they could take a look at it. So they gave me thier FEDEX account number to use so that I could ship it back on their dime (very cool).
I packed up the AR and drove down to the main FEDEX Office in our area. When I pulled into the parking lot and guess what I saw?
A sign as big as Jesus that said, "NO FIREARMS ALLOWED IN THIS BUILDING". Well, I got a big smile on my face, walked in and told the lady that I had a gun in my car that I needed to ship but I saw your sign. How can I ship the gun back to the Manufacturer if I can't bring it in the building?
Well she said, "I think that we ship guns but I better call someone first".
She got on some type of a 3 way call with her boss and somebody over at HQ. After a long wait and watching all the FEDEX Employees sweat it out I finally got it shipped.
I guess it was a good thing I didn't tell them about the Kimber Ultra CDP II on my belt!
FEDEX must have some really heavy duty anti gun people working over there
.....
A sign as big as Jesus that said, "NO FIREARMS ALLOWED IN THIS BUILDING". ...
I guess it was a good thing I didn't tell them about the Kimber Ultra CDP II on my belt!.....
You did the right thing with the AR.
However, with the Kimber..........?
Gun owners need to obey all the rules all the time, especially in todays
environment.
Whether or not you agree with the rules is irrelevant.
You did the right thing with the AR.
However, with the Kimber..........?
Gun owners need to obey all the rules all the time, especially in todays
environment.
Whether or not you agree with the rules is irrelevant.
Whatever floats your boat. I basically ignore those sorts of signs if I am carrying except at places like court houses, airports, etc. Businesses that are open to the public are considered "places of public accommodation" and cannot discriminate, like tell black people they cannot come in, even as "private" property. My right to carry is a civil right and I don't think they have the right to discriminate against me given the laws on "public accomodation." (If those laws did not exist then I might feel differently)
It is none of their business if I am carrying concealed -- after all, out of sight, out of mind. They never know and no harm no foul.
FromMyColdDeadHand
01-24-09, 21:05
What is the legality of signs like that? I know some state for CCW have signs people can put up on private property, but does it vary by state what the repurcusions are for not following them? As in pokey time versus being asked to leave?
At least they didn't say "No".
What if the sign said "No Gay People".
FEDEX must have some really heavy duty anti gun people working over there
Yeah it's a conspiracy.
What actually happened was that you were dealing with a customer service agent who wasn't familiar with our firearms shipping policy and checked with their supervisor to verify policy. Although we do handle these shipments, they're fairly infrequent so some of the agents aren't up to speed on how they're handled.
Yes, I am a Fedex guy.
CarlosDJackal
01-24-09, 21:28
You did the right thing with the AR.
However, with the Kimber..........?
Gun owners need to obey all the rules all the time, especially in todays
environment.
Whether or not you agree with the rules is irrelevant.
Simmer down now!! It's not like he broke the law when he walked into that FeDEX store with a concealed handgun. The worse they could have done is ask him to leave, never to come back again or charge him with tresspassing. JM2CW.
..... I basically ignore those sorts of signs if I am carrying.....
Businesses that are open to the public are considered "places of public accommodation"....
My right to carry is a civil right and I don't think they have the right to discriminate against me given the laws on "public accomodation."....
It is none of their business if I am carrying concealed -- after all, out of sight, out of mind. They never know and no harm no foul.
That's the attitude!
I have to agree with eguns-com. I carry almost everywhere I go because I want to make sure I keep my wife and kids safe. If I get into some trouble for shooting a mental case that's on a rampage or a crack head that knocks off the FEDEX office for a few bucks because he knows law abiding citizens wont be carrying there because of a big as Jesus sign, so be it. I saved my life and any one else that might have been involved in that situation.
thopkins22
01-24-09, 21:35
What is the legality of signs like that? I know some state for CCW have signs people can put up on private property, but does it vary by state what the repurcusions are for not following them?
It's my understanding that outside of areas prohibited by law(federal buildings, courthouses, or wherever) the only thing you could be found guilty of is trespassing. But if they know you're carrying, generally it would mean that you have broken other laws.
I'm obviously not a lawyer, nor am I familiar with laws in different states.
I am not going to sit at the back of the bus.
Just found this web site for CCW holders, The Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners . Answers almost any question you could ever ask. and they even list a "few" business that have signs up like FEDEX.
You should see how many there are:
http://www.mcrgo.org/mcrgo/d_no_gun_signs.asp
It's a shopping list for criminals!!!
Whatever floats your boat. I basically ignore those sorts of signs if I am carrying except at places like court houses, airports, etc. Businesses that are open to the public are considered "places of public accommodation" and cannot discriminate, like tell black people they cannot come in, even as "private" property. My right to carry is a civil right and I don't think they have the right to discriminate against me given the laws on "public accomodation." (If those laws did not exist then I might feel differently)
It is none of their business if I am carrying concealed -- after all, out of sight, out of mind. They never know and no harm no foul.
