View Full Version : Smith Enterprise chrome plated bolts.
Anybody have any opinions on the Smith Enterprise chrome plated bolts? According to the product description on the Brownells website they are MPI. The price is a little high but with my discount it’s only about $87. Still a little high but considering the way prices are right now maybe not.
http://www.brownells.com/aspx/ns/store/ProductDetail.aspx?p=12794&title=AR-15%20CHROME%20PLATED%20BOLT%20&%20PARTS
its never seemed like a good idea to have such a high-wear part plated to me. i got a chromed carrier in my match gun, but i went phosphate for the bolt
FromMyColdDeadHand
01-25-09, 19:48
Is that because chrome can flake off? People have said that, but I've never heard of it happening, even anecdotally? You always here that it can, not that it did.
A lot of pistols are hard chromed, especially the gamer guns that run tight tolerances.
Seems like a god idea, should help with scaping carbon off?
Isn't everything in a AK chromed?
i dont know about AKs. i also have only heard that chrome CAN flake off. i think that comes from seeing rusty chromed bumpers on peoples' dads' trucks flaking. i haven't done any research on the chroming process in gun parts (i will, now that the question has come up), but ive gathered that it's not the same as chroming wheels and bumpers and shit. i think it's an actual fusion of metals, so it'll wear through rather than chip off. i've sort of seen this in my carrier- the chrome has gotten thin around the front sides of the carrier, and i suspect it will eventually just wear through and show the duller steel underneath.
i guess my concern is uneven wear between barrel extension and on the lugs.. once the chrome wears through, seems like the steel underneath will wear faster than the chrome around it, and the barrel extension will wear faster than the bolt. as i said, haven't done any research, just the thoughts ive had.
Valid point! Thanks! Was actually considering getting a chrome bolt myself.:D
The only part chromed on an AK47 is the operating rod (piston) and not the bolt or the carrier portion. That can vary slightly but on the 1500+ in my various armories that is the usual rule. I say buy it, run it hard and then write up a little T&E for us.
When I was in the service I saw dozens upon dozens of chromed bolts and carriers come through our shop. This was in the mid 80”s. We had to trash the carriers because they were not "tactical". The bolts were ok to leave in. Anyway I don’t recall any with the chrome coming off.
I’m more concerned with the quality of the bolt. Not if it’s chromed or not. I will probably buy it and try it out.
Parabellum9x19mm
01-26-09, 15:12
what other option is really left at this point?
$160 DPMS?
$250 BCM?
no thanks!
those smith & young groups look better every day. at least you can get them for retail.
by the way that blue falcon shit on the tos EE and gunbroker is really getting to me. i didn't used to have a problem with it, but i have builds i cant finish now and its starting to get aggravating
i didnt think the panic would be this bad on the parts side of things. shows how little i know.
by the way that blue falcon shit on the tos EE and gunbroker is really getting to me. i didn't used to have a problem with it, but i have builds i cant finish now and its starting to get aggravating.
whats blue falcon?
Parabellum9x19mm
01-26-09, 19:52
buddy ****er
....if it wasn't for greed more people could get the kit at a reasonable price.
Heavy Metal
01-26-09, 20:11
Is that because chrome can flake off? People have said that, but I've never heard of it happening, even anecdotally? You always here that it can, not that it did.
A lot of pistols are hard chromed, especially the gamer guns that run tight tolerances.
Seems like a god idea, should help with scaping carbon off?
Isn't everything in a AK chromed?
The only part of the bolt on an AK that is chromed is the piston head. Silver does not equal chrome, it means raw, unfinished steel.
Ah yes, the Blue Falcon. The "superhero" that everyone loves to hate. :D
Well after pussy footing around I took to long to order and they are now out.:( Oh well.
Well after pussy footing around I took to long to order and they are now out.:( Oh well.
These were available a week ago:
http://www.newriverarms.net/store.php?Bolt_Carriers-pg1-cid38.html
The youngs are available from his site. I ordered a NM M16 and it was sent out within a week. I believe he is making and selling them so there is never to much of a wait.
The youngs are available from his site. I ordered a NM M16 and it was sent out within a week. I believe he is making and selling them so there is never to much of a wait.
the two ive ordered post-obamanation have shipped next day and arrived within a week. its a fantastic backup system in trying times to have a slightly more expensive, less known product that nobody buys from.. hah.
kinda like lancer mags
I did notice that Travis had a Young National Match carrier in his carbine in the Magpul DVD. I wonder if he used a Young bolt also.
Sttrongbow
01-30-09, 07:33
its never seemed like a good idea to have such a high-wear part plated to me. i got a chromed carrier in my match gun, but i went phosphate for the bolt
I find that statement a bit odd.. Aren't most bores and chambers chromed? I think you could argue they get as much or more wear that the bolt.
I find that statement a bit odd.. Aren't most bores and chambers chromed? I think you could argue they get as much or more wear that the bolt.
no, actually most arent.. but the good ones are. barrels and chambers only make contact with the brass cartridge or copper jacketed bullet, they dont move and bang around into other crap, and dont have corners to wear down, etc.
but i was only commenting what comes to mind- i could be way off.
Sttrongbow
01-30-09, 08:43
no, actually most arent.. but the good ones are. barrels and chambers only make contact with the brass cartridge or copper jacketed bullet, they dont move and bang around into other crap, and dont have corners to wear down, etc.
but i was only commenting what comes to mind- i could be way off.
Sorry, I didn't mean to come off like an A-hole. Re-reading my post, I was unintentionally a bit rude.
Yeah... it just strikes me that if the quality manufacturers aren't worried about chrome wear in the bore, then the bolt is no worry at all.
But as I understand it, the advantage of chroming is the natural "lubricity," less wear, and easier cleaning. All cool stuff, I 'spose, but not really a "gotta have."
