View Full Version : Range Fun With The Bushmaster Carbine
I know, I know, it's only a Bushmaster, generally considered one of the lowest end, poorly built AR's out there. Well according to what I have read here and at several other forums I frequent, they can be made to be dependable and a decent gun, that shoots fairly accurately. First, I torqued and restaked the gas key cap screws, though I did not replace them with larger ones per the suggestion of one post I read. I also retorqued and staked the castle nut as suggested. Two major problems according to what I read here. My next change is to the extractor spring setup. I reassembled the gun and headed to the range with a 200 round value pack of American Eagle Tactical 55gr. 5.56 x 45 FMJ's.
I walked out to the 50yard backstop and stuck an 8" Shoot-N-C target on the panel and went back to the shooting line. I loaded 10 rounds and split the orange bullseye dot with the top of the front sight, and centered it as best I could in the center of the rear A1 style peep. I then shot all 10 rounds from a standing position, using the strap wrapped around my left elbow to stabilize the gun. I am new to AR's I don't know what is considered to be a good shooting rifle, but I am very pleased with the results. I read somewhere that the Bushmaster is a decent entry level rifle and I believe I agree with that opinion. With the 200 rounds I put through the rifle today, I now have 350 total and no malfunctions or misfires. Here is the result of that 10 shot effort.
http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f43/mike_seale/AR15AMEA50.jpg
thopkins22
01-31-09, 19:10
Pretty nice for standing.
Where are you in Texas?
Nice looking rifle..........good shooting too!!:cool:
Pretty nice for standing.
Where are you in Texas?
thopkins,
Thank you, I am located off I-10 about half way between Houston & San Antonio.
and you??
tex45acp
thopkins22
01-31-09, 20:53
thopkins,
Thank you, I am located off I-10 about half way between Houston & San Antonio.
and you??
tex45acp
Houston.
I own 3 Bushy's?? Never had a problem with them. Been through JTF6 counter terr course (1600 rds) and a basic carbine with fire institute (1000 rds) just on my 1 shorty. Never had a problem except 1 bad magazine. I own 3 Colts also. I guess if your gonna suffer from bad QC it will be right off the start. My favorite match rifle is 90% Bushy, gold in the LEAA oly's, built it myself though. Bye the way, Nice offhand group! You were probably a little limited by the quality of the ammo, it's not bad but not the most accurate ball ammo out there, IMHO. Nice carbine and good shooting!
I know, I know, it's only a Bushmaster, generally considered one of the lowest end, poorly built AR's out there.
Hey Tex, first nice shooting!
Second, Bushmasters are not the lowest end/poorest built AR out there. Nobody here has said that. While it might be true that others have more desirable features (1:7 twist, M4 ext, H buffer, etc) and better quality the majority of Bushmasters are fine for the majority of AR owners for the majority of the shooting they do.
If your Bushmaster is running fine then good on you and keep blasting away. If you have problems more than likely someone here has run into that issue as well and can point you in the right direction for getting it straightened out.
Canonshooter
02-01-09, 07:09
I know, I know, it's only a Bushmaster, generally considered one of the lowest end, poorly built AR's out there. Well according to what I have read here and at several other forums I frequent, they can be made to be dependable and a decent gun, that shoots fairly accurately.
I know that BMs have a bad reputation here, but it's not an entirely fair rap. Some are bad but others are quite good. I was lucky to get what is IMO a pretty good sample. I purchased a M4gery upper direct from BM about 4 years ago and purchased the lower locally from a gun shop. All the parts and pieces are straight and tight, the trigger pull is very acceptable - heavy but reasonably crisp - and the accuracy is excellent. No malfunctions of any kind to date, but I do plan on upgrading to a LMT bolt assembly as soon as I can find one. If I am concerned about uber reliability in a combat rifle, I grab my Krebs Custom AK103K anyway.