I never quite thought of it in that way. I do tend to ignore the private business postings relying on the concealed is concealed principle. The public accommodation view never entered my mind. I wonder if it could be raised as a defense? The Supreme Court has ruled on 2A which could back up a constitutional rights issue much as discrimination of race, color and creed.
M4tographer
01-24-09, 21:54
It's my understanding that outside of areas prohibited by law(federal buildings, courthouses, or wherever) the only thing you could be found guilty of is trespassing. But if they know you're carrying, generally it would mean that you have broken other laws.
I'm obviously not a lawyer, nor am I familiar with laws in different states.
In a lot of places they can ask you to leave. If you REFUSE you can then be considered trespassing. But I'm with ya: If they see it when I'm trying to conceal then something's not right. ;)
Don Robison
01-24-09, 21:56
You did the right thing with the AR.
However, with the Kimber..........?
Gun owners need to obey all the rules all the time, especially in todays
environment.
Whether or not you agree with the rules is irrelevant.
Depends on what state he's in, for example in FL those signs hold the same legal authority as used toilet paper.
Depends on what state he's in, for example in FL those signs hold the same legal authority as used toilet paper.
You're right, I should know better than to post something like that on a gun
forum.
The CCW zealots jump on me every time.
Gun owners don't need any more enemies, and a little discretion
and maturity would go a long way in ensuring we continue to have
the right to carry concealed.
Don Robison
01-24-09, 22:10
You're right, I should know better than to post something like that on a gun
forum.
The CCW zealots jump on me every time.
Gun owners don't need any more enemies, and a little discretion
and maturity would go a long way in ensuring we continue to have
the right to carry concealed.
A couple of points.
1. I'm not a CCW zealot whatever that is.
2. Carrying concealed is using discretion.;)
M4tographer
01-24-09, 22:15
You're right, I should know better than to post something like that on a gun
forum.
The CCW zealots jump on me every time.
Gun owners don't need any more enemies, and a little discretion
and maturity would go a long way in ensuring we continue to have
the right to carry concealed.
I think there are those of us who have an aversion to anal rape, so we go about our normal lives while quietly carrying an extra tool in the waistline...much as others would carry a wallet or comb. I guarantee you couldn't pick me out of a crowd. ;)
I pack heat even in Disneyland:p
Might've been meant for employees.
I was a long-time FedEx guy. We shipped guns all the time, but an employee having a gun, even in his/her car, was grounds for immediate termination.
Simmer down now!! It's not like he broke the law when he walked into that FeDEX store with a concealed handgun. The worse they could have done is ask him to leave, never to come back again or charge him with tresspassing. JM2CW.
That's pretty much how it is in Nevada with the exception of courthouses and places like that.
The way I was told in my CCW courses was the signs have no legal meaning, unless you are asked to leave the premises if it is discovered that you are CCW. If you refuse then it will usually be a trespassing charge, though I recall that having the firearm could complicate the situation.
BTW- I stayed in a Holiday Inn in Ohio and they had a sign that said "firearms prohibited on the premises".
CCW/CHL licenses are state based, and as such the laws vary. It is one of those things that make cross-state carry a pain.
In Texas, that sign is utterly worthless. However, business owners can exclude CHL holders if they conform to the law.
In order to provide notice that entry on property by a license holder with a concealed handgun is forbidden, Penal Code Section 30.06(c)(3)(A) requires that a written communication contain the following language:
"PURSUANT TO SECTION 30.06, PENAL CODE (TRESPASS BY HOLDER OF A LICENSE TO CARRY A CONCEALED HANDGUN) A PERSON LICENSED UNDER SUBCHAPTER H, CHAPTER 411, GOVERNMENT CODE (CONCEALED HANDGUN LAW), MAY NOT ENTER THIS PROPERTY WITH A CONCEALED HANDGUN."
"CONFORME A LA SECCIÓN 30.06 DEL CÔDIGO PENAL (TRASPASAR PORTANDO ARMAS DE FUEGO) PERSONAS CON LICENCIA BAJO DEL SUB-CAPITULO H, CAPITULO 411, CODIGO DE GOBIERNO (LEY DE PORTAR ARMAS), NO DEBEN ENTRAR A ESTA PROPIEDAD PORTANDO UN ARMA DE FUEGO."
Also, Penal Code Section 30.06(c)(3)(B) further states that a sign must meet the following requirements:
1. includes the language described by Paragraph (A) in both English and Spanish;
2. appears in contrasting colors with block letters at least one inch in height; and
3. is displayed in a conspicuous manner clearly visible to the public.
