+P versus standard ammo

[sniperfrog]

Is there any real advantage to using +P ammo? According to ATKs websight there is only a 50fps difference in velocity between +p and standard. I am mostly looking at the 9mm loads. I currently am issued for my duty gun Winchester Ranger 124 grain 9mm.

[DocGKR]

That depends. If the +P offers improved reliability and terminal performance, then yes. If not, then no.

[Iraqgunz]

Doc,

Can you tell me your thoughts on the Federal 9BPLE 115gr. +P+ loading? Thanks.

[sniperfrog]

That depends. If the +P offers improved reliability and terminal performance, then yes. If not, then no.

Doc,
I guess that is kinda my question... Does the +P offer improved reliability and terminal performance? If you compare the 9mm 124 gold dot to the +P version, Is the +P that much better for terminal perfrormance/reliability?

[Zhukov]

Based on Doctor Roberts previous posts, there are only a few cases where +P is beneficial. One of these would be in short-barreled guns and the +P makes up for the lost velocity of a shorter barrel.

Most manufacturers design their ammunition with a bullet/powder combination that gives you plenty of margin on the velocity side to ensure proper bullet performance - all with standard pressure.

My thinking on the subject is: If a standard velocity load works fine, then why bother with the extra recoil of +P? It's harder on your gun and on follow-up shots.

[John Hearne]

+P or +P+ are great for guns that are carried in "cruddy" locations - like an ankle gun. The extra impulse can allow a pistol to cycle when it is less than pristine.

I would also offer that muzzle report is one of the few areas where we can contribute to the psychological side of the stopping power equation. I know of an instance where a BG was stopped by a complete miss from a full house .357 from a short barrel model 66. If you watch the FBI video that covers their Miami shooting, one of the agents comments on the difference in muzzle report from various weapons including the psychological impact of the .223 discharging.

[DocGKR]

John Hearne has some exellent comments!

The 9BPLE tends to be inconsistent in its performance, often fragments, and has poor intermediate barrier penetration compared to more modern designs.

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We compared the 9 mm Gold Dot 124 gr standard pressure to the 124 gr +P out of a Glock 17:

9 mm 124 gr JHP Gold Dot 53618 (lot# F08H33), gel calib= 9.5 cm @ 605 f/s
BG: vel=1144, pen=13.0, RD=0.62, RL=0.32, RW=125.5
4LD: vel=1153, pen=16.6, RD=0.51, RL=0.43, RW=125.2

9 mm 124 gr +P JHP Gold Dot 53617 (lot# B03J35), gel calib= 9.0 cm @ 596 f/s
BG: vel=1225, pen=12.0, RD=0.67, RL=0.30, RW=124.2
4LD: vel=1239, pen=13.0, RD=0.54, RL=0.39, RW=124.5

I would feel comfortable using either of these loads, as both offer acceptable performance, although the 124 gr +P has a slight edge.

[sniperfrog]

Thanks guys, I appreciate the input. It looks like for me anyways that its really not worth the extra velocity of the +P load.

[tpd223]

We issue the 124gr +P Gold Dot here for our Glock 9mms. I like this load alot, it has performed well in our OISs, and we have never had a stoppage with this ammo.

I too am a fan of using +P in 9mms to give the slide a bit more boost, this allows a margin of reliability IMHO when the gun is dirty, or dry, or the shooter is firing from an unlocked wrist or some sort of disadvantaged firing position, such as if they are wounded and firing from the ground.

I currently carry the 127gr +P+ Ranger-T in my 9mms.

[RyanB]

I really like 127+P+. I've seen it penetrate IIA armor.

[sjc3081]

NYPD has extensive data on Speer GD 124+P in actual shootings of men and beasts. It would be great if the data could be accessed.