Here is a photo of what my BM does at 100 yards on sandbags with Federal XM193. It will shoot groups like this all day long.
http://www.canonshooter.com/photos2/M4-2.jpg
I know that BMs have a bad reputation here, but it's not an entirely fair rap. Some are bad but others are quite good. I was lucky to get what is IMO a pretty good sample. ]
if only "some" are great- even fantastic- that still doesn't mean bushmaster doesn't deserve the rep they have.
even noveske can put out a lemon- and even bushmaster can put out a rifle that shoots straight and doesn't fail.
its about consistency.
I know that BMs have a bad reputation here, but it's not an entirely fair rap.
Actually it is fair and it's based on literally hundreds if not thousands of samples over the course of many years. If you asked an instructor like Pat Rogers which AR has had the most issues in his classes he would list Olympic, DPMS and Bushmaster in that order.
It's not that fact that they are junk it's just they've had poor QC and your average shooter shows up without properly setting up their carbine. I would have no issue with running a Bushmaster at a class IF I had the opportunity to run it before hand to make sure it's good to go. If I had to grab one out of the box and leave for a class I'd want a Colt or LMT only because you can expect them to run from the get go the majority of the time.
If I am concerned about uber reliability in a combat rifle, I grab my Krebs Custom AK103K anyway.
Now you're talking! :D
Canonshooter
02-01-09, 07:28
its about consistency.
Yes. That is probably the largest gripe with BM - not knowing what you'll get until you open the box and examine it.
If I had it to do all over, I would opt for a Colt or LMT. But at least with my sample of BM product and with a few upgrades, I don't feel overly disadvantaged. I have currently updated mine with a CRT mil-spec package and a MAID grip from Grant .
Now, where can I get a LMT bolt assembly?
Yes. That is probably the largest gripe with BM - not knowing what you'll get until you open the box and examine it.
If I had it to do all over, I would opt for a Colt or LMT. But at least with my sample of BM product and with a few upgrades, I don't feel overly disadvantaged. I have currently updated mine with a CRT mil-spec package and a MAID grip from Grant .
Now, where can I get a LMT bolt assembly?
i dont mean to rip on your stick- i was just making a point about terms. if i had easy access to parts i'd have no problem using a bushy.
as far as the LMT BCG- order one from LMT. i ordered two in mid november, right at the spike of panic, and got 'em in about a month. cant promise the same now, but i suspect it wouldnt be too bad.
ETA: actually, i placed the order at the end of november.. like nov 27 or so, and got 'em in about a month.
I think some people are missing the point. Though you may have gotten a gun that shoots fine, there are 9 others behind you that weren't so lucky. The whole issue comes down to QA/QC and a lack of consistent standards. Sadly, enough Bushmaster more so than the others could address and correct each short-coming and make a really good weapon. They choose not to. Draw your own conclusions from that.
The other thing that irks me death are those that say "if I wanted a reliable SHTF weapon" I'd grab this or that. Well guess what? When the the shit does hit the fan you don't get to choose what weapon you will have. As a matter of fact there is nothing that you will have control over other than your response and your kit.
So instead of satisfying for a gun that works most of the time, identify that issues that have been repeatedly addressed and get them fixed.
Canonshooter
02-01-09, 09:09
I think some people are missing the point. Though you may have gotten a gun that shoots fine, there are 9 others behind you that weren't so lucky. The whole issue comes down to QA/QC and a lack of consistent standards. Sadly, enough Bushmaster more so than the others could address and correct each short-coming and make a really good weapon. They choose not to. Draw your own conclusions from that.
I don't disagree with any of this. In fact, your first paragraph sums up my feelings too. With a little TLC, most BMs can be turned into fine rifles.
The other thing that irks me death are those that say "if I wanted a reliable SHTF weapon" I'd grab this or that. Well guess what? When the the shit does hit the fan you don't get to choose what weapon you will have. As a matter of fact there is nothing that you will have control over other than your response and your kit.
