View Full Version : Got my BCM milspec stocks
So I have 3 builds in-process and ordered BCM M4 milspec stock (Gen2) kits and they came in today. These are 5-pos stocks. When I put one on a lower and shouldered it I noticed it felt a lot shorter than my Double Star M4 with comm 6-pos stock. I measured the pull on both and the BCM is a full 1" shorter with both fully extended. Guess I thought they'd both be the same pull, just the BCM would have the 5-pos spaced out differently. I haven't measured each position, but would now assume they are spaced out differently.
Looking over both stocks, I think I actually like the stock on the DS better. Things I like better are the length of pull, diamond checkering on the adj lever verses just straight lines on the BCM and the DS stock sling mount can be positioned 180 degrees to be straight down, or to either side.
Now I am thinking about if I should sell the BCM's and get the milspec version of the DS stock - which I *think* is made by ACE? but am not for sure.
Inputs? Suggestions? Thoughts?
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***EDIT***
I just went and took a pic of the DS4 stock and compared it and dang if it don't look exactly like the Gen1 BCM stock, that is 6-pos adjustable. Hmmmmm........
BCM Gen 1
http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/v/vspfiles/photos/Stock%20M4%20Milspec%20Black-3.jpg
DS4 stock
http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee238/number9st/Guns/DS4_stock.jpg
BCM Gen 2
http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/v/vspfiles/photos/Stock%20M4%20Milspec%20Black%20-%20GEN2-2.jpg
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131 views and no comments?
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BUCK OFAMA
02-21-09, 12:45
131 views and no comments?
..
Maybe because you didn't even ask a clear question, and aside from that nobody gives a shit enough to just comment on a very vague thread?
What, you wanted somebody to tell you your stock was pretty? Ok...I'm feeling nice.
WOW, your stock is SOOOO AWESOME! Good job! I mean, it looks like every other f'ing stock in the world and you didn't really do anything different but hey, if it gives you a shiver up your leg then it's worthy of its own thread here!
Awesome!!
MisterWilson
02-21-09, 12:53
Buck kinda has a point. Your thread is much ado about nothing, and reeks of someone who stares at their rifle more than they actually shoot it.
Where's the yawn smiley...
5 pos vs 6 pos will vary with the receiver extension not the stock itself.
Maybe because you didn't even ask a clear question, and aside from that nobody gives a shit enough to just comment on a very vague thread?
What, you wanted somebody to tell you your stock was pretty? Ok...I'm feeling nice.
WOW, your stock is SOOOO AWESOME! Good job! I mean, it looks like every other f'ing stock in the world and you didn't really do anything different but hey, if it gives you a shiver up your leg then it's worthy of its own thread here!
Awesome!!
There's no reason to be such a freaking arrogant smart ass. :rolleyes:
Buck kinda has a point. Your thread is much ado about nothing, and reeks of someone who stares at their rifle more than they actually shoot it.
Where's the yawn smiley...
No, actually I am not one of these girly men who armor all their guns and prop them up in tactical backdrops to do photo shoots to post on the net. I shoot mine, I clean mine, and I shoot mine some more. Sorry my post was taken that way.
Actually, the point I was trying to make was that I was kinda disappointed in the stock I got and was at the same time surprised to find the one I had from a rifle that is generally looked down upon (and not that I care or get my feelings hurt by that, I didn't make the damn thing, I just bought it and plan to sell it once I get my builds completed with "Top-Tier" equipment as thought highly of around here) was identical to the Gen1 from BCM. Not at all knocking the items BCM is selling, just that comparing the two I think I'd prefer the Gen1 over the Gen2.
I guess I was looking for input, comments along the lines of.......
The GenX version is regarded as stronger, better than the GenX version.....
The 5-pos stocks generally result in a shorter length of pull than 6-pos stocks.........
Comm stocks generally result in a longer length of pull than Milspec stocks.......
XXX manufactures the stocks for lots of companies, BCM included and that's prob why they are identical.....
Generally the fixed position sling mount is regarded as a stronger setup over the adjustable mount type.......
