View Full Version : This has got to be a joke. Obama wants to "reach" out to the Taliban.
parishioner
03-08-09, 01:18
http://news.aol.com/article/obama-afghanistan-taliban/373693
This is my favorite part...Obama added that the U.S. doesn't torture its suspects and noted in some cases those being held would have an opportunity to challenge their detention in federal courts.
This guy is proving everyday that he is not on our side.
We know the taliban are a group of people that need to be eradicated.
But what about some of their so called "followers"?
I'd suspect a good deal of those terrorists are in it because of fear of retribution against their family, villages, etc, by the taliban. I saw some footage on some program showing US troops patroling in Afghanistan and stopping by some villages. One soldier was talking through a translator to one of the elders about if taliban forces came by recently. The man was very hesitiant to talk, stating that the taliban may be watching them at that moment along the mountians. When he cooperated with the US troops, he stated that the taliban threaten them for information about US forces and may be tortured and killed if found cooperating with Americans.
So basically as an Afghan, if you talk to Americans then you get killed by taliban. If you talk to taliban or get forced to do their bidding, then you get killed in combat or caught and locked up in some foreign land by the Americans.
If there are Afghans forced into being taliban soldiers, I do feel sorry for them. Maybe those are the types we need to reach out to and use against the taliban.
Obama's plan sounds like a gateway to my idea, but of course he's a liberal and liberals are factually known to **** things up. :p
I hate to say it, but it sounds like he is listening to the people who actually know the history of Afghanistan. There are more moderate factions within the Taliban, who was a stabilizing force in a country that has never had, and given its size and remoteness might never have, a strong centralized seat of power. If the moderates can overcome the more radical, and help to push out al qaida, there is the possibility for a stabilized confederation. We have the British to thank for drawing the fake border with Pakistan, and now the Pashtuns, the most populous group, is a divided people group lumped under flags and rulers who are not their own.
This could potentially be a good idea. Many of the Taliban are children from the Afghanistan Russian war. We trained the Mujahideen and supplied them to fight the Russians and when the time came to help them rebuild their country we simply said you are on your own. We used the Afghans as cannon fodder to fight the Russians and once they were successful they had no other purpose. If we had stayed and invested in Afghanistan's future then during the 80's then the Mujahideen would probably have not transformed into a terrorist organization. The Afghans felt betrayed by the US and this allowed radical religious leaders such as Osama bin Laden to step into the power vacuum created by the US. I guess what i am saying here is we do need to try reach out to some of the Taliban, and relentlessly w/o one hand tied behind our back eradicate the radical leaders and their ideas. That is why the "War on Terror" will never end. We can kill thousands of leaders but it is impossible to kill an idea. If we can regain the trust of the Afghans then maybe we can lessen the influence of tribal leaders and educate the people.
I could write about this for days. This was one of the topics in my senior seminar at ASU along with the Kurds in Iraq and how they would later create strife in Turkey and Iran.
Haven't you heard? Obama can turn a turd into a lump of gold.
Muslims band together. Lets not forget Obama's freudian slip:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XKGdkqfBICw
parishioner
03-08-09, 11:28
It should say reach out to the local afghans then, not the taliban.
I hate to say it, but it sounds like he is listening to the people who actually know the history of Afghanistan. There are more moderate factions within the Taliban, who was a stabilizing force in a country that has never had, and given its size and remoteness might never have, a strong centralized seat of power. If the moderates can overcome the more radical, and help to push out al qaida, there is the possibility for a stabilized confederation. We have the British to thank for drawing the fake border with Pakistan, and now the Pashtuns, the most populous group, is a divided people group lumped under flags and rulers who are not their own.
Sorry...have to disagree. There are no "moderate" Taliban....TB has been invited by Karzai and other gov't ministers/authorities to have a seat at the table....to settle things through talk and diplomacy--to give them a voice in the GIRoA. TB told them in so many words to go get bent.
TB does not want reconciliation....they do not want a seat at the table. They are not moderate...and anyone who claims to be TB and is in discussions or negotiations with the Afghan gov't or coalition forces is severely punished (or family members are severely punished).....these guys are all or nothing....you are a jihadist or you are an unbeliever.
We are 1 to 3 generations away from peace here while the TB has the ability to shoot, move, and communicate....
Mike
Kabul, Afghanistan
High quality variable power optics are the best way to reach out to the Taliban to send our copper jacketed messages! :D
This strategy was proposed during the Bush administration, they just did not have time to implement it. It is very similar to the strategy used in Iraq.
Fixed your post title for you!
This has got to be a joke. "OBAMA."
