View Full Version : Stoves
Outlander Systems
03-08-09, 11:55
Anyone got any experience with any of the portable/backpacker camp stoves?
I'm currently looking at the:
Jetboil:
http://www.jetboil.com/products/cookingsystems/personalcookingsystem
MSR:
http://www.msrgear.com/stoves/fastandlight.asp
I'm trying to keep the B.O.B. as lightweight as possible, so off the bat I'm ruling out the Coleman stoves.
I'd suggest the MSR Wisperlight International (http://www.msrgear.com/stoves/whisperint.asp) or their XGK (http://www.msrgear.com/stoves/xgkex.asp).
I've used both of the above quite a bit. The wisperlight is a tried and true design, lightweight, and easy to use. The International has different jets so you can run white gas or light fuels, and lets you run diesel, JP-5/8, kerosene, or about anything that burns.
The XGK is heavier duty, but mechanically about the same.
I've used a few of the models like you linked. They are nice, but are much taller, a little harder to insulate the flame area from wind, and easier to knock over. The others are a flatter design, and both need a decent base to put the stove on.
Just a few things to consider. Plus the shape of the longer MSR fuel bottles fit into more things easier. Make sure to get the repair kit for the stoves.
SeriousStudent
03-08-09, 13:53
I have not used a Jetboil.
I have an original model MSR XGK, that is about 30 years old. It's been all over the planet. I have used it at over 18,000 feet. It's been rebuilt either three or four times, using the factory-supplied maintenance kit. After 4-5 years, you need to replace the o-rings on it. That and the leather cup on the pump are all I have ever done. It has never let me down, and has probably saved lives, by helping treat hypothermia in several instances.
I think I paid $70 for it sometime in the late 1970's. UVvis is correct, the repair kit is a very good investment. Read the repair manual, mine is something like 40 pages long.
It will burn just about anything, including Wild Turkey if you switch the Sigg bottles by accident in the dark. Made for a rather foul-tasting cocktail hour later on..... :eek:
Buy once, cry once when it comes to survival gear. For me, that's rifles, pistols, stoves, ropes, sleeping bags, etc.
Littlelebowski
03-08-09, 14:00
I have the JetBoil. Supposedly it doesn't do well for higher altitudes but that's not the focus of this forum. It's an outstanding piece of gear, dead simple, easy to use, and always lights for me. It's all self contained including the cup you can cook in so it's ideal for your BOB.
losbronces
03-08-09, 14:15
I'd suggest the MSR Wisperlight International (http://www.msrgear.com/stoves/whisperint.asp) or their XGK (http://www.msrgear.com/stoves/xgkex.asp).
I've used both of the above quite a bit. The wisperlight is a tried and true design, lightweight, and easy to use. The International has different jets so you can run white gas or light fuels, and lets you run diesel, JP-5/8, kerosene, or about anything that burns.
The XGK is heavier duty, but mechanically about the same.
I've used a few of the models like you linked. They are nice, but are much taller, a little harder to insulate the flame area from wind, and easier to knock over. The others are a flatter design, and both need a decent base to put the stove on.
Just a few things to consider. Plus the shape of the longer MSR fuel bottles fit into more things easier. Make sure to get the repair kit for the stoves.
I also have the MSR Whisperlight International. There is a lot more flexibity with fuel and its still a light combination.
One other issue with the canister stoves is there is no way to tell how much fuel you have left in the canister. I did have a canister once where the internal valve didn't close after taking it off the stove. The MSR fuel bottles can be topped off anytime so you know they are full (and you didn't waste any money). I have used gasoline in my stove, its dirtier than white gas but it works.
MSR Whisperlight INt'l is a great stove. Field serviceable, lights well, multi-fuel capable, burns HOT, and if you are VERY careful you can dial down the flow of fuel, and sorta simmer on it. But it takes practice. HOwever the term Whisper, is sort of a joke...it is LOUD!
The MSR Dragonfly is a little quieter, and really does have a controlled simmer. I can't remember if it is multi-fuel or not. It is field serviceable. I think it is a little smaller than the Whisperlite, but doesn't strike me as quite as robust.
Also, MSR has fantastic customer service.
Outlander Systems
03-08-09, 18:32
Thanks for the advice.