Sidewinder6
01-30-09, 09:53
FWIW the Young's are a bit heavier than the Mil Spec and I have been considering downsizing mine with a lighter carrier since I have been experiencing short stroking with, ... economical ammo. Not exactly like getting a conversion kit, but the prices today and high round training makes this a point for consideration.
Only problem is you cant find anyone with inventory! I am reluctant to scavenge one of my other guns playing mix and match.
Many moons ago I owned a genuine Smith Ent. chromed BCG. The fit and finish were immaculate. I could kick myself for ever selling it off with the gun I did.
A year or two ago I ordered another chromed Smith BCG from Brownells. When I received it I noticed it looked a little sloppy, nothing like the previous Smith I owned, more like a DPMS one I've also had before. I called Brownells and was told that Smith Ent. no longer makes their own but instead resells DPMS ones! I was a little pissed that I was supposedly paying a markup to Smith for a product that was available on the same Brownells page at a considerably cheaper price. I returned it and got a refund.
Having owned both before I can tell you there definitely WAS a discernable difference between the Smith and DPMS chromed BCG's.
Buyer beware.
FWIW the Young's are a bit heavier than the Mil Spec and I have been considering downsizing mine with a lighter carrier since I have been experiencing short stroking with, ... economical ammo. Not exactly like getting a conversion kit, but the prices today and high round training makes this a point for consideration.
Only problem is you cant find anyone with inventory! I am reluctant to scavenge one of my other guns playing mix and match.
dont play mix and match- thats bad mojo. wait it out if you can.. my order for BCGs with LMT was filled in about a month.
When did you order your LMT BCG that took a month? I am going to need 3 BCG's to finish my builds and hate to pay $170+ for a RRA or $190+ for a BCM on TOS EE. If the wait for LMT is only a month, I'll go ahead and place the order today.
.....
WOW - I just called and asked LMT current delivery on standard S/A or F/A BCG's and was told "right around 6 months". :o I was expecting 6 weeks maybe, but not 6 months :(
Guess I'll either pick up a YM std or hope to snag a BCM when they ever come back available.
......
A properly chromed bolt will have a very nice, even hard coating. It won't peel or begin to look like poop and will be very easy to clean.
Improperly plated bolts will peel and crack locking lugs on either side of the extractor cut due to hydrogen embrittlement.
I chose chromed DPMS bolt cam pins because I was tired of galling. They work great.
Another good (but expensive) option is to have bolts and/or bolt carriers NP3-treated by RoBar. The Teflon-nickel coating is very slick and cleans quickly.
Well I ended up backordering three of them and they came in today. I thought if they were good quality then I couldn’t go wrong. At the very least I could send them back for a refund. After pulling one from it’s bag I felt the chrome job was well done. However I was a bit concerned from the lack of markings. There was nothing to indicate the manufacture or if it was MPI. The description on the Brownells site indicated that they were MPI. I find it strange that Smith Enterprise would do this and not mark it as such. The extractor has a black insert with a standard spring. The gas rings look odd. They look thinner then normal. Lastly the locking lugs are not radius at the back like the Colt and CM marked bolt I compared them with.
So I’m at a loss. I was looking for a quality bolt my LMT upper but not sure if this is it. Here are some picks.
Smith Enterprise, CM, Colt Bolts
http://generalcartridge.net/images/PICT2881.JPG
http://generalcartridge.net/images/PICT2884.JPG
http://generalcartridge.net/images/PICT2886.JPG
Extractor with spring
http://generalcartridge.net/images/PICT2888.JPG
CM bolt extractor and spring
http://generalcartridge.net/images/PICT2889.JPG
Top CM bottom SE gas rings
http://generalcartridge.net/images/PICT2892.JPG
Locking lugs
http://generalcartridge.net/images/PICT2894.JPG
http://generalcartridge.net/images/PICT2897.JPG
vicious_cb
02-11-09, 00:26
Ill stick with parked BCGs. Chrome doesnt hold lube well
They look like my Smith's.
How are they working for you?
I can't speak to the Smith bolt but I bought the matching carrier from brownells and ended up just sending it back. It had too many problems to deal with. For starters, the key was not staked at all...I attached it properly and staked it. Then I put a colt bolt in the carrier and it was extremely tight...roughly twice as tight as a standard colt BCG.
The show stopper was when I tried to put it in a standard Colt 6920 upper. The carrier was so tight that it would not reliably feed from a loaded mag. I looked at it closely and it appeared to have a few high spots where the machining was not perfect and those caused drag inside the receiver. At that point, I just sent it back and bought a BCM standard BCG which worked fine.
How are they working for you?
They're old production-- maybe ten years or so --but they've worked fine.
Cosidering how much opportunity I have for shooting they should last until the next century mark.
Hmm,
From my understanding, when a harder material constantly comes in to contact with a softer material, the softer material eventually wears faster.
Has anyone heard of, or experienced accelerated wear among the locking lugs from the chrome bolts?
Just curious. I run a chrome bolt too, but don't seem to be having any problems.
Hmm,
From my understanding, when a harder material constantly comes in to contact with a softer material, the softer material eventually wears faster.
Has anyone heard of, or experienced accelerated wear among the locking lugs from the chrome bolts?
Just curious. I run a chrome bolt too, but don't seem to be having any problems.
that was one of my concerns. i also have no idea how this plays out, but it stands to reason.
They're old production-- maybe ten years or so --but they've worked fine.
Cosidering how much opportunity I have for shooting they should last until the next century mark.
Read my post above on page 2. You probably have one of the original Smith Ent. bolts and carriers. The first one I had was over 10 years ago and the new ones Brownells is peddling as Smith's pale in comparison.
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