An offense under this section is a Class A misdemeanor. A sign that does not conform exactly to the above statue does not provide constructive notice and thus is void and can be ignored by the CHL holder without violating the law. Such would be the case with the FexEx sign. Texas also has another sign regarding the unlicensed carry of weapons, but that sign does not apply to CHL holders, who are by definition, licensed. It is basically a threat aimed at those who illegally carry, kind of like those signs that say "shoplifters will be prosecuted".
You cant do that shit in Co, if there is a sign out side you cant bring your gat in!:eek:
FromMyColdDeadHand
01-25-09, 08:24
You cant do that shit in Co, if there is a sign out side you cant bring your gat in!:eek:
Not a CCW holder, but that is not what I am seeing. Yea, you can't take it into a courthouse, but private property can post but it falls under trespass. Do you have a citation for the law that you're referencing?
Not a lawyer, but detaining for trespassing seems a bit contradictory.
I've had similar experience with Fedex and UPS agents. I just stay very patient with them - no, it's not loaded, etc. If you act calm and businesslike, they respond in a similar manner.
As to that other thing . . .
There's an old saying that it's better to be tried by 12 than carried by 6.
trunkmonkey
01-25-09, 10:55
CCW/CHL licenses are state based, and as such the laws vary. It is one of those things that make cross-state carry a pain.
In Texas, that sign is utterly worthless. However, business owners can exclude CHL holders if they conform to the law.
In order to provide notice that entry on property by a license holder with a concealed handgun is forbidden, Penal Code Section 30.06(c)(3)(A) requires that a written communication contain the following language:
Also, Penal Code Section 30.06(c)(3)(B) further states that a sign must meet the following requirements:
1. includes the language described by Paragraph (A) in both English and Spanish;
2. appears in contrasting colors with block letters at least one inch in height; and
3. is displayed in a conspicuous manner clearly visible to the public.
An offense under this section is a Class A misdemeanor. A sign that does not conform exactly to the above statue does not provide constructive notice and thus is void and can be ignored by the CHL holder without violating the law. Such would be the case with the FexEx sign. Texas also has another sign regarding the unlicensed carry of weapons, but that sign does not apply to CHL holders, who are by definition, licensed. It is basically a threat aimed at those who illegally carry, kind of like those signs that say "shoplifters will be prosecuted".
The 3.06 sign itself also has to be a very specific size to be legal. it's something like 18 inches by 24. And no store owner wants to put that monstrosity outside their business.
The 3.06 sign itself also has to be a very specific size to be legal. it's something like 18 inches by 24. And no store owner wants to put that monstrosity outside their business.
That is incorrect. The penal code makes no reference to the actual size of the sign itself, only the size of the lettering used. See for yourself:
http://tlo2.tlc.state.tx.us/statutes/docs/PE/content/htm/pe.007.00.000030.00.htm#30.06.00
(30.06 is at the bottom)
The way I was told in my CCW courses was the signs have no legal meaning, unless you are asked to leave the premises if it is discovered that you are CCW. If you refuse then it will usually be a trespassing charge, though I recall that having the firearm could complicate the situation.
BTW- I stayed in a Holiday Inn in Ohio and they had a sign that said "firearms prohibited on the premises".
I doubt they had the proper signage anyway like most of the ingnorant owners of hotels in our state that post and just know that once you're in your room you were protected by the castle doctrine.
The good thing is they could only tell you to leave and that is surely what they don't want. It would be nice to see that happen and then while leaving town dropping off the receipt to their manager letting them know the business they just lost!
Yeah it's a conspiracy.
What actually happened was that you were dealing with a customer service agent who wasn't familiar with our firearms shipping policy and checked with their supervisor to verify policy. Although we do handle these shipments, they're fairly infrequent so some of the agents aren't up to speed on how they're handled.
Yes, I am a Fedex guy.
I also work for Fedex and am sorry to say that our company is populated with a lot of sheep who suffer from cranial rectumitus at all levels. But, thanks for shipping with us!
I also work for Fedex and am sorry to say that our company is populated with a lot of sheep who suffer from cranial rectumitus at all levels. But, thanks for shipping with us!
Cranial Rectumitus? Don't you guys have a health care plan? :D
I sometimes have "anal gloucoma". Just can't see my *** going to work. But that is cured by a day or two of fishing and shooting.
Businesses are generally considered\ private property for public use. That being said the owners or management can refuse the right to serve or exclude anyone carrying a weapon on their property. They can refuse you access to the business. If you don't comply you can be charged with trespassing. The scope of the castle doctrine varies from state to state. Here in Maryland the state does not recognize the castle doctrine. You also have no reasonable expectation to privacy in a hotel room. When you check into a hotel read the fin print on the paperwork you sign. Some hotels have statements that allow them full access to your room.
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