If diamonds are a girl's best friend, redundancy is mine.
Do these stoves self-ignite, or is an external source required? I'd like something that self-ignites, as it would cut down on the use of my "fire makin'" supplies. That being said, if it self ignites, I'd like to also be able to use "fire makin'" supplies to get it going, in the event that the ignition source fails.
The goal of the stove, for me, is to serve as an alternative to a traditional fire in foul weather.
-Mike
ETA: The versatility of fuel options seems rather nice. Yet another reason to justify the Jack in my pack.
losbronces
03-08-09, 18:46
Thanks for the advice.
If diamonds are a girl's best friend, redundancy is mine.
Do these stoves self-ignite, or is an external source required? I'd like something that self-ignites, as it would cut down on the use of my "fire makin'" supplies. That being said, if it self ignites, I'd like to also be able to use "fire makin'" supplies to get it going, in the event that the ignition source fails.
The goal of the stove, for me, is to serve as an alternative to a traditional fire in foul weather.
-Mike
ETA: The versatility of fuel options seems rather nice. Yet another reason to justify the Jack in my pack.
The MSR Whisperlight doesn't have a peizoelectric start. You have to use a match or a lighter.
LonghunterCO
03-08-09, 19:32
Owned or have used the the following:
MSR Wisperlight
MSR Wisperlight International
MSR XGK older generation (not sure if it was called the XGK)
Svea 123r
Sierra Zip stove
MSR Wisperlight (and International): great stoves highly recommended, I just carry a spare parts kit with me on the trail. I like the external fuel tank concept.
MSR XGK [Note:the older model]: We called it the flame thrower it could boil water faster than anything we had in inventory. If you are making water from snow this is the stove for you. It also had a tendency to burn to rat poop anything that you were cooking. There was no real simmer setting on it. I would ask about that of "new model" owners before buying the new one.
Svea 123r: for those that are drawn to WW1 styles:D. Great stove. Bomb proof. Fairly heavy and has an internal tank (for those that prefer it)
Sierra Zip stove: This thing actually works. It is large and takes up some room in the pack. It relies on dry fuel (which is not always available). It relies on batteries for the fan (probably the thing that bothered me the most about it).
SeriousStudent
03-08-09, 20:28
Very true. My XGK has two settings. Off, and nuclear blast furnace. If you are going to be making creme brulee at your lakeside chateau, this is not the stove for you.
If you do not mind a stove that sounds like a F-111 at full burner during takeoff, then this one will work. Basically, I melt snow or boil water in a couple of minutes, shut it off, then dump some dried things in it to rehydrate. Cover the lid. Do camp chores for five minutes. Open lid, consume victuals.
If you are sitting in a hide, do not buy it. If you want something that is actually fairly miserly on fuel, it's good. You only need to run it a few minutes, so it's pretty efficient.
Very true. My XGK has two settings. Off, and nuclear blast furnace. If you are going to be making creme brulee at your lakeside chateau, this is not the stove for you.
What? I can't hear you over the stove.
That's the other thing, is considering your uses for these stoves. If you want to just make water (from snow/ice), or boil water for dehydrated food or to make a whatever soup, they are ideal. I've yet to try my culinary prowess with one. Besides, there is a difference between surviving and thriving, and cooking accordingly. Calories get priority over yummy in some situations.
Outlander Systems
03-08-09, 22:22
Lebowski: How long have you had your JB? Any Failures To Ignite?
Buy once cry once is good advice.
I tried to save money one time by buying a Coleman camp stove at an REI scratch and dent sale.
I discovered why it had been returned. It had a very annoying tendency to set the user on fire.
I once woke some fellow campers up rather rudely with a string of Marine Corps language. They woke to see a fireball arcing out into Lake Superior and me stabbing my flaming hand into the sand to put it out.
Unfortunately my buddy pointed out that was our only stove and we were out there for several more days and the girls were going to want something hot to drink.
Let's just say Superior in late May is still cold enough to send certain body parts up into the chest cavity.
I now own an MSR Dragonfly and am very happy with it as it's yet to cause me to burst into flame.
Semper Fi
warrior9504
03-10-09, 19:59
+1 on MSR. Used one all over the world and burned JP8 and even diesel in it for a while in the army (diesel is really messy and clogs the jets...but it's heat).