;) You're welcome......!!! dog
OldNavyGuy
03-09-09, 09:34
Obama wants to "reach" out to the Taliban.
well...., why not ?? he is one of them :D
Mike, I think you are completely correct here there is no in between with the taliban. Thank you for your service.
fruitjacket
03-09-09, 14:39
I don't see any form of diplomacy as a bad idea.
But if Obama becomes stubborn about it, and the Taliban will not listen to reason (Which I highly doubt they will), then we have no choice.
However, I'm a firm believer that we can't win. The more you kill, the more you recruit in the process. The US cannot get into a global 'witch hunt', because we simply cannot afford it. Terrorists have no borders, no country, and no 'government'. If you think Iraq was tough, wait till you see how much money and time is spent trying to eliminate a global terrorist network.
Diplomacy only makes sense as an OPTION. As long as we don't give up too much in the search for some form of peace, I don't see anything wrong with it.
Just my .02
At work, we're quite fond of the saying, "Never attribute to malice that which can be explained by incompetence."
I'm becoming quite convinced that the Kenyan isn't incompetent.
Robb Jensen
03-09-09, 21:23
He's gone full-retard. :eek:
Failure2Stop
03-10-09, 00:35
Obama wants to "reach" out to the Taliban?
Hell, so do I :D.
But seriously- is there actually some idiot that thinks that the Taliban are some cohesive unit with a chain of command and some shadowy Cobra Commander with whom to dialogue? Like there is some "Supreme Commander of Dress-Wearers" that will tell all the other goat-drillers to stop fighting?
Hardee-focking-har.
It's roughly equilavent to trying to deal with a forest full of hornets. You don't look for the King of All Hornets to seduce with Sugar Daddys, you smash each nest open, set it on fire and crush the stragglers. Step 2- move to the next hive and repeat.
Sure, I am an overly aggressive knuckle-dragger. And I have heard the saying, "If all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail." But give me a big enough hammer and I can solve most problems- might not be pretty, but I'm no effin' ballerina anyway, and I am rarely judged on visual appeal.
It's a lot easier to negotiate when you foot is firmly planted on the opposing party's windpipe.
This strategy was proposed during the Bush administration, they just did not have time to implement it. It is very similar to the strategy used in Iraq.
Which succeeded in isolating AQI and avoiding an all out civil war.
This strategy was proposed during the Bush administration, they just did not have time to implement it. It is very similar to the strategy used in Iraq.
Personally I think the Bush administration realized it was a losing proposition and shelved the idea.
Which succeeded in isolating AQI and avoiding an all out civil war.
Afghanistan and Iraq are two completely different animals...I'm not confident this would work there.
In dealing with moderate Iraqis you can dangle the power, money and influence "carrot" in front of them to bring them to the negotiation table. Since they are a more mature or civilized society those kind of inducements will appeal to them. Afghanistan is more like the wild west in that the only thing they understand or respect is strength. The minute you come in and try to take a moderate stance is when they start looking for a way to stab you in the back. It's been happening since Alexander rolled through there...why would anyone expect that to change now.
Just my humble opinion...
HowardCohodas
03-10-09, 18:25
This has got to be a joke. Obama
But then I repeat myself.
But seriously- is there actually some idiot that thinks that the Taliban are some cohesive unit with a chain of command and some shadowy Cobra Commander with whom to dialogue? Like there is some "Supreme Commander of Dress-Wearers" that will tell all the other goat-drillers to stop fighting?
It could look like this
Mike Yon spent more time embedded with US and Allied units that any other reporter.
www.michaelyon-online.com
His SF background also makes him uniquely qualified to see through the BS that flys from various sources....
Fr0ntal0b0t0my
03-12-09, 08:35
Obama wants to "reach" out to the Taliban?
Hell, so do I :D.
But seriously- is there actually some idiot that thinks that the Taliban are some cohesive unit with a chain of command and some shadowy Cobra Commander with whom to dialogue? Like there is some "Supreme Commander of Dress-Wearers" that will tell all the other goat-drillers to stop fighting?
Hardee-focking-har.
It's roughly equilavent to trying to deal with a forest full of hornets. You don't look for the King of All Hornets to seduce with Sugar Daddys, you smash each nest open, set it on fire and crush the stragglers. Step 2- move to the next hive and repeat.
Sure, I am an overly aggressive knuckle-dragger. And I have heard the saying, "If all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail." But give me a big enough hammer and I can solve most problems- might not be pretty, but I'm no effin' ballerina anyway, and I am rarely judged on visual appeal.
It's a lot easier to negotiate when you foot is firmly planted on the opposing party's windpipe.
Priceless! You sir are a poet, not a ballerina
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