As a civilian, I hope and pray that the only reason I'll ever have to discharge a weapon is for recreation purposes only. For any reason beyond a "trip to the range" it becomes pure speculation as to what circumstances might arise that would require me to fire shots in anger with a *rifle. If God forbid outright warfare breaks out in the U.S. and shows up in my neighborhood, I sincerely doubt I would survive long enough to see how many rounds it takes my copy of the BM to fail. In other words, I cannot imagine any circumstance that would have me firing thousands of rounds "in anger." Under those unimaginable conditions, my adversaries would probably be younger, stronger, better equipped and greatly outnumber me. In any SHTF scenario, I would pray it would all slip by without me having to engage any of it.
*As a long time competitive handgunner (IPSC, IDPA, NRA Action Pistol, NRA Bullseye) and a NRA Pistol Instructor, who has also studied the tactical use of pistols for self defense, my Glock 17 is what I reach for defense against life-threatening criminal activity. If my good fortune continues, I'll never have to put those skills to the test.
Canonshooter,
SHTF can be many things. Burglary/ home invasion robbery, some asshole on the range who goes whacko, etc..etc..It doesn't have to be a TEOTWAWKI siutation. And as you probably know it doesn't have to be thousands of rounds fired. It could be round number 2 or round number 300. The idea is to mitigate those factors and reduce the possibility of something going wrong.
Yes. That is probably the largest gripe with BM - not knowing what you'll get until you open the box and examine it.
If I had it to do all over, I would opt for a Colt or LMT. But at least with my sample of BM product and with a few upgrades, I don't feel overly disadvantaged. I have currently updated mine with a CRT mil-spec package and a MAID grip from Grant .
Now, where can I get a LMT bolt assembly?
Check with Grant at G&R but you might as well run your bolt until it breaks. Just have a spare on hand. All bolts will eventually break; they're a high wear item and I've seen Colt, LMT and just about every other brand break.
Your first statement sums it up in that you don't know what you'll get. But if you get one make sure the front sight is straight, the gas key is staked and it functions fine with various ammo. If it does keep trucking along!
Canonshooter,
SHTF can be many things. Burglary/ home invasion robbery, some asshole on the range who goes whacko, etc..etc..It doesn't have to be a TEOTWAWKI siutation. And as you probably know it doesn't have to be thousands of rounds fired. It could be round number 2 or round number 300. The idea is to mitigate those factors and reduce the possibility of something going wrong.
You forgot to include a Class V Zombie Infestation...
Couple of points:
Folks are often fond of using a round count as an indicator of reliability verification. It can be useful, but noting whether you fired 1k rounds in a day or 1k rounds in a week (which is really nothing) is moreso. Even a rec/hobby gun might go several thousand rounds, a box at a time. When someone posts: "not a failure in 2500 rounds" follow it up with "2500 rounds of what".
A gun that runs our of the box even with some intensity should also not be assumed to be GTG. An initial workload on the gun might produce some problems, but it may take time for others to emerge. Springs take sets, low quality parts fail, screws come loose.
Mitigate these issues by buying known good. In the alternative, PM the gun on arrival to pre-empt them.
RogerinTPA
02-01-09, 09:41
Good shooting by the way. As others have stated, if you decide to get a BM, just inspect your shooter to see if it was built right. If not, then make the necessary tweaks to insure you have a reliable "carbean" for all seasons & reasons. Here in the SE (FL for me) SHTF = Hurricanes (or the occasional riot if you live in the Miami area)= stealing, mugging, looting= protection of life and property. Our SHTF can come several times a year.
Jay Cunningham
02-01-09, 09:42
Here in the SE (FL for me) SHTF = Hurricanes
That's when park under the FSB really comes in handy!
:p
Tried Wolf? My BM wouldn't shoot the stuff.
M4arc,
You are correct! I forgot the most importand scenario of all. The dreaded (or welcomed depending on who you are) zombie infestation of mankind.
For that scenario I will go to the nearest .MIL installation about 20 minutes away and procure something bigger and better. :D Ever see zombies stop a tank? No!