Also for a total minimalist and if you need quite (perhaps tactically) try an Esbit. One of the blocks is enough to cook a pot of food, light, easy and small. Not to mention CHEAP. I use one of these on some shorter hikes.
http://www.armynavyshop.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=army-navy-shop&Product_Code=rc647
Outlander Systems
03-15-09, 11:34
I settled on the Jetboil Personal Cooking System, as it seemed like the best setup for MY needs.
Crosslink for more information here:
http://m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=27446&page=2
I have the JetBoil. Supposedly it doesn't do well for higher altitudes but that's not the focus of this forum. It's an outstanding piece of gear, dead simple, easy to use, and always lights for me. It's all self contained including the cup you can cook in so it's ideal for your BOB.
I have used my Jetboil up to 14,000 ft with no issues
I use cannister stoves for everything except winter camping. If I am melting snow I stick to white gas
It's been trouble-free and does a good job for me. DISCLAIMER- It HAS NOT been abused or taken to 15,000' or anything.
The fuel is easy to get and to pack, the lighter is reliable and it boils up very fast.
Take it for what it's worth.
LittleRedToyota
03-20-09, 17:19
another vote for the MSR whisperlite (if you are OK with having to use white gas) or MSR whisperlite international (if you want to be able to burn many types of fuel..which is prolly a good thing in a BOB application).
great stoves.
I have used my MSR dragonfly stove for years it will burn nearly every type of fuel. Another nice thing is it's ability to adjust the power output of the stove. The only complaint that i have is that it is still fairly large even when collapsed. Try the out at an REI near you and see which one you prefer.
double post. Sorry this forum is having problems with showing posts.
I carry a whisperlite now a days. Used to have a butane and liked it quite a lot but did have few issues with it in the extreme cold. I do try to carry some trioxane with me though for a quick cocoa so I don't have to go through the whole trouble of breaking out the stove setup, burner/cup stored around the canteen type setup. Also provides a little backup to the main gig.
I have a MSR burn everything. It is great for boiling water quickly. It has two modes, off and nuclear. It is good on fuel. I took it out for a week in the woods and only had a half bottel fuel. I came back with most of a bottel fuel and I only cooked over an open fire twice.. It is very dirty, but I still reccomend it for true survival work.
I also recomend Alcohal stoves. This is my prefered cooking method at this point. They are light, they are functional, they cost almost nothing to make at home. Fuel is avaliable everywhere.
Additionally, I know some people like canned bottled gas. It is better for chefs. I will get one of these in the future.
Yes, I love my stoves. I am a decent cook.
LonghunterCO
03-29-09, 19:15
I also recomend Alcohal stoves. This is my prefered cooking method at this point. They are light, they are functional, they cost almost nothing to make at home. Fuel is avaliable everywhere.
I have no direct experience with them, but once when was hiking on the AT everyone was a-buzz about an Englishman that was air lifted to the hospital the day before when he caught himself on fire with his alcohol stove. Something about not being able to see the flames when it is burning...Is that true?
I have no direct experience with them, but once when was hiking on the AT everyone was a-buzz about an Englishman that was air lifted to the hospital the day before when he caught himself on fire with his alcohol stove. Something about not being able to see the flames when it is burning...Is that true?
In direct sunlight it can be an issue. If you are dumb it can be an issue.
I don't find it any worse than liquid fuel.
It is not explosive like gasoline.
Water, any water will dilute it and then it will not burn.
Outlander Systems
04-01-09, 20:08
Jiminy F'in Crickets...
The Jetboil, ah, how shall we say this...works.
It actually works "better" than I had expected. I brought it with me to work today to try and cook a "field lunch". I set it up, filled it with two cups of H20, plopped in some spaghetti, and fired 'er up.
I walked back to my work truck to grab a smoke, and in less than 90 seconds the damned thing boiled over...
If you want to greatly decrease boil time on these, cook with the lid placed on top. The boiling time is absolutely unbelievable. It was quite a treat to have actual freshly cooked spaghetti in the woods, in about 3 minutes.
I figured the Jetboil would work well, but I had no idea it would seriously boil water that fast. It's unbelievable. The overboil caused a flare-up, and singed my cozy, but I'll live with it. I wanted the woodland camouflage cozy JB makes anyway.