BCM / other manufactures went from the Gen1 to the Gen2 because of XXX reasons.......
Not that I am saying any of the things above are true, just examples of input / comments I figured this post would result in. :confused:
You guys over here seem to hold top tier equipment in high regard and strictly stick to them, well so do I in other things I do / am interested in. I found TOS first and soaked up all the knowledge I could before laying my money down for an AR that I thought was good to go. I found this site and learned you guys hold to a "higher standard", if you will. I visit this site to gain knowledge and input from you guys so I can educate myself to that degree.
Having said that, I am not some nerdy teenager with mall ninja fantasies sitting in their parents basement building up AR's to impress people and I don't intend to be treated as such. :mad:
On every forum I visit I try to engage in educated, constructive, value added conversation and stay away from the musing of the peanut gallery. That's all I have tried to do here as well.
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Bushmaster-M4A3
02-21-09, 15:56
I won't comment on the Milspec vs. Commercial tube issue, since this is about the stock itself.
Now, on "mil-spec" stock itself, the reason that BCM Gen2 changed is really because that's how Colt made their M4 stock. The fact is this, Colt made their M4 stock way back in 90s and it hasn't reallly changed, and the military has been using it ever since. It's a nice design, but other makers have copies and improved on the design, such as more material around the locking lever housing, radiused area between tube and locking lever area, and sling swivel that can pivot 180deg.
But......people want something that looks like the Colt M4, because that's how the military gun looked like. So BCM took a step backwards, made Gen2, and it's a close copy of Colt M4 stock. So yes, the BCM Gen1 is technically superior to Gen2, but it is not a copy of milspec M4 stock, so people didn't care for it. Sometimes people are blinded to become "commando" wannabe, and not care for actual improvement made on milspec stuff.
5 pos vs 6 pos will vary with the receiver extension not the stock itself.
Thank You. That's the kind of replies I was looking for.
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Bushmaster-M4A3 => Excellent. Thank you very much.
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number9xd,
I don't believe that anyone was trying to be a smart ass. In the future it would be wiser to post a pointed question. It's kind of hard to blame people for the response when you didn't make it clear as to what you wanted to know. If you are happy with your new purchase, great. If not, sell them or do whatever and then move on.
cool breeze
02-21-09, 16:36
you know what dicks like you would fit better on a Obama site. grow up man maybe it is his first build and he is excited, maybe like all of us was on our first build. assholes like you really piss me off
Maybe because you didn't even ask a clear
question, and aside from that nobody gives a shit enough to just comment on a very vague thread?
What, you wanted somebody to tell you your stock was pretty? Ok...I'm feeling nice.
WOW, your stock is SOOOO AWESOME! Good job! I mean, it looks like every other f'ing stock in the world and you didn't really do anything different but hey, if it gives you a shiver up your leg then it's worthy of its own thread here!
Awesome!!
131 views and no comments?
..
I think this is what started the melee. I have asked several questions that have gotten few to no responses, and that means that no one is interested or the question was poorly posed and those that did look at the thread have no idea what information I am looking for. This site has a lot of useful information, but the OP should realize that if he has views and no comments so be it.
if you dont like it, sell it and try something else.
as for getting your panties in a twist over what people said on the internet, you DID ask for our thoughts.
if you dont like negative feedback, don't post threads asking for our opinion.
BUCK OFAMA
02-21-09, 20:20
There's no reason to be such a freaking arrogant smart ass. :rolleyes:
You're right, and I apologize. I just woke up and re-read the posts I'd made last night after my return from a pretty decent binge at the local bar, and they were decidedly unkind.
The point I was trying to make, however, was that your post lacked clarity as to exactly what info you sought, and then you had to gripe about nobody answering a question that wasn't asked in the first place.
Listen, I'm new to ARs, too, and you probably know as much or more than I do about them. I'm here for help, also. Just be a little clearer about the help you need and folks are generally quite helpful.
Good luck with your AR.
you know what dicks like you would fit better on a Obama site. grow up man maybe it is his first build and he is excited, maybe like all of us was on our first build. assholes like you really piss me off
A+1 to that!!!:p
...I'm glad you posted this...