You forgot to include a Class V Zombie Infestation...
Canonshooter
02-01-09, 09:48
That's when park under the FSB really comes in handy!
:p
But the rust helps prevent the FSB from coming loose. ;)
Canonshooter
02-01-09, 09:52
Tried Wolf? My BM wouldn't shoot the stuff.
Nothing but XM193 for me. The AK gets fed Barnaul.
You are what you eat.
sandman99and9
02-01-09, 10:06
Here in the SE (FL for me) SHTF = Hurricanes (or the occasional riot if you live in the Miami area)= stealing, mugging, looting= protection of life and property. Our SHTF can come several times a year.
Preach brother , preach !! Orlando here, and it can get pretty wild when a big storm is bearing down on the east coast. Can you say extended power loss...2wks with no ac/heat/ gas pumps don't work. People do crazy and/or stupid shit in tough times. You have to be ready and might not get much advance warning.
sandman99and9
02-01-09, 10:08
Preach brother , preach !! Orlando here, and it can get pretty wild when a big storm is bearing down on the east coast. Can you say extended power loss...2wks with no ac/heat/ gas pumps don't work. People do crazy and/or stupid shit in tough times. You have to be ready and might not get much advance warning.
[/QUOTE]Here in the SE (FL for me) SHTF = Hurricanes (or the occasional riot if you live in the Miami area)= stealing, mugging, looting= protection of life and property. Our SHTF can come several times a year.
I wish I could get 7 days notice when and where a storm was going to hit.
I wish I could get 7 days notice when and where a storm was going to hit.
gah.. no shit. Oklahoma? your warning is seeing a cow impale a semi-truck.
gah.. no shit. Oklahoma? your warning is seeing a cow impale a semi-truck.
hahaha your not lying
That's when park under the FSB really comes in handy!
:p
Katar is right!! I got slammed last July by Hurricane Dolly. The nonexistent rust on the FSB of my BM cost me the ability to kill several zombies... Uhhhh, wait! That's when I grabbed the DPMS and smoked them all! Stupid BM!!! Never let me down. Good weapon, the BM. I stake mine and my family's lives on it, 24/7, 365. I DO live in the land of home invasions. The Rio Grande Valley of S. Tx. Damn Mexico corruption creeping over here...!
DOG!!
M4arc,
You are correct! I forgot the most importand scenario of all. The dreaded (or welcomed depending on who you are) zombie infestation of mankind.
For that scenario I will go to the nearest .MIL installation about 20 minutes away and procure something bigger and better. :D Ever see zombies stop a tank? No!
Hehe...
You forgot to include a Class V Zombie Infestation...
That does have me worried, I'm all geared to a class III at the most. Class V, now thats just crazy talk!:D
So..., in a Class VI infestation, are all the zombies drunk? ;)
So..., in a Class VI infestation, are all the zombies drunk? ;)
i dunno, but i cant think of a better place to start the Resistance. :)
Lagadelphia
02-08-09, 23:14
gah.. no shit. Oklahoma? your warning is seeing a cow impale a semi-truck.
Now that is some funny stuff.
Canonshooter,
SHTF can be many things. Burglary/ home invasion robbery, some asshole on the range who goes whacko, etc..etc..It doesn't have to be a TEOTWAWKI siutation. And as you probably know it doesn't have to be thousands of rounds fired. It could be round number 2 or round number 300. The idea is to mitigate those factors and reduce the possibility of something going wrong.
OK, TEOTW = The End Of The World? And AWKI?
sorry... dog
OK, TEOTW = The End Of The World? And AWKI?
sorry... dog
AWKI=
As We Know It...
--->APB
[QUOTE=Iraqgunz;301381]I think some people are missing the point. Though you may have gotten a gun that shoots fine, there are 9 others behind you that weren't so lucky.
So your'e saying that 9 out of 10 bushmasters are problem rifles? Surely Bushmaster does a little better than a 10% success rate.
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