Seriously, I can't speak highly of this thing enough. I shall no longer fear stagnant water again.
A quick tip: Your piezo igniter may not be set from the factory at the optimal level. Adjust to approximately 1/4" from the grille for reliable, consistent lighting.
http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/8935/jetboil.jpg
http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/6912/flameslickmet.jpg
I just built and tested a Diet Coke can alcohol stove. 2 cans were the only expense. Simple to make, even easier to carry. Put about 2 oz. of denatured alcohol in and boiled water in about 10 minutes, burner kept going for about 19 minutes total. I now carry 2-8oz squirt bottles of denatured but may add Everclear bottle to the bag as well. For designs, google zen stoves and they have bunches of examples. I alos melted snow, about 2 cups worth in 10 degree weather this week, about 10 minutes.
This is great for the car when travelling in snowy weather...
I've used the XGK all over the planet & Serious Student has covered it well, except he didn't mention the occasional XGK Malitov Cocktail Factor:p:eek: I love this stove, but it doesn't saute;), I think you could heat a hot air balloon & power the space shuttle with this thing:p
In my Emergency Truck kit I keep an Optimus ? (mini folding stove) that fits into the bottom of the fuel cartridges. It works but is pretty wobbly. It is VERY small.
I have a buddy who is the real deal hard man elk hunter and he uses a Jet Boil, but to fuel it he takes a tuna can cuts top off & uses one of those small chemical blocks inside the tuna can to fuel it & swears it works great and reduces weight & is not affected by cold or altitude. I will try that for super light travel once I'm recovered.
got to love from cold water to boiling in less than 90 seconds.. watch out for the flame control knob not turning down or off in time, boiled over a batch of coffee and hand with mine.. :o. otherwise on camp stoves I've got 2 coleman multi fuels unleaded/ white gas)the other unleaded, white gas, Kerosene( works on JP8 and DF) just change generators. used JP8 and DF;) for it in Iraq daily from Nov-Mar 03-04. better than the crap I used on my first trip over there.
CharlieKilo
12-26-09, 09:45
Not that it matters, but I use this and love it.
Ketadyne Optimus (http://www.dickssportinggoods.com/product/index.jsp?productId=3521173&CAWELAID=345492921)
Outlander Systems
12-26-09, 10:02
Is Jetboil still making the woodland camouflage cozies?
I can't find one to save my life.
I have been watching the development of the AIO canister stoves like JB and MSRs Reactor with great interest. I love how light, quick, and compact they are. However I just cant part with my Primus Omni Fuel. Its a heavy mother, but it hasnt failed me in the 8 years Ive had it. Obligatory usage pic attached
HighSpeedDreams
12-26-09, 10:40
MSR Pocket Rocket is all I need.
I'm glad you like the Jetboil. I pretty much quit using my whisperlite (international burn anything) since I got mine about 2 years ago. If you're a coffee drinker, take a look at the press kit. It makes those mornings in the middle of nowhere a little more enjoyable.
Another vote for the MSR Pcoket Rocket.:eek:
I'm glad you like the Jetboil. I pretty much quit using my whisperlite (international burn anything) since I got mine about 2 years ago. If you're a coffee drinker, take a look at the press kit. It makes those mornings in the middle of nowhere a little more enjoyable.
I have the coffee press kit for my Jetboil but I never use the cup to mix food or drink in anymore.
I found some coffee bags, similar to tea bags but with coffee in them. this is what I use now for my jetboil as it keeps only clear water in the cup.
I've been using my Jetboil for quite some time and simply love it! If nothing else it makes a great cup of coffee! It's also VERY fuel efficient. As many times as I've used this thing I still haven't finished the first fuel bottle... :eek:
Jetboil rocks!
PS. A word to the wise.....do NOT put any kind of food in the stove first. Make sure you boil your water first. Burnt oatmeal is a living nightmare to remove from the bottom... :o
bearstalker
01-15-10, 17:34
Living in Alaska, I do a bunch of backpack hunting for various species up here. I got a handful of msr stoves and a few months back I purchased the Jetboil unit. I can't say enough good things about the Jetboil stove. That's all I use now. They are worth checking out.