I just got a lower with a 5 and I like it better than the loose-ass Colt 4 position...I'll get another fiver from BCM pretty soon for another lower and call it good. I still crave a SOPMOD and that'd be my next upgrade...http://emoticons4u.com/smoking/rauch06.gif
...and welcome to the fray... Snot such a bad place...usually...
Experienced Vandal
02-23-09, 11:38
Smells like TOS in here....:(
I won't comment on the Milspec vs. Commercial tube issue, since this is about the stock itself.
Now, on "mil-spec" stock itself, the reason that BCM Gen2 changed is really because that's how Colt made their M4 stock. The fact is this, Colt made their M4 stock way back in 90s and it hasn't reallly changed, and the military has been using it ever since. It's a nice design, but other makers have copies and improved on the design, such as more material around the locking lever housing, radiused area between tube and locking lever area, and sling swivel that can pivot 180deg.
But......people want something that looks like the Colt M4, because that's how the military gun looked like. So BCM took a step backwards, made Gen2, and it's a close copy of Colt M4 stock. So yes, the BCM Gen1 is technically superior to Gen2, but it is not a copy of milspec M4 stock, so people didn't care for it. Sometimes people are blinded to become "commando" wannabe, and not care for actual improvement made on milspec stuff.
I just want clarification on the above statement, all TOS squabbling aside. So the Gen 2 stock from Bravo is a step back? Yet they're charging more for them? Any legitimate source for this info?
BravoCompanyUSA
02-23-09, 22:52
Take a closer look at the DS4 stock and the BCM "Gen 1" stock at the same time.....
(stock bodies are same/similar)
The BCM Gen2, is different from the DS4 and the BCM "Gen 1" stocks.
The BCM Gen2 is a copy of the USGI/Colt M4 stock.
I do agree the "Gen1" stock is very very very nice, maybe even a better stock, but the Gen2 is the correct USGI product.
I hope this makes sence.
We offer them both (when they are in stock), no pun intended. :p
Thanks!
Edited to add:
Technically the BCM Gen 1 stock; we call the "BCM M4 Stock with Milspec Reciever Extention". (we really don't use the term Gen 1)
The "BCM Milpsec M4 Stock (Gen 2)", was the additional type of stock we offered. The "2" came from it being a copy of the "type 2" USGI/Colt term to describe their new M4 stock that replace the older CAR type, and it was the "2"nd version of a BCM M4 stock.
Both are still available. Confused yet ?.......:D I gotta get some sleep. Up in 5.5 hours to do it again. :p
This confirms what the previous poster said, but I still want to know if the Gen 1 is really better than the Gen 2. I'm just wondering because I ordered a Gen 1 in tan and a Gen 2 in black, because they didn't have the Gen 1 in black. I just don't want to find out I spent more money on something inferior.
Bushmaster-M4A3
02-24-09, 01:19
It's not really better or worse...just an evolution of the stock design. In reality, other than the ergonomic differences such as the sling swivel pivot, the stock are really substantially similar. If you want the stock to look mil-spec M4, then get the Gen2. If you don't care about, personally I'd get "Gen1" or the improved stock. The additional radius and the support area around the locking mechanism adds a degree of durability to the stock (as much as the plastic stock could provide).
PAUL - THANK YOU.
That is exactly the kind of information I was looking for. My mechanical mind makes me look at things to find changes and why the changes were made. It is a great expense to change molds / dies / tooling and for someone to do that there HAD to been a good reason to do so. That's what I was wondering, the reason that justified the change. Now I know this applies to the manufacturer, whoever that is and not you the retailer, but that then presented the question of why the retailer offers a newer generation - have they seen issues with one version, is there known strenghts/weaknesses with one over the other, do people just wanna play GI Joe to that degree, etc......
You have posted here and gave the answers to those questions and I thank you very much for that. I didn't expect you to join the conversation, but the fact that you did and gave clear information to the discussion takes the respect of you and your company up a notch further in my book.
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