SouthParkTactical
01-25-10, 11:05
Another vote for the MSR Pcoket Rocket.:eek:
x3 for the mighty pocket rocket!
I have used mine extensively on backpacking trips here in Colorado. It performs well at altitude (have personally used mine up to about 13k feet), boils water fast, and weighs very little. It actually has a respectable simmer capability as well as Jet Blast mode ;) Pretty sturdy despite minimalist construction.
I have a TI pot that the fuel canister, and stove all fit in to nicely. Takes up very little room in the pack.
I think something like this works very well in a BU scenario as it is very simple and lightweight. You do not have to worry about spilling fuel in your pack. Sets up super quick and does its thing. Less stove weight and bulk allows you to carry more food or ammo.
Great thread guys. I really like the thought of the multi-fuel stoves, but I have some concerns with using liquid fuel. How safe are they?
Great thread guys. I really like the thought of the multi-fuel stoves, but I have some concerns with using liquid fuel. How safe are they?
For the most part, they are as safe as making fire from pressurized liquid fuel goes. Most of the risks are easily mitigated by using a little common sense. With stoves like the MSR Whisperlite and XGK, you control the addition of fire, so if something is off, don't lite the thing. You basically end up doing a full mechanical check to get the stove set up for running.
There is always a small chance that you can let things get out of hand. That is why you shouldn't be lighting the stoves in tents or vehicles. Again, a little common sense and you'll be fine. In cold weather, the fuel can give you frostbite fast if you get it on your skin. Aside from that, I've seen 14 year old boy scouts using these for years with no issues.
Thanks UVvis. I think I will give one of them a try.
Once in the dark I overfilled the priming cup on my Whisperlite and got a nice trail of flame across the bench it was sitting on when I lit it. After the fuel burned off you couldn't even tell it had burned there.
Once the pump housing cracked and I couldn't use the stove for that trip but other than that it's worked fine for 20+ years.
For weekend camping/hiking I prefer the stoves that use propane/butane canisters. They burn cleaner, you can control the flame better, and a fuel canister will last for about five days of daily cooking. I have a GAS stove and lantern that are very small, light, and inexpensive. Canisters are getting harder to find though.
JB2000, who hasn't done that before? :D It's half the fun.
LonghunterCO
02-11-10, 16:22
For weekend camping/hiking I prefer the stoves that use propane/butane canisters. They burn cleaner, you can control the flame better, and a fuel canister will last for about five days of daily cooking. I have a GAS stove and lantern that are very small, light, and inexpensive. Canisters are getting harder to find though.
Our problem out here with canisters is their sometimes spotty performance when they are not at 100% at high altitude, often coupled with low temps.
GLOCKMASTER
02-11-10, 20:37
A lot of good information being shared here and thanks. I'm more than likely headed to some high country this year elk hunting and a lot this information is very useful.
I just saw this on another forum. It not out yet, but looks interesting.
http://www.biolitestove.com/BioLite.html
"BioLite is an affordable, ultra low emission, wood burning cook stove. Since most people who cook on wood live away from reliable electricity supply, the BioLite stove can too; our technology harnesses the fire’s own waste heat to drive the stove’s efficient process. The result is a stove that cuts wood consumption in half, reduces smoke emissions by 95% and nearly eliminates black carbon."
ETA: Looks like it is an evolution of the rocket stove which you can build yourself or order All kinds of plans on the net. Here the one:
http://www.rocketstoves.org/
I can understand not wanting to choose a coleman stove for a backpacker....but I did add a coleman Duel Fuel stove and Dual Fuel Lantern to my Emergency gear after the Ice Storms in 2007. This is the model that uses either Coleman Fuel or Unleaded Gasoline.
I lost power at approx 10:30 p.m. the night the first of the storms hit. I made my way to Wal-mart the next morning bright and early and already all the Coleman Fuel, Denatured Alcohol, Lamp Oil etc... and other canned fuels had been bought out. It was the same all over town so I ended up buying 3-gallons of Kerosene.
I wasn't after Coleman Fuel for cooking purposes as I had a gas cook stove at the time, but wanted it instead for use with a Coleman Lantern.
The ability to burn Unleaded fuel is a big plus in my book for a Survival Stove.
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